PVB Tower Charts, Sales Date and more!!!

[davidhr]

I totally get Reflections. It made sense with the timing as Riviera would’ve been close to being sold out. What I don’t get is PVB Tower. It’s a very expensive resort (price and point chart), with a shorter lifespan that’s being added to another huge resort with a ton of points.

 

[Hubalorian]

I totally get Reflections. It made sense with the timing as Riviera would’ve been close to being sold out. What I don’t get is PVB Tower. It’s a very expensive resort (price and point chart), with a shorter lifespan that’s being added to another huge resort with a ton of points.

PVB was maybe another litmus test of selling another resort without the resale restrictions, another data point besides just VGF

 

[Sandisw]

PVB was maybe another litmus test of selling another resort without the resale restrictions, another data point besides just VGF

I wonder if it had something to do with Reflections being back on track and so it made sense to roll it into PVB instead?

 

[Mouseforward]

I wonder if it had something to do with Reflections being back on track and so it made sense to roll it into PVB instead?

I think Reflections will be in the trust to avoid the condo rules.

 

[Sandisw]

I think Reflections will be in the trust to avoid the condo rules.

Me too…

 

[New Mouse]

If reflections does happen its clear they are anticipating a higher capacity magic kingdom in the relatively near future. You don't keep building massive hotels with nowhere for them to go.

 

[JB2022]

Just sharing for others that we bought direct today for PVB and we were able to request our preferred use year (rather than the offered June) and they honored it.

After many years of staying cash or renting points, it was just the right time for us. PVB has been a dream resort for us, and initially with the limited room types prior to the tower we didn't think we could make that work with our family needs. Now with the expanded room types in the tower, we are very excited to finally own and be part of DVC!

 

[supercarrie]

Just sharing for others that we bought direct today for PVB and we were able to request our preferred use year (rather than the offered June) and they honored it.

After many years of staying cash or renting points, it was just the right time for us. PVB has been a dream resort for us, and initially with the limited room types prior to the tower we didn't think we could make that work with our family needs. Now with the expanded room types in the tower, we are very excited to finally own and be part of DVC!

Welcome home!!

 

[CastAStone]

I totally get Reflections. It made sense with the timing as Riviera would’ve been close to being sold out. What I don’t get is PVB Tower. It’s a very expensive resort (price and point chart), with a shorter lifespan that’s being added to another huge resort with a ton of points.

I actually think PVB tower made a lot of sense; it solved a specific issue with that resort and expanded capacity in the highest demand part of WDW for the first time since BLT was built.

The point chart makes little sense, the pricing is probably limiting sales, and it sure would make a lot more sense if it was replacing Riviera as the only WDW resort in active sales instead of joining it was one of 3, but the concept in general I’m on board with.

 

[Kailunkat]

I actually think PVB tower made a lot of sense; it solved a specific issue with that resort and expanded capacity in the highest demand part of WDW for the first time since BLT was built.

The point chart makes little sense, the pricing is probably limiting sales, and it sure would make a lot more sense if it was replacing Riviera as the only WDW resort in active sales instead of joining it was one of 3, but the concept in general I’m on board with.

It solved the infrastructure problem that the reflections site had (transportation, restaurants, pool, proximity to other resorts, ease of cleaning/staffing and cost of operation). The outlay of money spent to bring PIT online must have been much lower than reflections just due to those logistical issues and the smaller footprint. It was a pivot that probably wouldn't have happened if COVID didn't threaten the revenue stream for resorts/parks/DVC as much as it did.

The points chart is too high for the tower, but ultimately, it will get sold because people who buy into DVC at the parks (direct spur-of-the-moment purchasers) will love it. I will also be interested to see how the existing member versus new member sales go this month. It may take longer than *WE* expect to sell out, but I have a feeling that DVC is fine with it. The cash bookings for those unsold points will be very lucrative in the first few years and they have at least 5-7 years until they are ready to bring whatever is happening at Reflections online. They are playing the long game with this resort hoping that people will stay at the tower and fall in love.

 

[HyperspaceMountainPilot]

The one silver lining to the higher point chart is that it will make those rooms much less attractive to commercial renters. I actually think we’ll see higher point charts going forward for a variety of reasons (not necessarily higher than PolyT) but one of them is that commercial renting has become so common Disney can’t afford to have point charts low enough to make it profitable to rent villas at $750/night.

 

[hockeydad21]

Disney has demonstrated a tremendous amount of arrogance recently in regards to DVC.

Whether it’s putting a ton of rooms into preferred view categories that have no clear view improvement over standard view rooms (Riviera, VDH, Poly 2), putting 5 and perhaps soon to be 6 resorts on sale at once, the cabins (like 50 different things), or them pretending they have a level of pricing power they clearly, clearly do not have, they have set themselves up to fail spectacularly.

And from over here, it looks like they are in fact failing spectacularly.

Riviera sales have been basically fine, and that’s the best any resort has been doing.

VDH sales have been genuinely, inarguably terrible this year. But they’re still 4X CFW’s monthly sales.

Aulani went on sale more than 14 years ago, and while we can’t see sales, we know generally that they’ve been steadily declining for a decade.

And while I’m confident Poly will do better, @maui22’s daily deed posting hasn’t been spectacular or even great, it’s been basically fine.

If my division at the Fortune 500 company I work at sold 4 products and launched a 5th and the results I delivered by product were more-or-less fine, terrible, unimaginably bad, steady decline, and underwhelming new product launch, I’d be fired. My boss would be fired. My dog would be fired.

DVC is not doing fine. It’s not healthy. It’s wildly underperforming their historical trajectory.

IMO they’ve vastly overestimated their potential market and their pricing power with that market.

For the most part I'm in agreement with this - DVC is not in as great of shape as most think it is.

• Not sure Aulani is quite the failure you imply simply because it does really well with cash bookings.
• Riviera is fine, but would be performing better without the restrictions. It's beautiful.
• VDH is certainly not good.
• The Cabins are a dumpster fire, but they'll be saved eventually by Reflections being added to the trust. What worries me is the eventual % of people buying to book at Reflections vs the % of people buying with the intent of booking the Cabins. If 80% of people buy into the Reflections/CFW trust to stay at the Reflections' rooms, then they're gonna have a big issue on their hands with customer satisfaction.
• PVB is 100% performing worse than leadership anticipated despite it still selling "very well" when compared to other resorts historically. This should have broken records for fastest resort to sell out, and I'm just not sure that'll happen.

My worry is the long term impact with many of the recent decisions - DVC has grown exponentially within the past 8 years, and I think this, along with the exponential cost to own direct and go to the parks, will put downward pressure on DVC in the long run. Couple this with the other negative aspects coming out of Disney recently, and it worries me the brand loyalty just won't be there in 10 years unless they get the next 3-5 years right with pricing (hotels, DVC, and parks), box office entertainment, and park entertainment. There are so many choices out there these days for vacations and entertainment, and the next generation coming into the real world (the iPad generation as I like to call it) likely won't have the same brand loyalty (or the attention span to stand in line for 30+ minutes to ride the Haunted Mansion) as the previous 3 generations did.

 

[CastAStone]

Not sure Aulani is quite the failure you imply simply because it does really well with cash bookings

Aulani is a failure from a business standpoint vs what it’s original concept was.

Disney was supposed to collect a billion dollars from Aulani in the early 2010s and then sit back and rent out the hotel side and the breakage.

That was the business objective.

I’m sure they’ve made money on Aulani and im sure it will turn a profit in 2024, but the profit maximizing model for a timeshare is get in and get out, then do it again. Put the risk of a pandemic or a hurricane on the owners, not TWDC. Pay off the loans in a year. That’s just not what has happened.

 

[MarkNC2Disney]

but the profit maximizing model for a timeshare is get in and get out, then do it again.

Yeah, guarantee every TWDC business model would rather have massive cash flow upfront to reinvest on other projects, rather than drip drip drip over time.

 

[hockeydad21]

Aulani is a failure from a business standpoint vs what it’s original concept was.

Disney was supposed to collect a billion dollars from Aulani in the early 2010s and then sit back and rent out the hotel side and the breakage.

That was the business objective.

I’m sure they’ve made money on Aulani and im sure it will turn a profit in 2024, but the profit maximizing model for a timeshare is get in and get out, then do it again. Put the risk of a pandemic or a hurricane on the owners, not TWDC. Pay off the loans in a year. That’s just not what has happened.

I agree, selling out in 3-4 years is absolutely preferred. I just don’t think it’s a complete failure like some potential other DVC properties are tending towards (looking at you VDH and CFW).

 

[CastAStone]

I agree, selling out in 3-4 years is absolutely preferred. I just don’t think it’s a complete failure like some potential other DVC properties are tending towards (looking at you VDH and CFW).

Oh there’s certainly no comparison to CFW. VDH remains to be seen. They can fix it - if they can admit what they did wrong.

They can’t fix CFW.

 

[MarkNC2Disney]

Back on topic, what’s the source on PVB sales not being as good as predicted?
Guide, Comptroller, Bus Driver???

 

[JackosinDIS]

Back on topic, what’s the source on PVB sales not being as good as predicted?
Guide, Comptroller, Bus Driver???

Comptroller - tracking recorded deeds on this thread https://www.disboards.com/threads/dvcnews-september-2024-sales-information.3955521/

 

[New Mouse]

I agree, selling out in 3-4 years is absolutely preferred. I just don’t think it’s a complete failure like some potential other DVC properties are tending towards (looking at you VDH and CFW).

it's a failure in that it doesn't meet investor/ceo expectations.

Also, Disney doesn't really care too much about guest satisfaction these days.

 

[davidhr]

Back on topic, what’s the source on PVB sales not being as good as predicted?
Guide, Comptroller, Bus Driver???

TBF, we don’t know their targets, so even those sales could be above what they planned (I don’t think so, but I don’t know).

I work for a very popular company with tons of fans and like to read forums online about what people think it’s happening and sometimes it’s totally the opposite lol