Disney Called Today Tips will not be cut out of DDP!~looks like they lied:(

[calypso*a*go-go]

You know, it's still six months until 2008 is here...so who knows what could happen between now and then. If the people that have posted saying they will no longer purchase the DDP actually follow through on their word, maybe the issues we are discussing right now won't even be a factor. Fingers crossed!

 

[hansel1]

6. In situations where our guests refuse to comply with our policy, it will be the responsibility of the service person to locate a Manager prior to the guests leaving the restaurant so that Management can speak with the guests. If the service person fails to involve a Manager in the situation prior to the guests departing the restaurant, or receives discipline for poor service, the Company will not be responsible for the difference between what the guest left and eighteen percent (18%) of the guest's food and beverage total.

So, if you recieve poor service and call the manager over, you can pay less than the 18% "service charge".

12. An eighteen percent (18%) service charge will be added for all package plans, supplemental Food and /or Beverage purchased and consumed by the guest covered by the package plan, and Company sponsored discounts. The service charge will be based on the total charges before any discounts have been applied. This provision does not apply to Disney Dining Experience and Disney Vacation Club. This change will phase into current packages through 2006.

DVC? So if you are staying in a DVC resort they won't charge you the 18%?

 

[DCDisney]

There will be NO Gratuity added in 2008 on the DDP, and the only time we will present a check to you is if your a party of 6 or more ,
But The Price of the DDP will not include Grat come Jan 08, so Tip your server Please, we are all very nervous...

So if no check is given to DDP folks I can see many people doing no tip and just walking out when they are done eating or some random small amount (like $5) which would be nowhere near 18% of the undiscounted check.I can't see how they'll keep any servers around if this really does happen.

Yvonne

 

[Lewisc]

So, if you recieve poor service and call the manager over, you can pay less than the 18% "service charge".

No different then a guest who complains to a manager about food. A guest doesn't like the food and leaves most of it on the plate. A guest can ask for a manager and the manager is likely to make some adjustment. The manager might discount your check or offer you something else at no charge. Speak up as soon as you have a problem with service. Don't wait until the check is presented and expect to get a manger to give you discounts due to bad food or bad service. Keep in mind the solution to a complaint isn't money. Call a manager over and complain about not getting drink refills. The solution is for the manager to get your drinks. Complain about not getting what your ordered the solution is for the manager to get you the correct food.

12. An eighteen percent (18%) service charge will be added for all package plans, supplemental Food and /or Beverage purchased and consumed by the guest covered by the package plan, and Company sponsored discounts. The service charge will be based on the total charges before any discounts have been applied. This provision does not apply to Disney Dining Experience and Disney Vacation Club. This change will phase into current packages through 2006.

DVC? So if you are staying in a DVC resort they won't charge you the 18%?

That's not what it says. What is said is guest getting a discount by using the DDE card or because the guest is a DVC member isn't subject to an "automatic tip". We already know that's changing for DDE discounts next year.

 

[hansel1]

No different then a guest who complains to a manager about food. A guest doesn't like the food and leaves most of it on the plate. A guest can ask for a manager and the manager is likely to make some adjustment. The manager might discount your check or offer you something else at no charge. Speak up as soon as you have a problem with service. Don't wait until the check is presented and expect to get a manger to give you discounts due to bad food or bad service.


That's not what it says. What is said is guest getting a discount by using the DDE card or because the guest is a DVC member isn't subject to an "automatic tip". We already know that's changing for DDE discounts next year.

This 12th provision is the contract terms that gave the servers their automatic 18% gratuity on the DDP package.

DDE was not required to add this as it was not regulated by this provision.

My question is what does DVC have to do with a dining package?

 

[CR88]

I think the most fair way to tip based on a pre-packaged plan is to tip what the plan costs per day.

From all accounts the DDP has increased patronage of the disney restaurants. The plan is bringing people in to eat and tip, without the people who go to LeCellier (for example) only because they are on the DDP (the only way they can afford it) the servers would have less tables.

Less tables = Less tips

So even if people tip based on the plan amount and not the ticket amount the servers are making money they might not otherwise.

2 adults @ roughly $40 each, plus 1 child @ roughly $15 would equal $95 dollars that I will tip on.

So, regardless of what my bill is i will tip 20% on the $95. $19

The argument that you should go to a less expensive restaurant is ridiculous. Servers do the same work whether they are working in an expensive restaurant or a cheap restaurant. On the DDP both servers would bring the same amount of food out and take the same amount of orders.

20% of the cost of the plan is the way to go. The larger the group the larger the tip.

Very Interesting post. I have been wondering the same thing. What amount will the tip be based on? From what I have read, the actual cost per meal on the DDP is less than the retail menu amount. I am not sure if this is true, or if it is on a restaurant to restaurant basis, or if it is the same everywhere but I have ready numerous times on DIS that the actual bill to the restaurant, when DDP is involved, is not the amount listed on the menu.

Are they saying that the cost of the meal is the same whether pre-paid or not? That doesn't seem to make sense. You are supposedly saving up to 40% on meals, but paying tips based on 100%? I am not arguing against leaving 18%, we always left extra, but I am just curious how they will handle this. I don't recall even seeing amounts on our receipts when we were on the plan. Are they going to have the meal amounts listed and totaled, then a zero balance AND a total from which to calculate tips? Kind of confusing. But as many posters have said, it is all speculation until the 2008 plan is detailed and officially released.

 

[Lewisc]

DVC members get a discount at some meals in some restaurants. That discount by itself, doesn't currently result in an "automatic tip". DDE is currently excluded from this provision but will be included next year.

Throughout the previous threads on tipping many posters said restaurants should pay servers appropriately and customers shouldn't be responsible for paying servers. Adding on an "automatic tip" or service fee does just that. Did people really think restaurants will increase the servers compensation without increasing prices?

I suspect your point is really a non-issue. I can't imagine very many guests, after being told an 18% service fee will be added to their check, will refuse to pay when presented with the check. You first asked how a mandatory tip could be enforced. The current wording clears up that issue. The manager has discretion to remove the tip. I think guests would have difficulty in claiming the service was only worth 15%.

Customers who think a restaurant is too expensive, including any "automatic service charge, should find another place to eat. This change will affect some families/groups that thought stiffing a server (tipping less then standard even for good service) is an acceptable budget technique.

This 12th provision is the contract terms that gave the servers their automatic 18% gratuity on the DDP package.

DDE was not required to add this as it was not regulated by this provision.

My question is what does DVC have to do with a dining package?

 

[hansel1]

DVC members get a discount at some meals in some restaurants. That discount by itself, doesn't currently result in an "automatic tip". DDE is currently excluded from this provision but will be included next year.

Throughout the previous threads on tipping many posters said restaurants should pay servers appropriately and customers shouldn't be responsible for paying servers. Adding on an "automatic tip" or service fee does just that. Did people really think restaurants will increase the servers compensation without increasing prices?

I suspect your point is really a non-issue. I can't imagine very many guests, after being told an 18% service fee will be added to their check, will refuse to pay when presented with the check. You first asked how a mandatory tip could be enforced. The current wording clears up that issue. The manager has discretion to remove the tip. I think guests would have difficulty in claiming the service was only worth 15%.

I did not know that discounts were provided to dvc members. Thank you for that information.

I think that even if a manager removed the entire tip, most people including myself would leave something (maybe 10% or so) even when service is poor.

 

[calypso*a*go-go]

I'm thinking the 18% calculation is going to be based on the menu price as I doubt Disney really wants to point out to people utilizing the DDP that the food actually costs them so much less than the listed price...because (as previously mentioned) that completely eliminated the "40% savings" by using the prepaid plan. This whole thing is craziness!!!

 

[Lewisc]

The level of service that would cause me to complain to a manger and for the manager to delete the tip would have be low. Probably so low that I wouldn't leave a tip. Same as with food. I don't like the food and I don't eat it. The price of the food is generally deleted from my check. I've never heard of a manager offering to take 1/3 off the price of an entree that I ate 1/3 of.

AN AUTOMATIC TIP/SERVICE FEE ISN'T LET'S MAKE A DEAL. A customer doesn't get to tell the manager I think service was worth 14% please take 4% off the bill. Rather a customer complains at the time of bad service so the issue can be corrected. Ask the next CM that goes past your table to get a manager. Tell the manager you've been waiting 10 minutes for drink refills. Your problem gets solved. You really don't get to discuss the servers shortcomings after the fact and negotiate a lower tip. I think an 18% "automatic tip" is too high for a buffet restaurant. The customer can pay it or dine elsewhere. It's really not fair to expect to be able to negotiate a lower tip with the manager.

I think that even if a manager removed the entire tip, most people including myself would leave something (maybe 10% or so) even when service is poor.

 

[hansel1]

The level of service that would cause me to complain to a manger and for the manager to delete the tip would have be low. Probably so low that I wouldn't leave a tip. Same as with food. I don't like the food and I don't eat it. The price of the food is generally deleted from my check. I've never heard of a manager offering to take 1/3 off the price of an entree that I ate 1/3 of.

AN AUTOMATIC TIP/SERVICE FEE ISN'T LET'S MAKE A DEAL. A customer doesn't get to tell the manager I think service was worth 14% please take 4% off the bill. Rather a customer complains at the time of bad service so the issue can be corrected. Ask the next CM that goes past your table to get a manager. Tell the manager you've been waiting 10 minutes for drink refills. Your problem gets solved. You really don't get to discuss the servers shortcomings after the fact and negotiate a lower tip. I think an 18% "automatic tip" is too high for a buffet restaurant. The customer can pay it or dine elsewhere. It's really not fair to expect to be able to negotiate a lower tip with the manager.

You can discuss a server's shortcomings at any point!

no one said they would try to negotiate a better tip.

If a server is giving poor service, that does not mean they should get NO TIP AT ALL! So after complaining to the manager at any point and having the tip removed, you could (only if you wanted to) leave a tip of some amount for the service that server provided.

As was previously stated in another post, the IRS requires you show a percentage of the food bill as a tip recieved whether you recieved it or not.

Regardless of how insistant you are in your posts. I will only tip based on the cost of the DDP to my family. If I don't use the DDP, I will then tip based on the total of my bill. And finally, I won't have a party of 6 or more, the auto 18% service charge is mute.

 

[tfc3rid]

A 15 to 20% gratuity on parties of 6 or more is the norm in every restaurant that I go to here in NYC... It's standard...

 

[Lewisc]

You first asked how Disney could enforce an "automatic tip". Several of us told you it's done as a service charge and can be enforced.

You asked what would happen if you got horrible service. Several of us said it's no different then bad food. Talk to the manager and your bill can be adjusted.

An "automatic tip" takes the discretion away from the diner. JMO but I think it's wrong to tell the manager the service is horrible enough to get the tipped deleted just so you can tip a lower amount. The time to complain about bad food is when the food is served. The time to complain about bad service is when it occurs, so the problem can be corrected.

The IRS doesn't require a server report a % of the food bill as a tip whether or not it was received but a server/restaurant that claims less better be prepared with documentation.

As long as you're not a party of 6 or more you're free to calculate your tip anyway you want. You previously mentioned basing your tip on the daily cost of your dining plan. I'm not sure why you'd be including the cost of a snack or CS meal in your tip calculation but 20% of the total cost of the meal plan probably translates to at least a 15% on the food your order. Sounds about right to me.

I'm not going to continue this discussion with you, it doesn't help others.

You can discuss a server's shortcomings at any point!

no one said they would try to negotiate a better tip.

If a server is giving poor service, that does not mean they should get NO TIP AT ALL! So after complaining to the manager at any point and having the tip removed, you could (only if you wanted to) leave a tip of some amount for the service that server provided.

As was previously stated in another post, the IRS requires you show a percentage of the food bill as a tip recieved whether you recieved it or not.

Regardless of how insistant you are in your posts. I will only tip based on the cost of the DDP to my family. If I don't use the DDP, I will then tip based on the total of my bill. And finally, I won't have a party of 6 or more, the auto 18% service charge is mute.

 

[bicker]

I've seen those mandatory "service charges" aka automatic tips on menus at other places, but I just never have to really deal with it since we so rarely eat with a group of eight or more. But come to think of it, it usually is worded as a "fee" or "charge" as opposed to "tip" or "gratuity."

And it is important to keep in mind that they're all for the same thing: cost-of-service. Any of three approaches are valid: integrated into the menu price, covered through gratuity, and covered via a service charge.

 

[bicker]

You know, it's still six months until 2008 is here...so who knows what could happen between now and then.

True, but January 1 isn't really the date-of-interest. Rather, this "becomes real" once MYW packages for 2008 are announced, sometimes in the next two months.

 

[hansel1]

An "automatic tip" takes the discretion away from the diner. JMO but I think it's wrong to tell the manager the service is horrible enough to get the tipped deleted just so you can tip a lower amount. The time to complain about bad food is when the food is served. The time to complain about bad service is when it occurs, so the problem can be corrected.

I'm not going to continue this discussion with you, it doesn't help others.

I would never tell the manager service was bad, just to lower a tip. I would, however, tell a manager about poor service.

You are saying that poor service deserves no tip, or in the alternative don't complain and pay 18% regardless of the service.

So, if you don't want to discuss this, don't post anymore!

I believe that people should be aware that if they get poor service on a party of 6 or more, they can complain anytime during their meal and ask the tip or "service charge" of 18% be romoved so they can then tip at their discretion.

THAT DOES HELP OTHERS!

 

[kimberh]

I would never tell the manager service was bad, just to lower a tip. I would, however, tell a manager about poor service.

You are saying that poor service deserves no tip, or in the alternative don't complain and pay 18% regardless of the service.

So, if you don't want to discuss this, don't post anymore!

I believe that people should be aware that if they get poor service on a party of 6 or more, they can complain anytime during their meal and ask the tip or "service charge" of 18% be romoved so they can then tip at their discretion.

THAT DOES HELP OTHERS!

One thing to really be careful with on with this approach is... There are families that are looking for a loophole around or through the system. The server could have gave good service, and it just will not matter. In their view, they should not have to pay a 18% tip, when they did not pay it the prior 2 years. Now, I am not one of those families, I have seen people eat good meals, never complain about the food, not one word, then call the manager over, tell him how bad the food was. They had cleaned their plate. This was not at Disney, at a seafood restaurant, here.

It takes all types to make the World go around.

 

[Lewisc]

Exactly. People lose credibility when they complain about food, after they cleaned their plate. Likewise people aren't credible when they don't complain about the service until it's time to pay their check.

One thing to really be careful with on with this approach is... There are families that are looking for a loophole around or through the system. The server could have gave good service, and it just will not matter. In their view, they should not have to pay a 18% tip, when they did not pay it the prior 2 years. Now, I am not one of those families, I have seen people eat good meals, never complain about the food, not one word, then call the manager over, tell him how bad the food was. They had cleaned their plate. This was not at Disney, at a seafood restaurant, here.

It takes all types to make the World go around.

 

[Tink10]

One thing to really be careful with on with this approach is... There are families that are looking for a loophole around or through the system. The server could have gave good service, and it just will not matter. In their view, they should not have to pay a 18% tip, when they did not pay it the prior 2 years. Now, I am not one of those families, I have seen people eat good meals, never complain about the food, not one word, then call the manager over, tell him how bad the food was. They had cleaned their plate. This was not at Disney, at a seafood restaurant, here.

It takes all types to make the World go around.

That's exactly what I see happening with those who are that determined to beat the system. They don't give a flying hoot if they put someone's job in jeopardy, let alone give an appropriate tip.

 

[GreatLakes5]

- I know I'm making 2008 dining reservations as of August for a February package....this will need to be resolved by July unless it will only apply for January 2008 and following rservations being made (so that would be June 2008 stays??)....

- remember that all the points from a contract that are being copied and pasted are the old contract....these were pasted and copied and quoted ad nauseum on another thread as well

- I'm in Michigan - not in a "fancy" area - most restaurants here add on the automatic gratuity on parties of 10 or more...if it's normal here it's pretty normal everywhere - we generally are not cutting edge

- That said, a good manager knows his/her servers. If I have horrid service, complain to the manager there's a good chance that other complaints have come before or that the manager is aware that the server is "difficult"...I would fully expect the manager to allow me to leave proper tip - not stiffing the server but perhaps directing it right to all those people that servers are sharing their tips with...let me tip the bartender, the cleaning crew, etc...my issue is with the server - period.

- I pay in advance for a month of violin lessons. I feel stupid doing it but I do it because I like the teacher and I want to keep him happy. My husband is a contractor. If we asked someone to pay in full for their house in advance of completion we'd be laughed out of contract negotiations. I guess it depends on what we equate with service in a restaurant...do we want it badly enough that paying tips ahead of service is something we'll accept? Or do we want to be the customer who laughs in the face of the request.

As stated in past threads I, personally, would not mind being in control of my tipping. Take away the tip. I'm okay. Take away the tip AND raise the price of the dining plan and we may not use it - I honestly don't know until I see the facts - just the facts.