Plans have been filed for DVC expansion at Caribbean Beach Resort

[Mr. Drauer]

for anyone who is interested, here is the plan sheet for the SFWMD permit design plans.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

... because location is the only thing that is important. Location is the only thing about a resort that can't be changed. Location, location, location. That is why CBR is so attractive for DVC. CBR is not land locked, honestly it's not a logistical issue as much as it is a lack of imagination. Connecting CBR with the friendship boats and the IG at Epcot is a relatively small and inexpensive endeavor with massive upside. It is in between 2 parks rumored and confirmed to be getting the most attention in the next 5 to 10 years. You know it has to drive the suits crazy that a moderate is smack dab in the middle of the action and not earning its full potential.

Ok...this is where we starting shouting at the wind.

Caribbean beach is entirely landlocked and logistically that is a huge deal. This is Florida...you don't "dig a ditch" and put a boat in it.

You can shout about how great that location is based on mapquest all you want. Honestly, you're refusing to grasp the reality here. But don't believe me...stick to your guns.

 

[Madonna3]

Ok...this is where we starting shouting at the wind.

Caribbean beach is entirely landlocked and logistically that is a huge deal. This is Florida...you don't "dig a ditch" and put a boat in it.

You can shout about how great that location is based on mapquest all you want. Honestly, you're refusing to grasp the reality here. But don't believe me...stick to your guns.

That's what I think we're both saying. This is not as "easy and inexpensive" as some think. My husband who is a pro can't see an "easy and inexpensive" solution, DanBoris who I think is also a structural engineer can't see it, and others, who aren't trained in these fields, don't see it either. They're not saying it's impossible, but the location does not lead to an "easy" solution just because of its close proximity. I think if it did, we would have seen access to Epcot a whole lot sooner.

 

[Madonna3]

Everybody is so enamoured with views...

I got some Florida swampland to sell you...

What happens on the back side that looks out on I-4?
(To be fair...if you had a telecope you could see vista way and then you'd really get a night time show )

...nobody wants to address the fact they don't build expensive amenities with dvc, huh?

Not Relevant?

Those are called "standard view"

 

[Madonna3]

for anyone who is interested, here is the plan sheet for the SFWMD permit design plans.

What's the mean?

 

[skier_pete]

I don't know what method they are going to choose; but, I will bet the farm it's going to happen.

I'm with you - how's that conversation going:
Exec: "Look there's $400 million in DVC sales on the table over 2 years if we connect this property to a park."
Imagineer: "But this property is nearly 1000 feet from Epcot. It's completely landlocked!"
Exec:"But in addition, we could upsell what's left of CBR with that direct connection, making tens of millions more each year. Certainly there must be something..."
Imagineer: "But it's separated by a road. A ROAD!!! We can't possibly bridge a ROAD!"
Exec: "Oh you're right, let's sell this DVC at a lower price. Who needs that $400 million extra anyways. Certainly not me have you SEEN my bonus?"

What I'm saying is - maybe there's no "Easy" solution, but what's worth $400 million.

 

[DisFanDad]

Devil's advocate.

What prevents Disney from using this property to debut a new fractional ownership model separate from DVC? One better positioned to grab the market below what is currently offered by DVC.

They can't change any previous agreements, but they are not required to make new properties fit in to the current model.

The current DVC model does.

 

[DisFanDad]

I seem to get told that a lot lately...

I am sorry !!!!

 

[skier_pete]

...nobody wants to address the fact they don't build expensive amenities with dvc, huh? Not Relevant?

Gotta point out that at WLV - they are expanding existing amenities, they took out the old dock and are replacing it with a bigger dock, what looks like TWO brand new restaurants, and possibly activity center, and they spent the money to completely dismantle a pool and replace it with...another pool. So don't tell me they don't spend money on amenities. They realized that the "old" Wilderness Lodge was not enough for the current DVC model - and are spending accordingly.

If this is a DVC resort - they'll put in the amenities.

 

[DisFanDad]

I'm with you - how's that conversation going:
Exec: "Look there's $400 million in DVC sales on the table over 2 years if we connect this property to a park."
Imagineer: "But this property is nearly 1000 feet from Epcot. It's completely landlocked!"
Exec:"But in addition, we could upsell what's left of CBR with that direct connection, making tens of millions more each year. Certainly there must be something..."
Imagineer: "But it's separated by a road. A ROAD!!! We can't possibly bridge a ROAD!"
Exec: "Oh you're right, let's sell this DVC at a lower price. Who needs that $400 million extra anyways. Certainly not me have you SEEN my bonus?"

What I'm saying is - maybe there's no "Easy" solution, but what's worth $400 million.

THat, right there, that's it.

Its not about being easy or inexpensive. But heck, even at $100 million ... yes, one hundred million dollars, there is still a potentially huge upside to making the investment.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

That's what I think we're both saying. This is not as "easy and inexpensive" as some think. My husband who is a pro can't see an "easy and inexpensive" solution, DanBoris who I think is also a structural engineer can't see it, and others, who aren't trained in these fields, don't see it either. They're not saying it's impossible, but the location does not lead to an "easy" solution just because of its close proximity. I think if it did, we would have seen access to Epcot a whole lot sooner.

Some Of us also work in environmental engineering

...just because I worked for Disney, doesn't mean I meant to go "career"

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Gotta point out that at WLV - they are expanding existing amenities, they took out the old dock and are replacing it with a bigger dock, what looks like TWO brand new restaurants, and possibly activity center, and they spent the money to completely dismantle a pool and replace it with...another pool. So don't tell me they don't spend money on amenities. They realized that the "old" Wilderness Lodge was not enough for the current DVC model - and are spending accordingly.

If this is a DVC resort - they'll put in the amenities.

Gotta point out that wilderness lodge already has a rack hotel and a dvc unit already long since paid for...in the DELUXE category

...think they've made a buck or two off that?

And unless I'm mistaken...whispering canyon, Roaring forks, artists point, the health club, the childcare center, the lobby, the gift shops, and the main pool will still be there...

So Yes - I will tell you they mooch, thank you very much.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

THat, right there, that's it.

Its not about being easy or inexpensive. But heck, even at $100 million ... yes, one hundred million dollars, there is still a potentially huge upside to making the investment.

$100 mil got you "frozen: ever after"...how far you think that's taking you?

Wait...are we talking Canadian?

 

[skier_pete]

THat, right there, that's it.

Its not about being easy or inexpensive. But heck, even at $100 million ... yes, one hundred million dollars, there is still a potentially huge upside to making the investment.

Poly has just over 4 million points - at say $170 per point average = $680 million in sales. That's the carrot. I don't know about $100 million, but you can't tell me it will cost that much to make that connection - I would say $25 to $50 million at most.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Those are called "standard view"

So 22 a night to watch the ball, 8 to watch the traffic on I-4...

That should work...

 

[skier_pete]

$100 mil got you "frozen: ever after"...how far you think that's taking you?

Wait...are we talking Canadian?

$100 got you a near entire gutting of a ride PLUS the 3 x character greet. You aren't spending that much for a canal.

So 22 a night to watch the ball, 8 to watch the traffic on I-4...

That should work...

22 and 14 probably.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Poly has just over 4 million points - at say $170 per point average = $680 million in sales. That's the carrot. I don't know about $100 million, but you can't tell me it will cost that much to make that connection - I would say $25 to $50 million at most.

Well...you obviously don't work in construction, Pete...

When they build a project, say for $500 mil...do you think it's $100 in site prep and $400 on buildings, theming, and art?

...more like the opposite. Site work doesn't even flinch/get started until we're talking 9 figures...realistically.

 

[sachilles]

What's the mean?

Just a guess, but I think it's something like South Florida Water managment District. The plans are showing water flow through the basins.

Looks thoroughly unimpressive to me. I don't see the splash that would make as a DVC of any level.

 

[sachilles]

The angle of the building seems an odd choice if you wanted to maximize fireworks views towards epcot.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

$100 got you a near entire gutting of a ride PLUS the 3 x character greet. You aren't spending that much for a canal.



22 and 14 probably.

I think you might be out of your zone here...have to know the relative costs.

Where do you think those budgets for avatar, new fantasyland, disney springs came from?

Well...avatar proves my point...it's over budget by a reportedly huge amount because my buddy joe thinks 3/4 IS FOR ART...that's how you get a 200% budget. Just like ak 1.0