Disney Dining Died On 8/16/2010 RIP

[grimley1968]

Now, if the quality's dropped in the quieter signature restaurants like Citricos, Artist Point, Flying Fish, and The Wave, then we have a problem.

Le Cellier is in one of the parks, but it used to be considered "signature" dining. I can remember it requiring 2 TS vouchers at one point, just like the other "signature dining" restaurants they still consider to be that way.

It used to be much quieter, and offer terrific food at a reasonable value. Note I'm not saying it was cheap - it was still expensive way back when - but what I felt what we got for our money (or TS vouchers) was far more than now.

 

[DisGirl23]

I don't expect to get free dining and therefore Disney better expect me to spend my food dollars where I feel I get the most value for the money.

I'm sure they're okay with it.
Just out of curiosity, have you, or anyone else here, ever contacted Disney about the dining plan and free dining? Sent and email or letter expressing your concern about your feelings? I would be interested in knowing what their response would be. Not trying to stir the pot here (we're all entitled to our feelings), it's just that if the whole dining thing wasn't working for them, they wouldn't be doing it. And it's not just Disney newbies... many, many people here are also big fans of it and wait for it to be announced each year.
We, personally, take advantage of it because it falls during the easiest time for us to get time off work. If it was a different promo, we'd be using that promo. And if there was no promo, we'd still be going.

 

[lugnut33]

I'm willing to pay for a good meal, I just don't want to overpay for a mediocre meal no matter where it's at.

 

[Tiger926]

For its first twenty years WDW dining was at best pretty good. This started to change in the late nineties as Disney realized the Food Channel was creating a new generation of gourmets who wanted a great meal as well as a theme park experience. Now the resort offered almost a dozen excellent to outstanding restaurants.

Then came a series of blows: a recession in 2000-2002, 9-11, and Disney's decision to keep expanding its hotel space without hiring the manpower to staff them or the customers to fill them. Voila: the dining plan is introduced.

Once again, I don't expect great meals in a theme park restaurant. I'm sorry, I just don't; there's simply too many mouths to feed. If Le Cellier and Bistro de Paris offer diluted, duller menus in 2010, it's still better than what they offered in 1996 or 1985 when American palates still weren't comfortable with foreign cuisine. I also don't expect great food at a buffeteria like Chef Mickey's, where food is not the attraction.

Now, if the quality's dropped in the quieter signature restaurants like Citricos, Artist Point, Flying Fish, and The Wave, then we have a problem.

I totally respect your opinion, but I just don't get it? Why does it matter what TS restaurant one dines at? If I'm eating steak, it shouldn't matter if I'm paying $28.00 at Le Cellier, or $50.00 at Yachtsmen in terms of an edible steak. Once people start believing in this theory, then you have segregation, IMHO. If it's like this with restaurants, then it will be like that with resorts too? And we all know what scary road that would lead down...

We don't feel that the Signatures are that great...not to justify the prices, nor 2 DP credits. Food should be of a decent quality all around, and in this respect, it is not, IMHO.

Interesting discussion, Tiger

 

[lugnut33]

I'm sure they're okay with it.
Just out of curiosity, have you, or anyone else here, ever contacted Disney about the dining plan and free dining? Sent and email or letter expressing your concern about your feelings? I would be interested in knowing what their response would be. Not trying to stir the pot here (we're all entitled to our feelings), it's just that if the whole dining thing wasn't working for them, they wouldn't be doing it. And it's not just Disney newbies... many, many people here are also big fans of it and wait for it to be announced each year.
We, personally, take advantage of it because it falls during the easiest time for us to get time off work. If it was a different promo, we'd be using that promo. And if there was no promo, we'd still be going.

I will contact guest services.

The whole dining thing works great for them because it locks people into eating on-site. It also locks guests into a price, and WDW can do whatever they want with that price. If you're not on "free" dining then you are locked into 42 or 47 bucks a day per adult and there's no way around that. Now, Disney can in turn lower the cost of the meals they are serving and that savings goes directly into Disney's pockets. You see, the DDP (and especially offering free DDP) actually effects quality in that way. Where is the incentive for them to improve or hold high standards when any money they save goes directly to their bottom line?

 

[grimley1968]

I will contact guest services.

The whole dining thing works great for them because it locks people into eating on-site. It also locks guests into a price, and WDW can do whatever they want with that price. If you're not on "free" dining then you are locked into 42 or 47 bucks a day per adult and there's no way around that. Now, Disney can in turn lower the cost of the meals they are serving and that savings goes directly into Disney's pockets. You see, the DDP (and especially offering free DDP) actually effects quality in that way. Where is the incentive for them to improve or hold high standards when any money they save goes directly to their bottom line?

Well said, and I agree.

And because they can control their cost of food by buying it in bulk, they're not losing that much by offering "free dining", while getting guests to pay full rack rate for their rooms (even though they'd still eke out a profit by offering rooms at discounted rates). So when they offer "free dining", their overall profit margin actually goes up - substantially.

We can call guest services and complain about it all we want, but as long as WDW can continue to do this and guests continue to buy the DDP directly or through exhorbitant room pricing (aka "free dining") and rack up the profits, our complaints will go right in the shredder pile.

 

[Kathy C]

Going off property for meals has always been the dumbest, most laughable, knee-jerk reaction to the topic of Disney food. Leaving property is (at the very least) an hour of wasted time per day. No matter how much money you think you're saving, or quality of food you think you're gaining, you can always make that up. When on a Disney vacation, every minute counts and any time spent away from the resorts, parks, et al. is Disney winning and you losing big-time, because you've already paid for the tickets and time in the parks which you are willingly giving up. Don't rationalize it, don't justify it, don't excuse it. You can never get back the time that you've lost.

BTW, we've been to hundreds of restaurants in the Orlando area and you're fooling yourself if you think leaving for lunch and/or dinner is taking you to some culinary heaven-on-Earth. It's not. Disney isn't winning any James Beard awards, but neither their F&B outlets nor their DDPs are so disgustingly bad that you cannot "tolerate" another meal.

You need to get over yourself.

Although we don't leave the property once we're there, I have to disagree to some extent in that you can wait for long periods sometimes for Disney transport to get you to and from.

 

[Funky Chicken]

How many people don't use all of their dining plan credits (for whatever reason) after paying full freight for the room, too? More than you might think.

Pretty smart on Disney's part if you ask me.

 

[clc053103]

Ummm...are you sure about that? As a DVC member I'm sure you've run the numbers...sorry you aren't feeling that your DVC purchase is not of value anymore. Last time I checked cash rates for DVC rooms at Beach Club and Boardwalk for a family member, they were still high, even with a 40% code.

Free Dining also doesn't seem to be the best discount for Deluxe resorts either, of which DVC would fall into that category, so not sure Free Dining will work out to a better savings than my cost. To get Free Dining, you would need to pay rack rate - you ready to shell out $600.00 - 700.00/night plus tax for a 1 bedroom (I am using this example as this is what we stay in when at DVC). My cost for my 1 bedroom this year, with my initial buy-in, plus dues is right around $200.00 CDN/night. That same room rack rate is over $700.00 plus tax. So, as you can see, I'm getting a great discount! Plus, I save $100.00 on each AP, and other dining, shopping and recreation discounts.

Hope you come to enjoy your DVC purchase once again, Tiger

Tiger, and TDC Nala, I appreciate your answers, as it had made me take a step back, and reassured me about our purchase!! I think I picked the wrong quote, as I realize that free dining would never provide the savings on a deluxe villa that being a DVC member has provided- but the 40% off room discounts can get them pretty close. I do need to look long term, as you've pointed out, that these discounts are not always going to be around.

I personally HATE free dining. We love dining around Disney and it really adds to our experience, but with free dining ADR's are much harder to get, restaurants more crowded. People who wouldn't dine at Disney table service otherwise are crowding the restaurants, and in many cases, people who do not seem to ever take their kids out to eat feel it is ok to take these kids to the nicer Disney places "because it's free"- and kids screaming, throwing food, and running around can really ruin the ambience!

I agree with the PP that said Disney needs to create a great dining experience to make us want to spend our money on Disney dining. And unfortunately, dealing with the issues during free dining periods can be unenjoyable.

 

[bangzoom6877]

How many people don't use all of their dining plan credits (for whatever reason) after paying full freight for the room, too? More than you might think.

Pretty smart on Disney's part if you ask me.

Well said...we on the DIS are certainly not in the majority of people who go to WDW. Most people do not plan. I'm sure there are plenty who don't even make ADRs because they are not as familiar with the concept that you will get turned away during peak travel periods (holidays, free dining, summer, etc.). And I'm sure many of those people either have free dining or purchased the dining plan and end up with leftover credits at the end. From Disney's view, this is a HUGE money-maker.

 

[Tiger926]

I will contact guest services.

The whole dining thing works great for them because it locks people into eating on-site. It also locks guests into a price, and WDW can do whatever they want with that price. If you're not on "free" dining then you are locked into 42 or 47 bucks a day per adult and there's no way around that. Now, Disney can in turn lower the cost of the meals they are serving and that savings goes directly into Disney's pockets. You see, the DDP (and especially offering free DDP) actually effects quality in that way. Where is the incentive for them to improve or hold high standards when any money they save goes directly to their bottom line?

Conversely, they keep raising the actual menu cost of the meals, to show an even greater savings to DP guests. When the DP first came out, Disney advertised a 40% savings on food, now, it's a 20% savings (just saw it on the website the other day). Because of this, those of us who pay cash, notice the decline in quality in regard to the cost of the product. In some instances, these two variables just don't match...

Tiger

 

[KTJAY]

I will contact guest services.

The whole dining thing works great for them because it locks people into eating on-site. It also locks guests into a price, and WDW can do whatever they want with that price. If you're not on "free" dining then you are locked into 42 or 47 bucks a day per adult and there's no way around that. Now, Disney can in turn lower the cost of the meals they are serving and that savings goes directly into Disney's pockets. You see, the DDP (and especially offering free DDP) actually effects quality in that way. Where is the incentive for them to improve or hold high standards when any money they save goes directly to their bottom line?

Disney usually meets their "bottom line" for restaurants/food. Where they are lacking in is sales of their merchandise for the last 5 or 6 yrs. And by offering free dining their hopes are people will buy more merchandise. I agree that the dining plan/free dining has definitely affected their menus-by not offering certain things ie prime rib in buffets, lobster at some restaurants. The menus have become much more limited. But I think quality and good service are more of an effect of the economy. Those things are really happening everywhere.

 

[myolite]

I don't agree- DVC members are sold on the DVC way of travel as a cost savings, but you can get the same room at a DVC resort for less than the DVC'ers are paying due to steep room discounts and free dining promotions. It makes us think our DVC purchase was a waste of money.

I agree with you. I don't see the value in our membership at the moment. I'd love to know what perks and discounts everyone is referring to.

 

[brunette8706]

I'm sure they're okay with it.
Just out of curiosity, have you, or anyone else here, ever contacted Disney about the dining plan and free dining? Sent and email or letter expressing your concern about your feelings? I would be interested in knowing what their response would be. Not trying to stir the pot here (we're all entitled to our feelings), it's just that if the whole dining thing wasn't working for them, they wouldn't be doing it. And it's not just Disney newbies... many, many people here are also big fans of it and wait for it to be announced each year.
We, personally, take advantage of it because it falls during the easiest time for us to get time off work. If it was a different promo, we'd be using that promo. And if there was no promo, we'd still be going.

*
Hi! Personally, in my opinion I would think most people would be better off getting a 40 percent discount vs the so called Free Dining. We ran the numbers for the Yacht Club, value season for 2 adults for 7 nights. The cost was a approximately a whopping $3039.00 with so called FREE DINING PLUS TIP vs the 40 percent discount for room only which was approximately $1400.00. Now the so called FREE DINING does include 2 park tickets. We are annual pass holders so we didn't really need the 2 day park tickets...BUT Disney did say you can put them towards a renewal of your annual pass.

 

[PrincessV]

Another problem is how they have structured the whole dining program. By jacking up the prices on the menus it makes people feel they are getting a "bargain" by getting "free" food, when that is actually far from the truth.

^^^ This, and...

The only thing I HATE is that the restaurants are so packed, adrs are impossible and when you do get them you still wait past adr time ( sometimes well past it-like 45 mins to an hour)for your table.

^^^ This, too. Also...

Who goes to Disney for the food? I go for the magical experience it provides, not the food.

For a time, WDW enticed us with culinary excellence. They drew us locals in, especially, and we absolutely went to Disney for the food. I'm talking, we went for a special dinner, never entered a park, and drove home after eating. It was THAT good.

So to go from that sense of special-ness to today's load-'em-in and get-'em-out at the lowest possible cost business practice has been a very hard pill to swallow. There are still a handful of places at which we like to eat, but each trip includes fewer TS meals for us. What do we do instead? If eating on-site is the best option for our touring plan, I go with CS or order less-expensive, hard to screw up items from TS locations. We've been getting condos off-site, cooking and giving non-Disney establishments our business. We no longer make dinner trips to WDW. Our last big trip, we wrote off several more restaurants as "never again." Each time we make one of those decisions, Disney doesn't just lose the cost of an entree - they may lose us for an entire evening; no after dinner snacks or drinks, no souvenirs, etc. Based on WDW's latest earnings reports, though, what they've been doing is good for their bottom line, so I can't really fault the company. I can just choose to do what's best for my bottom line.

Just out of curiosity, have you, or anyone else here, ever contacted Disney about the dining plan and free dining?

Not about the dining plan specifically, but about the diminishing quality of our restaurant experiences? Yep. Every. Single. Time. I also sing the praises to the Powers That Be for every meal that we enjoy. I made a special point of speaking with both the manager and Guest Relations about our recent meals at Sanaa, expressing my relief and joy upon finding that my meals there weren't "dumbed down" in the least. I can only hope others do the same. But ultimately, it'll still come down to what's most profitable for the company.

 

[Kathy C]

I am pretty much 'over myself'. I have been to WDW about 35 times since '99. I have eaten at almost every WDW restaurant....many more than once. And I will contend that Disney has taken away any individuality from most menus. In fact, we met friends at the Top of the World Lounge at BLT a few weeks ago. They go to WDW often..and enjoy drinking in the various lounges at the resorts. They complained that Disney now has a standardized bar menu...each resort no longer has it's 'specialities' like they used to. It's all the same.
The menus have changed at almost every single restaurant. The more expensive offerings have been taken away...quite awhile ago. Many of you may not even realize that if you haven't been going to WDW for many years.

When I go to WDW, there are days we don't go to a park. It's not all about the 'attractions' for us anymore. We like to try new things. So, if it means going offsite to a non-Disney restaurant in order to get a really good meal, then so be it. We don't mind taking that couple of hours away from the parks. Good dining is one of my dh's favorite things.....so we will go where the good food is.



Almost every single restaurant on site. No need to single any out. It won't help you out at all....you either eat at WDW and get the lesser menus now or you go to non-Disney spots and get better food.


I just returned, last Thursday, from a 12 day stay at WDW. We had many sitdown meals...sometimes two a day. I have never been so disappointed in so many meals. Chef Mickeys used to be a 'must do' on each trip. After our meal there a week ago, I doubt we'll be going back. The food was not particularly good.....bad in some cases. When I am offered a slice of beef, it would be nice if it were thicker than a piece of paper, with more than 3 edible bits from it.
I knew going in that meals were going to cost me more...seasonal pricing and all. But really???? What is seasonal about the end of July, beginning of August? Oh yeah...no free dining, so we'll take you for every penny we can get. To automatically add $3-4 to each buffet is incredible. Won't be doing many buffets down the road either.


When Disney came out with the DDP in the beginning, we started to see changes in the menus. As years went by, more changes were made...to both the DDP and the menus. Disney took stuff away from the DDP and then increased the price. It is now ridiculously overpriced...especially when you add in the tips to be paid OOP. Just nuts.
It looks like more signature dining for us....in addition to eating in our villa....from now on. Disney has made dining at WDW a non-event for us. Maybe it's okay with those who don't go frequently, but those of us that go often have seen the changes. Or perhaps, like in so many corporations, Disney just doesn't much care about those of us who love WDW...they figure we're going to go no matter what Disney does with prices and food. They 'have' us already. They pretty much care, for the most part, about those who don't go very often..they want to get them 'hooked' as well.
I am pretty much considering myself 'un-had'. Disney is starting to lose it's appeal for me.....and I own DVC to boot. I'll still go but not nearly as often as in the past.

Well said! We, too, are DVC members and have gone more times than I can count and have seen changes in the quality of the food. Eating is what we spend the majority of our money on - it will be more counter service for us along with eating in our villa.

 

[princesslexis'mom]

The big three....food/menus/quality. These are the reasons we choose to dine in the parks....less and less.

"Free" dining ends 9/29/2011? I think, I will refrain from booking any new vacations until October 2011.

If you feel that the quality of the food and the service has changed significantly since the introduction of the dining plan,then it probably wouldn't be any different if you went at another time,their new menus and policies would still be what they are. We do use the dining plan,but having received many room discount pins and compared the cost ,it is still less expensive with DDP.

 

[DisGirl23]

*
Hi! Personally, in my opinion I would think most people would be better off getting a 40 percent discount vs the so called Free Dining. We ran the numbers for the Yacht Club, value season for 2 adults for 7 nights. The cost was a approximately a whopping $3039.00 with so called FREE DINING PLUS TIP vs the 40 percent discount for room only which was approximately $1400.00. Now the so called FREE DINING does include 2 park tickets. We are annual pass holders so we didn't really need the 2 day park tickets...BUT Disney did say you can put them towards a renewal of your annual pass.

Hello there... I would definitely agree that Free Dining wouldn't be the best promo for a Deluxe resort.
Last year, our trip booking was kind of spur of the moment. Which didn't give us much time to save up (we only use credit for emergencies and according to DBF, this was NOT an emergency ). So, we were happy to stay at ASMu, just to be in Disney. We did consider this a good value for the 2 of us (yes, we used ALL our credits).
That said, my dream resort is Beach Club. And I am very well aware that without a room discount, we'd pay out the bum for it. So, I will wait patiently for a 40% during a time we can secure from work. Dreaming of BC...

 

[Alexander]

It's official, excellent dining experiences without getting gouged officially died at WDW today. It makes me sad that Disney now considers its dining as a throw-in commodity rather than a dining experience. Disney allowing a whole years worth of free dining (actually it's 14 months) just confirms to me that they are going to run it into the ground by cutting back on service and quality because each dollar they can save on the free dining is a dollar in their bottom line.

Over the years you have seen a decline in the quality of food and service in the WDW restaurants and most people agree that it's a result of the free dining. While I certainly don't begrudge people for booking free dining, dining at WDW is just not what it used to be years ago. Every year they have been cutting back on quality and selection. The menus are getting dumbed down so they can increase profits because the "free dining" really isn't free. Then they increase the cost of the food on the menu so it makes the "free" dining people feel like they are getting a bargain. I personally don't think that's cool, especially since I'm paying out of pocket.

In the end, I'll just be eating off property more and more. In August of 09 we ate every dinner off property and honestly it wasnt' that difficult to do. We saved a ton of money since we were a party of 8. We ate a few lunches at the parks and honestly they weren't that good.

So, I send my condolences to the Disney dining experience, may you Rest In Peace.

I couldn't agree more!

I sure hope this isn't true! I have to say I'm grateful for all the free dining...it's the only way we can budget to go and wouldn't go without it!

But you can afford to go without the free dining. You have to realize you are paying rack rates for your hotel room. There are so many great discounts on rooms that if you got one of those and then just paid for your food, you'll likely come out at almost the same amount of money. When the dining plan included appetizer and gratuity, it was a much better deal. Also with the value resorts only offering QSDP, you are paying far too much for your hotel room. I totally understand the draw of free dining, but it just isn't free.

Please correct me if I am understanding this all wrong...Isn't free dining in 2011 still only good on certain dates? For example, next summer it still doesn't begin until August 19, 2011. There are also several other blocks of time it is not available, if you read the dates that it is available. So, it is not free dining for a straight 14-month period with no gaps.

Yes, there will be blackout dates when Disney doesn't need to offer the free dining because they are busy times. However, the food isn't going to change during those blackout times. The Disney Dining Experience is gone. It is now a glorified dining plan, kind of like those colleges have!

 

[TDC Nala]

think, I will refrain from booking any new vacations until October 2011.

Free dining is apparently the most effective method Disney's come up with to get people to book resort stays at WDW who otherwise would either stay offsite or not plan a trip to WDW at all. It's been VERY effective in giving prospective guests the extra boost they need to pay full price for a room in the off-season. If WDW sees a need to fill empty rooms after 9/29, you can bet there will be another free dining offer covering that time.