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[Turn the Page]

What's a little interesting to think about (theoretically) is what happens to the Original 14 when they start running out of contract. If you buy a resale contract afater Jan 19, in 2042 when BCV, OKW, BWV, WL-VBR etc all end their contracts and they "reboot" these resorts, what happens with my AKV contract - now I can't stay at those resorts since they will start those with a new contract. I mean - no one thinks this far ahead, but it's a valid question when buying this. At least maybe just me, but I'm always thinking about 2042.

I'm right there with you. I have been pointing that out for the last few days on a couple of different threads and keep getting poo-poo'd. DH and I are interested in Riviera direct for a few reasons. In the first place, we will be ready to buy in the next year or two and my guess is there won't be many resale contracts at steep discounts at that point. Another reason for Riviera is because......so many of the legacy resorts expire in 2042......right about when we start thinking about taking grandkids to WDW (hopefully of course) so that makes most of the legacy resorts not a good deal for us.

Yes, the next restriction on Riviera resale gives us more to think about but I'm not so sure it will be a make or break thing for us. We need to wait to hear more details about point charts, room configurations, etc. before we make a final decision.

$190 per point for 50 years at Riviera sounds a lot better to me than $130 for less than half that amount of time at BCV. Will this restriction hurt Riviera resales? Of course it will. But how much? Because in a few years, say 10, people are going to be looking at resale contracts that are only good at Riviera but are good for 40 years while BCV contracts are good at 14 resorts but only for 12 years. That sounds like a bad deal to me but I realize I'm in the minority here.

 

[Turn the Page]

I wonder if CCV is selling through the roof right now? Still discounted, fully available direct, full benefits and waitlists for all other properties, 50 years and resales can book at legacy 14.

Any chance the leak (not confirmed by DVC) about riveria resales not being able to book the legacy 14 part of the plan?

You know, I often wonder if sometimes they leak things to get the online community in a tizzy and then issue a statement that dials it back a little so everyone calms down as a strategy to minimize their headache when they make changes they know people won't like.

 

[SL6827]

As others said, it's maybe more of a long-term plan to reduce resale desirability for future resorts.

This. I think Disney wants to get re-sale under control. They have to really hate it as it is now.

 

[bashuck]

Am I correct in thinking that if resale prices at Riveria are significantly depressed because of these changes it will result in Disney using ROFR even more frequently on them? That is a win for them as when they resell them it will be 'direct'.

 

[skippytx]

Am I correct in thinking that if resale prices at Riveria are significantly depressed because of these changes it will result in Disney using ROFR even more frequently on them? That is a win for them as when they resell them it will be 'direct'.

Probably. They don't want to get stuck with too much inventory though, it's a balancing act in a normal economy. My opinion is it's better for DVD to keep resale prices up than try to depress them.

As far as resale values go, I think the monorail/epcot resorts won't be affected at all. No one buys those resale if they don't want to stay there. You could see some depression on OKW/SSR/VB/HH points as those are often bought by people just to use at the 7 month mark elsewhere. Probably not anytime soon, but eventually.

 

[4luv2cdisney]

What's a little interesting to think about (theoretically) is what happens to the Original 14 when they start running out of contract. If you buy a resale contract afater Jan 19, in 2042 when BCV, OKW, BWV, WL-VBR etc all end their contracts and they "reboot" these resorts, what happens with my AKV contract - now I can't stay at those resorts since they will start those with a new contract. I mean - no one thinks this far ahead, but it's a valid question when buying this. At least maybe just me, but I'm always thinking about 2042.

I'm right there with you. I have been pointing that out for the last few days on a couple of different threads and keep getting poo-poo'd. DH and I are interested in Riviera direct for a few reasons. In the first place, we will be ready to buy in the next year or two and my guess is there won't be many resale contracts at steep discounts at that point. Another reason for Riviera is because......so many of the legacy resorts expire in 2042......right about when we start thinking about taking grandkids to WDW (hopefully of course) so that makes most of the legacy resorts not a good deal for us.

Yes, the next restriction on Riviera resale gives us more to think about but I'm not so sure it will be a make or break thing for us. We need to wait to hear more details about point charts, room configurations, etc. before we make a final decision.

$190 per point for 50 years at Riviera sounds a lot better to me than $130 for less than half that amount of time at BCV. Will this restriction hurt Riviera resales? Of course it will. But how much? Because in a few years, say 10, people are going to be looking at resale contracts that are only good at Riviera but are good for 40 years while BCV contracts are good at 14 resorts but only for 12 years. That sounds like a bad deal to me but I realize I'm in the minority here.

I still think they'd have to offer some killer incentives to get me to purchase Riv.

But I do think there is a very good argument for wanting a direct purchase at anything expiring 2060 forward. If you're not using your points outside of WDW, you will have your home resort plus 6 others unless you have access to the DVC2 (or whatever) after 2042.

But let's face it, people with GFV or Poly points are probably not looking to trade into SSR or OKW. So, you've really got Poly, CCV, AKV, BLT and GFV.

Personally, we're interested in BLT, AKV is not an option for us and we probably wouldn't have enough points for GFV. So, we'd be left with using our BLT points at BLT, CCV, or Poly.

 

[MommaBerd]

What's a little interesting to think about (theoretically) is what happens to the Original 14 when they start running out of contract. If you buy a resale contract afater Jan 19, in 2042 when BCV, OKW, BWV, WL-VBR etc all end their contracts and they "reboot" these resorts, what happens with my AKV contract - now I can't stay at those resorts since they will start those with a new contract. I mean - no one thinks this far ahead, but it's a valid question when buying this. At least maybe just me, but I'm always thinking about 2042.

Yes, you will have less options as to where to stay, but there will still be options with great locations. And technically, YOU could stay there, but should you sell your contract, that person would not be able to stay there. I am not denying that resale values will begin to decline on the 2042 resorts in about 10-15 years. However, if DVC continues to raise direct prices, selling my contract in 10 years for $125 pp (what I paid) will seem like a bargain and possibly “worth it” in comparison. I mean RIGHT NOW (or really, in the next week) that is $100 less pp than direct from Disney! It will still look like a bargain!

This did raise a tangential question in my mind. How will OKW work beyond 2042? Will only people with OKW contract extensions and other home resorts be able to stay there?

 

[Turn the Page]

I still think they'd have to offer some killer incentives to get me to purchase Riv.

But I do think there is a very good argument for wanting a direct purchase at anything expiring 2060 forward. If you're not using your points outside of WDW, you will have your home resort plus 6 others unless you have access to the DVC2 (or whatever) after 2042.

But let's face it, people with GFV or Poly points are probably not looking to trade into SSR or OKW. So, you've really got Poly, CCV, AKV, BLT and GFV.

Personally, we're interested in BLT, AKV is not an option for us and we probably wouldn't have enough points for GFV. So, we'd be left with using our BLT points at BLT, CCV, or Poly.

Don't get me wrong, the news about resale doesn't excite us but I'm not sure it's a deal killer either. I'm thinking there will be some incentives or something DVC has planned to sweeten the pot to get people to buy Riviera direct that they haven't announced yet. At least I hope so.

If we decide not to purchase Riviera we will likely go with SSR. We have stayed there several times and really enjoy it. I'm not wild about the expiration date but at least the prices are significantly lower. I really have very little interest in Poly, VGF, or OKW. I wouldn't mind trying BLT and I really want to stay at AKV and CCV at some point.

 

[Turn the Page]

Probably. They don't want to get stuck with too much inventory though, it's a balancing act in a normal economy. My opinion is it's better for DVD to keep resale prices up than try to depress them.

As far as resale values go, I think the monorail/epcot resorts won't be affected at all. No one buys those resale if they don't want to stay there. You could see some depression on OKW/SSR/VB/HH points as those are often bought by people just to use at the 7 month mark elsewhere. Probably not anytime soon, but eventually.

If they don't do something about the monorail soon those resorts may lose the cache of being on the monorail loop. But that's a separate issue.

 

[citivas]

So if I have an unrestricted 200 pt BW contract and I buy a 100pt BW resale a month from now, will I be able to use all 300 pts at any resort?

I doubt it. I would interpret the new rules as you would be able to use the original 200 points at any resort including the new ones yet to open and the new 100 points at only the original 14 resorts.

 

[citivas]

If they don't do something about the monorail soon those resorts may lose the cache of being on the monorail loop. But that's a separate issue.

BLT will always be walkable to MK and VGF and Poly will always be boat-able to it. While a decline in the monorail system is a serious bummer and not being able to rely on it to get to EPCOT could hurt values, I suspect the majority of the value is the easy proximity to MK. We own at BLT and always drive to EPCOT anyway -- we own there 100% for the proximity to MK.

 

[citivas]

Don't get me wrong, the news about resale doesn't excite us but I'm not sure it's a deal killer either. I'm thinking there will be some incentives or something DVC has planned to sweeten the pot to get people to buy Riviera direct that they haven't announced yet. At least I hope so.

If we decide not to purchase Riviera we will likely go with SSR. We have stayed there several times and really enjoy it. I'm not wild about the expiration date but at least the prices are significantly lower. I really have very little interest in Poly, VGF, or OKW. I wouldn't mind trying BLT and I really want to stay at AKV and CCV at some point.

So you're just not concerns that your Riviera points would have almost no asset value beyond your direct tenure of ownership? You're 100% convinced you'd never sell them?

 

[citivas]

Interesting ? but if one would sell a grandfathered resale... wouldn’t that then be deemed a post 1/19/19 resale subject to new rules (orig 14 only)?

Correct. No such thing as a grandfathered contract after resale.

 

[GoofyDisneyDaddy]

But let's face it, people with GFV or Poly points are probably not looking to trade into SSR or OKW. So, you've really got Poly, CCV, AKV, BLT and GFV.

While I 100% agree with this, SSR and OKW offer a nice last minute option to those folks. The system as a whole offers a lot of balance to folks. If (still unofficially confirmed, but I believe it to be the case) Riviera Resale will be restricted to Riviera, then I think the resale on that property should be pennies on the dollar whereas the other DVCs have, and will to continue to have, significant resale value.

As small as the resale market may be relative to direct sales, I think this is more of a matter of DVC simply being tired of competing with resales when making new sales. I don't think they are trying to kill the market, but they don't want to compete with it anymore. So now, when selling Riviera, if a potential buyer says, well hey, isn't it true I could buy this for half price in the resale buyer, the CM can respond yes, but if you buy Riviera in the resale market, it can't be used to trade into the other DVC properties. (True that person could buy the legacy 14 resale and use the legacy 14, but I don't expect that information to be volunteered unless asked).

 

[Turn the Page]

So you're just not concerns that your Riviera points would have almost no asset value beyond your direct tenure of ownership? You're 100% convinced you'd never sell them?

Um, no. The very first sentence in the post you quoted said we weren't excited about that aspect and I said in another post that it would give us more to think about and we need more details before we make a decision.

ETA: Additionally, I also said if the details of purchasing Riviera don't make sense for us we would buy SSR resale.

 

[bebec22]

I have been planning on buying resale at some point this year. I have a trip coming up in Feb where I'm renting points at BLT. I'm leaning towards purchasing BLT but wanted to stay there first before making the final decision. So, do I pull the trigger now and buy BLT resale (and hope it passes ROFR) or do I continue to wait until after my trip to make my decision? Or, do I completely forget the idea of purchasing resale? I really don't care about Riviera now but in 23 years when I have less inventory to choose from, I might care. 23 years from now is around the time I might have grandkids to take. Sigh, I just don't know what to do!

 

[Turn the Page]

I have been planning on buying resale at some point this year. I have a trip coming up in Feb where I'm renting points at BLT. I'm leaning towards purchasing BLT but wanted to stay there first before making the final decision. So, do I pull the trigger now and buy BLT resale (and hope it passes ROFR) or do I continue to wait until after my trip to make my decision? Or, do I completely forget the idea of purchasing resale? I really don't care about Riviera now but in 23 years when I have less inventory to choose from, I might care. 23 years from now is around the time I might have grandkids to take. Sigh, I just don't know what to do!

Did I make a second account in my sleep and post on the same thread? lol.

 

[we"reofftoneverland]

As a recent resale buyer, I still would have bought resale with these new restrictions in place. 14 legacy resorts? That's plenty for me. I'm only a once a year visitor, which I know isn't necessarily the norm around here, but I feel like I would have plenty of options even "only" having access to the legacy resorts. When I went to book my most recent trip, I had a hard enough time narrowing my choices with all of the resort options at WDW. I've been going to WDW since I was a baby in the 80s, and I've been staying at DVC resorts since about 2012, and there are still two resorts I haven't tried, but want to. For my purposes, resale would still definitely be the way to go. The legacy resorts are great. I'm happy to stay at any of them each trip.

We too are recent resale buyers. And yes, we too would have still bought with the 14 resort limit-- except for the fact that it was recently implemented. So it is not the resort limit that is the problem, but the dramatic change. What else will Disney change? Since we purchased last fall, 3 huge changes have been implemented. Too much change, too much instability. DH read the contract backwards and forward when we were purchasing and said they can basically do anything to us. So we knew that going in, but we relied on precedent. We waited 15-20 years watching from the sidelines for precedent to be established! In the past, Disney has treated the vacation club pretty fairly. It seems like now all bets are off. We would not purchase again. And the older I get, the more I realize that my thoughts are not very original. If I am thinking it, millions of others are there too.

 

[bebec22]

Did I make a second account in my sleep and post on the same thread? lol.

Lol, are you in the same predicament I am?

 

[we"reofftoneverland]

I have been planning on buying resale at some point this year. I have a trip coming up in Feb where I'm renting points at BLT. I'm leaning towards purchasing BLT but wanted to stay there first before making the final decision. So, do I pull the trigger now and buy BLT resale (and hope it passes ROFR) or do I continue to wait until after my trip to make my decision? Or, do I completely forget the idea of purchasing resale? I really don't care about Riviera now but in 23 years when I have less inventory to choose from, I might care. 23 years from now is around the time I might have grandkids to take. Sigh, I just don't know what to do!

I personally think they are overbuilding and there will be plenty of deals on regular and dvc resort rooms. I personally would not lock in with dvc. They are raising membership fees alone at higher than the inflation rate.