What do you consider a lot? Student debt?

[NHdisneylover]

$11,000 combined per year seems very very low to me. I guess it depends on the cost of tuition and room and board at the school your child is at, how much you managed to save in 18 years prior to them starting college, and your preferences on how much if any of your child's college you want to pay for. My son exhausted all our savings for college for both our kids with his selection of a $50,000 a year college, with room and board, and after a $10,000 grant each year from the College. To keep some breathing room, he took on $30,000 in student loans, and DW and I took on $30,000 in loans. His sister is 4 years younger, and she bounced from a State University away from home, to a Community College a mile from home, to a State University 6 miles from home, to a year at a University in England, back to a State University 6 miles from home. Her most expensive year, tuition, room and board came to $12,000. As we had paid off our mortgage, the $1,100 a month we had been paying there was more than enough to pay her tuition without going into further debt.
When my mom passed away and we sold her house, we were able to retire all the debt related to my son's college.

Which is why cost was a huge part of the decision making process for my kid. Personally, I would have strongly advised my kid against choosing a $50,000 a year college. STRONGLY. I also would not have blown all saved funds on my oldest, leaving my youngets with fewer options, to support my older one going to a pricey university. And if one child chose to go into a lot of debt anyway, while the other found ways to live more within their means, I personally, would not feel comfortable spending family inheritance to save the one from feeling the effects his poor financial planning decisions while not spending a similar amount to help the other (maybe giving that one the same amount towards a down payment on a home, etc). Your son is very lucky.

University, like anything else we purchase, from homes to cars to clothes to vacations, needs to fit into our budget. There are things we can afford and things we may like to have but cannot afford (or choose not to budget for while sacrificing elsewhere). Homes and education are things we will take on some debt for, but we still live within our means and choose homes and educations where the amount of debt really allows us to actually live well in those means and prefer never to rely on a future inheritence to pay off aynthing. It'S fine that you chose otherwise, but it is not at all how we want to live, or raised our children to think---for us the "right fit" school includes fitting into the budget. And it is certainly possible to make decisions which fit into those means---as even your daughter's education did.

 

[NHdisneylover]

Exactly I could just imagine my parents telling how much I can take & when to pay it back. Advice was welcomed & still is, but by that age I was a legal adult & making my own decisions. This is part of why our adults can’t be functional until they’re 30.

The point is, anything over that 5500 does require that a parent co-sign, or take out, the loan. (I believe---could be wrong).

So, in that case, yep, anything over that 5500 is my bussiness. Very much so.

The other point is, that long before my kids turned 18, we'd discussed what we could/would contribute for university costs, what our budgeting values were with it, etc. Had my kid inssited on going it on their own and doing so with a lot of debt--that would be their perogitive, and I am fully aware I have no right to stop them--but it would also be MY perogitive to not contribute to that by paying into it myself (which would likely be only just enough "help" to allow them to dig themselves deeper)

 

[barkley]

My daughters have to pay their college tuition, we can’t afford to. My older daughter is going for elementary education and is looking at about $50,000 debt.

OUCH! is that to cover all living expenses in addition to tuition? i only ask b/c that seems so expensive when i compare it to what people who earn them at public universities pay here.

 

[yeahdisney]

Your question freaks me out. I don't want our kids to have a large debt, but I don'T want to pay that bill either!
Looks like DD could grad debt free. Undergrad.
DS high school senior get decision this Friday. If he gets in where DD is, he needs saved for 2 more years room and board; $15000 year. He needs master, nothing is saved for that.
We saved for and purchased our states college tuition program.

 

[HeatherC]

Will all due respect, one should have a knowledge of real life things especially as you get to the point where you become a legal adult even if one hasn't had to pay rent at 17/18 or pay for their own food or utilities or insurance, etc.

If an individual has no real concept of money, of how to pay for their own food and on how to budget for things like utilities and insurance frankly that's a much much larger issue. College or no college.

I agree that one should have a concept of how budgeting and money works as kids become legal adults. But budgeting for gas for their car and paying for their own cell phone is a whole lot different than paying for everything and for a parent to willing co sign a loan (which they would need to do since the student can only take out $5500 a year in their name) that could totally alter their financial future when they are starting out in life is, in my opinion, selfish and short sighted on the part of a parent.

Now if a kid wants to take on all that debt without a parent co signing, there is not much anyone can do and that is certainly their option as a legal adult.

I don’t understand why any parent would want their kid to start their adult lives buried in debt just to teach them a lesson or because they are considered legal adults. How about we teach them to budget responsibly from the get go and not take on huge debts in the first place.

Maybe if more parents thought this way, we wouldn’t have such a student loan debt crisis like we are now seeing. And yet, I consistently hear talk about how student loan debt should be forgiven. Why? If you as a parent or student take it on, you own it.

 

[DisneyOma]

I had 2 requirements with my 2 and that was it had to be a public university in Florida and their major would have to be one that would provide gainful employment right away. Not a generic business degree or history or something similar. But I was the one paying. So I felt that was fair. And I agree about the age of 30 is about how we were at 20. So many of them won't or can't grow up.

Doesn't say much about the generation that is raising them, does it?

 

[GAMom2]

I think anything over $20,000 is a lot. I took out a loan for $8,000 for my last couple of years of college and haven’t regretted it at all. My family couldn’t afford to help and even though I worked full time I had to pay for most everything (car, food, insurance, clothes and half of the utilities) that was needed to live. The only thing I didn’t pay was rent. Looking back I wish we’d just done a student loan for my husband instead of paying as he went part time. It would have sped everything up and he could have started his career earlier. And compared to what he made with his degree I think $10,000 in student loans wouldn’t have been bad. The problem is when you take out too much for a career path that will not justify the debt. I have friends that took out $60,000+ in student loans for jobs that paid $30,000. That sounds crazy to me. My kids are still young so we’re still planning for them. I’m sure when the time comes we’ll pay what we can up to a reasonable amount and then it will be up to them. I don’t see anything wrong with making the person benefitting from the education help pay for it.

 

[QueenIsabella]

We had our oldest borrow the maximum that was federally guaranteed--I think this is the $5500/year loan. We did this because, although she had a grandmother who would pay the entire bill regardless, DD chose the most expensive school. Had she gone to her third choice, it would have been much, much cheaper, but she had very specific reasons for picking the school she did. Fine, but then you do what you can to mitigate Grandma's costs. As it happens, Grandma died last year, leaving DD enough money to make a serious dent in those loans, should she choose to. Now DD is 23, lives 800 miles from us, shares an apartment, holds 3 jobs, drives a cheapo car (also a gift from Grandma), and manages her bills just fine. She is working in her field (bilingual education)--not getting rich and famous, by any stretch, but she's happy with her choices, so I'm good.

Our 2nd child has a host of issues, and lives at home while attending community college. It's the right choice for him, and it's working for him. When the time comes, he'll transfer to the local 4-year school and continue to live at home. No student loans there.

Kid #3 wants to be a lawyer. She has zero interest in going local--she would move out if we pushed it. I just pointed out that, the more she saves on undergrad, the more money she has left for grad school. Since their grandmother passed, DH and I have assumed the responsibility of paying. We have a set amount of funds set aside for #3 and #4--it's up to them to choose wisely.

#4 will likely be a STEM kid, so there's a good chance that he'll be able to find a decent career path. Choosing/paying for college isn't on his radar yet. We just emphasize working hard and getting good grades, although he's probably absorbing some of the cross-talk with kid #3.

 

[Poohforyou]

That $5500 loan is just for freshman year, it goes up after that. Also, some grants schools offer are tied to accepting the Stafford loans. You also have to accept the unsubsidized loan if it's offered along with a subsidized portion.

All that said, I'm of the opinion that college is more than getting a degree. If that's all I thought it was my daughter could live at home and commute to one of five different schools, including an ivy.

My daughter will graduate with four years of Stafford loans which I believe will be $25,000. This was her choice. She could have gone to a different school but wouldn't be nearly as happy and engaged as she is. We may pay part or all of that off. It really depends on circumstances. She's fine with it.

I don't think it's a staggering unmanageable amount.

 

[AustinMommyofThree]

We're very fortunate to have saved for our children, assuming long before we knew their aptitudes they'd go to private schools like their father and I, and we have adequate income to make up any delta that exists when the time comes, so it's unlikely that they'll need to take on any debt. But that having been said, looking at the average increase in lifetime earnings for those who earn college degrees versus those who don't, I think upwards of $40,000 for an average undergraduate degree is totally legitimate. I figure if we'd pay that for a car, which depreciates to zero in just a few years, it's worth paying it for something that provides a lifetime of dramatically increased earnings as well as opens so many doors.

To be clear, my children will go wherever is the best fit for them, and that could be public and in-state, community college, or a crazy expensive school on the coasts (and we'll be a part of that conversation, but more to support rather than to steer), we just didn't want to undersave and so in their early years we invested my bonuses into a "college fund" and that has set us up well.

 

[NHdisneylover]

I'm not one to push my kids towards "marketable" fields over pursuing their own interests or require them to choose majors that offer a career path straight out of undergrad, so the long-term path they're interested in has a big impact on the conversations we've had about college funding. We're shooting for zero-debt undergrad for our HS senior, knowing that she might end up borrowing to get through grad school (which is absolutely required for her intended field - undergrad alone won't have much marketable value). When my son was weighing a dedicated trade school vs. the local community college, though, we didn't discourage borrowing the way we have for DD because the loans he'd have been taking were small relative to his expected starting salary and he plans to go straight into the workforce after graduation.

Generally speaking, I think $20K or so is reasonable for most degrees. No one would balk at a newly-graduated professional borrowing that for a modest new car; it is equally reasonable to think of making those payments instead and driving that student-beater a little longer.

I fall somewhere in the middle of this debate, I think.

I do not feel it is productive to push someone into a career (or for them to push themselves into it) that is not a good fit for them, solely becuase it is one associated with a strong paycheck. Unhappy engineers who aren't really all that great at what they do (even if they could get the grades in school) and do not like it also find themselves out of work. And it often happens that THE in demand career is suddenly flooded with too many applicants who all decided to take the same major when they read about that career beingv THE in thing while the were 17-19 years old.

On the other hard, I am not a fan of spending a lot of money to send a kid to university for art, or history or theatre, etc without some idea of what they can do with it, beyond the unlikely making it as a Broadway actor, etc--and good discussion about it----yes, go into arts, etc, but realistically and with a decent plan B. (I mean, by all means if you have ulimited funds to finance education jsut for education'S sake--go you! But for those of us in the real world . . . )


Soooo, for example, my friends's daughter was a theatre major. She'd love to make it as an actress, but that hasn't happened. However, she made sure she got plenty of tech experience and classes and now works for a company which does the stage managing for all kinds of short term shows (lots of dance recitals, travelling acts coming in for a few weeks, etc)---they work with several small theatres in the metro area she lives in. It's not super well paid thugh is a living wage, and it is full time work that uses her degree and keeps her in the field.

 

[kamik86]

I think it depends on major and prospects. I took out the stafford loans. My parents took out parent loans of about the same amount and that with grants and scholarships got me through my private school.

I have no problem paying my loans. My parents I think are done with theirs (since they started paying them back as I was there and I deferred mine until after grad school. That degree also allowed me to get a job making a pretty nice salary.

The rule I heard as a student often was that you shouldn't have more in loans then you expect you can make in your starting salary. Even counting in my parents loans we were within that.

 

[NHdisneylover]

. My older daughter is going for elementary education and is looking at about $50,000 debt.

.

Do you live in one of those magical places that pays teachers really well? That seems like an awful lot for elem ed--wow

 

[Happyinwonerland]

I guess you have to consider the investment. When I returned to school in my early 20's, I was married, in the middle of the grest recesssion, barely makig ends meet. I decided to take on some debt, knowing that it would double my income the first year out of school and more than triple it by year 3. I had no issues taking out debt to get there. I think all in, I took out $30k for an associates (this included money to supplement my living expenses).

I just think you have to have a plan for your career path. With no family support, many students have no choice but to take out laons. Trying to make it in life without a degree seems impossible anymore.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Average student debt for a 2017 graduate in the U.S. is $39,400, up 6% from the previous year.
Other statistics:

• Student loan delinquency rate of 11.2% (90+ days delinquent or in default)
• Average monthly student loan payment (for borrower aged 20 to 30 years): $351

https://studentloanhero.com/student-loan-debt-statistics/

That said, I think a small amount of debt paid on time is fine and can help establish credit. (As little as possible, to answer the question, but there are a lot of variables.)

 

[tvguy]

Which is why cost was a huge part of the decision making process for my kid. Personally, I would have strongly advised my kid against choosing a $50,000 a year college. STRONGLY. I also would not have blown all saved funds on my oldest, leaving my youngets with fewer options, to support my older one going to a pricey university. And if one child chose to go into a lot of debt anyway, while the other found ways to live more within their means, I personally, would not feel comfortable spending family inheritance to save the one from feeling the effects his poor financial planning decisions while not spending a similar amount to help the other (maybe giving that one the same amount towards a down payment on a home, etc). Your son is very lucky.

University, like anything else we purchase, from homes to cars to clothes to vacations, needs to fit into our budget. There are things we can afford and things we may like to have but cannot afford (or choose not to budget for while sacrificing elsewhere). Homes and education are things we will take on some debt for, but we still live within our means and choose homes and educations where the amount of debt really allows us to actually live well in those means and prefer never to rely on a future inheritence to pay off aynthing. It'S fine that you chose otherwise, but it is not at all how we want to live, or raised our children to think---for us the "right fit" school includes fitting into the budget. And it is certainly possible to make decisions which fit into those means---as even your daughter's education did.

All personal choice. University for our kids was too important to us. Better to give them the money now to educate them that an inheritance when we die. Our budget had to fit the cost of their College. That's what parents do in our opinion, and that was a discussion my wife and I had long before having kids. Looking back now that it is over, it was amazingly easy, given that the highest combined GROSS annual income we had through our kids finishing college was $100,000. We did splurge this year and replace the car we had 31 years!

 

[NHdisneylover]

All personal choice. University for our kids was too important to us. Better to give them the money now to educate them that an inheritance when we die. Our budget had to fit the cost of their College. That's what parents do in our opinion, and that was a discussion my wife and I had long before having kids. Looking back now that it is over, it was amazingly easy, given that the highest combined GROSS annual income we had through our kids finishing college was $100,000. We did splurge this year and replace the car we had 31 years!

See, we did not feel we should be obligated to budget our lives in such a way that our children could attend any high priced school their little hearts desired and i find it rather insulting that you say "that is what parents do" as if those of us who do not, are not fulfilling parental responsibility. Wow.
It'S a lovely thing that you did for your son, allowing him to pick ANYwhere to go, regardless of cost and not have to bear any responsibility for paying for it. But those who either cannot or choose not to do so are not failing to do "what parents do"

For us, personally, we feel the right thing to do is to support/finance an education which sets the kids up for a entering a sustainable career without debt---but do not feel in any way obligated to spend lots of extra for the luxury of going to a higher priced school just becuase. Similarly---we felt obligated to provide our kids with decent clothing growing up, weather appropriate, clean, comfortable, reasonably in styles they wanted---but we never felt like we were obligated to provide them with high end designer jeans, etc. Some people, like my cousin, have the money and desire to buy their 9 year olds Coach purses and enjoy doing so and I think that is just fine---but that doesn't mean it is "what parents do"

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I agree that one should have a concept of how budgeting and money works as kids become legal adults. But budgeting for gas for their car and paying for their own cell phone is a whole lot different than paying for everything and for a parent to willing co sign a loan (which they would need to do since the student can only take out $5500 a year in their name) that could totally alter their financial future when they are starting out in life is, in my opinion, selfish and short sighted on the part of a parent.

Now if a kid wants to take on all that debt without a parent co signing, there is not much anyone can do and that is certainly their option as a legal adult.

I don’t understand why any parent would want their kid to start their adult lives buried in debt just to teach them a lesson or because they are considered legal adults. How about we teach them to budget responsibly from the get go and not take on huge debts in the first place.

Maybe if more parents thought this way, we wouldn’t have such a student loan debt crisis like we are now seeing. And yet, I consistently hear talk about how student loan debt should be forgiven. Why? If you as a parent or student take it on, you own it.

Right but that's not what your initial quote said.

It's setting someone up for immediate failure if they don't have some background knowledge. You said: "It could completely alter their financial future when they haven’t even had to really pay most adult bills yet. Most 18 -20 year olds have never had to pay rent, mortgage, buy their own food, utilities, insurance, etc.."

And I would say not knowing how to do those things absolutely alters their financial future and far worse than student loans regardless of going to college or not because those things are part of being a basic functioning adult. And it wouldn't be because they are too young.

Also there's a difference in guidance and telling. Sitting down going over the impacts taking out X loan would do and how to budget that in with all other expenses is a lot different than saying "you're going to do this and that, etc"

 

[tvguy]

See, we did not feel we should be obligated to budget our lives in such a way that our children could attend any high priced school their little hearts desired and i find it rather insulting that you say "that is what parents do" as if those of us who do not, are not fulfilling parental responsibility. Wow.
It'S a lovely thing that you did for your son, allowing him to pick ANYwhere to go, regardless of cost and not have to bear any responsibility for paying for it. But those who either cannot or choose not to do so are not failing to do "what parents do"

For us, personally, we feel the right thing to do is to support/finance an education which sets the kids up for a entering a sustainable career without debt---but do not feel in any way obligated to spend lots of extra for the luxury of going to a higher priced school just becuase. Similarly---we felt obligated to provide our kids with decent clothing growing up, weather appropriate, clean, comfortable, reasonably in styles they wanted---but we never felt like we were obligated to provide them with high end designer jeans, etc. Some people, like my cousin, have the money and desire to buy their 9 year olds Coach purses and enjoy doing so and I think that is just fine---but that doesn't mean it is "what parents do"

Calm down. Just explaining why. And there is a chance we may need the favor returned when we are older and grayer, dare I say, because THAT is what kids do for elderly parents.
You are NOT being unreasonable in your view, just different. IMHO parents who say that when a child turns 18, they are on their own, THEY are being unreasonable. And there have been many heated threads over the years here where people felt their responsibility to their family ended when that family member turned 18.,

 

[mjkacmom]

OUCH! is that to cover all living expenses in addition to tuition? i only ask b/c that seems so expensive when i compare it to what people who earn them at public universities pay here.

In state public tuition in my state is over $30,000 a year, including room and board. Private universities are usually $50,000 + not including room and board (which is around $14,000 alone). The public colleges here don’t give a lot of merit scholarships.