DVC plans to target commercial renters

[Tatebeck]

You mentioned renting your points and then buying a confirmed reservation or renting points from another resort.

I wonder if swapping reservations is allowed by DVC? Like a VGF owner books a reservation for a Poly owner, and vice versa, like a trade. I'm assuming not allowed or DVC rental store would offer it.

They basically do offer it via their rental swap program I believe. You rent out points, then take that $$$ amount and they book something else for you (universal, cruises, ABD, etc.) as your travel agent. I imagine they would let you use it back in their own rental store as well. Like if you have restricted resale points at Riviera but want to stay somewhere else one year.

 

[eticketplease]

Which is why I said earlier in the thread that it would be very unlikely that Disney could strongly consider anything as commercial use unless the member is renting probably well over 50% of their points (at approximately double the dues or $20 ish) or a slightly smaller number (maybe 1/3 or so) if they are maximizing spec rental potential at around 3x ($30 ish) or more of the cost of dues on a regular basis. At that point they could/would be making more than the entire annualized cost of their contract(s), (both the annualized portion of their upfront cost plus their yearly cost of dues), and generating actual "profit"

How would Disney know how much it is being rented for? David’s & the board sponsor has different tiers and owners that rent here have varying rates. The amount of points to book the room is one thing but the actual amount that is charged I’m not sure how easy that would be for Disney to figure out.

 

[Tatebeck]

How would Disney know how much it is being rented for? David’s & the board sponsor has different tiers and owners that rent here have varying rates. The amount of points to book the room is one thing but the actual amount that is charged I’m not sure how easy that would be for Disney to figure out.

It would be very hard to know exactly. They would likely use an average rental price or price range, and they would be able to see how many points the owners' name(s) weren't on during a year to get a fairly accurate figure though.

 

[Sandisw]

I have seen definitions of "commercial enterprise" that do not include a reference to profit, but simply reference engaging in "commerce" i.e. the buying and selling of goods. If Red Lobster fails to make a profit, is it not still a commercial enterprise?

ETA: I would also argue that if 2 entities engage in trade and "break even", they have still engaged in commerce.

That is true…and I am sure that DVC isn’t going to dig that deep.

When they define for enforcement the threshold as to what makes a membership one that has a pattern of rental activity that rises to the level of a commercial enterprise or practice, they could decide to “ignore” certain memberships because they don’t see it as making a profit and thus, they determine that membership is not in violation of the contract.

That’s not to say that they can’t turn around and in a different situation ignore whether there is true profit.

For example, they may not care if someone is renting half their points if they own 500 because they don’t believe profit is there to make it a commercial enterprise.

But, the owner who has 4000 and is renting 2000 every year may be treated much differently because having that many points and renting half is definitely going to look different financially.

 

[eticketplease]

For example, they may not care if someone is renting half their points if they own 500 because they don’t believe profit is there to make it a commercial enterprise.

But, the owner who has 4000 and is renting 2000 every year may be treated much differently because having that many points and renting half is definitely going to look different financially.

Great Explanation!!

 

[tx911]

They basically do offer it via their rental swap program I believe. You rent out points, then take that $$$ amount and they book something else for you (universal, cruises, ABD, etc.) as your travel agent. I imagine they would let you use it back in their own rental store as well. Like if you have restricted resale points at Riviera but want to stay somewhere else one year.

I meant a bit less formally.

As in, hey Tate, book me a villa at BWV for such and such week, and I'll book you a villa at VGF

 

[Sandisw]

I meant a bit less formally.

As in, hey Tate, book me a villa at BWV for such and such week, and I'll book you a villa at VGF

Nothing prevents that because it really is simply each owner doing a rental for someone else who just happens to be another owner.

The DIS used to allow people to try and do this but it didn’t really work well and so it was stopped.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

Not if bots are used, which someone here thinks.

Bots would just take the room anyway.

As a total non computer guy….
Is that why sometimes I get those squiggly letters to input when I try to do something on a website?

If so, can that be done???

Obviously I’m not very computer literate.

 

[Cyberc1978]

As a total non computer guy….
Is that why sometimes I get those squiggly letters to input when I try to do something on a website?

If so, can that be done???

Obviously I’m not very computer literate.

Yes those website tries to ensure you are a human and not a bot.

I think it could be an option.

 

[HyperspaceMountainPilot]

Yes those website tries to ensure you are a human and not a bot.

I think it could be an option.

I’m in favor of anything that makes it harder for computer scripts to beat actual DVC owners, but I would not be surprised if the more sophisticated LLMs could successfully identify grids with bicycles or crosswalks better/faster than I can at this point.

 

[Sandisw]

I’m in favor of anything that makes it harder for computer scripts to beat actual DVC owners, but I would not be surprised if the more sophisticated LLMs could successfully identify grids with bicycles or crosswalks better/faster than I can at this point.

Me too!!! And don’t you hate when you think you got them all and it gives you another!!!!

People have said that there are ways around these too.

If someone is intent on using I am not sure there is anyway to 100% stop it.

But, I wonder if there is some script that can be written after the fact that could tell if a bot was used during the booking process?

If so, it should allow DVC the ability you cancel it since TWDC has something already published that prohibits those when accessing content.

 

[eticketplease]

I’m in favor of anything that makes it harder for computer scripts to beat actual DVC owners, but I would not be surprised if the more sophisticated LLMs could successfully identify grids with bicycles or crosswalks better/faster than I can at this point.

Me too!!! And don’t you hate when you think you got them all and it gives you another!!!!

Yes I hate them!! Especially with pictures of one motorcycle am I supposed to click the picture where the person is on it or the street as it has a sliver of a motorcycle? It seems as sometimes you have to click all the squares and other times only two. It drives me crazy lol

 

[xdan0920]

I am going to bow out of this argument for a while. Can’t keep banging my head against the wall of renters.

I will say though, if you rent every year, if you rent a good portion of your points, I’d start to make some exit plans.

 

[Chuck S]

Uh oh...

 

[eticketplease]

Uh oh...

View attachment 926261

Now that I can deal with to stop bots

 

[eticketplease]

I am going to bow out of this argument for a while.

It’s been so long I can’t remember what act we will be starting next after intermission.

 

[lowlight]

It’s been so long I can’t remember what act we will be starting next after intermission.

After intermission, we start over from the beginning. There is no end, and no way out.

 

[Judique]

I’m in favor of anything that makes it harder for computer scripts to beat actual DVC owners, but I would not be surprised if the more sophisticated LLMs could successfully identify grids with bicycles or crosswalks better/faster than I can at this point.

Anything is possible but the same way they learn to bridge any protocols, the tech giants can as they have in the past make another obstacle. Perhaps Disney is already on this, or not.

Technology is always a moving target. I don't even pretend to know anything past reading, posting, emailing and doing normal internet lay person business, but I know that we are not at the same level as when I started reading and posting back in the 90ties on 'other' disney boards before I joined Disboards.

 

[Genie+]

When it comes to offsetting costs - Is that in regard to unused points or vacation accommodations?

Is there a difference between reliably turning points into money every year vs selling off points on the occasions you don’t/can’t use them?

If DVC is like Tupperware maybe they should say so Sell some DVC points to pay for your own!

 

[tx911]

After intermission, we start over from the beginning. There is no end, and no way out.

It's so much like political discussions, right?
No one's minds are ever changed, it's just a huge circular discussion.