The US Covid Recovery is Exceptional. Why? What did it do different?

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Every article I read said "Presumed Covid". I don't know if he had a test.

Our local article has this: "We have been informed by his family that he passed away due to complications of COVID-19 over the weekend. Peyton’s last day of attendance was Thursday, October 22. We were informed he was quarantined on Monday, October 26. Later his family shared that he eventually began experiencing symptoms that required hospitalization but he did not improve."

It is very sad. However I did read some non-local articles discussing "it was unclear if he had any underlying conditions". Unfortunate that it may be it was very very clear obesity was at least one of his underlying conditions.

 

[tex1989]

Don't really know the answer but I will give my non political, non scientific, unprovable theroy about the whole mess.

We are Americans, and regardless of your political affiliation, belief structure or anything else we live in a country whose battle cry is, "you cannot tell me what to do!" and "I know what's best for me and my family!" So the idea that anyone is going to get this whole country of individuals heading in the same direction at the same time is impossible.

Just my opinion.

 

[Aladora]

Don't really know the answer but I will give my non political, non scientific, unprovable theroy about the whole mess.

We are Americans, and regardless of your political affiliation, belief structure or anything else we live in a country whose battle cry is, "you cannot tell me what to do!" and "I know what's best for me and my family!" So the idea that anyone is going to get this whole country of individuals heading in the same direction at the same time is impossible.

Just my opinion.

See, here is my issue with statements like this, your government tells you what to do every single day.

You, as Americans, are subject to widespread laws and regulations all the time. You are required by law to wear a seat-belt when driving in a car. You are required by law to not drive under the influence of drugs or alcohol. You are required by law to wear clothing that covers your genitalia when you are in a public place. You are required by law to not murder people. You are required by law to file and pay your taxes.

There are laws governing your behaviour, it's possibly that those laws are so ingrained into the collective psyche that they do not stand out when people think about rules and laws telling them what to do.

Just my musings from a non-American.

 

[tex1989]

Do you not have the same restrictions? I mean is okay to not pay taxes and murder people where you live?

 

[Aladora]

Do you not have the same restrictions? I mean is okay to not pay taxes and murder people where you live?

Well, I'm Canadian and where I live we don't have many people freaking out saying that the government can't tell us what to do.

 

[NotUrsula]

Totally agree that you have to be infected before it can kill you so controlling spread is important. The bold is mine, though. Where did you get this info?

Among other places, https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-care/why-did-so-many-new-yorkers-covid-19-wait-until-n1190111, and https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32915166/

 

[NotUrsula]

We’re a country of law breakers. We get what we deserve when we don’t take things seriously. I’m alright, Jack.

Collective "we"? The problem with ignoring most health dept. orders is that it also puts others at risk.

I guess the DUI comparison is the most apt: it's one thing for the law to have no interest in punishing you for doing stupid things if the only person who gets hurt is you, BUT the public safety aspect of the Police Power kicks in when the stupid things that people choose to do also put innocent bystanders in danger.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Well, I'm Canadian and where I live we don't have many people freaking out saying that the government can't tell us what to do.

Wasn't there just a story about how many young Canadians are not wearing masks, not social distancing, getting together in groups and driving the large increases in cases? And isn't small gatherings without masks, indoors, etc driving up the cases too in Canada? Sure they may not be vocal like us Americans tend to be having protests and whatnot but let's not pretend that everyone is always doing everything they were told to do because we know otherwise.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

One of the reasons my state gave for a quicker than expected (though by no means good) economic recovery is due to some of the big industries within the state not necessarily being fully shut down as they were deemed essential and large agriculture presence (farming tends to have a lower COVID incident rate due to the nature of it). There were def. outbreaks in meat processing (and still are) though. It's the restaurant industries, hotel industries, social/entertainment, etc that like everywhere else got hit hard.

The CARES act money is def. helping out. I'm still concerned we'll end up in a bad position. We just got out of being in a really bad position from our prior governor (not the interim one but the one before that) in terms of economic health of the state and then bam COVID happened. So I guess I'm hoping for the best but expecting dominoes to fall.

 

[NAB]

Wasn't there just a story about how many young Canadians are not wearing masks, not social distancing, getting together in groups and driving the large increases in cases? And isn't small gatherings without masks, indoors, etc driving up the cases too in Canada? Sure they may not be vocal like us Americans tend to be having protests and whatnot but let's not pretend that everyone is always doing everything they were told to do because we know otherwise.

Yes it is mostly private parties that are causing the numbers to go up. Just had a wedding of 100 people, 44 people got Covid. Just like the US some provinces are worse than others. Our numbers went up here in Ontario 2 weeks after Thanksgiving. Our guidelines were only have it with your household. We know that wasn’t the case in places.

We are definitely in a second wave. We have to wear masks in any public indoor space. Not outdoors unless you can’t distance. So you see people putting masks on when heading to the door of a store. Lots do not wear them right, nose always showing.

Schools are open but we’re giving the choice of doing in class or online. This month they can change if they chose. Our problem is we have a shortage of teachers since the online only do on line and class only do in class. We are seeing some break outs but not many. One teacher was fined last week for not wearing a mask in his class.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Yes it is mostly private parties that are causing the numbers to go up. Just had a wedding of 100 people, 44 people got Covid. Just like the US some provinces are worse than others. Our numbers went up here in Ontario 2 weeks after Thanksgiving. Our guidelines were only have it with your household. We know that wasn’t the case in places.

We are definitely in a second wave. We have to wear masks in any public indoor space. Not outdoors unless you can’t distance. So you see people putting masks on when heading to the door of a store. Lots do not wear them right, nose always showing.

Schools are open but we’re giving the choice of doing in class or online. This month they can change if they chose. Our problem is we have a shortage of teachers since the online only do on line and class only do in class. We are seeing some break outs but not many. One teacher was fined last week for not wearing a mask in his class.

Sounds a lot like places in the U.S.

My metro in recent weeks has seen a rapid increase sooo that's not going to be the best with Thanksgiving weeks away and I can guess that just like other areas and countries that had holidays cases will at least see some sort of a bump following it. And the thing I'm getting concerned about it the colleges as many of them have decided to have students stop going to in-person classes after Thanksgiving. If they were living on campus and decided to go home and stay home unless they quarantine or get tested they could be spreading it to their communities just like in the Spring. I think we have better procedures than we did in the Spring but it's not a good timing to have that with what could happen for Thanksgiving itself.

 

[Aladora]

Wasn't there just a story about how many young Canadians are not wearing masks, not social distancing, getting together in groups and driving the large increases in cases? And isn't small gatherings without masks, indoors, etc driving up the cases too in Canada? Sure they may not be vocal like us Americans tend to be having protests and whatnot but let's not pretend that everyone is always doing everything they were told to do because we know otherwise.

I'm not saying that we are perfect but in my health region of over 850,000 people, we had 5 new cases in the past 24 hours and a total since the beginning of 270. If you look at my entire province, we have a population of just over 5.1 million and a total covid case count of 15,800. South Carolina has a population of almost exactly the same and has a covid case count of 179,952. That means that SC has almost 11.4 times the number of cases in the same population. And my province has the 4th largest number of cases in Canada.

California has a population of 39 million, Canada has around 38 million. Covid cases in California: 934,672. Covid cases in Canada: 244,635. That is 4 times the number for almost the same population.

As I said, my area is not perfect but the numbers are staggeringly different.

 

[Tiggerette]

Don't really know the answer but I will give my non political, non scientific, unprovable theroy about the whole mess.

We are Americans, and regardless of your political affiliation, belief structure or anything else we live in a country whose battle cry is, "you cannot tell me what to do!" and "I know what's best for me and my family!" So the idea that anyone is going to get this whole country of individuals heading in the same direction at the same time is impossible.

Just my opinion.

I didn't want to like the post.... but sadly, I think our rugged individualism becomes detrimentally selfish in the context of covid. Those cultures that place the good of the whole over the self may have had better adherence with public health measures. Down the line months/years from now, data and analysis will more clearly demonstrate how national values may have ultimately shaped recovery.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I'm not saying that we are perfect but in my health region of over 850,000 people, we had 5 new cases in the past 24 hours and a total since the beginning of 270. If you look at my entire province, we have a population of just over 5.1 million and a total covid case count of 15,800. South Carolina has a population of almost exactly the same and has a covid case count of 179,952. That means that SC has almost 11.4 times the number of cases in the same population. And my province has the 4th largest number of cases in Canada.

California has a population of 39 million, Canada has around 38 million. Covid cases in California: 934,672. Covid cases in Canada: 244,635. That is 4 times the number for almost the same population.

As I said, my area is not perfect but the numbers are staggeringly different.

No one is or has contested that Canada has way different numbers as a whole than the U.S. so I'm not entirely sure why that is brought to the table. Trust me many of us are appalled at what we have going on here, we're frustrated, anxious, upset and more.

You called yourself out as a non-American, then as a Canadian, framed it as "you Americans" in a very specific way all the while your fellow countrymen are exhibiting some of the same exact behaviors as Americans albeit on a different noise level than us.

While you may live where you "don't have many people freaking out saying that the government can't tell us what to do." people are in fact not doing what the government is telling them to do. They just aren't out protesting for the right to be able to do what they want to do at least not the same way as us and that's is a difference in social cultures; they are still going to the bars, not wearing masks, flaunting their invisibility, having get togethers with little to no precautions and more. But non-compliance and high risky behavior is something that many countries have grappled with.

A lot of other countries have a different construct than ours that's for sure but there are still things that transcend that.

 

[Aladora]

You called yourself out as a non-American, then as a Canadian, framed it as "you Americans" in a very specific way all the while your fellow countrymen are exhibiting some of the same exact behaviors as Americans albeit on a different noise level than us.

You misunderstood my reasons for why I specified myself as a non-American and also framed it as "you, as Americans".

I did that because I was commenting on the concept of the inability to get an entire country of individuals going in the same direction as a result of a country who has the battle cry of "you cannot tell me what to do!" and "I know what's best for me and my family!" I specified that I was not American because I was observing as an outsider.

My comments were directly about the fact that there are country-wide laws telling people what to do.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

You misunderstood my reasons for why I specified myself as a non-American and also framed it as "you, as Americans".

I did that because I was commenting on the concept of the inability to get an entire country of individuals going in the same direction as a result of a country who has the battle cry of "you cannot tell me what to do!" and "I know what's best for me and my family!" I specified that I was not American because I was observing as an outsider.

My comments were directly about the fact that there are country-wide laws telling people what to do.

I can understand that But then you brought up the number of cases and population. A distinct rise in cases in places in Canada are a direct result of people saying the government can't tell me what to do..they just aren't yelling that but their actions are saying that. I'm just trying to point out we're not as dissimilar in that respect as one might think.

As a non-Canadian I simply see that human behaviors are fairly similar in a lot of places because that's the crux of it isn't it? We're just louder than you which let's be honest Americans are just loud in general Now as a Midwestern I have to say "ope sorry" as I'm going to switch back to watching The West Wing on Netflix as my diversion tactic for the night. Please enjoy the rest of your evening

 

[Aladora]

as I'm going to switch back to watching The West Wing on Netflix as my diversion tactic for the night.

West Wing, my favourite show ever.