Copper Creek Villas & Cabins Opening July 2017

[apple9117]

Just saw some pictures, they look great!

 

[jesschris]

Can't wait for the first reviews of stays to be posted.

 

[Saratoga Springs Tom]

Looking at the pictures, I don't care for the decor. Disappointed it's not keeping in theme with the Northwest rustic Lodge atmosphere.

 

[lovin'fl]

Spoke to my guide and fixed weeks can be sold today. Just 3 studios in each week so if you want a coveted Dec week you better hurry.

 

[wdrl]

Spoke to my guide and fixed weeks can be sold today. Just 3 studios in each week so if you want a coveted Dec week you better hurry.

The limit on the number of Guaranteed Week deeds sold by accommodation type for each week might increase in the future. The Copper Creek Master Declaration states that Disney has capped the percentage of Guaranteed Week deeds sold for accommodation type for each week to 35%. Keep in mind that only 13 studios have been declared for the DVC inventory at this time. In the future, as more Residential Units are declared, then more Guaranteed Week deeds might be sold.

 

[tjkraz]

Quite likely due to construction, but I doubt they're reopened to hopping.

I sort of doubt that they will lift the pool hopping restriction. But it's interesting to note that crowd levels at the resort should actually go down. They used two former hotel rooms (occupancy 8) to make a single one bedroom villa (occupancy 4.) And 3 hotel rooms (12) to make a single two bedroom villa (8.)

We're still waiting to get a clear picture of rooms at the resort. But it looks like we have at least 15 dedicated 1Bs and 112 total 2Bs. Shedding 4 guests from each of those rooms lowers the resort's maximum occupancy by 508 guests. Grand Villas would have a similar impact and there are still a few rooms unaccounted for.

Meanwhile the 26 cabins will add a maximum of 208 guests to the property.

So after the renovations are complete, WL should be home to fewer guests on a typical day and have a much larger "Leisure Pool" complex.

 

[Friendlyadvice2]

I sort of doubt that they will lift the pool hopping restriction. But it's interesting to note that crowd levels at the resort should actually go down. They used two former hotel rooms (occupancy 8) to make a single one bedroom villa (occupancy 4.) And 3 hotel rooms (12) to make a single two bedroom villa (8.)

We're still waiting to get a clear picture of rooms at the resort. But it looks like we have at least 15 dedicated 1Bs and 112 total 2Bs. Shedding 4 guests from each of those rooms lowers the resort's maximum occupancy by 508 guests. Grand Villas would have a similar impact and there are still a few rooms unaccounted for.

Meanwhile the 26 cabins will add a maximum of 208 guests to the property.

So after the renovations are complete, WL should be home to fewer guests on a typical day and have a much larger "Leisure Pool" complex.

Possibly, but those numbers assume those WL rooms were all occupied in the first place, which they were not and is one of the reasons they are now DVC. The CCV rooms on the other hand will most likely all be occupied when its fully operational. Accordingly, I expect the "Leisure Pool" area to feel very busy on a typical day and the reduction in WL rooms to have an immaterial affect on noticeable headcount.

 

[tjkraz]

Possibly, but those numbers assume those WL rooms were all occupied in the first place, which they were not and is one of the reasons they are now DVC. The CCV rooms on the other hand will most likely all be occupied when its fully operational. Accordingly, I expect the "Leisure Pool" area to feel very busy on a typical day and the reduction in WL rooms to have an immaterial affect on noticeable headcount.

WDW has been averaging around 90% occupancy for quite a few years. They don't like to leave rooms sitting empty. What the lower room inventory allows them to do is ease-off on discounting. They'll be able to charge a higher average rate for WL hotel rooms with only 350 vs. the previous 750.

Admittedly it's a very basic analysis which doesn't take into account actual occupancy levels of either the hotel rooms or villas. Some guest reduction should occur. Possibly as high as 10-15%

Whether that is felt or not is open to interpretation. IMO, every Disney pool tends to feel crowded when the weather is warm. I highly doubt that the "legal" pool hopping from DVC members adds dramatically to crowds.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

I sort of doubt that they will lift the pool hopping restriction. But it's interesting to note that crowd levels at the resort should actually go down. They used two former hotel rooms (occupancy 8) to make a single one bedroom villa (occupancy 4.) And 3 hotel rooms (12) to make a single two bedroom villa (8.)

We're still waiting to get a clear picture of rooms at the resort. But it looks like we have at least 15 dedicated 1Bs and 112 total 2Bs. Shedding 4 guests from each of those rooms lowers the resort's maximum occupancy by 508 guests. Grand Villas would have a similar impact and there are still a few rooms unaccounted for.

Meanwhile the 26 cabins will add a maximum of 208 guests to the property.

So after the renovations are complete, WL should be home to fewer guests on a typical day and have a much larger "Leisure Pool" complex.

DVC has stated before that villas run at a higher occupancy than the hotel rooms - it was a justification to shift more expense to BLT and away from CR. It's difficult to predict any shifts based only on maximum occupancy as it's possible those 1BR's will be filled to 4 with DVC and when they were hotel rooms they tended to have 2 guests each. It would then neutral. From the food service and pool additions/changes it doesn't necessarily appear that Disney thinks it will be lower.

 

[Friendlyadvice2]

WDW has been averaging around 90% occupancy for quite a few years. They don't like to leave rooms sitting empty. What the lower room inventory allows them to do is ease-off on discounting. They'll be able to charge a higher average rate for WL hotel rooms with only 350 vs. the previous 750.

Agreed on the discounts as this is obviously the current posture property wide and I don't blame them. However, although WDW may have been averaging around 90% occupancy, WL was not for quite some time. This is why I don't forsee a 10%-15% reduction in headcount and why I don't think Disney does either. This will all be very important for both DVC associations in regards to MF in the future.

 

[tjkraz]

DVC has stated before that villas run at a higher occupancy than the hotel rooms - it was a justification to shift more expense to BLT and away from CR.

They only said that DVC occupancy was higher than expected...not that it was higher than hotel rooms.

Projections may have been 3.0 guests per DVC Studio with actual numbers being 3.2 guests. If hotel room actual is 3.5 guests, it still sees higher utilization. But the DVC underestimate was enough to shift the needle.

It's difficult to predict any shifts based only on maximum occupancy as it's possible those 1BR's will be filled to 4 with DVC and when they were hotel rooms they tended to have 2 guests each.

Agree, it is difficult--actually impossible--to predict. But I'm not sure I see any reason to think that a Studio or 1B will display dramatically different usage than a hotel room. Both are equally well equipped for a family of 2-4 members. If anything, I think we'll see 2B villas with anywhere from 5-8 guests since there's no other alternative. Those 2Bs replacing three hotel rooms which would have held 12 guests.

From the food service and pool additions/changes it doesn't necessarily appear that Disney thinks it will be lower.

Just because they're expanding doesn't mean they expect numbers to rise. The WL quiet pool was notoriously small to begin with. The more elaborate pool and dining helps sell DVC points and raises the stature of the hotel component. There's much more buzz about Copper Creek than there would have been if they'd merely painted and refurnished the hotel rooms.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

Just because they're expanding doesn't mean they expect numbers to rise. The WL quiet pool was notoriously small to begin with. The more elaborate pool and dining helps sell DVC points and raises the stature of the hotel component. There's much more buzz about Copper Creek than there would have been if they'd merely painted and refurnished the hotel rooms.

Disney oversizing? More than once they've shown they undersize and then have to rip it out and start again. It would be a change of direction if they were suddenly doing differently here. IMO they DO tend to think they can slap some new paint on and sell DVC.

 

[dnkmmw]

Looking at the pictures, I don't care for the decor. Disappointed it's not keeping in theme with the Northwest rustic Lodge atmosphere.

I agree with this. We were planning to add on but, after seeing the photos, won't be doing so at this time.

 

[bobbiwoz]

We were invited to a 90 minute presentation later this month. We decided to go. I know I want to stay there. Doubt we will buy.

Your upcoming Walt Disney World® Resort vacation is ideally timed, allowing us to invite you to be among the first Member families to explore the rustically elegant accommodations created for the newest Resort in your neighborhood – Copper Creek Villas & Cabins at Disney's Wilderness Lodge. This sneak peek, ahead of the Resort's scheduled July 17opening, includes:

• A tour of a model room located at the Disney Vacation Club Preview Center at Disney's Saratoga Springs Resort & Spa
•
• Complimentary appetizers and beverages
•
• A fireside sing-along under the stars, complete with marshmallow roasting (weather permitting)

All of us at Disney Vacation Club hope this next return "home" is one to remember, and we look forward to sharing this new frontier for magical vacations with you.

Dates: March 21st & 22nd, 2017

Location: Disney Vacation Club Preview Center at Disney's Saratoga Springs Resort & Spa 1960 Broadway, Lake Buena Vista, Florida 32830

 

[Brian Noble]

WDW has been averaging around 90% occupancy for quite a few years

While that's true, that is averaged across all of the hotel properties. I'm told that WL has not done as well as the resort-wide average, though my source may not be ironclad.

Even accounting for that, though, this is likely to be about a push in the worst case, occupancy-wise.

 

[tjkraz]

Agreed on the discounts as this is obviously the current posture property wide and I don't blame them. However, although WDW may have been averaging around 90% occupancy, WL was not for quite some time. This is why I don't forsee a 10%-15% reduction in headcount and why I don't think Disney does either. This will all be very important for both DVC associations in regards to MF in the future.

Recent history aside, Wilderness Lodge has been open for more than 20 years. It's been at full capacity many, many, many nights. I cannot speak to current averages but I would still contend that the total guest count after this DVC transition will be lower than when the hotel was sold-out.

And unless there's some data suggesting that DVC members have higher average occupants than hotel, I'm not sure why we would believe that to be true. WL hotel rooms are equally well suited for families of 2, 3 or 4 as are DVC Studios and 1B villas.

IMO they DO tend to think they can slap some new paint on and sell DVC.

Examples?

The only thing remotely close to this was AKV nearly a decade ago. And even there, the resort gained a feature pool + kids play area, restaurant, Community Hall, sports courts and workout facilities at Kidani. Every other DVC project featured new construction of guest room buildings and/or massive updates to resort amenities.

 

[BWV Dreamin]

We were invited to a 90 minute presentation later this month. We decided to go. I know I want to stay there. Doubt we will buy.

Your upcoming Walt Disney World® Resort vacation is ideally timed, allowing us to invite you to be among the first Member families to explore the rustically elegant accommodations created for the newest Resort in your neighborhood – Copper Creek Villas & Cabins at Disney's Wilderness Lodge. This sneak peek, ahead of the Resort's scheduled July 17opening, includes:

• A tour of a model room located at the Disney Vacation Club Preview Center at Disney's Saratoga Springs Resort & Spa
•
• Complimentary appetizers and beverages
•
• A fireside sing-along under the stars, complete with marshmallow roasting (weather permitting)

All of us at Disney Vacation Club hope this next return "home" is one to remember, and we look forward to sharing this new frontier for magical vacations with you.

Dates: March 21st & 22nd, 2017

Location: Disney Vacation Club Preview Center at Disney's Saratoga Springs Resort & Spa 1960 Broadway, Lake Buena Vista, Florida 32830

Let me know how that fireside sing along goes.....

 

[BWV Dreamin]

Just because they're expanding doesn't mean they expect numbers to rise. The WL quiet pool was notoriously small to begin with. The more elaborate pool and dining helps sell DVC points and raises the stature of the hotel component. There's much more buzz about Copper Creek than there would have been if they'd merely painted and refurnished the hotel rooms.

The pool was no smaller than BWV quiet pool or BCV quiet pool. It had more character IMO. Now its just as big as the feature pool at Wilderness Lodge. So much for quaint.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

Examples?

The only thing remotely close to this was AKV nearly a decade ago. And even there, the resort gained a feature pool + kids play area, restaurant, Community Hall, sports courts and workout facilities at Kidani. Every other DVC project featured new construction of guest room buildings and/or massive updates to resort amenities.

The thought with the amenities and the "slapping paint on a room" was about DVC generally underachieving in building their resorts. Perhaps CCV will be the change to that and what they've done isn't a sign they expect higher occupancy then what was produced by WL and VWL. Examples: Aulani - pool and QS, SSR - pool and QS, PVB - still no fitness center, community hall and of course the studios only going into 30+ yo building shells. BLT gets complaints about crowding at the pool and QS at Kidani, OKW and BWV.

At least with CCV they added food service so maybe they've started to recognize on the front end that DVCer's aren't all planning on cooking - that's a plus! I personally never ran into pool crowding at Hidden Springs but did often see it at the main pool. I am going to miss that "quiet" pool. I'm already disappointed the Springs pool is being replaced by the quarry so if it's not due to an expected occupancy increase that will be even more disappointing.

 

[Debbie Jean]

Anyone been to a preview session at SSR? I'm scheduled for this coming Tuesday at 6. Very interested to see what the units look like!