Inflation..... wow the differance between Washington State and South Carolina is real!!!!

This is all about increasing income inequality. Don't think it's a big problem? There are 33 posts here so far, most arguing otherwise. Water will seek its level, and many are going to be moving in the coming years in order to survive.
Moving where though? Most families need decent schools and reasonable work commutes - not everyone can work remotely. Retirees need safe neighborhoods and good stores/medical facilities within reasonable distances. It limits geographical freedom/choices.
 
Moving where though? Most families need decent schools and reasonable work commutes - not everyone can work remotely. Retirees need safe neighborhoods and good stores/medical facilities within reasonable distances. It limits geographical freedom/choices.
And it's getting harder and harder for them to find these reasonable choices, while the gap is widening.
 
Why do they have massive surface parking lots next to Richmond, El Cerrito Del Norte, North Berkley, Bay Fair, Hayward, South Hayward, Union City, Fremont, Warm Springs, Berryessa, etc...??? That makes no sense. Complete waste of space. Should be 20 story high rise apartments on every single one of those parking lots.
I know because raising your family in a 20 story high apartment building next to public transportation...sounds amazing. Right?
 
Yes, I can see that would be true if a station was put into a high-crime residential area without the area around it being flattened and rebuilt.

I'm sure there are some I'm not at all familiar with, and I know nothing about California systems these days, my friends there all having relocated out of state. However, the projects I've been following in recent years seem to all be going the same way. The stations are not being built in existing residential areas at all. What seems more the norm is the scorched-earth option using old freight rights of way. In that scenario the system construction contractor flattens several blocks, and new streetscapes and housing are put in along with the station and tracks. Usually the developers learn the planned route long before it is announced and start buying up lots of surrounding land, so that they are in position to get buildings in at rock-bottom cost. In every case I've encountered, the developer made a killing on the new buildings near the stations, lots of small businesses moved in to support new residents, but within about 5 years the area would stagnate and become known for being a place young people live for a few years then just move on. Not high crime, not a food desert, just blah small box apartments and too busy with traffic.
Oh, I didn't realize we were also talking about California High Speed Rail. The more you know about the details for that project the worse the project appears to be. Voters were promised a straight shot, Los Angeles to San Francisco, with eventual extension to San Diego and Sacramento, total SF to LA cost $33 Billion. What we are getting is Bakersfield to Merced, with 3 intermediate stops. All of those stops are as you described above. The CAHSR will only reach top speed between Bakersfield and Tulare - a distance of 63 miles. If it ever completes the segment between Los Angeles and Anaheim (both stations are already complete-ish), it will have an average speed of only 45 mph for that stretch. Station work for the initial operating segment is not even scheduled to begin until 2028 - no tracks, no trains until years after that. Good news! It's all under budget. Oh, no, wait a minute - check that, it's on target to be OVER budget >$100 BILLION - assuming it ever gets built.

Another fun game with this project - the contractor for the initial segment knew for a fact that the right of ways, easements and permitting was not done. What did he do? He immediately mobilized every piece of equipment he could, then filed millions in claims because his work was being delayed. He was not wrong, and he did get paid.

Did I mention the CAHSR is being built on an EXISTING AMTRAK route? That's right - you can already take a train on the very same route. The big, signature structures they have already built are largely grade separations to go over and around this existing rail line.
 
Did I mention the CAHSR is being built on an EXISTING AMTRAK route? That's right - you can already take a train on the very same route. The big, signature structures they have already built are largely grade separations to go over and around this existing rail line.

so does that mean it will be subjected to the same railroad right of way and easement issues amtrak has? i did amtrak twice in california (routes originated in southern california that went up the entire west coast) and the trains were NEVER timely in large part b/c the transport trains have first right/right of way such that it routinely caused upwards of hours of delays. i can't imagine relying on a transportation system that would be so constricted.
 
so does that mean it will be subjected to the same railroad right of way and easement issues amtrak has? i did amtrak twice in california (routes originated in southern california that went up the entire west coast) and the trains were NEVER timely in large part b/c the transport trains have first right/right of way such that it routinely caused upwards of hours of delays. i can't imagine relying on a transportation system that would be so constricted.
No, it will be it's own rail line - but they could have done that routing it up the 5 corridor instead of the much more populated 99 corridor - that already has a rail line. The route was chosen so that CAHSR could get support from the representatives of those communities. But that created its own problem - they still need to accommodate the heavy rail - so they had to build the grade separations. Permitting, ROW acquisition, and lawsuits also resulted - and, if the train stops at those intermediate stations (it won't always which is how they are calling it "high speed rail", but then how does that benefit the communities it was routed to serve?), it won't be anywhere near the design speed. Not only that, but you can find videos on YouTube - the stations they are proposing are exactly as NotUrsula described.
 
I know because raising your family in a 20 story high apartment building next to public transportation...sounds amazing. Right?
You are correct that it isn't as nice as living in a 5,000 sq. mansion overlooking the Pacific in San Francsico. Still if you are working in the east bay living in an apartment building next to a rail station is far superior than having to commute from Merced even if that allows you to live in a single family house.
 
You are correct that it isn't as nice as living in a 5,000 sq. mansion overlooking the Pacific in San Francsico. Still if you are working in the east bay living in an apartment building next to a rail station is far superior than having to commute from Merced even if that allows you to live in a single family house.

i was one who commuted by car a long distance in the bay area so i could afford a single family house with decent schools for the kids. a good day with no accidents on the freeway was about 80 minutes one way but that paled in comparison to my co-workers whose commute was close to 100 miles in each direction (and they had to pray for no accidents through multiple commute corridors). they nor i would never have traded the safety and security we felt living 'in the burbs' for the convenience of a shorter commute.
 
i was one who commuted by car a long distance in the bay area so i could afford a single family house with decent schools for the kids. a good day with no accidents on the freeway was about 80 minutes one way but that paled in comparison to my co-workers whose commute was close to 100 miles in each direction (and they had to pray for no accidents through multiple commute corridors). they nor i would never have traded the safety and security we felt living 'in the burbs' for the convenience of a shorter commute.
Isn't a long commute sacrificing safety? Driving is the most dangerous thing you do on a daily basis.
 
Isn't a long commute sacrificing safety? Driving is the most dangerous thing you do on a daily basis.

true but constant worry over their kid's safety and wellbeing was a big factor in most people's decisions. we were already dealing with horrible situations at work such that we were UBER aware of the school/drug/gang violence so we mentaly justified the long distance driving risk (and we were reinforced in our beliefs on at least 5 occasions i can think of right off the top of my head when one of our close co-workers who lived closer to work lost either a child or sibling to drive by shootings).
 
true but constant worry over their kid's safety and wellbeing was a big factor in most people's decisions. we were already dealing with horrible situations at work such that we were UBER aware of the school/drug/gang violence so we mentaly justified the long distance driving risk (and we were reinforced in our beliefs on at least 5 occasions i can think of right off the top of my head when one of our close co-workers who lived closer to work lost either a child or sibling to drive by shootings).
Agreed but that is why you would want to live in Berkeley rather than a far distant suburb that is far more dangerous.

Just like the schools in Seattle are far safer than those in the suburbs. The violent crime rate is far less too.
 
Oh, I didn't realize we were also talking about California High Speed Rail. The more you know about the details for that project the worse the project appears to be. Voters were promised a straight shot, Los Angeles to San Francisco, with eventual extension to San Diego and Sacramento, total SF to LA cost $33 Billion. What we are getting is Bakersfield to Merced, with 3 intermediate stops. All of those stops are as you described above. The CAHSR will only reach top speed between Bakersfield and Tulare - a distance of 63 miles. If it ever completes the segment between Los Angeles and Anaheim (both stations are already complete-ish), it will have an average speed of only 45 mph for that stretch. Station work for the initial operating segment is not even scheduled to begin until 2028 - no tracks, no trains until years after that. Good news! It's all under budget. Oh, no, wait a minute - check that, it's on target to be OVER budget >$100 BILLION - assuming it ever gets built.

Another fun game with this project - the contractor for the initial segment knew for a fact that the right of ways, easements and permitting was not done. What did he do? He immediately mobilized every piece of equipment he could, then filed millions in claims because his work was being delayed. He was not wrong, and he did get paid.

Did I mention the CAHSR is being built on an EXISTING AMTRAK route? That's right - you can already take a train on the very same route. The big, signature structures they have already built are largely grade separations to go over and around this existing rail line.
I am amazed at how it seems so many think building a train track is such a difficult task. You look at all the amazing roads in California and now we can't build a train track. When we talk of the cost, it is not like it is in one year, spread over 20-30. What is real expensive is the freeway widening projects, no one seems to complain about those. Billions for a couple of miles of lanes. Really hope the Vegas track gets built just to show it can be done. California is not out of land, we have plenty, what we don't have is land you can build houses on with access to jobs.
 
I am amazed at how it seems so many think building a train track is such a difficult task. You look at all the amazing roads in California and now we can't build a train track. When we talk of the cost, it is not like it is in one year, spread over 20-30. What is real expensive is the freeway widening projects, no one seems to complain about those. Billions for a couple of miles of lanes. Really hope the Vegas track gets built just to show it can be done. California is not out of land, we have plenty, what we don't have is land you can build houses on with access to jobs.
We recently took the high-speed Barcelona-Madrid train both ways. The 385-mile trip would take 6-1/2 hours to drive, and the train took less than 2-1/2 hours. And cost us $19 per person each way. There are four different companies/trains that do that route, dozens of times a day. And there are always lots of people on them. Americans just don't demand rail travel, and don't like public transportation or to walk anywhere.
 





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