Helpppppp not sitting together? Sort of budget related

[BigAlsGal]

Remember the good ole days when you could book a flight and you knew you would be together? Lol

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

We just flew delta and when I booked our flights I was able to choose our seats. We booked the lowest fare class they had. Maybe it was the route we took?

The lowest fare could have still been Main Cabin as not all flight times,at least in my airport, have Economy Basic as an option. The booking fare where seats were not allowed to be pre-selected would have said Economy Basic when booking. You might check your receipt for your trip and see what booking fare you had paid for.

 

[#1hoosierfan]

We are flying southwest in a few weeks.My boys are 7 and 9, and I still don't feel comfortable being separated on a flight from them, so I ponied up the cash for early check-in both ways to make sure we are one of the first to board. I would not expect Southwest or another paying travelers to accommodate us. If my child were 3 it would not have even been on my radar that it could possibly be left to chance.

 

[Marionnette]

Remember the good ole days when you could book a flight and you knew you would be together? Lol

That was NEVER a guarantee. 11 years ago, we took the kids on our first trip to Europe. There was an aircraft change that occurred after we had booked and selected our seats. We were assigned new seats scattered around the plane...for an 8-hour flight.

 

[Marionnette]

A bit of a tangent: Whenever Congress delegates policy or rule-making authority to a Federal agency, there's implicit authority to define and add to the rules anything the agency decides is necessary or appropriate to achieve Congress's intent, so long as it doesn't actually go against anything else in the legislation. This is why we'll often see court cases arguing over whether an agency's rule making was consistent with the law. (The EPA tends to attract these because their rules can have the financial impact to justify the cost of a legal challenge.)

I haven't read the legislation in question here. I wouldn't be shocked if it were interpreted as requiring the airlines to reseat a passenger (and refund anything extra they paid for the privilege of choosing their seats first). Nor would I be shocked if, instead, it merely required the airline to waive seat selection fees for a child and one parent whenever it saw a qualifying child and other adult on a reservation - but no other implications, say if there were no other pairs of adjacent seats available (regardless of fees for advanced selection). It would depend on the precise wording of the legislation, other existing legislation, and even the legislative history. What I wouldn't do is draw too many conclusions based on a newspaper's interpretation of the law.

You can find the text of the bill here:

SEC. 3113. Child seating.

(a) In general.—Not later than 15 months after the date of enactment of this Act, the Secretary of Transportation shall complete such actions as may be necessary to require each covered air carrier and ticket agent to disclose to a consumer that if a reservation includes a child under the age of 13 traveling with an accompanying passenger who is age 13 or older—

(1) whether adjoining seats are available at no additional cost at the time of purchase; and

(2) if not, what the covered air carrier's policy is for accommodating adjoining seat requests at the time the consumer checks in for the flight or prior to departure.

(b) Requirements.—The disclosure under subsection (a) shall—

(1) if ticketing is done on an Internet Web site or other online service, be prominently displayed to the consumer on that Internet Web site or online service during the selection of seating or prior to the point of purchase; and

(2) if ticketing is done on the telephone, be expressly stated to the consumer during the telephone call and prior to the point of purchase.

Like I said before, nothing that requires an airline to move a seated passenger in order to accommodate a parent or that the airline has a responsibility to provide the family with adjoining seats at all. What is does require is that an airline must inform passenger traveling with a child under the age of 13 as to whether there are free seats for selection which are available for adjoining seats at the point of purchase. If no free seat selection is available at the time of purchase, the airline must inform the passenger as to what accommodations might be made between check in and departure. It still does not guarantee that parents and children will sit together if the parent chooses not to pay for seat selection. But as you said, it is open to interpretation when it comes to implementation.

 

[GaryDis]

You can find the text of the bill here:


Like I said before, nothing that requires an airline to move a seated passenger in order to accommodate a parent or that the airline has a responsibility to provide the family with adjoining seats at all. What is does require is that an airline must inform passenger traveling with a child under the age of 13 as to whether there are free seats for selection which are available for adjoining seats at the point of purchase. If no free seat selection is available at the time of purchase, the airline must inform the passenger as to what accommodations might be made between check in and departure. It still does not guarantee that parents and children will sit together if the parent chooses not to pay for seat selection. But as you said, it is open to interpretation when it comes to implementation.

That's actually not the bill that was enacted. This is, with a very different provision at section 2309.

 

[MomToOne]

HR 636, signed into law on 7/15/16:

https://www.congress.gov/bill/114th...36/text#toc-H8B665C4797E74F00B4D74050D6817986

SEC. 2309. FAMILY SEATING.
(a) In General.—Not later than 1 year after the date of enactment of this Act, the Secretary of Transportation shall review and, if appropriate, establish a policy directing all air carriers providing scheduled passenger interstate or intrastate air transportation to establish policies that enable a child, who is age 13 or under on the date an applicable flight is scheduled to occur, to be seated in a seat adjacent to the seat of an accompanying family member over the age of 13, to the maximum extent practicable and at no additional cost, except when assignment to an adjacent seat would require an upgrade to another cabin class or a seat with extra legroom or seat pitch for which additional payment is normally required.

(b) Effect On Airline Boarding And Seating Policies.—When considering any new policy under this section, the Secretary shall consider the traditional seating and boarding policies of air carriers providing scheduled passenger interstate or intrastate air transportation and whether those policies generally allow families to sit together.

(c) Statutory Construction.—Notwithstanding the requirement in subsection (a), nothing in this section may be construed to allow the Secretary to impose a significant change in the overall seating or boarding policy of an air carrier providing scheduled passenger interstate or intrastate air transportation that has an open or flexible seating policy in place that generally allows adjacent family seating as described in subsection (a).

 

[2DisPrincesses]

We booked basic economy on Delta for October. My girls are 7 and 11. We have discussed the probabaility of not sitting next to each other. They have flown many times and will have their iPads, headphones, ect. While I hope the girls can sit next to each other, if not, we'll all be on the same plane. Beats driving!

 

[KBoopaloo]

Here's what the Delta web site actually says about Basic Economy:



Observe that it's silent on the question of whether or not the entire party will be seated together.

Right, but the Delta website also says this (bolding mine):

What if customers want the option of selecting an advance seat assignment or flexibility in their travel plans?

We realize that Basic Economy fares aren’t for everyone – including families traveling with children. For that reason, we also offer other economy fares at different price points that include the ability to select seats in advance and the ability to make changes to their travel plans for the applicable fee for their class of service and fare purchase. Basic Economy fares offers our most price-driven customers additional options for their travel by allowing them to purchase their air travel on fares that are similar to those offered by competitors.

http://news.delta.com/basic-economy

And this:

If you’re looking for a low fare, your travel plans aren’t likely to change, and you don’t mind where you sit, Basic Economy just may be your ticket.

https://www.delta.com/content/www/e...oard-experience/main-cabin/basic-economy.html

And when I try to book a Basic Economy fare, I get a pop up window explaining the restrictions that I will not be able to choose a seat and that it will be assigned after check in. In order to proceed, you have to agree to those restrictions along with a bunch of others before continuing.

Maybe they need to add something specific that says "You may not be seated with other members of your traveling party" to the restrictions list in order to be more clear for folks who don't travel a lot or are used to Southwest where boarding is completely different. I think most people who travel fairly often would realize that seats assigned after check in will mean that you get whatever is left over but someone less familiar with traveling (especially on fuller flights) might not.

 

[NinaBella]

This thread is hilarious. The OP is totally at fault for this situation for not thinking in advance about seating arrangements.

I think in advance for my THIRTEEN year old daughter! How can you NOT think in advance for a THREE year old. We have been flying a lot on Southwest. During our first flight of several this past year, I did not pay extra for the early bird boarding. This resulted in the only two seats together were in the very last row. It worked out fine, and certainly she could have sat in the row in front of me alone, but to PREVENT the chance in the future of not finding two seats together the next three flights we took we did pay extra for the early bird. Now my daughter is small for her age and based on looks perhaps could have passed for under 12. I saw that they allow families with children 12 and under to preboard perhaps they would have allowed us to pre-board with no question but we are not about lying to get on a plane early.

So now we pay EXTRA to ensure we get on the flight earlier to find seats together. Most of these flights were to camps my daughter attended and actually many of the kids going to these camps fly alone; however, although she is 13, her dad and I still fly her to camp because we don't like the idea of her flying alone yet. She absolutely could sit by herself on a plane and us sit in a different row, but that is not our preference so we have to pay for the luxury of sitting together. Is there a big difference between 3 and 13, sure, absolutely, but the parent still needs to PLAN accordingly to accommodate their family needs and desires and not leave it up to chance or to an airline computer system that auto fills in passengers to seats.

We have been flying with our kids since they were 4 months old and those flights at 4 months old were 14 hour long international flights (Seoul, Korea to Atlanta several times). We like to fly on Delta and Korean Air for international flights but a few occasions had to fly United if the military booked us on United. We still always ensure we get assigned seating when our kids were that small. I would never book a flight with a young child with leaving seat options unassigned.

 

[NinaBella]

Also I wanted to vent a little about Southwest under 12 family boarding. I saw a family of about 8 (grandparents included) traveling on vacation and they had one child who maybe was 10-12 years old, yet the entire group of 8 pre-boarded with the child. I think that over-the-top. I think it should be the child and the other two individuals sitting in the row of three with the child. There is really no need for the entire group of 8 to need to pre-board. My complaint is really because they are not paying extra for priority seating when I am paying extra for priority seating. If they want to have this policy for 12 and under, that's fine and dandy but limit the family member number when it's a large extended family.

One of our flights in January I am paying extra for early bird boarding and my friend is not because her daughter is 12, she gets to pre-board anyways. Cheer families travel in groups and normally our gym travels Southwest. So in our group there might be 15 mom/daughter and several are under 12. Since they booked as a group should all 30 get to pre-board if say there are only 2 under 12? Shouldn't it just be those two mom/daughter combos? I think this has been the case in the past for some of our cheer families who pre-board and all sit in one section of the plane together.

 

[GaryDis]

This thread is hilarious. The OP is totally at fault for this situation for not thinking in advance about seating arrangements.

I think in advance for my THIRTEEN year old daughter! How can you NOT think in advance for a THREE year old. We have been flying a lot on Southwest. During our first flight of several this past year, I did not pay extra for the early bird boarding. This resulted in the only two seats together were in the very last row. It worked out fine, and certainly she could have sat in the row in front of me alone, but to PREVENT the chance in the future of not finding two seats together the next three flights we took we did pay extra for the early bird. Now my daughter is small for her age and based on looks perhaps could have passed for under 12. I saw that they allow families with children 12 and under to preboard perhaps they would have allowed us to pre-board with no question but we are not about lying to get on a plane early.

So now we pay EXTRA to ensure we get on the flight earlier to find seats together. Most of these flights were to camps my daughter attended and actually many of the kids going to these camps fly alone; however, although she is 13, her dad and I still fly her to camp because we don't like the idea of her flying alone yet. She absolutely could sit by herself on a plane and us sit in a different row, but that is not our preference so we have to pay for the luxury of sitting together. Is there a big difference between 3 and 13, sure, absolutely, but the parent still needs to PLAN accordingly to accommodate their family needs and desires and not leave it up to chance or to an airline computer system that auto fills in passengers to seats.

We have been flying with our kids since they were 4 months old and those flights at 4 months old were 14 hour long international flights (Seoul, Korea to Atlanta several times). We like to fly on Delta and Korean Air for international flights but a few occasions had to fly United if the military booked us on United. We still always ensure we get assigned seating when our kids were that small. I would never book a flight with a young child with leaving seat options unassigned.

You're contradicting yourself. You didn't start paying extra until after you had the experience of what can happen when you don't pay extra, but you're expecting the OP to be able to reach the same conclusion before having a similar experience.

 

[ten6mom]

I don't fly much and when I do it's usually on Southwest. I have a flight coming up next month with American. When I chose the seat online I did NOT choose any of the more expensive options (the seat map had color coded areas for different price points/upgrade fees.). Since I did not pay for a more expensive seat, but still chose a seat (the seat number is listed on my confirmation), does this mean they can still move me or does American not work that way? Thankfully I am traveling alone but I certainly don't want a middle seat. I chose a window seat on purpose.

 

[dina444444]

I don't fly much and when I do it's usually on Southwest. I have a flight coming up next month with American. When I chose the seat online I did NOT choose any of the more expensive options (the seat map had color coded areas for different price points/upgrade fees.). Since I did not pay for a more expensive seat, but still chose a seat (the seat number is listed on my confirmation), does this mean they can still move me or does American not work that way? Thankfully I am traveling alone but I certainly don't want a middle seat. I chose a window seat on purpose.

American won't move you unless they change plane types (doesn't happen very often) or an Air Marshall decides to take your seat.

 

[CalDisneyMomof2]

I don't fly much and when I do it's usually on Southwest. I have a flight coming up next month with American. When I chose the seat online I did NOT choose any of the more expensive options (the seat map had color coded areas for different price points/upgrade fees.). Since I did not pay for a more expensive seat, but still chose a seat (the seat number is listed on my confirmation), does this mean they can still move me or does American not work that way? Thankfully I am traveling alone but I certainly don't want a middle seat. I chose a window seat on purpose.

You can be moved on any flight, any airline especially if the plane changes which therefore changes the layout of the plane.

 

[Gracie09]

You can be moved on any flight, any airline especially if the plane changes which therefore changes the layout of the plane.

Which is why I periodically check the seating to make sure it hasn't changed and make adjustments if it has

 

[SirDuff]

Right, but the Delta website also says this (bolding mine):

SNIPPED FOR BREVITY

I know that this has moved beyond the OP specifically, but she said that she booked through Expedia, so I'm not sure what she saw.

Which is why I periodically check the seating to make sure it hasn't changed and make adjustments if it has

Me too.

 

[ten6mom]

American won't move you unless they change plane types (doesn't happen very often) or an Air Marshall decides to take your seat.

You can be moved on any flight, any airline especially if the plane changes which therefore changes the layout of the plane.

Which is why I periodically check the seating to make sure it hasn't changed and make adjustments if it has

I know that this has moved beyond the OP specifically, but she said that she booked through Expedia, so I'm not sure what she saw.



Me too.

Thanks for the info, everyone!

 

[crisi]

You're contradicting yourself. You didn't start paying extra until after you had the experience of what can happen when you don't pay extra, but you're expecting the OP to be able to reach the same conclusion before having a similar experience.

People have to do their own research and be their own advocates - and if you aren't comfortable with that, book through a travel agent who will walk you through the variations. To claim you didn't know - which may be true - will make a lot of people show up who simply claim they didn't know - or expect the same treatment next time.

 

[crisi]

I don't fly much and when I do it's usually on Southwest. I have a flight coming up next month with American. When I chose the seat online I did NOT choose any of the more expensive options (the seat map had color coded areas for different price points/upgrade fees.). Since I did not pay for a more expensive seat, but still chose a seat (the seat number is listed on my confirmation), does this mean they can still move me or does American not work that way? Thankfully I am traveling alone but I certainly don't want a middle seat. I chose a window seat on purpose.

If the flight doesn't change (aircraft change or they drop a flight and have you fly out eariler or later - those are the usual changes), barring unusual other exceptions, you should end up in the seat you booked.

That's another reason to always book seats. If you have a seat booked and the flight oversells, they won't sell your seat twice - but they'll sell extra "anywhere" seats. So by booking without booking a seat - you might not have a seat at all.