Reducing the Disney "Experience"

[PetePanMan]

IMO Many hard core Disney fans seem to struggle with change, even small ones. This is probably due to all the good the memories, nostalgia. etc. I do get it and I don't like all the changes either but I am pleased to see that Disney is doing things. I think many of the changes (FP+, starbucks (gasp), Maelstrom being Frozen etc.) were done in response to guest comments. It is just that you can't please everyone.

 

[larryz]

If I can ever get that time machine thing going, maybe we can get the rest of the EPCOT groupies together and hit 1985 EPCOT just for ole time's sake.....

I'd rather hit 1996 Pleasure Island and spend one more night bouncing between the Comedy Warehouse and the Adventurer's Club...

 

[SingingMom]

I'd rather hit 1996 Pleasure Island and spend one more night bouncing between the Comedy Warehouse and the Adventurer's Club...

I miss these two, also!! :-(

"SingingMom" ....Sent from my iPad using DISBoards

 

[Planogirl]

I'd rather hit 1996 Pleasure Island and spend one more night bouncing between the Comedy Warehouse and the Adventurer's Club...

Let's go there after Epcot closes. Pleasure Island was a hoot.

 

[TeamEvansGo]

This thread originated about the "magic" of Disney being lost. And this is a post of the economics of how much alcohol you get for your dollar.

I get it, they are cutting back and it stinks. It makes us all reach even further in our pockets.

But, priorities. If the Magic of Disney is how much beer you get at a beer festival is your magic, I can recommend at least a dozen East Coast beer Fests that you will feel you get your money's worth at.

It's amazing how quickly people lose site of how much Disney World has to offer as soon as they take something out they specifically liked.

Nothing in OP's list is really that big of a deal. These are third tier attractions and performances (at best) and their absence really doesn't ruin the magic for the majority of visitors to the parks.

The magic of Disney isn't about a bar band in kilts, it's not about someone making candy and it's not about a robot trash can. It's the culmination of a setting, staff and theme that delivers an exceptional experience. If you aren't willing to give in to the experience, and would rather nit pick what you don't like, you aren't letting yourself enjoy the magic. That's, quite frankly, your problem.

PUSH sang me Happy Birthday once, it was one of my favorite memories of Disney World. That being said, when I heard he was gone my only thought was "How cool was it that I was able to experience that! I can't wait to see what new experiences I can have on my next trip."

Change is good. Change is inevitable. Disney World wasn't built to be the same park every year. If it was, no one would be going anymore. If it's just too much for you to handle, then maybe it's time to move on.

 

[cakebaker]

You guys lost me at Pleasure Island. I really dislike it, never thought it fit in very well and I'm glad to see it change.

I'm a big believer in change and not insisting that everything stay the same. At the same time, it's pretty much ok to miss some of your favorite things at WDW that are no longer there. And yes, the longer you go to WDW, the more you miss things that you loved.

Tapestry, Lights of Winter- these are things taken away and replaced with ....nothing. My message for Disney is, change it if you have to, I'll look back on those things I really loved as great opportunities to see some really great things, but don't just rip out and leave a hole where there used to be something really great.

Epcot is in severe need of some love from Disney. I don't see it getting much and I haven't for a very long time. There's no new sparkly that keeps me from remembering when it was great and they had x, y or z there.

 

[tony67]

It's amazing how quickly people lose site of how much Disney World has to offer as soon as they take something out they specifically liked.

I think the real issue is the continuous drop in quality and experience over the last 7 or 8 years. The continuous money grab that has gone one. Less for more...

Again it goes back to the Frog in boiling water analogy.
Some of us will see it some of us won't, and many just down want to admit it.

Well it's obvious from these boards and others (at least to me) that more people are unhappy with Disney than ever.
These are people that have been 20 30 even 40 times - if they are unhappy maybe you have an issue.


And the response to this:
"There again, if you can't get with the program, maybe vacation elsewhere... There's no way around it..." and

"Disney has made it pretty clear that you either get on board the my magic plus train or get left at the station."

"If people don't like it, they can go to other amusement parks and not worry about FP+."

"Talk with your money! It's a whole lot louder than talking with your fingers, but then still spending the money."

And of course lets not forget the classic "You should be happy just to be at Disney. "

 

[clsteve]

I'd rather hit 1996 Pleasure Island and spend one more night bouncing between the Comedy Warehouse and the Adventurer's Club...

It's a deal.

Kungaloosh...!!

 

[kmb584]

Will they ever get rid of the Castle? Or meet and greets with the main characters? Or evening shows and parades? To me therein lies the magic. Not a talking trash can. Yes, I agree that they are cutting corners, yes it hurts to see, but no do I ever think a trip to WDW will have the magic of a trip to Six flags.

For some of us the magic is in those the small details.

 

[goofy4tink]

I still love WDW...truly I do. But, some of the changes that I'm seeing over the past few years is disheartening to say the least. Yes, things have to change. But, they don't see to be changing for the better.
I think that Disney is relying on first time visitors. They have proven they don't much care about those of us that return often. So, we either have to deal with it or just not go. Those that are going for the first time won't notice any differences. Who knows? They may even be fine with a lumberjack show. I have a trip in 2 weeks, then nothing planned. And that's unusual. I usually have a trip being planned at all times. I'm heading to San Diego right after Thanksgiving and driving up to DL for two days with another couple. Never been there, so eager to see the 'mother land'! After that? Who knows. Lots of places to visit...probably won't be returning to WDW multiple times a year anymore.

 

[ncdj2013]

Will they ever get rid of the Castle? Or meet and greets with the main characters? Or evening shows and parades[/B]? To me therein lies the magic. Not a talking trash can. Yes, I agree that they are cutting corners, yes it hurts to see, but no do I ever think a trip to WDW will have the magic of a trip to Six flags.

The parades are gone from HS and AK.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I understand that you have no empathy for anyone else's sense of loss.

I just don't understand WHY.

If you actually cared about the Disney experience, I'd think that you would be aware
that at the rate they are cutting and reducing what makes WDW special,
things that ARE important to you (or your son...) just might be on the cutting block in the coming months.

Pardon the pun--while it is sad that Push is gone, when push came to shove, it seems he was dismissed after a contract dispute, wasn't he? If that is the case--just because it is Disney doesn't necessarily warrant contracted employees to try and milk the opportunity.

I miss the acrobats in China. Not sure what happened there, but we loved them.

 

[Doug7856]

Under Bob Iger, the Walt Disney World parks have focused on extracting higher prices with very little if any additional value. The insane room and food costs, crazy increases in admission prices (well above income growth and inflation) without increase value demonstrate management willing to extract equity from the parks in order to give the appearance of growing profits. In the end this will diminish the good will of Disney's best customers and leave the parks with less ability to return profits. It's very hard to earn back goodwill when it's been withdrawn but poor management. The rate of profits form Disney Parks is considerably less now than when Eisner was CEO.

Epcot is a mess and the Magic Bands have exposed many of it's weaknesses, particularly the lack of attractions people want to experience.

Disney's Hollywood Studios has become disjointed, without a theme and again too few rides for families to experience.

Magic Kingdom has become the park that has to absorb the crowds because of the deficiencies of the other two parks.

Animal Kingdom is getting some love and attention. This will help in the long run.

This past July our family visited Disneyland for five amazing days. The line at Toy Story Midway Mania never had a posted wait of more than 25 minutes. The reason, in my opinion: there were so many wonderful attractions in the park to absorb the crowds and they were disbursed throughout the park.

Iger's focus at Walt Disney World has been to extract profits and not keep up with the crowds. Once people catch on, the crowds will choose to take their vacation dollars elsewhere. Iger's parks are living on diminishing goodwill that eventually will be lost without Disney's imagination and magic.

 

[tony67]

For some of us the magic is in those the small details.

I think that is what is being missed by a lot of these people.

These little things all add up and that is what made Disney different - the attention to detail that is now long gone

They will defend Disney again and again - I've seen that a lot over the years I've been on this board - and I've been attacked many times just because I was not a lemming.

It's started to change a lot over the last year or so...more and more people dissatisfied.
More and more people feeling like Mickey has his hand in their pocket.

I've never liked Off Kilter - but a lot of people did - and for a lot of those people that was the straw that broke the camels back.

I'm sure a lot of these people that are defending Disney will have one of those final straws moments unless something changes as well.

Iger's focus at Walt Disney World has been to extract profits and not keep up with the crowds. Once people catch on, the crowds will choose to take their vacation dollars elsewhere. Iger's parks are living on diminishing goodwill that eventually will be lost without Disney's imagination and magic.

I agree - but they have purchased a lot of franchises and they will be able to milk those and offset issues in the parks IMO

 

[Airship Ariadne]

I'm usually not one to complain about changes and even the loss of this, that or the other, but we just got done digging thru some old videos and one was the Lights of Winter back in 2002 . Cast In Bronze plays at a local Renfaire my daughters work at, so nice to still get to hear them at least. sigh

I don't know why either....

DD actually did a photo collage for the PTA "Reflections" competition a few years back when the theme was..."Better together" or something like that...got pictures of Frank in his mask with different shots of the bells...she got pretty far in the competition...so yes, catching a Cast in Bronze show is required viewing for our Ren Fest trips...guess that is why I am not too bummed about Off Kiltr...because we see so many celtic shows around here, there is a Ren Fest withing two hours of our home pretty much every weekend of the year Feb-June and Sept-Nov.

And let's not bring the castle cake or the wand and hands at EPCOT on the heads of current management....that had Eisner written all over them.

Sad to see some of these shows go (the Fife and Drum show really should be a lasting piece of the American Pavilion).

But they do need to occasionally update...let's hope they will put in some more country specific shows...and more rides dag-nabit!

 

[leebee]

My biggest issue with the changes is NOT that changes are being made, but that things are being eliminated and replaced with… NOTHING. Look at Epcot and all the empty buildings; Horizons replaced with nothing, Wonders of Life replaced with nothing (except the occasional party center). The Viking Ship in Norway is gone (and now Maelstrom, but at least something will replace it), acrobats in China, the masquerade characters in Italy, Miyoshi in Japan, living statues in France, Mo Rockin', Off Kilter (replaced with something that requires too large a venue to be done appropriately in that little spot). Does the Ooompah Band still play in the courtyard in Germany so everyone can Chicken Dance together? What happened to the Lights of Winter (or just the light arch that was there otherwise) and the fountain that danced to the music playing along with the water show? Tapestry of Nations? At one time, ALL of these were a part of Epcot. Now none (or almost none) are.

PP commented "Will they take the Castle away?" Actually, in a sense, they have. You used to be able to go IN the Castle, to walk through it from the hub to FL, see the beautiful mosaics on the wall. CRT used to have the FairyGodmother sitting in the lobby; queue up for a meet&greet while awaiting your meal… or if it wasn't busy, go meet the FG anyhow! The Castle Forecourt shows are fun, and a nice addition, but isn't there some other way to produce them than to close the Castle to visitors?

Look at how experiences in the restaurants have changed. Little things- venue-specific napkins, mickey-head butter pats, mickeyroni and cheese, etc.- have changed, food quality is lower, variety limited/offerings more generic, etc. All this adds up. DIsney USED to be able to give a terrific dining experience, but not anymore- and many believe it was in the chase for the dollar that the restaurants lost much of their individuality and quality. It's all about money.

Entertainment? I remember when live shows had pre-shows, actual entertainers to make the 30-60 minute wait pass more quickly. There were singers and jugglers at Fantasmic and 4-for-a-Dollar at Beauty & the Beast. The "counselors" at Camp Mickey-Minnie used to teach the crowd at Festival of the Lion King the hand-bop, so they could "play" along with Hakuna Matata. Why did all this end? Money.

It never surprised me that they closed PI; of course, during its heyday, I had small kids and didn't have the luxury of adult-only entertainment. Now I look at WDW when the parks closed and think "what do we do now?" We stayed on the Boardwalk last week and the Dance Hall was almost empty all the time, and JellyRolls? We listened to the off-key, lame singing from the 10 people inside and decided it wasn't worth the cover charge. While PI might have been TOO great an undertaking, some of it was popular; I'd love to experience the Adventurer's Club. I understand the business decision, but once again, Disney took away something to replace it with NOTHING.

AK? I remember when it opened. There was an amazing pre-park show ("The Awakening) that included about 20 dancers, dressed as different creatures and bugs, entertaining for the last 10 minutes before the park opened. Just inside the ticket stalls there were CMs with cages of all kinds of interesting bugs, small amphibians or reptiles, etc., (NOT MY THING, btw) to entertain and educate the kids. There were CMs stationed along the Discovery Trails on the way to the Bridge across the river, to talk about the animals lining the pathways, as well as some stationed on the paths around the Tree of Life, to explain what all these animals were, their lifestyles, habitats, etc. Is any of this still there, or has it all been eliminated- not replaced by new, exciting, updated things, but gone, to save money?

Many "newer" DIsney fans whine because the "old timers" complain, but I am lamenting the things that have been LOST and not replaced in any way, shape, or form. It's not this little thing or that… it's ALL the little things adding up, being replace with NOTHING. More money, less value. In the past, I always felt like Disney wanted to be the industry leader in giving people more than expected- more experiences, more opportunities, more entertainment, more customer service, more value and worth- than any other company in the industry. They prided themselves on giving the guest MORE than they'd dreamed possible. Now they just take more away, take more money, take more happiness. It's sad...

 

[Suvadoo]

I believe that the WDW experience has diminished greatly in the past few years. Some podcasters and Disney experts think Disney is scrambling to reduce costs throughout WDW because of the budget overruns associated with MDE, sounds logical.
IMO most exciting announcements from WDW are about experiences that come with an additional price tag. In the summer there was Harambe nights, and the Epcot after hours experience. MNSSHP now has another hard ticket event, so in addition to paying for party, you can pay for a party within a party! With this party, WDW blocked off an area for viewing the parade and fireworks and offered exclusive M&G’s to attendees. In previous years, MNSSHP attendees had access to all of these exclusive benefits. So this year, MNSSHP guests are paying more and getting less. This is just the most recent example of an ongoing trend at WDW.
So far, this year WDW has announced several closures in HS, but I haven’t seen any official announcement proclaiming what they are planning for these empty spaces. There’s speculation from fans, but nothing official from WDW. I wonder how long it will take for new attractions to arrive at HS, 10 years ? Epcot is another example. I can’t believe the execs thought a chain saw show would be a great addition to the world showcase. IMO there’s nothing I find more soothing than the sound of chain saws, except perhaps the sound of leaf blowers! Aren't the parks already loud enough?
When I was at WDW in April 2014, I noticed that the bathrooms were not being maintained, tabletops at QS restaraunts were not wiped off, and the walkways were no longer spotless. Overall, the parks felt neglected.
I realize that the parks are full and WDW is very successful and that there are plenty of people who are willing to pay for Disney’s exclusive events. But that does not lessen my disappointment in the current quality of a WDW experience.
I greatly admired WDW, it was a wonderful example of a company that continually re-invested in their parks and the guest experience. I never felt I was being ripped –off by ticket price increases. Now, I seriously question if the price of admission is worth it.

 

[tjevans]

Will they ever get rid of the Castle? Or meet and greets with the main characters? Or evening shows and parades? To me therein lies the magic. Not a talking trash can. Yes, I agree that they are cutting corners, yes it hurts to see, but no do I ever think a trip to WDW will have the magic of a trip to Six flags.

With all due respect, you don't get it. What you cite is what people expect. What used to define Disney is the extras that you didn't expect. Have you ever heard of under-promise and over-deliver? That WAS the Disney way. As others have said, it seeMs like Disney now says give them what they think of when they think of Disney, but no more.

 

[ncdj2013]

The Disney "Experience," the quality that separates it from all other theme parks around the world, is slowly eroding.

Alas, in order to save some bucks, Off Kilter and Mo' Rockin are gone from Epcot. Add to that roster of fine talent, the Spirit of America, which provided visitors from other nations a taste of American exceptionalism. Gone also from Epcot is Myuki, the incredibly talented "candy lady." And Push, the "talking garbage can," which provided so many magical moments to guests of all ages in Tomorrowland, is gone, too.


And at the Food and Wine Festival there are fewer tables and seating from a year ago (not that there ever were enough)...and no more benches at the International Gateway. Guests end up eating at garbage cans, and no one can sit for even for a moment as they exit Epcot.


What is going on?

Spirit of America is not gone.

I was told by Disney that the benches would be replaced after F&W

 

[ncdj2013]

My biggest issue with the changes is NOT that changes are being made, but that things are being eliminated and replaced with… NOTHING. Look at Epcot and all the empty buildings; Horizons replaced with nothing, Wonders of Life replaced with nothing (except the occasional party center). The Viking Ship in Norway is gone (and now Maelstrom, but at least something will replace it), acrobats in China, the masquerade characters in Italy, Miyoshi in Japan, living statues in France, Mo Rockin', Off Kilter (replaced with something that requires too large a venue to be done appropriately in that little spot). Does the Ooompah Band still play in the courtyard in Germany so everyone can Chicken Dance together? What happened to the Lights of Winter (or just the light arch that was there otherwise) and the fountain that danced to the music playing along with the water show? Tapestry of Nations? At one time, ALL of these were a part of Epcot. Now none (or almost none) are.
at WDW when the parks closed and think "what do we do now?" We stayed on the Boardwalk last week and the Dance Hall was almost empty all the time, and JellyRolls? We listened to the off-key, lame singing from the 10 people inside and decided it wasn't worth the cover charge. While PI might have been TOO great an undertaking, some of it was popular; I'd love to experience the Adventurer's Club. I understand the business decision, but once again, Disney took away something to replace it with NOTHING.


M .

The Jeweled Dragon Acrobats are still in China.