Selling of the fastpass....

[UNCFanatik]

I have said REPEATEDLY that late FP usage affected FP availability and caused FPs to run out faster at TSMM and Soarin.

How do you know that this happened at TSMM? You stated that it had been 10 yrs between the trip you just took and the one before that. TSMM was not even open 10 yrs ago so you have no first hand experience on this.

I wasnt at Gettysburg either but I can read different accounts of what has happened there.

 

[t_catt11]

I wasnt at Gettysburg either but I can read different accounts of what has happened there.

Okay, that's fair. Can you link us to some of these accounts where late fastpasses caused TSM or Soarin to run out of available passes earlier than they would have otherwise? We do need actual evidence, mind you - not another conspiracy theorist on a message board.

By all means, show me some solid data as to where, when, and how this happened, and I promise to read it with an open mind.

 

[Glennie5]

Yep. More to the point, does UNCFanatik actually have some data to back this up?
I made a prediction that Disney would miss out on some sales from families who rush to hit hard fastpass windows. I did not claim to have sales receipts, despite what is posted above by UNCFanatik. Perhaps my prediction will be wrong. As stated in the article, time will tell.
Our friend here makes repeated claims that late fastpasses use hurt the FP availability of TSM and Soarin... where is the evidence to back this up?
Have no fear, no such evidence is forthcoming - I doubt that WDW has this data themselves; I guarantee that UNCFanatik does not. It won't stop him from leveling yet another personal attack on me in a sad attempt to divert attention from the fact that he's the one making wild, baseless assertions.
Yup. I'm still holding out hope that our friend will decide to help fill the gaps in my spelling, editing, and reading comprehension, and take up my offer to help me produce better content for my site. Guess I shouldn't hold my breath, though.

I for one enjoyed looking through your web site and think it is great that you have taken the time to help other's plan their Disney vacation. For those of us who live in reality we get that things change and mistakes are made, no one is perfect but it would be a cold day in - well you know where before I would take UNCFanatic's advice on anything!

 

[t_catt11]

I for one enjoyed looking through your web site and think it is great that you have taken the time to help other's plan their Disney vacation. For those of us who live in reality we get that things change and mistakes are made, no one is perfect but it would be a cold day in - well you know where before I would take UNCFanatic's advice on anything!

Thanks, I appreciate that. I'm trying to share something that I enjoy with other people. That's all. That, perhaps, and the ability to live vicariously through them a bit (I love to browse photos submitted at the character finder).

I do make mistakes, and I could certainly do a better job of bird dogging older information that needs updating. Ah, well.

All fun aside, I'm always happy to get contributions from other Disney lovers.

 

[UNCFanatik]

Yep. More to the point, does UNCFanatik actually have some data to back this up?

Yes, its called guest behavior before and after the recent FP enforcement. Other variables have been introduced as well and not enough time has passed to see what ultimately happens. You seem to deny there will be any change on whether a previous FP late user will still pull the same FPs in the same number as before.

I made a prediction that Disney would miss out on some sales from families who rush to hit hard fastpass windows. I did not claim to have sales receipts, despite what is posted above by UNCFanatik. Perhaps my prediction will be wrong. As stated in the article, time will tell.

And you assert that prediction as coming true in your post here:

http://www.disboards.com/showpost.php?p=45173315&postcount=162

People do rush around the parks now and buy fewer Buzz chirts, er, shirts.

You claimed to have knowledge of merchandise sales because you said sales had decreased.

More credibility issues with what you say.

Our friend here makes repeated claims that late fastpasses use hurt the FP availability of TSM and Soarin... where is the evidence to back this up?

Have no fear, no such evidence is forthcoming - I doubt that WDW has this data themselves; I guarantee that UNCFanatik does not. It won't stop him from leveling yet another personal attack on me in a sad attempt to divert attention from the fact that he's the one making wild, baseless assertions.

The evidence lies within the changing of the guests behavior that use to use late FPs pre-enforcement. It is just basic math that the more people that pull FPs from a limited supply of FPs at TSMM and Soaring, the faster that supply runs out.

But now we have the supposed variable of increased FPs being put in circulation. But we have heard reports that FPs for Soarin and TSMM are now available later in the day than before. Perhaps a stat site like Touring Plans will take a closer look at the numbers.

Yup. I'm still holding out hope that our friend will decide to help fill the gaps in my spelling, editing, and reading comprehension, and take up my offer to help me produce better content for my site. Guess I shouldn't hold my breath, though.

As I am hoping you will provide support for your wild claims that now include knowing the capacity of FP machines.

Your pitiful site should be shut down because it is worthless.

 

[UNCFanatik]

Okay, that's fair. Can you link us to some of these accounts where late fastpasses caused TSM or Soarin to run out of available passes earlier than they would have otherwise? We do need actual evidence, mind you - not another conspiracy theorist on a message board.

By all means, show me some solid data as to where, when, and how this happened, and I promise to read it with an open mind.

one needs only to begin with Disney's own communication as shared earlier:

Disney's FASTPASS service return time reminder
02/08/2012

In order to provide the best experience possible for everyone at our theme parks, all Walt Disney World Guests will be expected to return within their Disney's FASTPASS return time window, effective March 7.

Disney's FASTPASS service plays an important role in our Guests' ability to enjoy their visit to one of our Walt Disney World theme parks, and our ability to provide this great service is dependent upon Guests returning during the designated window. The vast majority of our Guests are aware of their return times and arrive in the window printed on the Disney's FASTPASS ticket.

As more Guests choose to take advantage of this feature, we want to provide the same opportunity to everyone. By asking all Guests to return within the window printed on their pass, more Guests will have the opportunity to enjoy this great service.

This is not a change, but simply a reminder of our existing policy. All Cast Members are expected to adhere to this policy when visiting the parks as Guests.

from the bolded section we see that even Disney acknowledges the negative affects of late FP usage. Namely, that late FP usage prevented others from obtaining FPs and having the opporunity to enjoy it.

 

[t_catt11]

....lots of post content here...

So, no. You have no data. You have your interpretations of thirdhand reports colored by your opinion. On one hand, you tell us that fastpass distribution numbers are increased, or may have been adjusted (funny how you have knowledge of the thing you insist I claim to know, which I have never done), on the other, fastpasses are available later because there is no more late use.

Let's say that fastpasses are available later in the day. I could claim that this is because more passes are distributed, or that people are slower in walking lately, or that Mickey was sticking more in the machines later in the day. None of these are based on evidence, much liek the conclusion that you draw.

Also, please link us, or quote me, where I claimed to have knowledge of fastpass capacity.

Your post is full of opinion, conclusions drawn, and of course, the obligatory - and ever more nasty - personal attack. But no actual data. Anyone still reading this thread, raise your hand if you are surprised.

 

[UNCFanatik]

Thanks, I appreciate that. I'm trying to share something that I enjoy with other people. That's all. That, perhaps, and the ability to live vicariously through them a bit (I love to browse photos submitted at the character finder).

I do make mistakes, and I could certainly do a better job of bird dogging older information that needs updating. Ah, well.

All fun aside, I'm always happy to get contributions from other Disney lovers.

You forgot the part where you charge money for services on your website for "professional vacation advice". Is that the part where you give them all the wrong info that you have admittedly spread? Awesome!

Though who would pay $49 for such inaccurate info. maybe Glennie5 will pony up.

 

[goofy4tink]

I am sorry but what "magic"? The same "magic" that other guests with entitlement mentalities who abuse Disney systems and policies in areas such as CRT ressies and FP abuse in the past not to mention the whole pool hopping, refillable mug crowd. These are the people that prevent the spread of "magic" to others in Disney.

I dont spend 1000s of dollars at Disney to give other people anything that I have worked to get through proper planning. The other people have the same chance and opportunities but make other choices. Yet, they want to whine about those choices and how everything should be catered around them. that is why you hear the whining and gnashing of teeth about the FP enforcement. Funny though because all of their doomsday predictions have failed to come true but it doesnt stop them from whining all the time in various threads. Like a spoiled little child.

And dont worry, my trip last week to Disney was my first in about 10 years and I am good for another 10 years or more now.

Using your mentality, and argument....most people who researched prior to their trips, up until March 7, knew that they could use FPs past the window. So....I shouldn't do something, that Disney completely allows and actively encourages, because someone else didn't do their homework and didn't realize they could use FPs after the return window?? Not my problem. You either understand the way the system works, or you don't. Disney told us we could use the FP's late...we did. They are now no longer allowing that...so, we don't try to use them after the window expires.
I seriously doubt that someone who hasn't been to WDW in 10 years, and then makes one trip, is a veritable font of knowledge.

Something tells me he is deliberately ignoring this post.

Not surprising.

Hey...remember the fun days when you use to ACTUALLY have to stand in line for the full amount of time?

The only way to fast pass was to have one family member stand in line and wait and then when they get close to the front the whole dang family would cut through the line and "catch up".

I actually saw that in the soarin line just recently. Some people.

Oh, you mean like my first trip in '99 when I didn't know any better and went to Splash Mt at about 2:30pm, on a Sat??? 3 hrs in that line...who knew??!!! What an idiot!!!

I'm not exactly sure what 'service recovery procedure' is. So, I can't comment on how it applies to WDW. But, I do know that after close to 40 stays at WDW, since '99, I'm pretty well versed in the workings of WDW. I'm pretty clear on what Disney allows and what they don't allow. All I know is that Disney put fine print, on the reverse of the FP, stating that you should return to the attraction between the stated times on your FP. And that they, in all actuality, allowed you to return pretty much whenever you wanted to, that day. As I said in a previous post..but you seem to have chosen to ignore that one, Disney used to allow you to use the FP on different days, even different months!!!! I had friends that had FPs from stays 6 months prior to the current one, and they were allowed to use them. Now....Disney closed that loophole after about a year!!! So, they allowed you to return at any time. In all reality, there just weren't all that many people using FPs beyond the window..so there wasn't all that much impact on the FP availability. Besides you could only get so many in a day due to the various windows. There was often a 2 hr period you had to wait until your next FP would be available.
As of this moment, there are no FPs available at Peter Pan's Flight. I have a Disney app for that...love it. So, it's 3:30 and no more FPs available. And, you can't use 'em late. So, I have to wonder why we are still seeing reports from people that they can't get TSM FPs at noontime.

Oh, and by the way??? There have been many times, right up until March 7, that CMs at Soarin' did not allow you to return past your FP window! Depended on how busy it was. And few guests complained.

There is much ignorance at WDW. Go to RnRC sometime. Use a FP and charge up the FP que..watch how those multitudes of guests, standing in the standby que, look at you. Not pretty looks. If I had a dollar for every time I heard someone say to their buddy..'Yeah, they think they're special cause they have plenty of money to burn and can get those passes that let you get right on.' or 'Wish we had enough cash to buy one of those.' or 'I wonder what they used to let them get in that line.' Plenty of people not doing their homework. So, there were a huge number of guests that never even realized you could use your FP after the window expired.

I just can't see how holding onto the FPs to use later so negatively impacted others' ability to get a FP. Sure, if they were gone early in the day, then no, late arriving guests couldn't get one. But, more people took FPs and then tossed them when they realized they couldn't use them....did that impact others as well??? Same thing as using them later in the day....that FP was still taken out of service, so to speak.

 

[t_catt11]

one needs only to begin with Disney's own communication as shared earlier:



from the bolded section we see that even Disney acknowledges the negative affects of late FP usage. Namely, that late FP usage prevented others from obtaining FPs and having the opporunity to enjoy it.

I asked for data, not a PR release. Disney loves to talk about service improvements and the like, when most guests will readily admit that service isn't what it was even five years ago.

Data. As in, number of late fastpasses used and their impact on fastpass availability. Not opinion, not rhetoric, not a company line on a press release. Data.

And I'm the one with the comprehension issue.

 

[TxMickeyLover]

Just checking in....to see how things are going.....still going I see

It's like a train wreck. You want to cover your eyes, so you can't see the carnage, but you just can't seem to help peeking through your fingers.

 

[UNCFanatik]

So, no. You have no data. You have your interpretations of thirdhand reports colored by your opinion. On one hand, you tell us that fastpass distribution numbers are increased, or may have been adjusted (funny how you have knowledge of the thing you insist I claim to know, which I have never done), on the other, fastpasses are available later because there is no more late use.

Let's say that fastpasses are available later in the day. I could claim that this is because more passes are distributed, or that people are slower in walking lately, or that Mickey was sticking more in the machines later in the day. None of these are based on evidence, much liek the conclusion that you draw.

Also, please link us, or quote me, where I claimed to have knowledge of fastpass capacity.

Your post is full of opinion, conclusions drawn, and of course, the obligatory - and ever more nasty - personal attack. But no actual data. Anyone still reading this thread, raise your hand if you are surprised.

I gave you Disney's own opinion on the matter but its OK if you want to ignore and hold to your own wrong headed theories and add them to the rest of your mistakes and inaccuracies.

If you read what I wrote and obviously you have the reading comprehension of a 5 yr old, then you will see where I do freely admit that there have been reported variables since FP enforcement has begun.

All we have are reports from various guest and CMs right now in areas where Disney does not release the data. The same kind of third hand reports that you base your character sightings section of your website on. Funny how those reports are good enough for you there but not in this case.

Yes, my post are full of opinion as much as yours are. As much as anyone's are on *gasp* a discussion board. But the difference is, I never claimed to be a Disney expert where you do and offer "professional Disney advice" on your website. Advice that has been proven to be questionable and all together wrong.

 

[t_catt11]

You forgot the part where you charge money for services on your website for "professional vacation advice". Is that the part where you give them all the wrong info that you have admittedly spread? Awesome!

Though who would pay $49 for such inaccurate info. maybe Glennie5 will pony up.

For $49, I provide information to people that they can freely obtain themselves - and I tell them this before they pay. Some people don't want to spend hours reading message boards and books to learn things that Dis nuts consider to be basic info.

I explain fastpass. I explain ADRs and character dining. I stress the importance of showing up early. I offer advice on picking accommodations, on getting around the parks, on how to choose days. I offer advice on headliners and on general touring strategy.

I answer countless questions for that $49, and act as a search engine for those that don't feel like searching for themselves.

I do not hide the fact that I offer this service. However, I don't push it, either - here or even on my own site - it's in the menu there, nothing more... and I NEVER send anyone from the Dis to that page. All of the information on my site is freely available; take it or leave it.

Again, I'm not sure how your personal attacks have anything to do with your lack of understanding about fastpass. Once again, you rely on diversion and strawman arguments to take the focus off your lack of evidence for your position.

 

[t_catt11]

...All we have are reports from various guest and CMs right now in areas where Disney does not release the data. The same kind of third hand reports that you base your character sightings section of your website on. Funny how those reports are good enough for you there but not in this case...

Seriously? Someone reporting that they saw Pinocchio at DHS on the 15th of the month is completely different than someone reporting that fastpasses ran out early because those darned late fastpass users hogged them all. No wonder you can't be reasoned with.

 

[UNCFanatik]

I asked for data, not a PR release. Disney loves to talk about service improvements and the like, when most guests will readily admit that service isn't what it was even five years ago.

Data. As in, number of late fastpasses used and their impact on fastpass availability. Not opinion, not rhetoric, not a company line on a press release. Data.

And I'm the one with the comprehension issue.

Yes, and lets see your data as well that contradicts what the Disney press release says? And your data on merchandise sales decreases that you claim have happened since FP enforcement.

Since I see that your website is woefully out of date, I will give you 5 years to supply me with that data.

 

[UNCFanatik]

Seriously? Someone reporting that they saw Pinocchio at DHS on the 15th of the month is completely different than someone reporting that fastpasses ran out early because those darned late fastpass users hogged them all. No wonder you can't be reasoned with.

Still a third hand report. I guess you only agree with third hand reports that support your wrong headed theories and ideas.

 

[t_catt11]

Yes, and lets see your data as well that contradicts what the Disney press release says? And your data on merchandise sales decreases that you claim have happened since FP enforcement.

Since I see that your website is woefully out of date, I will give you 5 years to supply me with that data.

I made a prediction and ended the article with "time will tell". I did not claim to have sales data. I love how you invent statements and attribute them to me.

 

[Glennie5]

You forgot the part where you charge money for services on your website for "professional vacation advice". Is that the part where you give them all the wrong info that you have admittedly spread? Awesome!

Though who would pay $49 for such inaccurate info. maybe Glennie5 will pony up.

I was able to look through his website for free, I did not have to pay $49 - that is an option that his web site offers. Now unless you have paid the $49 for his professional advice then you really can't say if "that" information is inaccurate or not.

 

[t_catt11]

Still a third hand report. I guess you only agree with third hand reports that support your wrong headed theories and ideas.

You are truly amazing. You do realize that in a courtroom, one can offer into evidence events that one has witnessed, but one cannot offer into evidence their opinion as to why those events took place - speculation is not evidence.

Seeing a character and reporting that is useful to others. Now, we do get trolls from time to time who probably report sightings that did not happen; that's okay.

Someone trying to tell me that fastpasses were gone due to late returners (a) doesn't make sense and (b) is impossible for them to know.

More and more, I get the feeling that you are just keeping on at this for the sake of keeping on. Surely, no rational person can believe that the two types of reports are equivalent?

 

[UNCFanatik]

For $49, I provide information to people that they can freely obtain themselves - and I tell them this before they pay. Some people don't want to spend hours reading message boards and books to learn things that Dis nuts consider to be basic info.

I explain fastpass. I explain ADRs and character dining. I stress the importance of showing up early. I offer advice on picking accommodations, on getting around the parks, on how to choose days. I offer advice on headliners and on general touring strategy.

I answer countless questions for that $49, and act as a search engine for those that don't feel like searching for themselves.

I do not hide the fact that I offer this service. However, I don't push it, either - here or even on my own site - it's in the menu there, nothing more... and I NEVER send anyone from the Dis to that page. All of the information on my site is freely available; take it or leave it.

Again, I'm not sure how your personal attacks have anything to do with your lack of understanding about fastpass. Once again, you rely on diversion and strawman arguments to take the focus off your lack of evidence for your position.

Not diversion at all. I will remind you YET again. You are the one that used YOUR website as a basis and support for YOUR credibility. I only referenced your website once YOU brought it into the discussion.

I just ask the basic question of if you have so many mistakes on your websites and you have made so many inaccurate and unsubstantiated claims in this thread alone, then why should anyone lend you any credibility when it comes back to the original topic and your opinions on Disney policy. Now, you want to cherry pick which Disney communication to believe. You want us to believe the chart you produced but you call into question the validity of what Disney says in its Feb communication where they plainly state that:

1. It was not a change in policy
2. Late FP use was negatively affecting other guests.

You are the one that have went off on wild tangents because you have reading comprehension issues.