Just curious - Disney Dining Plan

[mom2rtk]

I'm opinionated and abrasive. But I try not to speak in universals for good reason.
Character meals -- at least a desire to do multiple character dinners, especially with children, is still a pretty good reason to get the dining plan. Though even then, adults can do character lunches and breakfasts for less than the cost of the plan.

Turning to the teenage son example -- the teenage son can be permitted to order anything on the menu, with or without the plan. In most cases, that will still be cheaper for the family, than using the dining plan.

Same with the spouse canceling the ADRs -- here the ddp is being used as an excuse to overspend. Not very rational. The spouse will cancel reservations, because he doesnt want to spend $900 on restaurants (hypothetical number). But if we flush $1,000 down the toilet in advance, then the spouse won't have the choice! Not a very rational approach.

Yes, I'm being judgmental. But I honestly don't buy most of the rationalizatins used to justify the dining plan.
If you honestly truly eat in a fashion where it saves you money, or you at least break even, then the plan is fully justified. There are indeed some people who fit that mold. (people who want individual desserts at every meal, character dinners, and steak at every TS restaurant )

I honestly don't care whether you think something is rationale or not. What works for one family does not always work for another.

And really, in the greater scheme of things, why people spend so much time and effort hating on the dining plan here on the DIS is just one of those great enigmas in life I suppose.

If YOU don't like it, don't buy it. If someone buys it and gets "taken" then it's their own fault.

Disney prices and choices would not be the same they were 5 or 10 years ago even if the dining plan never existed. And it would still be just as hard to get an ADR. We patrons might enjoy having tables open and waiting for us when we have the whim to eat there, but Disney does not. They'd have folks working overtime to find other ways to see that they were full.

I'm a big believer in the free market system. When people stop seeing value to what they are buying, they will stop. Period. Simple as that. Maybe that point is right around the corner. Prices ARE high. And benefits of the plan continue to go down. But I imagine Disney will see that coming and adjust when (if) needed. And to them, "need" will only be identified when DP bookings drop.

 

[disneyjunkie]

I honestly don't care whether you think something is rationale or not. What works for one family does not always work for another.

And really, in the greater scheme of things, why people spend so much time and effort hating on the dining plan here on the DIS is just one of those great enigmas in life I suppose.

If YOU don't like it, don't buy it. If someone buys it and gets "taken" then it's their own fault.

Disney prices and choices would not be the same they were 5 or 10 years ago even if the dining plan never existed. And it would still be just as hard to get an ADR. We patrons might enjoy having tables open and waiting for us when we have the whim to eat there, but Disney does not. They'd have folks working overtime to find other ways to see that they were full.

I'm a big believer in the free market system. When people stop seeing value to what they are buying, they will stop. Period. Simple as that. Maybe that point is right around the corner. Prices ARE high. And benefits of the plan continue to go down. But I imagine Disney will see that coming and adjust when (if) needed. And to them, "need" will only be identified when DP bookings drop.

 

[havoc315]

Now Disney does not mislead anyone about the plan or their discounts. I believe that if one is going to spend on a vacation it would make good sense to do a bit of research.

It's pretty misleading, that Disney will NOT tell you the price of the dining plan.
Instead, they simply ask, "Do you want to save up to 15% on dining by adding the dining plan?"
The price is not listed anywhere on the brochure. The price is not listed anywhere on the website. Typically, if you ask a phone CM for the price, they claim they cannot tell you the breakdown. They can only quote the total vacation price (making it rather difficult to understand what part of the package is for the dining.)

If I go to the supermarket, the price for a gallon of milk is listed as $3.79.

It would be rather misleading if I had to wait until checkout, and then could only be told, "the price of the milk, when added to the steak, chicken, apples, oranges, canned peas, paper towels, and dish soap was $73.22"

The only way we know the price of the dining plan, is people like me, have spent the time to take that $73.22, and sit here with calculators breaking it down. It's pretty misleading that Disney won't just tell you the price up front.

And if a company is hiding such basic information, you have to ask yourself why. Disney used to advertise the price of the plan, back when it was cheaper. But they stopped advertising when the price went over $42. They stopped listing the price on any publicity materials at all.

 

[havoc315]

I'm a big believer in the free market system.

I agree. But any economist will tell you that the free market system requires transparency to work. The consumer must have readily available information about price and value, in order to make a rational buying decision.

Disney intentionally obfuscates both the price (which they refuse to tell you) and the value (with vague promises of saving up to 15%).

Go to a typical retail store, and the law requires that every item for sale be clearly marked with price. Transparency. You know what you're getting. You know what you're paying.

Imagine Disney actually did that with the dining plan:
"Price: $55.94 per night, gratuities extra. Average value range of credits when used, $40-60. Savings are not guaranteed. Up to 15% savings may be saved when ordering select items at select locations."

If Disney were to provide such honesty, do you think it would affect people's decision about whether to buy the dining plan?

 

[Douvres Family]

We love the ddp! We have done it twice and it was so much relief for me in my planning. I am compulsive with budgeting and it was so nice not having to worry about paying for each meal. Since I am a compulsive planner I have always made my ADRs as soon as allowed. I can see where it would be frustrating for those who plan last minute trips though. The popular restaurants are hard enough to get into at the 180 mark!

I agree...I do the Disney meal plans every single time. Though, we did the Disney Dinning Deluxe once and I dont think we will do it again. Even my son said it was too much food for one day. Though, it came in handy for the dinner shows that would require 2 table service.

I just helped one of my bosses book a trip to WDW, he's staying at the Grand Floridian and will be there with his wife and 2 kids in September...FIRST TIME EVER...he was so sad he couldnt get any dinning reservations in Cinderella's Castle, Chef Mickey's and others their kids would like to see. I'm not happy either...wish everything works out for them...

 

[mom2rtk]

I agree. But any economist will tell you that the free market system requires transparency to work. The consumer must have readily available information about price and value, in order to make a rational buying decision.

Disney intentionally obfuscates both the price (which they refuse to tell you) and the value (with vague promises of saving up to 15%).

Go to a typical retail store, and the law requires that every item for sale be clearly marked with price. Transparency. You know what you're getting. You know what you're paying.

Imagine Disney actually did that with the dining plan:
"Price: $55.94 per night, gratuities extra. Average value range of credits when used, $40-60. Savings are not guaranteed. Up to 15% savings may be saved when ordering select items at select locations."

If Disney were to provide such honesty, do you think it would affect people's decision about whether to buy the dining plan?

Which price does Disney refuse to give you? Of course they're not going to put it in the terms you spell out for the obvious reasons. But if I call up Disney Dining to make an ADR will they not tell me the price of a character meal?

If you call up reservations, do they really not tell you the price of the dining plan?

I seriously don't know the answer because I've always done free dining. And I've always known the price of the dining plan from here on the DIS. As such, it never seemed hidden to me.

 

[Cafeen]

Which price does Disney refuse to give you? Of course they're not going to put it in the terms you spell out for the obvious reasons. But if I call up Disney Dining to make an ADR will they not tell me the price of a character meal?

If you call up reservations, do they really not tell you the price of the dining plan?

I seriously don't know the answer because I've always done free dining. And I've always known the price of the dining plan from here on the DIS. As such, it never seemed hidden to me.

Over the phone, they'll typically say something along the lines of "We don't have that information because it is part of a package." So, no, they don't typically release the individual dining plan prices (they have, rarely, in the past, and even were quoting people 2012's prices for mid-late 2011 trips...which led to all sorts of hubbub around these parts).

The prices you see on here, and nearly every other info site are generated via testing package pricing and comparing before and after prices when adding the various dining plans. It's tedious and can be tricky (I helped for 2012's, but wasn't available this year for 2013's) and Disney's site is crappy anyway . (It's pretty, but functionality is lacking).

 

[havoc315]

Which price does Disney refuse to give you? Of course they're not going to put it in the terms you spell out for the obvious reasons. But if I call up Disney Dining to make an ADR will they not tell me the price of a character meal?

If you call up reservations, do they really not tell you the price of the dining plan?

Yes, they will tell you the price of a character meal if you call for an ADR. (though not always accurately). No, they will not tell you the price of the dining plan. They will claim that the price cannot be broken out from the total package.

 

[monica9]

We love the dining plan. When we go on vacation, we want to sit down and relax and get served . I am pretty grossed out by the CS meals. I can't see eating all that junk 3 times per day for 7 days. I feel there are more healthier options and more variety when sitting down. And after a long day of walking, we enjoy sitting and getting served.
We usually split 2 CS between the 3 of us either once or twice a day and one sit down meal every day.

We got a pin for I think it was 30% off the room at WL and then the DDP came out and after doing the math, the DP saved us $200. We would have bought it anyway.

Oh and IMO, having to book the ADR's 180 in advance just teaches us not to be procrastinators.

 

[mom2rtk]

Over the phone, they'll typically say something along the lines of "We don't have that information because it is part of a package." So, no, they don't typically release the individual dining plan prices (they have, rarely, in the past, and even were quoting people 2012's prices for mid-late 2011 trips...which led to all sorts of hubbub around these parts).

The prices you see on here, and nearly every other info site are generated via testing package pricing and comparing before and after prices when adding the various dining plans. It's tedious and can be tricky (I helped for 2012's, but wasn't available this year for 2013's) and Disney's site is crappy anyway . (It's pretty, but functionality is lacking).

Yes, they will tell you the price of a character meal if you call for an ADR. (though not always accurately). No, they will not tell you the price of the dining plan. They will claim that the price cannot be broken out from the total package.

I guess I'd just roll my eyes at them not wanting to give you the daily price of the dining plan. But then I'd say "give me the price with and without". Then I'd divide the difference by the number of nights and call it good.

Sort of smarmy...... like car salesmen who ask what I want my monthly payment to be. Sorry, I just don't buy that way.

But I still say "caveat emptor". If people buy without quantifying the numbers, then it's on them.

 

[Cafeen]

I guess I'd just roll my eyes at them not wanting to give you the daily price of the dining plan. But then I'd say "give me the price with and without". Then I'd divide the difference by the number of nights and call it good.

Sort of smarmy...... like car salesmen who ask what I want my monthly payment to be. Sorry, I just don't buy that way.

But I still say "caveat emptor". If people buy without quantifying the numbers, then it's on them.

If I knew what caveat emptor meant, I might agree with you . (I'm assuming it's something like "Buyer Beware" for us less sophisticated people, hey, I DO live in Alabama... I'm not from here, but I can claim that I live here right? ) (I know, I know, Google is my friend...but he's busy right now). And besides, I'm pretty big about getting people to do the numbers and truly figure out what's best for them on that trip (quietly points to the spreadsheet below )

And that's pretty much exactly how we've figured out the nightly costs, but getting them to give us the price with and without and doing the math. It's a pain really, and for absolutely no good reason other than to obfuscate the price since you KNOW they require a price for the piece so that the different departments get charged properly (as a note, it's possible that some of the departments don't have the price, but there is certainly one).

ETA: Phew, I'm good at context clues...erm..cues...or is it is clues? Crap.

 

[mom2rtk]

If I knew what caveat emptor meant, I might agree with you . (I'm assuming it's something like "Buyer Beware" for us less sophisticated people, hey, I DO live in Alabama... I'm not from here, but I can claim that I live here right? ) (I know, I know, Google is my friend...but he's busy right now). And besides, I'm pretty big about getting people to do the numbers and truly figure out what's best for them on that trip (quietly points to the spreadsheet below )

And that's pretty much exactly how we've figured out the nightly costs, but getting them to give us the price with and without and doing the math. It's a pain really, and for absolutely no good reason other than to obfuscate the price since you KNOW they require a price for the piece so that the different departments get charged properly (as a note, it's possible that some of the departments don't have the price, but there is certainly one).

ETA: Phew, I'm good at context clues...erm..cues...or is it is clues? Crap.

LOL! You did just fine.

In a similar vein, my 11 y/o daughter and I ate breakfast at McDonalds last weekend. We read the nutrition facts sheet as we ate. She wanted to know how many calories were in a biscuit. It wasn't listed alone. Perhaps to obfucate the truth...... but I thought it would be a great math problem to figure out. She says it's 260. Turns out you can figure out the calories in the sausage by taking certain things off the big breakfast total. Then you can subtract the sausage total off the sausage biscuit total....... and get your answer.

Next time I need to know the cost of the dining plan, I'm asking her.

 

[Cafeen]

LOL! You did just fine.

In a similar vein, my 11 y/o daughter and I ate breakfast at McDonalds last weekend. We read the nutrition facts sheet as we ate. She wanted to know how many calories were in a biscuit. It wasn't listed alone. Perhaps to obfucate the truth...... but I thought it would be a great math problem to figure out. She says it's 260. Turns out you can figure out the calories in the sausage by taking certain things off the big breakfast total. Then you can subtract the sausage total off the sausage biscuit total....... and get your answer.

Next time I need to know the cost of the dining plan, I'm asking her.

Huge for her! Math is one of those things that is super useful no matter what you end up doing in life, and being able to apply it to real world stuff can make it much more interesting. I think I learned more about math from figuring out the workings of the dining plans than I did in High School

 

[mom2rtk]

Huge for her! Math is one of those things that is super useful no matter what you end up doing in life, and being able to apply it to real world stuff can make it much more interesting. I think I learned more about math from figuring out the workings of the dining plans than I did in High School

LOL! And who said Disney wasn't educational?????

Promise not to tell her I had her doing math homework in the summer though, OK?

 

[SteveandAli511]

I'm a firm believer in that the DDP should be judged on a family by family basis. You're dealing with a varying amount of people, different eating habits and styles and all kinds of age ranges. There are people that is a very good value for and others that would loe money by getting it.

My DW and I will be getting it for our trip in October and after crunching the numbers we think we should make out fairly well on it. After upgrading it to the DxDDP and figuring out the differences between "free" dining for our trip as opposed to buying while getting 30% off a room rate (CBR in our case) the plan comes out to roughly $640 for the DxDDP (compared to $300 for just having the regular DDP.)

We just added a night at AoA in a LM room (the DW's favorite!) so we won't have any DDP for that day but altogether we'll be there for 7 days, 6 nights. We will definitely be taking advantage of some 2 TS meals but also can spread out our other reservations to account for the DDP-less day. One reason? We're big Earl of Sandwich fans and can go there 2-3 times a trip for lunch or dinner. After the AAA discount we each get a sandwich, chips and a drink for under $20 OOP.

Dividing out 640 by 12 (6 nights for each of us) = $53.33 per adult per day. This also accounts for the two snacks per day that come in the DxDDP, not to mention having an appetizer for every TS meal.

To me that is a lot of value especially since we're hoping to try a few signatures and are big steak and seafood fans. This doesn't factor in tips which will be higher due to dining at higher-end restaurants but it's not something that we would consider a dealbreaker.

Like I said in the beginning of my post this may be a plan that wouldn't work for some, and that's perfectly fine. Everyone has their individual preferences on making food work for them. This is the first time we'll be using the DDP and due to it being "free" we decided to upgrade and try to get the most out of it and try places we normally wouldn't.

People under estimate the comfort that pre-paying can offer a family. Even if you spent $50 more for the exact same amount of food sometimes the piece of mind of knowing that you don't have to look at every price and decide "is it worth getting an appetizer/expensive entree/dessert? We could eat cheaper at a CS." is worth the extra money.

I plan on doing a review when we get back not only on the food but also on the cumulative price of everything that the DxDDP paid for and whether or not it was worth the price/piece of mind and if we would do it again. I can tell you now that we won't make any decisions based on menu prices. I'd rather get the $25 chicken than the $50 filet if I think I'd enjoy it more.

I enjoy reading the responses and the differing opinions on it, but remember that there is no true right or wrong answer, it's truly what you plan to make of it to determine if it's worth it.

 

[elfbo]

We like the free dining plan, but we would not buy the dining plan. If we pay out of pocket for food we tend to skip breakfast (or do it in the room), share CS for early lunch, and have a TS every other night. Sharing meals works for us because we like the same foods and the portions are big.

The savings on a room code, wouldnt quite cover OOP for 4 people, so free dining is better deal. We recalculate each trip, lol.

 

[danicaca]

I have tried to convince my DH that we do not need that much food, and even broke it down by each day comparing what we might spend. Even choosing the most expensive meals, we only save about $100 on the DDP. He is still not convinced, because he likes to prepay for the trip, and not have to worry about pulling cash out every time we have to eat. Has anyone ever loaded money onto a Disney gift card, and used that to pay for meals? I thought maybe this would convince him. Of course if we get "free" dining, that would be a completely different discussion....

 

[havoc315]

I have tried to convince my DH that we do not need that much food, and even broke it down by each day comparing what we might spend. Even choosing the most expensive meals, we only save about $100 on the DDP. He is still not convinced, because he likes to prepay for the trip, and not have to worry about pulling cash out every time we have to eat. Has anyone ever loaded money onto a Disney gift card, and used that to pay for meals? I thought maybe this would convince him. Of course if we get "free" dining, that would be a completely different discussion....

That's not uncommon. The gift card also allows you to truly Pre-pay everything not covered by the dining plan--- tips, appetizers, alcoholic beverages.

 

[smiths02]

SteveandAli...I really enjoyed your post. It is just so individual. I think some people who are a little more hardcore agianst the dining plan (maybe havoc?) feel that the problem is that so many families don't really make an educated decision (and some of the reason is because Disney makes it hard to make an educated decision).

I am so thrifty that if I knew I spent $50 extra pre-paying, I would have WAY less peace of mind For me, trying to get value out of the plan is as much worry as having to look at the bill everytime. (However, when we went with the in-laws, it was a great way to budget and not hear them complain and still get to eat where I want.)

Personally, I also lose peace of mind when I am restricted...no you can't get the Mickey caramel apple or the Goofy make your own treat even though that is what your family is craving instead fill up on soda and nasty chocolate cakes from counter service (which are two things I would rarely, rarely order from fast food/quick service-and not even for health reasons, I just usually like to drink ice water and not have a mildly edible dessert at lunch).

But heck, I guess I am not a big fan of pre-paying at all. Pre-paying always involves the risk that you won't get your money's worth (someone gets sick, you oversleep an ADR, you aren't as hungry as you thought you would be). I don't even love gift cards (not Disney ones) in general b/c you forget to use them, they expire, company goes out of business, etc. Whatever happened to just setting aside a budget for food-if I put $1000 in my savings account BEFORE my trip as my Disney food budget-is that not equivalent to pre-paying?

 

[Nancyg56]

Whatever happened to just setting aside a budget for food-if I put $1000 in my savings account BEFORE my trip as my Disney food budget-is that not equivalent to pre-paying?

I think that it is really important for every family to know what works for them. My family is a planning family. We make our ADR's 180 days in advance. We plan our parks and our "days off". The only thing I really cannot plan is what we will eat but I know that once we get to Disney we are going to eat. I have a very good idea what my family likes to eat and I know what they generally order when we dine out so I know that we will at least break even on the DDP. We have never had it cost more than we spent dining. My DD is an accountant and she keeps very good records while we are there.

Granted, it is not the value that it used to be but for us it is a value nonetheless. I know that I could prepay myself but this does not work for my DH. He likes to have a "final" price and know it is paid before we even step foot on the plane. We always have plenty of spending money that we add into our budget and that takes care of our appetizers if we want them, our cocktails, gratuities and additional meals that me may have planned. I don't pay for what we might use, but from past experience I know what we do use.

Not everyone likes the DDP but it is not the reason for all of the changes that have taken place in Disney. Disney is trying to find ways to keep visitors onsite and spending money in their restaurants, resort hotels and gift shops.

You want to blame something for making one of the biggest impacts on keeping guests hostage within DisneyWorld? Look to ME> You step off of your plane, hop onto the ME bus and then you are trapped. No vehicle to take you offsite to eat or shop. Oh no. You want to eat you get onto another bus that takes you to another Disney property.