kides say Magic Bands have ruined Disney

[Love Tink]

12 times in 6 years is kind of excessive, don't you think? How about a trip to Mt. Rushmore? Yellowstone? Disneyland?

I haven't been back since FP+, but I got to say I don't like the basic idea. But my family doesn't park hop, so we don't have the same issues it sounds like you do.

Oh, sorry, I must have missed the part where the OP provided his/her entire travel history.

Because - ready to have your mind blown? - you are actually allowed to take vacations to both Disney parks and other places!

(Although I do love that even within your snide comment, one of your three big suggestions is Disneyland - another Disney park - which kind of undermines your condescension. And Mt. Rushmore? Nobody just plans a vacation to Mt. Rushmore. You stop there on your way to or from somewhere else.)

 

[JimmyV]

FP+ does not limit the number of attractions a guest can experience... During our visit Dec 12-18 we still experienced a dozen or more rides, attractions and shows each park day, some more then once.

Herein lies the problem. To many Dis'ers, experiencing a dozen attractions in a day is a very slow day. In fact, it is what many expect to do by lunch. If one is accustomed to and satisfied with a dozen rides in a day, then FP+ will not negatively impact the overall experience. But if you look beyond that you will see that FP+ does act as a governor because it was always designed to do so. Remember that the system was deployed not to help the guest but to help the financial bottom line. Disney did not spend what it did to create this system without expecting to recapture those costs. So let's dig a little deeper.

First, there is the psychological impact. As some posters on this thread have noted: "FP+ is great! We don't have to do RD anymore!" OK. Ask yourself. Is a person who skips RD and arrives later in the day going to be able to ride as many rides as they did before? Skipping RD can have a tremendous positive impact on that family's vacation. More sleep. Less fatigue. Maybe a nice character breakfast at 'Ohana that they wouldn't otherwise do in their rush to make RD. ( There's your economic impact for Disney). So skipping RD can be a win-win. But it cannot be intelligently argued that the family that skips RD can or will ride as many rides as before. Not when sooooooo many people have come here and reported that they had great FP+ experiences by coupling their use with RD. It is universally accepted that RD is still the best crowd avoidance strategy. So FP+ is causing a certain percentage of people to skip RD. And those people are entering the park when the crowds have built up, so they are not maximizing their ride opportunities.

Second is the crowd redistribution impact of FP+. The system was designed to move people into standby lines for non-headliner attractions. A person who used to ride Space Mountain at RD and then three more times with FP- and who walked on to Pirates and Haunted Mansion is now riding Space Mountain once at RD, once more with FP+ and waiting 30-40 minutes each for Pirates and HM. Not an issue if the goal is a dozen rides in a day. But it is a speed bump if they are shooting for 27. FP+ was designed to retard the ability to ride headliners repeatedly. Guests are supposed to ride the rides once and then leave the park making room for other guests to arrive and do the same. Sort of like a factory that operates in shifts. Disney intends to recoup costs in part by selling more admission tickets. They don't intend all of those people to occupy the same space at the same time. Instead, they want the early shift to leave and go spend money elsewhere and they want the late shift to spend money elsewhere and then go to a park with locked in ride reservations. And no doubt this will happen. But we have to always keep in mind that the only time when guests don't spend money is when they are in lines for rides or are riding rides. If we think that Disney implemented this system to put people on more rides with their wallets shut, we are kidding ourselves. Again, if the old way was a dozen rides a day, then this is no big deal. But what you are seeing here are the commandos with torches and pitchforks. Their days are numbered.

 

[MagicalMomma1971]

The majority of guests do like FP+. say

This totally made me laugh out loud!!

 

[MagicalMomma1971]

I see that you haven't actually used FP+, which surprised me a great deal since you're reliably on every complaint thread.

We have used the MDE program 3 times. Magic Bands are fine, have no issue. FASTPASSES+, however, is awful! We hate it and we generally travel in lower crowd seasons 3 pre booked Fastpasses is simply not enough - it's certainly would not be sufficient during a high crowd week like Christmas/New Years.

With the old FP system we could ride the headliners multiple times, but you are lucky to get to ride them once with the new system. And the "tiering" system at DHS and Epcot is ridiculous!!!

We do not enjoy the new FP system at all. We are WDW and DL vets and we went back to DL this summer and our kids were so happy they didn't have the MDE system there. It was such a more laid back vacation with the old paper FP system still in place. And, yes, remarkably, my 12, 13, 15 and 17 year olds knew what they liked and disliked about their Disney trip - apparently some people find that strange?

 

[larryz]

This isn't ever going to happen, because the ENTIRE POINT of FP+ is to get more guests using the FP return lanes, and to get them planning it at least a little bit in advance.

I thought the entire point of FP, and its successor, FP+, was to get people out of line and into the shops and restaurants.

I think it's only circumstantial that some "genius" (and I use the term loosely) figured out that if they FP+'d every attraction in every park, they could better manage ride capacity. ("Better" in this case means spread the park loads out over the "B" and "C" rides and attractions, thus increasing overall capacity without investing in new attractions.)

There are lots of other options. California still has old-style FP. If you find yourself near Paris (we have) it also has old-style FP, but on many fewer attractions and with only a half-hour (enforced) return window. DCL is lovely---I'd recommend Alaska to anyone. As someone who just got back from an offsite stay over Christmas at Wyndham Bonnet Creek, I was reminded how similar my WDW vacations there are to my stays in DVC villas.

There are also tons of great non-Disney vacations out there. My wife and daughter are spending President's Week at Universal. We spent a week this summer in Sedona and the Grand Canyon. We spent a full week of our France vacation in an apartment in the Marais exploring Paris. We've done a week in a guest ranch at the doorstep to Rocky Mountain National Park. We often rent a beach house on the OBX. We have a (non-DVC) stay at Hilton Head this summer, and are planning a (non-Aulani) Hawaii stay for the summer after that. My son is agitating for Italy down the road, and I still want to get to Tokyo. (Okay, I admit I'll go to TDR while I am there, but...)

There are many ways to skin the vacation cat.

And your vacation balance appears to be rare for those who frequent this board. I applaud you, sir!

 

[Mambo Junkie]

If you don't want to read through all 14 pages (so far) of this thread, here's the Cliffs Notes version of how it has devolved:

"FP+ sucks and you're dumb if you don't think so"

"No FP+ is great and you're dumb if you don't think so"

"I resent you calling me a liar and you're double dumb"

"I resent you calling me calling you a liar (even though you're a liar) and you're triple dumb"

And so on and so forth for the umpteenth FP+ hijacked discussion.

You forgot about the part where the kids weren't old enough to think for themselves, spoiled, want to go somewhere else and that's their way of approaching it and just ditch the kids with grandma and go without them.
Edit to add: I forgot about the fact that they go too much so they're bored. Makes me even wonder why annual passes to amusement parks exist.

 

[larryz]

I would likely trade my TSMM for someone's RSR. Oh wait.... can't do that either.

Again with the ironic comparisons!

 

[larryz]

But Disney also has a huge chunk of responsibility as to why crowds are what they are. I did my college program in the spring of 2005. That was the year of The Happiest Celebration on Earth and certain things were brought in to each of the parks. Hollywood Studios got Lights Motors Action, Epcot got Soarin, Animal Kingdom got Lucky the Dinosaur, and Magic Kingdom got an overlay on Pirates, Small World, and the castle as well as the play area Pooh's Thoughtful Spot. LMA is rumored to be closing, Lucky is gone, and Pooh's Thoughtful Spot is gone. So, from that celebration, one new attraction remains. That's it.

Since then, Magic Kingdom has added the new Fantasyland which has 2 new rides and an extra Dumbo. Epcot has added... nothing. Everything currently at Epcot (ride-wise) was there in 2005. Hollywood Studios added Toy Story Midway Mania, but didn't add anything else. It did change Who Wants to be a Millionaire to American Idol, but now that's closing. I suppose you can also say it added Jedi Training Academy. Animal Kingdom added Expedition Everest. So, since 2005, anywhere from 4 to 6 rides have been added, depending on how you look at it. BUT, they have added multiple resorts at Disney Vacation Club properties including Art of Animation, Bay Lake Tower, Animal Kingdom Villas, The Villas at Grand Floridian, and are about to open to DVC property at Polynesian Village. So Disney added thousands of hotel rooms without adding attractions. What did they think was going to happen? Of course crowds are going to increase in the parks. That's their own doing. But rather than come up with the correct solution for these crowds (giving the crowds somewhere to go along the lines of new rides and attractions), their solution is to limit how many attractions a single guest can experience.

Yep!

 

[cattywampus]

DLR vets here, who used FP+ and Magic Bands in November on our first WDW visit and really liked both.

I feel like FPP evens the playing field a bit, between RD people and non-RD 'ers. That means those that swear by RD may feel the biggest impact, and be unhappy.

Coming from the west coast, we had no intention of doing rope drop and appreciated the ability to secure headliners later in the day, without running around, worried that all the paper FP had been distributed early in the day.

 

[larryz]

i don't know where you live but, dlr has no fp+ and no adr's, it's great!

sssshhhhhhh!!!!!

 

[Angel Ariel]

Coming from the west coast, we had no intention of doing rope drop and appreciated the ability to secure headliners later in the day, without running around, worried that all the paper FP had been distributed early in the day.

If that has been your experience in the past, I can understand appreciating FP+.

I can honestly say, for us, we never ran around,and we never worried about paper FP running out. Not at WDW, and not at DLR. I think that is, in part, due to our touring choices. We didn't usually hop. If we did, it was starting the day at Epcot (not at RD, but by 9:30/10ish), and hopping to MK at night - or starting at DHS and hopping to AK after their (now gone) parade. MK always had headliner availability when we hopped to it in the early evening, and AK was (is) a ghost town the closer to closing you get, so FPs weren't really needed (and were still available anyway).

All that is just to say that I do appreciate why others like FP+,but the repeated reasons that others had issues with legacy were never really issues for us in the first place, so FP+ doesn't enhance that for us.

 

[kaytieeldr]

If you don't want to read through all 14 pages (so far) of this thread, here's the Cliffs Notes version of how it has devolved:

"FP+ sucks and you're dumb if you don't think so"

"No FP+ is great and you're dumb if you don't think so"

"I resent you calling me a liar and you're double dumb"

"I resent you calling me calling you a liar (even though you're a liar) and you're triple dumb"

And so on and so forth for the umpteenth FP+ hijacked discussion.

You forgot, "You don't have kids, so your opinion of how you will react to future kids in this situation is utterly laughable".

 

[kaytieeldr]

But Disney also has a huge chunk of responsibility as to why crowds are what they are. I did my college program in the spring of 2005. That was the year of The Happiest Celebration on Earth and certain things were brought in to each of the parks. Hollywood Studios got Lights Motors Action, Epcot got Soarin, Animal Kingdom got Lucky the Dinosaur, and Magic Kingdom got an overlay on Pirates, Small World, and the castle as well as the play area Pooh's Thoughtful Spot. LMA is rumored to be closing, Lucky is gone, and Pooh's Thoughtful Spot is gone. So, from that celebration, one new attraction remains. That's it.

Since then, Magic Kingdom has added the new Fantasyland which has 2 new rides and an extra Dumbo. Epcot has added... nothing. Everything currently at Epcot (ride-wise) was there in 2005. Hollywood Studios added Toy Story Midway Mania, but didn't add anything else. It did change Who Wants to be a Millionaire to American Idol, but now that's closing. I suppose you can also say it added Jedi Training Academy. Animal Kingdom added Expedition Everest. So, since 2005, anywhere from 4 to 6 rides have been added, depending on how you look at it. BUT, they have added multiple resorts at Disney Vacation Club properties including Art of Animation, Bay Lake Tower, Animal Kingdom Villas, The Villas at Grand Floridian, and are about to open to DVC property at Polynesian Village. So Disney added thousands of hotel rooms without adding attractions. What did they think was going to happen? Of course crowds are going to increase in the parks. That's their own doing. But rather than come up with the correct solution for these crowds (giving the crowds somewhere to go along the lines of new rides and attractions), their solution is to limit how many attractions a single guest can experience.

Actually, no. "Tour Story Midway Mania" replaced "Who Wants to Be a Millionaire?"
"American Idol" replaced "Doug Live!", which replaced "Superstar Television" - although there may have been another show in that theater as well.

 

[mom2rtk]

You forgot, "You don't have kids, so your opinion of how you will react to future kids in this situation is utterly laughable".

Actually, such comments are generally much better received when not presented as absolutes and not phrased in an insulting fashion.

 

[Figmentmommy]

Seriously- can't we all just agree to disagree? Everything does not work for everybody. We don't have a choice in what Disney implements but we do have a choice to go there or not to go there- or use/not use FP+ however it best suits our touring style. There really isn't a right or wrong here. To each his own!

 

[minnie mum]

Seriously- can't we all just agree to disagree? Everything does not work for everybody. We don't have a choice in what Disney implements but we do have a choice to go there or not to go there- or use/not use FP+ however it best suits our touring style. There really isn't a right or wrong here. To each his own!

There you go being all rational and common sensy (not a real word). What kind of Diser are you anyway?

Then again, this is called a discussion board for a reason.

 

[Figmentmommy]

There you go being all rational and common sensy (not a real word). What kind of Diser are you anyway?

Then again, this is called a discussion board for a reason.

True- but I think we lost the discussion part about 10 pages back!
Maybe a little less snarky... a little more DIScussion!
Just sayin'!

 

[Hokie2000]

Seriously- can't we all just agree to disagree? Everything does not work for everybody. We don't have a choice in what Disney implements but we do have a choice to go there or not to go there- or use/not use FP+ however it best suits our touring style. There really isn't a right or wrong here. To each his own!

Agreed! One problem is there are distinct winners and losers in this debate. As you said, we have no choice over the FP system implemented by Disney. If you love WDW and you love FP+ you automatically win. If you love WDW but you hate FP+ then unfortunately you lose. The system is already in place.

I guess the debates heat up when we become sore losers and bad winners, lol.

 

[JimmyV]

I guess the debates heat up when we become sore losers and bad winners, lol.

And the issue magnifies when economics are brought to bear. Some of the "soreness" from the losers stems from the fact that they are now paying more to do less.

 

[Figmentmommy]

I guess the debates heat up when we become sore losers and bad winners, lol.