The Vaccine Discussion Thread

[o&smom]

But ACIP won’t have truly authorized it, it’s an emergency use authorization. True authorizations while likely take several years (as they should)
it’s why I’m so skeptical of private business requiring vaccination... it’s not truly bonafide. Once adult trials end in 2023, and they are fully licensed, not under the pandemic authorization, but truly licensed.
Then I could see companies, schools etc having legal standing (but not before, since double masking/correct fit,according to the CDC *is so great at reducing transmission*. I don’t remember the percentage if both people are wearing it properly, but it’s high)

I’m genuinely curious what liability employers have if they require an experimental vaccine and an adverse event (which have all been properly documented in the trials) happens? Sure it’s rare, but it happens, and if it happens to an employee (or yikes, a mishandled batch gets administered to several employees and they all have a claim) what recourse do they have? Will worker’s compensation cover it? Short term disability?

dr. Fauci has said time and time again that vaccine uptake is highest when it’s not mandatory, and there are peer reviewed studies to support that. It’s psychology and marketing 101.

100% agree. Just heard Dr. Fauci or Dr. Jha say that that full approval may be as early as June. Do not see how this would be possible, but who knows. Liability from vaccines has been dismissed. Before emergency use was authorized they gave an additional type of protection for vaccine manufacturers because it is EU and not fully approved by the FDA. Not sure if these indemnities would apply to businesses.

 

[o&smom]

This is something that I have yet to find a reasonable explanation for. Has there ever been a virus before where a vaccinated person could still infect others? I'm not saying it's not true, just that I would love to discover any research behind this idea. People toss this idea around without ever backing it up with science. It seems highly unlikely to me, and I don't recall any historical precedents for this, but maybe I am just not informed.

This is data from their own studies and has been stated by the CDC and Dr. Fauci. No proof that the current vaccines prevent spread or death, only mild symptoms. They are hoping that over time they will have data to , hopefully, confirm this. Monkeys in the Pfizer study still got Covid after full vaccination.

 

[Missingmypooh]

100% agree. Just heard Dr. Fauci or Dr. Jha say that that full approval may be as early as June. Do not see how this would be possible, but who knows. Liability from vaccines has been dismissed. Before emergency use was authorized they gave an additional type of protection for vaccine manufacturers because it is EU and not fully approved by the FDA. Not sure if theses indemnities would apply to businesses.

I found one mainstream article that said that Pfizer would apply for full authorization in April of this year.

Reuters- Pfizer full FDA approval in 2021

 

[Mousequake]

This is something that I have yet to find a reasonable explanation for. Has there ever been a virus before where a vaccinated person could still infect others? I'm not saying it's not true, just that I would love to discover any research behind this idea. People toss this idea around without ever backing it up with science. It seems highly unlikely to me, and I don't recall any historical precedents for this, but maybe I am just not informed.

It's fairly common that vaccines don't prevent infection altogether. However, it's NOT common that a vaccinated person would still be able to infect others, even in infected themselves. Here's a fairly decent article about the topic:

https://theconversation.com/coronav...W9OF8uIdT-SBAXsi1V0_UyNhsrjAyNWscqTZsFg2YDBLY

 

[princessmommyx3]

It's fairly common that vaccines don't prevent infection altogether. However, it's NOT common that a vaccinated person would still be able to infect others, even in infected themselves. Here's a fairly decent article about the topic:

https://theconversation.com/coronav...W9OF8uIdT-SBAXsi1V0_UyNhsrjAyNWscqTZsFg2YDBLY

Thank you so much! This is an excellent article and answers all of my questions. So if this article is correct, then my suspicions are correct. Even if vaccinated people can technically still spread Covid, the spread of disease will still slow as more and more people get vaccinated, which researchers have determined from years of studying the flu vaccine. This is such encouraging news!

 

[tidefan]

This is data from their own studies and has been stated by the CDC and Dr. Fauci. No proof that the current vaccines prevent spread or death, only mild symptoms. They are hoping that over time they will have data to , hopefully, confirm this. Monkeys in the Pfizer study still got Covid after full vaccination.

Actually, studies are now showing that the vaccines DO prevent/reduce transmission as well...

Pfizer's vaccine appears to reduce coronavirus transmission

 

[Mousequake]

This is data from their own studies and has been stated by the CDC and Dr. Fauci. No proof that the current vaccines prevent spread or death, only mild symptoms.

I believe you’re either misinterpreting the results, or I'm misinterpreting what you're saying. The current vaccines prevent 100% of COVID deaths in people vaccinated. Even if a vaccinated person develops symptomatic COVID (which is prevented 95% of the time), symptoms are mild and there have been no deaths from COVID reported. I'd have to go back and double-check, but I don't even believe there have been any COVID hospitalizations in people who are vaccinated.

 

[sabrecmc]

My understanding is that it seems like the vaccines work to make COVID something that we can live with, basically. It isn't going to totally disappear for a very long time, but if we can make it where it doesn't result in hospitalizations and death, then that's probably a risk most of us will be okay to take and get back to normal.

 

[o&smom]

I believe you’re either misinterpreting the results, or I'm misinterpreting what you're saying. The current vaccines prevent 100% of COVID deaths in people vaccinated. Even if a vaccinated person develops symptomatic COVID (which is prevented 95% of the time), symptoms are mild and there have been no deaths from COVID reported. I'd have to go back and double-check, but I don't even believe there have been any COVID hospitalizations in people who are vaccinated.

That is data from the new Johnson and Johnson vaccine they are trying to get approved. The Pfizer and Moderna do not show that from studies so far. Studies show that they are effective for moderate symptoms. The CDC website and Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting Service shows many reported hospitalizations and even deaths. Israel had a large outbreak of Covid in vaccinated individuals.

 

[Mousequake]

That is data from the new Johnson and Johnson vaccine they are trying to get approved. The Pfizer and Moderna do not show that from studies so far. Studies show that they are effective for moderate symptoms. The CDC website and Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting Service shows many reported hospitalizations and even deaths. Israel had a large outbreak of Covid in vaccinated individuals.

I'm not sure where you're getting this information from, but it's incorrect. Both the Pfizer and the Moderna trial reports detail the results I described:

Moderna trial results here: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2035389. "The mRNA-1273 vaccine showed 94.1% efficacy at preventing Covid-19 illness, including severe disease."

Pfizer trial results here: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2034577. "A two-dose regimen of BNT162b2 conferred 95% protection against Covid-19 in persons 16 years of age or older."

 

[Snowwhyt]

Well I am kinda depressed and exhausted. My daughter was able to get her second vaccination on Friday as an EMT I mentioned this earlier in the thread. Not much earlier of course because it is only Sunday morning

So last night I got a call from my daughter at 7o’clock telling me that the 10 AM spit test she took showed her positive for Covid. My mind goes immediately to the fact that she just had her second Covid shot the day before on Friday. As for symptoms she is having all the typical ones of the people who have had a second Covid vaccination. Sore arm freezing cold, kind of tired, temperature is going up She came home from college this morning I prepared the basement for her next two week stay. There’s a entire apartment down there as far as accoutrements go. Bed, shower, kitchen, refrigerator, TV, outdoor entrance, no tub no dishwasher other than that pretty good set up.
On her way home she took another Covid test to verify if this last test was valid. The results of this one we do not expect to be as quick as yesterdayas results it could be 3 to 5 days.
Typically you could hear my daughter complain about people that are not wearing a mask. She will turn and walk the other way if she sees somebody without a mask. She holds her breath when she has to walk by people. She has hand sanitizer with her constantly. We are in a state that has both UK and Brazilian variance of Covid both noted to be exceptionally easy to spread.
my father and mother just got there shots on Friday, but this is their first shot. Called called my parents after we found out and told them that at no point are they supposed to see anybody any longer until two weeks after the next shot. They have to get groceries delivered to their trunk, that’s it! They’re 78 and live 2 1/2 hours away so who knows if that’s gonna happen. My stress is that my daughter got Covid and she’s so very careful. And although the first shot was not a guarantee, the second shot did not offer a guarantee either. My daughter found out that my father took a bite of a free hotdog that was given to him at a gas station grand opening and she ripped him a new one. (I got first crack at him though) we both love them but we love them alive.

Anyway, try to be so careful and now we have to worry about future repercussions this virus may cause. She did everything she could to keep from getting Covid including the shots and I realize that the second shot wouldn’t take affect for two weeks, but still. So after I tried to get as much water milk cereal disposable bowls and utensils. I’m throwing stuff down the basement stairs so her and I don’t come within 12 feet of each other. I’m at risk and my daughter doesn’t want to be responsible for my getting the virus. It’s been an exhausting 22 hours.
Be careful folks, this could get ugly.
Our Next sale date is late August.

 

[CampbellzSoup]

First responder here for my second shot I felt like complete garbage the next day, aches chills and fatigue, it’s all part of your body wondering what is this!? Next day I felt like a million dollars!

 

[Snowwhyt]

First responder here for my second shot I felt like complete garbage the next day, aches chills and fatigue, it’s all part of your body wondering what is this!? Next day I felt like a million dollars!

If she got her shot on Friday morning would she be feeling the chills Saturday night and Sunday all day? I really hope this is just response from the second shot. But that the spit test showed that she had Covid yesterday morning it’s kind of stressful.

 

[Katiebird]

If she got her shot on Friday morning would she be feeling the chills Saturday night and Sunday all day? I really hope this is just response from the second shot. But that the spit test showed that she had Covid yesterday morning it’s kind of stressful.

If she had a positive test, she has Covid. The symptoms may be from the shot though, and the first shot should still help her have a milder case than she would’ve without any vaccination.

 

[princessmommyx3]

If she had a positive test, she has Covid.

Why couldn’t it be a false positive?

 

[Katiebird]

Why couldn’t it be a false positive?

Why would you assume it would be?

It’s possible it could be a false positive, but it’a much more likely that it’s not. I almost wrote “likely positive” but edited just because it’s really unlikely to be, and it shouldn’t change your behavior anyway.

 

[CampbellzSoup]

Second shot symptoms are legitimate and real I thought my co workers were being over dramatic but nope

 

[princessmommyx3]

Why would you assume it would be?

It’s possible it could be a false positive, but it’a much more likely that it’s not. I almost wrote “likely positive” but edited just because it’s really unlikely to be, and it shouldn’t change your behavior anyway.

I didn’t assume it was. I literally said it could be. Your original statement was worded in a way that sounded like a false positive was not even a possibility. I agree that she needs to act like it is a true positive until/if she can prove otherwise.

 

[Snowwhyt]

We have a friend who is a healthcare worker who tested positive for Covid so had a minimum of 10 days off of work. She got an additional Covid test the same day since she had no symptoms that showed she had no Covid. The tests aren’t 100% no surprise there, but I understand why we must behave as if they are.
truly hope that my daughter doesn’t have any trouble or diabetes or I’m not even sure what the other long-term risks are.

 

[braysmommy]

Second shot symptoms are legitimate and real I thought my co workers were being over dramatic but nope

Yep, I had my second shot on Thursday afternoon and was pretty much one with the couch all day Friday! Zero energy, chills and fever. I thought I felt ok in the morning so took the dog for a walk and about a mile into the walk it hit. The exhaustion was crazy and I took 4 naps and still was in bed by 9PM. Woke up the next day feeling great!