# Jim Lewis Fired from WDWCo



## Graydon

In an amazing move by WDCO Corporate, Jim Lewis, as of today, is no longer employed at WDWCo.  Finally, people can breathe.  Am sure those cast members and us Members can look forward to better days...


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## WilsonFlyer

That's pretty big news, if it's true. Source? First post? Sorry, but you gotta belly up to the bar and show some proof.


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## OrangeCountyCommuter

TROLL ALERT!

(And the devil you know could easily be better then the devil you don't... )


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## sweetdana

Assuming it is true, could you imagine the severance?  I bet it is more than most of us make in a yr.


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## WilsonFlyer

sweetdana said:


> Assuming it is true, could you imagine the severance?  I bet it is more than most of us make in a yr.



IN A YEAR??? Ya reckon?!?!?!


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## Mickey'sApprentice

Believe it or not though...Disney could get rid of Jim Lewis because he's not enough of a stingy bean counter.

Be careful for what you ask for.

I would really like for Disney and DVC to hire someone with a bit more operations and attention to care for the membership.

I cannot figure out why Disney does not see how important word of mouth is to the DVC business. This is a big purchase, and you can find anything you want on the internet. Social media only magnifies that.


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## Sammie

Surely if this was true we would have heard of it from other venues. 

I have heard nothing.


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## nyisles84

.


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## DisDad07

I can't find a thing on this statement,on any web site. We quess will just put it aside untill Graydon can come up with a news clip.


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## disneynutz

If Lewis was fired, you would think that Iger would know about it. I just called Bob and he doesn't know anything about it. He did say that Disney is a big company and often he is the last to be notified. 

 Bill


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## logan115

I am guessing the source has to be a bus driver.......

Chris


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## MdmMim

It is posted on another website, too.  But on that site, it is a longtime poster.


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## supersuperwendy

Is this another April Fool's Day joke?  I fell for the lifetime refillable mug joke a few months ago lol


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## supersuperwendy

http://www.intercot.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=184698

news per intercot member's source?


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## EeyoreEma

supersuperwendy said:


> Is this another April Fool's Day joke?  I fell for the lifetime refillable mug joke a few months ago lol



Glad I wasn't the only one!


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## disneynutz

Maybe he got a job working for Steve Harvey?

 Bill


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## anniet

I will confirm it. I'm a VWL owner since 2002 and  I was cast from May 1, 2010 up until three weeks ago as a DVC ASA and my friends - the wonderful talented "Disney" people I left behind are celebrating right now.

I got about 10 texts around 5:00pm with the news.

Trust me, top executives know that Jim Lewis was nothing but a Bean Counter - (it was brought to their attention numerous times) and that DVC was headed down the wrong path.  It won't happen over night but I would look for some good things to come.


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## supersuperwendy

what did your friends say?  any details of how it went down or why?


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## rentayenta

I predict he'll be working with Elvis in Small Town, USA at a local Burger King.


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## arthur06

I think that I better get my resume updated...


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## disneynutz

anniet said:


> I will confirm it. I'm a VWL owner since 2002 and  I was cast from May 1, 2010 up until three weeks ago as a DVC ASA and my friends - the wonderful talented "Disney" people I left behind are celebrating right now.
> 
> I got about 10 texts around 5:00pm with the news.
> 
> Trust me, top executives know that Jim Lewis was nothing but a Bean Counter - (it was brought to their attention numerous times) and that DVC was headed down the wrong path.  It won't happen over night but I would look for some good things to come.



Disney loves Bean Counters so there must be more to it.

 Bill


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## anniet

supersuperwendy said:


> what did your friends say?  any details of how it went down or why?



Every text was the same "Jim Lewis is gone".  No more details but I don't need them.  We all knew why.

I am just thrilled and grateful that Disney paid attention the pleas of many many many people who kept telling them that DVC was losing the magic.


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## supersuperwendy

Will we get the old logo back????? I hope so!!!


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## anniet

disneynutz said:


> Disney loves Bean Counters so there must be more to it.
> 
> Bill



Yeah, like I said, they were headed down the wrong path and someone recognized it was the wrong way to go.

Just mho (although others here may have witnessed it too) Disney was losing it's distinction in the "timeshare" marketplace.


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## ToddyLu

Maybe they will actually put useful information in Disney Files, now.    My scrapbook clipping file is getting full from the useful info in that publication.  

Dh thinks we paid for Lewis' golden parachute.....


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## ToddyLu

supersuperwendy said:


> Will we get the old logo back????? I hope so!!!



But you will have to change your ticker...


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## Deb & Bill

Maybe he had an offer he couldn't refuse from Kraft....... selling Kool-Aid.


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## ToddyLu

Deb & Bill said:


> Maybe he had an offer he couldn't refuse from Kraft....... selling Kool-Aid.


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## Sammie

Maybe he did not like having a boss to answer to, considering for years he has run unchecked. 

Honestly at this point I don't know.


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## OrangeCountyCommuter

anniet said:


> I will confirm it. I'm a VWL owner since 2002 and  I was cast from May 1, 2010 up until three weeks ago as a DVC ASA and my friends - the wonderful talented "Disney" people I left behind are celebrating right now.
> 
> I got about 10 texts around 5:00pm with the news.
> 
> Trust me, top executives know that Jim Lewis was nothing but a Bean Counter - (it was brought to their attention numerous times) and that DVC was headed down the wrong path.  It won't happen over night but I would look for some good things to come.



.

Trust me I am a "bean counter" by profession... it can get MUCH MUCH worse.   DVC and Disney have lots of opportunties to cut back and make both the employees and the members whine..... I can sit here and make a list of things I would do if "finances" were the motivating factor.... and all of them would have people like this   and thinking "gee things were not so bad"    

(And if posters on here think  "we are going to be happy now"   DVC members were "unloved in thier own minds" before Mr. Lewis and will be after.  Unless Disney suddenely starts giving "free dining" or "pays us to visit" I don't see a giant outcry of love on here)


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## Sammie

OrangeCountyCommuter said:


> .
> 
> Trust me I am a "bean counter" by profession... it can get MUCH MUCH worse.   DVC and Disney have lots of opportunties to cut back and make both the employees and the members whine..... I can sit here and make a list of things I would do if "finances" were the motivating factor.... and all of them would have people like this   and thinking "gee things were not so bad"
> 
> (And if posters on here think  "we are going to be happy now"   DVC members were "unloved in thier own minds" before Mr. Lewis and will be after.  Unless Disney suddenely starts giving "free dining" or "pays us to visit" I don't see a giant outcry of love on here)



For many long time members such as myself it is not about free dining or any perks. 

It was about things like Disney Files, Dee Vee Cee, changes such as the change to banking with the explanation that basically we were too stupid to do it the other way. It was about being treated with respect and listening to valued members instead of being talked down to or even lied to. 

I could care less about perks, nice but not what I bought. I bought a timeshare that I expect to be clean and in working order when I check in. Lately that has not been the case.


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## DVCconvert

Deb & Bill said:


> Maybe he had an offer he couldn't refuse from Kraft....... selling Kool-Aid.



I'm 100% SURE that's is NOT TRUE!

Kraft, knowing that they no longer had you as a prospective customer, would NEVER agree to the deal!!!


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## Deb & Bill

Sammie said:


> For many long time members such as myself it is not about free dining or any perks.
> 
> It was about things like Disney Files, Dee Vee Cee, changes such as the change to banking with the explanation that basically we were too stupid to do it the other way. It was about being treated with respect and listening to valued members instead of being talked down to or even lied to.
> 
> I could care less about perks, nice but not what I bought. I bought a timeshare that I expect to be clean and in working when I check in. Lately that has not been the case.



Exactly.  And communication.  Something we haven't gotten much of as members.  

Take the rules, enforce them, keep the properties clean and maintained and I'd be happy. I don't need any perks, even the AP discount. I can buy a few days ticket, enjoy the resort and be happy.  Just make sure the toilet works, I get sheets that fit the bed, towels that aren't stained, cabinet doors that work.


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## Sammie

Deb & Bill said:


> Exactly.  And communication.  Something we haven't gotten much of as members.
> 
> Take the rules, enforce them, keep the properties clean and maintained and I'd be happy. I don't need any perks, even the AP discount. I can buy a few days ticket, enjoy the resort and be happy.  Just make sure the toilet works, I get sheets that fit the bed, towels that aren't stained, cabinet doors that work.



And if they are going to expand, build a quality product that at two years old, does not look like it's five.


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## fall08CP

I know several guides and ASAs... this rumor is 100% true. 

Currently learning the details, but nothing I can share. But it's definitely true.


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## Sammie

fall08CP said:


> I know several guides and ASAs... this rumor is 100% true.
> 
> Currently learning the details, but nothing I can share. But it's definitely true.



What is an ASA? Thanks


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## Terry S

Advance Sales Associate.  They are the people in the DVC Kisosks and desks at resorts.


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## SusieBea




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## Sammie

Terry S said:


> Advance Sales Associate.  They are the people in the DVC Kisosks and desks at resorts.



Thanks Terry.


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## jrbdad

Where do I send my resume?


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## Sammie

jrbdad said:


> Where do I send my resume?



Karl Holz.


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## jrbdad

Sammie said:


> Karl Holz.



That works too.


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## hbehrman

Sammie said:


> For many long time members such as myself it is not about free dining or any perks.
> 
> It was about things like Disney Files, Dee Vee Cee, changes such as the change to banking with the explanation that basically we were too stupid to do it the other way. It was about being treated with respect and listening to valued members instead of being talked down to or even lied to.
> 
> I could care less about perks, nice but not what I bought. I bought a timeshare that I expect to be clean and in working when I check in. Lately that has not been the case.



And maybe they will lose the resale market rule on ownership (does not effect me by the way). My speculation is that that was the final straw. And we are about a business quarter since that occurred so the timing would be about right for a management change


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## TLSnell1981

Hmmm...can't wait for details.


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## Sammie

Ok I have been told true, but staff has been told not to discuss details.

Where is TJ with the insiders report?


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## jrbdad

Sammie said:


> Ok I have been told true, but staff has been told not to discuss details.
> 
> Where is TJ with the insiders report?



Oh come on -- we won't tell anyone


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## disneynutz

Sammie said:


> Ok I have been told true, but staff has been told not to discuss details.
> 
> Where is TJ with the insiders report?



Anything to do with the Aulani screw up?

 Bill


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## CarolAnnC

I think we will be having a very interesting DVC Member Cruise next month..


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## TLSnell1981

Lol..Wiki has already updated..


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## Sammie

Honestly I know no more than any of you. Basically those that would know are not talking which usually almost always means it is true.

If it is not true, they are always very forth coming in saying that it is rumor.


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## Sammie

disneynutz said:


> Anything to do with the Aulani screw up?
> 
> Bill



What happened at Aulani?


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## iluvdisney

I tend to agree with you Carol!


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## twinboysmom

TLSnell1981 said:


> Lol..Wiki has already updated..



They sure have.  That was quick.  I am interested to see what happens now.  I hope things improve for the better.  I know it can get worse but I am going to remain hopeful that this is a positive change.  To the poster that called the OP a troll, perhaps an apology is in order?


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## tjkraz

Timing sure fits.  Bury the news late on a Friday.  Hmmmmm.


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## disneynutz

Sammie said:


> What happened at Aulani?



Due to unknown reasons Disney has halted sales and a couple of DISers who thought that they bought Aulani received closing Docs for AKV.

 Bill


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## tjkraz

Sammie said:


> What happened at Aulani?



Aulani sales have been on hold for about a month due to some unspecified legal issue.  Only thing DVC would say about that is documents are being revised.  

One report suggests that the proverbial "other shoe" dropped in the midst of promotional events in Pasadena to promote Aulani.  They had 4 nights of presentations lined up.  According to one person, all was well and good the first night but by night #2 there was no word of Aulani and CMs were told not to discuss any Aulani sales topics with attendees.


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## ToddyLu




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## dwelty

While certainly not unique to Disney, they seem to let people go at the end of the day on Friday.  It's less disruptive to staff members.  If this is indeed true, it makes sense to do it on a Friday.


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## Wenny

My guess is someone at that level would have known ahead of time - they just chose to let it leak on Friday after 5:00.


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## kdzgon

tjkraz said:


> Aulani sales have been on hold for about a month due to some unspecified legal issue.  Only thing DVC would say about that is documents are being revised.
> 
> One report suggests that the proverbial "other shoe" dropped in the midst of promotional events in Pasadena to promote Aulani.  They had 4 nights of presentations lined up.  According to one person, all was well and good the first night but by night #2 there was no word of Aulani and CMs were told not to discuss any Aulani sales topics with attendees.



It's my understanding that there was an issue with the [RE sales] registration paperwork in Hawaii. It was discovered something was done wrong, and they (Disney) were not actually licensed to sell Aulani and needed to correct the legal filings. As a result, they could not do so much as even publicly acknowledge it _existed_ never mind solicit sales.

Promotional events were scheduled in Orlando as well, for the explicit purpose of pushing Aulani. Invites had been sent and loads of responses received; all requirements were in place, except for that one little piece.....


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## CarolAnnC

iluvdisney said:


> I tend to agree with you Carol!



hehehehe


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## tink1969

supersuperwendy said:


> Is this another April Fool's Day joke?  I fell for the lifetime refillable mug joke a few months ago lol



Me too!


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## tjkraz

kdzgon said:


> It's my understanding that there was an issue with the [RE sales] registration paperwork in Hawaii. It was discovered something was done wrong, and they (Disney) were not actually licensed to sell Aulani and needed to correct the legal filings. As a result, they could not do so much as even publicly acknowledge it _existed_ never mind solicit sales.
> 
> Promotional events were scheduled in Orlando as well, for the explicit purpose of pushing Aulani. Invites had been sent and loads of responses received; all requirements were in place, except for that one little piece.....



That fits other things I've heard.  Assuming our stories are accurate, this is not only extremely embarrassing for Disney but also very costly.    

I know a lot of folks here are disappointed with things DVC has done in recent years.  Not trying to trivialize that but it isn't really fair to use the DIS as a barometer for overall member satisfaction.  But when you combine an (apparently) enormous legal snafu with a few other issues (BLT furnishings & Studio sinks come immediately to mind; OKW extension) I can see how a change may be warranted.  Particularly with Karl Holz just now assuming oversight of DVC.


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## disneynutz

dwelty said:


> While certainly not unique to Disney, they seem to let people go at the end of the day on Friday.  It's less disruptive to staff members.  If this is indeed true, it makes sense to do it on a Friday.



And depending on the announcement, has less of an effect on the stock value and the media picking up on the story.

 Bill


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## DonnaL

Got to agree with above posters....


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## Graydon

My original post is true - no Pinnochio here.  

 He was a ruthless selfish man that made everyone's life miserable.   As a founding and 17+ year DVC cast member I got the call late afternoon.  Ex DVCers were smiling and dancing on cars from Long Island to Chicagoland to DLR and those on the Cruise Ships.

It appears its tied to Aluani's screwup in selling when they shouldn't have - something I hear he knew all about.  Couple that with internal investigations by Corp HR on Cast Member related issues and purposefully not allowing Members to book vacations on the Dream to minimize expenses out to DCL - he's a piece of work that had to go. I don't think I recall having to work with such a manipulative, ego-centric person in all my years there.  

My sources are real and factual.  Praise the lord change is in the air...  Karma kinda stinks doesn't it?


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## nunzia

Graydon said:


> My original post is true - no Pinnochio here.
> 
> He was a ruthless selfish man that made everyone's life miserable.   As a founding and 17+ year DVC cast member I got the call late afternoon.  Ex DVCers were smiling and dancing on cars from Long Island to Chicagoland to DLR and those on the Cruise Ships.
> 
> It appears its tied to Aluani's screwup in selling when they should have - something I hear he knew.  Couple that with internal investigations by Corp HR on Cast Member related issues and purposefully not allowing Members to book vacations on the Dream to minimize expenses out to DCL - he's a piece of work.
> 
> My sources are real and factual.  Praise the lord...



sooo...this is good then??


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## Sammie

It was not just members that were dissatisfied too, it was employees. That many long time agents retired early due to recent policy.


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## CarolAnnC

Graydon said:


> My original post is true - no Pinnochio here.
> 
> He was a ruthless selfish man that made everyone's life miserable.   As a founding and 17+ year DVC cast member I got the call late afternoon.  Ex DVCers were smiling and dancing on cars from Long Island to Chicagoland to DLR and those on the Cruise Ships.
> 
> It appears its tied to Aluani's screwup in selling when they shouldn't have - something I hear he knew all about.  Couple that with internal investigations by Corp HR on Cast Member related issues *and purposefully not allowing Members to book vacations on the Dream to minimize expenses out to DCL* - he's a piece of work that had to go. I don't think I recall having to work with such a manipulative, ego-centric person in all my years there.
> 
> My sources are real and factual.  Praise the lord change is in the air...  Karma kinda stinks doesn't it?



Not just the Dream, but the Wonder and Magic too...... _disclaimer, not that I am agreeing with everything quoted here, just clarifying the cruise booking fiasco part..._


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## Sammie

Graydon said:


> My original post is true - no Pinnochio here.
> 
> He was a ruthless selfish man that made everyone's life miserable.   As a founding and 17+ year DVC cast member I got the call late afternoon.  Ex DVCers were smiling and dancing on cars from Long Island to Chicagoland to DLR and those on the Cruise Ships.
> 
> It appears its tied to Aluani's screwup in selling when they shouldn't have - something I hear he knew all about.  Couple that with internal investigations by Corp HR on Cast Member related issues and purposefully not allowing Members to book vacations on the Dream to minimize expenses out to DCL - he's a piece of work that had to go. I don't think I recall having to work with such a manipulative, ego-centric person in all my years there.
> 
> My sources are real and factual.  Praise the lord change is in the air...  Karma kinda stinks doesn't it?



Graydon, my apologies for my very first post, thinking you might be a troll. But usually when an unknown comes on with a HUGE story, it usually is.

I have verified your account with many long time Disney employees and yes your news is fact on. 

Thanks for being the first to share. 

I don't know if you lurk here but the regulars know very well my feelings on Jim for quite some time now.


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## dianeschlicht

I just copied this from Wikipedia:



> Career with the Walt Disney Company
> 
> Lewis began his Disney Career in 1996 as the Director of Planning and Finance for Walt Disney Attractions. He later progressed to become Senior Vice President, Business Development and Public Affairs for the Walt Disney World Resort. Jim became the General Manager of the Disney Vacation Club (DVC) in November 2003;[1] he was promoted to the position of President in 2006,[2][3] making him one of the most senior African-Americans in the Disney Company.[4]
> During his tenure as President of the Disney Vacation Club, Lewis' division has expanded rapidly. When he took over, DVC had approximately 70,000 members in 2003; there were over 300,000 in 2006. The LA Times reported that the Disney Vacation Club's sales and profits more than doubled from 2003 to 2007.[5] Lewis has overseen the expansion of his division to California with the addition of time-share rooms at Disney's Grand Californian Hotel & Spa and to Hawaii with the forthcoming Aulani Resort.[6] The Disney Vacation Club has also opened a sales and preview center at the Tokyo Disney Resort.[7]
> Lewis was terminiated from Disney on August 12th, 2011.


Under "employment" it says, "unemployed".


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## CarolAnnC

Though Wiki is not foolproof evidence, lol, I have gone with my gut feeling that the postings on this event are probably factual.  Hopefully, some type of press release will be forthcoming..


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## Cyndibear

Wow!!!  Very interesting!!!

Cyndi


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## Sammie

While I had no idea this was coming down the pipe, the fact that Al Weiss suddenly without any warning up and retired and then Karl Holz was made JL's boss, I had a feeling somethinig was not right in DVCland. 

It will be very interesting to watch.


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## disneynutz

Two years ago at the Association meeting he promised that he would contact me about some questions that I had. Guess I can stop waiting for the call.

 Bill


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## arthur06

disneynutz said:


> Two years ago at the Association meeting he promised that he would contact me about some questions that I had. Guess I can stop waiting for the call.
> 
> Bill



Not necessarily... he has plenty of free time now.


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## goofydad99

disneynutz said:


> Two years ago at the Association meeting he promised that he would contact me about some questions that I had. Guess I can stop waiting for the call.
> 
> Bill



I don't know.  It seems like he would have a lot more free time now.


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## Sammie

CarolAnnC said:


> I think we will be having a very interesting DVC Member Cruise next month..



I might actually go on one now.


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## CarolAnnC

Sammie said:


> I might actually go on one now.



The scalpers will be heading to Ebay!


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## restorethemagic

100% True.  Jim will land on his feet, he is a smart guy.  But DVC is so much better off without him.

Member, DVC Cast Member, Etc.


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## Sammie

CarolAnnC said:


> The scalpers will be heading to Ebay!



 scalping what I am confused.


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## CarolAnnC

Sammie said:


> scalping what I am confused.



Well, since people like you are now wanting to go on their first ever DVC Member Cruise (due to the excitement here lol), and the cruise sold out in one day 11 months prior leaving a large waitlist, some folks may see value in that and want to head to Ebay to sell their existing reservation to the highest bidder! J/K!!!!!

_this could not be done if one wanted to as you cannot change the lead name on the cruise reservation anyway.  It was just a joke, lol._


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## Maistre Gracey

Is this true??? I couldn't read the whole thread, as I had all I could do not to pee the couch when I saw the title!!!

Kick the bum out!! I never thought he was the right guy. In fact, he screwed up almost everything he touched. 

MG


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## Sammie

CarolAnnC said:


> Well, since people like you are now wanting to go on their first ever DVC Member Cruise (due to the excitement here lol), and the cruise sold out in one day 11 months prior leaving a large waitlist, some folks may see value in that and want to head to Ebay to sell their existing reservation to the highest bidder! J/K!!!!!
> 
> _this could not be done if one wanted to as you cannot change the lead name on the cruise reservation anyway.  It was just a joke, lol._



Oh  No, I meant next year. But I see your point


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## Sammie

Maistre Gracey said:


> Is this true??? I couldn't read the whole thread, as I had all I could do not to pee the couch when I saw the title!!!
> 
> Kick the bum out!! I never thought he was the right guy. In fact, he screwed up almost everything he touched.
> 
> MG



It seems so, maybe he took Dee Vee Cee with him. 

I honestly liked Jim at the beginning but it was like each year his head swelled with his self importance and he completely forgot how he got there.

It's official: 

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...ion-club-executive-ou20110813,0,6823618.story


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## DisneyBill

Gee, I hope this didn't happen just because I haven't been able to sign onto dvcmember.com for the last two days.


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## sissy_ib

Relativity new DVC member here. (about a year and a half)
While I do see the threads about people dissatisfied about different things, why do we not like this guy? I see he was a "stingy bean counter", is this why? Were things better for DVC members before he was in charge? 

(I understand the most common complaints such as upkeep, the furniture problems at BLT and this whole Hawaii mess. And of course the whole loss of perks thing many people are upset about. Are these the main points?)


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## BeccaG

According to my sources, who made me aware of the previous mentioned Aulani fiasco, Lewis had lost the respect of most of the guides for a "long list" of things he had done.  Apparently, there has been quite an exodus of guides becasue of this.  I am sure turn over is high in this industry as a general rule, but it appears that in recent months the "I got a new guide" posts have greatly increased.


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## Sammie

BeccaG said:


> According to my sources, who made me aware of the previous mentioned Aulani fiasco, Lewis had lost the respect of most of the guides for a "long list" of things he had done.  Apparently, there has been quite an exodus of guides becasue of this.  I am sure turn over is high in this industry as a general rule, but it appears that in recent months the "I got a new guide" posts have greatly increased.



Many guides that had been long timers left and we were all told early retirement. 

Also when the banking changes came about, his explanation to why, was DVC members were not smart enought to use the previous procedure, funny though before he came along we did just fine with it. 

He overode the product committee on BLT, went for cheap in room product. Comments such as, as long as it looks good they will buy it then their dues will fix it and laughed.


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## aan1701

Sammie said:


> It seems so, maybe he took Dee Vee Cee with him.



Oh god I hope so.


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## Sammie

aan1701 said:


> Oh god I hope so.



And Disney Files too.


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## BeccaG

Sammie said:


> Many guides that had been long timers left and we were all told early retirement.



Yup, I know a lot of folks who took early retirements becasue they could not stand their bosses... maybe not in this economy, but my guess is that the "magic" was gone for them too!


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## Longhairbear

I remember how furious we all got when they tried to put paper cups in the studios. That's when I first started to wonder if Lewis was the right guy for DVC. 
 I am reading some nasty comments he's made about we owners over the years.


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## TagsMissy

Sorry if this was posted already:

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-disney-vacatuion-club-executive-ou20110813,0,6823618.story


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## disneynutz

I really didn't care for him when he was elected Chairman of the American Resort Development Association then asked all of the DVC Members to donate money to the organization. Very not Disney like to me and many felt but could not prove that the DVC Membership paid for the donation requests to be printed and mailed to the members.

 Bill


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## MrsNick

Longhairbear said:


> I remember how furious we all got when they tried to put paper cups in the studios. That's when I first started to wonder if Lewis was the right guy for DVC.
> I am reading some nasty comments he's made about we owners over the years.



Where are you reading those? I'm curious to see his thoughts on the membership. Thanks.


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## WDWLVR

Those of us on both the 2005 and 2006 Member Cruises saw a major change in him.  In 2005 he always had a smile and would stop and talk with anyone and everyone.  In 2006 he was constantly surrounded by his people, tried to avoid guests at all costs and even lied outright to some saying there was no 2007 Member Cruise booked even though everyone knew there was (and it was announced a few weeks later but with a different booking only for those who hadn't sailed before).  I lost respect for him after that cruise.

Here's hoping DVC has a brighter future with whoever they get to replace him.


----------



## Longhairbear

MrsNick said:


> Where are you reading those? I'm curious to see his thoughts on the membership. Thanks.



WDWmagic, ***********, etc. 
Basically he has said "they are all fanatics, they'll buy anything", and laughed.


----------



## Longhairbear

disneynutz said:


> I really didn't care for him when he was elected Chairman of the American Resort Development Association then asked all of the DVC Members to donate money to the organization. Very not Disney like to me and many felt but could not prove that the DVC Membership paid for the donation requests to be printed and mailed to the members.
> 
> Bill



Thanks for the reminder of that incident, that was a total turn off for us.


----------



## TisBit

Graydon said:


> In an amazing move by WDCO Corporate, Jim Lewis, as of today, is no longer employed at WDWCo.  Finally, people can breathe.  Am sure those cast members and us Members can look forward to better days...



As others have said, this is not necessarily a good thing.  Be careful what you ask for, because you just might get it!

While DVC could always improve, it could also get much worse.  Hopefully we will get an improvement, but you never know....I will reserve judgement on this one.


----------



## beachclub

uh oh...Dont know yet if this is good or bad...He was a nice guy with a good head on his shoulders meanwhile perks cutting and cutting though

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...ion-club-executive-ou20110813,0,6823618.story

The president of Walt Disney Co.'s time-share business was fired Friday, according to several people familiar with the move.

A spokeswoman for Disney confirmed late Friday night that Disney Vacation Club President Jim Lewis was no longer with the company. She declined to discuss further details.

"We wish Jim Lewis well in his future endeavors and we plan to announce his successor in the near future," spokeswoman Rena Langley said.

Lewis had been president of Disney's time-share business since 2006.

The abrupt move comes only about two weeks before Disney opens one of its most ambitious time-share projects: Aulani, a Hawaiian resort with 460 Vacation Club units and 359 standard hotel rooms. It is the first major resort Disney has built away from its theme park properties.

It also comes one month after a management shakeup within Walt Disney Parks and Resorts. The changes included inserting the head of Disney's cruise business, Disney Cruise Line President Karl Holz, between Lewis and Walt Disney Parks and Resorts Chairman Tom Staggs.

Only a few years ago, Disney Vacation Club was one of the fastest growing units within Disney's $11 billion parks and resorts business. But time-share sales slumped during the global recession and credit crunch.

Disney Vacation Club operates 11 facilities around the United States and has more than 400,000 members. The business is headquartered in Celebration.


----------



## Longhairbear

TisBit said:


> As others have said, this is not necessarily a good thing.  Be careful what you ask for, because you just might get it!
> 
> While DVC could always improve, it could also get much worse.  Hopefully we will get an improvement, but you never know....I will reserve judgement on this one.



Very true, but all of we DVC members on here know the difference between quality and crap.(VGC vs BLT, and only from what I read on here. I've never been to BLT and can't say, but have stayed at VGC many times, and can't say enough about it.) It just might help if we all write to corporate and thank them for this latest quality upgrade in the form of getting rid of someone who scoffs at the consumer.


----------



## beachclub

disregard...didnt see the other post...sorry


----------



## ML_LovesDisney

OrangeCountyCommuter said:


> TROLL ALERT!
> 
> (And the devil you know could easily be better then the devil you don't... )



http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...ion-club-executive-ou20110813,0,6823618.story

Why does everyone assume it is a "troll"????? Sometimes people on these boards can be so rude.


----------



## anniet

TisBit said:


> As others have said, this is not necessarily a good thing.  Be careful what you ask for, because you just might get it!
> 
> While DVC could always improve, it could also get much worse.  Hopefully we will get an improvement, but you never know....I will reserve judgement on this one.



I doubt it will get worse.  It was pretty ugly on the inside and I've heard wonderful things about Karl Holz.  Also, not mentioned in the article, Al Weiss retired a few months back and from what I understand he covered Lewis's rear end for a long time.  I think Disney has finally awoken to the fact that DVC was losing it's distinction in the industry and I hope they work to replace it.


----------



## logan115

Sammie said:


> Graydon, my apologies for my very first post, thinking you might be a troll. But usually when an unknown comes on with a HUGE story, it usually is.
> 
> .



I'll echo what Sammie said, and thanks for the news Graydon.

Chris


----------



## Doug7856

John Frost at TheDisneyBlog.com has chimed in with a post about Lewis:

http://thedisneyblog.com/2011/08/13/disney-vacation-club-shakeup/


----------



## anniet

OrangeCountyCommuter said:


> .
> 
> Trust me I am a "bean counter" by profession... it can get MUCH MUCH worse.   DVC and Disney have lots of opportunties to cut back and make both the employees and the members whine..... I can sit here and make a list of things I would do if "finances" were the motivating factor.... and all of them would have people like this   and thinking "gee things were not so bad"
> 
> (And if posters on here think  "we are going to be happy now"   DVC members were "unloved in thier own minds" before Mr. Lewis and will be after.  Unless Disney suddenely starts giving "free dining" or "pays us to visit" I don't see a giant outcry of love on here)



They didn't get rid of him JUST for bean counting.  He made them a lot of money.  Read Graydon's second post.  He sums it up pretty well.


----------



## EWL




----------



## TheRustyScupper

1) The guy was a bad manager
. . . would not listen to employees
. . . would not hear issues form members
. . . would not accept improvement ideas
. . . would not admit errors
2) Definitely nice to have him gone.
3) However, I remember the saying when getting replacements
. . . better to have the devil you know
. . . than the devil you do not know


----------



## nunzia

Sammie said:


> *It seems so, maybe he took Dee Vee Cee with him. *I honestly liked Jim at the beginning but it was like each year his head swelled with his self importance and he completely forgot how he got there.
> 
> It's official:
> 
> http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...ion-club-executive-ou20110813,0,6823618.story



Please let it be so..


----------



## disneynutz

anniet said:


> They didn't get rid of him JUST for bean counting.  He made them a lot of money.



I would guess that Disney is making a political move in firing Lewis. First of all, very, very rarely does a company publicly state that they *fired* an executive. The only reason that I can think of is that Disney is trying to correct the Aulani issue with the State of Hawaii and if it's not corrected, it could cost DVD a billion dollars or more. Some reports state that Lewis was aware of the Aulani problem and he ordered sales to start anyway even though he was told by Hawaii not to.

Secondly, Karl Holtz may be flexing his muscle being Lewis's new boss and/or they had a major falling out. One thing you can be sure of is that the DVD/DVC will take on the same business attributes as the DCL and now Holtz can hand pick his new president.

I don't know that much about the DCL but maybe DVCers will at least get clean, well maintained resort rooms before 4PM with the new management. 

 Bill


----------



## Oglet

I just love how the OP was tried, judged and executed on the first page. I have not read the whole thread in its entirety however I believe there are some people on here who need to seriously offer an apology to the OP.


----------



## anniet

disneynutz said:


> I would guess that Disney is making a political move in firing Lewis. First of all, very, very rarely does a company publicly state that they *fired* an executive. The only reason that I can think of is that Disney is trying to correct the Aulani issue with the State of Hawaii and if it's not corrected, it could cost DVD a billion dollars or more. Some reports state that Lewis was aware of the Aulani problem and he ordered sales to start anyway even though he was told by Hawaii not to.
> 
> Secondly, Karl Holtz may be flexing his muscle being Lewis's new boss and/or they had a major falling out. One thing you can be sure of is that the DVD/DVC will take on the same business attributes as the DCL and now Holtz can hand pick his new president.
> 
> I don't know that much about the DCL but maybe DVCers will at least get clean, well maintained resort rooms before 4PM with the new management.
> 
> Bill



I think the risks associated with keeping Lewis were beginning to outweigh any amount of cash he could bring in.


----------



## jimmytammy

Many longtime DVCers, who bought in the early days, have expressed their displeasure in how DVC has been heading in the last few yrs.  I dont remember that much negativity pre Lewis days.  But since he has been there, things in units have declined.  By himself, no he couldnt fix those things, but he had the power to fix them by letting up on monies to do so.  Refurnishing of old units, OKW alone has gotten a bad rap from its owners, especially those longtime owners.  

Cheap...its the word that comes to mind for the dues we pay each year that is supposed to keep DVC at the top of the timeshare pile.  Cheap is what DVC has become.

I, like so many here, feel the same about change, it might get worse.  But in this case, IMO, change will be better.  

I wont share my source, but a ASA our family knows has pointed out that many DVC CMs have become disgruntled about recent hires at the ASA level that are the typical pushy timeshare folks, not typical DVC/Disney type personalities.  And it was causing lots of disgruntle among its "good" people.  To the point of quitting.  

So Lewis being gone, it will be a good thing.  It will take DVC awhile to get back on top.  I for one liked when we were at the top, I look forward to at least having that opportunity again.


----------



## tjkraz

Doug7856 said:


> John Frost at TheDisneyBlog.com has chimed in with a post about Lewis:
> 
> http://thedisneyblog.com/2011/08/13/disney-vacation-club-shakeup/



Sales numbers have nothing to do with it.  DVC isn't putting up pre-recession numbers, but neither is the rest of the industry.  DVC's sales volumes have been quite respectable, with prices (and profitability) reaching all-time highs.  



anniet said:


> I think the risks associated with keeping Lewis were beginning to outweigh any amount of cash he could bring in.



For the most part, yes.  File it under the heading of "I can't believe you were stupid enough to do that!"   

Stories vary a bit depending upon the source but at the very least, Lewis deserves blame for the Hawaii licensing being mishandled.  Some go further and claim that he knowingly flaunted the laws by selling when he knew they shouldn't.  

Many bosses are disliked by their employees so that alone wasn't likely to lead to his ouster.  But the state of those relationships didn't do anything to save him once more serious issues came to light.


----------



## anniet

tjkraz said:


> Many bosses are disliked by their employees so that alone wasn't likely to lead to his ouster.  But the state of those relationships didn't do anything to save him once more serious issues came to light.




...yeah, but most companies aren't on the verge of major lawsuits over those relationships.


----------



## DVC Grandpa

disneynutz said:


> Two years ago at the Association meeting he promised that he would contact me about some questions that I had. Guess I can stop waiting for the call.
> 
> Bill



Much like the promise he made (at the same meeting) that he was going to look into the DVC cable TV offerings when asked about the FOX network selections, or lack of.


----------



## Sammie

His replacement has been chosen, I am sure even before Jim was let go. No I don't know who it is, but was told the announcement will be made soon.

My biggest complaint with Jim was that in the beginning he was very much for the membership and implemented some good improvements. Then it was like the glory of being head of DVC, went to his head and he thought himself above everyone. That he could do and say whatever and no one could check him on it and his agenda became self promotion over what was good for DVC. 

I think the Aulani situation was just the final straw in a building dissatisfaction from many factors.


----------



## tjkraz

anniet said:


> ...yeah, but most companies aren't on the verge of major lawsuits over those relationships.



I don't know any specifics on HR-related issues / lawsuits so I can't comment on that.  If you do, please share.  

The one constant in everything I'm hearing is Aulani.  Either he is being held responsible (as President) for subordinate errors or he is totally culpable by approving sales when he knew paperwork was not in order.  Somewhere between those two extremes. 

Other things were the proverbial icing on the cake.


----------



## Graydon

Glad to see the Sentinel was able to pick up and share the story on JL's departure.

He was a political vamp who hid behind Al Weiss and was yielding power he thought he had.  He created his own 'fifedom' of his own diverse candidates not based on qualifications as one would have hope.  He manipulated systems, processes and people for his own personal greed.  He cut expenses with disregard of the outcome for his own personal gain - as you can imagine bottom line numbers at year end means a healthy bonus.

Time for his hinchmen & women to follow suit and leave what was once a incredible organization to work for - a group of people who cared only about providing an amazing product and service to DVC members.  I should know - I was one of them.

I think this departure is long overdue and welcome the stewardship and kindness Karl H has bestowed upon many cast members across the world!


----------



## TisBit

anniet said:


> I doubt it will get worse.  It was pretty ugly on the inside and I've heard wonderful things about Karl Holz.  Also, not mentioned in the article, Al Weiss retired a few months back and from what I understand he covered Lewis's rear end for a long time.  I think Disney has finally awoken to the fact that DVC was losing it's distinction in the industry and I hope they work to replace it.



Unfortunately it doe not mean that Karl will take over DVC directly or really stand in the way of a new person that comes in with loftier ideas.  Again, I will reserve judgement until we get a couple of years in with the new guy.



disneynutz said:


> I would guess that Disney is making a political move in firing Lewis. First of all, very, very rarely does a company publicly state that they *fired* an executive. The only reason that I can think of is that Disney is trying to correct the Aulani issue with the State of Hawaii and if it's not corrected, it could cost DVD a billion dollars or more. Some reports state that Lewis was aware of the Aulani problem and he ordered sales to start anyway even though he was told by Hawaii not to.
> 
> Secondly, Karl Holtz may be flexing his muscle being Lewis's new boss and/or they had a major falling out. One thing you can be sure of is that the DVD/DVC will take on the same business attributes as the DCL and now Holtz can hand pick his new president.
> 
> I don't know that much about the DCL but maybe DVCers will at least get clean, well maintained resort rooms before 4PM with the new management.
> 
> Bill



My thoughts exactly, very rarely do you hear that someone was "fired" in this high of a position and rarely do they actually get fired vs asked to resign.  I think there have been some serious issues of late, but not the ones most members are complaining about.  The normal things like loss of perks, or the fact that BLT had some issues with furnishings are both causing a stir among members, but that is not something you fire the president over. Hawaii sales is MAJOR issue and an embarrassment for the Company.  That is something that can get you canned, especially if there were other relatively minor things that were piled up.



jimmytammy said:


> Many longtime DVCers, who bought in the early days, have expressed their displeasure in how DVC has been heading in the last few yrs.  I dont remember that much negativity pre Lewis days.  But since he has been there, things in units have declined.  By himself, no he couldnt fix those things, but he had the power to fix them by letting up on monies to do so.  Refurnishing of old units, OKW alone has gotten a bad rap from its owners, especially those longtime owners.
> 
> Cheap...its the word that comes to mind for the dues we pay each year that is supposed to keep DVC at the top of the timeshare pile.  Cheap is what DVC has become.
> 
> I, like so many here, feel the same about change, it might get worse.  But in this case, IMO, change will be better.
> 
> I wont share my source, but a ASA our family knows has pointed out that many DVC CMs have become disgruntled about recent hires at the ASA level that are the typical pushy timeshare folks, not typical DVC/Disney type personalities.  And it was causing lots of disgruntle among its "good" people.  To the point of quitting.
> 
> So Lewis being gone, it will be a good thing.  It will take DVC awhile to get back on top.  I for one liked when we were at the top, I look forward to at least having that opportunity again.



The disgruntledness from the members to me is a lot like the normal people at WDW that say "it was so much better when....".  A lot of people want to remember a time when things were just rosy and great, but a lot of times that is more imagination vs reality.  In a members "honeymoon" phase of owning DVC, they are always going to be happier, but as years go by and things change, they will start complaining.  

I do agree that it seems the guides have been put under a lot of pressure and some of that has been translated into more pressure on person taking a tour.  I hope that this is going to be a good and productive change....and I am sure the next person in charge will remember their predecessor was fired and hopefully not make the same mistakes.  The real question is what the motivation of firing him was...if they felt that he wasn't making enough money, well we are in trouble.  If it is because he was mismanaging and complaints where going through the roof (costing money) and screw ups in Hawaii, well we might be in good shape as members with this change.


----------



## WilsonFlyer

Oglet said:


> I just love how the OP was tried, judged and executed on the first page. I have not read the whole thread in its entirety however I believe there are some people on here who need to seriously offer an apology to the OP.



I think it's apparent now that this person is also a long-time member under another alias here and likely a CM (and to me it's obvious he is DEEP inside DVC and/or DVD) as well. Obviously, people at Disney know him as his other alias here and at the risk of his employer knowing his identity (real alias here) and associating him with posting this news, he formed the new alias in order to post this breaking news early/first.

I certainly understand where he is "coming from" in doing this but you certainly understand our hesitancy in swallowing the hook with no questions asked of a first time poster in this community, don't you? 

I don't think anybody was unreasonably harsh on him. We were just asking him to authenticate what he had claimed. Like a lot of things, it's easy to look back now and see how this all transpired but it certainly wasn't that apparent when I made my reply to him.

I certainly appreciate your sentiments but I have to say that I will likely respond exactly as I did this time next time something like this happens. I don't think your post was specifically related to my post because I don't see anything offensive in my response.

As it turns out, it's apprently true, but I'm sure everyone here understands our obvious hesitancy in accepting such a major claim as gospel from what initially appeared to everyone as a first time poster on the boards.


----------



## anniet

tjkraz said:


> I don't know any specifics on HR-related issues / lawsuits so I can't comment on that.  If you do, please share.



I can't share all that I know, but I can share this

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...ey-vacation-club-time-share-sales-time-shares

What is not printed in the sentinel is those cuts were made retroactive 2 weeks - which I believe is illegal - and DVC had to put a lump sum back into the ASAs checks for that time period.

That was just one of MANY other things that you won't hear about.

_Pay attention to and Trust the posts by Graydon.  I think I know who that is and if I'm right, you are getting THE MOST reliable info right from the heart and soul of DVC.
_


----------



## Oglet

WilsonFlyer said:


> I think it's apparent now that this person is also a long-time member under another alias here and likely a CM as well. Obviously, people at Disney know him as his other alias here and at the risk of his employer knowing his identity (real alias here) and associating him with posting this news, he formed the new alias in order to post this breaking news early/first.
> 
> I certainly understand where he is "coming from" in doing this but you certainly understand our hesitancy in swallowing the hook with no questions asked of a first time poster in this community, don't you?
> 
> I don't think anybody was unreasonably harsh on him. We were just asking him to authenticate what he had claimed. Like a lot of things, it's easy to look back now and see how this all transpired but it certainly wasn't that apparent when I made my reply to him.
> 
> I certainly appreciate your sentiments but I have to say that I will likely respond exactly as I did this time next time something like this happens. I don't think your post was specifically related to my post because I don't see anything offensive in my response.
> 
> As it turns out, it's apprently true, but I'm sure everyone here understands our obvious hesitancy in accepting such a major claim as gospel from what initially appeared to everyone as a first time poster on the boards.



No, I agree with everything you said in your original post, there is nothing wrong with asking for sources and some proof at all.

I feel that some posters crossed the line because rather than say something constructive they took the approach of mocking the OP, sadly it is something that seems to be coming more and more common on here, especially with some senior members.

There are certainly ways to address concerns with a post and I feel you done yours in a very respectful and courteous manor.


----------



## smjj

I have not read the whole thread and it is so long. Can someone in the know kind of summerize what has happened in a small post fior those of us who are new to this thread??...smjj


----------



## Sammie

Graydon said:


> Glad to see the Sentinel was able to pick up and share the story on JL's departure.
> 
> He was a political vamp who hid behind Al Weiss and was yielding power he thought he had.  He created his own 'fifedom' of his own diverse candidates not based on qualifications as one would have hope.  He manipulated systems, processes and people for his own personal greed.  He cut expenses with disregard of the outcome for his own personal gain - as you can imagine bottom line numbers at year end means a healthy bonus.
> 
> Time for his hinchmen & women to follow suit and leave what was once a incredible organization to work for - a group of people who cared only about providing an amazing product and service to DVC members.  I should know - I was one of them.
> 
> I think this departure is long overdue and welcome the stewardship and kindness Karl H has bestowed upon many cast members across the world!



I know for a fact that expenses were cut on the selection of product for BLT, even though he was warned by the selection team that these products would not last. He was not the least concerned and had an attitude of as long as it looks good while selling I don't care if they have to pay later to replace it. 

I feel the same was done for OKW. The redo looked cheap.


----------



## Corinne

Sammie said:


> While I had no idea this was coming down the pipe, the fact that Al Weiss suddenly without any warning up and retired and then Karl Holz was made JL's boss, I had a feeling somethinig was not right in DVCland. It will be very interesting to watch.



I thought the exact same thing with the announcement of Holz becoming Lewis' boss.  While others have cautioned, not to celebrate just yet, I do hope this is a step in the right direction. Only time will tell!


----------



## granmanh603

jimmytammy said:


> Many longtime DVCers, who bought in the early days, have expressed their displeasure in how DVC has been heading in the last few yrs.  I dont remember that much negativity pre Lewis days.  But since he has been there, things in units have declined.  By himself, no he couldnt fix those things, but he had the power to fix them by letting up on monies to do so.  Refurnishing of old units, OKW alone has gotten a bad rap from its owners, especially those longtime owners.
> 
> Cheap...its the word that comes to mind for the dues we pay each year that is supposed to keep DVC at the top of the timeshare pile.  Cheap is what DVC has become.
> 
> I, like so many here, feel the same about change, it might get worse.  But in this case, IMO, change will be better.
> 
> I wont share my source, but a ASA our family knows has pointed out that many DVC CMs have become disgruntled about recent hires at the ASA level that are the typical pushy timeshare folks, not typical DVC/Disney type personalities.  And it was causing lots of disgruntle among its "good" people.  To the point of quitting.
> 
> So Lewis being gone, it will be a good thing.  It will take DVC awhile to get back on top.  I for one liked when we were at the top, I look forward to at least having that opportunity again.



Boy I agree with you.  I have felt that things have gone downhill since he came on board but I feel that about Iger too.  I know people hated Eisner but at least I always felt he cared about WDW , don't feel that way about Iger...


----------



## LauraLea

WilsonFlyer said:


> I think it's apparent now that this person is also a long-time member under another alias here and likely a CM (and to me it's obvious he is DEEP inside DVC and/or DVD) as well. Obviously, people at Disney know him as his other alias here and at the risk of his employer knowing his identity (real alias here) and associating him with posting this news, he formed the new alias in order to post this breaking news early/first.
> 
> I certainly understand where he is "coming from" in doing this but you certainly understand our hesitancy in swallowing the hook with no questions asked of a first time poster in this community, don't you?
> 
> I don't think anybody was unreasonably harsh on him. We were just asking him to authenticate what he had claimed. Like a lot of things, it's easy to look back now and see how this all transpired but it certainly wasn't that apparent when I made my reply to him.
> 
> I certainly appreciate your sentiments but I have to say that I will likely respond exactly as I did this time next time something like this happens. I don't think your post was specifically related to my post because I don't see anything offensive in my response.
> 
> As it turns out, it's apprently true, but I'm sure everyone here understands our obvious hesitancy in accepting such a major claim as gospel from what initially appeared to everyone as a first time poster on the boards.



Agree.  

but Oglet should have read the entire thread BEFORE she started throwing flames.  Apoligies were given early on.

Laura


----------



## jimmytammy

Sammie said:


> His replacement has been chosen, I am sure even before Jim was let go. No I don't know who it is, but was told the announcement will be made soon.
> 
> My biggest complaint with Jim was that in the beginning he was very much for the membership and implemented some good improvements. Then it was like the glory of being head of DVC, went to his head and he thought himself above everyone. That he could do and say whatever and no one could check him on it and his agenda became self promotion over what was good for DVC.
> 
> I think the Aulani situation was just the final straw in a building dissatisfaction from many factors.



I had the chance meet with him at VWl maybe 2 months after he took over.  At that time, he seemed genuine. He asked if I was an owner and asked my opinion of DVC.  He was very cordial to me, and seemed sincere in his asking.  I agree, like so many, Eisner included, the title takes over, it goes to their heads, and they become bigger than they need to be.  Great leaders know to look to those under them for advice, help, etc.  Great leaders become that way because they have great people under them.  Lewis lost sight of that quickly, if he ever knew it in the 1st place.  DVC was great before he got there.  Hoping for greatness again!!


----------



## Deb & Bill

I guess you'll all have me to thank.  After the Deevy Cee issue of Disney Files, I sent a long letter to DVC.  That must have done the trick.  


 (yeah, right)


----------



## jimmytammy

granmanh603 said:


> Boy I agree with you.  I have felt that things have gone downhill since he came on board but I feel that about Iger too.  I know people hated Eisner but at least I always felt he cared about WDW , don't feel that way about Iger...



To me, the jury is still out on Iger.  He hasnt done anything earth shaking that I know of, good or bad in his tenure, IMO.  But he is at the top, and its tough to rid someone at that position.  Look at what it took to get Eisner out, and how long.  People at the top of any business, organization, etc. always take the criticism, but its understood up front it will be that way.  Lewis was his own demise, Eisner was his own worst enemy as he micro managed himself into a deep hole, and Iger will probably work himself into a hole of some making of his own.  I agree with you that Iger is not like Eisner in his passion for Disney, at least not publicly.

Dont mean to steer this in a different direction, just comparing leadership roles to those of Lewis.  IMO, parallels are that leadership goes to peoples heads.


----------



## jimmytammy

Deb & Bill said:


> I guess you'll all have me to thank.  After the Deevy Cee issue of Disney Files, I sent a long letter to DVC.  That must have done the trick.
> 
> 
> (yeah, right)



Thanks Deb


----------



## Deb & Bill

jimmytammy said:


> Thanks Deb



And you get a big YOU'RE WELCOME from me, Jimmy.


----------



## cgcw

WDWLVR said:


> Those of us on both the 2005 and 2006 Member Cruises saw a major change in him. In 2005 he always had a smile and would stop and talk with anyone and everyone. In 2006 he was constantly surrounded by his people, tried to avoid guests at all costs and even lied outright to some saying there was no 2007 Member Cruise booked even though everyone knew there was (and it was announced a few weeks later but with a different booking only for those who hadn't sailed before). I lost respect for him after that cruise.
> 
> Here's hoping DVC has a brighter future with whoever they get to replace him.


 
Very true ---- but at least I got a picture of the two of us together.


----------



## DebbieB

Sammie said:


> His replacement has been chosen, I am sure even before Jim was let go. No I don't know who it is, but was told the announcement will be made soon.
> 
> My biggest complaint with Jim was that in the beginning he was very much for the membership and implemented some good improvements. Then it was like the glory of being head of DVC, went to his head and he thought himself above everyone. That he could do and say whatever and no one could check him on it and his agenda became self promotion over what was good for DVC.
> 
> I think the Aulani situation was just the final straw in a building dissatisfaction from many factors.



I agree.   One of the first things he did was get the $100 AP discount.   Members were asking for an AP discount for years, hoping for just 10% like the old length of stay.   When it came out, the $100 discount was around 25%, which was awesome!    But then it has gone downhill.  The valet parking fiasco was bad.  How can you have someone parking their car at night when it's free and then being charged to pick it up in the morning?  They couldn't have announced it and made it effective in a week?  Or told people when they left the car?    It's not that it was alot of money but it was an underhanded way of doing business.

I had a feeling something was wrong when so many guides (including mine) suddenly "retired".


----------



## goofydad99

DebbieB said:


> I agree.   One of the first things he did was get the $100 AP discount.   Members were asking for an AP discount for years, hoping for just 10% like the old length of stay.   When it came out, the $100 discount was around 25%, which was awesome!    But then it has gone downhill.  The valet parking fiasco was bad.  How can you have someone parking their car at night when it's free and then being charged to pick it up in the morning?  They couldn't have announced it and made it effective in a week?  Or told people when they left the car?    It's not that it was alot of money but it was an underhanded way of doing business.
> 
> I had a feeling something was wrong when so many guides (including mine) suddenly "retired".




We don't know what happened to our original guide.  We suddenly just had a new one.  How do you figure out what happened to them?


----------



## Sammie

goofydad99 said:


> We don't know what happened to our original guide.  We suddenly just had a new one.  How do you figure out what happened to them?



You won't unless you were close enough to your guide they contacted you as our did.


----------



## twinboysmom

Deb & Bill said:


> I guess you'll all have me to thank.  After the Deevy Cee issue of Disney Files, I sent a long letter to DVC.  That must have done the trick.
> 
> 
> (yeah, right)



Thanks for taking care of that Deb!  I know everyone hates Disney files.  I wouldn't know because dvc can't seem to get it to me.  That last person I talked to was clueless and said maybe I don't have enough points for it.  Really?  I have 200 btw.  Our new guide called the other day.  I asked him to help us get it.  He said he couldn't help with that.  I hope he is waiting by the phone for that 200 point add on I want.


----------



## Gregowa

From all that I have read, I don't think the Disney powers that be had any choice in firing Lewis. If the snafu with Aulani is as serious as is being reported, firing Lewis is probably the 1st in a series of "good faith" measures to try to redeem the Aulani DVC holding with the state of Hawaii and the feds for any of those laws broken. That is no small task and Disney has a lot to be worried about in terms of sanctions and fines that could be imposed on them for JL's actions. As far as Lewis himself is concerned, it just goes to show that the bigger they are, the harder they fall - what goes around, comes around. One thing Disney seems to pride itself on is making the average consumer happy with their experience. DVC consumers have become less happy over the past few years and this seems to go right back to some of the decisions Lewis has made. With 400,000 members, DVC membership is a formidible marketing tool within itself. I think there has been a lot of people who have bought DVC resale at the recommendation of members. as well as members themselves who have added on resale.  The policy change for DVC resales most likely is not having the desired effect intended. Most members only use their points for trips to Dis and not for Adventures, cruises, etc. because the value just isn't there. Buying direct from DVC or by resale is not a cheap purchase in the best of times much less in a stressed economy.  Add the other general dissatisfaction over banking changes, loss of perks, cheap furniture, shoddy upkeep, poor housekeeping, or whatever other complaint, and people beome disillusioned and talk about it. Most people interested in buying DVC do some research prior to buying, and if they see members complaining and unhappy, that sends up red flags. It's not great publicity for DVC, particularly since it seems they want to keep building properties. Just saying ...IMHO.  I'll get off my soapbox now!


----------



## supersuperwendy

How did banking used to work?


----------



## PrincessYessenia

TisBit said:


> As others have said, this is not necessarily a good thing.  Be careful what you ask for, because you just might get it!
> 
> While DVC could always improve, it could also get much worse.  Hopefully we will get an improvement, but you never know....I will reserve judgement on this one.




I agree.  We were all excited at my job when our boss was fired and a new one came along.  She was a million times worse than the last one!  I'm just hoping this DVC issue won't end up the same way.


----------



## arthur06

Is it possible that the Aulani problem is bigger then being reported? Was the state of Hawaii dragging its feet, as it did not want any part of JL? Did Disney know this? Is this a move that Hawaii loves, and will get the ball rolling on Aulani again? 

JL needed to learn in business that "Pigs get fat, Hogs get slaughtered!"


----------



## jennypenny

Could Hawaii not grant a timeshare license to disney at this point? Could Hawaii be threatening that? What would disney do? And are we (members) paying for that in some way? Or is it Disney's problem until they sell the DVC contracts?


----------



## CarolAnnC

Oglet said:


> No, I agree with everything you said in your original post, there is nothing wrong with asking for sources and some proof at all.
> 
> I feel that some posters crossed the line because rather than say something constructive they took the approach of mocking the OP, sadly it is something that seems to be coming more and more common on here, especially with some senior members.
> 
> There are certainly ways to address concerns with a post and I feel you done yours in a very respectful and courteous manor.



If anyone has concerns with ANY post here on the DIS, please use the Report A Post to a Moderator button to express your concerns and not do so on the boards.

Otherwise, the posts should stay to the topic at hand here.  Thank you.


----------



## Donna DeVil

Graydon said:


> My original post is true - no Pinnochio here.
> 
> He was a ruthless selfish man that made everyone's life miserable.   As a founding and 17+ year DVC cast member I got the call late afternoon.  Ex DVCers were smiling and dancing on cars from Long Island to Chicagoland to DLR and those on the Cruise Ships.
> 
> It appears its tied to Aluani's screwup in selling when they shouldn't have - something I hear he knew all about.  Couple that with internal investigations by Corp HR on Cast Member related issues and purposefully not allowing Members to book vacations on the Dream to minimize expenses out to DCL - he's a piece of work that had to go. I don't think I recall having to work with such a manipulative, ego-centric person in all my years there.
> 
> My sources are real and factual.  Praise the lord change is in the air...  Karma kinda stinks doesn't it?




I am very disturbed about this, especially since we tried to book a cruise next summer LAST WEEKEND & were given the favorite answer,"No availability for points usage, but if you would like to book with cash..." Major disappointment. It was supposed to be a huge celebration for the whole family: my parent's 50th anniversay, my 25th, our daughter's HS graduation. 

I am a newbie here on disboards, but I have been a DVC member since 98. I was also a cast member long ago & far away back in 94.

Our satisfaction with DVC has been steadily declining in the last few years (maintenance, service, rules, etc.). Our vacation guide, Julie, abruptly left, too. I don't even know who our current guide is. I am not sure I care today.


----------



## mjc2003

I think it's a bit pie-in-the-sky to roll all these issues into one and say that he was fired unceremoniously b/c of all these "bean counting" decisions, like cheap furniture and shoddy renovations, and that Aulani was the final straw.  I doubt frankly that the powers that be care so much about the furniture at BLT.  I think this is an issue that can be worked out, and if JL was duly in charge of all facets of DVC then he would simply be prodded to change his perspective on the quality of furnishings going forward.  I also doubt very much that anybody cared about "unhappy CM's", or "more pushy timeshare-like sales tactics".  The bottom line is all that matters.  

My point is, Lewis is being fired for a specific incident.  This is not an accumulation of problems, b/c most of these perceived problems are not problems from the standpoint of DVC's bottom line.  They are not losing money if a CM is disgruntled.  And BLT is about to sell out and is selling for $150 pp, so the furnishings have not blinded peoples capacity for (over?) spending.  

He is being fired for this issue with Aulani, which I suspect is going to cost somebody a lot of money.  If this was an accumulation of incidents, they would "agree to part ways".  He is being isolated, and fired as the fall guy, so they can go back to the state of HI and say "Look, we've eliminated the problem".  
This is about his costing them big time bucks, not due to some slow deterioration of DVC owner sentiment over time.  It's nice as owners to think that somebody listened and agreed that Jim Lewis was not interested in DVC owners best interests, but I suspect this is hardly the case.  In other words, if this Aulani issue hadn't surfaced, Jim Lewis would not be on the outs.  

Just my opinion.


----------



## Mister Incredible

Like many, my first response was, "wow, time to polish up the resume!" 

I was then thinking about all the changes I would make, and then it hit me...can you imagine how hard this job must be?  The first thing I thought of was you cannot please everyone.  Something as simple as bringing back free valet parking would probably tick off a handful of people for one reason or the other.  Then, every decision you make is questioned by your employees, your guests and then debated on hundreds of message boards.  Not to mention how many people you impact on a day.  Sure some of that is being a manager, but other items, not so much.  Could you imagine if there was a message board at your work?

Who knows if between 2006 and 2007 he was directed to cut his budget by 10, 15 or even 25%.  I'm not defending him, nor his decisions, just saying there are several times as a manager, I'm directed to do things that are against my better judgment.  You would think with all the real estate lawyers and professionals who work for Disney THEY would have caught the problems in Hawaii.  I guess there has to be one fall guy (or girl).

In a position like this you always have those members who believe they are elite and purchased DVC thinking they should be treated like kings and queens.  I can't imagine dealing with people like that, and 99% of the time they are the most vocal.

Sure, I look for a few perks here and there.  Also, there are several immediate changes I would make.  However, I do hope the next person has a solid pulse on the employees, builds on the strengths of DVC and raises the bar with the weaknesses that have been created.

If by some miracle I was chosen, I would make sure the announcement wasn't made for months.  In that time I would visit every kiosk to be "sold on DVC", stay in every resort, and interact with as many employees and guests as possible.  All the time collecting data of the good, the bad and the ugly and make that my priority list.

Good luck to the person who fills this position!!  All eyes (and ears) will be watching!![FONT=&quot][/FONT]


----------



## supersuperwendy

I'm still a relatively new member so I'm curious what kind of changes should we hope for with someone new in charge?


----------



## tjkraz

arthur06 said:


> Is it possible that the Aulani problem is bigger then being reported? Was the state of Hawaii dragging its feet, as it did not want any part of JL? Did Disney know this? Is this a move that Hawaii loves, and will get the ball rolling on Aulani again?
> 
> JL needed to learn in business that "Pigs get fat, Hogs get slaughtered!"





jennypenny said:


> Could Hawaii not grant a timeshare license to disney at this point? Could Hawaii be threatening that? What would disney do? And are we (members) paying for that in some way? Or is it Disney's problem until they sell the DVC contracts?



Unless the state of Hawaii wants to turn its back on 500 timeshare units and thousands of recurring visitors, I don't think there will be any long term impact.  But, not knowing any specifics, it seems conceivable that millions of dollars worth of fines and restitution could be involved.  

It won't be long before details are known.  The only question is whether the Sentinel or Honolulu Star Advertiser will break the full story first.  



mjc2003 said:


> My point is, Lewis is being fired for a specific incident.  This is not an accumulation of problems, b/c most of these perceived problems are not problems from the standpoint of DVC's bottom line.  They are not losing money if a CM is disgruntled.  And BLT is about to sell out and is selling for $150 pp, so the furnishings have not blinded peoples capacity for (over?) spending.
> 
> He is being fired for this issue with Aulani, which I suspect is going to cost somebody a lot of money.



Agree.  Although other aspects of his job performance probably didn't help.  

If his performance had been exemplary in other regards, it might have been enough to allow him to ride out this situation.  Might have been "reassigned" within TWDC or at least given the opportunity to resign.  

But other negatives weighing against him probably made this an easy decision.  Two things that particularly stand out in my mind are design missteps at BLT and the OKW extension (which JL publicly admitted could/should have been handled differently.)  Sounds like there was a fair amount of discontent among staff internally, which doesn't help either.  

I doubt point reallocations, valet parking or banking windows played any role in the decision.  If this as serious as it appears, decision-makers didn't even need to reach the point of second-guessing every policy decision over the past 8 years.


----------



## tjkraz

supersuperwendy said:


> I'm still a relatively new member so I'm curious what kind of changes should we hope for with someone new in charge?



Completely unknown.  

Many policy decisions were warranted regardless of what individuals may think.  It's a case of not being able to please all of the people, all of the time. 

Communications have definitely been lacking so any improvement there would be welcome.  DVC was not at fault for members losing free valet parking access, but resort guests should not have had to find out when they went to pick up their cars on the day the change was made.  

I will gladly support the idea that Disney Cruise Line is several notches above DVC in most aspects of quality and customer service.  If Karl Holz (long time DCL head who now oversees DVC) has the same standards for DVC, we will certainly see improvements in many areas.


----------



## nunzia

Sammie said:


> His replacement has been chosen,* I am sure even before Jim was let go. No I don't know who it is, but was told the announcement will be made soon.*My biggest complaint with Jim was that in the beginning he was very much for the membership and implemented some good improvements. Then it was like the glory of being head of DVC, went to his head and he thought himself above everyone. That he could do and say whatever and no one could check him on it and his agenda became self promotion over what was good for DVC.
> 
> I think the Aulani situation was just the final straw in a building dissatisfaction from many factors.



maybe at the Expo?


----------



## tjkraz

nunzia said:


> maybe at the Expo?



Just my gut feeling but I don't think Disney wants the stink of this reaching any part of the Expo if it can be avoided.  

Unless the situation with Aulani sales is worked out in the next few days, we may not see any signs of Aulani or DVC at the Expo.


----------



## TisBit

Mister Incredible said:


> Like many, my first response was, "wow, time to polish up the resume!"
> 
> I was then thinking about all the changes I would make, and then it hit me...can you imagine how hard this job must be?  The first thing I thought of was you cannot please everyone.  Something as simple as bringing back free valet parking would probably tick off a handful of people for one reason or the other.  Then, every decision you make is questioned by your employees, your guests and then debated on hundreds of message boards.  Not to mention how many people you impact on a day.  Sure some of that is being a manager, but other items, not so much.  Could you imagine if there was a message board at your work?
> 
> Who knows if between 2006 and 2007 he was directed to cut his budget by 10, 15 or even 25%.  I'm not defending him, nor his decisions, just saying there are several times as a manager, I'm directed to do things that are against my better judgment.  You would think with all the real estate lawyers and professionals who work for Disney THEY would have caught the problems in Hawaii.  I guess there has to be one fall guy (or girl).
> 
> In a position like this you always have those members who believe they are elite and purchased DVC thinking they should be treated like kings and queens.  I can't imagine dealing with people like that, and 99% of the time they are the most vocal.
> 
> Sure, I look for a few perks here and there.  Also, there are several immediate changes I would make.  However, I do hope the next person has a solid pulse on the employees, builds on the strengths of DVC and raises the bar with the weaknesses that have been created.
> 
> If by some miracle I was chosen, I would make sure the announcement wasn't made for months.  In that time I would visit every kiosk to be "sold on DVC", stay in every resort, and interact with as many employees and guests as possible.  All the time collecting data of the good, the bad and the ugly and make that my priority list.
> 
> Good luck to the person who fills this position!!  All eyes (and ears) will be watching!![FONT=&quot][/FONT]



Very good post.  You will never please anyone and any changes will be met with resistance.  And if you don't change things, than they will complain that you aren't doing anything new.  

As for everyone that is trying to figure out why JL was fired, you also have to remember it might have NOTHING to do with Hawaii, Member feedback or even HR issues.  He might have had a serious conflict of interest with another timeshare company, he may have embezzled a million dollars, he could have had an affair with someone in the office.  Point being, while so many here on the DIS hate him and thing he was the worst thing in the world.....WDW very well may have been forced to fire him for some offense that we will never know, but would have rather kept him around.


----------



## nunzia

jimmytammy said:


> To me, the jury is still out on Iger.  He hasnt done anything earth shaking that I know of, good or bad in his tenure, IMO.  But he is at the top, and its tough to rid someone at that position.  Look at what it took to get Eisner out, and how long.  People at the top of any business, organization, etc. always take the criticism, but its understood up front it will be that way.  Lewis was his own demise, Eisner was his own worst enemy as he micro managed himself into a deep hole, and Iger will probably work himself into a hole of some making of his own.  I agree with you that Iger is not like Eisner in his passion for Disney, at least not publicly.
> 
> Dont mean to steer this in a different direction, just comparing leadership roles to those of Lewis.  IMO, parallels are that leadership goes to peoples heads.



So far I like Iger..sems to do OK and no huge blunders..I didn't agree with Cook leaving and so far under the new guy (Ross?) the jury is out.
I loved Eisner when he came in..Read Storming the Magic Kingdom..fascinating and you can thank Roy and that group for saving the entire company. At the end I was in the group formed by Roy to oust him. Sad, really..I think after Frank Wells died things changed quickly for the worse. Remember, Eisner was botching up things with Pixar..final straw for me. I'm thankful under Iger for the Pixar purchase and so far seems like decent leadership, starting with putting the Walt-esque Lassiter at the helm of so much.


----------



## nunzia

tjkraz said:


> Just my gut feeling but I don't think Disney wants the stink of this reaching any part of the Expo if it can be avoided.
> 
> Unless the situation with Aulani sales is worked out in the next few days, we may not see any signs of Aulani or DVC at the Expo.



Very true..but Expo marketing materials already are advertising DVC and Aulani, so maybe it's worse to just leave it all out?


----------



## TLSnell1981

Now, if Iger were to leave? I'd say, things might start looking up... I wouldnt mind, if Stagg left too and Prince Charming gave the Carousel back to Cindy. Unfortunately, Mickey and Minnie would still be homeless.

Until then, I'm not convinced, Lewis leaving will improve anything.


----------



## tjkraz

Mister Incredible said:


> If by some miracle I was chosen, I would make sure the announcement wasn't made for months.  In that time I would visit every kiosk to be "sold on DVC", stay in every resort, and interact with as many employees and guests as possible.  All the time collecting data of the good, the bad and the ugly and make that my priority list.



Disney doesn't have that luxury.  News of this will certainly get out and, depending upon what is uncovered regarding Aulani, it could be very damaging.  Current members would be calling for blood if months pass and there are no signs of a successor.  From a PR standpoint, Disney needs a public face to reassure current and potential members that all is well.  

Operationally, they need someone who can start getting his/her hands dirty immediately.  There are decisions to be made and the incoming President (or VP or whatever title is given) can't be delegating those decisions to underlings.  

The new head doesn't need to immediately appear in commercials or write articles for Disney Files, but he/she needs to serve as a visible sign of stability within DVC.


----------



## TisBit

tjkraz said:


> Disney doesn't have that luxury.  News of this will certainly get out and, depending upon what is uncovered regarding Aulani, it could be very damaging.  Current members would be calling for blood if months pass and there are no signs of a successor.  From a PR standpoint, Disney needs a public face to reassure current and potential members that all is well.
> 
> Operationally, they need someone who can start getting his/her hands dirty immediately.  There are decisions to be made and the incoming President (or VP or whatever title is given) can't be delegating those decisions to underlings.
> 
> The new head doesn't need to immediately appear in commercials or write articles for Disney Files, but he/she needs to serve as a visible sign of stability within DVC.



I disagree, majority of the membership probably doesn't even know who Jim Lewis is and will not know he is gone until they put an article in Disney Files announcing his replacement.  DVC does not need a head chief to keep trucking along.  The biggest reason for a quick replacement is to sort out the mess in Aulani and reassure their investors and sort things out with the regulators.


----------



## OrangeCountyCommuter

I am just starting a pool on the first complaint about his replacement....

My bet is on two weeks after the announement someone goes on the DIS and whines about how bad the replacement is....


----------



## debloco

tjkraz said:


> Aulani sales have been on hold for about a month due to some unspecified legal issue.  Only thing DVC would say about that is documents are being revised.
> 
> One report suggests that the proverbial "other shoe" dropped in the midst of promotional events in Pasadena to promote Aulani.  They had 4 nights of presentations lined up.  According to one person, all was well and good the first night but by night #2 there was no word of Aulani and CMs were told not to discuss any Aulani sales topics with attendees.


Wow.  I was at the Pasadena event the first day and all seemed fine.  Lots of talk about Aulani.


----------



## tjkraz

TisBit said:


> I disagree, majority of the membership probably doesn't even know who Jim Lewis is and will not know he is gone until they put an article in Disney Files announcing his replacement.  DVC does not need a head chief to keep trucking along.  The biggest reason for a quick replacement is to sort out the mess in Aulani and reassure their investors and sort things out with the regulators.



Lewis did a pretty effective job of getting his name and face out there.  Not everyone follows on-line forums but he was a consistent presence in marketing materials, Disney Files and other DVC tie-ins.  

And I do firmly believe that the more voracious fans (like ourselves) would be worked into a proverbial tizzy if several months went by with no word of a replacement.  There's a member cruise a month from now and the annual meeting in less than 4 months.  Those are perfect opportunities to immediately earn points with some of the most critical elements of the membership base.  

Beyond that, it's not just about members.  DVC has ongoing relationships with vendors, contractors, local government officials, business partners such as RCI, lending institutions, and so forth.  Someone needs to pick up those relationships immediately.  This isn't a forced retirement situation where his duties can be transitioned to a successor over the next few months--Lewis was shown the door.  There are decisions to be made, projects to manage, egos to smooth, hands to be shaken and so forth.

Internally people need to know who is in charge at DVC.  The new head has work to do and doesn't need to meet resistance from staffers who are unaware that he/she is Lewis' super-secret replacement.  

DVC is a multi-million dollar division of a multi-billion dollar, publicly-traded corporation.  The incoming head doesn't have the luxury of staying in the background, glad-handing sales booth agents for a couple of months while others make critical decisions and repair any damage left by Lewis' abrupt departure.  

In the end, I don't see any value to the new head remaining anonymous.  He/she can still spend spare time getting to know front line staff members.  But there is unquestionably work to be done.  A fair amount of member anxiety--even if largely limited to the DIS and similar forums--can be placated with an announcement and a few select public appearances.


----------



## jodifla

tjkraz said:


> Unless the state of Hawaii wants to turn its back on 500 timeshare units and thousands of recurring visitors, I don't think there will be any long term impact.  But, not knowing any specifics, it seems conceivable that millions of dollars worth of fines and restitution could be involved.
> 
> It won't be long before details are known.  The only question is whether the Sentinel or Honolulu Star Advertiser will break the full story first.
> 
> 
> 
> Agree.  Although other aspects of his job performance probably didn't help.
> 
> *If his performance had been exemplary in other regards, it might have been enough to allow him to ride out this situation.*  Might have been "reassigned" within TWDC or at least given the opportunity to resign.
> 
> But other negatives weighing against him probably made this an easy decision.  Two things that particularly stand out in my mind are design missteps at BLT and the OKW extension (which JL publicly admitted could/should have been handled differently.)  Sounds like there was a fair amount of discontent among staff internally, which doesn't help either.
> 
> I doubt point reallocations, valet parking or banking windows played any role in the decision.  If this as serious as it appears, decision-makers didn't even need to reach the point of second-guessing every policy decision over the past 8 years.



   I agree with this...if a manager's performance is exemplary and he or she is well-loved, most companies will want to keep the person, even with a big mistake that costs them money. But make a big, costly mistake AND be an arrogant jerk that nobody likes, and the decision becomes easy.


----------



## TisBit

tjkraz said:


> Lewis did a pretty effective job of getting his name and face out there.  Not everyone follows on-line forums but he was a consistent presence in marketing materials, Disney Files and other DVC tie-ins.
> 
> And I do firmly believe that the more voracious fans (like ourselves) would be worked into a proverbial tizzy if several months went by with no word of a replacement.  There's a member cruise a month from now and the annual meeting in less than 4 months.  Those are perfect opportunities to immediately earn points with some of the most critical elements of the membership base.
> 
> Beyond that, it's not just about members.  DVC has ongoing relationships with vendors, contractors, local government officials, business partners such as RCI, lending institutions, and so forth.  Someone needs to pick up those relationships immediately.  This isn't a forced retirement situation where his duties can be transitioned to a successor over the next few months--Lewis was shown the door.  There are decisions to be made, projects to manage, egos to smooth, hands to be shaken and so forth.
> 
> Internally people need to know who is in charge at DVC.  The new head has work to do and doesn't need to meet resistance from staffers who are unaware that he/she is Lewis' super-secret replacement.
> 
> DVC is a multi-million dollar division of a multi-billion dollar, publicly-traded corporation.  The incoming head doesn't have the luxury of staying in the background, glad-handing sales booth agents for a couple of months while others make critical decisions and repair any damage left by Lewis' abrupt departure.
> 
> In the end, I don't see any value to the new head remaining anonymous.  He/she can still spend spare time getting to know front line staff members.  But there is unquestionably work to be done.  A fair amount of member anxiety--even if largely limited to the DIS and similar forums--can be placated with an announcement and a few select public appearances.



Yes, I completely agree they will not have a super secret boss working the phones at MS just to get an idea of what is going on.  I was merely pointing out that they do not need to rush a replacement.  No one in a company is irreplacable and the show will still go on.  All of those business relationships will remain intact and Jim Lewis probably had little to do with the day to day operations.  Usually the President is more of a politician for the company and only called in on the big issues or to sign off on what the VP's and their underlings have already hammered out.  Karl could easily fill this role as "leader" until they replace him or there will be someone appointed as interim until a final selection is made.


----------



## pklein09

I went on to look at point charts for next year's vacation, and the first thing that pops up is Aulani and "own a piece of paradise."  If they're not supposed to be selling it or talking about it, someone forgot the website.


----------



## tjkraz

TisBit said:


> Yes, I completely agree they will not have a super secret boss working the phones at MS just to get an idea of what is going on.  I was merely pointing out that they do not need to rush a replacement.  No one in a company is irreplacable and the show will still go on.  All of those business relationships will remain intact and Jim Lewis probably had little to do with the day to day operations.  Usually the President is more of a politician for the company and only called in on the big issues or to sign off on what the VP's and their underlings have already hammered out.  Karl could easily fill this role as "leader" until they replace him or there will be someone appointed as interim until a final selection is made.



Agree to disagree.  Particularly if the Aulani situation proves to be as embarrassing for Disney as I'm sensing it will be.


----------



## Mister Incredible

> Current members would be calling for blood if months pass and there are no signs of a successor.



Ironically, that is some of what I am talking about.  Why should any member have any input on who or what DVC does with this position?  Of course we are the ultimate customer, but we are only that, customers.  We are not board members or active voters.

Almost like saying, I would have input into who Reebok hires as VP because I wear Reebok shoes.

I would rather DVC takes their time and hires an interim, then does a thorough search for a replacement.


----------



## anniet

pklein09 said:


> I went on to look at point charts for next year's vacation, and the first thing that pops up is Aulani and "own a piece of paradise."  If they're not supposed to be selling it or talking about it, someone forgot the website.



Someone forgot to update the website when they told the ASA's that the starting price was 19k and the website said 12k too.  Which whenever I told someone the starting price I was INSTRUCTED to say and they used their smartphone right in front of me to look it up, made me a BIG FAT LIAR and compromised any credibility I or DVC had at that moment.

He wasn't big on communication, consistent or otherwise, or processes, or caring about the right person for the right job and frankly I could give a rat's behind WHY he's gone, I just know, I saw it from the inside and it was UGLY and I'm glad he's gone!


----------



## tjkraz

Mister Incredible said:


> Ironically, that is some of what I am talking about.  Why should any member have any input on who or what DVC does with this position?  Of course we are the ultimate customer, but we are only that, customers.  We are not board members or active voters.
> 
> Almost like saying, I would have input into who Reebok hires as VP because I wear Reebok shoes.
> 
> I would rather DVC takes their time and hires an interim, then does a thorough search for a replacement.



Nobody ever said that members should have a say in the decision.  That's Disney's turf.  And I don't have a problem with Disney taking a _reasonable_ amount of time to find the right person...although it shouldn't take more than a few weeks even if they do consider a few outsiders. 

What I specifically object to are these comments:



> If by some miracle I was chosen, I would make sure the announcement wasn't made for months. In that time I would visit every kiosk to be "sold on DVC", stay in every resort, and interact with as many employees and guests as possible. All the time collecting data of the good, the bad and the ugly and make that my priority list.



If you were hired tomorrow, I would expect you to be front-and-center immediately...leading the division, meeting members, visible on the member cruise and at the upcoming condo meeting, cleaning up whatever mess JL left behind at 5pm on Friday.  

I don't want DVCs next leader to be someone who chooses to hide in the wings and spend several months gathering information and glad-handing Cast Members.  That's part of the on-the-job training.  You do that after putting in a 40+ hour work week.


----------



## DebbieB

I agree, they need someone in there immediately to stabilize the situation.   It sounds like there has been alot of anger in the cm ranks with JL.    That's the first thing they need to address, not the members.  Plus the Hawaii situation.


----------



## mommacat56

Sammie said:


> It seems so, maybe he took Dee Vee Cee with him. ;



OMG, I hope so!  That vacuous character is (or hopefully WAS?) a total dumbing down of all that DVC represents for me personally... and a total waste of money, air, and space!! But let me tell you how I really feel...

And, I hope his replacement restores the value of ALL points purchased(direct AND resale) so that ALL members can choose to use them any way THEY wish (like I do for cruises or I wouldn't see DCL at all!)...this will bring a little value back to our contracts should we ever decide to sell... I won't, but others want or need to sell, especially in the current economic climate.

And lastly, and I apologize for being a bit off topic, but do I actually own the Aulani points I purchased a few months ago?  Or are they (and the deed which I haven't seen) in Hawaiian regulatory limbo?  Is Aulani even able to open this month?

Thanks for letting me vent!

Mary


----------



## kikiq

mommacat56 said:


> OMG,  Is Aulani even able to open this month?
> Mary



I can answer this.  Aulani will have a "soft" opening on August 29 with Mickey Mouse and an guest family being selected as the "opening" family, along with Hawaiian festivities.  Late September, there will a "media event" opening with TV and radio stations.

What is in question is when sales will start up again?  And how do the paperwork reviews being done currently between the State of Hawaii and DVC affect the contracts already sold?


----------



## gatorskin76

tjkraz said:


> I don't want DVCs next leader to be someone who chooses to hide in the wings and spend several months gathering information and glad-handing Cast Members.  That's part of the on-the-job training.  You do that after putting in a 40+ hour work week.



Have you ever watched Undercover Boss?  I think the poster was making that statement because you can't truly find out how things run in a normal situation if you are the boss.  If people know you are the boss they act different around you.  I could be wrong, but I think that was the point.


----------



## Tigger031266

I think Dee Vee Cee is how Jim Lewis views us.  He sees us as middle age, overweight, load mouth, low IQ, happy folks.  Rather insulting really.

Would rather be the old guy from the movie "UP".  At least he was an adventurer.  

Honestly, when your in charge of 11 hotels that carry a world class name like Disney, the quality and service needs to be world class.  There hase been dozen of us complaining about cleaning quality, check in issues, lack of perks and lack of overall magic.  

If I ran the place my order of fixings things would be:
- guaranteed clean room or night is free (Hampton inns can pull this off)
- free valet again
- out with DEe Vee Cee. Have various characters
- instead of welcome home Wednesday. It would be BBQ with free burgers, dogs, chips, soda and listen to our pitch.  
- forget grand floridian, we want poly
- a speacial meal plan for DVc owners
(feel free to add on)


----------



## CarolAnnC

This thread needs to remain on topic as a discussion of the departure of Jim Lewis from DVC.

Thanks all...


----------



## arthur06

If JL receives a severance, how would that be paid? 
Isn't employee wages figured into our MF's, thus including JL's salary and severance?


----------



## Sammie

As to when the replacement will be announced I was told soon, the person has already been chosen. 

As to the former banking it was staggered and you had a time line where you could bank 100%, then 50%, then 25%.

For someone like us with an October use year that takes summer vacations, we have to bank; if we are going to do by the end of May before our trips. So if we have to cancel we have no way to save any points by banking.

The old way we could save 50% by banking by June and 25% by banking by July. We were even given a chart that had the months for each use year.

But JL, said they changed it because the members were not smart enough to figure it out. 

We had no problems with it prior to the change.



> I think Dee Vee Cee is how Jim Lewis viewed us. He sees us as middle age, overweight, load mouth, low IQ, happy folks. Rather insulting really.



I have several friends in DVC and yes that would be pretty accurate, except be sure to include regulars on an Internet forum.


----------



## mommacat56

arthur06 said:


> If JL receives a severance, how would that be paid?
> Isn't employee wages figured into our MF's, thus including JL's salary and severance?



If he was laid off, retired, or "encouraged" to resign, a severance package would possibly be in order.  Since he was fired (by all accounts here on the DIS), there may be something contractually that states "no severance or golden parachute" if fired for poor performance or another issue of importance (like selling timeshares before legally being authorized to do so).

I would think that if he costs DVC and Disney millions to correct this, the amount he may see, if anything at all, would be inversely proportional to that amount.  

Whose funds?  I certainly hope the vast majority comes from corporate, not DVC or DVDMC.  We pay enough in dues and I for one want my dues to redo the recent OKW redo! Cheap and ugly!

I hope all is disclosed at the annual STOCKHOLDERS meeting...I think these sort of financial arrangements are supposed to be made public (at least to the shareholders, maybe not to the members).  We will all have to wait and see.

JMHO...


----------



## Goofy DVC

Mister Incredible said:


> Like many, my first response was, "wow, time to polish up the resume!"
> 
> I was then thinking about all the changes I would make, and then it hit me...can you imagine how hard this job must be?  The first thing I thought of was you cannot please everyone.  Something as simple as bringing back free valet parking would probably tick off a handful of people for one reason or the other.  Then, every decision you make is questioned by your employees, your guests and then debated on hundreds of message boards.  Not to mention how many people you impact on a day.  Sure some of that is being a manager, but other items, not so much.  Could you imagine if there was a message board at your work?
> 
> Who knows if between 2006 and 2007 he was directed to cut his budget by 10, 15 or even 25%.  I'm not defending him, nor his decisions, just saying there are several times as a manager, I'm directed to do things that are against my better judgment.  You would think with all the real estate lawyers and professionals who work for Disney THEY would have caught the problems in Hawaii.  I guess there has to be one fall guy (or girl).
> 
> In a position like this you always have those members who believe they are elite and purchased DVC thinking they should be treated like kings and queens.  I can't imagine dealing with people like that, and 99% of the time they are the most vocal.
> 
> Sure, I look for a few perks here and there.  Also, there are several immediate changes I would make.  However, I do hope the next person has a solid pulse on the employees, builds on the strengths of DVC and raises the bar with the weaknesses that have been created.
> 
> If by some miracle I was chosen, I would make sure the announcement wasn't made for months.  In that time I would visit every kiosk to be "sold on DVC", stay in every resort, and interact with as many employees and guests as possible.  All the time collecting data of the good, the bad and the ugly and make that my priority list.
> 
> Good luck to the person who fills this position!!  All eyes (and ears) will be watching!![FONT=&quot][/FONT]



Very well said.


----------



## disneynutz

Mister Incredible said:


> Ironically, that is some of what I am talking about.  Why should any member have any input on who or what DVC does with this position?  Of course we are the ultimate customer, but we are only that, customers.  We are not board members or active voters.
> 
> Almost like saying, I would have input into who Reebok hires as VP because I wear Reebok shoes.
> 
> I would rather DVC takes their time and hires an interim, then does a thorough search for a replacement.



Because we are a CLUB! 

 Bill


----------



## disneynutz

arthur06 said:


> If JL receives a severance, how would that be paid?
> Isn't employee wages figured into our MF's, thus including JL's salary and severance?



He was an employee of Disney and his salary and benefits are not paid by the members. We do pay a set fee to the company that manages the DVC for us but we wouldn't directly pay him anything.

 Bill


----------



## sgtdisney

Ding dong, the witch is dead?    Sorry, but this is good news to me.   I am a long time owner, since 1992.  In my opinion too many things have changed since JL's tenure, and most were not for the better.   While I suppose it _could_ get worse, I really am hoping it will get better.  

Now, my question is this.   Will we get our peach bath towels and placemats and cloth napkins back?


----------



## Oglet

disneynutz said:


> He was an employee of Disney and his salary and benefits are not paid by the members. We do pay a set fee to the company that manages the DVC for us but we wouldn't directly pay him anything.
> 
> Bill



Are you really sure about that, reason I ask is because of something I experienced while working as a store manager for a large company.

My Salary was paid  by corporate office however It was also classified as labor on my P&L reports which my store had to absorb and factor in each month.

Would it not be fair to say that although Disney is technically paying him it is a possibility that DVC had allocated his salary into their operating expenses? If that is the case then a good argument could be made that DVC members did fund his paycheck.




sgtdisney said:


> Now, my question is this.   Will we get our peach bath towels and placemats and cloth napkins back?



Nope, they are going on the new Monorail Peach Party train.


----------



## quirty30

Darn.  I was really hoping to see Jim Lewis on a future episode of "Undercover Boss."


----------



## Shadeaux

sgtdisney said:


> Ding dong, the witch is dead?



LOL, that was the exact thing that went through my mind when I first read the news. We've been members since '94 and have been seriously thinking about selling our points due to some of the "enhancements" that have been put in place since JL came into the picture. I think for now we're going to hold off and see what happens. 

We can blame a lot of stuff on Jim Lewis, but I think he's off the hook for the disappearance of the peach towels, placemats & cloth napkins.


----------



## Sammie

TisBit said:


> Very good post.  You will never please anyone and any changes will be met with resistance.  And if you don't change things, than they will complain that you aren't doing anything new.
> 
> As for everyone that is trying to figure out why JL was fired, you also have to remember it might have NOTHING to do with Hawaii, Member feedback or even HR issues.  He might have had a serious conflict of interest with another timeshare company, he may have embezzled a million dollars, he could have had an affair with someone in the office.  Point being, while so many here on the DIS hate him and thing he was the worst thing in the world.....WDW very well may have been forced to fire him for some offense that we will never know, but would have rather kept him around.



But if he did any of those things then he is not the best leader for DVC. I for one could care less about perks, even valet parking, discounted APs, free internet, which is not really free, we pay for it. etc, etc.

When I bought; I bought a time share I felt would be managed as well as Disney resorts or I would not have bought. I did not buy anything else and don't care if I don't get more.

But recently Disney resorts have looked alot better in housekeeping and maintenance than DVC. And I personally really feel that JL was more interested in the bottom line and how good it made him look than the product.

He cut costs at BLT, he cut costs at OKW and he was not concerned that it would last because he knew the members would be the ones to eventually have to pay for it. I can assure you, that you will never see repainted furniture at the Yacht Club. I don't buy that dues would have gone up, they went up anyway. I think he was obsessed with being the worst kind of penny pencher. One who is willing to throw the product under the bus to make himself look good. He wanted to get the President position at Disneyland. 

He ridiculed us and his employees and lost touch with those that worked for him and the membership. 

He lost his focus and it happened about the time he asked us to support his membership to the Timeshare Association. 

I know that everyone will never agree to all the changes DVC makes; it would be impossible. But those changes will be received better if delivered with the respect we deserve instead of the canned, based on Member Feedback and talked down to like we are simple minded.  

I have been a member since the 90s and not once have I been polled about anything.

And yes for a long time I have been disppointed in JL and much of it was based on the fact that I was privvy to what was going on behind the scenes.

Unless the format changes for Disney Files we should hear from the new President in the next issue. 

Considering I am sure the new President is already on the job, I think a nice move would be to announce it on the member site instead of waiting for Disney Files.


----------



## sznk

Tigger031266 said:


> I think Dee Vee Cee is how Jim Lewis views us. He sees us as middle age, overweight, load mouth, low IQ, happy folks. Rather insulting really.
> Would rather be the old guy from the movie "UP". At least he was an adventurer...


wow, seriously? all that hate for Dee Vee?  I couldn't agree LESS.


----------



## Spencerfamilynj

I guess this is why I can't log onto the DVC website.  Since I couldn't do that, I came to DIS (my next stop anyway).  Very surprised to read the news.  Was out of touch since we were traveling back from HHI.  Hope this isn't like The Who - "meet the new boss, same as the old boss."


----------



## DaveH

From what I have read the mess in Hawaii is enough for him to go. My guess the fines go to the sales side of DVD. I know there are issues at the resorts. I suspect some of them were done to keep the dues down. Was it wise? It seems not. I met the man once. I was asking things about DVC and he only wanted to talk about the newest resort to be sold. He seemed to talk down to us. It will be interesting to see what happens next.


----------



## Deb & Bill

All smart organizations have succession planning, so if they lose someone in the chain, there is someone to take that person's place. I'm sure Disney had someone in mind to step up to the position.  Even if it is an interim person to take over until the position is filled.


----------



## aan1701

sznk said:


> wow, seriously? all that hate for Dee Vee?  I couldn't agree LESS.



Yup, I have nothing but hate for Dee Vee Cee. I never want to see a person lose a job, especially in this economy, but I hope she goes too. I can't stand her.


----------



## Deb & Bill

aan1701 said:


> Yup, I have nothing but hate for Dee Vee Cee. I never want to see a person lose a job, especially in this economy, but I hope she goes too. I can't stand her.



She's probably a very lovely person in real life and I'm sure they will find a spot somewhere for her that doesn't require her to resume her Deevy Cee persona.  Lose the wig, the screech and the accent and she could still help sell DVC.


----------



## WebmasterDoc

Dee Vee Cee is a character - and the CM who plays her also has multiple other roles within Disney. Dee Vee Cee is a pretty minor role in the daily activities at WDW.

You can see the same actress on Main Street and also on Hollywood Blvd playing other roles - so rest assured that she still has a role at WDW whether some DVC members like the character or not.


----------



## rutgers1

A few thoughts:
1) Someone mentioned that they had never been polled about DVC. I was just at BWV a few weeks ago, and there was a woman polling people in the lobby. I am not sure what she was asking, but she was there. Also, don't they ask you to take a poll at the end of Member Services calls? Once again, I have never taken it, but I do recall it being there.

2) I don't like Deeveecee. Like others, I feel she reflects poorly on DVC and the people who are members. Although there are a few people here and there who like her, I would guess that the vast majority of members can't stand her. I can see why members would feel that Jim was out of touch by keeping her employed.

3) I don't like reading his columns in the Disney Files. I feel like I am reading something penned by a slickster politician. He doesn't have to sell anything to us or talk to us in a fake cheery condescending tone.

4) With all that said, I think that the people who complain about the condition of the DVC resorts are the same types who have been complaining that Disney overall has been doing downhill since the day it opened its doors. The resorts are high traffic resorts catering to families, so there are always going to be some bumps in the road. I have always found the DVC staff to be very attentive. Furthermore, I have never had a bad vacation. On top of that, members have long clamored for more vacationing options, so how can anyone be upset with the fact that new resorts have been going up right and left? 

5) I'm all for some constructive criticism. Like many of you, I paid money that I didn't necessarily have to DVC, and I often feel that I should get some extra perks in exchange for guaranteeing them a lifelong Disney visitor. Yet I feel that we should temper some of our criticisms. I think that some people tend to idealize the past, look at the present under a microscope, and get too upset when things don't meet their heightened Disney expectations.


----------



## Sammie

rutgers1 said:


> A few thoughts:
> 1) Someone mentioned that they had never been polled about DVC. I was just at BWV a few weeks ago, and there was a woman polling people in the lobby. I am not sure what she was asking, but she was there. Also, don't they ask you to take a poll at the end of Member Services calls? Once again, I have never taken it, but I do recall it being there.
> 
> 2) I don't like Deeveecee. Like others, I feel she reflects poorly on DVC and the people who are members. Although there are a few people here and there who like her, I would guess that the vast majority of members can't stand her. I can see why members would feel that Jim was out of touch by keeping her employed.
> 
> 3) I don't like reading his columns in the Disney Files. I feel like I am reading something penned by a slickster politician. He doesn't have to sell anything to us or talk to us in a fake cheery condescending tone.
> 
> *4) With all that said, I think that the people who complain about the condition of the DVC resorts are the same types who have been complaining that Disney overall has been doing downhill since the day it opened its doors. The resorts are high traffic resorts catering to families, so there are always going to be some bumps in the road. I have always found the DVC staff to be very attentive. Furthermore, I have never had a bad vacation.* On top of that, members have long clamored for more vacationing options, so how can anyone be upset with the fact that new resorts have been going up right and left?
> 
> 5) I'm all for some constructive criticism. Like many of you, I paid money that I didn't necessarily have to DVC, and I often feel that I should get some extra perks in exchange for guaranteeing them a lifelong Disney visitor. Yet I feel that we should temper some of our criticisms. I think that some people tend to idealize the past, look at the present under a microscope, and get too upset when things don't meet their heightened Disney expectations.



So if you got a dirty room that had multiple items broken you would be ok with that.  Or are you saying because you have been lucky enough not to experience it, it does not exist.


----------



## Donna DeVil

I took one of those polls at Boardwalk in July. I was pleased that they asked for my opinions, but I really didn't expect any action beyond that. I will be thrilled with the departure of JL if our customer service levels return to those of years past & we again are treated with a bit of respect instead of always getting lame excuses & attitude.

Things I complained about in that survey: 
1. messed up bill at checkout 
2. broken table in room
3. getting kicked out of the pool for not having a room key on me (Hubby was taking a nap in the room. my teenage daughter & I went for a quick dip before dinner. We gave the lifeguard our names & room number, but he made us leave because we didn't have a room key & proceeded to give us lip--"Just how do you intend to get back in your room?"!
4. no one said "Welcome Home"...the entire stay

I was a cast member back in 94 under Eisner. I know a lot of people hate him, but a cast member would have never gotten away with displaying the attitude of the lifeguard to guests. Period. I think Disney would do well to remember a bit of that. Here's hoping!


----------



## disneychic

I can't believe I missed this MAJOR news!  I am 1/2 tempted to wake my husband up and tell him that JL is finally gone from our beloved DVC!  Here's hoping we start to see some positive changes real soon!


----------



## sissy_ib

rutgers1 said:


> A few thoughts:
> 1) Someone mentioned that they had never been polled about DVC. I was just at BWV a few weeks ago, and there was a woman polling people in the lobby. I am not sure what she was asking, but she was there. Also, don't they ask you to take a poll at the end of Member Services calls? Once again, I have never taken it, but I do recall it being there.



I have never been polled in a resort so I don't know what kinds of questions are asked. Every time I am stopped in the parks it is demographic research. As for the surveys at the end of the calls, they are about the actual call not DVC in general. Generic questions like "was this the first time you called about this issue?" or "was your issue resolved today" and some questions about the CM you talked to.

After I stayed at Vero beach I got an email survey to fill out. That was over a year ago so I don't remember what the questions were but some were resort specific.


----------



## Ciciwoowoo

Corporate errors costing big $$$ demand a sacrificial lamb.

Jim Lewis is that sacrifice.


I don't believe that he would be let go for saving money by being cheap with things like furniture and a lack of valet.  The corporation would reward him for these moves.

Now that he is gone, they have a convenient scapegoat for said cuts.


----------



## Maistre Gracey

Ciciwoowoo said:


> Corporate errors costing big $$$ demand a sacrificial lamb.
> 
> Jim Lewis is that sacrifice.
> 
> 
> I don't believe that he would be let go for saving money by being cheap with things like furniture and a lack of valet.  The corporation would reward him for these moves.
> 
> Now that he is gone, they have a convenient scapegoat for said cuts.


Not so sure... After reading some thoughts from DVC cast members it seems like there was cause other than the Aulani fiasco (whatever that is).

MG


----------



## dozerdog

Sammie said:


> I could care less about perks, nice but not what I bought. I bought a timeshare that I expect to be clean and in working order when I check in. Lately that has not been the case.



Thanks for stating the obvious. We all just want that Disney quality we all thought we had purchased originally. I don't want the door knobs missing off the kitchen cupboards any more!!!!


----------



## Lil' Grumpy

since we're haven't been members for very long....i really don't know 
what to think . 

i guess the first reaction is : who's in charge now? 


i can't believe i am saying this, but i agree with sammie. 

we have used dvc for 3 trips, & no one has ever greeted us. but 
that wouldn't have matter if we were not lied too. (just over christmas, 
i took time out to visit their office. i haven't forgotten her lying & 
we will meet again.)  however, the point, is all about how 
"un-disney", the dvc, has been for us. if you read some of
the experiences we had over christmas, then it isn't shocking. 
( i still feel unsafe @ our home resort & i don't want to take our family 
there ever again. * i also read on the dis about others having credit
cards stolen & unauthorized personnel walking in. not even counting the 
"ladies" making sells. ) . blt is our home resort. 


i think mr. greydon is also right. all anyone has to do is read what
others been reporting to figure a "good house cleaning" is in order. 

we bought 3 contacts & our guide vanished after a medical problem.
however, the dvc office did not know he was out. right now , we
don't have a guide. if dvc offer to take back ours & make it "even",
we would. while the room savings are nice, all the problems
are not. maybe they might make make an offer to buy out new
members within a certain time frame?  

to me, his firing is the proof that dvc isn't "pro disney" to its members.
but our trust has been gone long before this.


----------



## sissy_ib

Lil' Grumpy said:


> ( i still feel unsafe @ our home resort & i don't want to take our family
> there ever again. * i also read on the dis about others having credit
> cards stolen & unauthorized personnel walking in. not even counting the
> "ladies" making sells. ) . blt is our home resort.



People also have CC info stolen at restaurants and stores all over the country. There was an issue a few weeks ago at Michaels Crafts stores. That has to do with one or two devious people not DVC as a whole. Who are the "unauthorized people"? Do you mean walking in to a room? I really don't understand most of your post.


----------



## Sammie

dozerdog said:


> Thanks for stating the obvious. We all just want that Disney quality we all thought we had purchased originally. I don't want the door knobs missing off the kitchen cupboards any more!!!!



In our last room we had a closet door fall on us. I am not talking about normal wear and tear, I am talking about rooms that are not being cleaned and maintained even to the standard that value rooms are.

There is something very wrong with that.


----------



## Maistre Gracey

Sammie said:


> In our last room we had a closet door fall on us. I am not talking about normal wear and tear, I am talking about rooms that are not being cleaned and maintained even to the standard that value rooms are.
> 
> There is something very wrong with that.


I agree. We have maintenance and housekeeping issues every time we stay. 
We don't mind paying top dollar for DVC, but I want top quality in return. 

I'm very happy Lewis is gone. 
MG


----------



## Tink2312

I'm a new member and have only stayed on my membership once. I guess I must have been lucky when I stayed at my home resort, BLT, in March as apart from a chip on the table I found no other maintenance issues. Having said that the one thing I was a little disappointed with was the experience with CM at the resort - no welcome home etc and the CM in BLT were very surley (sp?) and unhelpful (although the Contemp CM went above and beyond).
If this solves the issues mentioned then I'm glad, but I'm skeptical and can see JL being used as others have said, as a scapegoat for all the ills of DVC.
Funnily enough I was contacted by my guide only a few weeks ago to check if I was having any issues and whether I was enjoying my membership - wondering now if this was collating complaints data to use against JL??
Anyway, only time will tell if the replacement to JL will be able to fix what clearly seems broken - trust and satisfaction between DVC and its members.


----------



## Longhairbear

I am not going to D23, but a few DVC owners we know are. They'll be on the lookout for anything Aulani, or DVC. They might even ask about JL. I bet they hear nothing, but Aulani is scheduled to open very soon.


----------



## disneynutz

Tink2312 said:


> I'm a new member and have only stayed on my membership once. I guess I must have been lucky when I stayed at my home resort, BLT, in March as apart from a chip on the table I found no other maintenance issues. Having said that the one thing I was a little disappointed with was the experience with CM at the resort - no welcome home etc and the CM in BLT were very surley (sp?) and unhelpful (although the Contemp CM went above and beyond).
> If this solves the issues mentioned then I'm glad, but I'm skeptical and can see JL being used as others have said, as a scapegoat for all the ills of DVC.
> Funnily enough I was contacted by my guide only a few weeks ago to check if I was having any issues and whether I was enjoying my membership - wondering now if this was collating complaints data to use against JL??
> Anyway, only time will tell if the replacement to JL will be able to fix what clearly seems broken - trust and satisfaction between DVC and its members.



The CM's at the resorts do not work for the DVC, they work for Disney Parks and Resorts who is contracted by the DVC to provide resort services. They are almost like two different companies who don't really care for each other but they are stuck working together.

The call from your Guide was a common sales call, a way to see if you might want to buy more points.

 Bill


----------



## doconeill

Deb & Bill said:


> I guess you'll all have me to thank.  After the Deevy Cee issue of Disney Files, I sent a long letter to DVC.  That must have done the trick.
> 
> 
> (yeah, right)



Actually, it was probably me having to contact Member Services because I forgot to bank that one measly point I had by the deadline and asked them to bank it for me. In my defense, the online system was broken the day I tried, and then I forgot about it...

I'm sure between that and forcing them to reclassify rooms at AKL because of my complaint, I broke everything.


----------



## dianeschlicht

Maistre Gracey said:


> I agree. We have maintenance and housekeeping issues every time we stay.
> We don't mind paying top dollar for DVC, but I want top quality in return.
> 
> I'm very happy Lewis is gone.
> MG



Me too!  Unfortunately, the downturn in maintenance and quality is likely now in place enough, that it is the new "normal" and will be the starting point for whomever takes JL's place.  Remember, it will likely be the same team hiring his replacement as hired him.


----------



## WilsonFlyer

Does anybody else find it a little odd that this thread originated in "Operations" and was moved to "Mousecellaneous"? I can't imagine anything more Operations that JL being fired and if I were searching for information about his firing in the future, I would most certainly assume I would find such information, if it existed, in the Operations section of the board.


----------



## anniet

Maistre Gracey said:


> I agree. We have maintenance and housekeeping issues every time we stay.
> We don't mind paying top dollar for DVC, but I want top quality in return.
> 
> I'm very happy Lewis is gone.
> MG



Last time I worked at Wilderness Lodge I had a first...I had a member tell me his dues were TOO LOW!  He said if DVC can't keep the rooms at a Quality Level then they need to raise the dues to a level where they can.  He then went on to say JL is a nice guy but the wrong guy in the wrong position.


----------



## OrangeCountyCommuter

dianeschlicht said:


> Me too!  Unfortunately, the downturn in maintenance and quality is likely now in place enough, that it is the new "normal" and will be the starting point for whomever takes JL's place.  Remember, it will likely be the same team hiring his replacement as hired him.



Have you all stayed at the hotels?

This is the Disney standard and I don't think it's going to change.

That said my last few DVC units have been in excellent shape! 

Disney is not a hotel management company but thinks they are.  They have never had professional management and it shows.  My view is at least I am not paying $500 a night for their sub par hotel management and it's after effects.   

Disney thinks "dressing" the housekeepers is the "important" part.   They really believe that 'cute' is the most important quality (which is why thier "deluxe" hotels are 3 stars with a lot of rating agencies! )


----------



## TisBit

Sammie said:


> So if you got a dirty room that had multiple items broken you would be ok with that.  Or are you saying because you have been lucky enough not to experience it, it does not exist.



I am ok with finding minor issues in a room, as long as they are addressed when I call them in.  I don't just take pictures and post about it later on the DIS about how unacceptable it was (not saying you do, but some do).  

I have had some minor and major issues at DVC resorts that have irked me and after addressing it with the resort also followed up with MS.  But, I also understand that things happen and my vacation is rarely perfect at WDW or anywhere else for that matter.



dianeschlicht said:


> Me too!  Unfortunately, the downturn in maintenance and quality is likely now in place enough, that it is the new "normal" and will be the starting point for whomever takes JL's place.  Remember, it will likely be the same team hiring his replacement as hired him.




Very good point.  The new person may just try to keep the Status Quo and not make any changes, which can be as bad as someone that makes too many changes.  Hopefully the replacement will be great, but who knows.


----------



## OrlandoNative

Per Orlando Sentinel this morning, Jim Lewis fired Friday.


----------



## Bellecruiser

I was thrilled when Karl Holz became JL's boss. . To me, the value proposition of the cruise line (high quality, world class service, respect for their customer, a touch of magic, while being (very) profitable) is the heritage of Disney as a whole, and should be the value proposition for DVC also, IMO.  To me,  Karl's business unit exemplifies those principles (even with their growth problems), and he needs to DRIVE them back into DVC.   JL had moved toward the profit side and didn't have the vision and capability to keep the balance.  It sounds as though the Aulani fiasco is a prime example of that...get it open vs do it right.  I am glad he is gone, and whoever takes over better get things back on track.

Hopefully, whomever KH and Disney Corp choose as a successor will make it happen.  If they are smart they are reading these posts, and will pay attention to what their customers want. Like everyone else, I will be watching, and hoping  that DVC moves forward seeking to regain it's balance and niche 
as a very special timeshare.


----------



## jimmytammy

nunzia said:


> So far I like Iger..sems to do OK and no huge blunders..I didn't agree with Cook leaving and so far under the new guy (Ross?) the jury is out.
> I loved Eisner when he came in..Read Storming the Magic Kingdom..fascinating and you can thank Roy and that group for saving the entire company. At the end I was in the group formed by Roy to oust him. Sad, really..I think after Frank Wells died things changed quickly for the worse. Remember, Eisner was botching up things with Pixar..final straw for me. I'm thankful under Iger for the Pixar purchase and so far seems like decent leadership, starting with putting the Walt-esque Lassiter at the helm of so much.



I was part of Roys group too.  Those were turbulent times, but the people spoke and the Co. finally listened.


----------



## Maistre Gracey

OrangeCountyCommuter said:


> Disney thinks "dressing" the housekeepers is the "important" part.   They really believe that 'cute' is the most important quality (which is why thier "deluxe" hotels are 3 stars with a lot of rating agencies! )


Carrying the theme through to the housekeepers is indeed very important to the overall experience. 
That said, I want a clean room. Even 3 star resorts are expected to be spotless. 

MG


----------



## Flossbolna

Just wanted to add a thought about Karl Holtz. He once was responsible for Disneyland Paris and during his time the resort had the worst decline in maintenance. I know that DCL is very popular and supposedly well run, but if I understand correctly he took over from the previous managers who supposedly were really great. So I really would not assume that Karl Holtz is only wonderful and that his new position will mean only good things for DVC. At least is tenure at Disneyland Paris is not considered a success at all by most fans of that park.


----------



## CarolAnnC

WilsonFlyer said:


> Does anybody else find it a little odd that this thread originated in "Operations" and was moved to "Mousecellaneous"? I can't imagine anything more Operations that JL being fired and if I were searching for information about his firing in the future, I would most certainly assume I would find such information, if it existed, in the Operations section of the board.



FYI, in the future please pm or email the board moderators with this type of query, as it is not appropriate to place in a thread on the boards.

Since it has been out here a while, I am placing below the DVC Board descriptions for both Operations and Mousecellaneous as a "refresher" for you.  Keep in mind, when the thread began, there was NO official confirmation, it was a rumor and speculation thread.  It will remain on this board however and will be the "official" thread for discussing the topic of Jim Lewis being terminated.  Thank you.

DVC OPERATIONS

*The DVC Operations Board is the place to discuss Disney Vacation Club ownership (membership) benefits, policies and statistics  Essentially any information contained in the Vacation Planner and POS.* 

DVC MOUSECELLANEOUS

The DVC Mousecellaneous Board is the place for discussions about DVC related topics not specific to DVC operations, DVC vacation planning, or Renting/Trading DVC reservations or points. This is the place to post "Welcome Homes" and other congratulations, trip countdowns, room and trip reports,* DVC rumors and speculations,* DVC special events (cruises, member get togethers, ride/attraction previews), member discounts and perks, other Disney perks and how they related to DVC members (DDE, Dining Plan, etc). These discussions are welcome here. Any threads/topics not DVC specific will either be moved to the appropriate DIS forum, or will be closed.


----------



## KevGuy

All I can say about JL is good, he got what he deserved. I love DVC and have always had a great experience evey stay thank goodness, but the downward trend has been very apparent the last few years.


----------



## WilsonFlyer

I'm sorry Carol. I sincerely apologize. It wasn't meant as a criticism at all. I Was just wondering. I am sincerely sorry if it offended anyone.


----------



## sgtdisney

Shadeaux said:


> We can blame a lot of stuff on Jim Lewis, but I think he's off the hook for the disappearance of the peach towels, placemats & cloth napkins.



HAHA!   Well, I can try right?     Of course the peach towels and green napkins won't fit in too well with the new color scheme in the redone OKW units....


----------



## anniet

dianeschlicht said:


> Me too!  Unfortunately, the downturn in maintenance and quality is likely now in place enough, that it is the new "normal" and will be the starting point for whomever takes JL's place.  Remember, it will likely be the same team hiring his replacement as hired him.



Doubt it since there were so many changes above him.  I would like to see the quality of the member experience improved and the cuts made within.  I can tell you that DVC spends LOTS of money on trying to make the sale.  This was a bone of contention with me and A LOT of other cast members when I worked there.  I would send GOOD tours over to the Open House and I had a 25-30% conversion rate, but I was barely making my goals...why?  Cuz I wasn't going to send someone who clearly had no interest over to tour just so I could make a buck.  On the other hand DVC has recently been in the habit of hiring people from other timeshares who send a lot of tours over to the sales center and they have a 7-12% conversion rate.  They are making a lot of money for themselves, but not a lot of money for DVC.  

Couple that with a down economy, yet they kept pushing people through the Preview Center turnstiles,  a 50%plus turnover rate in ASAs and the costs of training everyone who comes through that revolving door, keeping locations open that some ASAs don't want to work because they are practically impossible to book a legitimate tour....believe me...THERE ARE PLENTY OF PLACES to cut costs before they need to downgrade the quality of the rooms AGAIN....and I only saw what could be cut in the ASA area...I can only imagine what other big chunks of fat are in the operating system.


----------



## hacknsuit

What am I misssing?  Why is he so disliked?  and now that he's gone, how is that better for us?


----------



## wrighter

Having read this thread in its entirety, I must admit that as a fairly new DVC member I was unaware of the details behind the JL regime.  Am glad to have my eyes open, and will be watching for updates.  

Thanks to all those who have posted here with personal knowledge and experiences.  Here's to moving forward with hope in our beloved DVC!


----------



## goofystitch

anniet said:


> Doubt it since there were so many changes above him.  I would like to see the quality of the member experience improved and the cuts made within.  I can tell you that DVC spends LOTS of money on trying to make the sale.  This was a bone of contention with me and A LOT of other cast members when I worked there.  I would send GOOD tours over to the Open House and I had a 25-30% conversion rate, but I was barely making my goals...why?  Cuz I wasn't going to send someone who clearly had no interest over to tour just so I could make a buck.  On the other hand DVC has recently been in the habit of hiring people from other timeshares who send a lot of tours over to the sales center and they have a 7-12% conversion rate.  They are making a lot of money for themselves, but not a lot of money for DVC.
> 
> Couple that with a down economy, yet they kept pushing people through the Preview Center turnstiles,  a 50%plus turnover rate in ASAs and the costs of training everyone who comes through that revolving door, keeping locations open that some ASAs don't want to work because they are practically impossible to book a legitimate tour....believe me...THERE ARE PLENTY OF PLACES to cut costs before they need to downgrade the quality of the rooms AGAIN....and I only saw what could be cut in the ASA area...I can only imagine what other big chunks of fat are in the operating system.



DVC has indeed hired people from other timeshares - the sleazier the better. These people have conversion rates much lower than 7%, and you're right - they are laughing all the way to the bank while the ASAs that are trying to do the right thing by bringing in people who truly want to learn about DVC are getting the shaft. Maybe if JL's replacement realizes what sets DVC apart from other timeshares, then things will get better for everyone.


----------



## TisBit

hacknsuit said:


> What am I misssing?  Why is he so disliked?  and now that he's gone, how is that better for us?



In a nutshell, Jim Lewis was in charge of DVC during a great deal of change.  Many people blame him for some perks that were lost, policy changes, etc.  As the leader of the ship it is usually a correct assumption, but I also temper that with the fact that many people blame Iger for everything now, Eisner before him was destroying disney and Roy was dragging Walts legacy through the mud before that.  

There will always be people that dislike change and will blame the leader and say he is incompetent.  But, in the business world, you are given specific criteria for the job and it is possible that he was also under a great deal of pressure to increase revenues as well.


----------



## hauntedcity

As a new member, I had idea I was buying into a situation so exciting and DRAMATIC!  I'm about halfway through this topic, but I'm going to make some popcorn to enjoy the rest of the story.  

Oh, the drama!


----------



## Deb & Bill

sgtdisney said:


> HAHA!   Well, I can try right?     Of course the peach towels and green napkins won't fit in too well with the new color scheme in the redone OKW units....



No, the peach towels will still fit right in.  They didn't do anything it the bathrooms except repaint the pickeled wall.


----------



## Steamboat WillyNilly

TisBit said:


> The disgruntledness from the members to me is a lot like the normal people at WDW that say "it was so much better when....".  A lot of people want to remember a time when things were just rosy and great, but a lot of times that is more imagination vs reality.  In a members "honeymoon" phase of owning DVC, they are always going to be happier, but as years go by and things change, they will start complaining.



This statement is unfair. It's like labeling an entire group racist yet there is only a couple people. 
I've been a member since '97 and have loved coming here almost every year since '93. I come because I love Disney but I have noticed our perks becoming less and less. I miss the free valet, 10% off at the Disney store and some others. The new banking policy doesn't bother me but if what he said was true on why it was implemented, then I'm glad to see him go.

 I was on last years SSMC and found it not to be as much fun as the very first one that I went on in '03. Friends we met last year said the "Freebies" every night became more and more cheap and they were using the same "Freebie" ideas and cruise names that were used on SSMCs prior. 
With all the imaginative power behind Disney you would think that these "little things" would keep getting better and better! The only reasons they wouldn't would be OPERATING ON THE CHEAP and A DISASSOCIATION WITH HOW YOU GOT THERE! You need to keep your base happy in order to grow!!!! Word of mouth is KEY! I have walked by many a DVC kiosk and have overheard the conversation and hesitation of people and told them to just go, that it isn't a high pressure sales pitch and that it is fun getting all the info. I've persuaded quite a few over the years.

That's my 2 cents from a non insider. The "Magic" has dissipated for some time now and it would be better to have "The Best Kept Secret" than "Hey, I Wanna Talk To You bout Something". Here's to hoping things get back on the right track!


----------



## jimmytammy

anniet said:


> Doubt it since there were so many changes above him.  I would like to see the quality of the member experience improved and the cuts made within.  I can tell you that DVC spends LOTS of money on trying to make the sale.  This was a bone of contention with me and A LOT of other cast members when I worked there.  I would send GOOD tours over to the Open House and I had a 25-30% conversion rate, but I was barely making my goals...why?  Cuz I wasn't going to send someone who clearly had no interest over to tour just so I could make a buck.  On the other hand DVC has recently been in the habit of hiring people from other timeshares who send a lot of tours over to the sales center and they have a 7-12% conversion rate.  They are making a lot of money for themselves, but not a lot of money for DVC.
> 
> Couple that with a down economy, yet they kept pushing people through the Preview Center turnstiles,  a 50%plus turnover rate in ASAs and the costs of training everyone who comes through that revolving door, keeping locations open that some ASAs don't want to work because they are practically impossible to book a legitimate tour....believe me...THERE ARE PLENTY OF PLACES to cut costs before they need to downgrade the quality of the rooms AGAIN....and I only saw what could be cut in the ASA area...I can only imagine what other big chunks of fat are in the operating system.



I can speak on Annies behalf, and I dont feel she would have a problem at this point with me doing so, considering our friendship, she saw 1st hand, as an owner, as a CM, where things were going wrong. She was not a disgruntled CM, she truly had legit reasons for her concern. So many times, it seems we write CMs off as such, but she truly loved her job. We kept in confidence her concerns, but all the while watched more carefully, rather than as an owner in bliss, but as a concerned one. And she truly means what she says about not sending folks who would truly struggle to pay for DVC over to tour just to get her money.  

 I was truly concerned where OKW owners were being effected, because it meant us owners of later built resorts were next in line for the cuts where they come in refurbs, etc.  

Im not one to jump on the bandwagon unless I truly feel change needs to come, I am human, I dont like change.  But this is a case of it is broke, it needs fixing!  Lewis did wrong, knowingly, he needed to go.  Now our beloved DVC is vunerable to the critics.  But we will prevail.  I have no doubt. 

 Hopes are they will weed out the slime that is the norm among timeshare people, and get DVC back to its right place, at the top!!

Annie, thanks for revealing what you saw.  It allows us that glimpse inside, helps us to be more mindful of not allowing our investment to become just another timeshare Annie, I hope more like you come along and become CMs, Disney in general, and its guests will be all the better for it!!


----------



## jimmytammy

hauntedcity said:


> As a new member, I had idea I was buying into a situation so exciting and DRAMATIC!  I'm about halfway through this topic, but I'm going to make some popcorn to enjoy the rest of the story.
> 
> Oh, the drama!



Dont get scared off.  I can imagine how I would feel if I was a new owner and seeing all this unfold.  We are passionate about our DVC and our home resorts, but we unite when wrong is cast upon us.  Stand strong with us, and BTW, Welcome Home!!


----------



## Deb & Bill

hacknsuit said:


> What am I misssing?  Why is he so disliked?  and now that he's gone, how is that better for us?





TisBit said:


> In a nutshell, Jim Lewis was in charge of DVC during a great deal of change.  Many people blame him for some perks that were lost, policy changes, etc.  As the leader of the ship it is usually a correct assumption, but I also temper that with the fact that many people blame Iger for everything now, Eisner before him was destroying disney and Roy was dragging Walts legacy through the mud before that.
> 
> There will always be people that dislike change and will blame the leader and say he is incompetent.  But, in the business world, you are given specific criteria for the job and it is possible that he was also under a great deal of pressure to increase revenues as well.



Even moreso, there was a complete lack of communication with members regarding policy changes.  Most of the time it was found out by rumors which were discovered to not be rumors but fact.  There was the dumbing down of procedures to make it easier on the membership (changes to banking which was already discussed, calling to make a reservation changing from the last day of your trip to make it equal for all members to calling from the first day of your trip - all at 11 or 7 months out).  Supposedly, the reservation change was made to reduce calls to MS.  But if you want to book eight nights or more, you still have to call multiple times to book those stays.  

Vacation Magic, a delightful little quarterly magazine for members, suddenly became the Disney Files, a stupid rag about everything Disney and almost nothing about DVC.

Deevy See, need we say more??

I still remember his column in Disney Files talking about the wonderful member who sent him a letter/called him/met him in person who told him he took the time to check out his villa to report damage/missing items/etc and that JL thought all members should do that instead of requiring the staff to make sure the villa was ready to be occupied.

He went from VP of DVC to President of DVC for some unknown reason.   When he did that, suddenly there was a mass mailing to all members about his leadership in the Timeshare industry organization (see, made such a big impact on me that I don't remember the name) recommending sending cash to the organization. 

The logo.  Yuck. 

Free valet parking was a loss to members, but it wasn't because of anything that happened at DVC.  It was a loss because it wasn't free anymore.  There was a fee that had to be paid with the new contract and you could either pay for it with dues or when you park your car.  I'm not holding that one against him.

Under his leadership, DVC went from an exciting Disney product to the same old timeshare stuff.  Build, build, build and forget about the existing properties. 

Yes, it was time for JL to leave.


----------



## minnie6895

> 4) With all that said, I think that the people who complain about the condition of the DVC resorts are the same types who have been complaining that Disney overall has been doing downhill since the day it opened its doors. The resorts are high traffic resorts catering to families, so there are always going to be some bumps in the road. I have always found the DVC staff to be very attentive. Furthermore, I have never had a bad vacation. On top of that, members have long clamored for more vacationing options, so how can anyone be upset with the fact that new resorts have been going up right and left?



I disagree with "the people who complain about the condition of the DVC resorts are the same type who have been complaining that Disney overall has been going downhill since the day it opened it's doors."  
We love all of our trips to Disney and have always left exellent responses to most questions if we got a survey when we got home.  This was not the case after our trip last month.  We own and stayed at BLT.  The room was not at all up to par.  The air intake in the bedroom was filthy. Gobs of dust on it. Didn't appear to have been touched since BLT opened, it was that bad.  The balcony wasn't much better.  There were several other things as well, but my point being that it was not acceptable.  We were supposed to bring friends with us that were unable to come at the last minute. I was thankful because I would have been so embarassed after going on and on about how wonderful BLT is.  We have had several things we have overlooked during our DVC stays (and it has seemed to go downhill over the last several years), because we love it.


----------



## lockedoutlogic

My 2 lincolns is....

DVC is on the "decline"...and will stay in the decline going forward because - frankly - the economy is still crap.

All the talk, projections, pundits, and politics hasn't proven anything.  The United States (and the EU...for that matter) is on a path of decline/ stagnation because they have no production resources...only "sales".

But that's neither here nor there...the important thing is that in a down period for economic growth or losses...travel is the FIRST thing to suffer.  It's completely discretionary and the "pain" of eliminating it is minimal.

DVC had to suffer for the last five years...it was unavoidable.  it seems to do better than I would have expected...all things considered.

So if lewis was fired due to not "reaching goals" then that's just stupid.  There's no way to sustain a travel entity without losses or cuts or stagnation in such an economic climate.  WDW's struggles with discounts being a good piece of evidence to this fact.

But this has the potential to get WAAYYYY worse.
God knows what glorified slash and burner they plop into this title now...it could be much worse.

But this is another example of just how poisonous the corparate culture is:  disney threw up 1000 units at saratoga practically overnight...didn't put much in the way of amenity into it...and stood there and took visa payments in the tens of thousands of dollars for contracts to those that didn't have the resources...the same who probably were borrowing subprime back at home.

They made their gravy for five years and now will whine when it's thined out a little bit.

Such is the corporate vulture...no meat shall be left on the bones.


----------



## jarestel

Regardless of any specific reason for Jim Lewis' dismissal, as a relatively long term DVC member, I view this as an opportunity for DVC to get better. Truthfully, they weren't getting better under the stewardship of JL, just more generic. As in "just another timeshare".

For the "be careful what you wish for" crowd, I'm not concerned that Disney will conduct an active search for someone to do a worse job than JL. I expect they have already identified a candidate - or candidates - they anticipate will perform on a higher level for both DVC and the membership in general.

So, in the glow of the recent change, I'm cautiously optimistic that better DVC days lie ahead for all of us. But as always, time will tell.


----------



## JimC

Interesting times and fascinating thread.  Four points come to mind at the moment.

It strikes me that a public firing of an executive is a rare event.  He is being held accountable for something and Disney wanted and/or needed to signal that in a very direct way.  Of all the mentioned reasons for his departure, the Aulani issues seem to best explain the how and why of this event.

There are likely others who share responsibility for whatever happened and those will probably not get the public treatment.  Hopefully there will be much learned and changes made to prevent a recurrence.

A good employee who makes a serious error in judgment, even a costly one, is often counseled and put back in the game.  But there are lines that cannot be crossed without serious repercussions, and this appears to be one of those times.

Disney has a great heritage and a unique brand.  Our visits over three plus decades have brought much fun and the CMs deserve a serious portion of the credit for that.  I'm not blind to the challenges and issues that exist, or the "value" concerns others raise.  Just trying to keep it in perspective that overall we continue to enjoy our time with Disney.


----------



## ReneeandLori1226

I am really enjoying reading all the points everyone is making. DP and I love our membership and we are very interested in seeing what happens next.


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## wbl2745

What's not to like?

(Sorry, I couldn't resist...)


----------



## TisBit

Steamboat WillyNilly said:


> This statement is unfair. It's like labeling an entire group racist yet there is only a couple people.
> I've been a member since '97 and have loved coming here almost every year since '93. I come because I love Disney but I have noticed our perks becoming less and less. I miss the free valet, 10% off at the Disney store and some others. The new banking policy doesn't bother me but if what he said was true on why it was implemented, then I'm glad to see him go.
> 
> I was on last years SSMC and found it not to be as much fun as the very first one that I went on in '03. Friends we met last year said the "Freebies" every night became more and more cheap and they were using the same "Freebie" ideas and cruise names that were used on SSMCs prior.
> With all the imaginative power behind Disney you would think that these "little things" would keep getting better and better! The only reasons they wouldn't would be OPERATING ON THE CHEAP and A DISASSOCIATION WITH HOW YOU GOT THERE! You need to keep your base happy in order to grow!!!! Word of mouth is KEY! I have walked by many a DVC kiosk and have overheard the conversation and hesitation of people and told them to just go, that it isn't a high pressure sales pitch and that it is fun getting all the info. I've persuaded quite a few over the years.
> 
> That's my 2 cents from a non insider. The "Magic" has dissipated for some time now and it would be better to have "The Best Kept Secret" than "Hey, I Wanna Talk To You bout Something". Here's to hoping things get back on the right track!



Not really unfair.  Under Jim Lewis there were a lot of changes that came about that the membership generally did not like.  Jim Lewis took the blame for them, rightly or wrongly, he was the captain of the ship.  

What you quoted from me, that my opinion was a lot of the disgruntleness with the changes do fall into that categorey of constant complaints about how WDW is going downhill under its current leadership.  Some of the changes were good business sense and kept dues lower....and some of them I didn't understand, but also don't have all the information to really pass judgement.  I did not label Jim Lewis as the greatest leader ever and hope that some of the problems were due to him and now there will be a fresh start.  



JimC said:


> Interesting times and fascinating thread.  Four points come to mind at the moment.
> 
> It strikes me that a public firing of an executive is a rare event.  He is being held accountable for something and Disney wanted and/or needed to signal that in a very direct way.  Of all the mentioned reasons for his departure, the Aulani issues seem to best explain the how and why of this event.
> 
> There are likely others who share responsibility for whatever happened and those will probably not get the public treatment.  Hopefully there will be much learned and changes made to prevent a recurrence.
> 
> A good employee who makes a serious error in judgment, even a costly one, is often counseled and put back in the game.  But there are lines that cannot be crossed without serious repercussions, and this appears to be one of those times.
> 
> Disney has a great heritage and a unique brand.  Our visits over three plus decades have brought much fun and the CMs deserve a serious portion of the credit for that.  I'm not blind to the challenges and issues that exist, or the "value" concerns others raise.  Just trying to keep it in perspective that overall we continue to enjoy our time with Disney.



I completely agree about the public firing of an executive.  As I posted in another thread, I don't even see Aulani being the sole reason for his dismissal.  That issue has been going on for a month now, why would they fire him this week.  Usually, there will be a big shake up and than the head of the organization would be re-assigned somewhere else.  Jim Lewis has had a long history with WDW and for them to cut him off completely without even an opportunity to resign, I think there was something bigger that came about that broke the trust with WDW.  But as I said before, we will likely never know due to confidentiality agreements, etc.  WDW will just let everyone believe it was Aulani (or it will come out that the Aulani issue isn't that big of deal and was a legal mumble jumbo problem that Hawaii and WDW Legal messed up on) and we won't know what really happened.


----------



## lockedoutlogic

I haven't been following the issues with the Oahu development very closely...but i gotta say the fact there are issues is not suprising.

I would love to go to a DVC in Hawaii...but i think they jumped the gun on building there.

It seems to me that they need to build more of a "non-themepark" market niche for DVC in other, more reasonable locations than shooting for islands in the pacific.

And i don't think Vero Beach or Hilton Head exactly has the muscle to pull off the foundation.

But speaking of Hawaii - who exactly are they selling this too?
It sure isn't New Jersey - unlike all the other developments to this point...it ain't chicago...or even california...and it sure as heck isn't London...

Then who should be buying?

Ohhh...that's right...the Japanese.  Those who vacationed in Hawaii during their boom years from 1960-1989.
But I think they might have overstepped this one a little.
And of course...it's conveniently located not too far from their new best friends - the chinese.  But are they buying?

They tried to get off the launching pad too fast - in my opinion.

They should've built the Polynesian DVC - instead of the real thing

(they will - of course - in not too long of a time...bet on that selling out quickly and being booked during christmas week!)


----------



## bobbiwoz

TisBit said:


> ...
> Jim Lewis has had a long history with WDW ....



DH asked me how JL came to lead DVC.  Where in the organization was he?


----------



## doconeill

bobbiwoz said:


> DH asked me how JL came to lead DVC.  Where in the organization was he?



He was with Public Affairs prior to taking over DVC in 2003. 

There was some guide, not sure who it was (not mine), or maybe it was an ASA, who told me it was Lewis that convinced Eisner that DVC could really work because Eisner didn't think so. However, I'm not sure that could be true given the time frame...unless he talked Eisner into giving him the job...


----------



## Horace Horsecollar

doconeill said:


> He was with Public Affairs prior to taking over DVC in 2003.
> 
> There was some guide, not sure who it was (not mine), or maybe it was an ASA, who told me it was Lewis that convinced Eisner that DVC could really work because Eisner didn't think so. However, I'm not sure that could be true given the time frame...unless he talked Eisner into giving him the job...


The Eisner story is highly unlikely.

The first DVC resort, Disney's Old Key West Resort (originally simply called Disney Vacation Club Resort), opened in December 1991. That means that the go-ahead for it was given some time around 1989, with DVC feasibility studies probably starting several years before then -- long before Disney hired Jim Lewis.

Jim Lewis joined Disney in 1996 as Director of Planning and Finance for Walt Disney Attractions. In that capacity, Lewis was undoubtedly involved with later DVC resorts.


----------



## sgtdisney

Deb & Bill said:


> No, the peach towels will still fit right in.  They didn't do anything it the bathrooms except repaint the pickeled wall.



Come to think of it, you're right.  The same 20 year old tile and peach walls.   Hmm.   Now I really want my peach towels back!  

Hearing of all these stories from Cast Members and Club members related to Jim Lewis, I just keep imagining him sitting in his office (ivory tower) and saying "Let them eat cake" when referring to the DVC members....


----------



## doconeill

Horace Horsecollar said:


> The Eisner story is highly unlikely.
> 
> The first DVC resort, Disney's Old Key West Resort (originally simply called Disney Vacation Club Resort), opened in December 1991. That means that the go-ahead for it was given some time around 1989, with DVC feasibility studies probably starting several years before then -- long before Disney hired Jim Lewis.
> 
> Jim Lewis joined Disney in 1996 as Director of Planning and Finance for Walt Disney Attractions. In that capacity, Lewis was undoubtedly involved with later DVC resorts.



Oh, I admit knowing what I know now, it is highly suspect...but it wasn't that he founded DVC or anything, but supposedly convinced Eisner that it could work (presumably better than it had been) - but then again, everything prior to SSR was open at that point.


----------



## Sammie

I personally do not think hiring Jim was a bad idea, at first he was very much in tune with the membership. Eisner was the same way. Sadly some people in positions of power forget who helped them get there. 

As to the decline of the rooms being a Disney standard I have to disagree. During out last trip we stayed at the Yacht Club and our room was far and away much nicer than our DVC room. Better carpeting, better bedding including mattress, extremely well maintained. Yes there was the usual wear and tear that a hotel room gets but you could tell they had come in and made an attempt to repair those issues. DVC lets it go until it literally falls on you. 

Now if for some reason DVC rooms are abused more than the hotel rooms that needs to be addressed and make those doing the damage pay to put it back right.


----------



## Laurabearz

Just seeing this now... Wow...


----------



## photobob

Laurabearz said:


> Just seeing this now... Wow...



Me too!


----------



## DeeCee735

just seeing this as well, can someone do a quick recap? is it true? when did he get the boot and who is replacing him?

any info is very appreciated...


----------



## Donna DeVil

Sammie said:


> Now if for some reason DVC rooms are abused more than the hotel rooms that needs to be addressed and make those doing the damage pay to put it back right.



I wonder about this, too. We stayed at GC resort room in 2010. Beautiful! Perfect!

It seems unlikely that we, the people who ultimately pay for it, are the ones destroying our DVC rooms & stealing the kitchen utensils & towels. It would be interesting to know if the points-based reservations are responsible or the cash-based.


----------



## JimMIA

I read the entire thread, and am happy to be up to speed with what's going on.

Overall, a very good thing for DVC, I think.


----------



## Oglet

wbl2745 said:


> What's not to like?
> 
> (Sorry, I couldn't resist...)



She is kinda hot


----------



## Deb & Bill

Oglet said:


> She is kinda hot



Let me be the first to offer the name of a good optometrist.


----------



## dianeschlicht

jimmytammy said:


> I can speak on Annies behalf, and I dont feel she would have a problem at this point with me doing so, considering our friendship, she saw 1st hand, as an owner, as a CM, where things were going wrong. She was not a disgruntled CM, she truly had legit reasons for her concern. So many times, it seems we write CMs off as such, but she truly loved her job. We kept in confidence her concerns, but all the while watched more carefully, rather than as an owner in bliss, but as a concerned one. And she truly means what she says about not sending folks who would truly struggle to pay for DVC over to tour just to get her money.
> 
> I was truly concerned where OKW owners were being effected, because it meant us owners of later built resorts were next in line for the cuts where they come in refurbs, etc.
> 
> Im not one to jump on the bandwagon unless I truly feel change needs to come, I am human, I dont like change.  But this is a case of it is broke, it needs fixing!  Lewis did wrong, knowingly, he needed to go.  Now our beloved DVC is vunerable to the critics.  But we will prevail.  I have no doubt.
> 
> Hopes are they will weed out the slime that is the norm among timeshare people, and get DVC back to its right place, at the top!!
> 
> Annie, thanks for revealing what you saw.  It allows us that glimpse inside, helps us to be more mindful of not allowing our investment to become just another timeshare Annie, I hope more like you come along and become CMs, Disney in general, and its guests will be all the better for it!!


Very well put, but Annie and JimmyTammy.  

I too HOPE that we get this ship righted, but I'm probably less confident that we can go back to what it was pre-JL.  I think too much time and water has passed over the dam for that.


----------



## Hunclemarco

wbl2745 said:


> What's not to like?
> 
> (Sorry, I couldn't resist...)



I never had a problem with her as Dee Vee Cee...but if they do get rid of the character, i hope they keep her as part of the Disney team.

As far as Jim Lewis...he seemed very political to me, and hope that someone with a true love of disney takes his place.


----------



## Grumpy Grandma

Deb & Bill said:


> Let me be the first to offer the name of a good optometrist.


----------



## dianeschlicht

jarestel said:


> Regardless of any specific reason for Jim Lewis' dismissal, as a relatively long term DVC member, I view this as an opportunity for DVC to get better. Truthfully, they weren't getting better under the stewardship of JL, just more generic. As in "just another timeshare".
> 
> For the "be careful what you wish for" crowd, I'm not concerned that Disney will conduct an active search for someone to do a worse job than JL. I expect they have already identified a candidate - or candidates - they anticipate will perform on a higher level for both DVC and the membership in general.
> 
> So, in the glow of the recent change, I'm cautiously optimistic that better DVC days lie ahead for all of us. But as always, time will tell.



From your lips to DVC's ear!!!


----------



## Mickey'sApprentice

Oglet said:


> She is kinda hot



Ya know...I remember ladies in my hometown making themselves up like Deevee....in 1975!!


----------



## nickspace

These boards are filled with so much complaining that it has to turn many people off from buying into DVC. Word of mouth really is powerful and complaining is very harmful and that complaining will continue unless DVC makes changes that please DVC members. It would a good investment for Disney to keep its most committed consumers happy. The ripple effect of complaining shows up on the bottom line of the financial reports without a doubt. Negative word of mouth will cost you much more than you can gain by cutting this and that.

So if Disney thinks we are a done deal because we have committed ourselves to a lifetime of Disney vacations and they have nothing to gain from keeping us as happy consumers they are wrong. Throwing us a few really good bones will go a long, long way.


----------



## dianeschlicht

DeeCee735 said:


> just seeing this as well, can someone do a quick recap? is it true? when did he get the boot and who is replacing him?
> 
> any info is very appreciated...



Please do your own homework and read the thread.  It isn't fair to bog the thread down with recaps at this late point in the game.


----------



## JimMIA

DeeCee735 said:


> just seeing this as well, can someone do a quick recap? is it true? when did he get the boot and who is replacing him?
> 
> any info is very appreciated...


Jim Lewis, the President of DVC, was fired on Friday.


----------



## Deb & Bill

nickspace said:


> ...One of the biggest grips has been free dining that we are not privy to enjoy. That rubs DVC members the wrong way. So if Disney thinks we are a done deal because we have committed ourselves to a lifetime of Disney vacations and they have nothing to gain from keeping us as happy consumers they are wrong. Throwing us a few really good bones will go a long, long way.



You forget that free dining is just a way to fill empty rooms.  DVC rooms aren't empty.  And they aren't going to give free dining for stays on points.


----------



## dianeschlicht

JimMIA said:


> Jim Lewis, the President of DVC, was fired on Friday.


LOL!  Yep, that's it in a nutshell!  Too bad it took us 18 plus pages to come back to that!


----------



## nickspace

Deb & Bill said:


> You forget that free dining is just a way to fill empty rooms.  DVC rooms aren't empty.  And they aren't going to give free dining for stays on points.



I understand that but it still had a negative effect on many DVC member.


----------



## dianeschlicht

nickspace said:


> I understand that but it still had a negative effect on many DVC member.


Not me.


----------



## Donna DeVil

Walt believed in exceeding expectations. Those of us who have been members for quite a while were well schooled in what to expect: clean, beautiful, well-kept rooms; great customer service; exciting vacation options; and being part of something special. From what I have been reading on this thread, it has been a while since Disney even met those expectations, much less exceeded them.

A quote from Walt himself (regarding Disneyland):
_"Disneyland is a work of love.  We didn't go into Disneyland just with the idea of making money. . . even trying to keep that Park clean is a tremendous expense. And those sharp pencil guys tells you, 'Walt, if we cut down on maintenance, we'd save a lot of money.'  But I don't believe in that -- it's like any other show on the road.  It must be kept fresh and clean." _-- Walt Disney

Sounds like JL & Co are some of those "sharp pencil guys".


----------



## DeeCee735

dianeschlicht said:


> Please do your own homework and read the thread. It isn't fair to bog the thread down with recaps at this late point in the game.


 
Excuse me for asking. I read the first few pages, but enjoy my DVC time way too much to get any more into it than this. I don't share the negativism I see so far, but do feel change is always a good possibility and inevitable. If we ever find ourselves so unhappy with our membership, we'd sell our points, as it stands, Jim Lewis or not, we still love our DVC vacations and haven't had a poor experience in 11 years. So I'll bail on this thread, thanks for your opinion.


----------



## dianeschlicht

Donna DeVil said:


> Walt believed in exceeding expectations. Those of us who have been members for quite a while were well schooled in what to expect: clean, beautiful, well-kept rooms; great customer service; exciting vacation options; and being part of something special. From what I have been reading on this thread, it has been a while since Disney even met those expectations, much less exceeded them.
> 
> A quote from Walt himself (regarding Disneyland):
> _"Disneyland is a work of love.  We didn't go into Disneyland just with the idea of making money. . . even trying to keep that Park clean is a tremendous expense. And those sharp pencil guys tells you, 'Walt, if we cut down on maintenance, we'd save a lot of money.'  But I don't believe in that -- it's like any other show on the road.  It must be kept fresh and clean." _-- Walt Disney
> 
> Sounds like JL & Co are some of those "sharp pencil guys".


I agree with all you have said.  I STILL DO feel like our DVC is a good value, but it definitely has declined in the past few years.  Our first 10 were great....the past 4 are definitely different.


----------



## Steamboat WillyNilly

Deb & Bill said:


> You forget that free dining is just a way to fill empty rooms.  DVC rooms aren't empty.  And they aren't going to give free dining for stays on points.





nickspace said:


> I understand that but it still had a negative effect on many DVC member.





dianeschlicht said:


> Not me.



What would be nice though is for DVC to implement a Rewards Card to keep track of purchases made while at the parks to reward the ones that spend the most there with free souvenirs or meals or something to that nature.
That would go a long to make amends!!


----------



## JimMIA

dianeschlicht said:


> LOL!  Yep, that's it in a nutshell!  Too bad it took us 18 plus pages to come back to that!


Thanks.  I know a lot of our readers are incredibly busy and want the down-and-dirty version without all the work of actually reading.

Happy to be of service.


----------



## Deb & Bill

nickspace said:


> I understand that but it still had a negative effect on many DVC member.



Not the ones who understand why they are giving free dining.


----------



## DeeCee735

Donna DeVil said:


> Walt believed in exceeding expectations. Those of us who have been members for quite a while were well schooled in what to expect: clean, beautiful, well-kept rooms; great customer service; exciting vacation options; and being part of something special. From what I have been reading on this thread, it has been a while since Disney even met those expectations, much less exceeded them.
> 
> A quote from Walt himself (regarding Disneyland):
> _"Disneyland is a work of love. We didn't go into Disneyland just with the idea of making money. . . even trying to keep that Park clean is a tremendous expense. And those sharp pencil guys tells you, 'Walt, if we cut down on maintenance, we'd save a lot of money.' But I don't believe in that -- it's like any other show on the road. It must be kept fresh and clean." _-- Walt Disney
> 
> Sounds like JL & Co are some of those "sharp pencil guys".


 
Last time we were there was April, my daughter just got back. We can only speak for our own personal experiences and, I'm happy to say we still feel (and see) that it is exceeding our expectations. Hoping that doesn't change for us...


----------



## Donna DeVil

dianeschlicht said:


> I agree with all you have said.  I STILL DO feel like our DVC is a good value, but it definitely has declined in the past few years.  Our first 10 were great....the past 4 are definitely different.



Totally agree!


----------



## anniet

Steamboat WillyNilly said:


> What would be nice though is for DVC to implement a Rewards Card to keep track of purchases made while at the parks to reward the ones that spend the most there with free souvenirs or meals or something to that nature.
> That would go a long to make amends!!



They have that...it's called the Disney Visa Rewards Card.


----------



## Maistre Gracey

Deb & Bill said:


> Not the ones who understand why they are giving free dining.


Unless you consider the drop in quality and uniqueness of the restaurants.
The dinning plan, in many guests opinions, has led to a reduced restaurant experience. Of course that is felt amongst all guests, not just DVC. 
Point is, the restaurants are one of the main draws for my wife and me, thus they contributed to our decision to buy DVC. 

MG


----------



## Steamboat WillyNilly

anniet said:


> They have that...it's called the Disney Visa Rewards Card.



I know that! I'm talking about something specific for only DVC members that would keep track of their purchases while on their stays. That's it! Nothing else! That is something to make us members feel special and reward our loyalty!

Some people can't qualify for a Chase card! Chase's qualification standards are quite high and anyone with good credit can get the card!

You missed the whole point!


----------



## PirateFrank

Lil' Grumpy said:


> we have used dvc for 3 trips, & no one has ever greeted us. but that wouldn't have matter if we were not lied too. (just over christmas, i took time out to visit their office. i haven't forgotten her lying & we will meet again.)  however, the point, is all about how "un-disney", the dvc, has been for us. if you read some of the experiences we had over christmas, then it isn't shocking. ( *i still feel unsafe @ our home resort & i don't want to take our family there ever again.* * i also read on the dis about others having credit cards stolen & unauthorized personnel walking in. not even counting the "ladies" making sells. ) . blt is our home resort.



OMG.  I gotta call attention to this.  How exactly do you feel unsafe at BLT?  Please elaborate...  I've never felt safer than at any resort or location within WDW.  I am an owner at BLT and I have to say, your above account sounds like you have other issues with DVC besides what you describe and by inventing the above issues, you conveniently have a way to vent them.  I certainly feel quite safe at BLT.

I do not agree with anything you assert in the above paragraph and frankly, I'm take offense at your posting them, because they verge on dis-information and are potentially libelous. 

Oh, and what exactly do you mean by 'the "ladies" making sells'.....that doesn't even make any sense....


----------



## DaveH

We joined in 2001, we have been happy with DVC. We have noticed what to us are some things done in a manner that we find sad. Other things some good. In recent years we saw more bad than good. There has been a decline in communication from DVC in recent years. Perks are just stuff offered to us from other parts of the Disney Companies. I see the loss of valet parking as a result from outsourcing. DVC and Disney are outsourcing some of the guest services stuff to save money. They are finding out it is not always the best thing overall. I remember the perks from the parks were very low in 2001 & 2002. They later found out from all the surveys that DVC showed up when others were not. We got some more perks from the Parks side. Many we did not use, because they did not fit our needs. Welcome Home use to be DVC only. Now it is done at all resorts and to us has lost its magic. I have found recently housekeepers are very shell shocked from complaints from gusts. They try to avoid allot of us because they hear almost always complaints. I have called and said things are fine, because we want to, and they seemed shocked. Back to topic of this thread, I am at a wait and see mode. It seems Jim Lewis gave his bosses plenty of rope to dismiss him. I suspect the legal issue in Hawaii is more than likely the major reason, but not likely the only one.


----------



## been2marceline

maybe they'll actually start _cleaning_ the Villas' again!!


----------



## M4travels

PirateFrank said:


> .....
> Oh, and what exactly do you mean by 'the "ladies" making sells'.....that doesn't even make any sense....



IIRC, this poster was sure that there were, for the lack of a better word,  hookers up at TOWL every night he was up there.  Quite shocking, huh?

It may take some hard reading (IMO most of the posts are quite difficult to follow) of previous posts, but it's in there.....


----------



## dianeschlicht

M4travels said:


> IIRC, this poster was sure that there were, for the lack of a better word,  hookers up at TOWL every night he was up there.  Quite shocking, huh?
> 
> It may take some hard reading (IMO most of the posts are quite difficult to follow) of previous posts, but it's in there.....



Okay, so not sure how THEY would gain access unless they were members.  I totally agree about "those posts" being difficult to follow.  In fact, almost impossible to read or follow.


----------



## M4travels

dianeschlicht said:


> Okay, so not sure how THEY would gain access unless they were members.  I totally agree about "those posts" being difficult to follow.  In fact, almost impossible to read or follow.



And before I get charged with getting off topic....

I hear Jim Lewis was fired on Friday.....


----------



## dianeschlicht

M4travels said:


> And before I get charged with getting off topic....
> 
> I hear Jim Lewis was fired on Friday.....


LOL!  Yes, and I keep wondering if we will hear more of the "real" dirt  about this tomorrow morning.  I'm sure there are many more than just DVC members who are waiting for the next shoe to drop on this matter.


----------



## CWO4DVC

More impressed with DCL last 5 years than DVC. Owners for quite some time at OKW/HH/SS/BLT and soon to be GFV Happy JL is gone. I also was shocked when I read in one of his letters that we should donate to some timeshare group....I had to read it twice to make sure I was understanding correctly. Agree that a public firing out of the ordinary.......We will know soon enough...as we wait, I am hoping the DCL attitude of customer satisfaction carries over to DVC.


----------



## Mickey'sApprentice

Steamboat WillyNilly said:


> I know that! I'm talking about something specific for only DVC members that would keep track of their purchases while on their stays. That's it! Nothing else! That is something to make us members feel special and reward our loyalty!
> 
> Some people can't qualify for a Chase card! Chase's qualification standards are quite high and anyone with good credit can get the card!
> 
> You missed the whole point!



or choose not to take on another credit card. My husband and I spent years paying off credit card debt. Never again!

I would quit going to WDW before I signed up for a new credit card!!


----------



## Steamboat WillyNilly

Mickey'sApprentice said:


> or choose not to take on another credit card. My husband and I spent years paying off credit card debt. Never again!
> 
> I would quit going to WDW before I signed up for a new credit card!!



Thank you!!! Amen!!!
I just want something that is tied to our room keys that keep track of our purchases while at the world. No credit card. Just a rewards card!
To bring it back on topic. Since DVC has been going downhill the last few years, JL's fault or not. This would be a way to show a renewed spirit for the members and say we care about you AFTER the purchase too!


----------



## sissy_ib

Steamboat WillyNilly said:


> Thank you!!! Amen!!!
> I just want something that is tied to our room keys that keep track of our purchases while at the world. No credit card. Just a rewards card!
> To bring it back on topic. Since DVC has been going downhill the last few years, JL's fault or not. This would be a way to show a renewed spirit for the members and say we care about you AFTER the purchase too!



Not to mention ANYONE can get a CC. Even people who only go to WDW/DL once or every 10 years. I would be happy with a rewards program that is Disney Parks/Resort specific. DCL has one. I don't want free stays or anything like that. But something tied to how much I spend, and lets face it we all spend a lot on Disney vacations. Disney is to focused on the once-in-a-lifetime guest and not on repeat visitors.


----------



## drysdaleo

Have owned at BCV for 10 years now, and slowly things have changed and don't feel as "Disney" as when I first purchased.  Don't know if JL had anything to do with it or not.

The rooms are dirtier, period.  There is always some kind of trash under the bed, dust on the TV, hair in the bathroom, dirty balcony, etc.  It didn't used to be this way.  The villas were spotless for years and I wish it was still that way.  Now I have to make sure to at least take cleaning wipes to do a once-over when we get there.

I miss the old quarterly magazine.  I used to get excited when I saw it in the mail; now I could care less.  I had stopped even reading JL's first page antics a few issues ago, and after I got a load of DeeVee Cee I didn't even care if I ever cracked the cover again.  The whole thing has turned into a nose-thumbing at members.

I haven't been called by a guide/rep in many years.  Mine quit about 5 or 6 years ago.  She used to call us the first day of every trip when we checked in just to say hello.  I had actually considered doing an add-on earlier this year and didn't even know who to call.  I asked my sister (owns SSR) who her rep was and she said her rep quit but she had gotten sales literature from a guy named Michael but she had never talked to him.  Years ago, I would just have walked up to the DVC kiosk at the resort, but I don't know if I can trust them or not.  So, eventually I will just do resale I guess.

I would also like to know who the people are that are damaging the villas.  It can't be new owners, right?  I mean these are the people that are paying $120+ a point.  I paid $70-something a point and would never think of damaging or stealing anything (I do always bring home the little paper Disney coasters to use on the patio, if that counts).  I have always had such a sense of ownership and respect for the villas.  Why would others not feel that way?

I haven't been able to log on to the member website since my email address changed 2 years ago.  I called twice and spent over an hour with them trying to get my password reset, and after they couldn't get it to work they said they would figure it out and call me back.  Never got called back.  Don't really care because for one I know how many points I have, and for two hell will freeze over before we ever have an on-line reservations system.

Sorry to ramble.  Don't get me wrong, I love DVC so much.  Maybe I was just in the honeymoon stage for the first few years and JL had nothing to do with it.  It just felt more like a "Club" to me back then and that I was a valued member.  I think the only thing that is valued now is my dues check every January.


----------



## Sammie

nickspace said:


> I understand that but it still had a negative effect on many DVC member.



Not me either. Free dining has no effect on DVC in my opinion.


----------



## Sammie

Donna DeVil said:


> I wonder about this, too. We stayed at GC resort room in 2010. Beautiful! Perfect!
> 
> It seems unlikely that we, the people who ultimately pay for it, are the ones destroying our DVC rooms & stealing the kitchen utensils & towels. It would be interesting to know if the points-based reservations are responsible or the cash-based.



This I do know, it truly is the members as much or more than the cash based. For one thing at any given time there are more point reservations than cash.

Some members just seem to have the thought process of they paid for it with their dues so what if they don't take care it.


----------



## DVCPAT

Sammie said:


> While I had no idea this was coming down the pipe, the fact that Al Weiss suddenly without any warning up and retired and then Karl Holz was made JL's boss, I had a feeling somethinig was not right in DVCland.
> 
> It will be very interesting to watch.



I agree, thats probably when the decision was made. The July 5th article in the Orlando Sentinel outlined the personnel changes. Its interesting Disney released Karl Holz first task .


"Karl will be responsible for creating consistent and engaging guest experiences as they expand to new markets and destinations outside the berms of our theme parks," Staggs wrote in his memo. "These operations are an important driver of growth in our segment and a critical part of our efforts to build upon and broaden Disney's reputation for delivering magical experiences to our guests, both inside and outside the berm."

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com..._al-weiss-crofton-resorts-chairman-tom-staggs


----------



## eliza61

TheRustyScupper said:


> 1) The guy was a bad manager
> . . . would not listen to employees
> . . . would not hear issues form members
> . . . would not accept improvement ideas
> . . . would not admit errors
> 2) Definitely nice to have him gone.
> 3) However, I remember the saying when getting replacements
> . . .* better to have the devil you know
> . . . than the devil you do not know*



Or you can take the Mae West advice:

"*Whenever I'm caught between two evils, I take the one I've never tried*"


----------



## Longhairbear

As members since 2003 at VWL we have not had any bad experiences on vacation. We have had unusual experiences when going to DVC special events. 
 Till now, we didn't think much of our trips to special DVC events in CA until recently. Now it all makes sense.
 Way back when the VGC were announced, we attended a DVC event at Paradise Pier Hotel. At the time we were strongly pressured into buying SSR so we could be actual CA bought DVC owners, as opposed to CA resident DVC owners. As CA bought, and not CA resident DVC owners would give us first dibs at buying a contract at VGC, before the general public. At the time, everyone knew VGC would sell out in a few months time. Of course this was just before the economy took a huge fall. 
 We called our guide that we bought from initially for our VWL contract, and the later add ons. She told us she could not sell us the CA contract, and should go with the guide we would be assigned to in CA. for the SSR points. 
 That seemed very weird to us.
 The economy took a huge dump, and VGC did not sell out in a few months time as predicted.
 We never added points at VGC, and we wish we had, but the numbers were not right for our budget at the time. So, we are slaves to the 7 month window.
 A fabulous Aulani DVC presentation at Disneyland was up next. It felt like a used car salesman convention.
 We were surrounded on both sides by salespeople while we sipped our coffee after the presentation. They didn't want to hear how much we loved our   Wilderness Lodge home resort, nor our Old Key West recent stay. We got tag teamed, and pressured to go "upstairs" for the closing. When it was obvious we were not buying, we were ushered out.


----------



## nunzia

sissy_ib said:


> Not to mention ANYONE can get a CC. Even people who only go to WDW/DL once or every 10 years. I would be happy with a rewards program that is Disney Parks/Resort specific. DCL has one. I don't want free stays or anything like that. But something tied to how much I spend, and lets face it we all spend a lot on Disney vacations. Disney is to focused on the once-in-a-lifetime guest and not on repeat visitors.



OT but heard that ABD was starting a loyalty thing soon.
With DVC I just want a clean, well maintained room that I can get into before 6:00 pm.


----------



## dianeschlicht

Perhaps now is the time for all good DVC owners to come to the aid of our timeshare!  It might be a good time to make our opinions heard.  Maybe if we now voice the concerns many of us had growing over the past few years, it will be taken into account when choosing a new leader.  Unless, of course, that has already been done on the sly, and we have to just wait for news of the next  "chief".


----------



## Geezer

This thread is very interesting.  I can't say I'm unhappy about Jim Lewis being fired.  We saw some significant changes since he took over at the helm.  Most of those changes were negative from a customer standpoint.  

When we purchased DVC nearly 15 years ago the sales pitch was very low key and factual.  We appreciated that after having toured some sleazy ones in the past.  A few years ago we went to another timeshare presentation, and when they heard we were DVC owners, they said flat out they couldn't compare.  They said DVC was the gold standard for point based time shares.  I wonder if that is still the case?  When we did our add-on at AKV, it seemed like a much more high pressure sale and more like those traditional timeshare presentations than when we took our first tour back in 1994.


----------



## OrangeCountyCommuter

Since what I am reading is the "devil we don't know" is the Cruise Line guy.  

BE VERY AFRAID.

If you think DVC has gone downhill, have you been on the new ship.  I went if Febuary and was SO disappointed.   Service was bad, design has some major flaws (the adult pool is now a walk through area for everyone going to the main pools?  Gee that was  nice!), food was really not that good etc...

I had done DCL several times and really thought it was worth the premium they charge, but.. now I don't think so and will cruise other lines.


----------



## lockedoutlogic

Fact: the standards at WDW hotels have declined consistently over the last 20 or so years.

Fact: the DVC rooms will as well

Fact: once you are locked in your purchase...you really don't have any leverage over their policies or the direction they take.

So complaints or suggestions that these things will Change are - in essence - irrelevant.

Here's the reality: they know they've got you...that was the intent in the first place...and we are all feeding the monster, whether we want to acknowledge it or not.

I never get calls or emails over anything regarding DVC.  I got a 30 second call from my guide when he was assigned us (about 2 years ago...when the previous one got canned).  It was pure comedy...it started with and ended with a sales pitch.  About 28 seconds worth.

I have never heard anything else...nor do I expect too.  Because in the end it's just a timeshare and they are just as sleazy as any GM used car salesman.

What do we get?  15 wasteful and Eco-unfriendly brochures a year trying to get you to buy more...and 4 shiny min-magazines that, again, try to pump you to buy whatever they're pushing and buy tickets to more special ticket events.  It's all about what they're selling...not about what you bought...or should I say "leased".  But they do threaten poolhoppers each magazine.

It's so thinly veiled it's offensive...like anyone who own points doesnt know about what they're building...and about food and wine, cirque du soleil, the Halloween and Christmas parties...

I get locked in prices on expensive rooms...that's it.  That is the value.
The rest of the process is offensive.  That's it.


----------



## OrangeCountyCommuter

And it seems unlikely that the members are "stealing and destroying"

Really??  LOL!  

(I once saw some "members" loading the "souviners" into thier car.   I know they were members as I spoke to them the day prior and they told me where they owned.   They "borrowed" some dishware, throw pillows and probably some other stuff from OKW!)

Reading over this I am not sure what some of you think you bought..  you bought a TIMESHARE!

We did not buy "love" from Disney.  We did not buy "we should be special" LO!L

And if you have read your documents you will realize that when you bought you were basically told "you get NO say in anything we do"   If you can't accept that you really should not have bought.  I read.  I realized Disney holds all the power and control and really could care less what I think.  I was OK with that.


----------



## dianeschlicht

OrangeCountyCommuter said:


> And it seems unlikely that the members are "stealing and destroying"
> 
> Really??  LOL!
> 
> (I once saw some "members" loading the "souviners" into thier car.   I know they were members as I spoke to them the day prior and they told me where they owned.   They "borrowed" some dishware, throw pillows and probably some other stuff from OKW!)


That's inexcuseable!  DVC needs to start cracking down on that stuff, but that would require housekeepers who can report on a check sheet, and would require them to do it religeously after each guest.  That's not going to happen, so I suppose we have to deal with this kind of pilfering going on.  We once got into an OKW unit that had only one pan left in the cupboard, and that one didn't have a lid!   The mousekeeper brought us a whole new set to unpack, and then took the one old one back with her.  I can't believe anyone would steal things like that from a timeshare.  Moreover, why would you want their crappy pans?  

This is pretty off topic though with the JL business.  I'm not sure we can blame JL for this kind of stuff.


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## dmoore22

Several years ago I attended a program presented by the Disney Institute. This day long in-service addressed the topics of Leadership Excellence, People Management, Quality Service, Brand Loyalty, Inspiring Creativity and Business Excellence according to the gospel of Walt Disney. In recent years I've found there's a disconnect between what the Disney Institute is teaching and what is being practiced at DVC/DVD. Disney, the company, has been slowly drifting away from what Walt Disney, the man, has preached.


----------



## dianeschlicht

dmoore22 said:


> Several years ago I attended a program presented by the Disney Institute. This day long in-service addressed the topics of Leadership Excellence, People Management, Quality Service, Brand Loyalty, Inspiring Creativity and Business Excellence according to the gospel of Walt Disney. In recent years I've found there's a disconnect between what the Disney Institute is teaching and what is being practiced at DVC/DVD. Disney, the company, has been slowly drifting away from what Walt Disney, the man, has preached.



I loved those DI offerings too, and you are absolutely correct....The company as a whole no longer follows those precepts.


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## CarolAnnC

*This thread has been heavily edited for attacks, arguing, sarcasm and pretty much completely off topic and inappropriate conversation.  The topic of Jim Lewis' termination is the discussion at hand here.. 

This will serve as a "warning" to all and further postings of this nature will be subject to infractions being awarded.

Please continue in a respectful fashion keeping our DIS Posting Guidelines in mind at all times.  Thank you all for your compliance going forward..

*


----------



## Geezer

I'm sorry if some of my posts were inappropriate.  I see some are missing.  I don't post often, but I do read here, and while I don't say much, I am usually quite direct.  Sorry if it was offensive to anyone.


----------



## dmoore22

Al Weiss' retirement is effective November 1, 2011. We can only speculate as to how much of a lame duck he is during these final months. The loss of Roy E. Disney in 2009, to me, is more devastating. You always felt Roy was fighting for the company within the legacy of his father and uncle with his "Save Disney" trying to keep the company from, in his words, becoming a "rapacious, soul-less" conglomerate." The other being the departure of Dick Cook as chairman of Walt Disney Studios. It would appear that a corporate restructuring, consolidating responsibilities was inevitable whether Jim Lewis was doing a great or a dismal job. Of interest to note Disney is repurchasing the Disney Stores due to influence from the largest shareholder, Steve Jobs, CEO of Apple Computer. Several pilot stores have been opened heavily influenced by the Apple business model. Perhaps, and this is wishful thinking, this will trickle to DVC. With the purchase of Pixar, and John Lasseter being named principal creative advisor at Walt Disney Imagineering, where he helps design attractions for Disney's theme parks, and reports directly to Disney President and CEO Robert Iger, bypassing Disney's studio and theme park executives perhaps this may signal a fresh and welcome breeze coming to DVC and other Disney divisions.   Wishful thinking.


----------



## BEASLYBOO

This thread is wackier and wackier!

Personally, I don't care who's at the helm! I don't know that JL was entirely responsible for all of the changes that came good or bad.  Changes are almost never universally beneficial to all, perks come and go but some things should be a given and non-negotiable.

1. As DVC owners we are entitled to timely communication about the product we own.  Waiting months on end for a point chart and/or pertinent information we need is not acceptable.

2. Housekeeping has been such an on-going problem at all of the resorts, we pay dues for it, fix it. It's not good business to keep paying for poor services or inferior products.

3.  As far as the refurbs., there's a lack of standards or continuity from resort to resort. Example: a 90% refurb. was done to OKW, yet not a single bathroom was touched other than the addition of a dark stained mirror. Old grout, old tiles, old fixtures, old showers stalls, chipped drawers & tiles, that's not a 90%  refurb.  BLT, I've not seen it for myself but I've read so many posts about the displeasure of owners who feel that the furnishings are cheap and not wearing well.

Was JL the one who decided that the bottom line is the only thing that mattered with any/everything DVC!  ?

Unfortunately for all, I think the Walt Disney standard is a long, distant memory, it's now only about the all mighty buck!


----------



## disneynutz

It's officially official, Lewis's Executive bio was pulled this morning from Disney's Media Relations website.

 Bill


----------



## gmboy95

OK...just my 2 cents.....i don't know this Jim Lewis Guy, and i am sure he probably deserved his termination....That being said i have a few observations

1) I have been a member now for 12 years and am as happy today with the condition on the DVC resorts as i was then.

2) I find many of the complaints about the resorts to be anecdotal and not unlike any resort experience.

3) I think the overall disney experience took a major hit after Sept. 11th 2001....My issue is with the entire parks side who have not rebounded from this understandable downturn fast enough....the park experience has certainly suffered (if you have been in a park bathroom lately, you know what i mean)

4) My biggest issue with DVC is plain and simply PERKS, and overall COST!!!....things like free valet parking was a wonderful perk to have, and made you feel like you where an "owner".....The pass discounts are simply substandard for the investment made by the owner. I am not asking for free passes, but it would seem reasonable to me to offer across the board deep discounts for passes. This may be conjecture on my part, but i would guess the average DVC member spends a good deal more money over a year and beyond on food, gifts, specialty items, especially with the continued advent of free dining.

So to conclude, I am very happy with the resorts themselves, and the continued wonderful atmosphere.....It is the fiscal side of things that bothers me, and the perks!


----------



## jade1

dianeschlicht said:


> I agree with all you have said.  I STILL DO feel like our DVC is a good value, but it definitely has declined in the past few years.  Our first 10 were great....the past 4 are definitely different.



I feel bad for folks, ours just keep getting better and better.


----------



## going/again

anniet said:


> They have that...it's called the Disney Visa Rewards Card.



Cant get that in the uk, can get 42% off and free dining though.


----------



## keishashadow

dmoore22 said:


> Al Weiss' retirement is effective November 1, 2011. We can only speculate as to how much of a lame duck he is during these final months. The loss of Roy E. Disney in 2009, to me, is more devastating. You always felt Roy was fighting for the company within the legacy of his father and uncle with his "Save Disney" trying to keep the company from, in his words, becoming a "rapacious, soul-less" conglomerate." The other being the departure of Dick Cook as chairman of Walt Disney Studios. It would appear that a corporate restructuring, consolidating responsibilities was inevitable whether Jim Lewis was doing a great or a dismal job. *Of interest to note Disney is repurchasing the Disney Stores due to influence from the largest shareholder, Steve Jobs, CEO of Apple Computer. Several pilot stores have been opened heavily influenced by the Apple business model. Perhaps, and this is wishful thinking, this will trickle to DVC. With the purchase of Pixar, and John Lasseter being named principal creative advisor at Walt Disney Imagineering, where he helps design attractions for Disney's theme parks, and reports directly to Disney President and CEO Robert Iger, bypassing Disney's studio and theme park executives perhaps this may signal a fresh and welcome breeze coming to DVC and other Disney divisions.  Wishful thinking*.


 
I'll join you, didn't know re repurchase of the stores.  Children's Place ran them into the ground and the only Pittsburgh store recently went kaput.

jmho, thing deteriorated under Mr Lewis' control, whether he was just swept with the tide will remain to be seen.  As long as it's not a case of 'meet the new guards, same as the old guard', perhaps a rehab (fresh set of eyes) will do the trick.


----------



## dmoore22

dianeschlicht said:


> I agree with all you have said.  I STILL DO feel like our DVC is a good value, but it definitely has declined in the past few years.  Our first 10 were great....the past 4 are definitely different.



We agree with your comments totally. In spite of changes in recent years we still feel that we receive bang for the buck in comparison to other options. We have had some disappointments and have not been shy about letting MS know, eg. aspects of the OKW redecorating. Jim Lewis' beside manner has been a bit to be desired on some occasions. I would anticipate that Jim Lewis is a causality of the corporate restructuring. When the recession first hit most of the layoffs where at the white collar level with a consolidation of positions/responsibilities. Hopefully this is not a bad harbinger for the quality of DVC.


----------



## mjstaceyuofm

dianeschlicht said:


> That's inexcuseable!  DVC needs to start cracking down on that stuff, but that would require housekeepers who can report on a check sheet, and would require them to do it religeously after each guest.  That's not going to happen, so I suppose we have to deal with this kind of pilfering going on.  We once got into an OKW unit that had only one pan left in the cupboard, and that one didn't have a lid!   The mousekeeper brought us a whole new set to unpack, and then took the one old one back with her.  I can't believe anyone would steal things like that from a timeshare.  Moreover, why would you want their crappy pans?
> 
> This is pretty off topic though with the JL business.  I'm not sure we can blame JL for this kind of stuff.


Hardly off-topic. JL ran the show and the issue of stuff "disappearing", or being broken by guests is something that he, as the boss, should have heard about and implemented (through his underlings) some type of operational procedures or practices to remedy. He did not. The last few times we've been there we've encountered issues like this (stuff missing, blinds that don't work, sand on the tile floor, etc.) and it seems the standard of practice is to deal with it when someone calls the front desk.

We're going down in 10 days to stay at OKW since the refurb (our first trip to WDW since 2009) and you all have me scared about it. I was not fond of the new colors and hard floors, but everything else generally looked ok from the pictures I saw. Should be interesting.


----------



## Caren

keishashadow said:


> I'll join you, didn't know re repurchase of the stores.  Children's Place ran them into the ground and the only Pittsburgh store recently went kaput.



What? How recently? I was just at the South Hills Village store a week ago. Is it gone?


----------



## jimmytammy

mjstaceyuofm said:


> Hardly off-topic. JL ran the show and the issue of stuff "disappearing", or being broken by guests is something that he, as the boss, should have heard about and implemented (through his underlings) some type of operational procedures or practices to remedy. He did not. The last few times we've been there we've encountered issues like this (stuff missing, blinds that don't work, sand on the tile floor, etc.) and it seems the standard of practice is to deal with it when someone calls the front desk.
> 
> We're going down in 10 days to stay at OKW since the refurb (our first trip to WDW since 2009) and you all have me scared about it. I was not fond of the new colors and hard floors, but everything else generally looked ok from the pictures I saw. Should be interesting.



We recently stayed at OKW in Mar. and the refurbs to us looked nice.  But we own all pts at VWL, so understand those that own at OKW may not like refurb in comparison to what was there before.  We vaguely remember what OKW was like from a trip in 04, but dont really notice much difference.  I would say go with open mind.  We had a really great trip, looking forward to spending 2 weeks in Oct at OKW!!


----------



## papertraveller

This thread has been great reading, and most notably I'm extremely impressed at the business acumen displayed by the posters. The Disney model is a great one, for marketing, customer service, product development, etc. And when it gets broken -- and they make major shifts in an effort to fix -- it becomes an even more fascinating case study.

I guess we all should have seen this coming when the restructuring was announced and Karl Holtz was put in charge of DVC. It seemed a bit odd at the time, but now of course makes more sense.

In the realm of "be careful what you ask for", I'm still more inclined to give the new team (whoever they might be) the benefit of the doubt. Holtz led a complicated project to tremendous internal and external success (or at least, is on track to complete it). He had the company's trust to execute a massive expansion, and has people clamouring to get onboard his new ship(s). I'll bet he has some very interesting stuff he'd like to deploy at DVC, and he has the corporate capital to get board backing. 

Double-dip recession aside (or maybe because of it) we will see some very interesting developments over the next six to 12 months.


----------



## keishashadow

Caren said:


> What? How recently? I was just at the South Hills Village store a week ago. Is it gone?


 
I live way on the other side of town in the boonies, almost an hour further from Ross Park Mall store that closed.  I'm not even sure where south hills village is, let alone that it had a disney store.  If they build it (back up to prior standards) I will make the road trip.


----------



## doconeill

Just got the email - Claire Bilby is the top DVC exec, under the title of "[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Senior Vice President". Like Lewis she comes from the Marketing section of DPR.

[/FONT]


----------



## lawgs

doconeill said:


> Just got the email - Claire Bilby is the top DVC exec, under the title of "[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Senior Vice President". Like Lewis she comes from the Marketing section of DPR.
> 
> [/FONT]




Global Sales Leader Claire Bilby Named to Top Disney Vacation Club Role

Disney Vacation Club is pleased to welcome seasoned Disney leader Claire Bilby as its new Senior Vice President, with responsibility for all aspects of the business.

Claire succeeds Jim Lewis, who left the company after serving as its president since 2006. 

Claire has a distinguished history with Disney, starting in marketing at Walt Disney World Resort in 1988 and taking increasing levels of executive responsibility with the company in Florida, California and around the globe.

She recently served as Senior Vice President of Distribution Marketing and Asia Pacific Sales for Walt Disney Parks and Resorts. Among her responsibilities were leading all sales channel marketing for Walt Disney World Resort, Disneyland Resort, Disney Cruise Line, Walt Disney Travel Company, Adventures by Disney and Disney Institute. She also served as the top sales leader for Disney Destinations' Asia Pacific Region, with responsibilities for Hong Kong Disneyland, Disney's regional sales office in Tokyo and sales offices in Australia and China. Most recently, Claire led the sales organization at Disneyland Resort Paris on a temporary assignment.

"Claire brings to Disney Vacation Club an impressive track record in global sales, as well as an inspirational leadership style and innovative thinking," said Karl L. Holz, President of New Vacation Operations and Disney Cruise Line, and whose responsibilities include Disney Vacation Club.

Claire's many accomplishments include helping to launch several Disney theme parks and serving as a key leader in the milestone 50th anniversary celebration for Disneyland Resort.


----------



## DMKEDM

Wondering about the significance (if any) of the new person (Claire Bilby) having the title "senior vice president" as compared to Jim Lewis having been president of DVC?

Does this mean a "downgrade" to DVC in the pantheon of Disney businesses?


----------



## Mister Incredible

Nice sales background, wonder how she is with Customer Service??


----------



## anniet

Mister Incredible said:


> Nice sales background, wonder how she is with Customer Service??



My sources say she is a wonderful lady and this announcement should make us members VERY happy!


----------



## GatorMomInNC

No severance package per Orlando Sentinel

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/the-...y-time-share-trouble-20110815,0,4646293.story



sweetdana said:


> Assuming it is true, could you imagine the severance?  I bet it is more than most of us make in a yr.


----------



## Muushka

anniet said:


> My sources say she is a wonderful lady and this announcement should make us members VERY happy!



Great news!  Hi Annie, good to see you.


----------



## tjkraz

DMKEDM said:


> Wondering about the significance (if any) of the new person (Claire Bilby) having the title "senior vice president" as compared to Jim Lewis having been president of DVC?
> 
> Does this mean a "downgrade" to DVC in the pantheon of Disney businesses?



I am almost certain that Lewis had a VP position when he was first placed with DVC.  Don't think DVC ever had a President before him.  

In retrospect, the President title looks like more of a pat on the back from the days when he was a rising star in the company.  

I don't view it as any sort of downgrade for DVC.


----------



## WDWLVR

DMKEDM said:


> Wondering about the significance (if any) of the new person (Claire Bilby) having the title "senior vice president" as compared to Jim Lewis having been president of DVC?
> 
> Does this mean a "downgrade" to DVC in the pantheon of Disney businesses?



Jim Lewis started as Vice President (or maybe Senior Vice President) and it was a number of years (3-4) before he was made President.  I could see the same thing happening here.


----------



## fdwang

Interesting post.



Disney halts sales and fires executives amid financial issues with Hawaiian resort
By Jason Garcia, Orlando Sentinel

8:38 PM EDT, August 15, 2011

Financial issues with a new Walt Disney Co. resort scheduled to open this month in Hawaii prompted the company to suspend all time-share sales for the project and force out three executives, including the president of its Celebration-based time-share business, according to several people familiar with the events.

Disney on Friday fired Jim Lewis, president of Disney Vacation Club, the company's time-share division. The company also dismissed Jim Heaney, senior vice president and chief financial officer of Disney Cruise Line and travel operations, and Lawrence Smith, a former director of finance for Disney Vacation Club who was most recently with food-and-beverage operations for Walt Disney World.

The dismissals followed an internal investigation into problems surrounding Aulani, an estimated $850 million hotel and time share scheduled to open Aug. 29 on the Hawaiian island of Oahu. Plans call for the resort to have 460 Disney Vacation Club time shares and 359 conventional hotel rooms.

Disney said Monday evening it had appointed Claire Bilby, a 23-year company veteran who had most recently been senior vice president of distribution marketing and Asia Pacific sales, to run its time-share business. Bilby's title will be senior vice president of Disney Vacation Club.

According to the people familiar with details of the investigation, it focused on the annual dues that Disney Vacation Club plans to charge buyers of Aulani time shares. Those yearly fees are used to cover ongoing expenses such as the resort's maintenance and repairs.

Those people said Disney concluded that Vacation Club executives had calculated dues amounts so low that they would not generate enough money to cover the cost of maintaining Aulani. The inadequate dues amounts were included in legal-disclosure documents submitted to the Hawaiian government.

Disney said Aulani's operating costs were underestimated, leading to the inadequate annual dues. It said the mistake was unintentional.

The low fees prompted concerns within the company that Aulani would eventually face a significant operating shortfall, the people familiar with the investigation said. The company also feared the possibility of a brand-damaging backlash from Hawaiian regulators or consumers should Disney attempt to significantly raise Aulani's annual dues in future years to plug any deficit.

All of the people familiar with the events spoke only on the condition that they not be identified because of the sensitivity of the issue.

Disney suspended Aulani sales on July 9, a little more than one year after it started selling the project to consumers. The company says it is accepting "deposit reservations" in the interim from buyers who wish to lock in current Aulani prices, though there is no penalty for consumers who cancel such reservations.

Rena Langley, a spokeswoman for Disney, said the company is now in the process of changing the registration materials submitted to the Hawaiian government and that it expects to file the updated documents this week. She said the changes involve "adjustments to our annual dues forecast for Aulani."

Disney's initial sales materials stated that the 2011 annual dues for Aulani would be $4.31 for every "point" purchased, or $689.60 a year based on 160 points, which Disney says is the minimum amount for new Vacation Club members. (Disney Vacation Club sells points, rather than specific time periods, which allows buyers to redeem them at various times and destinations.)

Langley said buyers who have already purchased points in Aulani will get a credit toward their annual dues equal to the difference between the original quoted amount and whatever higher price Disney sets now. She declined to say how many people have bought into Aulani so far.

All time-share developers face pressure to keep maintenance fees as low as possible in order to drive sales. While such fees may seem a trifling issue when compared with the upfront sticker price of a time share — which can cost $50,000 or more — they can nonetheless be a significant deterrent for buyers.

A 2009 survey for the American Resort Development Association, the time-share industry trade group, found that one in four recent time-share buyers cited annual maintenance fees as a top reason they had been hesitant about purchasing a time share.

Tammie Kaufman, a professor in the University of Central Florida's Rosen College of Hospitality Management, said many buyers are wary because dues are a recurring expense that can increase from year to year.

"It's because of the unknown. People have heard horror stories" about dues, Kaufman said.

Aulani's performance is being closely watched by Disney investors. The project is the first test of the company's strategy to build standalone hotels and niche parks in secondary markets away from its massive theme-park resorts in Orlando and Anaheim, Calif., as Disney's parks division searches for new sources of growth in North America.

None of the three executives fired Friday received a severance package, according to a person who spoke with one of the men.

The dismissal marks a shocking fall for Jim Lewis, once considered a rising star within Disney's executive ranks and a leading candidate to become president of Walt Disney World, the company's biggest and most profitable theme-park operation.

Lewis joined Disney in 1996 from PepsiCo as a director of planning and finance for Disney's sales unit. He was tapped to oversee Disney Vacation Club in 2003, and under his watch the unit became the fastest-growing business within Disney's global theme-park division. At its peak before the global recession, Disney Vacation Club generated an estimated $190 million a year in operating income.

Lewis did not return phone messages Monday.

Disney's decision to force Heaney out in addition to Lewis stunned several company followers. The finance executive was highly regarded both inside and outside of Disney; he had earned the nickname "The Brain" from some fellow executives.

"I am very proud of my accomplishments and how I conducted business during my 16-plus years with Disney," Heaney said. "Given this track record, I am bewildered by the company's decision."

Smith could not be reached for comment.

The Aulani paralysis has frustrated some Disney customers. William Montgomery, a 37-year-old business owner from Dallas, said he called Disney on July 27 planning to buy into Aulani — only to be told by the sales agent that he couldn't.

"And so I said, 'What's the deal?' He got real cryptic, real fast. … All he would say is there was something wrong in the documentation and that the Disney lawyers had stopped everything," said Montgomery, who also owns an interest in a Disney time share in Orlando. "It's the damndest thing. I mean, Disney won't take your money."


----------



## podsnel

anniet said:


> My sources say she is a wonderful lady and this announcement should make us members VERY happy!



Thanks for this post- it is making this member VERY happy!



GatorMomInNC said:


> No severance package per Orlando Sentinel
> 
> http://www.orlandosentinel.com/the-...y-time-share-trouble-20110815,0,4646293.story



You really have to think there is a LOT more to the Jim Lewis story than we know....no severance?  That really says soooo much....


----------



## Mickey'sApprentice

fdwang said:


> Interesting post.
> 
> 
> 
> Disney halts sales and fires executives amid financial issues with Hawaiian resort
> By Jason Garcia, Orlando Sentinel
> 
> 8:38 PM EDT, August 15, 2011
> 
> *According to the people familiar with details of the investigation, it focused on the annual dues that Disney Vacation Club plans to charge buyers of Aulani time shares.* Those yearly fees are used to cover ongoing expenses such as the resort's maintenance and repairs.
> 
> *Those people said Disney concluded that Vacation Club executives had calculated dues amounts so low that they would not generate enough money to cover the cost of maintaining Aulani.* The inadequate dues amounts were included in legal-disclosure documents submitted to the Hawaiian government.
> 
> Disney said Aulani's operating costs were underestimated, leading to the inadequate annual dues. *It said the mistake was unintentional*.  Yeah Right!!
> 
> The low fees prompted concerns within the company that Aulani would eventually face a significant operating shortfall, the people familiar with the investigation said. *The company also feared the possibility of a brand-damaging backlash from Hawaiian regulators or consumers should Disney attempt to significantly raise Aulani's annual dues in future years to plug any deficit.*
> 
> Disney's initial sales materials stated that the 2011 annual dues for Aulani would be $4.31 for every "point" purchased, or $689.60 a year based on 160 points, which Disney says is the minimum amount for new Vacation Club members. (Disney Vacation Club sells points, rather than specific time periods, which allows buyers to redeem them at various times and destinations.)
> 
> All time-share developers face pressure to keep maintenance fees as low as possible in order to drive sales. While such fees may seem a trifling issue when compared with the upfront sticker price of a time share  which can cost $50,000 or more  they can nonetheless be a significant deterrent for buyers.




It makes you wonder just how bad things were eventually going to get under the guidance of Jim Lewis. IMHO, these problems in Hawaii are just symptomatic to the overall problems seen by current members.  Too low of dues means less housekeeping, less maintenance, less of everything. 

Were we going to see those big 1 time assessments we hear horror stories about so that they could re-do the shoddy craftsmanship.  Is it possible that some of those assessments will come down the pike because JL already set the wheels in motion, and its too late to completely stop!

I think we've only heard the beginning of what happened.

To me, it sounds like JL was doing a crappy job in terms of maintenance and upkeep of the resorts, and that no matter how much the DISSERS complained...nothing happened. It took the State of Hawaii telling Disney management what many here already knew. 

When it came down to JL jeopardizing a project in the hundreds of millions of dollars, COMBINED with the overall mismanagement of DVC did him in. 

It may be the other way around...but it sounds like he took the bean counters down with him.


----------



## disneynutz

I have often questioned the low dues at BLT and now you have to ask did Lewis do the same thing to BLT and will the owners be faced with a dues increase. The other executives fired seemed to have moved on to other jobs, when did they work with Lewis, prior to BLT being built?

 Bill


----------



## podsnel

disneynutz said:


> I* have often questioned the low dues at BLT and now you have to ask did Lewis do the same thing to BLT and will the owners be faced with a dues increase.* The other executives fired seemed to have moved on to other jobs, when did they work with Lewis, prior to BLT being built?
> 
> Bill



That's what I just said 2 minutes ago to my husband....


----------



## Laurabearz

Got this email tonight...



> Global Sales Leader Claire Bilby Named to Top Disney Vacation Club Role
> 
> Disney Vacation Club is pleased to welcome seasoned Disney leader Claire Bilby as its new Senior Vice President, with responsibility for all aspects of the business.
> 
> Claire succeeds Jim Lewis, who left the company after serving as its president since 2006.
> 
> Claire has a distinguished history with Disney, starting in marketing at Walt Disney World Resort in 1988 and taking increasing levels of executive responsibility with the company in Florida, California and around the globe.
> 
> She recently served as Senior Vice President of Distribution Marketing and Asia Pacific Sales for Walt Disney Parks and Resorts. Among her responsibilities were leading all sales channel marketing for Walt Disney World Resort, Disneyland Resort, Disney Cruise Line, Walt Disney Travel Company, Adventures by Disney and Disney Institute. She also served as the top sales leader for Disney Destinations' Asia Pacific Region, with responsibilities for Hong Kong Disneyland, Disney's regional sales office in Tokyo and sales offices in Australia and China. Most recently, Claire led the sales organization at Disneyland Resort Paris on a temporary assignment.
> 
> "Claire brings to Disney Vacation Club an impressive track record in global sales, as well as an inspirational leadership style and innovative thinking," said Karl L. Holz, President of New Vacation Operations and Disney Cruise Line, and whose responsibilities include Disney Vacation Club.
> 
> Claire's many accomplishments include helping to launch several Disney theme parks and serving as a key leader in the milestone 50th anniversary celebration for Disneyland Resort.


----------



## Brandis

I don't like it too much that she's coming from Marketing, but at least she has been with the Company for a long time, hopefully she know by now what Disney is about.

As for Karl Holz, I'm pretty happy with him. I met him a few time at shareholders meetings at Disneyland Paris and he always seemed genuinely interested in peoples concerns.

Since DVC is now part of the cruise divisin, can we hope for a DVC cruiseship resort? Just kidding of course!


----------



## Longhairbear

We think it is odd a DCL exec was also fired. Perhaps something to do with smaller blocks of cruise cabins available on points? Or even the no cruise option for new resale owners?
 No severance package for those fired, sounds like there might be more to this than Aulani.
 I don't want to think this way, but perhaps all the DVC resorts built under Lewis's reign? Could all those resorts have been sold with under estimated annual dues?


----------



## Biggreen19

As many have stated, I suspect JL was fired more for his "body of work", the Aulani issue was the straw that broke the camel's back.  Bean counters playing the shell game for favorable quarterly numbers, with nothing supporting those numbers LONG TERM will eventually collapse under their own weight.............


----------



## Ramsfan28

No severance for Jim Lewis points to something very bad that must have happened.  

While I do agree it could have been several things building up over time, there maybe was something else that we have not hear about yet.  

I can't stress enough the no severance thing is big and also perhaps a bit of a message to DVC owners that the company was not happy and heard the complaints from the owners.


----------



## Dizny Dad

I agree.  No severance for Jim Lewis is a very serious move for Disney.  My first thoughts were that they had enough difficulties with performance that they could weather the storm of attorneys that may be launched their way.  Generally a severance package comes with contractual agreements of no further action on either side.  Of course keeping any possible severance compensation is one way to offset the legal costs that would inevitably be incurred by the bank of lawyers Disney employs.  Time will tell.  

Let the games begin . . . .


----------



## granmanh603

Like Aulani  issue opened a can of worms and when they looked back at the resorts he has opened since 2006 he did the same with all of them to make the numbers look good.....this is kinda scary...  Just wonder how are they going to fix this mess and who is going to pay...  Like all of us


----------



## pilferk

DMKEDM said:


> Wondering about the significance (if any) of the new person (Claire Bilby) having the title "senior vice president" as compared to Jim Lewis having been president of DVC?
> 
> Does this mean a "downgrade" to DVC in the pantheon of Disney businesses?



I don't think so.

I think it's a modification based on them installing another layer of "leadership" (some would say bureaucracy) above her.

I also suspect they were looking for a way to part company with Jim when Karl was put "above" Jim.  Though, going by the reported Aulani mess up, there was GOOD reason to let Jim go.


----------



## pilferk

Ramsfan28 said:


> No severance for Jim Lewis points to something very bad that must have happened.
> 
> While I do agree it could have been several things building up over time, there maybe was something else that we have not hear about yet.
> 
> I can't stress enough the no severance thing is big and also perhaps a bit of a message to DVC owners that the company was not happy and heard the complaints from the owners.



Termination with no severence usually means it's "with cause" and not "at will".  With the Aulani mess up, I don't think it's hard to figure out just what Disney will point at as cause.


----------



## nunzia

Longhairbear said:


> We think it is odd a DCL exec was also fired. Perhaps something to do with smaller blocks of cruise cabins available on points? Or even the no cruise option for new resale owners?
> No severance package for those fired, sounds like there might be more to this than Aulani.
> I don't want to think this way, but perhaps all the DVC resorts built under Lewis's reign? Could all those resorts have been sold with under estimated annual dues?



I was just thinking that in regards to VGC..although it's very small and shares space with lots of hotel rooms..still...


----------



## BigEeyore

I am so impressed by how many people on the Dis are so up on what is going on inside the halls of DVC HQ! 
For those of us who are not so attuned (ahem, such as myself) - could somebody just summarize what all the problems with Jim Lews were? I read the stunning article about all the problems w/ Aulani, but what else?
Thanks for enlightening me...


----------



## jennypenny

There is more to this than just a dues issue at Aulani. I would think legal issues have to be involved. No severance is almost unheard of except for pending litigation or bankruptcy. 

The problems in Hawaii make me wonder about BLT and the assumed GFV. I wonder if Lewis will disappear like Hoffa and end up in the foundation at GFV


----------



## CMOORE185

I would be worried if I bought any resort built since JL was in charge, especially BLT considering their dues are so low and the poor quality of materials that they used. Look for a possible significant increase in dues over the next couple of years.


----------



## tjkraz

disneynutz said:


> I have often questioned the low dues at BLT and now you have to ask did Lewis do the same thing to BLT and will the owners be faced with a dues increase. The other executives fired seemed to have moved on to other jobs, when did they work with Lewis, prior to BLT being built?
> 
> Bill



DVC is going to have to do some damage control to address these questions.  

The one saving grace of other recent resorts is that their budgets would have gone through independent audits.  If those audit results were not reliable, they have much larger problems.  

The biggest factor in BLT's low dues is the higher point charts.  More points in the resort--comparatively speaking--means each point pays a smaller share of the operating costs.  Still it's clear there are lingering quality issues at BLT that will need to be addressed.


----------



## nytimez

jennypenny said:


> There is more to this than just a dues issue at Aulani. I would think legal issues have to be involved. No severance is almost unheard of except for pending litigation or bankruptcy.
> 
> The problems in Hawaii make me wonder about BLT and the assumed GFV. I wonder if Lewis will disappear like Hoffa and end up in the foundation at GFV



I know people who have been fired by Disney and given no severance. Not hourly employees, either.


----------



## dianeschlicht

tjkraz said:


> DVC is going to have to do some damage control to address these questions.
> 
> The one saving grace of other recent resorts is that their budgets would have gone through independent audits.  If those audit results were not reliable, they have much larger problems.
> 
> The biggest factor in BLT's low dues is the higher point charts.  More points in the resort--comparatively speaking--means each point pays a smaller share of the operating costs.  Still it's clear there are lingering quality issues at BLT that will need to be addressed.



I wonder if audits are pending?  I have always expected BLT dues would increase once the resort was sold out, and it sounds like sell out is near.


----------



## mjc2003

pilferk said:


> Termination with no severence usually means it's "with cause" and not "at will".  With the Aulani mess up, I don't think it's hard to figure out just what Disney will point at as cause.




Exactly.  I said a few days ago, before this news about Claire and the clarification on the Aulani mess broke yesterday, that JL was fired unceremoniously (not "parting ways" or "agreed to leave the company" but fired) because of something specific.  This is not an aggregate firing.  They (Disney) feel comfortable with not only not paying him a severance, but letting that information be made public.  This would indicate that they have a "smoking gun" with Jim's fingerprints on it.  I suspect the discovery of this MF "mistake" led them back to BLT, and a quick review of the books there showed them that the problem was actually a pattern.

I am confused about one thing: How did he benefit from low MF's?  Just from a sales perspective?  Is a $1 difference in MF's that much of an anchor on the speed of sales?  Maybe it is, I just think it's crazy to think that you can ignore the pending shortfall in MF's for the quick sale. Didn't he know that eventually this issue would come home to roost?


----------



## tjkraz

jennypenny said:


> There is more to this than just a dues issue at Aulani. I would think legal issues have to be involved. No severance is almost unheard of except for pending litigation or bankruptcy.



The dues issue is very much a legal matter.  Those numbers were provided to Hawaii regulators as part of the sales approval process and they've been given to thousands of current and potential owners.  

Disney is going to have to subsidize dues of early buyers for decades to come and deal with the perception that leaders of their timeshare "Club" attempted to defraud buyers by floating fabricated numbers.  

It seems clear that a great deal of blame falls upon Lewis' shoulders.  Either this was a coordinated scheme to boost sales by publishing fraudulent dues figures or it started as an error and Lewis did not act properly to resolve the situation once discovered.


----------



## sgtdisney

It should be interesting to see how this all shakes out.  Now hearing all this it makes me wonder even more about the OKW rehab.   There should have been sufficient funds in the reserve to do a full remodel, and yet they did it on the cheap by refinishing furniture as opposed to replacing it, and left hard surfaces in place, etc.   Wonder what more happened under Mr. Lewis' regime.


----------



## tjkraz

dianeschlicht said:


> I wonder if audits are pending?  I have always expected BLT dues would increase once the resort was sold out, and it sounds like sell out is near.



I believe the budgets are audited every year.  A representative of the audit firm was present at last year's annual meeting to confirm the results of the audit and answer any member questions.  

I never looked at it as a foregone conclusion that BLT dues would increase.  Part of it goes back to the math.  We all know how much higher the BLT point charts are than resorts like BCV, BWV, OKW, etc.  Higher charts means more points.  More points means each point pays a smaller share of the operating costs.  

But dues may have to go up to help correct some of the errors in the original room design.  



mjc2003 said:


> I am confused about one thing: How did he benefit from low MF's?  Just from a sales perspective?  Is a $1 difference in MF's that much of an anchor on the speed of sales?  Maybe it is, I just think it's crazy to think that you can ignore the pending shortfall in MF's for the quick sale. Didn't he know that eventually this issue would come home to roost?



Two comments come to mind:

1.  It's POSSIBLE that this started as a calculation mistake and Lewis' greatest error was not reporting / correcting it.  It may not have started as a deliberate attempt to deceive buyers.  

2.  We'll have to see how the revised numbers look but I'm sure every dollar alienates some buyers.  At some point, Disney was going to have to position Aulani as a resort that you could buy "just to get into the system."  The more it costs, the harder such an approach is to pull-off.


----------



## pilferk

mjc2003 said:


> I am confused about one thing: How did he benefit from low MF's?  Just from a sales perspective?  Is a $1 difference in MF's that much of an anchor on the speed of sales?  Maybe it is, I just think it's crazy to think that you can ignore the pending shortfall in MF's for the quick sale. Didn't he know that eventually this issue would come home to roost?



$1 per point can be a pretty hefty difference.  Doing some VERY rough math, it looks like each 2 BR equivalent unit has AROUND 23,347 points into it (that's roughing out view, etc...so it's a REALLY rough estimate).  Now, using the Aulani stated # of 2 BR equivalents (481), that would mean a difference in dues revenue (assuming sell out) of roughly $11,229,907 per year.

Eleven million dollars a year seems pretty hefty.

And that doesn't even take into account the hurdles (and ill will) they now have to deal with concerning the Hawaiian government.


----------



## izzy

tjkraz said:


> I believe the budgets are audited every year.  A representative of the audit firm was present at last year's annual meeting to confirm the results of the audit and answer any member questions.
> 
> I never looked at it as a foregone conclusion that BLT dues would increase.  Part of it goes back to the math.  We all know how much higher the BLT point charts are than resorts like BCV, BWV, OKW, etc.  Higher charts means more points.  More points means each point pays a smaller share of the operating costs.
> 
> But dues may have to go up to help correct some of the errors in the original room design.
> 
> 
> 
> Two comments come to mind:
> 
> *1.  It's POSSIBLE that this started as a calculation mistake and Lewis' greatest error was not reporting / correcting it.  It may not have started as a deliberate attempt to deceive buyers.  *
> 2.  We'll have to see how the revised numbers look but I'm sure every dollar alienates some buyers.  At some point, Disney was going to have to position Aulani as a resort that you could buy "just to get into the system."  The more it costs, the harder such an approach is to pull-off.




I think your first comment is important.  From my experience and in watching some of the financial debacles in the world in the past 10 years or so, people don't normally get fired for a mistake.  Where they get into trouble is when they start trying to cover up that mistake.


----------



## mommacat56

This is a reply I posted on another thread, but it seems to fit here as well. It was posted in response to a question about current Aulani owners dues and whether or not the "credit" mentioned would carry forward for a year or for longer:

It (the "credit") had better carry forward for the length of the CONTRACT, not just for one year! A two-tiered system is clearly possible with the current computer applications and is already in use for VB (?), from what I read here, though I do not own there and have no first-hand knowledge. 

I purchased Aulani a few months back, just before they discontinued sales, obviously not knowing any of the problems with the finances we are all just learning about. The stated member dues amount of $4.31/point, clearly outlined in my CONTRACT (legal and binding between me and DVDMC), definitely figured into my decision to purchase. 

If they now say that the amount should be double (or more!), that's fraud, pure and simple, especially if it was known to JL and his cronies, which seems clear at this point that he did! Imagine the lawyers lining up at their doorstep! 

Now you know why JL and the others got the boot in an unceremonius fashion (and without severence) late on a Friday afternoon! And now we all know why they simply can't "fix" the dues amount at a new level and get on with sales. They are legally bound by the existing CONTRACTS to honor their word!

Thank you GRAYDON (or should we call you DEEP THROAT?  ) for breaking this news! 

And welcome to Ms. Bilby! You have a huge job ahead of you to turn this wonderful part of Disney operations around. I have owned since December of 1991 (yes, one of the first believers!) and have never once regretted my purchase (and multiple add-on purchases, direct and resale since then)... Please don't let Aulani be my first! 

And please read the DIS regularly... happy owners, like me and many others, are your best assets! And, as you can see, we are totally unafraid to share our opinions openly and regularly, so you can start saving money on the polling...just come by here and sit a spell!  
Welcome aboard!


----------



## Scott H

mommacat56 said:


> This is a reply I posted on another thread, but it seems to fit here as well. It was posted in response to a question about current Aulani owners dues and whether or not the "credit" mentioned would carry forward for a year or for longer:
> 
> It (the "credit") had better carry forward for the length of the CONTRACT, not just for one year! A two-tiered system is clearly possible with the current computer applications and is already in use for VB (?), from what I read here, though I do not own there and have no first-hand knowledge.
> 
> I purchased Aulani a few months back, just before they discontinued sales, obviously not knowing any of the problems with the finances we are all just learning about. The stated member dues amount of $4.31/point, clearly outlined in my CONTRACT (legal and binding between me and DVDMC), definitely figured into my decision to purchase.
> 
> If they now say that the amount should be double (or more!), that's fraud, pure and simple, especially if it was known to JL and his cronies, which seems clear at this point that he did! Imagine the lawyers lining up at their doorstep!
> 
> Now you know why JL and the others got the boot in an unceremonius fashion (and without severence) late on a Friday afternoon! And now we all know why they simply can't "fix" the dues amount at a new level and get on with sales. They are legally bound by the existing CONTRACTS to honor their word!
> 
> Thank you GRAYDON (or should we call you DEEP THROAT?  ) for breaking this news!
> 
> And welcome to Ms. Bilby! You have a huge job ahead of you to turn this wonderful part of Disney operations around. I have owned since December of 1991 (yes, one of the first believers!) and have never once regretted my purchase (and multiple add-on purchases, direct and resale since then)... Please don't let Aulani be my first!
> 
> And please read the DIS regularly... happy owners, like me and many others, are your best assets! And, as you can see, we are totally unafraid to share our opinions openly and regularly, so you can start saving money on the polling...just come by here and sit a spell!
> Welcome aboard!




Thank You , well said, we are also long standing members  (1991) with several contracts and concur with your statements, 

had we known this was coming I would have asked Holtz to sit and chat with him about DVC while on the Alaska cruise.


----------



## pilferk

mommacat56 said:


> This is a reply I posted on another thread, but it seems to fit here as well. It was posted in response to a question about current Aulani owners dues and whether or not the "credit" mentioned would carry forward for a year or for longer:
> 
> It (the "credit") had better carry forward for the length of the CONTRACT, not just for one year! A two-tiered system is clearly possible with the current computer applications and is already in use for VB (?), from what I read here, though I do not own there and have no first-hand knowledge.
> 
> I purchased Aulani a few months back, just before they discontinued sales, obviously not knowing any of the problems with the finances we are all just learning about. The stated member dues amount of $4.31/point, clearly outlined in my CONTRACT (legal and binding between me and DVDMC), definitely figured into my decision to purchase.



The contract also outlines how much they can legally raise those dues in a year.  I think (but am not sure) it's around 15% per year.  Other posters can correct me if that figure is wrong.

I doubt the difference will be double...MAYBE $1 a point more (so 25% difference-ish).

What DVC can do is raise those paying the higher rate of dues 2 to 4% per year (the normal increase), and YOURS the full 15%, until they hit equilibrium.  Or, rather, make you pay more of the difference (lowering the credit they provide) between your dues and the "corrected" dues.

IF they're going to offer a "two tier" system, I'm pretty sure it's in their rights to do so, in order to close that gap, and unify the system.


----------



## mommacat56

Scott H said:


> Thank You , well said, we are also long standing members  (1991) with several contracts and concur with your statements,
> 
> had we known this was coming I would have asked Holtz to sit and chat with him about DVC while on the Alaska cruise.



I purchased Aulani sight-unseen based on the Disney imagineering's artist renderings, DISer photos, and the promises made by DVDMC that this place would be special!     I am planning to see it for the first time next May, when the first-ever DCL Hawaiian cruise lands there and I take an excursion over to tour it!   I'm sure they will have plenty of shuttles heading over for those who have, or may, want to purchase there!  That's assuming they ever get the go-ahead to start selling Aulani again!  

I hope the whole new management structure is present, both on the Hawaiian cruise AND over at Aulani!  I know from past DCL cruises that they have exclusive member events onboard.  I would be very pleased to see Mr. Holtz and Ms. Bilby front and center, welcoming every single member, whether they are travelling on their points like me, or having paid cash for their reservations.  

I would also like to see the DVC Guides assigned to this sailing, and also those at Aulani, getting a tutoring by them, so they hear the facts from the top!  NO passing along false information or using pressure tactics of inferior timeshare operations (IMO), just to make a sale!  ALL guides need to be on the same page, providing current and potential members with true and complete information, and delivering it in a considerate and professional manner, remembering that service AFTER the sale (promises made and promises kept) is more important than the sale itself (IMO).  

If guides were on salary (not on commission), that would go a long way in elevating the professionalism of each guide (IMO).  And the high-pressure, high sleeze factor guide    would soon be a bad dream...  

OR, better yet, they can hire us "old-timers"     who have been there since the beginning...I always said that would be my ABSOLUTE DREAM JOB, since DVC sells itself!    But, maybe not so much anymore   

Here's hoping the new management can turn DVC around and again make it the premier timeshare operation it once was


----------



## dianeschlicht

mommacat56 said:


> Here's hoping the new management can turn DVC around and again make it the premier timeshare operation it once was



We can only hope!


----------



## nytimez

mommacat56 said:


> Here's hoping the new management can turn DVC around and again make it the premier timeshare operation it once was



If the reports are true, the firing had nothing to do with the direction/tone/approach/maintenance anything else -- just a big-time screwup that's costing the company money. 

So... I wouldn't expect anything to change on the surface for most of us.


----------



## hakepb

pilferk said:


> The contract also outlines how much they can legally raise those dues in a year.  I think (but am not sure) it's around 15% per year.  Other posters can correct me if that figure is wrong.
> 
> I doubt the difference will be double...MAYBE $1 a point more (so 25% difference-ish).
> 
> What DVC can do is raise those paying the higher rate of dues 2 to 4% per year (the normal increase), and YOURS the full 15%, until they hit equilibrium.  Or, rather, make you pay more of the difference (lowering the credit they provide) between your dues and the "corrected" dues.
> 
> IF they're going to offer a "two tier" system, I'm pretty sure it's in their rights to do so, in order to close that gap, and unify the system.



Can a timeshare legally increase one members dues at a higher percentage than another member?  
Ie your legally defined unit had a fire, so your dues are going up 15% but your next door neighbor only goes up 4%?  I think all members share all costs.
I think VB works because every unit pays the same dues, its just the subsidized dues are billed to DVD and the member.


----------



## mjc2003

pilferk said:


> $1 per point can be a pretty hefty difference.  Doing some VERY rough math, it looks like each 2 BR equivalent unit has AROUND 23,347 points into it (that's roughing out view, etc...so it's a REALLY rough estimate).  Now, using the Aulani stated # of 2 BR equivalents (481), that would mean a difference in dues revenue (assuming sell out) of roughly $11,229,907 per year.
> 
> Eleven million dollars a year seems pretty hefty.
> 
> And that doesn't even take into account the hurdles (and ill will) they now have to deal with concerning the Hawaiian government.



I certainly appreciate how a dues shortfall would accumulate and quickly become a problem for DVC, that's kind of my point..  My question was, didn't he realize this and how was he gaining by it?  I guess he thought it would sell faster, but I find this hard to believe.  If the dues at Aulani were $1 more per point, I don't think that would kill sales.  But then again, who knows what he was shooting for.  Maybe he was financially incentivized to sell out in 18 months, or 30 months or whatever.


----------



## White_Sox_Fan

While $1 a point seems inconsequential if you figure a 3% increase per year for 50 years it comes to an additional $22,560.00 in dues over that time on a 200 point contract.


----------



## jennypenny

nytimez said:


> I know people who have been fired by Disney and given no severance. Not hourly employees, either.



Wow. The mouse is meaner than I thought. 

I still wonder why all 3 were fired on the same day. I guess that's why I'm wondering if the issue is more than Hawaii. What would a DCL exec have to do with that? And if they aren't related, why would Disney fire them the same day? And so publicly?

Curiouser and curiouser...


----------



## hakepb

mjc2003 said:


> I certainly appreciate how a dues shortfall would accumulate and quickly become a problem for DVC, that's kind of my point..  My question was, didn't he realize this and how was he gaining by it?  I guess he thought it would sell faster, but I find this hard to believe.  If the dues at Aulani were $1 more per point, I don't think that would kill sales.  But then again, who knows what he was shooting for.  Maybe he was financially incentivized to sell out in 18 months, or 30 months or whatever.


That $11mil / year might mean a $220 mil 50 year annuity for the subsidy.  Was Jim and other execs planning on getting a great BLT sell-out bonus this year, knowing that annuity was going to kill DVC profitability next year?


----------



## pilferk

hakepb said:


> Can a timeshare legally increase one members dues at a higher percentage than another member?
> Ie your legally defined unit had a fire, so your dues are going up 15% but your next door neighbor only goes up 4%?  I think all members share all costs.
> I think VB works because every unit pays the same dues, its just the subsidized dues are billed to DVD and the member.



Again, if you create 2 separate sub groups of dues payers, you can treat them differently (since, technically, they're going to have signed different contracts).

You couldn't treat two owners, in the same group, differently.  But you CAN treat the two groups/contracts differently.   I'm not saying Disney will..only that they COULD.  

They could also trash the old contracts and start over with new paperwork (stating the credit amount and duration) OR have all current owners sign a contract addendum (or receive a full refund of purchase price and dues paid to this point) in order to get everyone under the same terms LONG term.

The method at Aulani sounds slightly different than the one at VB (though maybe it's just semantics in the article).  If DVC is issuing a credit for dues...THEY are not being billed.  The owner is billed for the full amount of dues, and DVC issues a credit to cover the shortfall between THEIR contracted dues price and whatever the NEW contracted dues price is.  Again, in practice, though, they may adopt the VB method and it could just be the way the article is explaining it.

VB is slightly different in the hows and whys, though, too.


----------



## pilferk

mjc2003 said:


> I certainly appreciate how a dues shortfall would accumulate and quickly become a problem for DVC, that's kind of my point..  My question was, didn't he realize this and how was he gaining by it?  I guess he thought it would sell faster, but I find this hard to believe.  If the dues at Aulani were $1 more per point, I don't think that would kill sales.  But then again, who knows what he was shooting for.  Maybe he was financially incentivized to sell out in 18 months, or 30 months or whatever.



The difference between $690 in annual dues (assuming a 160 pt contract) and $850 in annual dues (or about 8,000 + differences in increases over 50 years) is, I think, a substantial one....especially psychologically during the sales process. That's 57.50 vs 70.83 per month.

He may NOT have thought it would sell faster. It COULD have been an accounting mistake that he then tried to cover up and sweep under the rug.
Or, he thought it would make enough of a difference (especially considering DVC members are going to be on the hook for resort taxes when staying there AND parking) to spur sales.  We won't know til more info comes out.


----------



## Breyean

pilferk said:


> They could also trash the old contracts and start over with new paperwork (stating the credit amount and duration) OR have all current owners sign a contract addendum (or receive a full refund of purchase price and dues paid to this point) in order to get everyone under the same terms LONG term.



This is what I keep coming back to. I expect my Guide to call any time and say something like, "We had a slight change in your Aulani contract so we're sending you a new one. Just sign it and return it. No big deal. Thanks."

In my case, and I bet a bunch of us earlier Aulani buyers, I used the points already. Haven't yet taken the vacation, of course, but I couldn't take it w/o the Aulani points.

So would we have any option other than just accepting whatever changes Disney makes in the contract and agreeing to the new terms?


----------



## pilferk

Breyean said:


> This is what I keep coming back to. I expect my Guide to call any time and say something like, "We had a slight change in your Aulani contract so we're sending you a new one. Just sign it and return it. No big deal. Thanks."
> 
> In my case, and I bet a bunch of us earlier Aulani buyers, I used the points already. Haven't yet taken the vacation, of course, but I couldn't take it w/o the Aulani points.
> 
> So would we have any option other than just accepting whatever changes Disney makes in the contract and agreeing to the new terms?



IF they chose to go that route (and it might be a slippery one), yes.  You could likely opt out of the contract, get a full refund of the purchase price and whatever you've paid, thus far, for dues.  BUT, you'd have to relinquish your points....and you'd be no better off because to "rebuy", you're going in at the new dues rate.

You could TRY to negotiate...but I doubt you'd have much luck getting anything other than the terms offered in the addendum.  Maybe they'd throw in some token thing (like they did with OKW folks that didn't want to extend but had to pay a notary) to sweeten the pot...but likely they would do that for everyone and not on a case by case basis.

Short answer: If you WANT the points and the terms are acceptable to you, sign the addendum.  If the terms aren't acceptable, tell Disney you want your money back because you feel they've violated the original contract and the terms of the addendum are not acceptable to you.  I don't recall anything in our POS or contract that says they have the right to modify the contract without consent in relation to stuff like this...but I haven't seen an Aulani contract to say for sure it's NOT different (I'd be shocked if it is).

Again, all this ASSUMING Disney went that route.

They could, just as easily (and probably in a much more CS friendly manner), maintain the current contract, raise your dues the same amount as everyone else (2% - 4% per year) who buys in going forward, and give you a dues credit in perpetuity to cover the shortfall.

You just don't know until it all shakes out.


----------



## paulh

nytimez said:


> If the reports are true, the firing had nothing to do with the direction/tone/approach/maintenance anything else -- just a big-time screwup that's costing the company money.
> 
> So... I wouldn't expect anything to change on the surface for most of us.



cut the head off and the body stays the same
Paul


----------



## tjkraz

hakepb said:


> Can a timeshare legally increase one members dues at a higher percentage than another member?
> Ie your legally defined unit had a fire, so your dues are going up 15% but your next door neighbor only goes up 4%?  I think all members share all costs.
> I think VB works because every unit pays the same dues, its just the subsidized dues are billed to DVD and the member.



Aulani would work the same way...same dues for all but a select group would see their final number reduced a bit due to a subsidy from the developer.  

I could see this going several ways:

1.  Perpetual subsidy based upon difference between $4.31 and re-calculated dues.  If the final number for 2011 is $5.00, the early buyers would get a $.69 subsidy (perhaps inflation adjusted) from now until 2062.  

2.  Subsidy that is gradually reduced.  Not sure how legal that would be but Disney could try to float it past members, hoping nobody would challenge. 

3.  Some sort of one-time payout to compensate for misinformation provided during sales process.  This would be the best way to sort of sweep it under the rug and have the entire debacle forgotten in a few years.  

Of course, all buyers would also have grounds to terminate the agreement if they chose to do so.  But they'd have to pursue this quite soon, not use any of the points, etc.  

Will be very interesting to see how Disney approaches this.  If they contact members and give them options (including selling-back the points) or just decide on one approach and apply to all.  



jennypenny said:


> I still wonder why all 3 were fired on the same day. I guess that's why I'm wondering if the issue is more than Hawaii. What would a DCL exec have to do with that? And if they aren't related, why would Disney fire them the same day? And so publicly?



The Sentinel has Jim Heaney's title as "senior vice president and chief financial officer of Disney Cruise Line and travel operations".  I've been lead to believe that DVC fell under his umbrella--probably the "travel operations" part.  

As for why Disney would do this "so publicly", they didn't do it publicly.  There's simply no quiet way of firing 3 high level execs at a company that employs 60,000 in one metropolitan area.  Disney did it as quietly as they could.  First reports were from other employees who got wind of the terminations and then it leaked to the media.  



mjc2003 said:


> I certainly appreciate how a dues shortfall would accumulate and quickly become a problem for DVC, that's kind of my point..  My question was, didn't he realize this and how was he gaining by it?  I guess he thought it would sell faster, but I find this hard to believe.  If the dues at Aulani were $1 more per point, I don't think that would kill sales.



Hard to judge since we're just speculating about numbers.  Final variance could be $.50 per point, $1, $2, etc.  

Regardless, as I said in another post I think a key to Aulani's success was going to be selling it as "a way to get into the system."  With BLT dues at $3.89 and VGC at $4.07, I would expect Grand Floridan to be in the same neighborhood.  Having Aulani at $4.31 already makes it something of a tough sell.  

Put it this way: If Grand Floridian has dues in the $4 - 4.50 neighborhood and Aulani ends up at $5 - 5.50, Aulani is going to be a REALLY tough sell.  Perceptions can be altered by charging less up-front for the Aulani points, but that also impacts the profitability of the project.  Disney spent $120 million on the land alone--an expense that's pretty much absent for any of its theme park resorts.  

I don't think this bodes well for a future DVC in National Harbor.


----------



## ppiew

Good Luck to Karl Holz.  DVC is VERY fortunate to have a man of his caliber ready and "ABLE to take the reins of this mess!  No better choice could have been made.


----------



## jennypenny

> The Sentinel has Jim Heaney's title as "senior vice president and chief financial officer of Disney Cruise Line and travel operations".  I've been lead to believe that DVC fell under his umbrella--probably the "travel operations" part.



Didn't know that. Still a tough firing if JL is really to blame here.



> Regardless, as I said in another post I think a key to Aulani's success was going to be selling it as "a way to get into the system."  With BLT dues at $3.89 and VGC at $4.07, I would expect Grand Floridan to be in the same neighborhood.  Having Aulani at $4.31 already makes it something of a tough sell.



It's hard not to wonder now if those dues are artificially low.


----------



## tjkraz

jennypenny said:


> Didn't know that. Still a tough firing if JL is really to blame here.



We can only assume that each played some role in the current situation.  Disney doesn't have a track record of frequently terminating senior VPs without severance.  



> It's hard not to wonder now if those dues are artificially low.



Budgets are reviewed by an external auditor so I suspect those two are reasonably safe.  In fact, it could have been this audit process which revealed the inconsistencies with Aulani.  

The low dues at BLT and VGC are a function of the higher point charts.  Most nights cost 15-25% more points than other resorts like BCV or BWV.  More points means each point incurs a smaller share of the dues liability.  

That said, some of the furnishings at BLT represent an ongoing issue and may require changes sooner than anticipated.  Still, a single Two Bedroom villa at BLT represents about 19,000 points.  Even if they have to replace every stick of furniture, the cost could be spread over several years (via reserves) and the per-point charge would not be all that noticeable.


----------



## been2marceline

Even if the current owners were granted, in perpetuity, a credit that would make their original dues equal to the amount on the contract, that credit has to be funded from somewhere.

Is DVC going to run Aulani with a minimized, yet still negative budget?

Doubtful - why run the resort if its not going to make money?

Are they going to have the later owners subsidized the credit by increasing the dues to cover the anticipated cost plus the original owners credits?

Doubtful and possibly illegal.

With this knowledge of the dues problems - I wouldn't buy it period.

This is going to be ugly....


----------



## tjkraz

been2marceline said:


> Even if the current owners were granted, in perpetuity, a credit that would make their original dues equal to the amount on the contract, that credit has to be funded from somewhere.
> 
> Is DVC going to run Aulani with a minimized, yet still negative budget?
> 
> Doubtful - why run the resort if its not going to make money?
> 
> Are they going to have the later owners subsidized the credit by increasing the dues to cover the anticipated cost plus the original owners credits?
> 
> Doubtful and possibly illegal.
> 
> With this knowledge of the dues problems - I wouldn't buy it period.
> 
> This is going to be ugly....



Similar situation occurred with Vero beach and Disney has been subsidizing dues for over 15 years.  In that case, Disney intended on building the resort much larger but later scaled back its plans due to lack of demand.  The subsidy is representative of the reduction in scale from the original project plan communicated to early buyers.  As of 2011, the Vero subsidy is at $1.47 per point.  

As for the finances, Disney receives a fee for operating the DVC program.  The fee is equal to 12% of most budgeted annual expenses.  DVC can cover the subsidy out of their portion of those recurring revenues.  There are only a few thousand people who will get the subsidy.  

This situation is definitely a black mark on the entire DVC program but I don't view it as any impending signs of disaster for Aulani owners.


----------



## mjstaceyuofm

nytimez said:


> If the reports are true, the firing had nothing to do with the direction/tone/approach/maintenance anything else -- just a big-time screwup that's costing the company money.
> 
> So... I wouldn't expect anything to change on the surface for most of us.


I have some hope. Usually with a shake-up like this, the new guy (figurative term in the case of Ms. Bilby) wants to come in and put their stamp on things. Aside from her and Mr. Holz fixing this dues thing, the quickest way for her to put a positive spin on this thing with existing members is to do some quick-fix things at the resorts like cleanliness, better front-line cast members, timely check-ins, etc. It may take a while to achieve all the pie in the sky things our collective Disboards DVC fandom has thrown out there for her to consider, but the aforementioned items are easily achievable and should be right up there with fixing this dues issue.

Honestly, there's some damage control that needs to be done and aside from rectifying the dues issue, I think she needs to work expeditiously to earn some goodwill and grace from the members.

Also, Jim Lewis et al may have been fired over this dues flap, but my experience in situations like this tells me Mr. Holz and other Disney execs at his level will want everything that was under Mr. Lewis to be reviewed to make sure there are no other skeletons in the closet. They may see a pattern of practices that aren't Disney quality that the new regime will want to get right with members.

There are some that seem to think we are getting a better DVC leader in Ms. Bilby than JL ever was. Hopefully that translates into some of the things we've been clamoring for as DVCers recently...


----------



## Sammie

sgtdisney said:


> It should be interesting to see how this all shakes out.  Now hearing all this it makes me wonder even more about the OKW rehab.   There should have been sufficient funds in the reserve to do a full remodel, and yet they did it on the cheap by refinishing furniture as opposed to replacing it, and left hard surfaces in place, etc.   Wonder what more happened under Mr. Lewis' regime.



And the fact he insisted that BLT use the cheaper furnishings even though the committee to pick them recommended not to. Have to wonder if that money went somewhere else. 

I have felt for some time that money that was suppose to be going to housekeeping and maintenance was not being used properly.


----------



## Mickey'sApprentice

mjstaceyuofm said:


> I have some hope. *Usually with a shake-up like this, the new guy (figurative term in the case of Ms. Bilby) wants to come in and put their stamp on things. Aside from her and Mr. Holz fixing this dues thing, the quickest way for her to put a positive spin on this thing with existing members is to do some quick-fix things at the resorts like cleanliness, better front-line cast members, timely check-ins, etc.* It may take a while to achieve all the pie in the sky things our collective Disboards DVC fandom has thrown out there for her to consider, but the aforementioned items are easily achievable and should be right up there with fixing this dues issue.
> 
> Honestly, there's some damage control that needs to be done and aside from rectifying the dues issue, I think she needs to work expeditiously to earn some goodwill and grace from the members.
> 
> Also, Jim Lewis et al may have been fired over this dues flap, but my experience in situations like this tells me Mr. Holz and other Disney execs at his level will want everything that was under Mr. Lewis to be reviewed to make sure there are no other skeletons in the closet. They may see a pattern of practices that aren't Disney quality that the new regime will want to get right with members.
> 
> There are some that seem to think we are getting a better DVC leader in Ms. Bilby than JL ever was. Hopefully that translates into some of the things we've been clamoring for as DVCers recently...



It may be too soon...but DH may have fantastic customer service for our trip in late September!!

It might just be long enough away for the new procedures for housekeeping, and additional mousekeepers put in place, and the employees being on high alert, or just an overall new found happiness of the staff...but not so far away that things have gotten back to normal.

On the other hand...we could see people getting used to new procedures that may or may not work, overworked CMs, and newly hired people that don't know what they are doing...OR of course...Ms. Bilby could go the other way by firing housekeepers to improve the bottom line, etc.

Either way, I'm really excited about our upcoming trip!!!


----------



## nytimez

mjstaceyuofm said:


> I have some hope. Usually with a shake-up like this, the new guy (figurative term in the case of Ms. Bilby) wants to come in and put their stamp on things. Aside from her and Mr. Holz fixing this dues thing, the quickest way for her to put a positive spin on this thing with existing members is to do some quick-fix things at the resorts like cleanliness, better front-line cast members, timely check-ins, etc. It may take a while to achieve all the pie in the sky things our collective Disboards DVC fandom has thrown out there for her to consider, but the aforementioned items are easily achievable and should be right up there with fixing this dues issue.
> 
> Honestly, there's some damage control that needs to be done and aside from rectifying the dues issue, I think she needs to work expeditiously to earn some goodwill and grace from the members.
> 
> Also, Jim Lewis et al may have been fired over this dues flap, but my experience in situations like this tells me Mr. Holz and other Disney execs at his level will want everything that was under Mr. Lewis to be reviewed to make sure there are no other skeletons in the closet. They may see a pattern of practices that aren't Disney quality that the new regime will want to get right with members.
> 
> There are some that seem to think we are getting a better DVC leader in Ms. Bilby than JL ever was. Hopefully that translates into some of the things we've been clamoring for as DVCers recently...



I tend to think the way people in Ms. Bilby's position put their stamp on things is by showing their bosses that they can make money.


----------



## drusba

Here is something no one has mentioned: remember last annual meeting that Lewis and Co. said they were going to roll out a tiered member benefit program potentially based at least partly on number of points owned? Not too long ago someone mentioned that it would be coming by end of the year. I wonder if that idea is still on the table with the Lewis' and others' departure.


----------



## Mickey'sApprentice

nytimez said:


> I tend to think the way people in Ms. Bilby's position put their stamp on things is by showing their bosses that they can make money.



Iger's first move was to buy Pixar. It was a bold move that was applauded for moving the company forward.

Yes, I know what you mean about making stockholders happy...but there are other moves. 

I expect some other kind of bold move that will transform the DVC product for the better would be in the making.

What about some improvement in trades. I've heard Dean and some of the others talk about some sort of inside trading with Marriott or Hilton or the other exclusive timeshares. I've always thought that an acquisition of the Hyatt timeshares would be a wonderful companion to DVC.

I bet Ms. Bilby has or is in the process of doing a SWOT analysis on DVC as we speak. SWOT stands for Strengths, Weaknesses, Opportunities, Threats.  

The housekeeping issue is a weakness, and finding better opportunities for members is well...and opportunity for the division.


----------



## Sammie

drusba said:


> Here is something no one has mentioned: remember last annual meeting that Lewis and Co. said they were going to roll out a tiered member benefit program potentially based at least partly on number of points owned? Not too long ago someone mentioned that it would be coming by end of the year. I wonder if that idea is still on the table with the Lewis' and others' departure.



Probably for right now, just sorting through the mess with Aulani, possibly BLT, maybe even OKW and accessing personnel will keep that topic off the front burner for a while.


----------



## DVCPAT

nytimez said:


> If the reports are true, the firing had nothing to do with the direction/tone/approach/maintenance anything else -- just a big-time screwup that's costing the company money.
> 
> So... I wouldn't expect anything to change on the surface for most of us.





One screw up usually wont get you fired. Its when you make multiple, consecutive screw-ups that get you terminated. Tom Staggs specifically assigned Karl Holz to broaden Disney's reputation for delivering magical experiences to our guests, both inside and outside the berm."


----------



## disneychic

Sammie said:


> Probably for right now, just sorting through the mess with Aulani, possibly BLT, maybe even OKW and accessing personnel will keep that topic off the front burner for a while.



I hope you are right and this "tiered system nightmare" gets lost in the shuffle


----------



## dianeschlicht

drusba said:


> Here is something no one has mentioned: remember last annual meeting that Lewis and Co. said they were going to roll out a tiered member benefit program potentially based at least partly on number of points owned? Not too long ago someone mentioned that it would be coming by end of the year. I wonder if that idea is still on the table with the Lewis' and others' departure.



I hope that idea is gone, but my guess is that it might still be in development.  If  that's the case, maybe calmer heads will prevail and think differently about it.  

I think it will cause a pull out of sorts instead of encouraging people to buy more points.


----------



## drakethib

Wow.

I just heard a rumor that Jim Lewis was fired.

Any truth to that?


----------



## nytimez

DVCPAT said:


> One screw up usually wont get you fired.



In Jim Lewis' case, I don't know the full story -- but I think even if this was the only screw up, it's more than enough to get him fired. This is massive.


----------



## tjkraz

nytimez said:


> In Jim Lewis' case, I don't know the full story -- but I think even if this was the only screw up, it's more than enough to get him fired. This is massive.



Agree.  

Providing false information to state regulators.

Providing false information to customers and potential customers.

By all appearances, some element of covering it up / lying to superiors within TWDC.

Literally decades of compensation (subsidy) for early buyers which will total millions of dollars--perhaps tens of millions.

Damage to Disney's reputation.

Yeah, this was a doozie.


----------



## izzy

It will be interesting to see if anything fraudulent was going on with all of this.  Mistakes are one thing - covering it up is something else.

Last week when the stock market was wonky and all over the place, I remember one day that the Disney stock lost significantly more percentage-wise than the market's average loss that day.  I'm now beginning to wonder if some of these folks who were fired knew what was coming down the pike and dumped their stock on the market.  I can't imagine that they would have had enough stock to make a signficant difference, but who knows.


----------



## Oglet

Many people are cautious of time shares in general. Disney had gone to great lengths to put an image out there to the general public that they are not like the others.

This could potentially damage the image of Disney in a way that will take quite some time to rehabilitate.


----------



## BeccaG

izzy said:


> It will be interesting to see if anything fraudulent was going on with all of this.  Mistakes are one thing - covering it up is something else.
> 
> Last week when the stock market was wonky and all over the place, I remember one day that the Disney stock lost significantly more percentage-wise than the market's average loss that day.  I'm now beginning to wonder if some of these folks who were fired knew what was coming down the pike and dumped their stock on the market.  I can't imagine that they would have had enough stock to make a signficant difference, but who knows.



I would think they would be smart enough not to add insider trading to their crimes and foibles but one never knows...


----------



## hakepb

Any trades by company officers will be reported to the S.E.C. So eventually any stock sales would be reported.


----------



## TisBit

tjkraz said:


> Similar situation occurred with Vero beach and Disney has been subsidizing dues for over 15 years.  In that case, Disney intended on building the resort much larger but later scaled back its plans due to lack of demand.  The subsidy is representative of the reduction in scale from the original project plan communicated to early buyers.  As of 2011, the Vero subsidy is at $1.47 per point.
> 
> As for the finances, Disney receives a fee for operating the DVC program.  The fee is equal to 12% of most budgeted annual expenses.  DVC can cover the subsidy out of their portion of those recurring revenues.  There are only a few thousand people who will get the subsidy.
> 
> This situation is definitely a black mark on the entire DVC program but I don't view it as any impending signs of disaster for Aulani owners.



It think the key difference there is that the resort was changed, adversely affecting the owners.  For all intense purposes this is merely a budget issue wiht a miscalculation of dues (which is bad and could bring lawsuits if it was done intentionally), but will not likely see a long term subsidy, because the scope of the project was not changed from the original POS, etc.



Mickey'sApprentice said:


> Iger's first move was to buy Pixar. It was a bold move that was applauded for moving the company forward.
> 
> Yes, I know what you mean about making stockholders happy...but there are other moves.
> 
> I expect some other kind of bold move that will transform the DVC product for the better would be in the making.
> 
> What about some improvement in trades. I've heard Dean and some of the others talk about some sort of inside trading with Marriott or Hilton or the other exclusive timeshares. I've always thought that an acquisition of the Hyatt timeshares would be a wonderful companion to DVC.
> 
> I bet Ms. Bilby has or is in the process of doing a SWOT analysis on DVC as we speak. SWOT stands for Strengths, Weaknesses, Opportunities, Threats.
> 
> The housekeeping issue is a weakness, and finding better opportunities for members is well...and opportunity for the division.



This is a blow to the DVC reputation, especially with it being the first off site "mini resort".  The leaders of DVC will need to work hard to rebuild a reputation with DVC and the last thing they will want is a disgruntled owner base due to housekeeping/maintenance issues.  So, I suspect in the next year you will see many DVC CM's getting extra pressure to improve customer service and satisfaction.  This might ultimately end up in some dues increases if they add positions, etc to accomplish this, but I wouldn't think they would want to look bad by going on a sudden spending spree either.  



tjkraz said:


> Agree.
> 
> Providing false information to state regulators.
> 
> Providing false information to customers and potential customers.
> 
> By all appearances, some element of covering it up / lying to superiors within TWDC.
> 
> Literally decades of compensation (subsidy) for early buyers which will total millions of dollars--perhaps tens of millions.
> 
> Damage to Disney's reputation.
> 
> Yeah, this was a doozie.



Definitely damage to reputation and possibly covering up the budget problems there.  

Providing false information is very difficult to prove.  Even if you file paperwork with overly generous numbers, that is not necessarily "false" information and especially when you get into accounting, it is near impossible to improve that is was done maliciously.  

Decades of subsidies is more than jumping the gun.  The cost difference in dues is not even known and how much this difference is will be a big factor.  It is obviousl that JL and company all did some fuzzy math in determining costs and most of it probably comes down to how they split the operating costs between the cash/DVC portions of the resort.  Purchasers of Aulani will be given their credit this year and will gradually be brought back up to a "normal" dues costs over the next year or two in accordance with the contract.  If they subsidized the early members and never brought them in line with the other members, this could be quite complicated.  It is not as straight forward as Vero Beach when the developer failed to develop part of the resort, resulting in increased operating costs to the membership.


----------



## tjkraz

TisBit said:


> Decades of subsidies is more than jumping the gun.



http://www.kitv.com/news/28888158/detail.html

_The Disney spokeswoman said anyone who already purchased time share units at Aulani for the lower rate will not see a dues increase over the life of the 50-year contract that expires in 2062.

"It's the right thing to do," said Langley._

Sure sounds like they plan on subsidizing over the life of the contract.


----------



## Chuck S

tjkraz said:


> http://www.kitv.com/news/28888158/detail.html
> 
> _The Disney spokeswoman said anyone who already purchased time share units at Aulani for the lower rate will not see a dues increase over the life of the 50-year contract that expires in 2062.
> 
> "It's the right thing to do," said Langley._
> 
> Sure sounds like they plan on subsidizing over the life of the contract.



It may also avoid lawsuits from those owners.  It sounds as if this will be a subsidy without the maximum increases, unlike Vero, where the resort was never fully built out.


----------



## drusba

tjkraz said:


> http://www.kitv.com/news/28888158/detail.html
> 
> _The Disney spokeswoman said anyone who already purchased time share units at Aulani for the lower rate will not see a dues increase over the life of the 50-year contract that expires in 2062.
> 
> "It's the right thing to do," said Langley._
> 
> Sure sounds like they plan on subsidizing over the life of the contract.



So under the new management if Jim Lewis screwed up your dues, your dues are frozen forever. I sure hope they find out he screwed up at one of the resorts I own.


----------



## wdrl

tjkraz said:


> http://www.kitv.com/news/28888158/detail.html
> 
> _The Disney spokeswoman said anyone who already purchased time share units at Aulani for the lower rate will not see a dues increase over the life of the 50-year contract that expires in 2062.
> 
> "It's the right thing to do," said Langley._
> 
> Sure sounds like they plan on subsidizing over the life of the contract.



I certainly hope that Langley, the Disney spokesperson, misstated the situation when she said those who already bought Aulani "will not see a dues increase over the life of the 50-year contract that expires in 2062."  As operating expenses increase over the years, why would the early Aulani buyers be exempt from paying for normal cost of living expenses?  If normal cost of living expenses increase 3% in a year, then all Aulani owners should absorb the cost.   

I fully understand that the early Aulani owners should be protected because they bought thinking Aulani's _starting_ MF would be $4.31.  But even those buyers knew, or should have known, that the MF would increase year by year.  Its simply ludicrous for Langley to imply that the early Aulani buyers will still be paying $4.31 per point in 2062.

Another item that should be remembered is that Hawaii's Transient Accommodations Tax is based, in part, on the yearly maintenance fees.  The State of Hawaii uses one-half of a timeshare's annual maintenance fee in computing the tax.  But the law allows the State to use a different amount if it knows that the annual maintenance fee is not representative of a timeshare's true operating expenses.  The Honolulu Star Advertiser article states that Hawaii would let Disney charge the lower MF amount to some owners.  However, I wonder if Hawaii will use the higher, more accurate MF amount in computing the TAT on Aulani stays.  Which then begs the question, Will Disney subsidize the TAT for the early Aulani owners who are grandfathered in with the $4.31 rate?


----------



## Breyean

wdrl said:


> I certainly hope that Langley, the Disney spokesperson, misstated the situation when she said those who already bought Aulani "will not see a dues increase over the life of the 50-year contract that expires in 2062."  As operating expenses increase over the years, why would the early Aulani buyers be exempt from paying for normal cost of living expenses?  If normal cost of living expenses increase 3% in a year, then all Aulani owners should absorb the cost.
> 
> I fully understand that the early Aulani owners should be protected because they bought thinking Aulani's _starting_ MF would be $4.31.  But even those buyers knew, or should have known, that the MF would increase year by year.  Its simply ludicrous for Langley to imply that the early Aulani buyers will still be paying $4.31 per point in 2062.
> 
> Another item that should be remembered is that Hawaii's Transient Accommodations Tax is based, in part, on the yearly maintenance fees.  The State of Hawaii uses one-half of a timeshare's annual maintenance fee in computing the tax.  But the law allows the State to use a different amount if it knows that the annual maintenance fee is not representative of a timeshare's true operating expenses.  The Honolulu Star Advertiser article states that Hawaii would let Disney charge the lower MF amount to some owners.  However, I wonder if Hawaii will use the higher, more accurate MF amount in computing the TAT on Aulani stays.  Which then begs the question, Will Disney subsidize the TAT for the early Aulani owners who are grandfathered in with the $4.31 rate?



I agree. It has to be a mistake on her part. I'm one of the founding Aulani owners, so I would benefit from this, but it's not the right thing to do. 

Just keep me at my original base and apply the normal annual dues increases on a percentage basis on that starting point. That seems fair.

She has to be wrong about the no increase thing. I bet she meant no IMMEDIATE increase to the new dues to be announced for new people buying in now, and no catch up increases in the future just on us to equalize things eventually.


----------



## TisBit

tjkraz said:


> http://www.kitv.com/news/28888158/detail.html
> 
> _The Disney spokeswoman said anyone who already purchased time share units at Aulani for the lower rate will not see a dues increase over the life of the 50-year contract that expires in 2062.
> 
> "It's the right thing to do," said Langley._
> 
> Sure sounds like they plan on subsidizing over the life of the contract.





Chuck S said:


> It may also avoid lawsuits from those owners.  It sounds as if this will be a subsidy without the maximum increases, unlike Vero, where the resort was never fully built out.





wdrl said:


> I certainly hope that Langley, the Disney spokesperson, misstated the situation when she said those who already bought Aulani "will not see a dues increase over the life of the 50-year contract that expires in 2062."  As operating expenses increase over the years, why would the early Aulani buyers be exempt from paying for normal cost of living expenses?  If normal cost of living expenses increase 3% in a year, then all Aulani owners should absorb the cost.
> 
> I fully understand that the early Aulani owners should be protected because they bought thinking Aulani's _starting_ MF would be $4.31.  But even those buyers knew, or should have known, that the MF would increase year by year.  Its simply ludicrous for Langley to imply that the early Aulani buyers will still be paying $4.31 per point in 2062.
> 
> Another item that should be remembered is that Hawaii's Transient Accommodations Tax is based, in part, on the yearly maintenance fees.  The State of Hawaii uses one-half of a timeshare's annual maintenance fee in computing the tax.  But the law allows the State to use a different amount if it knows that the annual maintenance fee is not representative of a timeshare's true operating expenses.  The Honolulu Star Advertiser article states that Hawaii would let Disney charge the lower MF amount to some owners.  However, I wonder if Hawaii will use the higher, more accurate MF amount in computing the TAT on Aulani stays.  Which then begs the question, Will Disney subsidize the TAT for the early Aulani owners who are grandfathered in with the $4.31 rate?



We all know you cannot believe everything you see.  I don't see how DVC or WDW could freeze MF's for 50 years on these members (unless there are considerably less owners than we know about).  It doesn't make sense on any level and is most likely a bad sound bite.  Maybe, possibly they will have a slightly less MF than other purchasers, but even that is yet to be seen.  Lets say that the Mf's were miscalcuated at $1 per point, those owners would recieve that subsidy through the life of the contract at $160...but I don't see how they could be exempt from the normal increases due to normal wear and tear, rising costs of insurance salaries, etc.  

I know that the Sentinel had a similar statement in their orgiinal article, which suddenly was revised with it being reworded.  So it is quite possible that there was a clarification that this reporter has not updated with as well.


----------



## gkrykewy

TisBit said:


> For all intense purposes



intents and purposes.

I'm sorry, but I figured that if this is a turn of phrase you use often, you'd want to know


----------



## tjkraz

FYI, I contacted Rena Langley and she clarified that they intend to calculate a subsidy based upon the 2011 variance (original vs new dues.) That subsidy amount will apply to all early buyers through the end of the term.  

She said that many news outlets have misrepresented her comments.  Dues are not permanently frozen at the $4.3071 level as KITV stated.  If the disparity between $4.3071 and the revised dues amount ends up being $1.00 per point, those early buyers will get a $1.00 per point credit from now until 2062.


----------



## Mickey'sApprentice

tjkraz said:


> FYI, I contacted Rena Langley and she clarified that they intend to calculate a subsidy based upon the 2011 variance (original vs new dues.) That subsidy amount will apply to all early buyers through the end of the term.
> 
> She said that many news outlets have misrepresented her comments.  Dues are not permanently frozen at the $4.3071 level as KITV stated.  If the disparity between $4.3071 and the revised dues amount ends up being $1.00 per point, those early buyers will get a $1.00 per point credit from now until 2062.



Will it be a $ amount less or a percentage amount less?

From a financial point of view, making it a $ amount less will be unfair to current Aulani owners.

Let's say dues go up 5X in 50 years. (For simplicity sake...let's say that the dues difference is 69 cents or $4.31 and $5.00.

If dues go up 5X - then by percentage the dues would be $21.55 and $25.00 respectively. If they made it the same $ amount per year, it would be $24.31 and $25.00. That is not a huge difference...unless you have hundreds of points, or the difference is more than 69 cents...and it probably is more than that.


----------



## bwvBound

tjkraz said:


> FYI, I contacted Rena Langley and she clarified that they intend to calculate a *subsidy based upon the 2011 variance* (original vs new dues.) That subsidy amount will apply to all early buyers through the end of the term.


Thanks for making that contact.  The response makes sense.


----------



## newyorkmike

Someone inquired about potential stock sales by the terminated insiders at Disney.  The "Disney" that is the registrant with the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) is Walt Disney Co.  "Officers" of Walt Disney Co. are required to file a Form 4 with the SEC within two business days of any transaction in the company's stock disclosing the details of the transaction.  These filings by Disney officers are publicly available on the SEC's EDGAR database at:  http://www.sec.gov/cgi-bin/browse-e...K=0001001039&type=&dateb=&owner=only&count=40

An officer is defined under SEC Rules to mean the company's president, principal financial officer, principal accounting officer, principal executive officer, any vice-president of the issuer in charge of a principal business unit, division or function, and any other officer who performs a policy-making function.  

His President title notwithstanding, Jim Lewis was not deemed to be an "officer" of Walt Disney Co. and therefore was not subject to Form 4 reporting obligations.  Jim likely had a direct report to someone higher up in the Walt Disney Co. who was an officer subject to Form 4 reporting, thereby making Jim not an "officer" for purposes of SEC disclosure rules.  So if Jim Lewis unloaded any stock in recent weeks, it would not have been subject to SEC reporting.

However, such sales would have been subject to insider trading liability, i.e., any sales while in possession of material nonpublic information would be a felony.  

With respect to documentation problems in real estate offering documents, in my experience (which is not in Hawaii) there are typically three tiers of regulatory scrutiny: 

(i) immaterial errors or ommissions - can be fixed by "stickering the prospectus" i.e., sending a few page summary explaining what is different to people who have already purchased in the offering.

(ii) material errors or ommissions that are unintentional- must sticker the prospectus and make the investors whole.  Making the investor whole is accomplished in one of two ways.  In a straight stock offering, the regulators will almost always insist you offer rescission to all investors, i.e., each investor must be given the right to rescind his purchase and get his money back.  In real estate or bond offerings, making the investor whole means giving them the original deal.  This would take the form of the points subsidy some posters have discussed, but could also be accomplished in the form of a lump sum refund.

(iii) intentional material errors or ommissions - This is fraud.  The regulators could cancel all contracts, impose significant penalties, and potential criminal liability may exist.   

Every state is different, and I have no idea what the law in Hawaii may be with respect to these issues, and whether or not any of these scenarios is applicable to the suspension of Aulani sales is purely speculative.  You should not construe any of the foregoing information as legal advice and it is not intended as such.  It is provided for information purposes only in the context of the speculative discussion of the Aulani sales suspension and potential outcomes that are being discussed as the possible "for cause" basis of the termination of Jim Lewis.


----------



## pilferk

tjkraz said:


> FYI, I contacted Rena Langley and she clarified that they intend to calculate a subsidy based upon the 2011 variance (original vs new dues.) That subsidy amount will apply to all early buyers through the end of the term.
> 
> She said that many news outlets have misrepresented her comments.  Dues are not permanently frozen at the $4.3071 level as KITV stated.  If the disparity between $4.3071 and the revised dues amount ends up being $1.00 per point, those early buyers will get a $1.00 per point credit from now until 2062.



Good to hear the clarification.

Basically, they're going to go the VB route.


----------



## TisBit

Mickey'sApprentice said:


> Will it be a $ amount less or a percentage amount less?
> 
> From a financial point of view, making it a $ amount less will be unfair to current Aulani owners.
> 
> Let's say dues go up 5X in 50 years. (For simplicity sake...let's say that the dues difference is 69 cents or $4.31 and $5.00.
> 
> If dues go up 5X - then by percentage the dues would be $21.55 and $25.00 respectively. If they made it the same $ amount per year, it would be $24.31 and $25.00. That is not a huge difference...unless you have hundreds of points, or the difference is more than 69 cents...and it probably is more than that.



It actually wouldn't make it unfair.  One is more financially rewarding than the other, but it doesn't mean that it is "fair".  The difference in per point cost which was calculated before and what the new price will be is a set dollar amount.  If they would have been charged $1 more per point, it would have increased every year based on actually increased dollar amounts vs percentage.  

Just because one could potentially save the member more money, doesn't mean that it is "fair" or "unfair".


----------



## Sammie

izzy said:


> I think your first comment is important.  From my experience and in watching some of the financial debacles in the world in the past 10 years or so, people don't normally get fired for a mistake.  Where they get into trouble is when they start trying to cover up that mistake.



Exactly there is usually two scenarios. 

The mistake was intentional. 

The mistake was not intentional but the cover up was. 

Al Weiss early retirement was one of those situations where he was much respected for years of service but there was a reason he needed to go, so they asked him to take early retirement and worked a deal. And he left without any fanfare which tells alot and that no one saw this coming. 

Jim Lewis and the other two were not asked to resign, were not offered a package and were fired. When that is done late on a Friday afternoon, that usually means some one higher up the chain goes with security to the office, asks them to clean out their office and is escorted off the property.

On Friday early afternoon Jim's Disney bio and email were shut down.


----------



## L.C.Clench

Just posted my topic for this in the operations forum, but didnt get a response yet. Thought I'd post here and see what happens..

I am looking for some clarification on some of the titles that have been thrown around recently with the firings and hirings at DVC. I have seen a few different titles of Senior Vice President, Executive Vice President and President. Could someone (maybe someone who works for the company) list the people layed off, their titles and their replacements as well as who will report to who? If you want to include Al Weiss retirement and Meg Croftons promotion as well that would be great. 

Thanks!


----------



## tjkraz

AFAIK, the reporting chain for DVC goes like this:

Bob Iger
Tom Staggs
Karl Holz (Meg Crofton is at roughly the same level, with different duties, also reporting to Staggs)
Claire Bilby

Google for titles.

Al Weiss used to be roughly between Staggs and Crofton / Holz.  His position was essentially eliminated with duties being reshuffled.  

If you're looking for information on folks in finance, legal, or other similar positions, or anyone who will report to Bilby, best of luck to 'ya.


----------



## manning

mjstaceyuofm said:


> I have some hope. Usually with a shake-up like this, the new guy (figurative term in the case of Ms. Bilby) wants to come in and put their stamp on things. Aside from her and Mr. Holz fixing this dues thing, the quickest way for her to put a positive spin on this thing with existing members is to do some quick-fix things at the resorts like cleanliness, better front-line cast members, timely check-ins, etc. It may take a while to achieve all the pie in the sky things our collective Disboards DVC fandom has thrown out there for her to consider, but the aforementioned items are easily achievable and should be right up there with fixing this dues issue.
> 
> Honestly, there's some damage control that needs to be done and aside from rectifying the dues issue, I think she needs to work expeditiously to earn some goodwill and grace from the members.
> 
> Also, Jim Lewis et al may have been fired over this dues flap, but my experience in situations like this tells me Mr. Holz and other Disney execs at his level will want everything that was under Mr. Lewis to be reviewed to make sure there are no other skeletons in the closet. They may see a pattern of practices that aren't Disney quality that the new regime will want to get right with members.
> 
> There are some that seem to think we are getting a better DVC leader in Ms. Bilby than JL ever was. Hopefully that translates into some of the things we've been clamoring for as DVCers recently...



Usually the first move is even a more thorough audit, and the first one is tough to begin with.


----------



## manning

drakethib said:


> Wow.
> 
> I just heard a rumor that Jim Lewis was fired.
> 
> Any truth to that?



Nah, came from a reporter at the Orlander Sentinel who use to be a bus driver at Disney


----------



## lockedoutlogic

manning said:


> Usually the first move is even a more thorough audit, and the first one is tough to begin with.



Exactly...and that is always where the trouble starts in entertainment...cost accounting sucks the juices dry...

Some of the 'simple' suggestions are near impossible...'cleaner rooms' 'better service' and 'better frontline employees' all translate to the same thing: better trained, educated, paid and compensated employees.

Over Iger's dead body...no way at all this will happen.   They will ride the whole horse into bankruptcy before that will ever happen.  They've spent 25 Years cutting and lowering standards...they will not reverse.


But maybe I'm a skeptic...but does anybody else have any faith that this new DVC head is anything more than a 2 bit salesman?

I mean...the resume screams salesman, does it not?


That's gonna mean more cutting and accounting and more sleazy peddling...


----------



## TisBit

Sammie said:


> Exactly there is usually two scenarios.
> 
> The mistake was intentional.
> 
> The mistake was not intentional but the cover up was.
> 
> Al Weiss early retirement was one of those situations where he was much respected for years of service but there was a reason he needed to go, so they asked him to take early retirement and worked a deal. And he left without any fanfare which tells alot and that no one saw this coming.
> 
> Jim Lewis and the other two were not asked to resign, were not offered a package and were fired. When that is done late on a Friday afternoon, that usually means some one higher up the chain goes with security to the office, asks them to clean out their office and is escorted off the property.
> 
> On Friday early afternoon Jim's Disney bio and email were shut down.




I am not exactly sure the timing of this, but Al Weiss retirement might have been the kick off of the investigaiton.  If he had seen this issue and tried to warn his bosses that there was a problem, but not one would listen, it may have prompted him to retire before the house of cards came crashing down.  In doing so, probably expressed his concerns and displeasures...prompting the higher action.

But Al Weiss seemed to have retired just shortly before the sales were suspended.....


----------



## JimC

Did Disney comment on the transferability of the dues credit?  If an early purchaser sells does the new owner get the credit?


----------



## tjkraz

lockedoutlogic said:


> But maybe I'm a skeptic...but does anybody else have any faith that this new DVC head is anything more than a 2 bit salesman?
> 
> I mean...the resume screams salesman, does it not?



Don't think they had any choice.  The position is--first and foremost--a sales position.  I couldn't see them hiring someone with a background in customer service or resort management and saying "gee it would be really nice if you could sell a few points along the way, too."  

She can certainly surround herself with capable people who have a customer service / hotel management background.  

In retrospect, one of the biggest issues with Lewis in recent years was that he seemed to go out of his way to thumb his nose at members.  Small gestures can often have a big impact.  I remember in our early years of ownership (2004/05) mailings would often include things like postcards of the resorts or magnets.  If DVC is spending tens-of-thousands of dollars to mail each member a flashy member handbook or some new promotional deal, how hard is it to include something which is actually practical / meaningful / useful?  

Cleanliness and maintenance will always be challenges.  100% satisfaction is unobtainable.  There is definitely room for improvement, but I also think that members' attitude / outlook would improve with a little token hand-holding.  

I bet there would be a noticeable change in member disposition if we were able to spend a little more time talking about some free trinket received in the mail rather than commiserating over the latest horrible trip report.  

(Of course, thinking back to the 15 anniversary giclee, there was more talk about how it was paid for rather than appreciation so maybe that wouldn't work either.   )


----------



## Mickey'sApprentice

tjkraz said:


> Don't think they had any choice.  The position is--first and foremost--a sales position.  I couldn't see them hiring someone with a background in customer service or resort management and saying "gee it would be really nice if you could sell a few points along the way, too."
> 
> She can certainly surround herself with capable people who have a customer service / hotel management background.
> 
> In retrospect, one of the biggest issues with Lewis in recent years was that he seemed to go out of his way to thumb his nose at members.  Small gestures can often have a big impact.  I remember in our early years of ownership (2004/05) mailings would often include things like postcards of the resorts or magnets.  If DVC is spending tens-of-thousands of dollars to mail each member a flashy member handbook or some new promotional deal, how hard is it to include something which is actually practical / meaningful / useful?
> 
> Cleanliness and maintenance will always be challenges.  100% satisfaction is unobtainable.  There is definitely room for improvement, but I also think that members' attitude / outlook would improve with a little token hand-holding.
> 
> I bet there would be a noticeable change in member disposition if we were able to spend a little more time talking about some free trinket received in the mail rather than commiserating over the latest horrible trip report.
> 
> (Of course, thinking back to the 15 anniversary giclee, there was more talk about how it was paid for rather than appreciation so maybe that wouldn't work either.   )



I have a friend in marketing who says that the majority of why doctors get sued is because of rude people working for them in the office. It seems weird, but my friend swears by it.


----------



## TisBit

JimC said:


> Did Disney comment on the transferability of the dues credit?  If an early purchaser sells does the new owner get the credit?



They have not commented, but I can say the answer will be no.  The dues at VB are only prorated for orginial purchasers due to the changes in the resort plan.  If someone sells Aulani, the new owner will be fully aware of what the current dues are and will not receive a credti because they were not originally affected.


----------



## hakepb

lockedoutlogic said:


> Exactly...and that is always where the trouble starts in entertainment...cost accounting sucks the juices dry...
> 
> Some of the 'simple' suggestions are near impossible...'cleaner rooms' 'better service' and 'better frontline employees' all translate to the same thing: better trained, educated, paid and compensated employees.
> 
> Over Iger's dead body...no way at all this will happen.   They will ride the whole horse into bankruptcy before that will ever happen.  They've spent 25 Years cutting and lowering standards...they will not reverse.
> 
> 
> But maybe I'm a skeptic...but does anybody else have any faith that this new DVC head is anything more than a 2 bit salesman?
> 
> I mean...the resume screams salesman, does it not?
> 
> 
> That's gonna mean more cutting and accounting and more sleazy peddling...



It seems to me the cleaning issues are more than just staff/pay/training.  
And then mousekeeping spends a lot of resources (including resort management offering credits) doing rework.
It seems part of the problem is knowing which rooms need what service on a given day.  I don't think mousekeepers have a real-time system letting them know about all last-minute room assignment changes, etc.  Then it gets compounded with late guest checkout, and the DVC system results in unbalanced mousekeeping needs on a day to day basis...

Something more along the line of a Toyota-type quality initiative (costs go down when you reduce defects) may improve cleaning and reduce costs.  What if there were 3 different colored lights on a mini-hidden mickey at each door.  1 light=T&T. 2=Full cleaning.  3=done(logged by mousekeeper).  Blinking=member still in room.

But that may be against Disney culture which started by throwing a ton of resources at an issue to provide the service when quality mistakes were present.


----------



## disneynutz

hakepb said:


> It seems to me the cleaning issues are more than just staff/pay/training.
> And then mousekeeping spends a lot of resources (including resort management offering credits) doing rework.
> It seems part of the problem is knowing which rooms need what service on a given day.  I don't think mousekeepers have a real-time system letting them know about all last-minute room assignment changes, etc.  Then it gets compounded with late guest checkout, and the DVC system results in unbalanced mousekeeping needs on a day to day basis...
> 
> Something more along the line of a Toyota-type quality initiative (costs go down when you reduce defects) may improve cleaning and reduce costs.  What if there were 3 different colored lights on a mini-hidden mickey at each door.  1 light=T&T. 2=Full cleaning.  3=done(logged by mousekeeper).  Blinking=member still in room.
> 
> But that may be against Disney culture which started by throwing a ton of resources at an issue to provide the service when quality mistakes were present.



My understanding is that they use a system accessed by the in room phone to get their assignments and to report the rooms ready. Problem is that the codes for the system change and most of the Mousekeepers have trouble using the system. That's why often the rooms are not reported as being ready or a dirty room is reported as being cleaned.

 Bill


----------



## hakepb

disneynutz said:


> My understanding is that they use a system accessed by the in room phone to get their assignments and to report the rooms ready. Problem is that the codes for the system change and most of the Mousekeepers have trouble using the system. That's why often the rooms are not reported as being ready or a dirty room is reported as being cleaned.
> 
> Bill



Sounds like a system better developed for a hotel where every occupied room gets cleaned everyday.  In room phones don't help set out laundry baskets in-front of rooms before cleaning days.
I wonder if (OT?) costs could be reduced and check-in times improved if some members got shifted service.  Ie days 3 and 7 instead of 4 and 8. Ask a member at check-in, would you like to help keep dues low by allowing cleaning a day earlier? Then print the room with schedule.


----------



## Sammie

TisBit said:


> I am not exactly sure the timing of this, but Al Weiss retirement might have been the kick off of the investigaiton.  If he had seen this issue and tried to warn his bosses that there was a problem, but not one would listen, it may have prompted him to retire before the house of cards came crashing down.  In doing so, probably expressed his concerns and displeasures...prompting the higher action.
> 
> But Al Weiss seemed to have retired just shortly before the sales were suspended.....



Don't think it was a decision Al made on his own, I think he was encouraged to take an early and sudden retirement. 

If there had been no reason to do it suddenly with the length of time he had been with the company there would have been a prior announcement, a date set for retirement, and big send off. 

It did not happen that way.


----------



## TisBit

Sammie said:


> Don't think it was a decision Al made on his own, I think he was encouraged to take an early and sudden retirement.
> 
> If there had been no reason to do it suddenly with the length of time he had been with the company there would have been a prior announcement, a date set for retirement, and big send off.
> 
> It did not happen that way.



This article (if it is correct) Al is still with Disney directly reporting to Staggs until November 1st.  He stepped down from his position immediately, but did not leave the company immediately.  The article also puts pretty pointedly that he was not available for comment outside of the press report.  This is where I wonder if he pulled a "whistleblower" on Jim Lewis and company, while announcing his pending retirement.  He stays on with WDW for another 6 months helping to sort out the problems at DVC and being available to the audit/investigation teams.  Just saying that it seems pretty logical with the timeline and conditions of his departure.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...hawaiian-hotel-and-time-theme-park-executives



> Al Weiss, the Walt Disney Co.'s top executive in Florida and a longtime civic leader in Orlando, is retiring after 39 years with the company.
> 
> Weiss, the president of worldwide operations for Walt Disney Parks and Resorts, announced the decision Wednesday afternoon in a note to Disney employees.
> 
> The 57-year-old executive will step down from his leadership position effective immediately, though Disney said he will remain with the company working directly with Disney Parks Chairman Tom Staggs until Nov. 1.
> 
> "While I will miss the great people, exciting projects and stellar vision of Disney, I am very excited to begin the next chapter of my life," Weiss wrote. "I will not miss my weekly Monday morning commute to California, but I will look forward to spending time with family, grandchildren and friends and traveling this great big world in which we live."
> 
> Weiss began his career with Disney as an 18-year-old hourly worker in the Magic Kingdom and ultimately held more than 20 different jobs with the company, from finance manager for entertainment to vice president of resort operations support. He was president of Disney World, the company's biggest resort, for 11 years, from 1994 until 2005.
> 
> He also has been active in the Central Florida community. He co-founded and remains actively involved in Vision360, an Orlando organization that builds multidenominational Christian churches. He has chaired the Metro Orlando Economic Development Commission, served on the University of Central Florida's board of trustees and currently sits on the board of directors for the Sanford-Burnham Medical Research Institute.
> 
> Disney said Weiss was unavailable for comment beyond his letter.
> 
> Disney is losing one of its most experienced theme-park executives at an important time, with the division in the midst of a host of big-ticket capital projects. The company launched the first of two new cruise ships in January, will open a Hawaiian hotel and time share this summer and is expanding theme parks in Orlando, California and Hong Kong.
> 
> What's more, Disney recently completed a deal to build a new $4.4 billion resort in Shanghai, in what will be the company's first theme park on mainland China. And Weiss has been a leading supporter of the company's billion-dollar "Next Generation Experience" project, which will introduce a host of technology-driven upgrades at Disney World over the next few years.
> 
> In a separate note to employees, Staggs, the former Disney Co. chief financial officer who now runs the company's theme-park division, suggested that he did not intend to directly replace Weiss. Instead, Staggs said he would detail a new operations structure for Disney's parks division in the coming weeks.
> 
> Staggs credited Weiss with leaving "a profound mark" on Disney's theme-park business.
> 
> "As you all know, he spent his whole professional life with Disney, literally growing up in the company  and most notably serving as an integral part of Walt Disney World Resort through most of its history," Staggs wrote. "That experience enabled him to have a genuine appreciation for and true understanding of all that our cast does, and all that our guests expect. This operational knowledge has been invaluable over the years, and I greatly appreciate all he did to ground me in the business when I moved into this role a year and a half ago."


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## pilferk

hakepb said:


> Sounds like a system better developed for a hotel where every occupied room gets cleaned everyday.  In room phones don't help set out laundry baskets in-front of rooms before cleaning days.
> I wonder if (OT?) costs could be reduced and check-in times improved if some members got shifted service.  Ie days 3 and 7 instead of 4 and 8. Ask a member at check-in, would you like to help keep dues low by allowing cleaning a day earlier? Then print the room with schedule.



There's an easier way to track it....and I'm not sure why Disney doesn't do it.

You use a room key system.  The housekeeper gets 2 keys (one red, one green).  You swipe the red key, when you enter, and begin cleaning.  

You shut the door and swipe the green admin key when you're done cleaning.

Walk away.

The door swipes record every in and out swipe of the keys (and which key was used).  They do this for security purposes..but could (relatively) tie the system into housekeeping.

I've seen a slightly modified, mostly off the rack, system used by BA's in a healthcare setting.

As for assignments (which rooms need cleaning)...pretty much every large hospital in the US has a decent bed management application.  And cleaning a room (when a patient is Discharged or needs cleaning) needs to happen a lot faster, and on a lot less notice, than what usually occurs at a hotel.

But we've seen the disaster that is DisneyIT.


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## manning

pilferk said:


> There's an easier way to track it....and I'm not sure why Disney doesn't do it.
> 
> You use a room key system.  The housekeeper gets 2 keys (one red, one green).  You swipe the red key, when you enter, and begin cleaning.
> 
> You shut the door and swipe the green admin key when you're done cleaning.
> 
> Walk away.
> 
> The door swipes record every in and out swipe of the keys (and which key was used).  They do this for security purposes..but could (relatively) tie the system into housekeeping.
> 
> I've seen a slightly modified, mostly off the rack, system used by BA's in a healthcare setting.
> 
> As for assignments (which rooms need cleaning)...pretty much every large hospital in the US has a decent bed management application.  And cleaning a room (when a patient is Discharged or needs cleaning) needs to happen a lot faster, and on a lot less notice, than what usually occurs at a hotel.
> 
> But we've seen the disaster that is DisneyIT.



Why not program it for one key? The first swipe logs you in the second one logs you out.


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## hakepb

I think 2 keys (or 3 keys,  TnT complete.  Full complete)  would be helpful.  

What if the door locked when you leave the room to get a roll of TP from the cart?  I don't think 1 key only would work.


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## TisBit

pilferk said:


> There's an easier way to track it....and I'm not sure why Disney doesn't do it.
> 
> You use a room key system.  The housekeeper gets 2 keys (one red, one green).  You swipe the red key, when you enter, and begin cleaning.
> 
> You shut the door and swipe the green admin key when you're done cleaning.
> 
> Walk away.
> 
> The door swipes record every in and out swipe of the keys (and which key was used).  They do this for security purposes..but could (relatively) tie the system into housekeeping.
> 
> I've seen a slightly modified, mostly off the rack, system used by BA's in a healthcare setting.
> 
> As for assignments (which rooms need cleaning)...pretty much every large hospital in the US has a decent bed management application.  And cleaning a room (when a patient is Discharged or needs cleaning) needs to happen a lot faster, and on a lot less notice, than what usually occurs at a hotel.
> 
> But we've seen the disaster that is DisneyIT.



Hotel lock systems are not designed this way.  They are not connected to a network and the locks are merely "readers" which determine if the card is permitted access.  All employee cards are stored in the reader, so they work all the time.  The guest cards are read the very first swipe and will continue to work as they were programmed (until such and such date, etc) or until a new guest card is swiped and overrides the previous guests card.  This is why if someone is mistakenly issued the wrong room, when they swipe the new card, it deletes the old guests cards (or if you lose your room key and they reprogram with new cards...but they can do a "reissue" that doesn't delete the other room keys.)

There are wireless systems that have handheld computers where a housekeeper can enter the status of the room and include maintenance codes, etc.  These are then either dowloaded or direct networked via wireless and could improve the maintenace issues as well.


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## doconeill

TisBit said:


> Hotel lock systems are not designed this way.  They are not connected to a network and the locks are merely "readers" which determine if the card is permitted access.  All employee cards are stored in the reader, so they work all the time.  The guest cards are read the very first swipe *and will continue to work as they were programmed (until such and such date, etc) or until a new guest card is swiped and overrides the previous guests card*.  This is why if someone is mistakenly issued the wrong room, when they swipe the new card, it deletes the old guests cards (or if you lose your room key and they reprogram with new cards...but they can do a "reissue" that doesn't delete the other room keys.)



I've wondered how the lock systems work, but this doesn't seem right at all. It would imply that ANYONE can get in to ANY room just by swiping their card, and I could lock everyone out of their rooms by just going down the hall and swiping. So I'm sure there must be something more technical to it that described.

Now, I could see doing something like programming a card with "I can open room X until date Y", but there are also many complications with that. And the readers still need to be programmable (for the employee cards, etc.) and report that data (who entered when, etc.)


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## CarolAnnC

This thread has veered way off of the topic of Jim Lewis' termination, and since we have exhausted the topic anyway, it is time to close this.  Thanks everyone.  You will find a separate thread on the Aulani situation and on the new VP Claire here on Mouse as well.  But if you have an unrelated topic you are seeking to discuss, please feel free to start a new thread.  thank you.


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