Poor Sportsmanship in the NFL

[sunshinehighway]

And they are breaking no laws or violating policies. He has freedom of speech but they have no freedom to choose no to do an assignment that is not required of them?

It's childish. It does nothing to improve the image of police and nothing to improve police and community relationships which is central to the safety of all involved.
All this tit for tat nonsense has to stop.
You don't want people to feel you abuse your authority and feel above reproach then stop responding in a way that says exactly that. Be the bigger people and show your professionalism and desire to improve community relations. Respond in a way that tells people they have the wrong image of you.

 

[declansdad]

If they are not required by the department then it is their choice. He has every right to sit in protest, so do they.

I don't agree with either of them particularly. I don't necessarily think he should be punished by the NFL. And I do think he is being disrespectul and a jerk with the socks and not standing for the anthem. But he has every right. They want to protest his disrespect so they do it in the best way they can.

If they agreed to work the contract then they are legally obligated to work.

 

[JoeA]

Police are just running around killing people everyday and have less training and education than a cosmologist... you would think Kap and the crowd should be happy if the police aren't there.

(Its not just the sitting that is creating the threat of boycott - its the socks, the things he says during interviews. The whole package.)

 

[Magpie]

If they are not required by the department then it is their choice. He has every right to sit in protest, so do they.

I don't agree with either of them particularly. I don't necessarily think he should be punished by the NFL. And I do think he is being disrespectul and a jerk with the socks and not standing for the anthem. But he has every right. They want to protest his disrespect so they do it in the best way they can.

I'm not sure it IS "the best way they can".

What does it say?

1. You need us (the police) to protect you.

2. We don't like what this one guy is saying about us, and we don't like the way he's saying it. We don't care if what he's doing is legal or constitutional. We don't even care if you agree with him or not.

3. If you all want our protection, you're going to have to get rid of that guy.

4. If you don't, no protection for you!

Threats, bullying, coercion, strong-arm tactics... whatever you want to call it, it only strengthens the argument that police themselves are a part of the overall problem. Or as Kaepernick put it: "...a country that oppresses black people and people of color," ... "There are bodies in the street and people getting paid leave and getting away with murder."

These "protests" are not comparable.

On the one side you have a man choosing to sit during the anthem and wear tasteless, obnoxious socks (which are not visible from the stands). His protest is not impacting his ability to play the game, or the ability of anyone to watch him play the game. It has no measurable impact on anyone, except in the sense that now we all know what he thinks about a current topic.

On the other side we have threats of a protest action that would potentially put people's safety at risk, people who have nothing to do with whether or not Kaeparnick sits or stands. A protest action that would involve breaking contracts. A protest action which, at the very least, causes some headache for the organizers who now have to replace them.

If they wanted to stage a comparable protest, they'd simply do something like make a point of standing in uniform with hand over heart while the anthem plays.

 

[Magpie]

...you would think Kap and the crowd should be happy if the police aren't there.

Maybe Kap is... has anyone asked him?

The "crowd" on the other hand, all seem to be standing for the anthem at games. Kap's teammates also all stand. Why should they (ie, us) be held accountable for Kap's individual action? We have no way of knowing who, among the "crowd" supports the police and who doesn't.

Going to a game where one man sits and everyone else stands, does not mean you're automatically supporting the one man who sits.

 

[sunshinehighway]

Police are just running around killing people everyday and have less training and education than a cosmologist... you would think Kap and the crowd should be happy if the police aren't there.

(Its not just the sitting that is creating the threat of boycott - its the socks, the things he says during interviews. The whole package.)

The police threatening to not provide security does nothing to change the image you described above (which I personally think is very exaggerated).
At some point something's got to give. It's entirely possible to acknowledge that police have a bad image while not saying that image is true. It would go miles if instead of drawing lines in the sand and taking a hard-line approach there was an acknowledgement that yes this image exists and it's not the image police believe to be true and it's certainly not how they want communities to see them.

 

[luvsJack]

Yall do realize that the stadium or NFL can always hire security that isn't police officers. If the officers refuse to be there, its not necessary to not have security. There are businesses and events all over the country that have security that are not officers.

If the police aren't there and they don't have security, thats on them.

It always amazes me how one can have a silent protest and its within their rights, another does it and because it might actually step on some toes and they don't have the same right.

 

[disneyjunkie]

Who said anything about beauty based on things one has never seen? The point was about various ethnicities believing they were superior to other ethnicities they actually encountered, and the way they treated them.

You know damn well that that the conflicts/wars between various African tribes is not the same as the colorism that resulted as a result of colonization and the diaspora.


Colorism isn't just an issue in America. It can been seen and heard in any land where Europeans enslaved and dehumanized black and brown people. Colorism exists among blacks, Hispanics, south east Asians.....in America, South America, Central America, the Caribbean, India.......

Colorism is the reason why the mixed person the previous poster referred to was mistreated by other blacks. It is also the reason why dark skin black, blacks with kinky hair....are also teased by other blacks. This has nothing to do with what occurred between various African tribes. Hell, thanks to the horrors of colonization, the vast majority of us have no idea what tribe we come from.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

You know damn well that that the conflicts/wars between various African tribes is not the same as the colorism that resulted as a result of colonization and the diaspora.


Colorism isn't just an issue in America. It can been seen and heard in any land where Europeans enslaved and dehumanized black and brown people. Colorism exists among blacks, Hispanics, south east Asians.....in America, South America, Central America, the Caribbean, India.......

Colorism is the reason why the mixed person the previous poster referred to was mistreated by other blacks. It is also the reason why dark skin black, blacks with kinky hair....are also teased by other blacks. This has nothing to do with what occurred between various African tribes. Hell, thanks to the horrors of colonization, the vast majority of us have no idea what tribe we come from.

Europeans didn't create the African slave trade. And while the motivation was different, the result of colorism (as you call it is the same).

Moreover, if you're honestly blaming the negative way 2 black people treat each other today on the way some white person would have treated them 200 years ago, that is just a sad copout.

 

[Magpie]

It always amazes me how one can have a silent protest and its within their rights, another does it and because it might actually step on some toes and they don't have the same right.

Depending on their contract, they may or may not have the "same right".

Also, what the police are doing is not a "silent protest". It's a job action, similar to a football player breaking his contract and refusing to play.

You can easily support silent protests and take exception to job actions. Many people who support teachers, still get quite upset when they go on strike.

 

[bcla]

If they agreed to work the contract then they are legally obligated to work.

The contract is with various police agencies, and not with the police unions or individual officers. These are completely optional assignments. I'm pretty sure they're free to decline an assignment before taking one, but I doubt they free to leave their assignment like what happened with the Minnesota Lynx game.

Now the officers working outside the stadium on traffic and crowd control are probably not considered as doing off-duty assignments.

 

[luvsJack]

Depending on their contract, they may or may not have the "same right".

Also, what the police are doing is not a "silent protest". It's a job action, similar to a football player breaking his contract and refusing to play.

You can easily support silent protests and take exception to job actions. Many people who support teachers, still get quite upset when they go on strike.

Yes I know. People don't like teacher strikes because its inconvenient for them and what they do with their kids. Stepping on those toes again. We tend to think they should be paid more, we just don't want them to actually DO anything.

If the contract, as the pp says, is with the department and not a requirement of any one officer then they have every right. Actually they do anyway. There may be consequences, but they can do it. Just as this ball player can refuse to play. Of course he isn't going to do that. I seriously doubt he feels strongly enough about all of it to give up his multi million dollar contract. But they may be just sick enough of risking their lives for people that do nothing but spit on the job they do to take the consequences of their actions.

 

[bcla]

Depending on their contract, they may or may not have the "same right".

Also, what the police are doing is not a "silent protest". It's a job action, similar to a football player breaking his contract and refusing to play.

You can easily support silent protests and take exception to job actions. Many people who support teachers, still get quite upset when they go on strike.

The status of these in-stadium police details is very different. The officers are considered off-duty, even though they're in uniform and may even have access to police vehicles.

 

[LisaR]

Yall do realize that the stadium or NFL can always hire security that isn't police officers. If the officers refuse to be there, its not necessary to not have security. There are businesses and events all over the country that have security that are not officers.

If the police aren't there and they don't have security, thats on them.

It always amazes me how one can have a silent protest and its within their rights, another does it and because it might actually step on some toes and they don't have the same right.

First off, we have to determine if the police are under a contract before we can say they are well within their rights. If they aren't under contract and provide security "only if and when they want" then they are most certainly within their rights to silently protest.

It does speak volumes to me that they would refuse to provide security for 60,000+ people all because one guy is being a jerk. While I could see them slowly walking over to aid Kap if he needed some added protection instead of rushing over, walking out on thousands upon thousands of other people who they know nothing about is childish. Wearing those despicable socks did nothing to help Kap's reputation or further the conversation in a productive way. Refusing to provide security to all of those people because of one guy also diminishes their reputation and doesn't further conversation in a productive way. Sadly, I don't see this divide ever improving because both sides (not just in this situation) have too many supporters who are too stubborn and ignorant.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

The status of these in-stadium police details is very different. The officers are considered off-duty, even though they're in uniform and may even have access to police vehicles.

Yup, I've hired off duty police through the city to work security at my events and the city has always made it clear those who worked my events did so of their own choosing. But, they always arrived in their cruisers & worked in uniform.

Edit: I was also told that in an emergency, these off-duty officers could be called into service at any time which could shut down my event. Ambulance/EMT worked the same. Fire was a little different as we have an all volunteer force.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Santa Clara Police Association's letter to 49ers, York

The Santa Clara Police Officers' Association on Friday issued a letter to 49ers owner Jed York with the intent of addressing the current situation regarding Colin Kaepernick's protest of the National Anthem.

The letter, obtained by NBC Bay Area, is in full below.

Mr.Jed York

San Francisco 49ers

4949 Marie P. DeBartolo Way Santa Clara, CA 95054

September 2, 2016

Mr. York,

The members of the Santa Clara Police Officers' Association {SCPOA) have a long history of working with the San Francisco 49ers organization. This relationship was greatly expanded with the construction of Levi's stadium. Our officers and 49er employees have worked incredibly well together to create a safe and enjoyable environment for guests and employees. This partnership has made Levi's stadium the premier sports venue in the world as evident in the extremely successful Super Bowl 50 operation.

Unfortunately, some recent actions by a 49ers employee have threatened our harmonious working relationship. On August 26, 2016, prior to the start of the 49er pre-season football game at Levi's stadium, on duty 49er employee Colin Kaepernick made the decision to exercise his right of free expression and not stand to honor the National Anthem. This expression caught the attention of the media. Following the game, your employee explained to the media that his actions were an attempt to get public attention to the oppression of African Americans and minorities in the United States by police officers. Your employee then insinuated that police officers are being placed on paid leave for murdering minorities. This statement is obviously insulting, inaccurate and completely unsupported by any facts.

On August 28, 2016, at 49er training facility in Santa Clara, Mr. Kaepernick again made the allegation that police officers are getting paid to murder people. Your employee further insulted all law enforcement officers in America by stating, "There is police brutality. People of color have been targeted by police." Mr. Kaepernick then made inaccurate and untrue statements about the level of training that is required to be a police officer.

On August 31,2016, it was learned by the members of the SCPOA that the 49er organization has been allowing Mr. Kaepernick to wear exposed socks with the image of a pig wearing a police hat during practices at the training camp in Santa Clara . Photos of Mr. Kaepernick wearing these socks with the derogatory image have been broadcast nationally.

Our membership acknowledges that police officers are human and are not perfect. However, blanket statements that police officers in general, murder minorities is completely false and insulting to the dedicated men and women in law enforcement agencies across America.

These intentional acts and inflammatory statements by Mr. Kaepernick are insulting to the members of the SCPOA . It is apparent, that the 49ers organization is aware of Mr. Kaepernick's actions. These actions have occurred while Mr. Kaepernick was acting as an employee of the 49ers and at 49er facilities in Santa Clara. The 49ers organization has taken no action to stop or prevent Mr. Kaepernick from continuing to make inaccurate, incorrect and inflammatory statements against police officers, which include members of the Santa Clara Police Officers Association.

Furthermore, your organization has made no statement disagreeing with Mr. Kaepernick's accusations. It is the unanimous opinion of the SCPOA that the 49ers organization has failed to address your employee's inappropriate workplace behavior. The board of directors of the Santa Clara Police Officers Association has a duty to protect its members and work to make all of their working environments free of harassing behavior.

SCPOA members have worked thousands of hours at Levi's stadium, 49er training camp and headquarters protecting guests, players and fellow employees. Our officers voluntarily agree to work these assignments. If the 49ers organization fails to take action to stop this type of inappropriate workplace behavior, it could result in police officers choosing not to work at your facilities. Please contact us as soon as possible with the corrective actions your organization intends on implementing.

The men and women of the Santa Clara Police Officers Association are sworn to protect the rights of ALL people in the United States, a duty we take very seriously. Our members, however, have the right to do their job in an environment free of unjustified and insulting attacks from employees of your organization.

SCPOA Board of Directors

Cc: Rajeev Batra Chief Mike Sellers

http://www.csnbayarea.com/49ers/santa-clara-police-associations-letter-49ers-york

 

[pryncess527]

It always amazes me how one can have a silent protest and its within their rights, another does it and because it might actually step on some toes and they don't have the same right.

FWIW, I think they have the right to protest in this manner -- I just don't think it sends a very positive message to the community about their relationship with police.

I also agree with this part of their letter

Our members, however, have the right to do their job in an environment free of unjustified and insulting attacks from employees of your organization.

If any member of the police force has been directly subjected to an insulting attack from a member of the 49er's while on duty, I'd expect the organization to address that. I personally would not include general statements made to the media, not singling out any member of their force, as falling under that definition.

 

[Unas]

Europeans didn't create the African slave trade. And while the motivation was different, the result of colorism (as you call it is the same).

Moreover, if you're honestly blaming the negative way 2 black people treat each other today on the way some white person would have treated them 200 years ago, that is just a sad copout.

Who brought African slaves to the "New World" and then resold them?
And hey, this whole thread started because some folks got their knickers in a twist because some guy protested recent events by not standing for some 200 year old tune. So yeah in some issue, issues of pride and issues that were painful and dehumanizing, the passage of time doesn't change things.

 

[bcla]

Yall do realize that the stadium or NFL can always hire security that isn't police officers. If the officers refuse to be there, its not necessary to not have security. There are businesses and events all over the country that have security that are not officers.

If the police aren't there and they don't have security, thats on them.

It always amazes me how one can have a silent protest and its within their rights, another does it and because it might actually step on some toes and they don't have the same right.

Of course they have private security. At most sporting events, most are basically ushers, although I've met a few who could lay the wood if needed. I've taken the train to work (the station is right next to 49ers headquarters, and HQ was there before the stadium), and the station parking lot had the entrance to HQ. Private security takes over most of the parking lot before game days, and

Granted, I don't think they need as much security as they used to. Even though the games are officially sold out (lots of corporate and season ticket sales) it looks like half the seats are empty.

However, as a practical matter I've never been to a large public event where there wasn't a uniformed police presence. The have the authority to make an arrest quickly and efficiently (most of the time). This included everything from college basketball games to NFL games, as well as county fairs. It may even be a requirement in the law. I know in Oakland, California, all major sporting events, concerts, etc. are considered special events. They may have a police presence requirement depending on expected attendance. I've never been to an event at the Oakland Coliseum Complex that didn't have a police presence, and that included A's games, Warriors games, the circus, Raiders games, figure skating, and even Disney on Ice. Heck, for Raiders games I've seen them in bring in Alameda County Sheriiff deputies - they're actually the lead agency at Raiders games.

http://www2.oaklandnet.com/government/o/OPD/s/sefaqs/index.htm#OF
https://www.acgov.org/about/weareac/documents/weareac01.pdf

 

[Chocolate Cake]

Who brought African slaves to the "New World" and then resold them?
And hey, this whole thread started because some folks got their knickers in a twist because some guy protested recent events by not standing for some 200 year old tune. So yeah in some issue, issues of pride and issues that were painful and dehumanizing, the passage of time doesn't change things.

If someone tries to put me down because the shade of my skin, I just assume they are a jerk. And if they ever tried to explain away their poor behavior (in the year 2016) by blaming it on European slave holders, I would assume they were a massive jerk.