I"ve never seen so many threads on sharing

[JimMIA]

This thread is getting to be yet another example of why the mods should consider locking most threads at 4 pages.

 

[zookeeper]

Minnie61650 - I did read all of the previous posts and I understood what you were saying. My point in response was along the same lines. I don't recall there being such a huge "moral" issue about the DDP in any shape or form last year whether it was phantom guests, sharing meals or using Child credits for Adult TS meals. It seemed,(to me anyways ), to be a loophole that was celebrated last year. I'm not questioning your honesty at all. I'm sure you wouldn't just make up that story to make a point. That would be immoral right? Just remarking on what a difference a year makes.

 

[bicker]

If I only had a dime for every time this is posted. You don't share my point of view, your dishonorable. You don't agree with me, your dishonorable.

No: If you engage in deception; if you exploit lack of enforcement; if you behave without integrity; THEN you're dishonorable.

You're trying to rationalize bad behavior by asserting that there is no such thing as a difference between good behavior and bad behavior: There is such a difference. You aren't entitled to dictate both sides of a commercial transaction: The supplier makes an offer; you as the customer can either accept those terms and conditions or reject them and walk away from the deal.

This discussion isn't about morality

Of course it is.

It would seem that if Disney wanted to really control the use of the meals. They would ...

... rely on the honesty and integrity of their guests. Until recent times, the vast majority of guests were indeed trustworthy.

 

[melomouse]

.... Most of the time big business has the upper hand, when they make a mistake in favor of the consumer, the consumer should take advantage....

NOW I see where you are (you're) coming from.

JIm MIA made the excellent suggestion that after 4 pages the mods shut some of these threads down.

Lock 'er up, mods!!!

 

[minnie61650]

Minnie61650 - I did read all of the previous posts and I understood what you were saying. My point in response was along the same lines. I don't recall there being such a huge "moral" issue about the DDP in any shape or form last year whether it was phantom guests, sharing meals or using Child credits for Adult TS meals. It seemed,(to me anyways ), to be a loophole that was celebrated last year. I'm not questioning your honesty at all. I'm sure you wouldn't just make up that story to make a point. That would be immoral right? Just remarking on what a difference a year makes.

Thank you. I am glad that you had read my previous posts and understood what I was saying.
I do not recall a moral issue last year either. Of course I usually read and post on the resorts board, the theme park board, and the disABILITIES board so I was unaware about what was happening last year.

I never even gave it a second thought when the CM wanted all of our party to check in together last October.

It was not until I was reading the the thread posted a few weeks ago that I even thought about it again.

I have no idea if the CM was checking for "phantom guests" or just asked to see everyone for another reason. I only know he asked and that for us it was not that big of deal because we had arrived on the same flight and we were all in the building together.

Here is the post that made me remember that the CM wanted to see all the members of our party.

This is really good to know. My cousin who will be sharing the room with us, will not be arriving until much later that night....I am usually the only one who checks in, and hope that not everyone needs to be present, but can totally understand due to abuses why they might be cracking down on this now. I hope to get more clarification on this once the free dining starts again this year. Has anyone seen this happen personally? Where a CM asks where everyone in the party is when you check in??

When I read that post I remembered the CM wanted to see all of us at check in. It was only after that post that I began to think maybe they were checking for "phantom guests" but since I knew nothing about the "phantom guests" until I read about them on the resorts board this summer I never even considered it might be why the CM asked us to check in together.

I really wish I had not read those posts because I became concerned for those families and that is why this whole thing seems to bother me way too much.

It is true sometimes ignorance is bliss.

 

[disney2d2]

(I am not talking about phantom guests)

Disney obviously understands that Adults using Child credits is a money losing deal for them, so they've put a rule about it in their brochure. But, what they have not done is enforce and train the servers to make sure that credits are used properly. Also, they've made it very confusing for people to use credits appropriately.

I believe this the brochure line is a temporary measure, and they will probably divide credits next year or sooner. Until then, and excuse my French, it's a half-assed measure. Although they can still enforce in the manner that someone has reported, where you cannot use more TS credits at one sitting than the number of adults in your package.

On the other hand, sharing credits between two or more adults both of whom are on the plan is a no brainer, both for the guests (who want to share) and Disney. Enforcing such a rule would be, simply put, a stupid move on the part of Disney.

 

[Lewisc]

K-mart made a mistake when they first put in self service registers. Many of their customers were giving themselves BOGO specials and K-Mart had to take actions to prevent dishonest customers from taking more items then they were paying for.

I guess we now understand your position. Policy is irrelevant. Rules are irrelevant. The only thing that matters is if you'll get caught.

Prior to the new brochure guests were justified in taking advantage of the plan. There really isnt any doubt what you're allowed to do. The only question is if you'll get caught and how long before it's not even possible.

Most of the time big business has the upper hand, when they make a mistake in favor of the consumer, the consumer should take advantage.

 

[Muziqal]

Until recent times, the vast majority of guests were indeed trustworthy.

Bicker, where do you come up with these ridiculous claims?

How recent? How many? Where did you get these figures?

You certainly make my day when I log in and read something you've written about how the world has turned upside down and there are no longer any ethical people inhabiting it.

 

[bstnsprts]

No: If you engage in deception; if you exploit lack of enforcement; if you behave without integrity; THEN you're dishonorable.

You're trying to rationalize bad behavior by asserting that there is no such thing as a difference between good behavior and bad behavior: There is such a difference. You aren't entitled to dictate both sides of a commercial transaction: The supplier makes an offer; you as the customer can either accept those terms and conditions or reject them and walk away from the deal.

Of course it is.

... rely on the honesty and integrity of their guests. Until recent times, the vast majority of guests were indeed trustworthy.

Chalk up another dime. Now we've kicked it up a notch to say that the vast majority of Disney guests are no longer trustworthy. Would judging someone and calling them and others dishonorable border on name calling. Carefull, you may be breaking a Dis Board rule.

For the terms and conditions to be met, the suplier has to provide the proper terms and conditions, that's their resposibility. Disney has changed the terms and conditions by not supplying child and adult credits, just credits, and accepting them that way for payment.

 

[bstnsprts]

K-mart made a mistake when they first put in self service registers. Many of their customers were giving themselves BOGO specials and K-Mart had to take actions to prevent dishonest customers from taking more items then they were paying for.

I guess we now understand your position. Policy is irrelevant. Rules are irrelevant. The only thing that matters is if you'll get caught.

Prior to the new brochure guests were justified in taking advantage of the plan. There really isnt any doubt what you're allowed to do. The only question is if you'll get caught and how long before it's not even possible.

Sorry, but not even close as an analogy. Disney, not I, provides the pooled credits. Disney, not I, accepts payment with the pooled credits. Disney can't fix this just by saying don't use child credits for adult meals. There are no child credits, there are no adult credits, if Disney doesn't want them being used as pooled, then they, not I, must separate them.

Let me try an analogy that I stated before. Disney decides to put in it's brochure that you will now only get a snack every other day. Crazy, but as it's been said, they have the right to change the plan. Now Disney doesn't want to spend the money or time and effort to change the computer program. So you show up for your eight night stay and are given 8TS, 8CS, and also 8 snacks. When you question this your told, ya that's the way it is, the program hasn't been changed yet. Well it's not your obligation or responsibility to just use 4 snacks because the brochure says so when you've just been given 8 by Disney. When you get that 5th snack on so on, and it deducts payment from your DDP, that's Disney's issue for not fixing their systems. The brochure change should have happened if and when the credits are separated.

 

[Pedler]

Sorry, but not even close as an analogy. Disney, not I, provides the pooled credits. Disney, not I, accepts payment with the pooled credits. Disney can't fix this just by saying don't use child credits for adult meals. There are no child credits, there are no adult credits, if Disney doesn't want them being used as pooled, then they, not I, must separate them.

Let me try an analogy that I stated before. Disney decides to put in it's brochure that you will now only get a snack every other day. Crazy, but as it's been said, they have the right to change the plan. Now Disney doesn't want to spend the money or time and effort to change the computer program. So you show up for your eight night stay and are given 8TS, 8CS, and also 8 snacks. When you question this your told, ya that's the way it is, the program hasn't been changed yet. Well it's not your obligation or responsibility to just use 4 snacks because the brochure says so when you've just been given 8 by Disney. When you get that 5th snack on so on, and it deducts payment from your DDP, that's Disney's issue for not fixing their systems. The brochure change should have happened if and when the credits are separated.

By using your analogy then it is OK to ignore rules that do not have an enforcement mechanism, things that rely on the honor system. Just out of curiosity, not making a moral judgement one way or the other, but what is your view on refillable mugs? Disney clearly states that mugs purchased (with some distant long go exceptions) are good for the length of stay. At the same time there is no enforcement mechanism to insure that you don't bring back the mug. Since there isn't an enforcement mechanism for refillable mugs I would assume that you feel that rule doesn't need to be followed as well?

 

[Pedler]

... rely on the honesty and integrity of their guests. Until recent times, the vast majority of guests were indeed trustworthy.

Bicker,

What data are you basing your evaluation that the vast majority of guests are not trustworthy? Seeing as the majority of WDW guests probably have never even heard of the DIS.

 

[Pedler]

Most of the time big business has the upper hand, when they make a mistake in favor of the consumer, the consumer should take advantage.

My take on it is that it doesn't make a difference if it is a big business small business or a friend. Why should I behave differently in a situation if it is a large company as opposed to a small busines or individual?

 

[minnie61650]

The brochure change should have happened if and when the credits are separated.

I am hoping the brochure change happened because the credits are going to be separated soon.

I do hope credits will be separated by August 13.

Then I will not have to worry so much about the free dining guests trying to check in before the rest of their party arrives.

I will be able to relax and hope that means that GEM and her 3 year old son can check in and not have to wait until Grandma arrives 12 hours later.

I can hope that scoutsmom 99 will not have to wait 5 hours for her sister to arrive.

I can hope that Michelle will not have to wait until much later that night for her cousin to arrive.

I can hope these people and others whose party are not arriving at the same time will be able to get their room keys with their park tickets and DDP.

I am hoping Disney will check these people in even without the separation of credits but if Disney can separate the credits I think it is more likely they will not have a problem getting their keys.

Here's to hope

 

[thunderbird1]

I am hoping the brochure change happened because the credits are going to be separated soon.

I do hope credits will be separated by August 13.

Then I will not have to worry so much about the free dining guests trying to check in before the rest of their party arrives.

Here's to hope

Linda, what a caring, thoughtful person you are. Worrying about all these people you don't even know. I hope everything works out for them, too.

Unless, of course, they all arrive the same day I do, and have Le Cellier dinner reservations that they have to cancel because they can't get their credits until all members of their party have arrived, and I am therefore able to get into Le Cellier for dinner instead of the lunch I currently have scheduled. Then I couldn't care less what happens to them because, hey, at least I got mine! Does that make me dishonorable? Or just plain mean?

 

[aubriee]

You may be right about last year, but the landscape has obviously changed...as you can see from the language in the brochure.
Sure enough, when we arrived in May, the CM told me we'd need everybody there when we got to the DDP part and I had to go round them up. Both the DDP rep and the OKW CM said, without me asking, that the procedure was a new one "designed to cut down on the cheating"...their words, not mine.

Same thing happened to us this past May. I got off the DME bus and went straight in to check in while my mom went to luggage services to pick up her scooter. The CM checking us in said he had to 'eyeball' my mom "since you're on the DDP". It wasn't a problem as my mom came in about that time and was looking for me. She simply waved and he said OK, she didn't need to come all the way over since she was in a scooter. When I mentioned to him that I checked my party in by myself last Sept, because we didn't want to take up all that room in line, he said 'unfortunately times have changed due to a few people playing the system'.

 

[minnie61650]

Linda, what a caring, thoughtful person you are. Worrying about all these people you don't even know. I hope everything works out for them, too.

Unless, of course, they all arrive the same day I do, and have Le Cellier dinner reservations that they have to cancel because they can't get their credits until all members of their party have arrived, and I am therefore able to get into Le Cellier for dinner instead of the lunch I currently have scheduled. Then I couldn't care less what happens to them because, hey, at least I got mine! Does that make me dishonorable? Or just plain mean?

Thank you for your kind words.

Dishonorable? ---No---mean?---No-- --Yes!


Have a great time at Disney and I hope you get into Le Cellier for dinner instead of lunch!

 

[bicker]

What data are you basing your evaluation that the vast majority of guests are not trustworthy?

Gosh, here's a great example of intellectual misdirection. What I said was that until recent times, the vast majority of guests were indeed trustworthy.

Folks: Please read what you're replying to before you reply to it.

 

[Pedler]

Gosh, here's a great example of intellectual misdirection. What I said was that until recent times, the vast majority of guests were indeed trustworthy.

Folks: Please read what you're replying to before you reply to it.

Sorry, bad wording on my post. Still on what data do you base your statement that things have changed?

 

[minnie61650]

Gosh, here's a great example of intellectual misdirection. What I said was that until recent times, the vast majority of guests were indeed trustworthy.

Folks: Please read what you're replying to before you reply to it.

I'm headed back to the resorts board.