DVC plans to target commercial renters

[kilik64]

Difficult to be sure, but what you write is plausible, I think.
The problem is DVC won't increase the first two weeks of December because (I think) a lot of fixed weeks have been sold for those dates. If they increase those more, then they have to use their own points to compensate all owners who keep their weeks. This will make them lose money.

Couple of questions come to mind with this though. When you buy a FW you pay a premium on the points at the start right? So there is already some leeway built in for them to increase the points for those 2 weeks and still not be above what people paid for already because of that? And two, are there really that many? I thought DVC set a cap at how many they would sell for each FW? Are we sure those caps were hit? And even if they were, would it be a large amount that they would actually be concerned about it?

Please let me know what I am wrong on, that's all off memory and I've never paid real close attention to FW specifics.

 

[AstroBlasters]

That’s me. I’d like the 3rd parties shut down. It would have no effect on folks who primarily use DVC for personal use, it would still allow anyone who wanted, to send their friends and family. And it would, IMO, have a huge positive impact on availability.

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of the issue.

 

[Sandisw]

You are conflating two things in an attempt to be…something. There are facts here that don’t care about feelings, and they are:

1) Riv and GF standard studios have been walked since early November
2) Some of those walkers are for personal use
3) Some of those walkers are for maximized rental profits
4) Supply and demand dictates that this week is hard to get regardless of 1, 2, and 3
5) 1, 2, and 3 make supply and demand irrelevant

Now my opinions:

6) Most who logged in today at 8am had no chance at a standard studio except Sandi
7) Sandi got her Riv standard view studio because apparently someone chose December 1st as the end of their walk. Odd.

See, you have made a very big assumption and that I am the only one who got a Resort view studio today by neither walking nor intending to rent.

And that is what is difficult in these conversations because we seem to be mixing renting and commercial renting as though they are the same thing.

Even if I decided tomorrow to offer this for rent…I won’t…and priced it slightly above market value…to offset the cost of an AP…instead of using points through MMB…and it becomes my one and only rental for 2025…it makes no logical sense that DVC can accuse me of being a commercial renter.

Of course, commercial renters book these to take advantage of the extra profit…but that is because they are already a commercial renter.

 

[xdan0920]

At least that’s an honest response that for you, it isn’t really about commercial renting but it’s about the rental market in general.

You really seem to want DVC to pretty much stop owners from renting or institute rules that make it almost impossible to do it.

I’ve been pretty clear from the start that i consider renting through a 3rd party to be commercial.

 

[xdan0920]

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of the issue.

How many points/reservations do you list with a 3rd party per year?

 

[zavandor]

Couple of questions come to mind with this though. When you buy a FW you pay a premium on the points at the start right? So there is already some leeway built in for them to increase the points for those 2 weeks and still not be above what people paid for already because of that? And two, are there really that many? I thought DVC set a cap at how many they would sell for each FW? Are we sure those caps were hit? And even if they were, would it be a large amount that they would actually be concerned about it?

Please let me know what I am wrong on, that's all off memory and I've never paid real close attention to FW specifics.

Yes, a fixed weeks costs 10% more than the equivalent nights. But DVC has already increased the first two weeks of December by around 10% (if I'm not wrong). So they've already "eaten" that premium. Other times is previous months have been increased even more already, to the point that some lucky owners currently own fixed weeks that would cost more points than if they keep the week. But fewer FW have been sold for October than for December.
It's even possible that DVC cannot actually increase December if they haven't ROFRed enough contracts to compensate the extra, I don't know how all that works in practice.

Of course I cannot be certain this is the reason, but I cannot find another reasonable explanation why December was increased less than October.
I started researching DVC in 2011 already at the time early December was the highest demand time of the year, by a good margin.

 

[AstroBlasters]

How many points/reservations do you list with a 3rd party per year?

I rented out a fair amount of points through David’s and DisBoards in 2024 for trips people will be taking in the first half of 2025.

This is mostly because I purchased 6 new resale contracts and wanted to help offset some of the cost.

In future years I am sure we will rent out points to try something different that year.

That flexibility is part of the program.

 

[Sandisw]

I’ve been pretty clear from the start that i consider renting through a 3rd party to be commercial.

Well, then that means that you are defining every single rental as commercial.

And obviously, that can’t be an accurate way to define it since we are allowed to rent.

 

[JOLT]

I rented out a fair amount of points through David’s and DisBoards in 2024 for trips people will be taking in the first half of 2025.

This is mostly because I purchased 6 new resale contracts and wanted to help offset some of the cost.

In future years I am sure we will rent out points to try something different that year.

That flexibility is part of the program.

Walking and renting ::clutches pearls::

all there needs to be is a % of points rented for X years trend and an LLC crack down.

if someone has a different primary person on 80% of their points for 2 years in a row DVC can ask whats going on and determine if its just someone that couldn't go to Disney for 2 year or if they are renting all their points as an investment plan. if they continue having other primary member names than Disney takes action.

I dont understand the 3rd party? I would think less commercial renters would use 3rd party since you get a fraction of the return.

 

[AstroBlasters]

Walking and renting ::clutches pearls::

all there needs to be is a % of points rented for X years trend and an LLC crack down.

if someone has a different primary person on 80% of their points for 2 years in a row DVC can ask whats going on and determine if its just someone that couldn't go to Disney for 2 year or if they are renting all their points as an investment plan. if they continue having other primary member names than Disney takes action.

I dont understand the 3rd party? I would think less commercial renters would use 3rd party since you get a fraction of the return.

I agree with the last part.

I think what Disney really doesn’t want is anything that feels like an asset manager coming in and applying private equity like techniques to DVC at a large scale.

 

[5kidsmommy]

That’s me. I’d like the 3rd parties shut down. It would have no effect on folks who primarily use DVC for personal use, it would still allow anyone who wanted, to send their friends and family. And it would, IMO, have a huge positive impact on availability.

It wouldn't impact us at all either. Heck, we wouldn't care if we were restricted to our home resort either. We bought where we like to stay. We bought DVC for us and us alone. We do have grown kids but they've all said if they want to go to Disney they'll pay for it

 

[JackosinDIS]

I’ve been pretty clear from the start that i consider renting through a 3rd party to be commercial.

This doesn’t make sense. It is the less experienced owners who need help with renting points that are more likely to use a 3rd party site.

It would be a terrible commercial enterprise to rent your points through a broker (unless the aim of your business was to make a loss!)

 

[kilik64]

This doesn’t make sense. It is the less experienced owners who need help with renting points that are more likely to use a 3rd party site.

It would be a terrible commercial enterprise to rent your points through a broker (unless the aim of your business was to make a loss!)

But then it'd be that much harder for average joe to rent, so most likely they wouldn't and not use their points and then magically anyone who wants AKL value studios will get one or some other fantastical argument.

(Thats because the brokers are getting people to make spec rentals vs just renting the points ya know)

 

[xdan0920]

Well, then that means that you are defining every single rental as commercial.

And obviously, that can’t be an accurate way to define it since we are allowed to rent.

Untrue. If I rent to my buddy Mark, I wouldn’t use David’s or whatever. I’d just book his trip and take his money. Rental. Easy peasy.

 

[xdan0920]

I rented out a fair amount of points through David’s and DisBoards in 2024 for trips people will be taking in the first half of 2025.

This is mostly because I purchased 6 new resale contracts and wanted to help offset some of the cost.

In future years I am sure we will rent out points to try something different that year.

That flexibility is part of the program.

Thought as much. And look, I get it. If I’d bought 750 points with the idea that I could rent 500 and take “free” vacations. I wouldn’t want anyone messing with that.

 

[xdan0920]

(Thats because the brokers are getting people to make spec rentals vs just renting the points ya know)

I know you think you’re joking. But this happens quite a lot. I have an account with a 3rd party website, and I get emails weekly encouraging me to book spec rentals.

 

[xdan0920]

There's a lot of Confirmed Reservations for Boardwalk in May at dvcshoprentals right now.

Pulled from another thread. It’s fine though.

 

[sethschroeder]

Shutting down those rentals full time won't make scarce studios available.

I dont care if studios are available.

Its in the contract so enforce it like you should.

Same concept with balancing the point charts for availability. Its not going to be perfect thats fine but its in the baseline contract that they are supposed to be doing that so do it.

Talked with the leadership of the team that balances point charts a number of years ago and the next year they made some actual moves with point charts addressing the fall to early December over demand.

 

[Robber Baron]

Pulled from another thread. It’s fine though.

What?

 

[sethschroeder]

18 minutes is about 17 minutes and 30 seconds too long for most. We're talking 30 seconds of distilled knowledge. I have faith in you.

You could as well with the help of AI if you wanted to. This took 30 seconds for me to get.


How to Walk a DVC Reservation
●
Book a reservation 11 months in advance for a time period that is easier to book at your desired resort. For example, if you want to visit in November, book your reservation for September.
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Wait until near the end of the booked time period.
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Contact Member Services or modify your reservation online to change the reservation dates. For instance, if your reservation is from September 25th to October 1st, move the reservation to be from October 1st to October 8th.
●
Continue to move the reservation in 7-day increments until you reach your desired dates.
Why Walk a DVC Reservation?
●
To secure reservations during popular or hard-to-get time periods.
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To book specific room types with limited availability, like studios or value rooms.
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This strategy is most effective at the 11-month booking window because DVC members have priority access to reservations.

Walking reservations allows DVC members to bypass the limited availability at the 11-month mark by essentially blocking off future dates with an existing reservation. As they "walk" the reservation forward, rooms become available that would otherwise be unavailable. However, this practice is controversial as some DVC members argue that it unfairly blocks availability for others trying to book at the 11-month window.