just curious dont want this to get out of control bathroom use

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

There have been issues which is why at many places, folks use the facilities for those they identify with. A trans female, to me, IS female. It wasn’t so long ago that gay people were murdered for being gay, on a regular basis. I believe there is even more hatred for the trans community, especially in certain areas.

I agree, embarrassing how we've regressed in some areas when we had just progressed.

 

[leahgoogle]

I guarantee that my 20, 20, 22, 25 and 27 year olds (girls and boys) would have zero issue with it. I’m pretty confident that they don’t see even a need for separate bathrooms.

That's great. And, my kids feel differently. I think there should be single room unisex bathrooms.

 

[disneychrista]

Weird way to describe it, since I doubt that intention had anything to do with it.

Maybe she was ovulating

 

[leahgoogle]

Can’t they pee in the toilet?

I have my husband and son trained to put the seat down. They are at least somewhat careful when they pee. I can't imagine what a stall toilet and surrounding area would look like if men were strictly peeing in public toilets.

 

[Living42Day]

Again, you don’t need to use the term transvestite, it’s like using the word retarded (for lack of a better word).

Then what term do you prefer that I use? It is not a slur, so not close to calling someone with developmental disabilities the r-word.

edit: I asked previously and have not had a response to what would be a more gentle term that still conveys someone who cross dresses. Google does not give much in terms of what would be less offensive, so please - enlighten me on the proper terminology that you would prefer I use.

 

[Living42Day]

Have I not answered every single question you’ve asked me? You apparently are uninterested in answering any of the questions I ask of you. Yet you insist on making false claims about my supposed bias against……what was it again? Oh here! I found it. You said I was biased against an imaginary trans woman (that you created out of thin air) with male genitalia (not sure how you knew that even if they were imaginary), who secretly identifies as a man, presents as a woman, while standing in line for the women’s restroom and I was in the wrong for assuming this person (who again, presents as woman, but is still a creation of your imagination) is a woman waiting to use the women’s restroom. It’s obvious to me you really enjoy typing. A lot. And I think that’s wonderful. But I’m beginning to lose interest. While I had found this conversation with you to be both mildly fascinating as well as extremely entertaining, it has become clear your only goal is to get the last word in. Even if it means typing a bunch of words while saying almost nothing of substance. Disappointing and exhausting. Please put me out of my misery and reply one more time so we can get this over with.

This part made me lol but only because I think most of us can relate.

 

[Bad Pink Tink 2.0]

Then what term do you prefer that I use?

The shortened word Trans is used most often, as it covers a wider verity of gender expression.

https://www.apa.org/topics/lgbtq/transgender-people-gender-identity-gender-expression

Transgender is an umbrella terms for persons whose gender identity, gender expression or behavior does not conform to that typically associated with the sex to which they were assigned at birth.

Gender identity refers to a person’s internal sense of being male, female or something else; gender expression refers to the way a person communicates gender identity to others through behavior, clothing, hairstyles, voice or body characteristics. ”

While transgender is generally a good term to use, not everyone whose appearance or behavior is gender-nonconforming will identify as a transgender person. The ways that transgender people are talked about in popular culture, academia and science are constantly changing, particularly as individuals’ awareness, knowledge and openness about transgender people and their experiences grow.

Many identities fall under the transgender umbrella. The term transsexual refers to people whose gender identity is different from their assigned sex.

According to the American Psychological Association Style guide, the term “transsexual” is largely outdated, but some people identify with it; this term should be used only for an individual who specifically claims it.

Often, transsexual people alter or wish to alter their bodies through hormones, surgery, and other means to make their bodies as congruent as possible with their gender identities. This process of transition through medical intervention is often referred to as sex or gender reassignment, but more recently is also referred to as gender affirmation.

People who were assigned female, but identify and live as male and alter or wish to alter their bodies through medical intervention to more closely resemble their gender identity are known as transsexual men or transmen (also known as female-to-male or FTM). Conversely, people who were assigned male, but identify and live as female and alter or wish to alter their bodies through medical intervention to more closely resemble their gender identity are known as transsexual women or transwomen (also known as male-to-female or MTF). Some individuals who transition from one gender to another prefer to be referred to as a man or a woman, rather than as transgender.

 

[Living42Day]

The shortened word Trans is used most often, as it covers a wider verity of gender expression.

https://www.apa.org/topics/lgbtq/transgender-people-gender-identity-gender-expression

Transgender is an umbrella terms for persons whose gender identity, gender expression or behavior does not conform to that typically associated with the sex to which they were assigned at birth.

Gender identity refers to a person’s internal sense of being male, female or something else; gender expression refers to the way a person communicates gender identity to others through behavior, clothing, hairstyles, voice or body characteristics. ”

While transgender is generally a good term to use, not everyone whose appearance or behavior is gender-nonconforming will identify as a transgender person. The ways that transgender people are talked about in popular culture, academia and science are constantly changing, particularly as individuals’ awareness, knowledge and openness about transgender people and their experiences grow.

Many identities fall under the transgender umbrella. The term transsexual refers to people whose gender identity is different from their assigned sex.

According to the American Psychological Association Style guide, the term “transsexual” is largely outdated, but some people identify with it; this term should be used only for an individual who specifically claims it.

Often, transsexual people alter or wish to alter their bodies through hormones, surgery, and other means to make their bodies as congruent as possible with their gender identities. This process of transition through medical intervention is often referred to as sex or gender reassignment, but more recently is also referred to as gender affirmation.

People who were assigned female, but identify and live as male and alter or wish to alter their bodies through medical intervention to more closely resemble their gender identity are known as transsexual men or transmen (also known as female-to-male or FTM). Conversely, people who were assigned male, but identify and live as female and alter or wish to alter their bodies through medical intervention to more closely resemble their gender identity are known as transsexual women or transwomen (also known as male-to-female or MTF). Some individuals who transition from one gender to another prefer to be referred to as a man or a woman, rather than as transgender.

So basically people will find offense in any term that is used? You can use transsexual, but that is outdated. I cannot use transgender in report taking because not every man who is wearing women's clothing is transgender and it changes the context, possibly significantly.

When describing a suspect, is calling them heavyset also offensive? I know I would find that offensive but it is basically the only way to accurately describe the physical characteristics of a potential suspect. How about stating someone appears to be African-American when they prefer to be called Black because as one person stated "I'm not from Africa!"? There is an endless amount of innocuous words that can be taken as offensive by the right person. I think context matters. Calling someone a "trannyvestite" or "tranny" - yes that is offensive. But stating the actual term, using it appropriately, to describe the way a person is dressed does not appear to be offensive based on what you copied/pasted here and what several other sources have stated.

 

[Dan Murphy]

Life can sometimes be so complicated these days.

 

[Bad Pink Tink 2.0]

So basically people will find offense in any term that is used? You can use transsexual, but that is outdated. I cannot use transgender in report taking because not every man who is wearing women's clothing is transgender and it changes the context, possibly significantly.

When describing a suspect, is calling them heavyset also offensive? I know I would find that offensive but it is basically the only way to accurately describe the physical characteristics of a potential suspect. How about stating someone appears to be African-American when they prefer to be called Black because as one person stated "I'm not from Africa!"? There is an endless amount of innocuous words that can be taken as offensive by the right person. I think context matters. Calling someone a "trannyvestite" or "tranny" - yes that is offensive. But stating the actual term, using it appropriately, to describe the way a person is dressed does not appear to be offensive based on what you copied/pasted here and what several other sources have stated.

The shortened word Trans is used most often, as it covers a wider verity of gender expression.

 

[starlite_]

Life can sometimes be so complicated these days.

Trans ppl are not a new thing tho. They have always been part of the human population. It is simply that now days it is (or was) safer for them to be themselves.

 

[DisneyOma]

I really wasn't sure how I felt about this and then I used the bathrooms at my daughter's basketball tournament today. They were normal stalls with gaps and the doors didn't touch the ground. I definitely would not feel comfortable with men using the bathroom in that situation especially with many young girls using the bathrooms. Single-room bathrooms where only one uses it at a time would be ok. DD is 13 and she definitely said she would not feel comfortable with boys or men using the same bathroom.

If those "men" you are talking about are trans female, it's probably already happened. What do you expect to occur?

I'm still confused about when political correctness overcame common sense. I'm sorry but men, whether they are transgender or not, do NOT belong in a womens bathroom or locker room. Sorry but its just WRONG!!!!

It's already happened to you, and you just didn't notice!

Do you think that a biological female feels comfortable with a biological male in the rest room or locker room?? I'm not going to get into a pissing contest over this and get points or banned. I was just stating my opinion.

How can you tell? Are you checking everyone out before you pee?

Then what term do you prefer that I use? It is not a slur, so not close to calling someone with developmental disabilities the r-word.

edit: I asked previously and have not had a response to what would be a more gentle term that still conveys someone who cross dresses. Google does not give much in terms of what would be less offensive, so please - enlighten me on the proper terminology that you would prefer I use.

How about "not naked"? It's just clothing, and people can wear whatever they want "as long as the necessary parts are covered" to quote my high school principal. No body shaming, no blaming what someone is wearing on someone else's behavior. I feel like some people are so insecure about their own sexuality, their own lives even, that they can't handle how other people dress, or identify, or live. But that is their problem - and if someone cant handle a transgendered person using a public bathroom, then that person should pee at home, IMO. I know many transgender students, and they have enough of a burden - where they pee should be the least of their issues.

 

[Dan Murphy]

Trans ppl are not a new thing tho. They have always been part of the human population. It is simply that now days it is (or was) safer for them to be themselves.

Yes, very true.

 

[sam_gordon]

There's been a lot of talk over who feels "comfortable" and where. I had a thought about that...

Assume you and a friend go to some public business. There are people there that you see and for whatever reason make you feel uncomfortable. What do you do? Do you tough it out? Do you leave? Do you ask the business to kick out the people who make you feel uncomfortable?

I don't see anyone picking the last one. But isn't that what people are saying should happen with opposite sex people in the bathrooms? Now, can things be done (such as changing how 'visible' the stalls are) to help make people feel more at ease? Absolutely. But think about it a minute.

 

[sam_gordon]

I never said anything about trans males. If you look at my post previous to the one you quoted you will see that I said that MEN should NOT be in women’s restrooms. When I say men I mean ALL men. The response you quoted was in response to CdnCarrie.

I was trying to get you to elaborate on this comment...

Why make it easier for women to be taken advantage of?

How does allowing trans women into the women's restroom make it "easier for women to be taken advantage of"?

 

[mjkacmom]

Then what term do you prefer that I use? It is not a slur, so not close to calling someone with developmental disabilities the r-word.

edit: I asked previously and have not had a response to what would be a more gentle term that still conveys someone who cross dresses. Google does not give much in terms of what would be less offensive, so please - enlighten me on the proper terminology that you would prefer I use.

When I was in graduate school for special education, it was a medical term. Times change, if the population bring labeled prefer a different label, use a different label. https://www.alleydog.com/glossary/definition.php?term=Educable+Mentally+Retarded+(EMR)

 

[AprilsZoo]

The term transvestite literally means someone (historically a man) who dresses in clothing traditionally accepted as being associated with the opposite sex. It may not have anything whatsoever to do with gender identity or sexuality.
There are a lot (more than you think) of straight [cis] men who enjoy wearing women’s clothing — could be underwear, or dresses, or frilly blouses. They identify as male and are not gay.
Women may do the same & dress in mens clothing. The difference is that nobody gives a second look to a woman wearing Levi’s, work boots, and a flannel shirt.
But see a man wearing a skirt (well,outside of Hawaii or Polynesia) and everyone gets all antsy. Heaven forbid he enjoy being in full drag, with makeup and hairstyle or wig.
Those men while in public, will use a ladies’ room, because even today, they risk inciting violence if they went into a men’s doom.

This is actually the solution and would make EVERYONE more comfortable, right? I mean, who likes having to go with an 18 inch gap from the bottom of the door to the floor and cracks between the panels? If all bathrooms were single user and gender-neutral, there would be no issues.

Or at least if every restroom had toilet stalls that provide better privacy. The so-called European style.

You should see the stalls at rest stops along AZ highways— not only is there an 18” gap at the bottom of the stall door, but I am 5’6” and the top of the stall door is at approximately armpit level to me.
They have tiled walls between the stalls, but even those are a bit shorter than I am. I personally can’t see over the wall, but someone 5-9 or 5-10 could. And I can definitely see over any of the stall doors.

I’m sure it’s probably by design, to prevent people from doing anything improper in there… like “hooking up” or doing drugs. But it’s still lacking any feeling of privacy. It does encourage quick visits… you definitely get in and get back out as fast as possible, hopefully before anyone hew come in— or heaven forbid… a bus

 

[Dan Murphy]

You should see the stalls at rest stops along AZ highways— not only is there an 18” gap at the bottom of the stall door, but I am 5’6” and the top of the stall door is at approximately armpit level to me.
They have tiled walls between the stalls, but even those are a bit shorter than I am. I personally can’t see over the wall, but someone 5-9 or 5-10 could. And I can definitely see over any of the stall doors.

I think it’s probably by design, to prevent people from doing anything improper in there… like “hooking up” or doing drugs. But it’s still lacking any feeling of privacy. It does encourage quick visits… you definitely get in and get back out as fast as possible, hopefully before anyone hew come in— or heaven forbid… a bus

When I was in high school, all boys parochial, no doors on the stalls.

 

[tinkerbellandpeterpan]

I legitimately dont care who is in the bathroom next to me as long as they aren't a pig. And ladies are sometimes worse than men. But I think it's perfectly fine for women to not want men in their bathroom. For me, if the men's line is shorter then I'm happy to run in looking down and run out looking down using hand sanitizer LOL

 

[sam_gordon]

I legitimately dont care who is in the bathroom next to me as long as they aren't a pig. And ladies are sometimes worse than men. But I think it's perfectly fine for women to not want men in their bathroom. For me, if the men's line is shorter then I'm happy to run in looking down and run out looking down using hand sanitizer LOL

Shouldn't you be looking UP? LoL