Kids Club Age Change

[Mags2002]

Because race/genetics plays a big role in how big a child is. I live in a very diverse area with 139 different languages spoke in my kids school. The classes are diverse and so are the kids. Yes kids will be bigger at 12 than 8 however many of those 8 year olds will be the same size or bigger than some of those 12 year olds. This age range is amazing in how fast slow kids grow. I am sorry if I am being salty it just makes me irritated when someone is defending DCL on this discussion. DCL fixes nothing, making it worse, and only is a response to a lawsuit. They could have done a much better job and made smaller age appropriate groups, taken their time with the roll out, etc. But they did not. They made a big change in just a few weeks and have not told everyone who is sailing, have not updated their website, nor their check in issues (signing up 11/12 year olds for the club/lab). If you complain they send a form letter and if you call they say to talk to the CM's. Making the CM deal with the (understandably) frustrated guests. They messed this up big and only pressure will make them make this right. The 3-10 is also to big of an age group (heck a law suit involving a 3 and 7 year old happened). As far as I am concerned DCL deserve no grace on this.

As previously stated it is not as a result of a lawsuit

 

[ThinkTink91]

Do you think the 8-10 year olds would not trample the younger kids? I don't think this solved any issues. Nor made the little kids any safer as far as being trampled.

So the 3-4 yr olds are separated within the club from the 5-10yr olds. They stick with 2-4 counselors and they are trying to keep it the same 4 throughout the cruise so the little ones feel more comfortable with them.

 

[CamillaF]

As previously stated it is not as a result of a lawsuit

The only way that I would believe that this had nothing to do with a lawsuit is if they had thought it out and made the change in reasonable way. That DCL had given proper notice, changed there website, and updated there website so online check in did not have 11-12 year olds being checked in to lab/club. You have no idea if it was a lawsuit as DCL would not tell you. I am looking at their actions and making an educated guess on how our world works. Are you 100% certain that the law suits did not play a part in these quick decisions? If so please let us know your source and reason for believing so. If not then DCL has given us every reason to believe it was rash because a lawyer said it had to be.

 

[CamillaF]

So the 3-4 yr olds are separated within the club from the 5-10yr olds. They stick with 2-4 counselors and they are trying to keep it the same 4 throughout the cruise so the little ones feel more comfortable with them.

Is this what is happening? It's the first I have heard of the 3-4 year olds being separated from the 5-10 year olds. I think that makes the most since.

 

[o&smom]

The dif between my cousin at 8 and then at 12 is a full 2 and a half heads (if not almost 3). So I'm much more inclined to believe 11-12yos accidentally hurting younger kids than 8yos.

Luckily, my kids never got trampled or hurt by the older kids when in the club/lab. Never saw any trampling when I would be there.

 

[Mags2002]

The only way that I would believe that this had nothing to do with a lawsuit is if they had thought it out and made the change in reasonable way. That DCL had given proper notice, changed there website, and updated there website so online check in did not have 11-12 year olds being checked in to lab/club. You have no idea if it was a lawsuit as DCL would not tell you. I am looking at their actions and making an educated guess on how our world works. Are you 100% certain that the law suits did not play a part in these quick decisions? If so please let us know your source and reason for believing so. If not then DCL has given us every reason to believe it was rash because a lawyer said it had to be.

My friends in YA told us why it was changed. It doesn’t matter whether you believe me (and the crew onboard) or not, but spreading misinformation is damaging when you have no idea what happened and why

 

[Mags2002]

Is this what is happening? It's the first I have heard of the 3-4 year olds being separated from the 5-10 year olds. I think that makes the most since.

This was announced as part of the new policy

 

[Disneymooner07]

My friends in YA told us why it was changed

So why was it changed?

 

[Mags2002]

So why was it changed?

I am not risking my job to share that information. DCL will share it with Guests if and when they chose to do so

 

[ThinkTink91]

That DCL had given proper notice, changed there website, and updated there website so online check in did not have 11-12 year olds being checked in to lab/club.

The website STILL says they offer wildside to teens, they haven't offered that since before the pandemic. We begged for over a year for them to remove that we feed the kids lunch and dinner. And those things were known before we started sailing again so it should have been removed. A crew member just posted an updated prohibited items list because it hasn't been posted online. The website is fancy but still has outdated info from 2020 so I wouldn't take that as a sign.

 

[starlite_]

Because race/genetics plays a big role in how big a child is. I live in a very diverse area with 139 different languages spoke in my kids school. The classes are diverse and so are the kids. Yes kids will be bigger at 12 than 8 however many of those 8 year olds will be the same size or bigger than some of those 12 year olds. This age range is amazing in how fast slow kids grow. I am sorry if I am being salty it just makes me irritated when someone is defending DCL on this discussion. DCL fixes nothing, making it worse, and only is a response to a lawsuit. They could have done a much better job and made smaller age appropriate groups, taken their time with the roll out, etc. But they did not. They made a big change in just a few weeks and have not told everyone who is sailing, have not updated their website, nor their check in issues (signing up 11/12 year olds for the club/lab). If you complain they send a form letter and if you call they say to talk to the CM's. Making the CM deal with the (understandably) frustrated guests. They messed this up big and only pressure will make them make this right. The 3-10 is also to big of an age group (heck a law suit involving a 3 and 7 year old happened). As far as I am concerned DCL deserve no grace on this.

And this is still completely irrelevant. I am not talking about or defending DCLs communication skills.

We already agreed there are outliers on kids growth. The race or genes of those kids is irrelevant unless what you are trying to claim is that DCL is being racist for enforcing the age restrictions/giving little warning. Otherwise the reason of why certain kids mature faster (look at the twins a poster mentioned! A mature twin and an immature one) or are taller or shorter doesn't matter at all.

My point still stands, in general, 11-12s will be taller and bigger than 8-9s.

Also a fact: no set of rules/restrictions will fit all. Someone is gonna be unhappy. It sucks when you (general you) are the unhappy person but it happens.

Would tighter age restrictions work better? Probably!... for some. There's already some upset ppl in another thread about toddlers and 7yos having dif programming, so again. Always someone will be unhappy, no matter what they do or how they do it.

 

[lanejudy]

They could have done a much better job and made smaller age appropriate groups, taken their time with the roll out, etc. But they did not. They made a big change in just a few weeks and have not told everyone who is sailing, have not updated their website, nor their check in issues (signing up 11/12 year olds for the club/lab). If you complain they send a form letter and if you call they say to talk to the CM's. Making the CM deal with the (understandably) frustrated guests. They messed this up big and only pressure will make them make this right.

I don't want to single out anyone specifically, but several posters on this thread -- I'm not sure how familiar folks are with DCL -- maybe relatively new to cruising with them. This is a pretty typical scenario for DCL making changes. Rarely are changes announced far in advance, rarely is notification sent out, rarely does the website exactly match up -- as is evidenced by other things that aren't accurate. Is it right? Maybe not, but it's definitely not a sign of a knee-jerk reaction that they'll rescind with enough push-back. It's pretty much SOP for DCL. They don't often give reasons/explanations (other than weather) for why changes are made, or worse you might get 3 different answers from 3 different CMs.

I understand the frustration and disappointment from cruisers of children in the impacted age range. I feel for those who are within the PIF period and may have a difficult decision to make about whether to cruise with the new changes. As a parent of a child who has never fit the "normal" model, we frequently make travel plans based on what will work well for her and always have a plan-B in mind if needed. For those who are not yet within PIF, it's perfectly understandable to change plans and be disappointed about it.

But anyone who thinks that if guests complain loud enough and long enough that DCL will "make this right" -- that's an unrealistic expectation. This isn't the first time DCL has made kids' club changes that resulted in an uproar; they've made their decision and will weather through the storm so to speak. Families will adjust and cruising will go on with the new rules. In 12+ years, the only time I recall DCL changing course quickly on any unfavorable decision was the All Aboard Platter.

 

[Bibbidi_Boo]

As previously stated it is not as a result of a lawsuit

Believe as you wish, DCL is not gonna flat out say the changes are due to a lawsuit. But they also wouldn’t have made such a fast rush change like this if not forced to.

 

[Mags2002]

Believe as you wish, DCL is not gonna flat out say the changes are due to a lawsuit. But they also wouldn’t have made such a fast rush change like this if not forced to.

Not to Guests no. But Managers and other crew have been told why and they definitely were not “forced” to do anything

 

[Bibbidi_Boo]

Not to Guests no. But Managers and other crew have been told why and they definitely were not “forced” to do anything

Still don’t by it, companies will tell what they want to who they want and it isn’t always the full story.

 

[lanejudy]

But they also wouldn’t have made such a fast rush change like this if not forced to.

We actually don't know how long the idea was kicked around the board room table. It seems sudden because it wasn't announced with any lead-in time; that doesn't mean it hasn't been in the planning stages for months behind the scenes.

 

[Mags2002]

Still don’t by it, companies will tell what they want to who they want and it isn’t always the full story.

Luckily you don’t have to “buy it”. I have shared that this is not the reason, you can believe what you want, without spreading harmful rumors in the process

 

[KrzyKtty101]

We actually don't know how long the idea was kicked around the board room table. It seems sudden because it wasn't announced with any lead-in time; that doesn't mean it hasn't been in the planning stages for months behind the scenes.

True. It is possible they expected a fight either way, so just decided to "rip the band-aid" off per se.

 

[Mags2002]

The “why” was not the reason for this thread, it was to share the news that this change had happened, and offered a place to vent frustrations in the immediate aftermath. It seems most people have come to terms with it and have taken action/decisions appropriate for their family.
The policy has changed and is here to stay. No amount of complaining will change it now

 

[Nala301]

I am recently off a DCL cruise and joined because I feel like people should know what is truly going on on-board the ships before making decisions about their cruises. Shoreside guest assistance is giving out incorrect information and there seems to be a lack of communication or clear guideline regarding this change.

For context, this was our 6th DCL cruise, but first since the pandemic. Our children are 16, 13, and 11. We planned this cruise, at this time specifically because they are all VERY different and we wanted them to have their own space and own activities. I have spent years telling people that DCL is the best because there is something for all ages, AND you can also have quality family time. Our youngest is an 11 year old immature boy who was completely happy that he could still go to Oceaneers, and his sisters were thrilled to have their own spaces. He does not have a phone yet, and there are no longer wave phones on board, so there is no way to communicate. And he needs to still have some supervision.

Several weeks before the cruise, my son asked about some Edge activities, and we emailed to see if he could be in both Oceaneers and Edge. We were told he did not have to commit to one club and could do whichever activities he wanted. We talked to him about going to Edge only for short periods of time, but going to Oceaneers for longer periods (like when we would be at Palo brunch) so we would know where he was. This was our plan at the time we received an email about the change, which was less than a week before we cruised. It was too late to cancel or change, so we emailed again, attaching the response from the original email. We were told there was no longer any flexibility, but that Edge would offer secure programming, similar to Oceaneers.

This was a complete lie, and we only found out when we boarded. There is no secure programming for Edge, they can come and go as they please. The CMs said they would watch him and message us when he left and where he was going, but they rarely followed through. On the second night of our cruise, they told us he left, and when we went to find him, Edge was closed and locked with no note posted. We went to Oceaneers to look for him because it was listed on the Navigator and were not allowed in because it was secured programming. We searched the ship and finally ended up at Guest services for help. It was 10 at night, everything was shutting down on deck and youth activities CMs that we spoke with would not help us out. Guest services tried calling all the kids clubs and was told he wasn't there. Concierge also started calling the youth activity CMs, but no one would answer their phones. It was over an hour and security had been called and was searching for him when someone finally answered concierge and they found him. He had left Edge, but come back and they went to take over Oceaneers, but no one notified us or even let us in to search for him. He says he asked them to message us that he was back, but there was no follow through. All they had to do was answer their phones or at least send a message through the app. I truly felt terrified and like no one cared about my son or my family. I was asked so many times if he had a phone, and even told that he shouldn't go to Edge without a phone. That should not be a requirement for an 11 year. There seems to be no guidelines on how to supervise the younger tweens who don't have a way to communicate with family.

Obviously this affected the rest of our cruise. I didn't want to let him go back at all, but that didn't seem fair to him. He is immature, but was able to follow some ground rules that we came up with so we would know where he was. We cancelled some adult only activites because we constantly had to be checking in to be sure we knew where he was. I never really got the relaxing vacation I was hoping for. If we had known ahead of time, we could have had time to make a plan or reschedule. I truly never would have booked this cruise if I had known he would not go to Oceaneers. I pay a premium for Disney to know that my kids are safe and happy. That was definitly not the case.

In addition, my 13 year old felt pushed out of Edge because of the amount of younger kids there. She tried doing ice breakers the first night, but felt out of place. We signed a wavier for her to go to Vibe, but she felt out of place there as well. There is a trickle down effect of pushing so many younger/immature kids into the Edge space. I'm also not sure why I can sign a waiver for my younger child to go to an older club, but can't sign a waiver to send one the other direction.

There were many other ramifications from this whole situation, but that was the start of our problems. Honestly, if anyone is on the fence about sailing with an 11/12 year old, just don't do it, especially if they are a bit immature. Disney has failed this age group. I understand if there needs to be changes, but this was pushed through with no notice and no planning. Not all kids can handle the freedom. There is a huge range of normal development in tweens and parents know their kids the best. And at minimum, parents should know that they can depend on the services that are offered at the time they book the cruise. Disney took our money and then changed things at the last moment with no apologies.