# Back to School during the pandemic ...a discussion thread



## pigletto

As the conversation about retuning to school is spilling into some of the other threads this one has been created for dedicated discussion. It‘s a big emotional topic with a lot to consider and discuss. Feel free to jump in.

I’ll start ... I have one 16 year old son who is a strong and eager student. He struggled a lot with online learning in the Spring which we didn’t expect. He didn’t know what was priority and what wasn’t as important. He treated it all as equally important and sat at the table for 8 or more hours some days. He was worried and felt behind all the time. He would like to go back and would benefit a great deal from in person instruction . However online learning is likely to be different in the Fall now that there has been time to prepare.
I would probably prefer he didn’t go back and would rather see how it all shakes out but I haven’t said that because I am not sure. I‘m also very unimpressed that our board is not mandating masks, especially for high school students.

So that’s where we are in a nutshell. Please share your thoughts and personal situations .


----------



## wdwmom3

Well my older kids are in university now, so I just have my 10 year old.  For him we found online learning was really just a way to spend time, didn’t really learn anything new. We have spent a lot of time making our decision as we have high risk family members. That said we have noticed a change in our son over the last couple months.  He desperately misses being around his classmates.  It’s gotten a little better after sports teams starting up, but he’s still not himself.  

We have decided he will be back at school.  My husband and I, plus my own older child will all be home during the day (working and studying) and have the ability to keep him home.  But that’s not what’s best for him.  For his mental health and social development, he needs to be back in a classroom with friends at least part time.  We have been big with mask wearing, sanitizing etc and his sports practices are already huge in keeping distance etc.   So we’ve seen how he’s handled that and the extra things to keep safe don’t seem to stress him.  He would rather wear a mask and have to stay a few feet away, but get to see some friends, then be stuck at home.  

We will be skipping the school bus and driving him ourselves though.  Partially to reduce that exposure, and to help with limited capacity.  We are also making sure we are prepared to have him home again if things get worse.  Right now our cases are fairly low in our area so we feel safe in our decision.


----------



## hdrolfe

My son will be going back, he's 10 and going into grade 6. Whether part time or full time, for his mental health he needs to go and see friends, play. I am able to work from home and will hopefully be able to continue to do so, his will be the only exposure we get (other than me going to get groceries once a week). He normally walks now, I was driving him to daycare but won't be using that since I'll be home any way. Technically, I could keep him home, but the few months before he was allowed to go play with friends again were very difficult for him. His activity level was not high enough, and since I am also working, I am not able to pay that much attention to him as he needs. 

The Ottawa Catholic Board seems to have laid out a decent plan for going back, hopefully it isn't too difficult to implement the recommendations. I have purchases masks for him, though they may not need them all day, I imagine they will during breaks, walking the halls, etc. I'll also send him with hand sanitizer. He already has a good sized backpack as they will be carrying everything with them and not using a cubby for their stuff. They are pushing for electronic work instead of paper, and he has a chromebook for school that my parents got him for Christmas so he's set there. I am not sure how they will manager French Immersion, they are different teachers, last year he had 3 for the various classes, but I understand they are limiting it to one teacher per cohort, so perhaps they will have a virtual lesson for the French? I don't know. 

I will be contacting the school to make sure he is not with a certain boy he always fights with, and that they will be able to accommodate his needs. I understand Gym is out, but hopefully they will be able to have outdoor time to run and move. It's his last year at this school. Given he didn't do very much after March, I hope he will be able to make it up. He is a smart kid, I know he can catch up if he has the right teacher.


----------



## bababear_50

I had a feeling the boards would not have a say when Ford and the *Leech* spoke last week about making an announcement this coming week.
Well it's up to parents to ask the questions now,,because so far the precautions they stated in the past are not in the works for my school for this coming Sept.


So sad,and wrong!
Hugs
Mel


----------



## wdwmom3

bababear_50 said:


> I had a feeling the boards would not have a say when Ford and the *Leech* spoke last week about making an announcement this coming week.
> Well it's up to parents to ask the questions now,,because so far the precautions they stated in the past are not in the works for my school for this coming Sept.
> 
> 
> So sad,and wrong!
> Hugs
> Mel



I could be wrong cause things keep changing.  But I thought boards did have a say but their plans had to be approved? Our school board has released and fairly detailed plan on what they plan on doing for a modified approach .  It sounds like they are just waiting for things to be approved and to get some clarity on a few things (like wearing masks).  I guess we just have to wait and see, the announcement could be about funding? Who knows.


----------



## bababear_50

wdwmom3 said:


> I could be wrong cause things keep changing.  But I thought boards did have a say but their plans had to be approved? Our school board has released and fairly detailed plan on what they plan on doing for a modified approach .  It sounds like they are just waiting for things to be approved and to get some clarity on a few things (like wearing masks).  I guess we just have to wait and see, the announcement could be about funding? Who knows.



The most recent email I got indicated that the Board would have a say but if TDSB has passed
with no changes pre covid 19 then I don't know what to think.
Yeah our plans looked very detailed (modified approach) and included lots of precautions.
Let's see what the *Leech* has to say this week.
Agreed who knows? BUT we should as we are the ones putting ourselves out there.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## Madame

bababear_50 said:


> The most recent email I got indicated that the Board would have a say but if TDSB has passed
> with no changes pre covid 19 then I don't know what to think.
> Yeah our plans looked very detailed (modified approach) and included lots of precautions.
> Let's see what the *Leech* has to say this week.
> Agreed who knows? BUT we should as we are the ones putting ourselves out there.
> 
> Hugs
> Mel


Just wanted to clarify in case it wasn’t a typo - it’s TCDSB not TDSB who voted to return at pre-Covid numbers.  Yeah, they are throwing us all under the bus & undermining our fight for safe numbers.  Consensus amongst the ed experts I follow on Twitter (not union members) is that they realize no funding is forthcoming and realistically this is the only option.  It’s becoming a political football when it should be about what is best for kids & staff.


----------



## pigletto

I have a sister in law who is a teacher and from the beginning she said despite what Ford and the Education Minister were saying  publicly, the boards were being told what to do privately and not being given much say at all .


----------



## pigletto

bababear_50 said:


> The most recent email I got indicated that the Board would have a say but if TDSB has passed
> with no changes pre covid 19 then I don't know what to think.
> Yeah our plans looked very detailed (modified approach) and included lots of precautions.
> Let's see what the *Leech* has to say this week.
> Agreed who knows? BUT we should as we are the ones putting ourselves out there.
> 
> Hugs
> Mel


I’m really on the fence about all of this and I’m going to really make an effort to educate myself but a huge consideration in my choices to send my child back will be the safety of staff. Nobody should be risking their health and safety to educate my child .


----------



## bababear_50

Madame said:


> Just wanted to clarify in case it wasn’t a typo - it’s TCDSB not TDSB who voted to return at pre-Covid numbers.  Yeah, they are throwing us all under the bus & undermining our fight for safe numbers.  Consensus amongst the ed experts I follow on Twitter (not union members) is that they realize no funding is forthcoming and realistically this is the only option.  It’s becoming a political football when it should be about what is best for kids & staff.



Hi Hon
Thanks for clarifying that.
For those wondering....
TCDSB Toronto Catholic District School Board
TDSB Toronto District School Board.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## Madame

pigletto said:


> I’m really on the fence about all of this and I’m going to really make an effort to educate myself but a huge consideration in my choices to send my child back will be the safety of staff. Nobody should be risking their health and safety to educate my child .


The sad part is, that at 15 to 1 and mandatory masks, it’s doable.  We can be as safe as possible, not perfect, but ok.  It’s just going to cost a lot of money & boards are begging for it (more of them just today).  The MoE is counting on parents like me who will voluntarily keep their kids at home & sacrifice time etc to educate their own kids, so they don’t have to pony up the funding.

It’s crazy to think that I cannot send my kids unvaccinated for polio to school in Sept, but this is ok?!?  My DD is upset she will miss her gr 8 yr.  I’m happy that she’ll never wonder if *she* brought home a disease which (God forbid) killed an at-risk member of our extended family.  The 1st she’ll get over, the second on the other hand...


----------



## MoreTravels

Parents are under a highly stressful environment to work. I have seen over the years that parents send their kids with running nose, coughs, or even fever to class because they cannot suddenly cancel business meetings and client deals. Some of them even intentionally trying to hide the symptoms by taking cough syrup and Advil.

I am afraid the same practice will continue by those parents. There are also asymptotic cases. The sad reality is that we will not see the infection rate from school opening until October and deaths until November. By the the horses have already left the barn and it’s too late to close the school again.


----------



## martikus

My son is entering 8th grade.  I feel in minority that it’s not end of world if he doesn’t have a great academic year.  It’s not high school and some years you can have a bad teacher.  I’m just hoping for good enough.  So many people around here are stressing about finding the perfect online school etc.

Since this virus is clearly around awhile, especially since I live I’m USA and more specifically SC where the leadership is terrible so no confidence virus disappearing we left It up to my son.

he wants in person.  His school is doing every other day so half the kids which makes me feel safer.  And they are requiring masks.  And we will skip the bus this year.

I also think because the states are doing such a poor job and so many people are living like their isn’t a virus (even on these boards the number not putting off Disney vaca is staggering) I’m mentally ready for his school to have to go virtual.  It will be what it will be.

just trying to take it one day at a time.


----------



## bcwife76

Here in BC the education minister is set to give an announcement about September this coming week. For the past few weeks we have all been led to believe we will return to blended learning but now from what I hear, BC wants full time participation for elementary and middle school and blended for high school. Guess we will find out this week. Then the premier announced "be prepared to have a plan B in case the virus creates a second wave." My kids are going into grades 5&7 and will be going back with, what I hope, are extra precautions. I'll post again later this week with an update once our education minister makes his announcement.


----------



## wdwmom3

martikus said:


> My son is entering 8th grade.  I feel in minority that it’s not end of world if he doesn’t have a great academic year.  It’s not high school and some years you can have a bad teacher.  I’m just hoping for good enough.  So many people around here are stressing about finding the perfect online school etc.
> 
> Since this virus is clearly around awhile, especially since I live I’m USA and more specifically SC where the leadership is terrible so no confidence virus disappearing we left It up to my son.
> 
> he wants in person.  His school is doing every other day so half the kids which makes me feel safer.  And they are requiring masks.  And we will skip the bus this year.
> 
> I also think because the states are doing such a poor job and so many people are living like their isn’t a virus (even on these boards the number not putting off Disney vaca is staggering) I’m mentally ready for his school to have to go virtual.  It will be what it will be.
> 
> just trying to take it one day at a time.



I have to say that if I lived in the US I would 100% not be sending my kids to school.  The case levels in Canada are nowhere near what they are in the US.  In Ontario we have been hovering around an average of 150 new cases a day for the entire province and that’s with some major outbreaks on farms.  My region seems to hover around an average of 3-4 new cases a day.  That risk I can tolerate my kid at school.  If it went back up to where we were in April, nope my kid is at home.  

I have to say I can’t believe the US is even considering in class at the moment.


----------



## Frozen2014

I don't even know what I want for our kids.  My older one is independent (going into grade 10) and my younger one is almost there (going into grade 6) so childcare isn't an issue. Plus at the moment, both DH and I are at home...not sure when/if our works will send us back to the office.

Onlien learning wasn't much learning.  Our school (in york region) really did try and i think our school did a great job at keeping the kids in touch and motivated.  They sent personal letters of "we miss you" and my DD's teacher even called her end of the year.  Both kids did ok with the online stuff, but they had work for maybe 2-3 hrs a day and free time rest of the day.  SO they certainly didn't learn much. Plus it was more assignments than teaching.

But the reality is that the virus is still here.  So while it's running at large, as a parent I am scared sending them each day.  Having said that, I don't want them locked up for more months and not socializing.  That's not healthy either.

In the surveyI voted a mix, but then that may be riskier as then some parents will need to sen their kids for additional childcare, exposing them to another source.  No easy solution.


----------



## hdrolfe

Frozen2014 said:


> more assignments than teaching.



I think this was a good part of the problem I had in the spring. I am not a teacher, the way I learned things is not even close to how they teach them now. It was difficult for my son who wasn't interested any way, and if he couldn't figure out on his own how to do something, it was no go. And trying to do both the learning and get my full work day in... impossible. 

The whole situation is just frustrating for everyone. I can't see letting him do nothing for an entire school year, but I also want everyone to be safe. It is hard when things are "opening" and people seem to be forgetting why we are all cooped up. There are 3 daycares in Ottawa now with COVID cases. That's the daycare centres, not home daycares. Sure, kids will recover, but they are also saying they are the ones presenting more cases now, it's scary times.


----------



## mshanson3121

I had shared some of this in the other thread but figured would share here in the actual school thread.

In NB, for K-8, children will be going to school "as normal", though a modified normal. School will be in class, M-F, regular (and potentially expanded) hours. Class sizes for K-5 will be reduced, and 6-8 as well, _if possible_. There will be no masks required. There will be no social distancing required. There will be a bubble (presumed to be a single class), and you will only be able to socialize and interact with the students in your bubble. Arrival, departure, recess and lunch times will now be staggered, to reduce the amount of students in one space. As a result, they are talking about expanding the school day to accommodate. There will be no extra-curriculars. They are asking every parent who is capable to drive their children to school, instead of using the bus. For high school students, social distancing will be required, and they will be doing blended delivery - part in class, part online. They will also be required to provide their own computer.

So... these are my thoughts:

So, the main issues as I see it are: first and foremost, we're going into this more or less blind.  This situation is still evolving. Plans are up in the air because there's a thousand different scenarios and no one knows how it's all going to play out. At the same time, they are rushing to try and come up with some sort of plan, because they school year is fast approaching. Rushed plans are rarely good plans.

Too many parents think it's going to be their "saving grace", that their lonely kids are going to go back to school, see their friends like they used to, that they'll get the same quality education that they would have before etc... and the reality is, they're not. This school year is going to be extremely stressful for teachers, parents _AND_ students. This will be reflected in the learning. Students aren't going to be seeing their friends like they used to (if they are placed in a different bubble they won't be allowed to see their friends at all), they aren't going to have their sports and activities and they're going to be trying to adjust to a highly different schedule, routine, stressful atmosphere, and for high schoolers, a different learning format.  Young students that rely on bussing are going to be _exhausted_. Where we are, with a lot of rural areas, some/many students already have to get on the bus at 7:30 am. If they fall under the new staggered start time, they will be getting on the bus at 7:00 am, potentially earlier in the winter. That's too early.

Many parents are going to have to deal with the bussing shortage issues and find ways of trying to accommodate their students new schedule into their work schedule. Not to mention the stress of having to take time off work every time your child has a doesn't clear the screening (no symptoms allowed - temperature, cough, sniffles etc...), since they won't be allowed at daycare, either. During cold and flu season, this could be be quite a bit. And of course, two weeks off work if your child is exposed and has to isolate.  Students will potentially miss a lot of time because of ^^.  And what of the teachers who don't meet screening? Who get sick and are suddenly gone for 1-2 months? Who have a spouse or child who get sick and they have to stay home and self-isolate for 2 weeks? We're short-staffed as it is, and the government has already had to go through and redistribute jobs to try and accommodate the extra staffing needed, so they can reduce the class sizes as much as possible. There isn't a lot of availability left to cover these scenarios.  So, either your child's class get shut down, or they deal with a rotation of supply teachers (which has a negative impact on learning).

Furthermore, our province has already announced that if another outbreak occurs, schools will be shut down and revert totally to online learning, for all grades. So, the strong possibility is, is that we start off with this ^^ mess in the fall, and then come winter, we're right back to where we were - children at home, learning at home.

So what are the options? I mean these are my ideas, but they all pose their own issues:

1. Scrap the school year completely. Take the savings and give a dividend to families to help offset the increase in daycare costs. The biggest problem being of course there aren't enough daycare spaces, since let's call a spade a spade, school is largely free daycare.

2. Just do the whole thing online. You eliminate the back and forth and exposure risks. The problems being of course potential quality of learning issues (online doesn't begin to compare to a classroom setting for the majority of learners) and we're right back to daycare issues. What do working parents of daycare aged children do?

3. Move learning outdoors. This was done in many places during the 1918-1919 pandemic, and is being done in some places this year, and is done in other places (yes, even cold places). This would definitely reduce exposure risk, but people will balk and throw a fit at the idea, and there are logistical issues too - families that can't afford quality winter gear for their children, the need for a lower student-teacher ratio due to safety, special needs issues etc...

4. Just do half days. Rethink the curriculum for the year. Just teach the 3Rs only, since they really are the foundation of all other learning, and are the worst to have interrupted. It would make it easier to spread kids out, reduce class sizes, and generally have less exposure. Though there would still be many of the same issues as I initially laid out, and of course... daycare.

so I have no idea what the solution is.  I just know I'm so grateful that I'm a SAHM and we homeschool. I feel so bad for my friends who have to deal with this mess.  I do know that if nothing else, Covid has done a great job of shining a light on the problem that a two-parent working household presents. Once upon a time, for better or worse, most of this would have been a non-issue since the mother would have been already home, making the situation far easier to deal with.


----------



## Madame

mshanson3121 said:


> I had shared some of this in the other thread but figured would share here in the actual school thread.
> 
> In NB, for K-8, children will be going to school "as normal", though a modified normal. School will be in class, M-F, regular (and potentially expanded) hours. Class sizes for K-5 will be reduced, and 6-8 as well, _if possible_. There will be no masks required. There will be no social distancing required. There will be a bubble (presumed to be a single class), and you will only be able to socialized and interact with the students in your bubble. Arrival, departure, recess and lunch times will now be staggered, to reduce the amount of students in one space. As a result, they are talking about expanding the school day to accommodate. There will be no extra-curriculars. They are asking every parent who is capable to drive their children to school, instead of using the bus. For high school students, social distancing will be required, and they will be doing blended delivery - part in class, part online. They will also be required to provide their own computer.
> 
> So... these are my thoughts:
> 
> So, the main issues as I see it are: first and foremost, we're going into this more or less blind.  This situation is still evolving. Plans are up in the air because there's a thousand different scenarios and no one knows how it's all going to play out. At the same time, they are rushing to try and come up with some sort of plan, because they school year is fast approaching. Rushed plans are rarely good plans.
> 
> Too many parents think it's going to be their "saving grace", that their lonely kids are going to go back to school, see their friends like they used to, that they'll get the same quality education that they would have before etc... and the reality is, they're not. This school year is going to be extremely stressful for teachers, parents _AND_ students. This will be reflected in the learning. Students aren't going to be seeing their friends like they used to (if they are placed in a different bubble they won't be allowed to see their friends at all), they aren't going to have their sports and activities and they're going to be trying to adjust to a highly different schedule, routine, stressful atmosphere, and for high schoolers, a different learning format.  Young students that rely on bussing are going to be _exhausted_. Where we are, with a lot of rural areas, some/many students already have to get on the bus at 7:30 am. If they fall under the new staggered start time, they will be getting on the bus at 7:00 am, potentially earlier in the winter. That's too early.
> 
> Many parents are going to have to deal with the bussing shortage issues and find ways of trying to accommodate their students new schedule into their work schedule. Not to mention the stress of having to take time off work every time your child has a doesn't clear the screening (no symptoms allowed - temperature, cough, sniffles etc...), since they won't be allowed at daycare, either. During cold and flu season, this could be be quite a bit. And of course, two weeks off work if your child is exposed and has to isolate.  Students will potentially miss a lot of time because of ^^.  And what of the teachers who don't meet screening? Who get sick and are suddenly gone for 1-2 months? Who have a spouse or child who get sick and they have to stay home and self-isolate for 2 weeks? We're short-staffed as it is, and the government has already had to go through and redistribute jobs to try and accommodate the extra staffing needed, so they can reduce the class sizes as much as possible. There isn't a lot of availability left to cover these scenarios.  So, either your child's class get shut down, or they deal with a rotation of supply teachers (which has a negative impact on learning).
> 
> Furthermore, our province has already announced that if another outbreak occurs, schools will be shut down and revert totally to online learning, for all grades. So, the strong possibility is, is that we start off with this ^^ mess in the fall, and then come winter, we're right back to where we were - children at home, learning at home.
> 
> So what are the options? I mean these are my ideas, but they all pose their own issues:
> 
> 1. Scrap the school year completely. Take the savings and give a dividend to families to help offset the increase in daycare costs. The biggest problem being of course there aren't enough daycare spaces, since let's call a spade a spade, school is largely free daycare.
> 
> 2. Just do the whole thing online. You eliminate the back and forth and exposure risks. The problems being of course potential quality of learning issues (online doesn't begin to compare to a classroom setting for the majority of learners) and we're right back to daycare issues. What do working parents of daycare aged children do?
> 
> 3. Move learning outdoors. This was done in many places during the 1918-1919 pandemic, and is being done in some places this year, and is done in other places (yes, even cold places). This would definitely reduce exposure risk, but people will balk and throw a fit at the idea, and there are logistical issues too - families that can't afford quality winter gear for their children, the need for a lower student-teacher ratio due to safety, special needs issues etc...
> 
> 4. Just do half days. Rethink the curriculum for the year. Just teach the 3Rs only, since they really are the foundation of all other learning, and are the worst to have interrupted. It would make it easier to spread kids out, reduce class sizes, and generally have less exposure. Though there would still be many of the same issues as I initially laid out, and of course... daycare.
> 
> so I have no idea what the solution is.  I just know I'm so grateful that I'm a SAHM and we homeschool. I feel so bad for my friends who have to deal with this mess.  I do know that if nothing else, Covid has done a great job of shining a light on the problem that a two-parent working household presents. Once upon a time, for better or worse, most of this would have been a non-issue since the mother would have been already home, making the situation far easier to deal with.


Absolutely all of this   I was discussing our decision with our kids again last night - this is hard on them & on us.  We assume most of their friends will return to school and that means no in person contact with their friends, not even the slight socially distanced contact we’ve managed this month; it would simply expose us to the entire school population & the fact I will be exposed to a space with 1000 + teens a day is sufficient.....

I told them not to worry about it.  Chances are everyone will be back online full time by Thanksgiving


----------



## wdwmom3

mshanson3121 said:


> I had shared some of this in the other thread but figured would share here in the actual school thread.
> 
> In NB, for K-8, children will be going to school "as normal", though a modified normal. School will be in class, M-F, regular (and potentially expanded) hours. Class sizes for K-5 will be reduced, and 6-8 as well, _if possible_. There will be no masks required. There will be no social distancing required. There will be a bubble (presumed to be a single class), and you will only be able to socialized and interact with the students in your bubble. Arrival, departure, recess and lunch times will now be staggered, to reduce the amount of students in one space. As a result, they are talking about expanding the school day to accommodate. There will be no extra-curriculars. They are asking every parent who is capable to drive their children to school, instead of using the bus. For high school students, social distancing will be required, and they will be doing blended delivery - part in class, part online. They will also be required to provide their own computer.
> 
> So... these are my thoughts:
> 
> So, the main issues as I see it are: first and foremost, we're going into this more or less blind.  This situation is still evolving. Plans are up in the air because there's a thousand different scenarios and no one knows how it's all going to play out. At the same time, they are rushing to try and come up with some sort of plan, because they school year is fast approaching. Rushed plans are rarely good plans.
> 
> Too many parents think it's going to be their "saving grace", that their lonely kids are going to go back to school, see their friends like they used to, that they'll get the same quality education that they would have before etc... and the reality is, they're not. This school year is going to be extremely stressful for teachers, parents _AND_ students. This will be reflected in the learning. Students aren't going to be seeing their friends like they used to (if they are placed in a different bubble they won't be allowed to see their friends at all), they aren't going to have their sports and activities and they're going to be trying to adjust to a highly different schedule, routine, stressful atmosphere, and for high schoolers, a different learning format.  Young students that rely on bussing are going to be _exhausted_. Where we are, with a lot of rural areas, some/many students already have to get on the bus at 7:30 am. If they fall under the new staggered start time, they will be getting on the bus at 7:00 am, potentially earlier in the winter. That's too early.
> 
> Many parents are going to have to deal with the bussing shortage issues and find ways of trying to accommodate their students new schedule into their work schedule. Not to mention the stress of having to take time off work every time your child has a doesn't clear the screening (no symptoms allowed - temperature, cough, sniffles etc...), since they won't be allowed at daycare, either. During cold and flu season, this could be be quite a bit. And of course, two weeks off work if your child is exposed and has to isolate.  Students will potentially miss a lot of time because of ^^.  And what of the teachers who don't meet screening? Who get sick and are suddenly gone for 1-2 months? Who have a spouse or child who get sick and they have to stay home and self-isolate for 2 weeks? We're short-staffed as it is, and the government has already had to go through and redistribute jobs to try and accommodate the extra staffing needed, so they can reduce the class sizes as much as possible. There isn't a lot of availability left to cover these scenarios.  So, either your child's class get shut down, or they deal with a rotation of supply teachers (which has a negative impact on learning).
> 
> Furthermore, our province has already announced that if another outbreak occurs, schools will be shut down and revert totally to online learning, for all grades. So, the strong possibility is, is that we start off with this ^^ mess in the fall, and then come winter, we're right back to where we were - children at home, learning at home.
> 
> So what are the options? I mean these are my ideas, but they all pose their own issues:
> 
> 1. Scrap the school year completely. Take the savings and give a dividend to families to help offset the increase in daycare costs. The biggest problem being of course there aren't enough daycare spaces, since let's call a spade a spade, school is largely free daycare.
> 
> 2. Just do the whole thing online. You eliminate the back and forth and exposure risks. The problems being of course potential quality of learning issues (online doesn't begin to compare to a classroom setting for the majority of learners) and we're right back to daycare issues. What do working parents of daycare aged children do?
> 
> 3. Move learning outdoors. This was done in many places during the 1918-1919 pandemic, and is being done in some places this year, and is done in other places (yes, even cold places). This would definitely reduce exposure risk, but people will balk and throw a fit at the idea, and there are logistical issues too - families that can't afford quality winter gear for their children, the need for a lower student-teacher ratio due to safety, special needs issues etc...
> 
> 4. Just do half days. Rethink the curriculum for the year. Just teach the 3Rs only, since they really are the foundation of all other learning, and are the worst to have interrupted. It would make it easier to spread kids out, reduce class sizes, and generally have less exposure. Though there would still be many of the same issues as I initially laid out, and of course... daycare.
> 
> so I have no idea what the solution is.  I just know I'm so grateful that I'm a SAHM and we homeschool. I feel so bad for my friends who have to deal with this mess.  I do know that if nothing else, Covid has done a great job of shining a light on the problem that a two-parent working household presents. Once upon a time, for better or worse, most of this would have been a non-issue since the mother would have been already home, making the situation far easier to deal with.



I don’t think any of us who want our kids back in school thinks it’s our “saving grace”.  And we know it won’t be the same.  But yeah some kids who haven’t seen any friends in months just want to be back even if it’s not the same.  Just because they can’t do all the things they used to doesn’t mean it’s not a better option for them then staying home.  

I have started to notice a trend, many parents who think kids should stay home are quick to point out every little issue with kids going back to school.  They make a huge deal out of things like “kids won’t get to play sports or see all of their friends”.  Yet those things aren’t an issue with keeping kids home? How is that? It’s like they feel the need to justify not sending their kids.  You don’t.  We get it, and don’t judge you. 

I would just like to point out that those of us who want our kids in school for various reasons are not stupid, we know all these things.  We have thought long and hard about our decisions.  We don’t sit here and point out all the reasons why keeping kids at home isn’t a good idea.  So why do others feel the need to bring up every little issue with sending kids to school.


----------



## Madame

wdwmom3 said:


> I don’t think any of us who want our kids back in school thinks it’s our “saving grace”.  And we know it won’t be the same.  But yeah some kids who haven’t seen any friends in months just want to be back even if it’s not the same.  Just because they can’t do all the things they used to doesn’t mean it’s a better option for them then staying home.
> 
> I have started to notice a trend, many parents who think kids should stay home are quick to point out every little issue with kids going back to school.  They make a huge deal out of things like “kids won’t get to play sports or see all of their friends”.  Yet those things aren’t an issue with keeping kids home? How is that? It’s like they feel the need to justify not sending their kids.  You don’t.  We get it, and don’t judge you.
> 
> I would just like to point out that those of us who want our kids in school for various reasons are not stupid, we know all these things.  We have thought long and hard about our decisions.  We don’t sit here and point out all the reasons why keeping kids at home isn’t a good idea.  So why do others feel the need to bring up every little issue with sending kids to school.
> [/QUOTE


I can only answer for me personally & this is the only time I will respond to you going forward.  I understand *needing* to send your child back.  Keeping my kids home will be literally taking on a 3rd job for me - Moms wear all the hats unfortunately.  I am in no way qualified to teach grade 6 or 8 anything besides French & History.  What I want the public to understand is that this is not being funded correctly & since it is not MY life is at risk.  MINE.  A 44 year old Mom of 3 that needs to pay bills.  So right or wrong when others say my child needs to return for socialization I hear “your actual life < kids’ social lives.

Sure I signed up for the job, but other than breaking up a fight while pregnant once or a fleeting thought during an active shooter drill I did not believe I was signing up to potentially die.  Jobs other than health care do not have the same interaction risk, but if they can work from home they will continue to.  So let’s put everyone on the same risk footing, no?  Everyone back to work...  That won’t happen becauseprivate companies will get sued for unsafe work conditions.   Ask yourself why post secondary kids are online.  I wish you and  yours a safe and healthy school year


----------



## wdwmom3

Madame said:


> I can only answer for me personally & this is the only time I will respond to you going forward.  I understand *needing* to send your child back.  Keeping my kids home will be literally taking on a 3rd job for me - Moms wear all the hats unfortunately.  I am in no way qualified to teach grade 6 or 8 anything besides French & History.  What I want the public to understand is that this is not being funded correctly & since it is not MY life is at risk.  MINE.  A 44 year old Mom of 3 that needs to pay bills.  So right or wrong when others say my child needs to return for socialization I hear “your actual life < kids’ social lives.
> 
> Sure I signed up for the job, but other than breaking up a fight while pregnant once or a fleeting thought during an active shooter drill I did not believe I was signing up to potentially die.  Jobs other than health care do not have the same interaction risk, but if they can work from home they will continue to.  So let’s put everyone on the same risk footing, no?  Everyone back to work...  That won’t happen becauseprivate companies will get sued for unsafe work conditions.   Ask yourself why post secondary kids are online.  I wish you and  yours a safe and healthy school year



See this is my point.  The way you put “needing” in quotes shows how dismissive you are.  You seem angry at parents who want their kids back in school.  Nobody is arguing with your choice to keep your kids home, or tell you it’s wrong.  But people want to tell parents who are sending their kids how terrible they are.  And nobody is talking about our kids social life, we are talking about our kids mental heath and social development.  The fact you don’t get that actually worries me. 

It sounds like to me you are more upset with going back to work.  You have the same options as those working in food processing plants, dentists, etc.   If you don’t like it don’t go back to work. Your not the only one and teaching is not the only profession that has had to face difficult decisions.  But don’t blame the parents.  You may not get it but many kids do need school.


----------



## Madame

wdwmom3 said:


> See this is my point.  The way you put “needing” in quotes shows how dismissive you are.  You seem angry at parents who want their kids back in school.  Nobody is arguing with your choice to keep your kids home, or tell you it’s wrong.  But people want to tell parents who are sending their kids how terrible they are.
> 
> It sounds like to me you are more upset with going back to work.  You have the same options as those working in food processing plants, dentists, etc.   If you don’t like it don’t go back to work. Your not the only one and teaching is not the only profession that has had to face difficult decisions.  But don’t blame the parents.  You may not get it but many kids do need school.


Please stop.  I am begging you to please stop.  I am not angry at parents.  I am not angry at going back to work.  Some teachers might have put in the minimum for online learning but (and I have the feeling you won’t believe me) I was available all week-end and up to 11pm for my kids.  I had my messages forwarded directly to my phone and my phone constantly at my side.

I understand that teachers are not supposed to self-advocate.  I get that it’s not done and is seen as whinging and laziness.  That’s truly not who I am.  I am blocking you now, but I do hope you have a safe school year.


----------



## wdwmom3

For the rest of this thread can we all please not judge others.  Can we try not to convince parents what the best thing to do is.  Can we stop focusing on all the negative things of the options we didn’t choose. 

Every situation is unique.  Every child is different and has different needs.  There is no right answer.  What is best for every family will be different.  For some keeping kids home is what they need, for others they 100% need to be back at school, and for others they fall somewhere in between.  

It’s not an easy decision for any parent to make.  And every parent has considered all options.  There is absolutely no reason for anyone to need to justify their decision.  And nobody needs to made to feel bad by others, or more fearful, because of their choice.


----------



## 22Tink

bcwife76 said:


> Here in BC the education minister is set to give an announcement about September this coming week. For the past few weeks we have all been led to believe we will return to blended learning but now from what I hear, BC wants full time participation for elementary and middle school and blended for high school. Guess we will find out this week. Then the premier announced "be prepared to have a plan B in case the virus creates a second wave." My kids are going into grades 5&7 and will be going back with, what I hope, are extra precautions. I'll post again later this week with an update once our education minister makes his announcement.


Thanks for this, I’ll keep be watching for that. I hadn’t really heard or seen much regarding our province’s plans for school. My daughter is going into grade 7 and in my town that’s a high school grade since we don’t have a middle school. We have 4 public elementary schools (k-6) that feed into our 1 high school. Our high school has a grade 7/8 wing that is segregated from the rest of the school so it’ll be interesting to see how they handle that.


----------



## Renarr

I think where the challenge in this particular situation is going to be is that there are districts where what families are choosing and what staff are choosing are not in equal proportions.  In order to normalize that, some people are going to be forced to abide by a choice that they did not get to make.  And there will be substantial hand-wringing in that process.

If a parent is told that their child has to still stay home to satisfy the staff choosing to stay home, while other students are permitted in school, that parent is going to rightfully feel that their voice isn't being heard.

If a staff member is told that they have to report to work to satisfy the families choosing to send their students to school, while other staff are permitted to work remotely, that staff member is going to rightfully feel that their voice isn't being heard.

And the truth of it all is, these decisions are going to be made by people who don't know the particulars of the student and staff lives that led to those choices.  Ultimately, I think that's why these conversations end up being so heated.  There are going to be people forced to do something they don't want to do, and that they feel jeopardizes the health (physical, mental, social/emotional) of themselves or a family member.  And what a terrible situation that is!

Personally, I'm an at-risk staff member, with an at-risk family member.  I've put in the request with my district to work remotely, but I also know that more staff members are in the at-risk population than families have put in to learn remotely.  So I'm weighing the possibilities of what I'm going to do if told to report to work, that my at-risk situation isn't "at enough risk".  Financially, I could afford to take a year's leave of absence and be okay.  I'd rather not do it, but in listening to conversations from my district, as well as seeing the actions of my administration in other matters, this may be the situation I'm looking at.

Where I really struggle with the societal conversation around a number of issues (not just COVID-related issues) is this concept argument of "Well, X and Y field don't have that, why should Z?"  When shouldn't the conversation really be "Z has that benefit, why don't X and Y?  Or if not that specific benefit, something else in return?"  If we started thinking this way about issues such as compensation, PTO and sick leave, health benefits, and the like, I think we would be substantially better off.


----------



## susanv

I am very thankful for the choices we have made.  As my DH would say "You are not a SAHM you are a school bus driver, that is a job".  Hahaha I always looked at it as a way to pay for my Disney fix while bringing my children with me.  Due to our personal beliefs we have sent our children to a private Christian School for their entire school journey.  Both the High School and Elementary School my four children are going to have been very helpful last year and the information we have received for next year is encouraging.  

The turnover to online learning last year went very well as the teachers were very prepared last year for on-line learning.  They spent their March Break getting ready to start up, and luckily one of our teachers is also principal for an on-line school so he was able to help guide the other teachers in their journey of emergency on-line schooling.  The teachers had daily google hangouts with the kids and both the assignments available for the mandatory courses as well as optional assignments.  Unfortunately we live in a valley in a rural area and our internet reception is atrocious!  We could only access the internet with one or two devices at a time, but we needed four going constantly.  There were many nights  one child would be up until 11 pm, some nights midnight.  Two of my four children bloomed during that time, with more one on one mom time.  Three of the four have learning disabilities.

Part of the reason we will be sending our children back to school is the limited internet access they have here at home, part is with the LD one of my children is going very backwards.  As our school is directed by our own Boards  they have more leeway in how they react.  The elementary school has hired an extra daytime custodian and extra homeroom teachers to enable them to have lower classroom sizes, sanitation, and small cohorts.  I am not sure where they will get the extra classrooms from, however we do still have an extra french room, two portables that are currently used for storage, and the possibility of rooms at the church that is abutting the school.  Excited to see how they do it!  They have already sent out the surveys where we choose if our children will be bussed or driven for this year, to make up their routes.  Their intentions are five days a week but with plans in place to swing instantly over to on-line learning, as well as providing on-line learning off the bat to those who so desire.  The High School two of my children will be attending is just finishing off an expansion.  Their intention is to keep the kids in school five days a week in with their classmates for classes (they do not call it a cohort, but it sure seems like it).  They also have sent out the survey asking if you intend to bus or drive your children. 

My biggest worry is as a school bus driver for the public and separate school systems I might bring sickness home to my family, and how I will be able to get my children to their school bus stops.  Part of their LD, they are not allowed to be left without adult supervision.    Would love some prayer that all four get to their schools safely every day.


----------



## mshanson3121

Madame said:


> Absolutely all of this   I was discussing our decision with our kids again last night - this is hard on them & on us.  We assume most of their friends will return to school and that means no in person contact with their friends, not even the slight socially distanced contact we’ve managed this month; it would simply expose us to the entire school population & the fact I will be exposed to a space with 1000 + teens a day is sufficient.....
> 
> I told them not to worry about it.  Chances are everyone will be back online full time by Thanksgiving



Yes. My friend (also homeschools) is a tutor, and she has decided to not tutor this year, because to do so would increase her exposure way too much.



wdwmom3 said:


> *I don’t think any of us who want our kids back in school thinks it’s our “saving grace”.  And we know it won’t be the same.  *But yeah some kids who haven’t seen any friends in months just want to be back even if it’s not the same. * Just because they can’t do all the things they used to doesn’t mean it’s not a better option for them then staying home. *
> 
> I have started to notice a trend, many parents who think kids should stay home are quick to point out every little issue with kids going back to school.  T*hey make a huge deal out of things like “kids won’t get to play sports or see all of their friends”. * *Yet those things aren’t an issue with keeping kids home? How is that? *It’s like they feel the need to justify not sending their kids.  You don’t.  We get it, and don’t judge you.
> 
> *I would just like to point out that those of us who want our kids in school for various reasons are not stupid*, we know all these things.  We have thought long and hard about our decisions.  We don’t sit here and point out all the reasons why keeping kids at home isn’t a good idea. * So why do others feel the need to bring up every little issue with sending kids to school.*



There are many people who actually do think it is going to be same old. Good to know  you're not one of them.

Also please pay attention to what was and wasn't said - I didn't say ANY option was better than another. I pointed out the options and the challenges they all pose.

No one was making a big deal out of anything, except perhaps you.  Where we are, there are actually several activities running for kids this summer that will not be available this fall.

No one even remotely called anyone stupid.

The point of this thread is to discuss back to school plans and the issues surrounding the return to school. If this is bothers you, then this isn't the thread for you.



wdwmom3 said:


> For the rest of this thread can we all please not judge others.  Can we try not to convince parents what the best thing to do is.  Can we stop focusing on all the negative things of the options we didn’t choose.



No one was. The only one doing these things, or imagining these things, was you.


----------



## bababear_50

Now take ten deep breaths and come back team players cause we are all in this together!
Hugs
Mel


----------



## pigletto

We went for an outdoor visit with family yesterday and this was the topic of conversation for more than half the visit. Its a big topic with big feelings , that’s for sure. I can’t imagine the anxiety educators are feeling. Well I can a little bit. My sister in law is a teacher and she put it nicely , she’s just worried about ALL of it.. she‘s worried about teaching , she’s worried about not teaching , she‘s worried about her students, she’s worried about sending her kids back to school and daycare , she’s worried about the ramifications of not sending her kids to school and daycare. She’s such a lovely kind person and I look at her and think “if anyone would do the best things possible, it would be her” ..but she doesn’t even know what those things are .. so she worries . All any of us want is to feel safe and protect our families. Let’s protect each other too.


----------



## Meglen

Im from the US so im not sure how canada is dealing with unemployment right now. But here they ahve since stopped the bonus and many jobs are saying come back or you loose your job. What options do parents have at this point? Cant pay bills or kids get sick. Its legit torture right now to have to make these kinds of choices. Most that need to be at work right now have them in daycares so sending them to school would be little different. What about folks who cant afford daycare on top of working. Daycare is SUPER $$$$. All of this on top of the safety and wellness of staff and students.


----------



## FigmentSpark

susanv said:


> I am very thankful for the choices we have made.  As my DH would say "You are not a SAHM you are a school bus driver, that is a job".  Hahaha I always looked at it as a way to pay for my Disney fix while bringing my children with me.  Due to our personal beliefs we have sent our children to a private Christian School for their entire school journey.  Both the High School and Elementary School my four children are going to have been very helpful last year and the information we have received for next year is encouraging.
> 
> The turnover to online learning last year went very well as the teachers were very prepared last year for on-line learning.  They spent their March Break getting ready to start up, and luckily one of our teachers is also principal for an on-line school so he was able to help guide the other teachers in their journey of emergency on-line schooling.  The teachers had daily google hangouts with the kids and both the assignments available for the mandatory courses as well as optional assignments.  Unfortunately we live in a valley in a rural area and our internet reception is atrocious!  We could only access the internet with one or two devices at a time, but we needed four going constantly.  There were many nights  one child would be up until 11 pm, some nights midnight.  Two of my four children bloomed during that time, with more one on one mom time.  Three of the four have learning disabilities.
> 
> Part of the reason we will be sending our children back to school is the limited internet access they have here at home, part is with the LD one of my children is going very backwards.  As our school is directed by our own Boards  they have more leeway in how they react.  The elementary school has hired an extra daytime custodian and extra homeroom teachers to enable them to have lower classroom sizes, sanitation, and small cohorts.  I am not sure where they will get the extra classrooms from, however we do still have an extra french room, two portables that are currently used for storage, and the possibility of rooms at the church that is abutting the school.  Excited to see how they do it!  They have already sent out the surveys where we choose if our children will be bussed or driven for this year, to make up their routes.  Their intentions are five days a week but with plans in place to swing instantly over to on-line learning, as well as providing on-line learning off the bat to those who so desire.  The High School two of my children will be attending is just finishing off an expansion.  Their intention is to keep the kids in school five days a week in with their classmates for classes (they do not call it a cohort, but it sure seems like it).  They also have sent out the survey asking if you intend to bus or drive your children.
> 
> My biggest worry is as a school bus driver for the public and separate school systems I might bring sickness home to my family, and how I will be able to get my children to their school bus stops.  Part of their LD, they are not allowed to be left without adult supervision.    Would love some prayer that all four get to their schools safely every day.


Sending some prayers your way.


----------



## susanv

FigmentSpark said:


> Sending some prayers your way.


Thank you!


----------



## mshanson3121

pigletto said:


> .but she doesn’t even know what those things are .. so she worries .



Exactly. There just aren't really any truly good options. Every option has risks and challenges - for the students, the parents, the teachers etc...  And in a way it's a matter of conflicting interests. To best address everyone's safety, the student's education gets put the most at risk. To best address their education, people's health gets put the most at risk.


----------



## Maddysdaddy

I keep hearing people argue about how keeping their kids out of school negatively affects their mental health - which does have some merit, although there are a million ways to have had your kids socially distance interact over the last four months.  You know what’s going to impact their mental health even worse, living with the knowledge that they brought Covid home from school which then sickened or killed a family member.


----------



## Meglen

They need to have teacher modded ******* channels for the students. Let them have a place to hop in on a phone or PC and let them chat and play games together. Safe space for kids.


----------



## wdwmom3

Maddysdaddy said:


> I keep hearing people argue about how keeping their kids out of school negatively affects their mental health - which does have some merit, although there are a million ways to have had your kids socially distance interact over the last four months.  You know what’s going to impact their mental health even worse, living with the knowledge that they brought Covid home from school which then sickened or killed a family member.



See this is the type of post we could do without.   It’s not your child, you don’t know why they need school.  And you are basically trying to make people feel for guilty for sending their kids to school.


----------



## bababear_50

Maddysdaddy said:


> I keep hearing people argue about how keeping their kids out of school negatively affects their mental health - which does have some merit, although there are a million ways to have had your kids socially distance interact over the last four months.  You know what’s going to impact their mental health even worse, living with the knowledge that they brought Covid home from school which then sickened or killed a family member.


Hi Hon
There are ways and maybe you can help others by suggesting some ways that you have helped your family (kids) during this time.
I know I struggle with not seeing my granddaughter and she is only a short drive away.
So far I am
:emailing once a week (don't want to impose more than this as she is a teen).
rdering a few treats off of Amazon for her,,yes I spoil her but she's my only grandchild.
:took up a hobby to show her if I could she could.(never too old to learn something new).

Hugs
Mel


----------



## bababear_50

Meglen
Throughout the summer I am doing Zoom with one of my kids (student) that got stuck in India,,
He is a very special little kid!
We use Zoom.
His mom & Dad are ok with it.
I sure hope they can get a flight home soon and his mom's visa runs out Aug 1dt!!!

Hugs Mel


----------



## bababear_50

wdwmom3 said:


> See this is the type of post we could do without.   It’s not your child, you don’t know why they need school.  And you are basically trying to make people feel for guilty for sending their kids to school.



Woooow slow down and re read,,,try not to judge posts too much..let others say what they feel.
Engage in positive conversation. 

Hugs
Mel


----------



## wdwmom3

bababear_50 said:


> Woooow slow down and re read,,,try not to judge posts too much..let others say what they feel.
> Engage in positive conversation.
> 
> Hugs
> Mel





bababear_50 said:


> Woooow slow down and re read,,,try not to judge posts too much..let others say what they feel.
> Engage in positive conversation.
> 
> Hugs
> Mel



I don’t think someone making comments like it will hurt a child’s mental health more, if they give covid to someone because of going to school, then staying home, is very positive.  

If a parent says their child needs to be in school it’s not up for debate.  We don’t know the child.  We don’t know the reasons why.


----------



## Madame

This is on everyone’s minds.  I just had a FB conversation with a Mom of one of my boy’s best friends.  She is conflicted too.  She wants to keep her kids home but they both work & their kids are in a French-language school where my daughter attends & neither parent is fluent.  I am a 20 year French Immersion vet. 

We are going to pool together with another friend of my other boy and I’ll be “tutoring” them along with my 3 after school & on weekends.  Win-win.  I get an enclosed social bubble for my kids & they are less stressed about their kids’ education.  

Put out some feelers with your teacher friends if you’d prefer to keep your kids online, but are worried about them keeping up due to lack of f2f instruction.


----------



## Maddysdaddy

wdwmom3 said:


> See this is the type of post we could do without.   It’s not your child, you don’t know why they need school.  And you are basically trying to make people feel for guilty for sending their kids to school.



To steal a line from early 90’s SNL, “Denial ain’t just a river in Egypt”.

Pretending that some percentage of kids (and a much higher percentage of the people they live with) aren’t going to get very, very sick and may die if kids are sent back to school, doesn’t mean it’s not going to happen.

All we’ve heard since this started is public health officials and epidemiologists screaming at us that the best way to lower the risk of catching Covid is to stay home, and if you can’t stay home, you need to social distance supplemented by masking.

Now we have governments who are worried about decreased tax revenue from those not working, saying that it’s perfectly ok to throw 30-40 kids into an enclosed classroom - where social distancing is 18” and not 6’ - and without mandated masks.

I can’t wrap my head around how anyone thinks that’s going to turn out to be anything less than a disaster when kids, who ‘may’ not suffer the effects of Covid as severely, bring the virus home to their parents/grandparents/other caregivers.


----------



## bababear_50

My steps (baby).

1 patiently wait for gov announcements.

2 wait for school board to announce their plan.

3.  Make a go to bag/box of supplies as depending on Gov,unions,others has in the past not been a good idea. (Wipes, gloves, paper towels, hand sanitizer, special hand soap, fresh supply of extra masks, baggies, paper bags etc),

4. Go back with the knowledge that things will not be the same but try to make it as safe as possible.

5 Go back with the knowledge that 16 cohorts is actually = 160 people x 3 because of before and after school care ,,,,,,,
which brings my daily exposure up to 480 contact tracings. (God I hope everyone practises safe precautions ).

6. Start planning my resource materials to meet the kids needs taking into consideration no shared objects ,,disposable materials,,etc.

7. Put a garment bag in the garage and dispose of clothing in there before coming into the house--grab a shower. (My son has Asthma so he is at risk but works from home).

8. Remember that sick days are available and maybe in the past you went to work because it was just a cold,,,this year you are using those sick days.

9. Hope that school has a quick turnaround plan for Covid testing or my kids are going to end up with no in class support.(the past 5 years we have been using lunchroom helpers as no supply staff available).

10. Stop eating junk or the kids are going to say Ms. M you look fat!

I'll be editing and adding to this list
Hugs
Mel


----------



## bababear_50

Madame said:


> This is on everyone’s minds.  I just had a FB conversation with a Mom of one of my boy’s best friends.  She is conflicted too.  She wants to keep her kids home but they both work & their kids are in a French-language school where my daughter attends & neither parent is fluent.  I am a 20 year French Immersion vet.
> 
> We are going to pool together with another friend of my other boy and I’ll be “tutoring” them along with my 3 after school & on weekends.  Win-win.  I get an enclosed social bubble for my kids & they are less stressed about their kids’ education.
> 
> Put out some feelers with your teacher friends if you’d prefer to keep your kids online, but are worried about them keeping up due to lack of f2f instruction.



What a great idea!
Hugs
Mel


----------



## Madame

bababear_50 said:


> My steps (baby).
> 
> 1 patiently wait for gov announcements.
> 
> 2 wait for school board to announce their plan.
> 
> 3.  Make a go to bag/box of supplies as depending on Gov,unions,others has in the past not been a good idea. (Wipes,gloves,paper towels,hand sanitizer,special hand soap,,etc),
> 
> 4. Go back with the knowledge that things will not be the same but try to make it as safe as possible.
> 
> 5 Go back with the knowledge that 16 cohorts is actually = 160 people x 3 because of before and after school care ,,,,,,,
> which brings my daily exposure up to 480 contract tracings. (God I hope everyone practises safe precautions ).
> 
> 6. Start planning my resource materials to meet the kids needs taking into consideration no shared objects ,,disposable materials,,etc.
> 
> 7. Put a garment bag in the garage and dispose of clothing in there before coming into the house--grab a shower.
> 
> 8. Remember that sick days are available and maybe in the past you went to work because it was just a cold,,,this year you are using those sick days.
> 
> 9. Hope that school has a quick turnaround plan for Covid testing or my kids are going to end up with no in class support.(the past 5 years we have been using lunchroom helpers as no supply staff available).
> 
> 10. Stop eating junk or the kids are going to say Ms. M you look fat!
> 
> I'll be editing and adding to this list
> Hugs
> Mel


#6 is just brutal .  All my beautiful vocab games and interactive activities 

#10.  Me too.  And I have a recent thyroid diagnosis that makes impossible  to shift


----------



## wdwmom3

Maddysdaddy said:


> To steal a line from early 90’s SNL, “Denial ain’t just a river in Egypt”.
> 
> Pretending that some percentage of kids (and a much higher percentage of the people they live with) aren’t going to get very, very sick and may die if kids are sent back to school, doesn’t mean it’s not going to happen.
> 
> All we’ve heard since this started is public health officials and epidemiologists screaming at us that the best way to lower the risk of catching Covid is to stay home, and if you can’t stay home, you need to social distance supplemented by masking.
> 
> Now we have governments who are worried about decreased tax revenue from those not working, saying that it’s perfectly ok to throw 30-40 kids into an enclosed classroom - where social distancing is 18” and not 6’ - and without mandated masks.
> 
> I can’t wrap my head around how anyone thinks that’s going to turn out to be anything less than a disaster when kids, who ‘may’ not suffer the effects of Covid as severely, bring the virus home to their parents/grandparents/other caregivers.



I find your post incredibly ignorant.  There will not be 30-40 kids in a small classroom.  And there are many non economic reasons to have kids back in school, safely.  

I’m out.  I’m tired of people making parents feel guilty for their choices.  For those keeping their kids home, great!!! For those sending their kids to school, great!!!!


----------



## Maddysdaddy

wdwmom3 said:


> I find your post incredibly ignorant.  There will not be 30-40 kids in a small classroom.  And there are many non economic reasons to have kids back in school, safely.
> 
> I’m out.  I’m tired of people making parents feel guilty for their choices.  For those keeping their kids home, great!!! For those sending their kids to school, great!!!!



Every class my daughter had last year averaged around 35 students, and the Government of Alberta plan is school goes back to the way it was before - no reduced class size, no half days or 3/2 scheduling, and no mandatory masks - so don’t you dare tell me I’m ‘ignorant’.

I’m a post-secondary professor and we’re completely online for at least the rest of 2020, so why is it unsafe for those 18+ who are likely to be living in their own to be in class, but it’s ok for those under 18 who live with their families, to go back to school?


----------



## bababear_50

Madame said:


> #6 is just brutal .  All my beautiful vocab games and interactive activities
> 
> #10.  Me too.  And I have a recent thyroid diagnosis that makes impossible  to shift



Ah hugs to you hon
Yeah I use a ton of sensory materials that are going to just be out this year,,Kinder teachers have had their water/sand/sensory table removed from our classrooms.

I went through Thyroid issues a few years ago,,,Hyper--Hypo
I had Radioactive Iodine to kill the thyroid and now replacement thyroid pills,,which we just changed the dosage again.
Hugs Hon
Mel


----------



## bababear_50

Maddysdaddy said:


> Every class my daughter had last year averaged around 35 students, and the Government of Alberta plan is school goes back to the way it was before - no reduced class size, no half days or 3/2 scheduling, and no mandatory masks - so don’t you dare tell me I’m ‘ignorant’.
> 
> I’m a post-secondary professor and we’re completely online for at least the rest of 2020, so why is it unsafe for those 18+ who are likely to be living in their own to be in class, but it’s ok for those under 18 who live with their families, to go back to school?



To be honest I think many parents are being given inaccurate information depending upon their province and city/town. It is important as you suggest that parents contact their own school to see what preparations and precautions are in the works.
Yeah our Kinder class size was the same as you mention.
Our grade 7 and grade 8 are sitting at 29 for next year.
Ontario GTA area.
You are not ignorant and we all appreciate you contributing to the discussion.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## Madame

bababear_50 said:


> Ah hugs to you hon
> Yeah I use a ton of sensory materials that are going to just be out this year,,Kinder teachers have had their water/sand/sensory table removed from our classrooms.
> 
> I went through Thyroid issues a few years ago,,,Hyper--Hypo
> I had Radioactive Iodine to kill the thyroid and now replacement thyroid pills,,which we just changed the dosage again.
> Hugs Hon
> Mel


Yup.  I had a tumour several years ago and had 1/2 of my thyroid removed.  Just this past year my levels started going haywire.  It’s the gift that keeps on giving . I hope I can still use my small white boards.  I bought a class set and the kids love them & I use them all the time for vocab/grammar review competitions.  I doubt it though.  Once we get a set plan of can/cannot I’ll feel a lot less stressed.  I think it’s the not knowing as a parent then again a teacher.  Nothing feels stable right now.


----------



## bababear_50

Love mini whiteboards!!!
Gheesh I hope we can use them as I've already bought some for my traveling sensory cart.
So true the not knowing is very stressful BUT we will make it through this.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## FigmentSpark

bababear_50 said:


> My steps (baby).
> 
> 1 patiently wait for gov announcements.
> 
> 2 wait for school board to announce their plan.
> 
> 3.  Make a go to bag/box of supplies as depending on Gov,unions,others has in the past not been a good idea. (Wipes,gloves,paper towels,hand sanitizer,special hand soap,Fresh supply of extra masks,etc),
> 
> 4. Go back with the knowledge that things will not be the same but try to make it as safe as possible.
> 
> 5 Go back with the knowledge that 16 cohorts is actually = 160 people x 3 because of before and after school care ,,,,,,,
> which brings my daily exposure up to 480 contact tracings. (God I hope everyone practises safe precautions ).
> 
> 6. Start planning my resource materials to meet the kids needs taking into consideration no shared objects ,,disposable materials,,etc.
> 
> 7. Put a garment bag in the garage and dispose of clothing in there before coming into the house--grab a shower. (My son has Asthma so he is at risk but works from home).
> 
> 8. Remember that sick days are available and maybe in the past you went to work because it was just a cold,,,this year you are using those sick days.
> 
> 9. Hope that school has a quick turnaround plan for Covid testing or my kids are going to end up with no in class support.(the past 5 years we have been using lunchroom helpers as no supply staff available).
> 
> 10. Stop eating junk or the kids are going to say Ms. M you look fat!
> 
> I'll be editing and adding to this list
> Hugs
> Mel


Me, as a parent trying to do your #1 and #2




We have had no information that they are even doing anything, other than they asked us to do the standard survey of which of the 3 choices we prefer.  I know they are working on it, at least I hope they are, but having no information is hard.

My grade 11 son wants to go back.  He knows he learns better in class, but there's also the hope of a little social normalcy.  Well, if he's put in a cohort of 15, that's likely not going to happen.  And depending on the teachers he has (because not all are great), he may not do better in class than at home.  There are just so many factors in play right now and I think it's got us all on edge.


----------



## pigletto

FigmentSpark said:


> Me, as a parent trying to do your #1 and #2
> 
> View attachment 513563
> 
> 
> We have had no information that they are even doing anything, other than they asked us to do the standard survey of which of the 3 choices we prefer.  I know they are working on it, at least I hope they are, but having no information is hard.
> 
> My grade 11 son wants to go back.  He knows he learns better in class, but there's also the hope of a little social normalcy.  Well, if he's put in a cohort of 15, that's likely not going to happen.  And depending on the teachers he has (because not all are great), he may not do better in class than at home.  There are just so many factors in play right now and I think it's got us all on edge.


My son is in grade 11 too . We were laughing yesterday as we imagined the worst possible scenario for the 15 person cohort. You know .. the ex girlfriend that he doesn‘t talk to anymore , and the group of 8  jerks that move in a pack and disrespect the teachers and don’t listen or stay quiet in class and make everyone miserable.. he said he will end up in that cohort if he knows his luck. 

I‘m still completely on the fence on this one. I will see what they come up with and go from there . I honestly think I’m leaning more heavily toward not sending him. He is leaning more toward going back for the in class instruction. He’s worried that the online option will be as bad as it was in the spring and worried about  keeping his grades up. My husband is about as on the fence as I am.


----------



## quandrea

My only concern for my family is that whatever Ontario’s plan is, that school remains voluntary. That was the pivotal piece for me in the original announcement. I don’t want to send my dd nor does she want to go. So long as that option is available, we will be fine. If they remove that voluntary piece, I’ll have to initiate homeschool paperwork so she can register with the ILC. That worries me a bit, as the school/school board is notoriously slow at generating paperwork. I homeschool my elementary aged twins, so that’s sorted.

It seems to me that moving high school, save perhaps for special education to an online platform would simplify taming this beast of a job.My brother in law is a building supervisor with a school board. He noted today that most of the classrooms will not accommodate the distance required for the fifteen cohort suggestion. Just another wrinkle. Put Hs online and just handle the elementary.


----------



## quandrea

pigletto said:


> My son is in grade 11 too . We were laughing yesterday as we imagined the worst possible scenario for the 15 person cohort. You know .. the ex girlfriend that he doesn‘t talk to anymore , and the group of 8  jerks that move in a pack and disrespect the teachers and don’t listen or stay quiet in class and make everyone miserable.. he said he will end up in that cohort if he knows his luck.
> 
> I‘m still completely on the fence on this one. I will see what they come up with and go from there . I honestly think I’m leaning more heavily toward not sending him. He is leaning more toward going back for the in class instruction. He’s worried that the online option will be as bad as it was in the Spring.


Ha ha. My daughter is actually thrilled that she need not return to Hs. She has always loved her online classes (has always done partially online to accommodate high performance athletics). High school is not the wonderful experience it’s necessarily cracked up to be. My daughter was homeschooled for elementary and thus started high school ahead of her peers. So she was in class with kids older than her sometimes. Those classes were fine. The ones with her peers drove her nuts—poor behaviour, slow moving, etc. 100% online is best case, dream scenario for her. Hopefully the online classes will be better in the fall. My daughter has always used the e-learning consortium courses and they are rigorous and well executed.


----------



## bababear_50

FigmentSpark said:


> Me, as a parent trying to do your #1 and #2
> 
> View attachment 513563
> 
> 
> We have had no information that they are even doing anything, other than they asked us to do the standard survey of which of the 3 choices we prefer.  I know they are working on it, at least I hope they are, but having no information is hard.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My grade 11 son wants to go back.  He knows he learns better in class, but there's also the hope of a little social normalcy.  Well, if he's put in a cohort of 15, that's likely not going to happen.  And depending on the teachers he has (because not all are great), he may not do better in class than at home.  There are just so many factors in play right now and I think it's got us all on edge.




Hi Hon
I am not sure where you are but I would definitely look for your school's Parent Council info and see if they have gone online with information.

I know sometimes when kids hit grade 6 parents feel like it's hard to be part of their kids school but in the case of Covid 19 now is the time to jump on the bandwagon.
You will get through this Hon!

I do NOT *Twit* nor *Tweet* nor * Pacebook * as I have found these forms of communication to be unwise,,however I do know most schools do have some form of communication.


Ahh teachers....Hmmmm......................
Not all Teachers & Parents are alike, but by the time they are finished they will all be great!
This from a 23 year vet as a children's special needs Teaching Assistant.


Hugs to you
Mel


----------



## Madame

quandrea said:


> My only concern for my family is that whatever Ontario’s plan is, that school remains voluntary. That was the pivotal piece for me in the original announcement. I don’t want to send my dd nor does she want to go. So long as that option is available, we will be fine. If they remove that voluntary piece, I’ll have to initiate homeschool paperwork so she can register with the ILC. That worries me a bit, as the school/school board is notoriously slow at generating paperwork. I homeschool my elementary aged twins, so that’s sorted.
> 
> It seems to me that moving high school, save perhaps for special education to an online platform would simplify taming this beast of a job.My brother in law is a building supervisor with a school board. He noted today that most of the classrooms will not accommodate the distance required for the fifteen cohort suggestion. Just another wrinkle. Put Hs online and just handle the elementary.


Have you not received info from your board reassuring you that you will have online option?  I have from both my kids’ boards.  One was in email, the other I just stumbled across in a FB post by a friend.  Contact them & I’m certain they’ll tell you that you have that option.


----------



## hdrolfe

I think each province, and within the provinces each school board, has different plans and ideas. Even in Ottawa, there are 4 school boards. My son's has provided a very detailed plan with the explanations as to why they chose the options they include. I don't know about other boards or provinces but I do feel confident in what they are proposing. I guess others are not so lucky. My son has been lucky that his classes have been up to 22 kids in the class so far, that's in all grades in the school, so I feel confident they could manage with smaller classes should even 1/4 of the kids choose to stay home. Again, his school has empty classrooms and small classes already. If it was a different school, perhaps I would feel differently. 

I certainly feel for the teachers who have to make the decision whether they will work or not, I get it. A lot of people are having to make that decision, and have been since this started. I recognize how lucky I am, my son is old enough that I don't have to spend my entire day watching him, and I am able to work while we are at home together. But I am not a teacher, and there was no teaching happening in the spring. They gave us videos to watch to explain how to do long division... That is not teaching! If they move to all online there had better be more teaching involved. Interaction with the students, not just all chatting and showing off their rooms or pets. The plans I've seen, where the online kids would work with the in class kids on their work and be able to communicate throughout the day, makes it seem like perhaps something would actually get done. I am expecting if that is the option that I will have to adjust my work day to accommodate things. And then spend not only my 8 hours a day working but also how many hours a day teaching? That's provided I'm still allowed to stay working from home. 

If it was me, if I was the student? I'd love to be online! I hated having to deal with other kids, slow learners, all of it, but my son is not me. He learns better in person, he is not self motivated to do the online work, and there are some fights I'm not prepared to take on. I am sure some of his classmates were thriving with the at home learning. 

My school board sent a detailed plan and then a survey with a "will you send your child to in class learning?" question. I assume they will use those to determine the number of staff etc. We are promised more information in the beginning of August, which I believe is also when the province will make their announcements.


----------



## bababear_50

quandrea said:


> Ha ha. My daughter is actually thrilled that she need not return to Hs. She has always loved her online classes (has always done partially online to accommodate high performance athletics). High school is not the wonderful experience it’s necessarily cracked up to be. My daughter was homeschooled for elementary and thus started high school ahead of her peers. So she was in class with kids older than her sometimes. Those classes were fine. The ones with her peers drove her nuts—poor behaviour, slow moving, etc. 100% online is best case, dream scenario for her. Hopefully the online classes will be better in the fall. My daughter has always used the e-learning consortium courses and they are rigorous and well executed.



Ah Ha you have given me something to discuss with my granddaughter--she is going into grade 11 next year..I wonder what her feelings on this are?

Thanks Hon
Hugs
Mel


----------



## quandrea

bababear_50 said:


> Ah Ha you have given me something to discuss with my granddaughter--she is going into grade 11 next year..I wonder what her feelings on this are?
> 
> Thanks Hon
> Hugs
> Mel


You’ll have to ask. It’s interesting. I put dd in Hs to facilitate making her transcript, figuring it would aid in university application . With her younger siblings, I know more about the system and I’m just going to enrol them in the Independent Learning Centre right from the start. They’ll just homeschool right through. Being in the bricks and mortar school provided no benefit and we have been beholden to the school system’s schedule and red tape for two years now. Dd is taking three courses this summer to accelerate, and she will be done by the end of August 2021. A year ahead of schedule, but none too soon. She has hated high school.


----------



## quandrea

Madame said:


> Have you not received info from your board reassuring you that you will have online option?  I have from both my kids’ boards.  One was in email, the other I just stumbled across in a FB post by a friend.  Contact them & I’m certain they’ll tell you that you have that option.


No we have not.


----------



## Silvermist999

My friends and I have been having this discussion about our children, but until we know exactly what options our school boards are providing to us, we are trying not to jump to any conclusions or panic (too much).

My oldest is going into grade 11 with a science focussed course load (physics, chemistry and biology) so it concerns me whether she will be able to actually learn enough to succeed in grade 12 and then at the post secondary level if classes are held online, with a similar level of “teaching” in the spring, which was almost none at all, just posting work to do online and no daily or weekly meetings on google hangouts.

We will find out in a couple weeks what options our board has come up with and hopefully how they plan to execute them.


----------



## FigmentSpark

bababear_50 said:


> Hi Hon
> I am not sure where you are but I would definitely look for your school's Parent Council info and see if they have gone online with information.
> 
> I know sometimes when kids hit grade 6 parents feel like it's hard to be part of their kids school but in the case of Covid 19 now is the time to jump on the bandwagon.
> You will get through this Hon!
> 
> I do NOT *Twit* nor *Tweet* nor * Pacebook * as I have found these forms of communication to be unwise,,however I do know most schools do have some form of communication.
> 
> 
> Ahh teachers....Hmmmm......................
> Not all Teachers & Parents are alike, but by the time they are finished they will all be great!
> This from a 23 year vet as a children's special needs Teaching Assistant.
> 
> 
> Hugs to you
> Mel


We are in HCDSB.  I haven’t really followed the parent council in HS, but I do know someone who does.  I don’t think there’s been any activity for parents though.  

I don’t do Zuckbook, either.  But I do follow our board and school on Twitter.  Not much there other than pats on the back. Real info is supposed to be emailed to parents and there hasn’t been much lately.  But, I get the impression there isnt much decided.


----------



## Renarr

pigletto said:


> My son is in grade 11 too . We were laughing yesterday as we imagined the worst possible scenario for the 15 person cohort. You know .. the ex girlfriend that he doesn‘t talk to anymore , and the group of 8  jerks that move in a pack and disrespect the teachers and don’t listen or stay quiet in class and make everyone miserable.. he said he will end up in that cohort if he knows his luck.



I seem to invariably teach this group, so I look forward to meeting your son!  LOL



pigletto said:


> I‘m still completely on the fence on this one. I will see what they come up with and go from there . I honestly think I’m leaning more heavily toward not sending him. He is leaning more toward going back for the in class instruction. He’s worried that the online option will be as bad as it was in the spring and worried about  keeping his grades up. My husband is about as on the fence as I am.



I think this is what irritates me about what our district is doing with the parent community.  They've put out a couple of surveys asking parents what they intend to do, but they don't have the details worked out such that they can make the decision.  I'm convinced that *some* of the parents voting to put their kids back in school are doing so based on how remote instruction occurred this past spring, and if the district hasn't told them what will change, what else can they assume?

I understand it's hard for the district to do the planning without having an idea of what the parents will do, but it's hard for the parents to tell you what they want to do until they tell the parents what school is going to look like.


----------



## quandrea

Silvermist999 said:


> My friends and I have been having this discussion about our children, but until we know exactly what options our school boards are providing to us, we are trying not to jump to any conclusions or panic (too much).
> 
> My oldest is going into grade 11 with a science focussed course load (physics, chemistry and biology) so it concerns me whether she will be able to actually learn enough to succeed in grade 12 and then at the post secondary level if classes are held online, with a similar level of “teaching” in the spring, which was almost none at all, just posting work to do online and no daily or weekly meetings on google hangouts.
> 
> We will find out in a couple weeks what options our board has come up with and hopefully how they plan to execute them.


My dd is doing online biology right now. The course is excellent.  Hopefully you will have the same luck. I think if the course starts as online, with the intention to be an online course, things will be better than the slap dash effort of the spring, where they basically went digital midway through. Teachers were also limited in what they could ask of kids time wise and marks could not go down. I’m hopeful the fall will be more akin to the made for online classes that are widely deployed on a regular basis.


----------



## bababear_50

FigmentSpark said:


> We are in .  I haven’t really followed the parent council in HS, but I do know someone who does.  I don’t think there’s been any activity for parents though.
> 
> I don’t do Zuckbook, either.  But I do follow our board and school on Twitter.  Not much there other than pats on the back. Real info is supposed to be emailed to parents and there hasn’t been much lately.  But, I get the impression there isnt much decided.



Ha ,,love the Zuckbook......
I had to Google that one HCDSB
*Halton Catholic District School Board*
And so true not much has been decided by each board as we wait for Ford and the *Leech* to make an announcement.
Right now our staff email is undergoing a security change up so I can't even log in right now to see anything. Help Desk says it should be all finished by Monday,,,hmmmmm...yeah.
So I guess we wait..............................................and wait,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Hugs to you
Mel


----------



## Madame

For anyone not au courant, this is the newly amended risk chart.  As we see, schools (my windows open maybe 4 inches and no AC) are comparable to outdoor patio risk . I think we can all guess where this is heading...


----------



## bababear_50

I am trying to figure out if it's safer to have the windows closed with a wall air conditioner on.
The air conditioner we have is a have to have due to a child with medical needs,,only 2 classes in our school have A/C.
I have put an email into our Association/Union asking if they are going to install any special filtres on the air conditioner (about a week ago) so far no response.
I know the millwork was redone in some of our classes because the health & Safety people have sent emails regarding the removal of Asbestos tiles.
I know one of my kids will not be coming back to in school learning (he doesn't know this yet) and he will be crushed but he is just way tooooo at risk. sad.
Communication from the powers that be during this time would be helpful.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## Renarr

Madame said:


> For anyone not au courant, this is the newly amended risk chart.  As we see, schools (my windows open maybe 4 inches and no AC) are comparable to outdoor patio risk . I think we can all guess where this is heading...
> View attachment 513604



So here's one thing I never understood about charts like this one: does it take into account students eating in classrooms?  Just wondering, because that seems to be the route that a lot of schools are considering for distancing their lunches.


----------



## Madame

Renarr said:


> So here's one thing I never understood about charts like this one: does it take into account students eating in classrooms?  Just wondering, because that seems to be the route that a lot of schools are considering for distancing their lunches.


I don’t know, but this graph was only recently re-released by the fed gov.  Outdoor fully ventilated adequately separated patrons are not kids in desks who need a pencil/to use the facilities etc.  I have 3 separate classes of 30+ kids rotate through my room.  I’m giving myself a panic attack just imagining it.


----------



## bababear_50

Madame said:


> I don’t know, but this graph was only recently re-released by the fed gov.  Outdoor fully ventilated adequately separated patrons are not kids in desks who need a pencil/to use the facilities etc.  I have 3 separate classes of 30+ kids rotate through my room.  I’m giving myself a panic attack just imagining it.



Deep breathe Hon,,you'll figure this out!

I know at my school the Core French teacher is going *Ala Carte* as in she will be moving herself and her new teaching cart from classroom to classroom (the kids will be staying in their home classrooms for the day). Her classroom is being repurposed. I know she is upset about not having a classroom but she said it will probably be safer doing this. How to pair down resources and materials will be hard.

Hugs to you
Mel
example


this is my favourite one



Have a look here

https://www.google.com/search?q=por...ECAUQIg&biw=1920&bih=937#imgrc=NuyU4AbqoIQFYM


----------



## hdrolfe

bababear_50 said:


> Deep breathe Hon,,you'll figure this out!
> 
> I know at my school the Core French teacher is going *Ala Carte* as in she will be moving herself and her new teaching cart from classroom to classroom (the kids will be staying in their home classrooms for the day). Her classroom is being repurposed. I know she is upset about not having a classroom but she said it will probably be safer doing this. How to pair down resources and materials will be hard.
> 
> Hugs to you
> Mel



I believe this is what they are doing in my son's school as well. For Core and Immersion, if they do Immersion that is. It will be a big change since the kids are used to moving around and they have immersion and core kids in the same home rooms.


----------



## bankr63

DW (teaches grade 7 in OCDSB - Ottawa-Carleton) were discussing our contingencies this afternoon.

Although The *Leach* (tm - @bababear_50) hasn't announced anything, we are expecting that it will be full time school with no reduced cohorts for Grade 7 (approx 25-28 per class).  After all, with $0.10 per day per student extra, how could they hire the teachers to reduce the sizes?  With no AC and limited ventilation in her classroom, we expect that we will probably have an infection in our home by October sometime.  We are visiting our aging parents now while we can. My mom is 92 and healthy; no way am I going to be the one to pass the COVID on to her.  I will probably have to continue to travel the two hours to her home every couple of weeks for yard work, but I will not be entering the home.  

My favorite meme on the Zuckerbook has to be the one "If they are virtual meeting to discuss return to school because it is not safe to meet, what makes them think that it could possibly be safe to return to school?"


----------



## bababear_50

bankr63 said:


> DW (teaches grade 7 in OCDSB - Ottawa-Carleton) were discussing our contingencies this afternoon.
> 
> Although The *Leach* (tm - @bababear_50) hasn't announced anything, we are expecting that it will be full time school with no reduced cohorts for Grade 7 (approx 25-28 per class).  After all, with $0.10 per day per student extra, how could they hire the teachers to reduce the sizes?  With no AC and limited ventilation in her classroom, we expect that we will probably have an infection in our home by October sometime.  We are visiting our aging parents now while we can. My mom is 92 and healthy; no way am I going to be the one to pass the COVID on to her.  I will probably have to continue to travel the two hours to her home every couple of weeks for yard work, but I will not be entering the home.
> 
> My favorite meme on the Zuckerbook has to be the one "If they are virtual meeting to discuss return to school because it is not safe to meet, what makes them think that it could possibly be safe to return to school?"



So sorry Hon,,I hope things get planned very different for you and your wife.
When it comes to kids the government needs to put their wallet where their mouths are.
You want the economy open,, then do so safely.


Yeah here is what I think of him *Leech* 
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/leech
Hugs to you
Mel


----------



## bankr63

bababear_50 said:


> When it comes to kids the government needs to put their wallet where their mouths are.
> You want the economy open,, then do so safely.
> 
> Hugs to you
> Mel


And that is the key.  The Ottawa Citizen did an article looking at the various countries that have opened schools and how they have fared.  Those countries (and there are a few) that have done so successfully had a solid plan and were well resourced (costs $$$).  Those who did not did those two things are more than a bit of a disaster.  Which bucket does it appear Ontario is selecting?

The *Leech*:  I have a plan, I have a plan, I have a plan... Weeks later: my plan is to let someone else plan it!  More weeks later: and I will have to approve those plans.  More weeks later with only a couple of weeks left to actually do something:  my plan is.... (wait for it, 'cause we don't know the answer yet).  The suspense is killing me (dark pun intended).


----------



## CanadianKrista

I am so torn on this.  A few weeks ago, when Ottawa daily cases were super low, I was all for sending my kids back.  DH is going to grade 7, and is not AT ALL motivated with the online learning.  It was a major struggle every day.  He does game online with his friends, and mentally seems to be doing okay with the separation.   Meanwhile, DD, going to grade 5, did pretty well with the online learning, but her mental health is greatly suffering from being separated from her peers.  Anxiety, insomnia, general meltdowns over little things - she is a social creature, and this is harming her in ways we may not understand for years.

When they sent out a survey a couple of weeks ago if we were planning to keep the kids home if online was an option, I said no.  But as cases rise again in the Ottawa area, I just don't know anymore.

There are no good options for our kids right now.


----------



## Debbie

bankr63 said:


> The *Leech*:  I have a plan, I have a plan, I have a plan... Weeks later: my plan is to let someone else plan it!  More weeks later: and I will have to approve those plans.  More weeks later with only a couple of weeks left to actually do something:  my plan is.... (wait for it, 'cause we don't know the answer yet).  The suspense is killing me (dark pun intended).


Seriously, it's like the government thinks we are stupid and don't realize that there has to be a second plan for the times if/when the numbers change and a change is warranted. Call it Plan A, B, C, but HAVE the plans instead of a plan to make the announcement to make a plan.


----------



## pigletto

bankr63 said:


> And that is the key.  The Ottawa Citizen did an article looking at the various countries that have opened schools and how they have fared.  Those countries (and there are a few) that have done so successfully had a solid plan and were well resourced (costs $$$).  Those who did not did those two things are more than a bit of a disaster.  Which bucket does it appear Ontario is selecting?
> 
> The *Leech*:  I have a plan, I have a plan, I have a plan... Weeks later: my plan is to let someone else plan it!  More weeks later: and I will have to approve those plans.  More weeks later with only a couple of weeks left to actually do something:  my plan is.... (wait for it, 'cause we don't know the answer yet).  The suspense is killing me (dark pun intended).


Haha, don’t forget .... school boards can pick from my three plans, except not really because we are leaning on them in private.

Also I dislike how they announce their announcements. Please stop with the press conferences just to tell us you will be telling us something some other time.


----------



## Prince John Robin Hood

Tough decisions for everyone on this.  One of my biggest concerns is that with things opening up again now we'll see a spike in Sept/Oct.  I'm really hoping cases somehow stay low until a vaccine comes out.


----------



## bankr63

CanadianKrista said:


> I am so torn on this.  A few weeks ago, when Ottawa daily cases were super low, I was all for sending my kids back.  DH is going to grade 7, and is not AT ALL motivated with the online learning.  It was a major struggle every day.  He does game online with his friends, and mentally seems to be doing okay with the separation.   Meanwhile, DD, going to grade 5, did pretty well with the online learning, but her mental health is greatly suffering from being separated from her peers.  Anxiety, insomnia, general meltdowns over little things - she is a social creature, and this is harming her in ways we may not understand for years.
> 
> When they sent out a survey a couple of weeks ago if we were planning to keep the kids home if online was an option, I said no.  But as cases rise again in the Ottawa area, I just don't know anymore.
> 
> There are no good options for our kids right now.


I think that one option to make the best of online learning is community schooling. 
I don't think hundreds of students in a single building is a viable plan UNLESS the governments are willing to adjust to be safe and fund the required changes (no sign of that yet). Even then, outbreaks will happen.
What mostly failed in online education last year was motivation as well as problems with access.  In Ontario, Ford's announcement at the very beginning that everyone gets an automatic pass was the biggest disincentive to giving effort I have ever heard.  One of the dumbest things a politician ever said; and it was true, teachers were not allowed to evaluate any work that occurred after March 13, UNLESS it actually helped the student's mark.  So free pass everybody!
So community schooling could solve a couple of issues; I am thinking like the one room schoolhouse.  Small cohorts of students from a limited area would attend school at one neighbor's house (all grades together) allowing for social interaction with a small cohort of friends.  That neighbor could be compensated by the government to oversee the children's education.  Proper access to internet and devices would have to provided (also government subsidized); that is one of the biggest issues that many families faced - five kids and one laptop trying to share access and attend sessions at one time. The parent who takes on this role is intended to be a proctor/assistant, ensuring that students are putting in the effort; the teachers would still create the content.  the proctor would ensure that students who need help with topics are actually reaching out to the professional teachers and would enable these interactions.  This would also help with the unemployment problem for folks (like me) who are unable to find work during the COVID crisis.
This idea occurs to me because I live on a street with a "gang of 8".  Kids from two families who have been a social circle since this was allowed (and probably a bit before as they struggled with social distancing when it was required).  Having one parent oversee their education as a JOB would cost no more than the $2000/mo they are currently getting from government sources and would greatly enhance the economic recovery by allowing several other parents who still have jobs to concentrate on work, or actually go to work, during school hours. More people contributing, and contributing effectively.
If communities step up they can keep their young people healthy and educated and mentally stimulated while reducing the inherent risks that a large building filled with people presents.


----------



## TammyLynn33

I’m late to this party here but I am beyond frusturated right now . Not with the plans or lack of plans the govt/school boards are presenting BUT with the parents and staff and community members who as I look in my social media clearly aren’t bubbling or social distancing and are acting like this is all over . We the parents/ community and staff of said schools have a responsibility now to ensure numbers are as low as possible in order to ensure it’s not You or Your child bringing it into the schools in Sept.  We all need to be a little accountable here and do our part instead of just screaming the schools aren’t doing enough .
( my sons hockey league president just hosted the boys championship golf/ party last night . Retired principal non stop shooting his mouth off about how unsafe when I walked into the golf course the tears started , all the teen boys ( jobs, girlfriends) huddled together zero social distancing arms around way other for pics.. I allowed my son to golf if he rented a private cart. He was not allowed to attend the after festivities .  See what I’m saying here.. I don’t expect the schools to keep my kid safe if I’m not doing everything I can to keep them safe on my time.
That said big kid is not taking his dream program in Toronto this year , we weren’t comfortable. DD starts high school in September and acc to her she’s going regardless .. two boys gr 3 and gr 1.. grade 3 special needs excelled at home . I didn’t let the tears I can’t do this let him off the hook, he sat there until work was done and not in the iPad either  mean mom but man has his writing , math and reading improved . Grade 1 is now my and big kids shadow . Mention school to him he cries he doesn’t want to go and get “the virus”
Right now I’m leaning towards littles stay home I will switch to evenings and home school. Taking it day by day here though


----------



## Madame

TammyLynn33 said:


> I’m late to this party here but I am beyond frusturated right now . Not with the plans or lack of plans the govt/school boards are presenting BUT with the parents and staff and community members who as I look in my social media clearly aren’t bubbling or social distancing and are acting like this is all over . We the parents/ community and staff of said schools have a responsibility now to ensure numbers are as low as possible in order to ensure it’s not You or Your child bringing it into the schools in Sept.  We all need to be a little accountable here and do our part instead of just screaming the schools aren’t doing enough .
> ( my sons hockey league president just hosted the boys championship golf/ party last night . Retired principal non stop shooting his mouth off about how unsafe when I walked into the golf course the tears started , all the teen boys ( jobs, girlfriends) huddled together zero social distancing arms around way other for pics.. I allowed my son to golf if he rented a private cart. He was not allowed to attend the after festivities .  See what I’m saying here.. I don’t expect the schools to keep my kid safe if I’m not doing everything I can to keep them safe on my time.
> That said big kid is not taking his dream program in Toronto this year , we weren’t comfortable. DD starts high school in September and acc to her she’s going regardless .. two boys gr 3 and gr 1.. grade 3 special needs excelled at home . I didn’t let the tears I can’t do this let him off the hook, he sat there until work was done and not in the iPad either  mean mom but man has his writing , math and reading improved . Grade 1 is now my and big kids shadow . Mention school to him he cries he doesn’t want to go and get “the virus”
> Right now I’m leaning towards littles stay home I will switch to evenings and home school. Taking it day by day here though


One of my boys too.  Jeez the first say 3 wks were non-stop hell.  Every day he hummed & hawed and “But I don’t get it!  Which part?  All the parts...”.  His twin who genuinely struggles (dyslexic etc etc etc) wraps everything up in an hour & he was sat there angry because he had to work.

Much of that3 weeks he had no electronics/TV/nada for the rest of the day...  try again tomorrow...  I can (and actually DO) do this ALL day long.  Like a 10 year old can pull anything that my 15-17 year old students don’t try daily .  He would NEVER do that at school.  Teaching your own kids is brutal.


----------



## TammyLynn33

No what I meant is because he’s designated as special needs they don’t care if he learns they simply try to avoid meltdowns .
I pushed him and saw results I wish I could home school permanently but I need to work too 

member: 509240"]
One of my boys too.  Jeez the first say 3 wks were non-stop hell.  Every day he hummed & hawed and “But I don’t get it!  Which part?  All the parts...”.  His twin who genuinely struggles (dyslexic etc etc etc) wraps everything up in an hour & he was sat there angry because he had to work.

Much of that3 weeks he had no electronics/TV/nada for the rest of the day...  try again tomorrow...  I can (and actually DO) do this ALL day long.  Like a 10 year old can pull anything that my 15-17 year old students don’t try daily .  He would NEVER do that at school.  Teaching your own kids is brutal.
[/QUOTE]


----------



## quandrea

bankr63 said:


> I think that one option to make the best of online learning is community schooling.
> I don't think hundreds of students in a single building is a viable plan UNLESS the governments are willing to adjust to be safe and fund the required changes (no sign of that yet). Even then, outbreaks will happen.
> What mostly failed in online education last year was motivation as well as problems with access.  In Ontario, Ford's announcement at the very beginning that everyone gets an automatic pass was the biggest disincentive to giving effort I have ever heard.  One of the dumbest things a politician ever said; and it was true, teachers were not allowed to evaluate any work that occurred after March 13, UNLESS it actually helped the student's mark.  So free pass everybody!
> So community schooling could solve a couple of issues; I am thinking like the one room schoolhouse.  Small cohorts of students from a limited area would attend school at one neighbor's house (all grades together) allowing for social interaction with a small cohort of friends.  That neighbor could be compensated by the government to oversee the children's education.  Proper access to internet and devices would have to provided (also government subsidized); that is one of the biggest issues that many families faced - five kids and one laptop trying to share access and attend sessions at one time. The parent who takes on this role is intended to be a proctor/assistant, ensuring that students are putting in the effort; the teachers would still create the content.  the proctor would ensure that students who need help with topics are actually reaching out to the professional teachers and would enable these interactions.  This would also help with the unemployment problem for folks (like me) who are unable to find work during the COVID crisis.
> This idea occurs to me because I live on a street with a "gang of 8".  Kids from two families who have been a social circle since this was allowed (and probably a bit before as they struggled with social distancing when it was required).  Having one parent oversee their education as a JOB would cost no more than the $2000/mo they are currently getting from government sources and would greatly enhance the economic recovery by allowing several other parents who still have jobs to concentrate on work, or actually go to work, during school hours. More people contributing, and contributing effectively.
> If communities step up they can keep their young people healthy and educated and mentally stimulated while reducing the inherent risks that a large building filled with people presents.


This is the kind of innovative thinking we need!  A Can do attitude, rather than throwing obstacles up all the time. These are crazy times that call for out of the box thinking and an acceptance that there is no return to normal. Why don’t you write the minister?  Probably won’t help, but couldn’t hurt.


----------



## bababear_50

This is from the very analytical son who hated K-12 public school education but accelerated and enjoyed in College/University. Not married yet and no kids.
He is now a computer analyst.
He says "well why don't hey open the Hockey arena and hold the clases there ,,then the kids can take breaks skating" ?
There are washrooms and also a snack bar???? Hmmmmmm...Mmmmmm.
So I checked for rental rooms and yes it looks like due to recent renos the Hockey arena has rooms for rent,,,,Hmmmmm....Hmmmm.
Smart kid I raised.
And the Hockey arena is within walking distance to our school.


Room - Full80-100Room 1 - North50Room 2 - South25-30Room 330-45

So many ways that things can be done!

I just emailed my Principal with info and suggestions.

Hugs Mel


----------



## bankr63

quandrea said:


> This is the kind of innovative thinking we need!  A Can do attitude, rather than throwing obstacles up all the time. These are crazy times that call for out of the box thinking and an acceptance that there is no return to normal. Why don’t you write the minister?  Probably won’t help, but couldn’t hurt.


LOL - my very good public sector job in health innovation ended because the LAST thing this government wants to hear about is innovation and out of the box thinking.  The millions of dollars my team was able to redirect from administration costs to front line health services meant nothing to them.  Sorry still a little bitter about the current government.  Ashamed I voted for change; thought it would be change for the better.


----------



## quandrea

bankr63 said:


> LOL - my very good public sector job in health innovation ended because the LAST thing this government wants to hear about is innovation and out of the box thinking.  The millions of dollars my team was able to redirect from administration costs to front line health services meant nothing to them.  Sorry still a little bitter about the current government.  Ashamed I voted for change; thought it would be change for the better.


Oh I’m not surprised by that. Just disappointed. This pandemic is extraordinary and doing things like we always have done them won’t work. Unfortunately, all I ever seem to hear is, “That won’t work...”


----------



## bankr63

quandrea said:


> Oh I’m not surprised by that. Just disappointed. This pandemic is extraordinary and doing things like we always have done them won’t work. Unfortunately, all I ever seem to hear is, “That won’t work...”


Interestingly enough, the following item just came across my newsfeed.  Micro-School Article  Apparently micro-schools are a burgeoning idea in the states.  Very similar to what I proposed, but my idea of having it publicly supported takes away the main drawback identified.  I also wouldn't suggest trying to remove teachers from school.  I think professional educators should be teamed with the micro-schools and support a normal sized cohort virtually.  More of a win-win all around IMO.


----------



## TammyLynn33

bababear_50 said:


> This is from the very analytical son who hated K-12 public school education but accelerated and enjoyed in College/University. Not married yet and no kids.
> He is now a computer analyst.
> He says "well why don't hey open the Hockey arena and hold the clases there ,,then the kids can take breaks skating" ?
> There are washrooms and also a snack bar???? Hmmmmmm...Mmmmmm.
> So I checked for rental rooms and yes it looks like due to recent renos the Hockey arena has rooms for rent,,,,Hmmmmm....Hmmmm.
> Smart kid I raised.
> And the Hockey arena is within walking distance to our school.
> 
> 
> Room - Full80-100Room 1 - North50Room 2 - South25-30Room 330-45
> 
> So many ways that things can be done!
> 
> I just emailed my Principal with info and suggestions.
> 
> Hugs Mel



Don’t tell my hockey playing kids who are having a hard enough time getting ice right now lol . I can’t imagine telling them no hockey because your school will be there lol that might just send them over the edge lol


----------



## pigletto

I’m not sure how I didn’t think of this already, but something just occurred to me.
My 16 year old son has horrible seasonal allergies. When we went for the initial testing when he was 7, the paediatrician who did the test said he had one of the worst reactions he’s ever seen to ragweed. He got allergy shots for years and it’s better than it was but it’s still bad. We are on very strict regimen of allergy meds from late August to late October . I can tell if he’s even an hour late taking the medicine because he starts to sneeze and sneeze and sneeze and gets congested and his eyes get puffy and red etc. At that point he needs Benadryl to stop the reaction .

   Anyway .. this complicates things a little . Would they have to isolate him and send him home from school if he started that reaction ? Surely if he’s coughing and sniffling and sneezing they can’t just take his word for it that it’s allergies ? At least a few times an allergy season we end up picking him up because the headache is so bad or he’s so congested. Then what ? Would he need a test before going back ?

This is all rhetorical I guess , because nobody knows what the protocol will be. Just another layer in the complicated decision that this is .


----------



## tgropp

wdwmom3 said:


> I don’t think any of us who want our kids back in school thinks it’s our “saving grace”.  And we know it won’t be the same.  But yeah some kids who haven’t seen any friends in months just want to be back even if it’s not the same.  Just because they can’t do all the things they used to doesn’t mean it’s not a better option for them then staying home.
> 
> I have started to notice a trend, many parents who think kids should stay home are quick to point out every little issue with kids going back to school.  They make a huge deal out of things like “kids won’t get to play sports or see all of their friends”.  Yet those things aren’t an issue with keeping kids home? How is that? It’s like they feel the need to justify not sending their kids.  You don’t.  We get it, and don’t judge you.
> 
> I would just like to point out that those of us who want our kids in school for various reasons are not stupid, we know all these things.  We have thought long and hard about our decisions.  We don’t sit here and point out all the reasons why keeping kids at home isn’t a good idea.  So why do others feel the need to bring up every little issue with sending kids to school.



My son in law is the head of all skilled trades in a school board district. For the last three months they have been putting hand washing and hand sanitizing stations in the classroom along with partitions. Nothing is perfect but I find it ironic that a certain teachers union is fighting for online teaching which is exactly why they were striking last year. If every essential worker used this rational, the economy would have collapsed along with health care disappearing. I did my health care duties without getting sick. We were careful and pro active. To say that it’s on safe and refuse to work without even trying is unreasonable. I am not blaming teachers as they are the pawns in the game of chess between the teachers union and the provincial government. Very sad.


----------



## Madame

tgropp said:


> My son in law is the head of all skilled trades in a school board district. For the last three months they have been putting hand washing and hand sanitizing stations in the classroom along with partitions. Nothing is perfect but I find it ironic that a certain teachers union is fighting for online teaching which is exactly why they were striking last year. If every essential worker used this rational, the economy would have collapsed along with health care disappearing. I did my health care duties without getting sick. We were careful and pro active. To say that it’s on safe and refuse to work without even trying is unreasonable. I am not blaming teachers as they are the pawns in the game of chess between the teachers union and the provincial government. Very sad.


I’m not fighting for online.  I hate online.  Most kids hate online.  

I’m going to post 2 photos I sent to a colleague at my former school as a kind of eye roll indicating that it was the same old same old. I changed schools in Feb and my room was in the same condition that the previous classroom was in - mouse crap everywhere (my old room had a cupboard of old magazines encrusted with mouse droppings and urine as they had been nesting in it for years obviously). Desks are NEVER cleaned unless I do it (rare if my boards get cleaned and when they do it’s with the floor broom), and in my new room the chairs get put up on the desks from the filthy floors. My old school about 7 years back seniors hot a master key and flipped every desk in every room (sigh). I wish I had taken a photo - Jesus the years of gum. I almost puked. My Mom was a custodian at my high school & I KNOW for a fact they scrapped that off every summer. Apparently not anymore 

The ventilation is trash.  The circulation is trash.  So hot in the summer sweat dripping off me onto my kids’ desks if I lean over them to help.  I spend most of the winter teaching in a winter coat - no word of a lieMy last school they were renovating the foyer and the asbestos I had been screaming about because of the broken asbestos floor tile in my room (lots of old schools around here have high incidents of teacher cancers....) was fully exposed.....  Custodians had to sign something saying they wouldn’t sue and the whole damn thing was hushed up.  

Brand new bottle filling stations upstairs shut down due to high lead that couldn’t be flushed out at a safe enough level. Washrooms locked because of vaping (2 were left open - 1 for each sex & God were they disgusting by the end of the day). The public has no clue what our work conditions are. I do not think that my schools are outside the norm.
Do you have these conditions at your place of work..?  Cause, honestly, I don’t think these things will change in Sept. and I’m scared.  

I used one baby wipe per desk (just the tops) - we are not permitted to use ANY chemicals ourselves.

This one is difficult to see - I tried to get a close up and of course it blurred but this was just one of my preps spent cleaning - the little black dots are mouse droppings.

So yeah.  I’m a little concerned.


----------



## tgropp

Madame said:


> I’m not fighting for online.  I hate online.  Most kids hate online.
> 
> I’m going to post 2 photos I sent to a colleague at my former school as a kind of eye roll indicating that it was the same old same old. I changed schools in Feb and my room was in the same condition that the previous classroom was in - mouse crap everywhere (my old room had a cupboard of old magazines encrusted with mouse droppings and urine as they had been nesting in it for years obviously). Desks are NEVER cleaned unless I do it (rare if my boards get cleaned and when they do it’s with the floor broom), and in my new room the chairs get put up on the desks from the filthy floors. My old school about 7 years back seniors hot a master key and flipped every desk in every room (sigh). I wish I had taken a photo - Jesus the years of gum. I almost puked. My Mom was a custodian at my high school & I KNOW for a fact they scrapped that off every summer. Apparently not anymore
> 
> The ventilation is trash.  The circulation is trash.  So hot in the summer sweat dripping off me onto my kids’ desks if I lean over them to help.  I spend most of the winter teaching in a winter coat - no word of a lieMy last school they were renovating the foyer and the asbestos I had been screaming about because of the broken asbestos floor tile in my room (lots of old schools around here have high incidents of teacher cancers....) was fully exposed.....  Custodians had to sign something saying they wouldn’t sue and the whole damn thing was hushed up.
> 
> Brand new bottle filling stations upstairs shut down due to high lead that couldn’t be flushed out at a safe enough level. Washrooms locked because of vaping (2 were left open - 1 for each sex & God were they disgusting by the end of the day). The public has no clue what our work conditions are. I do not think that my schools are outside the norm.
> Do you have these conditions at your place of work..?  Cause, honestly, I don’t think these things will change in Sept. and I’m scared.
> 
> I used one baby wipe per desk (just the tops) - we are not permitted to use ANY chemicals ourselves.
> View attachment 514022
> This one is difficult to see - I tried to get a close up and of course it blurred but this was just one of my preps spent cleaning - the little black dots are mouse droppings.
> View attachment 514023
> So yeah.  I’m a little concerned.


Totally unacceptable. I would be more than upset. The resources are there for janitors to do their job. Hopefully you will get this resolved. NO ONE should have to work in those conditions


----------



## Starwind

pigletto said:


> I’m not sure how I didn’t think of this already, but something just occurred to me.
> My 16 year old son has horrible seasonal allergies. When we went for the initial testing when he was 7, the paediatrician who did the test said he had one of the worst reactions he’s ever seen to ragweed. He got allergy shots for years and it’s better than it was but it’s still bad. We are on very strict regimen of allergy meds from late August to late October . I can tell if he’s even an hour late taking the medicine because he starts to sneeze and sneeze and sneeze and gets congested and his eyes get puffy and red etc. At that point he needs Benadryl to stop the reaction .
> 
> Anyway .. this complicates things a little . Would they have to isolate him and send him home from school if he started that reaction ? Surely if he’s coughing and sniffling and sneezing they can’t just take his word for it that it’s allergies ? At least a few times an allergy season we end up picking him up because the headache is so bad or he’s so congested. Then what ? Would he need a test before going back ?
> 
> This is all rhetorical I guess , because nobody knows what the protocol will be. Just another layer in the complicated decision that this is .



A possible help to your son's situation, which doesn't solve it entirely, but maybe could reduce the number of times it gets to the points where things flare up and become and issue...

The antihistamines I take are supposed to last 24 hours but only last 6-8 before there are noticeable symptoms like sneezing, coughing, tearing eyes, etc. NOt fun at the best of times when it happens mid-afternoon, but definitely not a good thing to be happening at work during covid. I take another antihistamine mid-day before the morning one wears off and if the timing is right they overlap enough to prevent the symptoms when the first wears off. The challenge is to remember to take it mid-day while you are busy with many other things. So I started doing some research...

I discovered that there are vibration alarms that are used for medication dosing reminders. They come in a variety of formats, including bracelets/wristbands that look like a small format Fitbit, watches, etc. IN fact, some of the activity trackers have built in vibration alarms that can be used for this purpose too. And many digital watches if only a single alarm needs to be set. I haven't gotten one yet because I have an added challenge that whatever I get can't have any wireless connection in it, but without that restriction there are lots of options. They make kid friendly ones too !!

In the meantime I have alarms set on my smartphone to remind me to take my meds at the right times. I usually don't hit snooze ;-) 

As for the school's policy re: symptoms and what they will do, that is a conversation you will have to have with the school. Personally, *I* wouldn't be surprised if they err on the side of caution though. FWIW, I have read several media stories of people who have now recovered from covid who when they first got sick with it thought their symptoms were due to allergies until after a few days they got sicker and realized "not allergies". So I could see a school [or, in my case, a workplace] going "yep, it probably is allergies in your case, but we aren't taking the chance" because they have a duty of care to the safety of all their students/employees.

SW


----------



## pigletto

Starwind said:


> A possible help to your son's situation, which doesn't solve it entirely, but maybe could reduce the number of times it gets to the points where things flare up and become and issue...
> 
> The antihistamines I take are supposed to last 24 hours but only last 6-8 before there are noticeable symptoms like sneezing, coughing, tearing eyes, etc. NOt fun at the best of times when it happens mid-afternoon, but definitely not a good thing to be happening at work during covid. I take another antihistamine mid-day before the morning one wears off and if the timing is right they overlap enough to prevent the symptoms when the first wears off. The challenge is to remember to take it mid-day while you are busy with many other things. So I started doing some research...
> 
> I discovered that there are vibration alarms that are used for medication dosing reminders. They come in a variety of formats, including bracelets/wristbands that look like a small format Fitbit, watches, etc. IN fact, some of the activity trackers have built in vibration alarms that can be used for this purpose too. And many digital watches if only a single alarm needs to be set. I haven't gotten one yet because I have an added challenge that whatever I get can't have any wireless connection in it, but without that restriction there are lots of options. They make kid friendly ones too !!
> 
> In the meantime I have alarms set on my smartphone to remind me to take my meds at the right times. I usually don't hit snooze ;-)
> 
> As for the school's policy re: symptoms and what they will do, that is a conversation you will have to have with the school. Personally, *I* wouldn't be surprised if they err on the side of caution though. FWIW, I have read several media stories of people who have now recovered from covid who when they first got sick with it thought their symptoms were due to allergies until after a few days they got sicker and realized "not allergies". So I could see a school [or, in my case, a workplace] going "yep, it probably is allergies in your case, but we aren't taking the chance" because they have a duty of care to the safety of all their students/employees.
> 
> SW


Thank you ! That is an excellent idea and I think you are right . We usually have him keep extra meds in his bag in case he feels like one isn’t going to be enough , but I’m going to take your suggestion and just have him take it a second time at the 8 hour mark . He can set a reminder on his cell phone. 
It’s almost impossible to distinguish it from a cold so I can definitely see it  being an issue .


----------



## bababear_50

Madame said:


> I’m not fighting for online.  I hate online.  Most kids hate online.
> 
> I’m going to post 2 photos I sent to a colleague at my former school as a kind of eye roll indicating that it was the same old same old. I changed schools in Feb and my room was in the same condition that the previous classroom was in - mouse crap everywhere (my old room had a cupboard of old magazines encrusted with mouse droppings and urine as they had been nesting in it for years obviously). Desks are NEVER cleaned unless I do it (rare if my boards get cleaned and when they do it’s with the floor broom), and in my new room the chairs get put up on the desks from the filthy floors. My old school about 7 years back seniors hot a master key and flipped every desk in every room (sigh). I wish I had taken a photo - Jesus the years of gum. I almost puked. My Mom was a custodian at my high school & I KNOW for a fact they scrapped that off every summer. Apparently not anymore
> 
> The ventilation is trash.  The circulation is trash.  So hot in the summer sweat dripping off me onto my kids’ desks if I lean over them to help.  I spend most of the winter teaching in a winter coat - no word of a lieMy last school they were renovating the foyer and the asbestos I had been screaming about because of the broken asbestos floor tile in my room (lots of old schools around here have high incidents of teacher cancers....) was fully exposed.....  Custodians had to sign something saying they wouldn’t sue and the whole damn thing was hushed up.
> 
> Brand new bottle filling stations upstairs shut down due to high lead that couldn’t be flushed out at a safe enough level. Washrooms locked because of vaping (2 were left open - 1 for each sex & God were they disgusting by the end of the day). The public has no clue what our work conditions are. I do not think that my schools are outside the norm.
> Do you have these conditions at your place of work..?  Cause, honestly, I don’t think these things will change in Sept. and I’m scared.
> 
> I used one baby wipe per desk (just the tops) - we are not permitted to use ANY chemicals ourselves.
> View attachment 514022
> This one is difficult to see - I tried to get a close up and of course it blurred but this was just one of my preps spent cleaning - the little black dots are mouse droppings.
> View attachment 514023
> So yeah.  I’m a little concerned.



I have been waiting for someone to be brutally honest.
Everything you have stated is in my school or even worst.
Yeah just got another notice about the Asbestos removal today.(this one is a level 2).
We (staff) hide wipes because we are not supposed to use them but the desks are so filthy we do use them. Plus for god sake I have a kids who are medically fragile.
We also have those huge creepy crawly BIG bugs behind all the white boards and old chalk boards.
Spiders,ants and mice galore. (And not the Mickey Mouse kind).
My co workers were so worried that I'd pick up something in late Feb that they went into the classroom and used water and bleach on all the desks. I was due to have gallbladder surgery. A very close co worker has just been diagnosed with a spot on her lungs//this dx came during the Pandemic and she is still waiting for to see a specialist,,Dr says it's from Asbestos. I'm so worried about her.
Every tap in the school has to be run for 5-8 minutes every morning due to high lead content.
I do our classroom but I'm not sure who does the others?????or even if they get done.
Do not let your kids drink school water.
I take bottled water for my special needs kids as their families can't afford it.
https://globalnews.ca/news/6603235/ontario-schools-safe-water/
https://www.thestar.com/news/invest...rch-our-database-to-see-the-test-results.html
And just a note here**** Custodians get 7-8 minutes per room max, ,,I know this for a fact as my youngest son used to work for a board as an evening custodian while going to school.
They are dealing with old/rundown facilities that should have been shut years ago.
He said it was the worst job he's had in his life,,,thank-goodness University paid off for him.



So yeah I have little to NO faith that things will be safe.
I'm packing my go to bag!
And just so I get to vote--I hate online too!,,BUT I will do it if I have to.
Hugs
Mel


----------



## pigletto

Madame said:


> I’m not fighting for online.  I hate online.  Most kids hate online.
> 
> I’m going to post 2 photos I sent to a colleague at my former school as a kind of eye roll indicating that it was the same old same old. I changed schools in Feb and my room was in the same condition that the previous classroom was in - mouse crap everywhere (my old room had a cupboard of old magazines encrusted with mouse droppings and urine as they had been nesting in it for years obviously). Desks are NEVER cleaned unless I do it (rare if my boards get cleaned and when they do it’s with the floor broom), and in my new room the chairs get put up on the desks from the filthy floors. My old school about 7 years back seniors hot a master key and flipped every desk in every room (sigh). I wish I had taken a photo - Jesus the years of gum. I almost puked. My Mom was a custodian at my high school & I KNOW for a fact they scrapped that off every summer. Apparently not anymore
> 
> The ventilation is trash.  The circulation is trash.  So hot in the summer sweat dripping off me onto my kids’ desks if I lean over them to help.  I spend most of the winter teaching in a winter coat - no word of a lieMy last school they were renovating the foyer and the asbestos I had been screaming about because of the broken asbestos floor tile in my room (lots of old schools around here have high incidents of teacher cancers....) was fully exposed.....  Custodians had to sign something saying they wouldn’t sue and the whole damn thing was hushed up.
> 
> Brand new bottle filling stations upstairs shut down due to high lead that couldn’t be flushed out at a safe enough level. Washrooms locked because of vaping (2 were left open - 1 for each sex & God were they disgusting by the end of the day). The public has no clue what our work conditions are. I do not think that my schools are outside the norm.
> Do you have these conditions at your place of work..?  Cause, honestly, I don’t think these things will change in Sept. and I’m scared.
> 
> I used one baby wipe per desk (just the tops) - we are not permitted to use ANY chemicals ourselves.
> View attachment 514022
> This one is difficult to see - I tried to get a close up and of course it blurred but this was just one of my preps spent cleaning - the little black dots are mouse droppings.
> View attachment 514023
> So yeah.  I’m a little concerned.


That is appalling .
My sons grade 8 classroom was on the third floor of a building built in 1924. There was little to no air movement up there . It wasn’t unusual for it to be 37 or 38 degrees in the classroom in September or June .  So many of these old buildings just aren’t equipped for the measures needed .


----------



## bababear_50

Interesting observation by family and friends............................
I have Rhinitis,,,,and allergies,,Pigletto I know what your son goes through and it's awful.
I can take up to 20mg of Reactine a day but prefer to try and keep it at 5mg.
Well I never get sick in the summertime. By the second week back to school I get sick.
Hmmmm makes one wonder.
Hugs
Mel


----------



## FigmentSpark

bababear_50 said:


> I have been waiting for someone to be brutally honest.
> Everything you have stated is in my school or even worst.
> Yeah just got another notice about the Asbestos removal today.(this one is a level 2).
> We (staff) hide wipes because we are not supposed to use them but the desks are so filthy we do use them. Plus for god sake I have a kids who are medically fragile.
> We also have those huge creepy crawly BIG bugs behind all the white boards and old chalk boards.
> Spiders,ants and mice galore. (And not the Mickey Mouse kind).
> My co workers were so worried that I'd pick up something in late Feb that they went into the classroom and used water and bleach on all the desks. I was due to have gallbladder surgery. A very close co worker has just been diagnosed with a spot on her lungs//this dx came during the Pandemic and she is still waiting for to see a specialist,,Dr says it's from Asbestos. I'm so worried about her.
> Every tap in the school has to be run for 5-8 minutes every morning due to high lead content.
> I do our classroom but I'm not sure who does the others?????or even if they get done.
> Do not let your kids drink school water.
> I take bottled water for my special needs kids as their families can't afford it.
> https://globalnews.ca/news/6603235/ontario-schools-safe-water/
> https://www.thestar.com/news/invest...rch-our-database-to-see-the-test-results.html
> And just a note here**** Custodians get 7-8 minutes per room max, ,,I know this for a fact as my youngest son used to work for a board as an evening custodian while going to school.
> They are dealing with old/rundown facilities that should have been shut years ago.
> He said it was the worst job he's had in his life,,,thank-goodness University paid off for him.
> 
> 
> 
> So yeah I have little to NO faith that things will be safe.
> I'm packing my go to bag!
> And just so I get to vote--I hate online too!,,BUT I will do it if I have to.
> Hugs
> Mel


I just dug a little deeper for my son's school.  It was one of the ones that tested as having high levels in a tap used for food prep back in 2018.  The board's answer... flush the taps every day for the next 24 months.  No filters necessary.  Yay.


----------



## Boopuff

The school I work in is filthy. I'm sure there are some good "custodians" out there, but I think ours excel at nothing but "Candy Crush".  I did the "cheerio test".  Placed one cheerio on the edge of the sink right by the faucet.  It sat, and sat, and sat.  You guessed it, the sink was NEVER cleaned.  We wipe down around the sink with "approved bleach solution" - Clorox wipes are not allowed...such a pain.  Well we don't have to be concerned, just got the missive today: On line learning until Oct.


----------



## bababear_50

Just a few snippets from an article I have been reading,,,
16.3 billion in disrepair!!!!
http://fixourschools.ca/
Please mark July 29th on your calendar to visit your local MPP’s office at noon and demand a safe and fully funded return to school for Ontario’s students. *Ontario Families for Public Education *and the *Ontario Parents Action Network* are organizing this event and ask that you please *register here*.

When you connect with your local MPP, be sure to remind them that even prior to the COVID-19 pandemic, provincial funding for schools was grossly inadequate, allowing* $16.3-billion of disrepair to accumulate in Ontario’s school buildings.* Below, we’ve listed school disrepair details for PC ridings where local MPPs signed the Fix Our Schools Pledge during the last provincial election, committing personally to ensuring all Ontario schools are provided adequate funding to ensure they are safe, healthy, well-maintained and provide environments conducive to learning.

Now would be the perfect time to remind these MPPs of their commitment and to hold them to their election promise! And please be sure to point out that for a *safe return to school amidst a global pandemic, school boards will need additional funding* to ensure PPE availability, good ventilation in classrooms, reasonable classroom temperatures, proper hand hygiene and cleanliness, and sufficient caretaking staff, to name but a few details.

And the Ontario Gov came to realize that Nursing Homes and Long Term care were in bad (horrific) shape,,,,take a look at our schools where our children are everyday!.

P>S> I am NOT advocating anyone go out and risk exposure to this nasty virus,,an email or call to your MP is a much safer idea!


----------



## pigletto

tgropp said:


> My son in law is the head of all skilled trades in a school board district. For the last three months they have been putting hand washing and hand sanitizing stations in the classroom along with partitions. Nothing is perfect but I find it ironic that a certain teachers union is fighting for online teaching which is exactly why they were striking last year. If every essential worker used this rational, the economy would have collapsed along with health care disappearing. I did my health care duties without getting sick. We were careful and pro active. To say that it’s on safe and refuse to work without even trying is unreasonable. I am not blaming teachers as they are the pawns in the game of chess between the teachers union and the provincial government. Very sad.


So I‘ve been giving your post some thought and feel the need to respectfully disagree with a few key points here . When the teachers unions were fighting against online learning as an acceptable delivery model it was because it is not a substitute for in class learning and not the best delivery method for our kids in all circumstances. They didn’t want to see a disproportionate amount of class learning to be shunted to online for a cost saving measure. Especially if it wasn’t the best delivery model for our kids.  I don’t think there was anywhere this was made more evident than the mess it was when all kids had to transition to online learning environment in the Spring. However .. a global pandemic is an entirely different animal . They are fighting for safe working conditions. Maybe a better way to look at it is that it’s ironic the Ontario government was so keen to push to online learning but won’t consider it now that we need it for health and safety.

My second problem with your post is the assertion that as a health care worker you did your job so everyone else should have to as well. Nobody is saying they don’t want to do their job .. they just want to be safe doing it. My entire family are doctors and nurses.. you all had PPE and strict protocols for disease mitigation. When you didn’t , your unions went to bat for you or there was public outcry. You were lauded as heroes  and honoured by the public. It’s a pretty far cry from what teachers are facing. Educators want a safe working environment , and money for the changes that need to be made to the school and classrooms. They can’t even get a mandate that people need to wear masks in their buildings . Everyone is so focused on what is best for their child’s mental health and learning that I feel some of us are forgetting there is a significant risk to educators and that hurts our kids too .

We should all be demanding truly safe working conditions for teachers . It benefits us all. If those rooms aren’t safe to work in, they aren’t safe for our families either.


----------



## tgropp

pigletto said:


> So I‘ve giving your post some thought and feel the need to respectfully disagree with a few key points here . When the teachers unions were fighting against online learning as an acceptable delivery model it was because it is not a substitute for in class learning and not the best delivery method for our kids in all circumstances . I don’t think there was anywhere  this was made more evident than the mess it was when all kids has to transition to online learning environment in the Spring. However .. a global pandemic is an entirely different animal . They are fighting for safe working conditions. Maybe a better way to look at it is that it’s ironic the Ontario government was so keen to push to online learning but won’t consider it now that we need it for health and safety.
> 
> My second problem with your post is the assertion that as a health care worker you did your job so everyone else should have to as well. Nobody is saying they don’t want to do their job .. they just want to be safe doing it. My entire family are doctors and nurses.. you all had PPE and strict protocols for disease mitigation. When you didn’t , your unions went to bat for you or there was public outcry. You were lauded as heroes  and honoured by the public. It’s a pretty far cry from what teachers are facing. Educators want a safe working environment , and money for the changes that need to be made to the school and classrooms. They can’t even get a mandate that people need to wear masks in their buildings . Everyone is so focused on what is best for their child’s mental health and learning that I feel some of us are forgetting their is a significant risk to educators and that hurts our kids too .
> 
> We should all be demanding truly safe working conditions for teachers . It benefits us all. If those rooms aren’t safe to work in, they aren’t safe for our families either.


And I totally respect your point of view. These are crazy times right now. There is a risk to everyone that Is working right now. Just not sure on how  we can identify the people that should be working and the ones that should not report to their Working environment. Some parents can not have their children at home and be teachers at the same time While they are working. Mental health is increasing at at an alarming rate. I don’t know the answer but I just feel that getting the children back to school is a step in the right direction if done as safely as possible......that is the key. Here is hoping that your concerns are met for that safe environment.


----------



## pigletto

tgropp said:


> And I totally respect your point of view. These are crazy times right now. There is a risk to everyone that Is working right now. Just not sure on how  we can identify the people that should be working and the ones that should not report to their Working environment. Some parents can not have their children at home and be teachers at the same time While they are working. Mental health is increasing at at an alarming rate. I don’t know the answer but I just feel that getting the children back to school is a step in the right direction if done as safely as possible......that is the key. Here is hoping that your concerns are met for that safe environment.


I agree. I think that the hardest part in all of this is that no matter how hard I try to come up with the right answers , there just doesn’t seem to be any that work for everyone. And that stinks.
Thank you for the friendly discussion. It’s not an easy one but it’s way easier when people are kind.


----------



## hdrolfe

CBC had an article this morning about back to school, based on research on COVID in children, from reading it seems that children under 10 are less likely to get infected, and thus not transmit it. I do wonder if the schools should focus on elementary aged kids being in classrooms (perhaps using the high schools) and more of the high school kids online. I know it wouldn't be all children, but certainly as kids get older there are some advantages, like being able to stay home alone while mom/dad are working. Whether they are responsible enough to get their school work done is debatable of course. I certainly know my son, at 10, is not ready to stay home along for a whole day. Even with me working, he still needs my time and attention throughout the day. He understand when I have a meeting or something, but I do have to adjust my day as I go. If he was younger? I can't see being able to both work and take care of him. If schools aren't safe how would a daycare be any better? Or having to use both? 

I do get it. I have no desire to head back to my office until there is a vaccine. But my office is cubciles packed closer than 6 feet, with 4 elevators for a 10 story building. Even with masks there is little chance of maintaining social distancing. And yes, I can work from home. But I cannot work from home and teach my son at the same time. It didn't work in the spring and it won't work this fall. So the choice for me is really, send him to school to get an education, or let him fall even further behind. Keep him home and safe, or send him and increase the risk. Health now, versus his mental health later, and now a bit too since he was really missing his friends when he couldn't get out, and winter will be worse since he'll be in the house a lot and not able to go play so much. He is a smart kid, he is curious and has a great imagination, but he's also easily distracted and lacks motivation to learn the basics. He is very aware that he is different from his friends, and he does not want to be singled out at all. If he falls behind and doesn't move forward with them to grade 7 and high school, he will be devastated. He has enough issues with self esteem as it is. 

This coming year is going to be hard on everyone.


----------



## Maddysdaddy

tgropp said:


> I don’t know the answer but I just feel that getting the children back to school is a step in the right direction if done as safely as possible......that is the key.



I haven’t heard anyone make the argument that in an ideal world, kids shouldn’t be in school. The question is how does a complete lack of social distancing + no mandatory masks + inadequate ventilation + inadequate cleaning = “as safely as possible”?

Baseball lasted less than a week before an outbreak started - and that was with fairly strict safety and testing protocols.  Provinces  already can’t keep up with testing, and that’s before our kids are sent back into the petri dishes we call schools.

Best case scenario, I can’t envision schools (at least here in Calgary) making it thru September before they’re shut down again because of an explosion in cases. I hope I’m wrong, but current trends based on people becoming more complacent (AB’s Chief Medical Officer said yesterday that the curve was no longer flattened) would suggest otherwise.


----------



## Donald - my hero

*I'm truly on the sidelines of this discussion because my "kids" range in age from 28 - 34 (if you include the ones who married into the family, ones i gave birth to are 32 & 34) but i still feel I have an obligation as a member of society to be involved, concerned and take the time to be properly informed on all sides of this evolving and less-than-perfect situation. There will never be a one-size-fits all answer to education during or after COVID-19 because there wasn't one BEFORE! There are so few children who fit into the cookie-cutter image of what a "normal" student is expected to be based on guidelines set out nor are there many teachers who are able to do all that expected of them and/or do it well.

I have some very close connections to educators and administrators in Ontario and because of this I get to be a fly on the wall for their side of the story. We live in a townhouse complex that is filled with children in all levels  of education from day care to post secondary so I'm part of the parking lot conversations for their side of the story (similar to the water cooler chats but with more swearing  ) My heart is pulled in several different directions and it aches for all of you who are struggling with these very difficult and far-reaching decisions. 

A friend just shared this well written letter to Ford, Lecce, board trustees and MPPs from a teacher who has decided to extend her parental leave until the end of 2020 and to keep her son home from school. I thought others might like to read her thoughts.

Return to School Open Letter*


----------



## pigletto

Donald - my hero said:


> *I'm truly on the sidelines of this discussion because my "kids" range in age from 28 - 34 (if you include the ones who married into the family, ones i gave birth to are 32 & 34) but i still feel I have an obligation as a member of society to be involved, concerned and take the time to be properly informed on all side of this evolving and less-than-perfect situation. There will never be a one-size-fits all answer to education during or after COVID-19 because there wasn't one BEFORE! There are so few children who fit into the cookie-cutter image of what a "normal" student is expected to be based on guidelines set out nor are there many teachers who are able to do all that expected of them and/or do it well.
> 
> I have some very close connections to educators and administrators in Ontario and because of this I get to be a fly on the wall for their side of the story. We live in a townhouse complex that is filled with children in all levels  of education from day care to post secondary so I'm part of the parking lot conversations for their side of the story (similar to the water cooler chats but with more swearing  ) My heart is pulled in several different directions and it aches for all of you who are struggling with these very difficult and far-reaching decisions.
> 
> A friend just shared this well written letter to Ford, Lecce, board trustees and MPPs from a teacher who has decided to extend her parental leave until the end of 2020 and to keep her son home from school. I thought others might like to read her thoughts.
> 
> Return to School Open Letter*



THIS!!!!
*I can’t order a freakin’ Timbit without a plexiglass shield between my masked mug and that of a gloved, mask-clad cashier who has to endure our brief 30 second interaction before passing my order across the counter via a stainless steel tray duct taped to a hockey stick to ensure distancing. Tell me again how returning to school indoors, full classes, 6 hours a day, without PPE is even an option right now?*


----------



## Madame

I’m going to have a conversation with DH tonight about the feasibility of taking an unpaid leave first semester.  I am already not sleeping - I am very anxious by nature 

Luckily as we advanced in our careers we kept the same small house and both car payments are finished as of this past May. Pretty sure that if we put a halt on vacation savings (where are we gonna go ) & the kids’ college/university savings, that we’ll be fine.

I could probably ask the group I’m setting up to barter/trade for my services- as long as we all stick to our bubble, there’s no reason their kids can’t be masked and dropped at my house to e-learn for the day.  Lots of Immersion/French-language parents will be looking for help and I can control contact and the cleanliness of my own house.


----------



## hdrolfe

So I do get that teachers should have protective equipment, but it's a bit different to be in a chohort of 15 or so kids who are being monitored for temperature and illneess versus serving everyone in the public who may or may not even be wearing a mask and certainly doesn't need the temperature checked before they walk into that grocery store. And those people working in the stores are serving far more than 15 people who they can trace. I don't see how that compares. Especially adding in that kids (under 10) are shown to be less suseptible to the virus than all those adults. 

I'd strongly suggest that the schools should be looking to countries that have successfully opened their schools, there have been a few. I have found this discussion eye opening in that it seems schools across the country are in really poor shape. I guess I have been lucky with my son's school, it's been well cleaned (I've seen the staff working when dropping off and picking up from daycare in the school), it's newer so no lead or asbestos, and, again, the school board plans do seem quite detailed and well thought out. I am gathering from all of you that those plans are something of a lie though, that they are telling parents what we want to hear to feel safe but in reality they won't be doing those things. I do feel that the first outbreak from a school will have the whole thing shut down, and they had better have a good plan in place for the online learning because the nonsense from the spring was useless and not worth the effort. I expect actual teaching to take place, not watch a video and answer some questions. To be honest here, if I had to send my son to the schools you all work in, he wouldn't be going.


----------



## tgropp

Would using Zoom for teaching be an option if an outbreak occurs again?


----------



## Madame

hdrolfe said:


> So I do get that teachers should have protective equipment, but it's a bit different to be in a chohort of 15 or so kids who are being monitored for temperature and illneess versus serving everyone in the public who may or may not even be wearing a mask and certainly doesn't need the temperature checked before they walk into that grocery store. And those people working in the stores are serving far more than 15 people who they can trace. I don't see how that compares. Especially adding in that kids (under 10) are shown to be less suseptible to the virus than all those adults.
> 
> I'd strongly suggest that the schools should be looking to countries that have successfully opened their schools, there have been a few. I have found this discussion eye opening in that it seems schools across the country are in really poor shape. I guess I have been lucky with my son's school, it's been well cleaned (I've seen the staff working when dropping off and picking up from daycare in the school), it's newer so no lead or asbestos, and, again, the school board plans do seem quite detailed and well thought out. I am gathering from all of you that those plans are something of a lie though, that they are telling parents what we want to hear to feel safe but in reality they won't be doing those things. I do feel that the first outbreak from a school will have the whole thing shut down, and they had better have a good plan in place for the online learning because the nonsense from the spring was useless and not worth the effort. I expect actual teaching to take place, not watch a video and answer some questions. To be honest here, if I had to send my son to the schools you all work in, he wouldn't be going.


I can only speak to my experience, but my hands were seriously tied in how much work, could I demand the kids show up to an online meeting etc.  Our kids weren’t rolling out of bed til after lunch which was why I was conferencing so late in the evening with them.  Some of them were working all day at grocery stores!!!  

I cannot have a cohort in high school.  I see 90 plus kids in a day!  Their schedules are not the same so it won’t be teachers moving from room to room.  It’s not possible.  Instead of this ridiculous lack of planning, they should have figured it out!!  They’ve had since March!  I’ve been around ED for too long not to know what will happen - last minute, do this (even though it’s not possible) and then berate us after for not following the non-existent plan.


----------



## hdrolfe

Madame said:


> I can only speak to my experience, but my hands were seriously tied in how much work, could I demand the kids show up to an online meeting etc.  Our kids weren’t rolling out of bed til after lunch which was why I was conferencing so late in the evening with them.  Some of them were working all day at grocery stores!!!
> 
> I cannot have a cohort in high school.  I see 90 plus kids in a day!  Their schedules are not the same so it won’t be teachers moving from room to room.  It’s not possible.  Instead of this ridiculous lack of planning, they should have figured it out!!  They’ve had since March!  I’ve been around ED for too long not to know what will happen - last minute, do this (even though it’s not possible) and then berate us after for not following the non-existent plan.



I think maybe elemntary and high schools need to have different plans, since they do work very differently? Though my son did have 4 teachers last year, and had to move rooms for most of his classes, they won't be able to do that this year. It has been a long time since high school but the majority of my classes I had the same kids with me, with some variation. I think online learning may work better for high school, provided they have the discipline necessary to do it. And the resources etc. 

Also agree, they have had since March to plan this! Why are we waiting to the last minute? Oh right, the first few months were spent in denial thinking we'd be "back to normal" quickly. Even at the end of the school year they didn't really come out with a proper plan for the new year. They had time. It's frustrating for everyone for sure.


----------



## susanv

Boopuff said:


> The school I work in is filthy. I'm sure there are some good "custodians" out there, but I think ours excel at nothing but "Candy Crush".  I did the "cheerio test".  Placed one cheerio on the edge of the sink right by the faucet.  It sat, and sat, and sat.  You guessed it, the sink was NEVER cleaned.  We wipe down around the sink with "approved bleach solution" - Clorox wipes are not allowed...such a pain.  Well we don't have to be concerned, just got the missive today: On line learning until Oct.


What province do you work in?


----------



## susanv

tgropp said:


> Would using Zoom for teaching be an option if an outbreak occurs again?


This wouldn't be an option for us.  Our school did an amazing job with distance education, however we live in a valley in a rural area with little to no internet service.  We pay through the nose for very spotty Rogers Infinity on our phones.  It was horrible for google meets, zoom and downloading some assignments.


----------



## BLAZEY

bcwife76 said:


> Here in BC the education minister is set to give an announcement about September this coming week. For the past few weeks we have all been led to believe we will return to blended learning but now from what I hear, BC wants full time participation for elementary and middle school and blended for high school. Guess we will find out this week. Then the premier announced "be prepared to have a plan B in case the virus creates a second wave." My kids are going into grades 5&7 and will be going back with, what I hope, are extra precautions. I'll post again later this week with an update once our education minister makes his announcement.


I'm in BC too, DD11 is going into grade 6, which in our district is the start of middle school. I really want her to be able to go back, she didn't go back in June, it just wasn't worth more change as she had gotten used to the online learning. She had a great report card at the end of June. the missed all the celebratory events the school usually does for the Grade 5 kids moving on. I honestly hope they do send the kids back, I have no issue with them requiring masks, or any other preventative measures to help slow the spread or exposure to the virus.


----------



## TammyLynn33

Maddysdaddy said:


> Baseball lasted less than a week before an outbreak started - and that was with fairly strict safety and testing protocols.  Provinces  already can’t keep up with testing, and that’s before our kids are sent back into the petri dishes we call schools.
> 
> Respectfully  totally disagree . Baseball players were in no way bubbled or quarantined before their mess started .  They are travelling into and from states with recommended 14 day quarantines ( which they and their media aren’t doing obviously ) and if you’ve watched 5 mins of any game they are high-fives all around  and not sitting 6 feet apart.. ( which had they bubbled before wouldn’t have mattered ai much )
> 
> NHL and  NBA have a chance because if their bubbling . Baseball has no hope in .. with their travel


----------



## TammyLynn33

hdrolfe said:


> CBC had an article this morning about back to school, based on research on COVID in children, from reading it seems that children under 10 are less likely to get infected, and thus not transmit it. I do wonder if the schools should focus on elementary aged kids being in classrooms (perhaps using the high schools) and more of the high school kids online. I know it wouldn't be all children, but certainly as kids get older there are some advantages, like being able to stay home alone while mom/dad are working. Whether they are responsible enough to get their school work done is debatable of course. I certainly know my son, at 10, is not ready to stay home along for a whole day. Even with me working, he still needs my time and attention throughout the day. He understand when I have a meeting or something, but I do have to adjust my day as I go. If he was younger? I can't see being able to both work and take care of him. If schools aren't safe how would a daycare be any better? Or having to use both?
> 
> I do get it. I have no desire to head back to my office until there is a vaccine. But my office is cubciles packed closer than 6 feet, with 4 elevators for a 10 story building. Even with masks there is little chance of maintaining social distancing. And yes, I can work from home. But I cannot work from home and teach my son at the same time. It didn't work in the spring and it won't work this fall. So the choice for me is really, send him to school to get an education, or let him fall even further behind. Keep him home and safe, or send him and increase the risk. Health now, versus his mental health later, and now a bit too since he was really missing his friends when he couldn't get out, and winter will be worse since he'll be in the house a lot and not able to go play so much. He is a smart kid, he is curious and has a great imagination, but he's also easily distracted and lacks motivation to learn the basics. He is very aware that he is different from his friends, and he does not want to be singled out at all. If he falls behind and doesn't move forward with them to grade 7 and high school, he will be devastated. He has enough issues with self esteem as it is.
> 
> This coming year is going to be hard on everyone.



Did you see Ottawa’s numbers . As of Sunday 55 kids under the age of 19 and a lot 0-9 From the 3 daycare outbreaks.. I’m sure it’s higher now I’ve just been swamped with work, school and kids. Ottawa is the new hot spot and it’s affecting kids


----------



## hdrolfe

TammyLynn33 said:


> Did you see Ottawa’s numbers . As of Sunday 55 kids under the age of 19 and a lot 0-9 From the 3 daycare outbreaks.. I’m sure it’s higher now I’ve just been swamped with work, school and kids. Ottawa is the new hot spot and it’s affecting kids



My understanding is that the majority of new cases are in teens and 20's, below 10 there is only a handful and not new as of today but over the weekend. But perhaps I am not looking at the right numbers? If there is a better place to check I'm happy to see it. I am looking at the Ottawa Public Health but it's more summary totals than day by day totals.


----------



## Madame

hdrolfe said:


> My understanding is that the majority of new cases are in teens and 20's, below 10 there is only a handful and not new as of today but over the weekend. But perhaps I am not looking at the right numbers? If there is a better place to check I'm happy to see it. I am looking at the Ottawa Public Health but it's more summary totals than day by day totals.


I found this, but not sure if it’s the info you need (link is where I found the chart:
https://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/ottawa-re...-more-than-a-month-cases-rise-by-25-1.5042058


----------



## bababear_50

hdrolfe said:


> So I do get that teachers should have protective equipment, but it's a bit different to be in a chohort of 15 or so kids who are being monitored for temperature and illneess versus serving everyone in the public who may or may not even be wearing a mask and certainly doesn't need the temperature checked before they walk into that grocery store. And those people working in the stores are serving far more than 15 people who they can trace. I don't see how that compares. Especially adding in that kids (under 10) are shown to be less suseptible to the virus than all those adults.
> 
> I'd strongly suggest that the schools should be looking to countries that have successfully opened their schools, there have been a few. I have found this discussion eye opening in that it seems schools across the country are in really poor shape. I guess I have been lucky with my son's school, it's been well cleaned (I've seen the staff working when dropping off and picking up from daycare in the school), it's newer so no lead or asbestos, and, again, the school board plans do seem quite detailed and well thought out. I am gathering from all of you that those plans are something of a lie though, that they are telling parents what we want to hear to feel safe but in reality they won't be doing those things. I do feel that the first outbreak from a school will have the whole thing shut down, and they had better have a good plan in place for the online learning because the nonsense from the spring was useless and not worth the effort. I expect actual teaching to take place, not watch a video and answer some questions. To be honest here, if I had to send my son to the schools you all work in, he wouldn't be going.



Hi Hon
So see here's the thing,,,
I don't think the responsibility is going to be on the school to do a wellness check (temp,illness) at all.
I think the responsibility will be on the parent. I mean we could never have enough time to do a wellness check for every kid or we'd have no classroom time,,plus who's going to do them?
I know a designated person will have a list and just call the parent or guardian to pick up the child immediately. I know a isolated area is going to be needed but staffed by who is unknown.
We don't know what the procedure for notifying the rest of the class will be? Crum even for something as common as head lice there are strict privacy protocols. We don't even know if the child will be required to see a doc or get a test before they return.
Pretty much the parent could at this point say oh he's just got a cold and they bring him back the next day.
Remember your son's group of 15 kids also includes their extended bubble group 
15 kids + 1-5 staff  x 10 

Hugs
Mel


----------



## Aladora

For anyone in BC who may have missed it, there is going to be an announcement tomorrow at 12:30 where the government will outline their plans for the 2020-2021 school year.

https://www.cheknews.ca/b-c-school-...cfV3_mgX832TS2KUGIGyiqBJeO-NfxBT-apYqY5iq5mzM


----------



## pigletto

bababear_50 said:


> Hi Hon
> So see here's the thing,,,
> I don't think the responsibility is going to be on the school to do a wellness check (temp,illness) at all.
> I think the responsibility will be on the parent. I mean we could never have enough time to do a wellness check for every kid or we'd have no classroom time,,plus who's going to do them?
> I know a designated person will have a list and just call the parent or guardian to pick up the child immediately. I know a isolated area is going to be needed but staffed by who is unknown.
> We don't know what the procedure for notifying the rest of the class will be? Crum even for something as common as head lice there are strict privacy protocols. We don't even know if the child will be required to see a doc or get a test before they return.
> Pretty much the parent could at this point say oh he's just got a cold and they bring him back the next day.
> Remember your son's group of 15 kids also includes their extended bubble group
> 15 kids + 1-5 staff  x 10
> 
> Hugs
> Mel


We won’t have mandated masks or wellness checks. This is what it says on our school board FAQ about any sort of wellness checks ;

_*Will there be COVID testing for staff and students? Will there be daily health screening?*_
*It will be the parent’s and student’s responsibility to do a daily assessment before sending them to school. If your child exhibits symptoms such as coughing, fever, and headache, they are not permitted to attend school. If anyone in your household has a confirmed case of COVID-19, your child must remain home and you must contact your health provider for more information.*


----------



## hdrolfe

bababear_50 said:


> Hi Hon
> So see here's the thing,,,
> I don't think the responsibility is going to be on the school to do a wellness check (temp,illness) at all.
> I think the responsibility will be on the parent. I mean we could never have enough time to do a wellness check for every kid or we'd have no classroom time,,plus who's going to do them?
> I know a designated person will have a list and just call the parent or guardian to pick up the child immediately. I know a isolated area is going to be needed but staffed by who is unknown.
> We don't know what the procedure for notifying the rest of the class will be? Crum even for something as common as head lice there are strict privacy protocols. We don't even know if the child will be required to see a doc or get a test before they return.
> Pretty much the parent could at this point say oh he's just got a cold and they bring him back the next day.
> Remember your son's group of 15 kids also includes their extended bubble group
> 15 kids + 1-5 staff  x 10
> 
> Hugs
> Mel



I think public health will still be involved with the contact tracing, but in a group like that it certainly is easier than if it's just the whole school. And I do understand the bubble thing, which is part of why I will be contacting the school to let them know the kids my son has already been playing with (socially distanced and outside but still).


----------



## Madame

I forgot I was going to post this for anyone interested.  I follow this teacher on Twitter - he is the guru of Covid stats  & has even put forth a very detailed re-opening of schools assessment. 

Possible class sizes on the top, region on the left, Twitter handle at the very top.  The chart updates daily on his feed.  Yeah, we’re the big ole 25.2% in a class of 33 towards the bottom.  Too bad it doesn’t mean we’re winning


----------



## Madame

Madame said:


> I forgot I was going to post this for anyone interested.  I follow this teacher on Twitter - he is the guru of Covid stats  & has even put forth a very detailed re-opening of schools assessment.
> 
> Possible class sizes on the top, region on the left, Twitter handle at the very top.  The chart updates daily on his feed.  Yeah, we’re the big ole 25.2% in a class of 33 towards the bottom.  Too bad it doesn’t mean we’re winning
> 
> View attachment 514274


And I just found today’s


----------



## badiggio

I'm happy my grandkids are homeschooled .The way i see it,putting kids in a so called bubble ,while in school,without masks or  social distancing in an enclosed classroom,doesn't do anything as far as the preventing of spreading the virus,but increases it.What about when the kids go home to their families,other friends,etc.Now they've been exposed to everyone in your family and friends have been exposed to.I would wait as long as it takes before potentially risking my kids lives to rush back to school.JMO


----------



## bcwife76

BLAZEY said:


> I'm in BC too, DD11 is going into grade 6, which in our district is the start of middle school. I really want her to be able to go back, she didn't go back in June, it just wasn't worth more change as she had gotten used to the online learning. She had a great report card at the end of June. the missed all the celebratory events the school usually does for the Grade 5 kids moving on. I honestly hope they do send the kids back, I have no issue with them requiring masks, or any other preventative measures to help slow the spread or exposure to the virus.


So my oldest going into grade 7, this will be her last year of elementary school (we don't have middle schools in Surrey). I didn't send either of mine back in June not because of the virus but because the amount of days they would have been back would have been so minimal. We are definitely leaning towards sending both of ours back in September, with masks, sanitizer etc. Will be interesting to see what Fleming has to say tomorrow but I'm 99% sure he's going to say full time in class instruction for elementary and middle school.


----------



## FigmentSpark

Madame said:


> And I just found today’s
> View attachment 514276


Ouch.  My son is supposed to be going to U. Windsor in Sept.  While the classes are all online for the fall, nothing's been said about winter, so we've booked him a room on the campus just so he will have something in winter.  He was planning on mostly staying home, but we are picking up his keys and putting sheets on the bed, in case he does need to be on campus for anything.  But when I see that number, I mean, wow!  I thought most of the Windsor-Essex were on a few farms.  Those stats suggest the virus is pervasive throughout the area.  Now I'm thinking we should highly encourage our DS to just stay home and do his classes online only.


----------



## mshanson3121

TammyLynn33 said:


> No what I meant is because he’s designated as special needs they don’t care if he learns they simply try to avoid meltdowns .
> I pushed him and saw results I wish I could home school permanently but I need to work too



Don't give up on the idea of homeschooling permanently just because you work. It's hard, but I know many people that successfully do it. You might look into joining a couple homeschool groups on Facebook, there are some just for working Moms that you might glean some support from, even if it is just this year. 

https://www.facebook.com/groups/WorkingHomeschoolMomClub/
Special needs homeschooling groups can also be helpful. I have to say, choosing to homeschool our daughter with ASD, was by far the best option. Not easy, but definitely the best for her.


----------



## Madame

FigmentSpark said:


> Ouch.  My son is supposed to be going to U. Windsor in Sept.  While the classes are all online for the fall, nothing's been said about winter, so we've booked him a room on the campus just so he will have something in winter.  He was planning on mostly staying home, but we are picking up his keys and putting sheets on the bed, in case he does need to be on campus for anything.  But when I see that number, I mean, wow!  I thought most of the Windsor-Essex were on a few farms.  Those stats suggest the virus is pervasive throughout the area.  Now I'm thinking we should highly encourage our DS to just stay home and do his classes online only.


The workers visit the Walmarts, grocery stores, etc.  Granted I am more anxious by nature than most, but I would not be sending him if he’s comfortable online.  Think of it this way, I work in Windsor but live in one of the greenhouse communities and DD goes to school in the other greenhouse community where my DM also lives.  Once schools open, this is going to be EVERYWHERE.  

Our family used to own greenhouses before my DF died.  My DM made sure that the workers were comfortable, but there are places where they are stacked into « housing » like cordwood, and testing on farms remains voluntary, so


----------



## quandrea

mshanson3121 said:


> Don't give up on the idea of homeschooling permanently just because you work. It's hard, but I know many people that successfully do it. You might look into joining a couple homeschool groups on Facebook, there are some just for working Moms that you might glean some support from, even if it is just this year.
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/groups/WorkingHomeschoolMomClub/
> Special needs homeschooling groups can also be helpful. I have to say, choosing to homeschool our daughter with ASD, was by far the best option. Not easy, but definitely the best for her.


I’m a special education teacher by profession and I’ve always said that if I had a special needs child, my first decision would be to remove him or her from the public school system.


----------



## mshanson3121

bankr63 said:


> So community schooling could solve a couple of issues; I am thinking like the one room schoolhouse.  Small cohorts of students from a limited area would attend school at one neighbor's house (all grades together) allowing for social interaction with a small cohort of friends.  That neighbor could be compensated by the government to oversee the children's education.  Proper access to internet and devices would have to provided (also government subsidized); that is one of the biggest issues that many families faced - five kids and one laptop trying to share access and attend sessions at one time. The parent who takes on this role is intended to be a proctor/assistant, ensuring that students are putting in the effort; the teachers would still create the content.  the proctor would ensure that students who need help with topics are actually reaching out to the professional teachers and would enable these interactions.  This would also help with the unemployment problem for folks (like me) who are unable to find work during the COVID crisis.



The problem being that indoor spaces are the highest risk. So, you're not solving anything. You're still indoors in a relatively small space with multiple people that are going out and living their life after school, cross-exposing everyone. It's a smaller class-size, yes. But basically the same problems regarding risk remain.




bababear_50 said:


> He says "well why don't hey open the Hockey arena and hold the clases there ,,then the kids can take breaks skating" ?
> There are washrooms and also a snack bar???? Hmmmmmm...Mmmmmm.



An idea I mentioned earlier, that I have seen discussed a lot on Facebook, and that is being put in place in various places in the US, Canada and across the world, are outdoor classrooms this year. This is what many places did during/after the 1918-1919 pandemic - they did school outside, even in winter (with very unique options for staying warm I must say, lol). Outdoor, fresh air spaces pose the least amount of risk, and offer more space to spread out. It poses it's challenges, and would require flexible thinking, but it really should be an option to be considered.



pigletto said:


> That is appalling .
> My sons grade 8 classroom was on the third floor of a building built in 1924. There was little to no air movement up there . It wasn’t unusual for it to be 37 or 38 degrees in the classroom in September or June .  So many of these old buildings just aren’t equipped for the measures needed .



Yup... many of our schools were built during times that had very different (horrible) building codes, different materials allowed, horrible ventilation etc...  And some of the new schools aren't much better.  The town I grew up in closed several of their elementary and middle schools, which were old and had many issues, and built two new K-8 schools. So, yes, everything is up to code as far as insulation, plumbing etc... Much better air exchange. However, there's still no AC/Heat. The thermostat is set at a consistent temperature all year long, and can only be adjusted by 2-3 degrees. And even better is the fact that there's no thermostat in the classroom for the teacher to use - the temperatures are controlled remotely by district office, over 100 km away. If you want to lower or raise the temperature in your classroom, you have to submit a Help Desk request to head office, and wait for them to comply. When you're on the 3rd floor of a school... it can get mighty hot. And bonus... the new schools don't have windows that can be opened, due to "safety". At least in the old schools, each teacher could control the temperature in their classroom, and they had windows that opened fully for fresh air.



hdrolfe said:


> CBC had an article this morning about back to school, based on research on COVID in children, from reading it seems that children under 10 are less likely to get infected, and thus not transmit it. I do wonder if the schools should focus on elementary aged kids being in classrooms (perhaps using the high schools) and more of the high school kids online.



Two thoughts:

1. This is how they're doing it where we are. K-8 are going back in class, high school is going to be blended, partly in school, partly on line. No social distancing required for the younger kids, full social distancing required for high school.

2. That said, just because under 10 are less likely, doesn't mean it won't happen. We had an outbreak occur in NB, three young children (preschool to K age) all caught/spread Covid. One needed hospitalization.



tgropp said:


> Would using Zoom for teaching be an option if an outbreak occurs again?



Not a great one, no. My husband had to use it for work and it definitely has limitations. It's also not good for areas with poor connection.


----------



## ForeverDance

We are in an interesting situation as our 8 year old daughter has a medical condition that makes her high risk. The one benefit of this is that we have access to a whole medical team. We had a long discussion with them a couple of weeks ago, and unless something changes drastically in the next month, our daughter will be going back to class if the schools are open.  At this point, they have asked us to prioritize her mental health. They believe the mental health struggles she is experiencing from the sustained physical distancing is doing more harm than the potential risk. Again, this is based off the current situation and the area we live in. If things change then we may need to re-assess.


----------



## mshanson3121

quandrea said:


> I’m a special education teacher by profession and I’ve always said that if I had a special needs child, my first decision would be to remove him or her from the public school system.



Yup, sadly. Our district especially is short staffed, and there just is not the necessary support. My mother is a teacher and she was one of the first ones to tell us that our kids would end up being the "left behind" ones (our son has his own challenges). So then add in the amount of days my daughter would have missed due doctors appointments, hospitalizations, not feeling well... School just isn't the place for her.


----------



## quandrea

mshanson3121 said:


> Yup, sadly. Our district especially is short staffed, and there just is not the necessary support. My mother is a teacher and she was one of the first ones to tell us that our kids would end up being the "left behind" ones (our son has his own challenges). So then add in the amount of days my daughter would have missed due doctors appointments, hospitalizations, not feeling well... School just isn't the place for her.


Exactly. When I worked for the public board, I had sixty kids on my caseload—grade seven and eight. All were years behind in math and reading and I could only go into math or English classes to provide support. No withdrawal. I could not make any effective change for anyone. Those kids just got further and further behind. Now when I worked in a private school for special education kids—3-5 in a class, I made real progress. Tutoring was also highly successful.


----------



## Madame

I feel like we’re getting punked.  SickKids new recommendations would have us return with no mask mandate, no cohorting and a ONE metre distance 5 days / wk.  How very convenient for the government.  It talks of ventilation and sanitation, but we know those are lies.  This is REGARDLESS of regional infection rate.  I expect board plans to be completely overridden tomorrow for a one-size fits all « solution. »

The image is this teacher’s room - in the following Tweet she made it clear more desks would fit with the 1m guidelines, but this is her class number for now.


----------



## Madame

And this camp where all were masked & following distancing rules:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/boucherville-cases-day-camp-1.5666352


----------



## wdwmom3

Madame said:


> I feel like we’re getting punked.  SickKids new recommendations would have us return with no mask mandate, no cohorting and a ONE metre distance 5 days / wk.  How very convenient for the government.  It talks of ventilation and sanitation, but we know those are lies.  This is REGARDLESS of regional infection rate.  I expect board plans to be completely overridden tomorrow for a one-size fits all « solution. »
> 
> The image is this teacher’s room - in the following Tweet she made it clear more desks would fit with the 1m guidelines, but this is her class number for now.
> 
> 
> View attachment 514422View attachment 514423



I don’t know what you are reading.  But this says they do recommend masks in high school students and possibly middle school.  They also recommend smaller class sizes and cohorting students so they only stay with one group.  

It also still recommends 2 m distance but says there would not be significant change of transmitoon at 1m.  I read somewhere else 2 m was still being recommended for high school.  It’s also important to note that many other counties use 1.5 M as the distance to stay apart not 2.  
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/sickkids-experts-recommendations-1.5667023


----------



## Madame

wdwmom3 said:


> I don’t know what you are reading.  But this says they do recommend masks in high school students and possibly middle school.  They also recommend smaller class sizes and cohorting students so they only stay with one group.
> 
> It also still recommends 2 m distance but says there would not be significant change of transmitoon at 1m.  I read somewhere else 2 m was still being recommended for high school.  It’s also important to note that many other counties use 1.5 M as the distance to stay apart not 2.
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/sickkids-experts-recommendations-1.5667023


I read the entire actual report.  Not a media synopsis.  I know what you think.  I’m not engaging with you.  Leave.  Me.  Alone.


----------



## bababear_50

I can't see anywhere that it is Mandatory for staff to wear mask?
Ont GTA area.
Anyone help me out with this?

Thanks Mel


----------



## Madame

bababear_50 said:


> I can't see anywhere that it is Mandatory for staff to wear mask?
> Ont GTA area.
> Anyone help me out with this?
> 
> Thanks Mel


Well, you see bababear, you wearing a mask might interfere with your facial expression (insert major sarcasm here) - this is pulled from page 18


----------



## hdrolfe

wdwmom3 said:


> I don’t know what you are reading.  But this says they do recommend masks in high school students and possibly middle school.  They also recommend smaller class sizes and cohorting students so they only stay with one group.
> 
> It also still recommends 2 m distance but says there would not be significant change of transmitoon at 1m.  I read somewhere else 2 m was still being recommended for high school.  It’s also important to note that many other counties use 1.5 M as the distance to stay apart not 2.
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/sickkids-experts-recommendations-1.5667023



The report itself is actually quite detailed and explains all of these points, including their recommendation for young children to not wear masks because it is harder for them to maintain proper hygene while doing so. They'll be touching them, taking them off, etc, and it can be worse than not wearing one at all. As well, masks are necessary where social distancing can't be maintained, that's standard across all provinces, so if the students are all the recommended distance apart, why do they need a mask on? 

They also recommend more space in classrooms and using "non traditional classrooms" which I would take to mean setting up other rooms and turning them into classrooms. Co horting in groups of 10-15 is also recommended to help with this. They note that it is easier in elemntary classes and that in high school masks and social distancing may be a better choice. 

The CBC article obviously highlights the top points but is a good summary of the report. I am impressed that so many doctors across the province wrote it and they do cite where there is disagreement on something. 

@bababear_50 The section on EA's and PPE is on page 16 and specifically for working with children with development delays etc, so I think the type of work you do? http://www.sickkids.ca/PDFs/About-S...mmendations-for-School-Reopening-SickKids.pdf


----------



## wdwmom3

hdrolfe said:


> The report itself is actually quite detailed and explains all of these points, including their recommendation for young children to not wear masks because it is harder for them to maintain proper hygene while doing so. They'll be touching them, taking them off, etc, and it can be worse than not wearing one at all. As well, masks are necessary where social distancing can't be maintained, that's standard across all provinces, so if the students are all the recommended distance apart, why do they need a mask on?
> 
> They also recommend more space in classrooms and using "non traditional classrooms" which I would take to mean setting up other rooms and turning them into classrooms. Co horting in groups of 10-15 is also recommended to help with this. They note that it is easier in elemntary classes and that in high school masks and social distancing may be a better choice.
> 
> The CBC article obviously highlights the top points but is a good summary of the report. I am impressed that so many doctors across the province wrote it and they do cite where there is disagreement on something.
> 
> @bababear_50 The section on EA's and PPE is on page 16 and specifically for working with children with development delays etc, so I think the type of work you do? http://www.sickkids.ca/PDFs/About-S...mmendations-for-School-Reopening-SickKids.pdf



Yes and some people apparently want to pick out specific words and ignore others just to fit what they have been saying and how “terrible” opening schools is .  They want to pick out parts that say “kids shouldn’t wear masks” and ignore that the comment is made in reference to certain situations and also ignore where the report “kids should wear masks” . 

This is how misinformation spreads.  People pick and choose things.  You need to look at things in their entirety.


----------



## tgropp

Madame said:


> I read the entire actual report.  Not a media synopsis.  I know what you think.  I’m not engaging with you.  Leave.  Me.  Alone.


Than you are in the wrong forum. I don’t think that anyone knows the real facts and for one to think that they are 100% right well....... There are many posters/ teachers/ concerned parents that have offered their point of view with respect for each other. Let’s all try to keep this civil. It is understandable for people to be upset though with other posters. I find a glass of wine helps. Stay healthy everyone. We will get through this


----------



## bankr63

Madame said:


> I’m not fighting for online.  I hate online.  Most kids hate online.
> 
> I’m going to post 2 photos I sent to a colleague at my former school as a kind of eye roll indicating that it was the same old same old. I changed schools in Feb and my room was in the same condition that the previous classroom was in - mouse crap everywhere (my old room had a cupboard of old magazines encrusted with mouse droppings and urine as they had been nesting in it for years obviously). Desks are NEVER cleaned unless I do it (rare if my boards get cleaned and when they do it’s with the floor broom), and in my new room the chairs get put up on the desks from the filthy floors. My old school about 7 years back seniors hot a master key and flipped every desk in every room (sigh). I wish I had taken a photo - Jesus the years of gum. I almost puked. My Mom was a custodian at my high school & I KNOW for a fact they scrapped that off every summer. Apparently not anymore
> 
> The ventilation is trash.  The circulation is trash.  So hot in the summer sweat dripping off me onto my kids’ desks if I lean over them to help.  I spend most of the winter teaching in a winter coat - no word of a lieMy last school they were renovating the foyer and the asbestos I had been screaming about because of the broken asbestos floor tile in my room (lots of old schools around here have high incidents of teacher cancers....) was fully exposed.....  Custodians had to sign something saying they wouldn’t sue and the whole damn thing was hushed up.
> 
> Brand new bottle filling stations upstairs shut down due to high lead that couldn’t be flushed out at a safe enough level. Washrooms locked because of vaping (2 were left open - 1 for each sex & God were they disgusting by the end of the day). The public has no clue what our work conditions are. I do not think that my schools are outside the norm.
> Do you have these conditions at your place of work..?  Cause, honestly, I don’t think these things will change in Sept. and I’m scared.
> 
> I used one baby wipe per desk (just the tops) - we are not permitted to use ANY chemicals ourselves.
> View attachment 514022
> This one is difficult to see - I tried to get a close up and of course it blurred but this was just one of my preps spent cleaning - the little black dots are mouse droppings.
> View attachment 514023
> So yeah.  I’m a little concerned.


Jeez, I didn't know you worked at my wife's school!


----------



## Madame

tgropp said:


> Than you are in the wrong forum. I don’t think that anyone knows the real facts and for one to think that they are 100% right well....... There are many posters/ teachers/ concerned parents that have offered their point of view with respect for each other. Let’s all try to keep this civil. It is understandable for people to be upset though with other posters. I find a glass of wine helps. Stay healthy everyone. We will get through this


I have asked that poster repeatedly not  to quote me.  She implied I was lazy or incompetent.  I don’t need that type of shrill judgement in my life right now thx.  I have been VERY civil.  It didn’t work   I don’t drink, but thanks.


----------



## Aladora

So, BC schools are reopening in September at Stage 2 of the resart plan.

https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/education-training/k-12/covid-19-return-to-school
The kids will be in "learning groups" of up to 60 for elementary and middle school and up to 120 for high school.

https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/education-training/k-12/covid-19-return-to-school/learning-groups


----------



## Best_Vacation_EVER!

The document from Sick Kids about re-opening was well done and helpful but I'm really waiting for the announcement this week to see what the Ontario government announces specifically to figure things out for us.   After that we'll look at how the school board plans to implement what the Province announces....  

We really want to send DS back to the classroom in September --- SAFELY --- as that's where he really thrives academically.   If we're not confident we'll figure that out once everything is out there and make our decision then...


----------



## bcwife76

Aladora said:


> So, BC schools are reopening in September at Stage 2 of the resart plan.
> 
> https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/education-training/k-12/covid-19-return-to-school
> The kids will be in "learning groups" of up to 60 for elementary and middle school and up to 120 for high school.
> 
> https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/education-training/k-12/covid-19-return-to-school/learning-groups


Still have LOTS of questions lol Hoping for more direction from our school district soon.


----------



## ottawamom

wdwmom3 said:


> I don’t know what you are reading.  But this says they do recommend masks in high school students and possibly middle school.  They also recommend smaller class sizes and cohorting students so they only stay with one group.



In an effort to keep this discussion civil, another way of phrasing this might have been to say "My interpretation of the following article is ..." This way no one is attacked and put on the defensive and you get your point across.

Covid has everyone on edge. Lets keep the discussions as pleasant as possible while discussing different points of view.


----------



## hdrolfe

Looks like Ontario should find something out tomorrow
https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/ontario-...DNjGII4txbnu5bm6e9qo4nnVwPrqiaQH11dpE4uoLWHv0


----------



## Aladora

bcwife76 said:


> Still have LOTS of questions lol Hoping for more direction from our school district soon.



Yeah, I think most of us have a ton of questions!

Our family is in a bit of a different situation. DS just got accepted into a private school for this upcoming year and we have zero idea how they are going to do things. Guess it is a wait and see situation!

I'm of two minds about in school learning. 

On one hand, he did amazingly well for March-June and his grades improved in 2 of his 4 subjects with the other 2 staying exactly the same. He ended the year with straight As so I am not concerned about his ability to learn remotely in a regular school environment. 

On the other hand, the new school he is going to is an IB school so his courses are going to be more intensive and I am concerned about that. They also have a certain amount of volunteer hours they need to do in order to graduate and with so many volunteer organizations not running at full capacity, I'm not sure what he is going to do to fulfill his obligations. I was really counting on sending him to help with my mother's Rotary Club events (he has been volunteering there for almost 10 years) but all events for 2020 have been cancelled.


----------



## DisLiss

I cared more about knowing what our school would do than what they actually were going to do, because honestly, there are so many pros and cons to each choice that no matter which I thought was best, a part of me would still second guess the choice anyway.

So now they've announced we'll start virtual then ramp up to "normal".  The ramping up part is still a work in progress, but we do know that students can continue to learn virtually and reenter the schools as families see fit, which I think is something that will work out well for most families.  People like choices.  How it will all play our remains to be seen, but at least we know where our starting point it and it's a starting point that won't change if things get worse, which could have been the case in a "start with everyone at school" or a hybrid situation.  So if nothing else it's nice to have one stable thing to plan for this year.  So far it's been the only stable thing to plan for.


----------



## mshanson3121

Madame said:


> And this camp where all were masked & following distancing rules:
> 
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/boucherville-cases-day-camp-1.5666352



It has blown my mind that day camps are running this year. Locally, our huge Christian camp decided to go ahead with overnight camps. Um.... no thanks. And yes, this definitely challenges the idea that kids under 10 rarely get/transmit it.



wdwmom3 said:


> Yes and some people apparently want to pick out specific words and ignore others just to fit what they have been saying and how “terrible” opening schools is .



Seriously, why are you even here if this topic bothers you or triggers you so badly?


----------



## wdwmom3

mshanson3121 said:


> It has blown my mind that day camps are running this year. Locally, our huge Christian camp decided to go ahead with overnight camps. Um.... no thanks. And yes, this definitely challenges the idea that kids under 10 rarely get/transmit it.
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously, why are you even here if this topic bothers you or triggers you so badly?



What bothers me is the misinformation.  

Bottom line is parents should have the choice to send their kids to school or not.  Every parent who doesn’t feel the school is safe can keep their child hone. And teachers have the same options as every other person who works.  They go to work or if they don’t feel safe or have health issues then they stay home.  

Look I usually support teachers.  They do a tough job.  But so do lots of other people.  Many other people have had to make decisions to return to work or not.   To me it’s no different with teachers. I wonder do the same people arguing about keeping schools closed also think dental offices and hair salons should be closed? I doubt it.


----------



## Brett Wyman

Our school board just announced their plans and all I have to say is, put down the crack pipe. They have decide k-2 kids are somehow supposed to sit through an entire 7 hour school day of live online classes(with breaks and an hour for lunch to be fair). There’s a virtual town hall on August 5th and I hope the school board has fire extinguishers near by. It’s gonna be a hot one  . How parents who have to work from home full time are supposed to make that work is beyond me.


----------



## Best_Vacation_EVER!

Brett Wyman said:


> Our school board just announced their plans and all I have to say is, put down the crack pipe. They have decide k-2 kids are somehow supposed to sit through an entire 7 hour school day of live online classes(with breaks and an hour for lunch to be fair). There’s a virtual town hall on August 5th and I hope the school board has fire extinguishers near by. It’s gonna be a hot one  . How parents who have to work from home full time are supposed to make that work is beyond me.



Just out of curiousity what province are you in?   based on news it seems like BC but this seems crazy....


----------



## wdwmom3

Madame said:


> I have asked that poster repeatedly not  to quote me.  She implied I was lazy or incompetent.  I don’t need that type of shrill judgement in my life right now thx.  I have been VERY civil.  It didn’t work   I don’t drink, but thanks.



I did not imply any of those things.


----------



## wdwmom3

In case anyone wants to read another article about what Sick Kids is recommending here you go.  They are recommending masks for high school students and for desks in high schools to be spaced 2 M apart.  They do not recommend masks for elementary schools for a variety of reasons. 

https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/high-...r-masks-this-fall-experts-recommend-1.5043641


----------



## bababear_50

I'm out of this discussion.
Best wishes to you all come the Fall.
Hugs
Mel


----------



## wdwmom3

ottawamom said:


> In an effort to keep this discussion civil, another way of phrasing this might have been to say "My interpretation of the following article is ..." This way no one is attacked and put on the defensive and you get your point across.
> 
> Covid has everyone on edge. Lets keep the discussions as pleasant as possible while discussing different points of view.


 
She did not quote an article.  I did.  That’s why I said I don’t where there are reading that.


----------



## pigletto

I highly recommend the Ignore button folks . I’ve been on this board for years and never used it more than I have since this pandemic . We are all fried down to our last nerve , and some stuff is just not worth the aggravation .
In my house we still have no idea what the plan is . We need to see it laid out by the board , decide how feasible we think it is and go from there . I’m also listening to the educators I know (here and offline ) to get an idea of their concerns. They are in those classrooms every day . They know their school climate and the the boards they work for and have a better idea than we do or how possible these plans are going to be .
Bottom line .. extraordinary times call for extraordinary measures. If I don’t feel it’s safe for my child, the staff,  or the community at large to resume school right now I’ll make the choice and keep him home .


----------



## mshanson3121

bababear_50 said:


> I'm out of this discussion.
> Best wishes to you all come the Fall.
> Hugs
> Mel



Don't let that person ruin it ☹ You've had great input.


----------



## mshanson3121

> ="Brett Wyman, post: 62181850, member: . How parents who have to work from home full time are supposed to make that work is beyond me.



This. I have no idea how they'll accomplish that, either. If that is their solution, scrap the year completely for those grades.


----------



## wdwmom3

mshanson3121 said:


> Don't let that person ruin it ☹ You've had great input.



You know what funny how a parent concerned about the mental health and social development of their child is told by a teacher that they are putting their child’s social life before the teaches  life.  But the parent is the evil one? It seems like anyone who doesn’t agree with a select few on this thread are the problem here.  

Well when I get accused of caring more about my kids social life then someone else’s  health I have an issue.  When I get accused  of calling someone lazy and incompetent, when I didn’t I have an issue.  I have been civil but civil does not mean I need to agree, and that I’m not going to call someone out when they post something that is obviously false.  

So you know what yes that I will be “that women” who won’t let you bully me because I don’t agree with you.


----------



## mshanson3121

wdwmom3 said:


> You know what funny how a parent concerned about the mental health and social development of their child is told by a teacher that they are putting their child’s social life before the teaches  life.  But the parent is the evil one? It seems like anyone who doesn’t agree with a select few on this thread are the problem here.
> 
> Well when I get accused of caring more about my kids social life then someone else’s  health I have an issue.  When I get accused  of calling someone lazy and incompetent, when I didn’t I have an issue.  I have been civil but civil does not mean I need to agree, and that I’m not going to call someone out when they post something that is obviously false.
> 
> So you know what yes that I will be “that women” who won’t let you bully me because I don’t agree with you.



Yeah. You need help, thats all there is to it. I'm sorry, that teacher said that to you, I really am. They shouldn't have. But you can quit taking it out on everyone else here. Because not I, nor anyone else, has even remotely said or implied anything of the sort to you or to anyone. You're being delusional. Seriously, talk to someone. I'll be hitting that ignore button now. Good luck to you.


----------



## wdwmom3

mshanson3121 said:


> [
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah. You need help, thats all there is to it. I'm sorry, that teacher said that to you, I really am. They shouldn't have. But you can quit taking it out on everyone else here. Because not I, nor anyone else, has even remotely said or implied anything of the sort to you or to anyone. You're being delusional. Seriously, talk to someone. I'll be hitting that ignore button now. Good luck to you.



Umm the person that said that is the poster here who has also accused me of calling her lazy and incompetent. Which I did not.


----------



## Best_Vacation_EVER!

pigletto said:


> I highly recommend the Ignore button folks . I’ve been on this board for years and never used it more than I have since this pandemic . We are all fried down to our last nerve , and some stuff is just not worth the aggravation .
> In my house we still have no idea what the plan is . We need to see it laid out by the board , decide how feasible we think it is and go from there . I’m also listening to the educators I know (here and offline ) to get an idea of their concerns. They are in those classrooms every day . They know their school climate and the the boards they work for and have a better idea than we do or how possible these plans are going to be .
> Bottom line .. extraordinary times call for extraordinary measures. If I don’t feel it’s safe for my child, the staff,  or the community at large to resume school right now I’ll make the choice and keep him home .


Love this....  Since really we're all trying to do what's right based on the info we have at this entirely crazy moment .... it's got us all frazzled and we all need to to not only take step back  --- but understand this is the first time any of us have gone thru this -- some process this differently but we just need to try to do our best..... and we can get through it way better together.   Decide on the info you want to take forward and move with that..... it doesn't mean the other persons input is valueless --- it just isn't helpful for you ...


----------



## mshanson3121

Best_Vacation_EVER! said:


> Love this....  Since really we're all trying to do what's right based on the info we have at this entirely crazy moment .... it's got us all frazzled and we all need to to not only take step back  --- but understand this is the first time any of us have gone thru this -- some process this differently but we just need to try to do our best..... and we can get through it way better together.   Decide on the info you want to take forward and move with that..... it doesn't mean the other persons input is valueless --- it just isn't helpful for you ...



To add to this - if you're (understandably) dealing with insecurities and this topic triggers you and causes you to unjustly lash out at others, then do the right thing and stay away.


----------



## wdwmom3

mshanson3121 said:


> Yeah. You need help, thats all there is to it. I'm sorry, that teacher said that to you, I really am. They shouldn't have. But you can quit taking it out on everyone else here. Because not I, nor anyone else, has even remotely said or implied anything of the sort to you or to anyone. You're being delusional. Seriously, talk to someone. I'll be hitting that ignore button now. Good luck to you.



If you look back a little further your friend said this

What I want the public to understand is that this is not being funded correctly & since it is not MY life is at risk. MINE. A 44 year old Mom of 3 that needs to pay bills. So right or wrong when others say my child needs to return for socialization I hear “your actual life < kids’ social lives.

But yeah I’m delusional. My only comment to her other then pointing out she doesn’t know what’s happening in every board was that she seems upset about going back to work. And that if she was she has the same options as everyone else.

Sorry I don’t have sympathy for someone pretending to be a victim here just because someone doesn’t agree with everything the say, or because people correct when they post incorrect information.


----------



## Madame

mshanson3121 said:


> Yeah. You need help, thats all there is to it. I'm sorry, that teacher said that to you, I really am. They shouldn't have. But you can quit taking it out on everyone else here. Because not I, nor anyone else, has even remotely said or implied anything of the sort to you or to anyone. You're being delusional. Seriously, talk to someone. I'll be hitting that ignore button now. Good luck to you.





Madame said:


> What I want the public to understand is that this is not being funded correctly & since it is not MY life is at risk. MINE. A 44 year old Mom of 3 that needs to pay bills. So right or wrong when others say my child needs to return for socialization I hear “your actual life < kids’ social lives.





wdwmom3 said:


> It sounds like to me you are more upset with going back to work.





Madame said:


> Please stop. I am begging you to please stop. I am not angry at parents. I am not angry at going back to work. Some teachers might have put in the minimum for online learning but (and I have the feeling you won’t believe me) I was available all week-end and up to 11pm for my kids. I had my messages forwarded directly to my phone and my phone constantly at my side.





Madame said:


> She implied I was lazy or incompetent.


The above quotes is how that conversation really went.  It becomes hard to understand the flow of the conversation when half of it’s missing b/c you’re ignoring posters, but I assume from your responses that there is some question as to what was said.

I too am through with this conversation.  Good luck in Sept everyone.  I wish you all a very safe and healthy return.  If anyone needs any language assistance for their Immersion or full French kids PM me.  I’ll be off first semester & will be happy to help.  But seriously, math, even in French, you’re on your own


----------



## mshanson3121

Madame said:


> The above quotes is how that conversation really went.  It becomes hard to understand the flow of the conversation when half of it’s missing b/c you’re ignoring posters, but I assume from your responses that there is some question as to what was said.
> 
> I too am through with this conversation.  Good luck in Sept everyone.  I wish you all a very safe and healthy return.  If anyone needs any language assistance for their Immersion or full French kids PM me.  I’ll be off first semester & will be happy to help.  But seriously, math, even in French, you’re on your own



Oh trust me, I've been following all along. I know what was, and more importantly, what *wasn't* said. It's clearly a case of personal insecurities affecting how they choose to read things, and causing them to completely misconstrue things. It's understandable, but... also not fair to those they're undeservedly lashing out at. And I wholly agree you with you re: math and especially math in French. Oie. Thankfully, I married a man who both loves and excels in math


----------



## wdwmom3

Madame said:


> The above quotes is how that conversation really went.  It becomes hard to understand the flow of the conversation when half of it’s missing b/c you’re ignoring posters, but I assume from your responses that there is some question as to what was said.
> 
> I too am through with this conversation.  Good luck in Sept everyone.  I wish you all a very safe and healthy return.  If anyone needs any language assistance for their Immersion or full French kids PM me.  I’ll be off first semester & will be happy to help.  But seriously, math, even in French, you’re on your own



I’m still waiting to see the horrible things I said.  And where I implied your were lazy or incompetent


----------



## mshanson3121

So to get this thread back on track, LOL... 

Have any school boards yet announced _anything_ about extracurricular activities? Here, it sounds like nothing will be running - no sports, band, drama etc...


----------



## tgropp

Would the moderator shut this thread down please. Nothing good will come of this being left open


----------



## ottawamom

I wish my fellow posters who have decided to leave this thread the best of luck in the fall. I do hope those who have decided to stay will keep the thread informative about what various school boards are proposing etc.

Remember, we're all in this together. It's together we will see the other side of this and be able to return to "Normal"


----------



## hdrolfe

mshanson3121 said:


> So to get this thread back on track, LOL...
> 
> Have any school boards yet announced _anything_ about extracurricular activities? Here, it sounds like nothing will be running - no sports, band, drama etc...



This is what's in the Ottawa Catholic Board's parent guide:
Sports – Intramurals and interscholastic games
Individual sports may continue with proper hygiene and physical distance in place, as long as this does not impact cohorts that have been put in place as a health and safety measure.  Team sports continue to be “on hold” until the province indicates that it is safe for team sports to resume.


----------



## hdrolfe

tgropp said:


> Would the moderator shut this thread down please. Nothing good will come of this being left open



It isn't really just this thread though, the same people are saying the same things in all the threads. As someone else said, use the ignore feature.


----------



## Debbie

Thames Valley DSB posted this on Facebook today :

_Families can choose to have their child continue full-time distance learning at home. In August, after the Ministry of Education has made their final decision on reopening, we will ask parents/guardians to tell us if their child will continue to learn remotely. Stay tuned __#TVDSB_


----------



## Best_Vacation_EVER!

So ... this thread should NOT be shut down... it's valuable for us Canadian parents.    The info provided is important...

*Madame *you should definitely stay and contribute (it's important) .... All of this situation is new to all of us... we're all working our way through.... losing a teacher's view seems like a BIG loss.... We'll disagree and we'll discuss but the conversation is important. Everyone should be here and the thread is important. We shouldn't just close threads because people disagree... Canadians have always been able to agree to disagree...
....


----------



## Aladora

Best_Vacation_EVER! said:


> Just out of curiousity what province are you in?   based on news it seems like BC but this seems crazy....



Not BC, we just found out today that they are not doing online schooling and instead are planning on all students returning to in school learning on September 8.


----------



## tgropp

Best_Vacation_EVER! said:


> So ... this thread should NOT be shut down... it's valuable for us Canadian parents.    The info provided is important...
> 
> *Madame *you should definitely stay and contribute (it's important) .... All of this situation is new to all of us... we're all working our way through.... losing a teacher's view seems like a BIG loss.... We'll disagree and we'll discuss but the conversation is important. Everyone should be here and the thread is important. We shouldn't just close threads because people disagree... Canadians have always been able to agree to disagree...
> ....


The reason I asked that this thread to be closed is that it ran its course. People expressed their views, it was bordering on nasty and going nowhere. It borders on politics which is a Nono.......but the biggest reason is that we are a Disney family here to talk Disney. You can not tell me that posters who have been helpful , friendly and respectful towards each other will remain that way and that is the purpose of our group. Remember, no one is 100% right but every poster has had valid points that have been helpful. These are trying times right now but it so will pass And we will all be planning and asking for help for our future trips ”Back home”


----------



## friedela

I am in Alberta and our government has announced a full return to school in September with it looking as close to normal as possible (no masks).  I may be one of the weirdos here, but I feel very comfortable with sending my kids back to school. I know that all of the data from other countries who have already gone back is showing that kids are at a much lesser risk and also less likely to transmit Covid. I trust the decision our Public Health Minister has made, knowing that they wouldn't be sending us back if they felt our kids were in danger. I also appreciate how our Minister has spoken about considering the "whole health" of children, with Covid being 1 part of the picture and that she is also sending her OWN school aged children back. To me, that speaks volumes.

As a mom who traditionally homeschooled our 2 kids a couple years ago, I know from experience that our kids do better in a school environment. While distance learning was so much easier because the weight of responsibility wasn't on my shoulders (and our school board was PHENOMENAL), there were struggles with being home that were hard to navigate again. Both of my kids have learning disabilities and each of them need equal amounts of one-on-one attention which was always my greatest challenge with homeschooling. Not to mention the incredible loneliness that came with traditionally homeschooling.

All this to say, we are really happy with our Provincial plan for September, understanding that we may need to jump to a part time scenario or back to full time distance learning, whatever the situation - we are ready.

I also just wanted to say, that when it comes to discussing with others about September I heard some great advice from a friend of mine. Knowing that all of us are making the best decisions we can for our families, no matter what side of the fence you stand on, it's best to have a response of, "Wow! I am proud of you, I am sure that was a hard decision to make" (even if you don't agree with their choice.) I have 4 friends who have never homeschooled who are signed up with a homeschool board for September. I also have plenty of friends who are sending their kids back to school. Neither decision is wrong. The school decision is going to be so personal for each family dependant on a variety of factors so what is going to work for us, will not work for others and that's ok. If we look at it from that perspective, there really is nothing to fight about.


----------



## Donald - my hero

*There was a comment made somewhere in this thread and I'm not going to take the time to look for the exact post to quote because i do NOT want to make the poster feel like I'm attacking them personally. I had an extremely stressful day yesterday for personal reasons completely unrelated to this discussion leaving me with little emotional reserves but i wanted to share my PERSONAL thoughts.*

*Part of the problems that are arising from this discussion is the dividing line between receiving a service and providing one. Someone asked if any of us were/are upset when other types of services started being able to be offered again or if we only felt this over the return to school. (Remember this is coming from someone who has no children in school and does not work in a school setting in any capacity) For me and my hubby as well, YES we were and continue to be extremely concerned about the types of services that have been allowed to open up before we felt/feel they truly needed to be. Haircuts and/or other beauty services?? No, that one really irked me, again just personal. Indoor restaurants/Bars? OMG, yes, 1000X yes, i think this is too early. But the most ridiculous reopening? GYMS!>!!!??? No, not safe, for anyone, staff or clients. 

Another question asked or comment made was that if teachers and/or other staff didn't feel safe returning then maybe they should just find another job, or not go back (AGAIN please don't feel attacked if you made the comment, I'm only vaguely recalling the comments with no idea who made them!!!) I think the problem here is that we need to remember that for almost every other service that has been allowed to start up again most have required the wearing of masks for both customers and employees-again remember in my county it's been mandated since June so you can't go inside ANYWHERE without  a mask if you're over the age of 3(not sure about the stupid gyms though?) BUT for most education settings what we're hearing and/or reading about is that masks won't be required. Personally I can understand that might be extremely distressing for someone to know that the people they are working with are required to wear a mask to spend an hour in the grocery store but not to spend an entire day, inside a small room, with over 20 other people.

Trying to summarize my scattered thoughts here is hard! I don't think anyone should be attacking anyone else for their thoughts, feelings and opinions over this subject. Perhaps if we are able to take the viewpoint of this old, annoying woman and look at it as a service that is being given and received it might be easier. IF possible, doing our best to remove our emotions from the equation  *might* make it a tad easier to deal with what is being offered, how it will be delivered and how our families will participate in this "different than before" school year. It's not perfect, but we all know that!!! AS with any other service, business or industry that we deal with, it is up to us to decide what the best solution is for OUR family and not try to make others feel bad for making different decisions for THEIR family.*


----------



## wdwmom3

Ontario plans being released now.  But so far I’ve heard elementary full time 5 days a week.  High school will be mixed online and in person.  Same said class for elementary, max of 15 for high school. 

Masks will be mandatory for grades 4-12.  More funding to pay for PPE, public heath nurses and more cleaning.

Medical masks will be provided to all staff.


----------



## hdrolfe

Matches what I am hearing, cloth masks grade 4 through 12 (optional for younger kids) and PPE will be provided to the teachers/workers. Social distancing of 1 metre to be maintained. Though it's not clear how that will work in the elementary schools. 

And of course, parents have the option to not send their kids. I believe I heard "live online, teacher lead" learning. Again, not sure how that will work!

I am sure the school boards will provide plans soon. 

I, for one, feel good about this plan and am glad I have a stock of masks for kiddo now so he can take two per day, though it's possible they will be providing them? Not sure on that... 

Oh, and public health nurses to be hired to work with the schools/in the schools as well.


----------



## Disneylover99

Following along on CP24 but confused about a few things......

Elementary students to return to school 5 days a week, but class sizes will be a 1 to 15 ratio? Are kids going back every other day?


----------



## quandrea

hdrolfe said:


> Matches what I am hearing, cloth masks grade 4 through 12 (optional for younger kids) and PPE will be provided to the teachers/workers. Social distancing of 1 metre to be maintained. Though it's not clear how that will work in the elementary schools.
> 
> And of course, parents have the option to not send their kids. I believe I heard "live online, teacher lead" learning. Again, not sure how that will work!
> 
> I am sure the school boards will provide plans soon.
> 
> I, for one, feel good about this plan and am glad I have a stock of masks for kiddo now so he can take two per day, though it's possible they will be providing them? Not sure on that...
> 
> Oh, and public health nurses to be hired to work with the schools/in the schools as well.


I need more info. Dd is in grade 11, but taking courses mostly in grade 12. Not sure how cohorting will work for her. She is selecting online learning but isn’t interested in synchronous learning. She want to move at her own pace. Not sure this will be possible. Might be calling superintendent’s office for clarification.


----------



## ottawamom

I love that they are going to hire public health nurses for the schools but where are all these extra nurses going to come from. My understanding is the hospitals have a hard time keeping the numbers they need to keep things going.


----------



## hdrolfe

quandrea said:


> I need more info. Dd is in grade 11, but taking courses mostly in grade 12. Not sure how cohorting will work for her. She is selecting online learning but isn’t interested in synchronous learning. She want to move at her own pace. Not sure this will be possible. Might be calling superintendent’s office for clarification.



I am hoping more details were in writing and provided to the school boards for their use in planning.

I didn't write a lot of stuff on the secondary kids because my son isn't there yet, it will be cohort groups of 15, with a combination of online and in class, with lower risk areas able to do 5 days a week in class.


----------



## hdrolfe

ottawamom said:


> I love that they are going to hire public health nurses for the schools but where are all these extra nurses going to come from. My understanding is the hospitals have a hard time keeping the numbers they need to keep things going.



No idea! But they are likely differently trained, so perhaps they are available? But not trained to work in a ER or ICU? They will be helping to train the kids/staff on how to safely use masks and also to assist with screening and in particular in the high schools to help reduce the risks.


----------



## Prince John Robin Hood

Disneylover99 said:


> Following along on CP24 but confused about a few things......
> 
> Elementary students to return to school 5 days a week, but class sizes will be a 1 to 15 ratio? Are kids going back every other day?



I think the 1 to 15 ratio is for high school but I'm not certain.  

My son is going into grade 2 so I'm curious about the mask recommendation.  Will be interesting to see how many younger kids are wearing masks or maybe a shield is easier for them to wear?


----------



## Disneylover99

Prince John Robin Hood said:


> I think the 1 to 15 ratio is for high school but I'm not certain.
> 
> My son is going into grade 2 so I'm curious about the mask recommendation.  Will be interesting to see how many younger kids are wearing masks or maybe a shield is easier for them to wear?


Thanks. I’m now realizing that there will not be a 1-15 ratio for elementary. I think that was just speculation ahead of time.  Upon being further questioned, Lecce said the 1 to 20 ratio in elementary schools across Ontario was already the lowest ratios in Canada, so that would be good enough?


----------



## Disneylover99

I’m hoping non-semestered highschools will become semestered highschools in order to reduce the number of Interactions between teachers and students.


----------



## hdrolfe

Disneylover99 said:


> Thanks. I’m now realizing that there will not be a 1-15 ratio for elementary. I think that was just speculation ahead of time.  Upon being further questioned, Lecce said the 1 to 20 ratio in elementary schools across Ontario was already the lowest ratios in Canada, so that would be good enough?



1 to 20 for JK thru grade 3, then it's 1 to 25 for grade 4 thru 6 (not sure about 7 & 8?)  Interesting though, at my son's school the JK/SK were grouped together and it was 1 teacher and 1 ECE for up to 40 kids. I guess they'll need to split those up now. I am anxious to see how they split up the kids into cohorts, I hope it is by class and not just by grade. I will have to wait for the written details though I guess. And now to get kiddo to practice with his masks, taking them off and on safely and getting used to wearing one for an extended time. Also need labels... I'm sure there will be a lot of kids with the same ones. Oh, and now I really need to make some special Halloween, Christmas ones.


----------



## chrispeto

Disneylover99 said:


> I’m hoping non-semestered highschools will become semestered highschools in order to reduce the number of Interactions between teachers and students.


i know the non semestered high school in Windsor (Massey) changed over to semesters for this year .
My husband is the VP there.


----------



## damo

So is it high schoolers going every other day just because they are making class sizes smaller so suddenly they will need twice as many actual classes?  I assume teachers are going to have to teach every day?


----------



## Disneylover99

hdrolfe said:


> 1 to 20 for JK thru grade 3, then it's 1 to 25 for grade 4 thru 6 (not sure about 7 & 8?)  Interesting though, at my son's school the JK/SK were grouped together and it was 1 teacher and 1 ECE for up to 40 kids. I guess they'll need to split those up now. I am anxious to see how they split up the kids into cohorts, I hope it is by class and not just by grade. I will have to wait for the written details though I guess. And now to get kiddo to practice with his masks, taking them off and on safely and getting used to wearing one for an extended time. Also need labels... I'm sure there will be a lot of kids with the same ones. Oh, and now I really need to make some special Halloween, Christmas ones.


Yeah, it will be interesting to see what September actually looks like from class to class. I’ve been teaching full day kindergarten since it began in our school 10 years ago. But I’m moving to a grade 2/3 split class this year.

I know the recommended average number of students in kindergarten with a teacher and ECE is 26, but that’s just an average across the board. I’m usually close to 30 students each year. I’ve heard of other schools with much higher numbers, but to have 40 kids in one kindergarten class just sounds nuts to me!   

I know the class sizes for Kindergarten at my school this year is currently at about 28 students. I’m not certain at this point if they’ll even try to make those class sizes smaller.


----------



## pigletto

We are at my parents cottage and just catching up to all of this news . For my son ( who is 16) they will be mandating masks , cohorts of 15 , and every other day alternating in school /online. I am very pleased  to see they are providing funds to teachers for PPE and I’m very happy to see public health nurses being hired .
Now the next steps in my decision is seeing how the board will implement these things. I feel it’s about as safe as they can be for the high school in theory. Hopefully will be the same in practice .


----------



## Renarr

damo said:


> So is it high schoolers going every other day just because they are making class sizes smaller so suddenly they will need twice as many actual classes?  I assume teachers are going to have to teach every day?



I've heard this envisioned in one of two ways.  Let's suppose a district has A days and B days.

(1) Some districts have half the class in person on A days and the other half the class doing independent work remotely.  Then, on B days, the other half of the class comes in to learn in person and the first half does independent work remotely.

(2) What my district wants to try (without really any training so far on this) is to have half the class in person on A days, while the other half synchronously follows remotely.  Then, on B days, the other half of the class comes in to learn in person while the first half synchronously follows remotely.

In the first scenario, you're only really getting half the learning in.

In the second scenario, you're getting more "days of instruction" in, but your instructional style is going to look a lot more like "live remote instruction" because you'll have to be giving access to your remote students.  Meaning that some of the benefits of in-person instruction (students having less time on laptops, students working with manipulatives, etc.) could be lost unless carefully implemented, if at all.

EDITS for clarity.


----------



## jba2

Disneylover99 said:


> Yeah, it will be interesting to see what September actually looks like from class to class. I’ve been teaching full day kindergarten since it began in our school 10 years ago. But I’m moving to a grade 2/3 split class this year.
> 
> I know the recommended average number of students in kindergarten with a teacher and ECE is 26, but that’s just an average across the board. I’m usually close to 30 students each year. I’ve heard of other schools with much higher numbers, but to have 40 kids in one kindergarten class just sounds nuts to me!
> 
> I know the class sizes for Kindergarten at my school this year is currently at about 28 students. I’m not certain at this point if they’ll even try to make those class sizes smaller.


----------



## jba2

FDK classes should be capped at 29. There are many classes running above the "cap".


----------



## bababear_50

Ontario 
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/7010472-Guidance-Document-FINAL-En.html#pages/p1
Mel


----------



## TammyLynn33

Where are you guys getting board specific info? I front think mine has come out with anything? 
Heres what I know, absolutely not attending before school program or taking buses even tho my littles take the "short bus" lol bc 8 yr old is autistic.
DD14 going to high school regardless she says so im not stopping her. I don't think she gets its not going to be what she envisions, sigh. * 8 yr old if I can get him in a 3/4 split with masks he will prob go..DS6 going into gr 1 I may keep home. I like masks its something at least and he's terrified of going to school. only thing is it might be the end of French immersion for him. he's  the only one out ofd the four to be in French. it may be just too much


----------



## Silvermist999

TammyLynn33 said:


> Where are you guys getting board specific info? I front think mine has come out with anything?
> Heres what I know, absolutely not attending before school program or taking buses even tho my littles take the "short bus" lol bc 8 yr old is autistic.
> DD14 going to high school regardless she says so im not stopping her. I don't think she gets its not going to be what she envisions, sigh. * 8 yr old if I can get him in a 3/4 split with masks he will prob go..DS6 going into gr 1 I may keep home. I like masks its something at least and he's terrified of going to school. only thing is it might be the end of French immersion for him. he's  the only one out ofd the four to be in French. it may be just too much



I haven’t heard of any board specific plans being released yet.  If they have, I’d be interested to see what they have decided upon. Our board’s plans are to be submitted to the Ministry this week for approval.  Their specific plans for reopening schools will be released to parents on August 10.


----------



## FigmentSpark

Our board site has the posting of the survey results (from last week).  Everything has to trickle down.

For HS, I'm hoping for grade 9 and 11 on one day and 10 and 12 on the next, or something like that.  I don't want to see half the class being taught in person one day and then another half the next.  Just cut the classes in half and have the separation be by grades.  It'll be easier on the kids and the teachers.  They can at least walk home with their friends, even if they aren't in the same classes with them.


----------



## Silvermist999

ottawamom said:


> I love that they are going to hire public health nurses for the schools but where are all these extra nurses going to come from. My understanding is the hospitals have a hard time keeping the numbers they need to keep things going.



I can't speak to public health nurses in particular, but finding nurses for full-time jobs should not be as difficult as it may seem.  Often nurses are working part-time or casually in various settings.  Plus I am sure there would be a decent supply of recent nursing school graduates who are seeking employment.


----------



## Silvermist999

FigmentSpark said:


> Our board site has the posting of the survey results (from last week).  Everything has to trickle down.
> 
> For HS, I'm hoping for grade 9 and 11 on one day and 10 and 12 on the next, or something like that.  I don't want to see half the class being taught in person one day and then another half the next.  Just cut the classes in half and have the separation be by grades.  It'll be easier on the kids and the teachers.  They can at least walk home with their friends, even if they aren't in the same classes with them.



I’m just curious, in your survey, did they ask whether you had multiple children attending the same school?  I think I read somewhere that school boards were considering trying to have siblings in different grades attend classes on the same days, to try to reduce risk of exposure.  I just can’t remember where I heard this from.


----------



## hdrolfe

TammyLynn33 said:


> Where are you guys getting board specific info? I front think mine has come out with anything?
> Heres what I know, absolutely not attending before school program or taking buses even tho my littles take the "short bus" lol bc 8 yr old is autistic.
> DD14 going to high school regardless she says so im not stopping her. I don't think she gets its not going to be what she envisions, sigh. * 8 yr old if I can get him in a 3/4 split with masks he will prob go..DS6 going into gr 1 I may keep home. I like masks its something at least and he's terrified of going to school. only thing is it might be the end of French immersion for him. he's  the only one out ofd the four to be in French. it may be just too much



My school board has provided us with information a few weeks ago, they will be making updates and providing those in the next few days (from their facebook). 

I believe masks are optional for the younger kids, and I am sure some will be wearing them, but obviously it's harder to keep the little ones from playing around with them I'm sure. 

I don't recall seeing anything in the briefing about buses, my son walks so it won't be a problem for us. I imagine it will be difficult to manage if they have to distance on the buses, I mean, they are so tightly scheduled here they'd have to hire more drivers.


----------



## Renarr

FigmentSpark said:


> For HS, I'm hoping for grade 9 and 11 on one day and 10 and 12 on the next, or something like that.  I don't want to see half the class being taught in person one day and then another half the next.  Just cut the classes in half and have the separation be by grades.  It'll be easier on the kids and the teachers.  They can at least walk home with their friends, even if they aren't in the same classes with them.



I don't think this works logistically for teachers.  You'd have to make sure that teachers had balanced work assignments between grades 9/11 and grades 10/12, which would be logistically hard to do for some subject areas.


----------



## OnceUponATime15

Disneylover99 said:


> Yeah, it will be interesting to see what September actually looks like from class to class. I’ve been teaching full day kindergarten since it began in our school 10 years ago. But I’m moving to a grade 2/3 split class this year.
> 
> I know the recommended average number of students in kindergarten with a teacher and ECE is 26, but that’s just an average across the board. I’m usually close to 30 students each year. I’ve heard of other schools with much higher numbers, but to have 40 kids in one kindergarten class just sounds nuts to me!
> 
> I know the class sizes for Kindergarten at my school this year is currently at about 28 students. I’m not certain at this point if they’ll even try to make those class sizes smaller.



It’s intriguing to me that many of the children who will have gone to childcare since it reopened and will move into jk or sk in September have until this past Monday been in cohorts of 10 including the 2 RECEs in the classroom for their safety.  This past Monday the cohort increased to 15 children and 2 RECEs. (with a cohort that must be at least 7 days in length minimum and no movement between cohorts)  Yet the children will be in classrooms where the 26 to 2 ratio in a best case is ok... 

The Ministry of Ed has very different ratios for kindergarten as opposed to those for childcare in light of this pandemic. You’d think that cohorts would be more in line with what is being done in ELCCs at the moment, if for no other reason then to maintain the physical distancing requirements that are mandated by public health and limit exposure possibility. 

It will be interesting to see what the DDSB and DCDSB will do moving forward here.  I know what we have to do in the Regionally operates ELCCs and wonder if the boards will be held to the same stringent standards or if they are even plausible in a school setting with the number of children, staff and families involved.


----------



## Donald - my hero

TammyLynn33 said:


> Where are you guys getting board specific info? I front think mine has come out with anything?
> Heres what I know, absolutely not attending before school program or taking buses even tho my littles take the "short bus" lol bc 8 yr old is autistic.
> DD14 going to high school regardless she says so im not stopping her. I don't think she gets its not going to be what she envisions, sigh. * 8 yr old if I can get him in a 3/4 split with masks he will prob go..DS6 going into gr 1 I may keep home. I like masks its something at least and he's terrified of going to school. only thing is it might be the end of French immersion for him. he's  the only one out ofd the four to be in French. it may be just too much


*edited to remove my post*


----------



## FigmentSpark

Silvermist999 said:


> I’m just curious, in your survey, did they ask whether you had multiple children attending the same school?  I think I read somewhere that school boards were considering trying to have siblings in different grades attend classes on the same days, to try to reduce risk of exposure.  I just can’t remember where I heard this from.


They had 3 surveys.  One was for Elementary kids, one for HS kids and one for special needs.

The HS questions were:



So, I guess the info is there, but whether they sorted for it when doing analysis is another thing entirely.





Renarr said:


> I don't think this works logistically for teachers.  You'd have to make sure that teachers had balanced work assignments between grades 9/11 and grades 10/12, which would be logistically hard to do for some subject areas.


Well, you do that anyway.  I was assuming the teachers would be available to teach on the online days, as well, not in a class every day.  They'd still only have their 4 classes to teach.


----------



## bababear_50

OnceUponATime15 said:


> It’s intriguing to me that many of the children who will have gone to childcare since it reopened and will move into jk or sk in September have until this past Monday been in cohorts of 10 including the 2 RECEs in the classroom for their safety.  This past Monday the cohort increased to 15 children and 2 RECEs. (with a cohort that must be at least 7 days in length minimum and no movement between cohorts)  Yet the children will be in classrooms where the 26 to 2 ratio in a best case is ok...
> 
> The Ministry of Ed has very different ratios for kindergarten as opposed to those for childcare in light of this pandemic. You’d think that cohorts would be more in line with what is being done in ELCCs at the moment, if for no other reason then to maintain the physical distancing requirements that are mandated by public health and limit exposure possibility.
> 
> It will be interesting to see what the DDSB and DCDSB will do moving forward here.  I know what we have to do in the Regionally operates ELCCs and wonder if the boards will be held to the same stringent standards or if they are even plausible in a school setting with the number of children, staff and families involved.



Two different Gov organizations with two different rules & regulations & ratios


https://www.ontario.ca/page/ministry-education

https://www.mcss.gov.on.ca/index.aspxGiant Grey Book with excellent rules,regulations,ratios clearly defined and expected or no license for the operator.



I was shocked at the difference when I transferred between the two.

Mel


----------



## Debbie

Disneylover99 said:


> Thanks. I’m now realizing that there will not be a 1-15 ratio for elementary. I think that was just speculation ahead of time.  Upon being further questioned, *Lecce said the 1 to 20 ratio in elementary schools across Ontario was already the lowest ratios in Canada*, so that would be good enough?


 Lecce was quoting the 'average' at 20. I don't believe there is a hard cap, so don't be surprised to see 22, 23 in a classroom. (I could be wrong on that, maybe someone could confirm/correct)


hdrolfe said:


> *I don't recall seeing anything in the briefing about buses*, my son walks so it won't be a problem for us. I imagine it will be difficult to manage if they have to distance on the buses, I mean, they are so tightly scheduled here they'd have to hire more drivers.


 There was nothing about busing except "extra cleaning". The bus companies will be giving information on this in the next weeks, I'd imagine. I do know that at TVDSB, parents were expected to register their kids for busing for next year beginning earlier this month.


----------



## FigmentSpark

I found this from last week's board meeting (pre-provincial announcement)


----------



## OnceUponATime15

bababear_50 said:


> Two different Gov organizations with two different rules & regulations & ratios
> 
> 
> https://www.ontario.ca/page/ministry-education
> 
> https://www.mcss.gov.on.ca/index.aspx
> 
> I was shocked at the difference when I transferred between the two.
> 
> Mel


The Minisrty of Education is responsible for Childcare (CCEYA). We were moved from the ministry of child and youth services  MCYS in 2010.


----------



## bababear_50

Double post



Mel


----------



## bababear_50

OnceUponATime15 said:


> The Minisrty of Education is responsible for Childcare (CCEYA). We were moved from the ministry of child and youth services  MCYS in 2010.




Good to know.

Mel


----------



## quandrea

Renarr said:


> I've heard this envisioned in one of two ways.  Let's suppose a district has A days and B days.
> 
> (1) Some districts have half the class in person on A days and the other half the class doing independent work remotely.  Then, on B days, the other half of the class comes in to learn in person and the first half does independent work remotely.
> 
> (2) What my district wants to try (without really any training so far on this) is to have half the class in person on A days, while the other half synchronously follows remotely.  Then, on B days, the other half of the class comes in to learn in person while the first half synchronously follows remotely.
> 
> In the first scenario, you're only really getting half the learning in.
> 
> In the second scenario, you're getting more "days of instruction" in, but your instructional style is going to look a lot more like "live remote instruction" because you'll have to be giving access to your remote students.  Meaning that some of the benefits of in-person instruction (students having less time on laptops, students working with manipulatives, etc.) could be lost unless carefully implemented, if at all.
> 
> EDITS for clarity.


This synchronous learning is what my daughter doesn’t want. She loves that the online learning moves at her own pace, on her own agenda. She is not interested in logging in at an appointed hour to watch what is going on in a classroom. She wants an online course where she sets the agenda. For instance, she is in summer school now. She blitzed a unit this afternoon, submitting assignments that are due late next week. Now she is ahead and can sit back the next few days, Slow down a bit and start preparing for the upcoming unit test. She directs the learning. We will probably withdraw her and homeschool through the Independent Learning Centre.


----------



## Renarr

FigmentSpark said:


> Well, you do that anyway.  I was assuming the teachers would be available to teach on the online days, as well, not in a class every day.  They'd still only have their 4 classes to teach.



Not every area is planning to have synchronous remote instruction on the days where half the kids are in class.

And if you're having all the 9th graders in on one day, and you only teach 9th graders, then you don't have distancing in the classroom.  Or maybe I'm misunderstanding the initial premise of the 9/11 days and 10/12 days suggestion.


----------



## Silvermist999

FigmentSpark said:


> They had 3 surveys.  One was for Elementary kids, one for HS kids and one for special needs.
> 
> The HS questions were:
> View attachment 514740
> View attachment 514741
> 
> So, I guess the info is there, but whether they sorted for it when doing analysis is another thing entirely.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, you do that anyway.  I was assuming the teachers would be available to teach on the online days, as well, not in a class every day.  They'd still only have their 4 classes to teach.



Thanks for sharing.  I think in all likelihood our survey will look very similar to this, I’ve got two kids in HS.


----------



## bankr63

Original post deleted at request of @Donald - my hero

But to be clear, that was a genuine laugh, not at you, but more at the fact that a great many people have misconceptions about what governments/administrations say will happen and what actually happens.  DW is in education and I have spent more than half my career in health care.  What governments and boards say to the public and what actually happens IRL are at best faint resemblances to each other, and at worst pure comedy (or tragedy?)

Until recently I was a provincial civil servant in management, and often had to support positions that were at best half-truths.


----------



## Donald - my hero

bankr63 said:


> Teachers are the last ones to get information about what is going on, usually about a week after the ministry announces to the parents, they will get some garbled instruction on how the board expects them to implement the impossible.  They are unionized; management does not interact with labour like that in most industries, including education.


*

I'm going to delete my post and I'd appreciate you deleting it as well. I was only providing what i thought might answer the question but obviously i was mistaken and i HATE sharing information that I can't back up*


----------



## Silvermist999

bankr63 said:


> Teachers are the last ones to get information about what is going on, usually about a week after the ministry announces to the parents, they will get some garbled instruction on how the board expects them to implement the impossible.  They are unionized; management does not interact with labour like that in most industries, including education.



On our school board site, the timeline for when information will be released shows Ministry approval of board plans will be made August 4th.  Teachers/staff will receive reopening plans on August 7th.  And parents/students will receive this same info on August 10th.  Staff training/planning will be held week of September 1st.  Ideally, other school boards are just as transparent with those affected.


----------



## Donald - my hero

*I posted in error. sorry!*


----------



## bankr63

Debbie said:


> Lecce was quoting the 'average' at 20. I don't believe there is a hard cap, so don't be surprised to see 22, 23 in a classroom. (I could be wrong on that, maybe someone could confirm/correct)


My understanding (husband of teacher) is that the school is resourced with educational resources (teaching resources) based on the ratios and overall enrollment in the school.  However, not all teaching resources are actually teaching.  For instance, if a school has guidance counselor or student success resource they count in that mix, so classes are almost always over the government set average.  The SSR is one example; I know there are several non-teaching teaching resources in her school who bring up the class average overall.  
Generally her grade 7 class sits around 25-28 each year; the administration will try to split classes when they hit around 30.  We expect that she will have that full cohort this year.  She teaches "core" in a predominantly underprivileged area of the city.  The parents of her students (a great many of whom are ESL, new English learners a/o recent Canadian arrivals) do not have the resources to keep their kids at home.  These are some of the hardest working parents in the city as they try to forge a better life.  Her classes are full on "snow days" when the immersion classes may have 2 or 3 students; we would expect similar attendance for COVID.  
With roughly 25% of parents expected to keep their kids at home based on surveys (read the latest Leger national/provincial results last night) in wealthier areas I am sure this "keep them home" decision will greatly help keep class cohort sizes controlled but I don't think it will help with DW's specific situation. 
And then there is keeping them all shoehorned into the tiny asbestos filled box with no A/C and very small windows.  At 1m distancing, it might be possible to get them all in there if all her teaching resources are removed from the room.  She has 20 plus years of accumulation; somehow I think our garage will be stacked to the ceiling with boxes very soon.


----------



## bankr63

Silvermist999 said:


> On our school board site, the timeline for when information will be released shows Ministry approval of board plans will be made August 4th.  Teachers/staff will receive reopening plans on August 7th.  And parents/students will receive this same info on August 10th.  Staff training/planning will be held week of September 1st.  Ideally, other school boards are just as transparent with those affected.


Staff training/planning will be held the week of September 1st.  Great, classes start September 3rd.  Does that sound like enough time to anyone?  Great article here from G&M from a Project Manager about what is wrong with this timeline.  I am a PM as well and it is easy to see the disaster that awaits as the triple constraint is being totally ignored. 
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opi...hools-in-september-are-on-a-collision-course/

ETA: see my earlier post about the countries that have been successful with this had things WELL PLANNED, and WELL RESOURCED.  Those who did not had much more unwanted outcomes.


----------



## bababear_50

*bankr63*
So much of what you posted is very similar in my school.....I could have written your post.

I was just wondering if they would consider utilizing the Library Learning Commons or is there anywhere else that her class could be relocated to in her school?

And yes get that garage ready,,that's what I did last week.

Mel


----------



## wdwmom3

hdrolfe said:


> My school board has provided us with information a few weeks ago, they will be making updates and providing those in the next few days (from their facebook).
> 
> I believe masks are optional for the younger kids, and I am sure some will be wearing them, but obviously it's harder to keep the little ones from playing around with them I'm sure.
> 
> I don't recall seeing anything in the briefing about buses, my son walks so it won't be a problem for us. I imagine it will be difficult to manage if they have to distance on the buses, I mean, they are so tightly scheduled here they'd have to hire more drivers.


for our school board masks are mandatory (I think for all kids) on buses.  They will only be sitting one kid per bench unless they are siblings.  We are just going to drive our son, a little safer, but also to help with the capacity.


----------



## hdrolfe

wdwmom3 said:


> for our school board masks are mandatory (I think for all kids) on buses.  They will only be sitting one kid per bench unless they are siblings.  We are just going to drive our son, a little safer, but also to help with the capacity.



That makes sense. I know the city buses here you have to wear a mask. I am kind of glad he walks now, and also that I don't have to worry about daycare in addition to school.


----------



## wdwmom3

Debbie said:


> Lecce was quoting the 'average' at 20. I don't believe there is a hard cap, so don't be surprised to see 22, 23 in a classroom. (I could be wrong on that, maybe someone could confirm/correct)
> There was nothing about busing except "extra cleaning". The bus companies will be giving information on this in the next weeks, I'd imagine. I do know that at TVDSB, parents were expected to register their kids for busing for next year beginning earlier this month.



our school board has already said masks are mandatory for all and only one child per bench except for siblings.


----------



## wdwmom3

hdrolfe said:


> That makes sense. I know the city buses here you have to wear a mask. I am kind of glad he walks now, and also that I don't have to worry about daycare in addition to school.


Agreed.  We can drive our son so can avoid the bus (he’s normally bused) and we have no daycare.  There is always someone home.


----------



## bababear_50

I believe the Ministry Of Education for Ontario has said there may be exceptions to the rules for masks on buses especially for students with certain medical or special needs. At least that's what I read in the report.

Mel


----------



## damo

Renarr said:


> I've heard this envisioned in one of two ways.  Let's suppose a district has A days and B days.
> 
> (1) Some districts have half the class in person on A days and the other half the class doing independent work remotely.  Then, on B days, the other half of the class comes in to learn in person and the first half does independent work remotely.
> 
> (2) What my district wants to try (without really any training so far on this) is to have half the class in person on A days, while the other half synchronously follows remotely.  Then, on B days, the other half of the class comes in to learn in person while the first half synchronously follows remotely.
> 
> In the first scenario, you're only really getting half the learning in.
> 
> In the second scenario, you're getting more "days of instruction" in, but your instructional style is going to look a lot more like "live remote instruction" because you'll have to be giving access to your remote students.  Meaning that some of the benefits of in-person instruction (students having less time on laptops, students working with manipulatives, etc.) could be lost unless carefully implemented, if at all.
> 
> EDITS for clarity.




Yes, the second scenario sounds good.  As a retired high school math teacher, I think I would prefer that.


----------



## wdwmom3

bababear_50 said:


> I believe the Ministry Of Education for Ontario has said there may be exceptions to the rules for masks on buses especially for students with certain medical or special needs. At least that's what I read in the report.
> 
> Mel


I believe you are right about the exemptions.  When I said for everyone I meant all grades.  Whereas in class it’s only grade 4 and over.  

We have started our back to school mask shopping. We figure our son will need around 10 to get him through the week and be able to change it.


----------



## bababear_50

wdwmom3 said:


> I believe you are right about the exemptions.  When I said for everyone I meant all grades.  Whereas in class it’s only grade 4 and over.
> 
> We have started our back to school mask shopping. We figure our son will need around 10 to get him through the week and be able to change it.



Yeah two masks per day sounds good.

Yes my students are medical/special needs ,,however they are in mainstream classes and they will be exempt for the masks on the bus & in the classroom.


Mel


----------



## Silvermist999

bankr63 said:


> Staff training/planning will be held the week of September 1st.  Great, classes start September 3rd.  Does that sound like enough time to anyone?  Great article here from G&M from a Project Manager about what is wrong with this timeline.  I am a PM as well and it is easy to see the disaster that awaits as the triple constraint is being totally ignored.
> https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opi...hools-in-september-are-on-a-collision-course/
> 
> ETA: see my earlier post about the countries that have been successful with this had things WELL PLANNED, and WELL RESOURCED.  Those who did not had much more unwanted outcomes.



From what I understand, the week of September 1st is designated for
PD days, so I guess teachers and staff would potentially get up to one full week of necessary training. 

First day of school for students will be on September 8th, after the Labour Day weekend. I would be surprised to hear any schools would be starting before then.


----------



## hdrolfe

Silvermist999 said:


> From what I understand, the week of September 1st is designated for
> PD days, so I guess teachers and staff would potentially get up to one full week of necessary training.
> 
> First day of school for students will be on September 8th, after the Labour Day weekend. I would be surprised to hear any schools would be starting before then.



It's strange because my school board (actually both in Ottawa) have said the first day of school will be September 3rd and it was approved by the Ministry, so now I am unsure what will happen. I hope it's the 3rd as I booked time off to take him and make sure it goes well. Though I hope we get the class lists before hand as well as who his teachers will be and such. The normal way (they put up lists on the school windows and everyone crowds around) wouldn't really work. The teachers are supposed to get 3 gets to "learn what they need to know".


----------



## OnceUponATime15

When Doug Ford made the announcement this afternoon he said that the children would be returning to classes five days a week beginning September 8th.


----------



## uandmfan

OnceUponATime15 said:


> When Doug Ford made the announcement this afternoon he said that the children would be returning to classes five days a week beginning September 8th.



Some boards had planned to go back before Labour day while others hadn't. Our Ottawa Board changed our start date from September 1st to 3rd recently and moved some PD days around to do so. I think they would either have to extend the school year or move more PS days around to start the 8th or there won't be enough instructional days scheduled.

Also, the French Boards always go back before Labour Day. I can't see that changing.


----------



## OnceUponATime15

uandmfan said:


> Some boards had planned to go back before Labour day while others hadn't. Our Ottawa Board changed our start date from September 1st to 3rd recently and moved some PD days around to do so. I think they would either have to extend the school year or move more PS days around to start the 8th or there won't be enough instructional days scheduled.
> 
> Also, the French Boards always go back before Labour Day. I can't see that changing.



I took a quick look at all the GTA board websites .. all are showing September 8/20
I thought maybe I had misrepresented so I watched the video of the press conference again.
Here are the words from the mouth of the Premier at today’s press conference.  At 33 minutes in,  he gets to announcing the date.


----------



## star72232

Waterloo posted some idea of what they had planned for the hybrid high school model. Instead of every other day, they were looking at a week on-week off model (running Thursday to Wednesday). They also put out the idea of a quadmester schedule (only 2 classes each quad, 4 quads in the year), with only one class each day. If they do the 4 class semester model, it was suggested that it would be one class per day instead of 4 shorter classes (that would certainly limit contacts).

I’ve got 2 in HS (in different schools - of course my DD just had to do the IB program...) and 2 in elementary. Even though my youngest won’t officially need to wear a mask (Gr 3), I will be sending them, expecting them to be worn. If enough parents are clear with their expectations that their child wear a mask, hopefully the classes will be safer.


----------



## pixie_mtl

My daughter is enrolled in competitive swimming as part of a S_port-études_ program (high-school) and I am still waiting to know how things will unfold on the Quebec side. Both the FNQ _(fédération de natation du Québec) _and the new model of school governance (we no longer have school boards) have yet to communicate how this back-2-school will look like.


----------



## Disneylover99

Debbie said:


> Lecce was quoting the 'average' at 20. I don't believe there is a hard cap, so don't be surprised to see 22, 23 in a classroom. (I could be wrong on that, maybe someone could confirm/correct)


Oh, for sure. I currently have 23 on my list for September. 

I was just thinking that maybe the high schoolers with their 1 to 15 ratio was a hard cap.


----------



## bankr63

uandmfan said:


> Some boards had planned to go back before Labour day while others hadn't. Our Ottawa Board changed our start date from September 1st to 3rd recently and moved some PD days around to do so. I think they would either have to extend the school year or move more PS days around to start the 8th or there won't be enough instructional days scheduled.
> 
> Also, the French Boards always go back before Labour Day. I can't see that changing.


This is correct, the OCDSB has announced that September 3rd is the first day of classes, as approved by the ministry.  Teachers have 3 PD days (which will severely restrict their usual report writing days later in the year) before classes start.  Hardly enough time to "plan" and prepare for what the new protocols will be.  Of course perhaps the Premier is planning to rescind their approval of the Ottawa Board's calendar, or perhaps, as usual, he thinks that Toronto is the centre of the universe, and no where else matters.


----------



## MoreTravels

Do you have elementary school children that need to perform classroom duties regularly? I understand some teachers assign those to build independence and characters. Some duties include clean up toys, wipe classroom desks, bring documents to administrative office, etc. I really hope the teachers would stop asking my kids to wipe everyone's desk when they don't have full PPE and anti-viral disinfectants. I know back in February when the pandemic was starting in other parts of the world, my kids were still doing those chores. I really hope they changed the practice as it is no longer safe to do them.


----------



## Disneylover99

MoreTravels said:


> Do you have elementary school children that need to perform classroom duties regularly? I understand some teachers assign those to build independence and characters. Some duties include clean up toys, wipe classroom desks, bring documents to administrative office, etc. I really hope the teachers would stop asking my kids to wipe everyone's desk when they don't have full PPE and anti-viral disinfectants. I know back in February when the pandemic was starting in other parts of the world, my kids were still doing those chores. I really hope they changed the practice as it is no longer safe to do them.


I’m 100% certain that students will not be allowed to wipe down other student’s desks.


----------



## mshanson3121

They put out a bit more info yesterday re: New Brunswick and high school specifically. The students will go to school every other day. Class sizes will be reduced with a minimum of 1m social distancing required at all times in class, and 2m recommended in public areas. Their learning will be split between in class, online classes, project based learning and experiential learning (which could be really good if executed well) . *Every student is required to provide their own laptop* the province isn't providing them, though they will provide financial assistance to families in need. This specifically, has a lot of families ticked off. It's not exactly a small item to have to purchase period, let alone multiple of.

Then in general, they have also stated they are encouraging all schools to think outside the box re: learning areas, and are encouraging them to make use of outdoor and large community spaces. Also, curriculum is only going to be focused on core subjects - absolutely no art, music, gym, or high school electives, and minimal history, science etc... in younger years. It's the curriculum chop of their dreams budget-wise, and the absolute worst chop for students. It's understandable in current times, but, anyone who understands the budget issues going on in recent years (at least in our province) and the huge cut backs they've already made to the arts, knows that this could potentially be the beginning of the permanent end (or drastic cut back) for the arts programming. Lastly, by the sounds of things they will not be requiring masks at all, in any grade.


----------



## mshanson3121

bankr63 said:


> Original post deleted at request of @Donald - my hero
> 
> But to be clear, that was a genuine laugh, not at you, but more at the fact that a great many people have misconceptions about what governments/administrations say will happen and what actually happens.  DW is in education and I have spent more than half my career in health care.  What governments and boards say to the public and what actually happens IRL are at best faint resemblances to each other, and at worst pure comedy (or tragedy?)
> 
> Until recently I was a provincial civil servant in management, and often had to support positions that were at best half-truths.
> 
> _
> Teachers are the last ones to get information about what is going on, usually about a week after the ministry announces to the parents, they will get some garbled instruction on how the board expects them to implement the impossible.  They are unionized; management does not interact with labour like that in most industries, including education._



I'm sorry I copied it as I wanted to second this. My mother was a teacher for years, and she would definitely agree. And even now, DH teaches at our community college, they return to work in 4 weeks and have NO clue what is happening. There's been stuff said by the government to the students, but NOTHING to any of the teachers. He has no idea if he'll be working from home or the school, if he'll be teaching all online, in class, blended? If online,  they haven't even remotely been able to start uploading their academic content online. And the worst of it all, in a year when they need more prep time than ever, they're only being brought back one week early, instead of two.


----------



## bankr63

I started running some sanity checks on some of the Ontario funding announcements.  For example, the $40MM for cleaning of buses that was an earlier topic here.  There are 18,000 school buses in Ontario, covering 198 instructional days of school.  So that works out to $11.22 per day per bus.  Most buses urban run multiple routes per day, so if there is expectation of sanitation between runs, that might be $2 or less per run (3 runs morning and afternoon).
They have funding to hire an additional 900 custodians.  There are 880 Secondary Schools in Ontario.  Want to guess where these 900 will probably be assigned?  I would not expect much additional cleaning help in the 3,948 elementary schools in Ontario.


----------



## Donald - my hero

*OH man .. there are some families in my city losing their minds right now and I think we'd be joining in the outcry if our kids were still in school. Guelph is not in "the list" (our school board is huge and other than us, mostly rural) so our schools are opening with 100% attendance, every day. The schools were already full to capacity, running staggered lunch hours and kids had to share lockers. I have NO idea how they expect them to maintain the social distances. *


----------



## Prince John Robin Hood

Our school board emailed out their plan and it includes:
"If any signs or symptoms, student and other household members must stay home, and school must be contacted."

So if the schools follow this kids will not be allowed to attend school with so much as a runny nose I assume.  I don't mind keeping my kids home if they have a cold but I can see how this will be problematic if a child has a cough that is lingering for weeks.  
The list of symptoms to screen for is here:
http://www.health.gov.on.ca/en/pro/...onavirus/docs/2019_reference_doc_symptoms.pdf


----------



## ottawamom

Exactly, I'm not sure how that is going to work. In any given week I think I have most of those symptoms at one time or another. I always have had (allergies, stress etc). If I had kids in school and we followed those rules they would never be going to school.


----------



## Minniemoo15

mshanson3121 said:


> They put out a bit more info yesterday re: New Brunswick and high school specifically. The students will go to school every other day. Class sizes will be reduced with a minimum of 1m social distancing required at all times in class, and 2m recommended in public areas. Their learning will be split between in class, online classes, project based learning and experiential learning (which could be really good if executed well) . *Every student is required to provide their own laptop* the province isn't providing them, though they will provide financial assistance to families in need. This specifically, has a lot of families ticked off. It's not exactly a small item to have to purchase period, let alone multiple of.
> 
> Then in general, they have also stated they are encouraging all schools to think outside the box re: learning areas, and are encouraging them to make use of outdoor and large community spaces. Also, curriculum is only going to be focused on core subjects - absolutely no art, music, gym, or high school electives, and minimal history, science etc... in younger years. It's the curriculum chop of their dreams budget-wise, and the absolute worst chop for students. It's understandable in current times, but, anyone who understands the budget issues going on in recent years (at least in our province) and the huge cut backs they've already made to the arts, knows that this could potentially be the beginning of the permanent end (or drastic cut back) for the arts programming. Lastly, by the sounds of things they will not be requiring masks at all, in any grade.



It’s not true that art, music, PE will be cut in NB - at least at the elementary level. I am a NB Kindergarten teacher and we have directly been told these subjects will be kept. In fact, they are introducing a daily exploratory block that will be focused on child centred and play based learning. Cross-curricular learning will become part of our every day plans. They are also allocating time each day to socio-emotional learning, recognizing that all children will have experienced some level of trauma due to the pandemic.

I know I am in the minority - but I am very encouraged by all our government has been doing. They have been working very hard to come up with a safe plan, hired hundreds of new teachers to reduce class sizes. They were one of the first in the country to shut down the schools back in March, so I feel confident that if an outbreak occurs it will be handled quickly.

While our year will look different, I am determined to make this as positive of an experience as possible for my incoming Ks. In fact, it may be one of my best years teaching yet! I will only have 15 students and increased freedom to deliver the curriculum. Of course - I am in NB where cases are very low. I read somewhere this week that we have had the lowest overall COVID rate of any province or state to date. So I feel that if we can try reopening schools safely anywhere - NB is the place to start. I would feel much differently and certainly empathize with educators in harder hit areas.


----------



## wdwmom3

Minniemoo15 said:


> It’s not true that art, music, PE will be cut in NB - at least at the elementary level. I am a NB Kindergarten teacher and we have directly been told these subjects will be kept. In fact, they are introducing a daily exploratory block that will be focused on child centred learning and play based outcomes. Cross-curricular learning will become part of our every day plans. They are also allocating time each day to socio-emotional learning, recognizing that all children will have experienced some level of trauma due to the pandemic.
> 
> I know I am in the minority - but I am very encouraged by all our government has been doing. They have been working very hard to come up with a safe plan, hired hundreds of new teachers to reduce class sizes. They were one of the first in the country to shut down the schools back in March, so I feel confident that if an outbreak occurs it will be handled quickly.
> 
> While our year will look different, I am determined to make this as positive of an experience as possible for my incoming Ks. In fact, it may be one of my best years teaching yet! I will only have 15 students and increased freedom to deliver the curriculum. Of course - I am in NB where cases are very low. I read somewhere this week that we have had the lowest overall COVID rate of any province or state to date. So I feel that if we can try reopening schools safely anywhere - NB is the place to start. I would feel much differently and certainly empathize with educators in harder hit areas.



Thanks for sharing this perspective with us. We keep hearing all the doom and gloom it’s refreshing to hear some positive things. I think we need to remember that things won’t be perfect, we haven’t dealt with this before. There is really no right answer.

I know a lot of parents are upset over the plan here not to reduce class sizes etc. And to be honest I’m a little nervous (my husband is higher risk) and I kind of wish they had done a modified approach for elementary schools here. But our cases have really dropped in our area and I will watch that closely and I know I can pull him out if cases start to go up. I’ve talked to some teachers I know around here and the schools are expecting classes to be a little smaller then normal as some parents keep their kids home. So if my son would normally be in a class of say 23-24 kids (normal at his school) his may actually only have 19-20 kids. That made me feel a lot better knowing that.

Yesterday my son actually made a comment about how he would actually like to be home schooled.  I questioned him as to why. He said, well I would learn things so much quicker cause you guys would just be teaching me instead of a teacher who has to teach everyone else.  A bit more questioning revealed that he figured he could get his work done in a couple hours and then spend the rest of the day playing x-box . When I told him, umm no you would being work for longer then that and you wouldn’t get more x-box time, he quickly changed his mind and was wanting to go to school.  Gotta give the kid credit for trying lol.


----------



## wdwmom3

Donald - my hero said:


> *OH man .. there are some families in my city losing their minds right now and I think we'd be joining in the outcry if our kids were still in school. Guelph is not in "the list" (our school board is huge and other than us, mostly rural) so our schools are opening with 100% attendance, every day. The schools were already full to capacity, running staggered lunch hours and kids had to share lockers. I have NO idea how they expect them to maintain the social distances. *



That sucks. The high schools in Guelph would be just as full as the ones here, and our high schools are opening with a modified plan. With boards with rural and suburban you think they would decided school by school.

My daughter graduated this year but has friends still in high school.  A bunch of them are considering doing just online.  Or seeing if they can do some courses 100% online and only certain ones in person.


----------



## TammyLynn33

Am I the only one to think that they are banking on parents being scared or unwilling to accept the risks that they keep their kids home therefore achieving smaller numbers?

I can't stop shaking my head that I took a hefty financial hit because I switched my flights back in  ?? winter when we heard wed be going back before labour day and I didn't want kids to miss first dy of college and high school sigh those were real nfoirst world problems id love to hav etc deal with right now.


----------



## hdrolfe

I'm still waiting for the school board and the school to announce their intentions based on the new information from the province. I still plan to send kiddo to school. He is anxious to see his friends and get back to learning something. Ironically, he hasn't played a game on his computer or xbox in a few days, though he is still watching youtube and tiktok, and he has been so good. He is wanting to help, learn how to cook things, spend time with me... remarkable what a change in his personality when he gets off those games. So yes, I hope he will stay off them and back to school means less time for them. 

I am prepared to keep him home if he has a cough/sniffle, and will work from home if necessary those days, and hopefully those kids will be able to do some of the online stuff those days as well. 

Back to school shoe shopping in a few weeks, his backpack and stuff from last year got less use so should still be good for another year. But shoes, he is so hard on his shoes!

I've been reading a lot of opinions on facebook and such, so many people who aren't parents have opinions they feel quite willing to share. And I do wish they would make the classes smaller as well. I still hope they will be as some people chose to keep their kids home. He has been lucky, his biggest class was last year at 23 kids. The other grade 5 class was the same, so 46 grade 6 kids this year unless there are new enrollments. It would be nice if they got split into 3 classes, but if even 6 kids stay home and they split into 2 groups, I am ok with that. I emailed the school, the new principal actually emailed me back quite quickly, and hopefully he'll be with the kids he's already playing with. 

I imagine if this was a different school year, or he was at a different school, my opinion could be different. Everyone's situation is different and one little thing can make such a difference. If he was at a more populated school, if he was in kindergarten, or going into high school. So many things could change this. 

We did talk about homeschooling, and online schools, he also thought if he could stay home he'd get more time to play games and watch videos, umm no. But I think if I did decide to homeschool I'd go for more of the "unschooling" approach. And that is still in my back pocket should things go sideways on the back to school stuff, or even if we all get locked down again. I just want him to learn something this year. And let him be able to play with his friends.


----------



## Disneylover99

TammyLynn33 said:


> Am I the only one to think that they are banking on parents being scared or unwilling to accept the risks that they keep their kids home therefore achieving smaller numbers?


Yes, I think they’re banking on that in elementary especially. Keeping class size status quo, instead of reducing class size, may deter families from sending the younger students back. I think they’re hoping many will opt to keep their kids home home and do 100% online learning. Then, the smaller numbers in class will appease the teachers and parents in school, and it will save the boards from hiring additional teachers.


----------



## pigletto

Disneylover99 said:


> Yes, I think they’re banking on that in elementary especially. Keeping class size status quo, instead of reducing class size, may deter families from sending the younger students back. I think they’re hoping many will opt to keep their kids home home and do 100% online learning. Then, the smaller numbers in class will appease the teachers and parents in school, and it will save the boards from hiring additional teachers.


There could be many parents who are waiting to see what those class sizes will be before making those decisions though . I imagine that it will be hard for schools to get a solid head count and it will even harder for parents to hear what the numbers will be . I know I wouldn’t  be making my decisions without the most accurate number they could provide for me though . Cohorts of 15 is vastly different than 26 in these scenarios .


----------



## mshanson3121

Minniemoo15 said:


> It’s not true that art, music, PE will be cut in NB - at least at the elementary level. I am a NB Kindergarten teacher and we have directly been told these subjects will be kept. In fact, they are introducing a daily exploratory block that will be focused on child centred and play based learning. Cross-curricular learning will become part of our every day plans. They are also allocating time each day to socio-emotional learning, recognizing that all children will have experienced some level of trauma due to the pandemic.



I said my info was re: high school specifically. Though yes, I had added general info re: classroom spaces, so I can see your confusion.


----------



## Disneylover99

pigletto said:


> There could be many parents who are waiting to see what those class sizes will be before making those decisions though . I imagine that it will be hard for schools to get a solid head count and it will even harder for parents to hear what the numbers will be . I know I wouldn’t  be making my decisions without the most accurate number they could provide for me though . Cohorts of 15 is vastly different than 26 in these scenarios .


I’m sure many parents will take a ”wait and see” approach. If class sizes are low, many parents may decide to opt back in, making class sizes large again. So who knows.

I thought I read there were windows for opting in or out of online learning too, but I’m not really sure about that.


----------



## quandrea

We officially withdrew our daughter from the school system yesterday. I feel at peace with the decision. It’s nice not having to wait and wonder how things will turn out. It’s also nice that should any drama ensue during the year, that we will be away from it. In the end, she will just have an ordinary final year of high school.


----------



## hdrolfe

Disneylover99 said:


> I’m sure many parents will take a ”wait and see” approach. If class sizes are low, many parents may decide to opt back in, making class sizes large again. So who knows.
> 
> I thought I read there were windows for opting in or out of online learning too, but I’m not really sure about that.



I imagine the school boards will share those plans if they haven't already in terms of how they plan to handle this. 

We had this sent in early July:
The Ottawa Catholic School Board is prepared to offer remote education for students whose parents choose, for personal reasons, not to send their children back to school in September.
As we hope you can appreciate, there are several factors that we need to consider that require considerable planning to welcome our students back in person or through distance learning.  Please complete this short survey so that we can more accurately plan. 
For staffing and planning purposes, we ask families who choose full-time distance learning as the September option to commit to three months (September - November) for elementary students and Semester 1 (September- January) for high school students.


----------



## Donald - my hero

*I know from the parking lot discussions and the local newspaper that our school board wants an answer by August 14th from families. Either in class or online,  it's an all or nothing type choice so they can get classes set and lessons planned.  *


----------



## tgropp

Just out of curiosity, how many people have gone to restaurants and especially Walmart since the epidemic?


----------



## hdrolfe

tgropp said:


> Just out of curiosity, how many people have gone to restaurants and especially Walmart since the epidemic?



No restaurants for anything but take out. Been to Walmart a couple times, my parents go there quite often. Honestly, the restaurant thing, we don't eat at them very often (except when travelling). Usually only Mother's Day and last day of school. We did delivery instead. 

My last trip to Walmart was annoying, I hate my walmart to begin with honestly, it's such a mess... but this time people were just all up in my business. I guess because we had moved to stage 3 and everyone was wearing masks they thought you didn't have to keep your distance. It was annoying though.


----------



## FigmentSpark

People, in the before-times, if the class sizes were low, they made a split class with another grade.  Be careful hoping for people to withdraw or do remote, because the board may just end up filling up fewer classes with split grades.  That would be hard to manage, but if they are required to keep "full" classes, it could happen.


----------



## bababear_50

tgropp said:


> Just out of curiosity, how many people have gone to restaurants and especially Walmart since the epidemic?



Nope no restaurants,,unless a Mcdonald's drive thru coffee counts and I never go to Walmart.
I actually had a bad fall in Walmart a few years ago (someone poured baby oil on the floor,,guess it was some sort of joke) anyhow you would not believe how filthy dirty their floors and under the shelves are,,, .

Hugs
Mel


----------



## bababear_50

This is the timeline in my email as a staff.
GTA area.

"Reopening Plans will be shared with staff in mid-August and training will be provided during the Professional Learning Days that are scheduled from Sept. 1 to 3, 2020. "

I am going to also say that as staff we normally go into the school anywhere from 1-2 weeks ahead of school start (on our own dime) and do
:classroom prep (example .. bulletin boards)
:classroom moving
:IEP reviews
:material prep
:tour for new families and special needs kids
:equipment cleaning and organizing
:mini staff collaborative meets
:filing/photocopying for parents
:schedule organizing
and a 1001 other jobs that are never ending,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,


From our Union representation : Nothing..........
OPSEU

Not a whole lot of planning time here,, just saying.


----------



## mshanson3121

tgropp said:


> Just out of curiosity, how many people have gone to restaurants and especially Walmart since the epidemic?



No restaurants unless they provide outdoor dining. And that has only been twice. Walmart we have been to a few times, but we order online as much as possible. Same with groceries - we have only gone in store a few times. We typically do curb side pick up or get things delivered. If we go in a store we aren't there long - we're typically just picking up one or two items, so are in and out quickly.


----------



## TammyLynn33

tgropp said:


> Just out of curiosity, how many people have gone to restaurants and especially Walmart since the epidemic?



Not sure how this is relevant to schools opening . Restaurants are trying to maintain 2m distance  and no one  spends  6 hours in one with mostly poor ventilation .
Same as Walmart , unless you work there . 
But to answer your questions no no restaurants , takeout occasionally . Usually curb side or no contact delivery. 
As for Walmart, I order curb side pickup. And if I do go to a store I go early or late not On weekends and get in and get out. I am masked and I am the only person from my family grocery shopping because well my family needs to eat , and I mask and as an adult I’m careful with hand sanitizing keeping 6ft apart as opposed to little kids in small classrooms who don’t have that capacity and aren’t being mandated to wear masks . 
Any other questions ?



tgropp said:


> Just out of curiosity, how many people have gone to restaurants and especially Walmart since the epidemic?


----------



## quandrea

tgropp said:


> Just out of curiosity, how many people have gone to restaurants and especially Walmart since the epidemic?


No restaurants, coffee shops, etc. No visits to grocery stores, drugstores, any retail of any kind. We have been to the dentist once and for haircuts.


----------



## pigletto

Just in case any of us were still hanging on to the notion that kids don’t contract or spread Covid . I still feel like we are walking into a dangerous experiment

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.pbs...-covid-19-after-4-days-at-a-georgia-ymca-camp


----------



## ottawamom

We went to one of our favourite breakfast restaurants last week. Sat outside (I won't eat inside a restaurant) no one closer that 8 feet from us. Food was served on paper plates with plastic cutlery and paper coffee cups. The food was the same (slightly smaller portions) but we won't be going back until we can eat off regular plates with real cutlery and mugs for coffee and do so safely.

I was happy to be back to support them but until things are "normal" we'll eat at home. We do get take-out from some local haunts but these are places we always got take-out from before Covid.

Haven't stepped foot inside a WalMart in a few years (or a mall for that matter) and big venue shopping will just have to wait.


----------



## tgropp

tgropp said:


> Just out of curiosity, how many people have gone to restaurants and especially Walmart since the epidemic?



Just thought that I would ask. Since we live in a city of 30,000 and go to the cottage in Southampton, we have eaten out on patios on a regular basis but shy away from Walmart...... Canadian Tire pretty well covers our household needs. We are quite strict on our social distancing but I have worked in a seniors retirement home all along with no symptoms, which was a result of wearing masks and temperature taking weeks before government recommendations. If all peopLe would thoroughly scrub their hands On a regular basis, the spread can be greatly reduced. The biggest issue with kids returning to school would be for them to not follow this simpletask.


----------



## bababear_50

tgropp said:


> Just thought that I would ask. Since we live in a city of 30,000 and go to the cottage in Southampton, we have eaten out on patios on a regular basis but shy away from Walmart...... Canadian Tire pretty well covers our household needs. We are quite strict on our social distancing but I have worked in a seniors retirement home all along with no symptoms, which was a result of wearing masks and temperature taking weeks before government recommendations. If all peopLe would thoroughly scrub their hands On a regular basis, the spread can be greatly reduced. The biggest issue with kids returning to school would be for them to not follow this simpletask.


This is interesting to me as today I read an article that suggests that the CDC was in error of not making masks mandatory right from the start but that it probably didn't because governments did not have an adequate stockpile for frontline workers. Masks also became a *political* subject unfortunately.
In discussing this matter today with some co workers we feel the staff in classrooms with young children not wearing masks will be at the most risk.
This is just our thoughts,,,4 kinder and 1 grade 2/3 teachers.
Children in those classes may not get very sick with the Virus however the Staff and their families will.

**Biggest issue for many schools is having enough washroom sink space to adequately provide an area for the kids to wash**.
I did some digging and my school needs over 4 million just to bring it up to code...whew!

Mel


----------



## mshanson3121

pigletto said:


> Just in case any of us were still hanging on to the notion that kids don’t contract or spread Covid . I still feel like we are walking into a dangerous experiment
> 
> https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.pbs...-covid-19-after-4-days-at-a-georgia-ymca-camp



I was just coming to share this. Of special importance, it was noted that children between ages 6-10 had the highest rate of attack.


----------



## wdwmom3

mshanson3121 said:


> I was just coming to share this. Of special importance, it was noted that children between ages 6-10 had the highest rate of attack.



Except this was an overnight camp. The staff wore masks but kids did not. It also states the buildings did not have good ventilation. And the kids slept in a large group in the same building and were regularly singing and cheering. Given it’s an overnight camp you also can assume the staff was not wearing masks all the time. Georgia also has a very high infection rate right now.

This is terrible but I don’t think you can compare it to schools opening here.  I should add that if our level of infection was even a fraction of what it is in Georgia, then no schools should be open.


----------



## Disneylover99

tgropp said:


> Just out of curiosity, how many people have gone to restaurants and especially Walmart since the epidemic?



No restaurants or Walmart for me or my family.

I will be teaching in September. And my children will be attending high school. They are not nervous, but I’m a bit worried and nervous for us all.


----------



## bababear_50

wdwmom3 said:


> Except this was an overnight camp. The staff wore masks but kids did not. It also states the buildings did not have good ventilation. And the kids slept in a large group in the same building and were regularly singing and cheering. Given it’s an overnight camp you also can assume the staff was not wearing masks all the time. Georgia also has a very high infection rate right now.
> 
> This is terrible but I don’t think you can compare it to schools opening here.



Hi
I think it is important as many people are saying young children do not come down with the virus and this seems to indicate that yes they do.
Sorry but many schools have very ,,very poor heating and ventilation systems.
Some classrooms have windows that do not even open.
The cabins had 16 to 26 kids and staff in them,,,somewhat similar to projected classrooms in my area.
Maybe some of the kids did wear masks as it doesn't say,,it just says they didn't have to.
What the article doesn't say is the kids were actually outdoors a majority of the time.
And to note kids often scream/yell/laugh in classrooms --no different than singing and cheering really.
J.M.H.O. (Just My Honest Opinion).

Mel


----------



## Disneylover99

wdwmom3 said:


> Except this was an overnight camp. The staff wore masks but kids did not. It also states the buildings did not have good ventilation. And the kids slept in a large group in the same building and were regularly singing and cheering. Given it’s an overnight camp you also can assume the staff was not wearing masks all the time. Georgia also has a very high infection rate right now.
> 
> This is terrible but I don’t think you can compare it to schools opening here.



My classroom is very small. Ventilation is not great. Masks for my students will not be required. The students will be in class with me all day, every day, eating and drinking. At some points, I’ll need to remove my mask to eat and drink as well.

I think it is comparable to schools.


----------



## bababear_50

To be honest I have so many texts from staff that are some of the greatest people I've ever worked with...just terrific ,,would do everything and anything for kids....BUT
they are very scared right now and they have the right to be!

Mel


----------



## FigmentSpark

bababear_50 said:


> Hi
> I think it is important as many people are saying young children do not come down with the virus and this seems to indicate that yes they do.
> Sorry but many schools have very ,,very poor heating and ventilation systems.
> Some classrooms have windows that do not even open.
> The cabins had 16 to 26 kids and staff in them,,,somewhat similar to projected classrooms in my area.
> Maybe some of the kids did wear masks as it doesn't say,,it just says they didn't have to.
> What the article doesn't say is the kids were actually outdoors a majority of the time.
> And to note kids often scream/yell/laugh in classrooms --no different than singing and cheering really.
> J.M.H.O. (Just My Honest Opinion).
> 
> Mel


Exactly.  Did all those studies that say kids don't spread it take into account that when things shut down, people may have had to go out, but the kids were kept on lockdown.


----------



## bababear_50

I think teachers and resource staff will need to do intensive inclass *online training* with the kids for the first few weeks of back to school.
They need to know that the kids are well prepared should return to online education occur.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## bababear_50

FigmentSpark said:


> Exactly.  Did all those studies that say kids don't spread it take into account that when things shut down, people may have had to go out, but the kids were kept on lockdown.



Yes this is true,,most kids have been fairly isolated during this lockdown.


Mel


----------



## bababear_50

Disneylover99 said:


> My classroom is very small. Ventilation is not great. Masks for my students will not be required. The students will be in class with me all day, every day, eating and drinking. At some points, I’ll need to remove my mask to eat and drink as well.
> 
> I think it is comparable to schools.



Hi Hon
You will need time to exit ,,even if it's to your car and take a break away,,walk around the block.
Remember your health and well being is important so that you can be strong to support the kids.
It is not going to be easy,,talk to your co workers and lean on them for support.

Hugs to you
Mel


----------



## Disneylover99

bababear_50 said:


> Hi Hon
> You will need time to exit ,,even if it's to your car and take a break away,,walk around the block.
> Remember your health and well being is important so that you can be strong to support the kids.
> It is not going to be easy,,talk to your co workers and lean on them for support.
> 
> Hugs to you
> Mel


Thank you! Yes. I will take care of myself mentally and physically and do my best to take care of my student’s needs as well.


----------



## wdwmom3

bababear_50 said:


> I think teachers and resource staff will need to do intensive inclass *online training* with the kids for the first few weeks of back to school.
> They need to know that the kids are well prepared should return to online education occur.
> 
> Hugs
> Mel



this is actually a good idea. One thing I’m going to ask our school is how will it work if our son starts in class but a month or two later we want to pull him out. We only feel comfy sending him now because cases in our area are pretty low and keep dropping. If cases start to go back up we will have him back at home. We are also buying him a new chrome book so he’s prepared.  

I should also add that our school isn’t overcrowded and has air conditioning and windows that open etc. It’s also not a really big school in general.  My decision to send him may be different if his school was more crowded or older etc.


----------



## hdrolfe

I think most school boards will be asking for you to commit to a certain time frame if you say you will be doing online or in class. I know mine is based on what I posted earlier. I hope that if there is a spike they will send everyone home though. 

The studies on kids I read were from around the world, and I particular from places where kids were back to school. Kids under 10 do not tend to have symptoms, nor do they spread it. That is not saying they can't get it. 

I understand teachers being scared to go to work, I imagine a lot of people who have been at work throughout and gone back as things have opened up feel the same way. I think that having PPE and limited contacts should help. At least in Ontario for the PPE  I do wish they could  make class sizes smaller, I do not know how they would do that in most schools. They can't suddenly open twice as many schools and hire all those additional teachers. 

We were asked to provide whether our kids would be doing online learning by July 21. No idea if they will revise that now that we know more. It was so they can plan classes and teachers. Hopefully we will get more details soon.


----------



## Maddysdaddy

wdwmom3 said:


> We are also buying him a new chrome book so he’s prepared.



Before you invest in a Chromebook, you should try to investigate whether the online platform used by your school is D2L. I teach post secondary using that platform and when we went full remote in March, there were significant issues with students trying to use Chromebooks, with most having to go out to purchase a new Windows or Apple computer.


----------



## mshanson3121

FigmentSpark said:


> Exactly.  Did all those studies that say kids don't spread it take into account that when things shut down, people may have had to go out, but the kids were kept on lockdown.



No, they didn't. At least not the earlier ones that I looked at, but that was awhile ago. IMO, studies from other countries in EU, Asia are of very limited value as a) we have some different strains circulating here and b ) despite what may be happening there, we are having a increasing number of reports in North America of transmission AND symptomatic cases in young children.


----------



## mshanson3121

tgropp said:


> Just thought that I would ask. Since we live in a city of 30,000 and go to the cottage in Southampton, we have eaten out on patios on a regular basis but shy away from Walmart...... Canadian Tire pretty well covers our household needs.* We are quite strict on our social distancing* but I have worked in a seniors retirement home all along with no symptoms, *which was a result of wearing masks and temperature taking *weeks before government recommendations.* If all peopLe would thoroughly scrub their hands On a regular basis*, the spread can be greatly reduced. The biggest issue with kids returning to school would be for them to not follow this simpletask.



Hand scrubbing is good, but also not all that effective since the primary means of infection is droplets. So the #1 defense that kept you healthy and keeps others healthy, is masks. Which many schools will not be requiring. The second is social distancing, which in the younger years, many schools will also not be requiring within their "bubble" (keeping in mind the bubble could be anywhere from 15-60 kids depending on class size and then how many classes are in the bubble, and that all those kids in the bubble are being exposed to many people outside of school). Temperature checking isn't being proposed here, either.

The return to school is really a very different scenario than going to eat on a patio or running into Canadian Tire for half an hour, or even your job where you had hand washing, masks and temp checks.

To me, I think one of the most important things school can do this year is take learning outside as much as possible, then require face shields and/or masks while indoors. Parents could easily start working with their kids now re: wearing them, especially learning not to fidget with them. I'm thinking face shields for teachers and students would be better for K-2, for the purpose of learning to read, social skills learning etc... Not as good as masks, but better than nothing. Then have a hand wash station set up in each K-2 classroom, so kids can wash their hands with soap regularly, since those ages are the slimiest lol. By grade 3/4, most schools have moved past learning to read to reading to learn, so masks would be fine, though I think face shields will always be better for teachers since some kids are always going to rely on seeing what they are hearing. I also think they should be screening everyone (temp check), every day. While temp checks are useless for the asymptomatic cases, even if they catch just a few cases, that could go a long way towards stopping a local outbreak.


----------



## bababear_50

My Board is going to be sending out emails this week asking parents and students to commit to at home online or in school learning.
They will have a date by which the decision needs to be made. (I believe it is Aug 14-15th).
I would keep in mind that many places just entered into stage 3 of reopening and the results of how that goes will not be seen for a few weeks.

I believe schools will have to be fairly fluid in moving kids to online should situations (child ill, family member ill, parent job loss, home relocation etc) to moving the child from one form of learning to the other. There maybe a time delay to make this happen,,material resource distribution/staff allocation.

Last night we were discussing our observations when out and about shopping for groceries. It appeared to us that the kids have no problem wearing masks but the adults seem to have a difficult time not fidgeting with them,,,lol. Just something to think about.

In our one contained classroom (for students with ASD DD) the staff will be wearing masks & shields as their students unfortunately have certain behaviours that require this. Refusal to wash hands is fairly common and a skill the staff work on with kids in this class so lots of hand sanitizer hopefully will be available.
Staff illness in this class is usually very high during a regular school year so hopefully enough staff backup can be put in place ,,, as during a regular year our resource staff were constantly being pulled,,,just not going to be available this year.

At my school Admin is going to have to step up to the plate as we deal with many behaviour situations on a regular basis and it has been an issue in the past not having enough staff to deal with it. During this stressful time staff and students need to be supported properly.
I do know we are supposed to open a *contact program class* next year but haven't heard of the staffing for it.

*CONTACT PROGRAM

The Contact Room provides an atmosphere for students to*:

• Identify and evaluate the behaviors they have chosen
• Learn that they are responsible for their choices and that the choices they make come with

  consequences
• Develop skills to make better choices

*The Contact Program Room is a place where a system of interventions is implemented.

It helps students to:*


• Reflect on their actions and subsequent reactions
• Consider their behavior and its effects
• Develop a plan to replace the undesired behavior
• Develop skills for more positive behavior /attitude in class

*Programs offered through the Contact Room staff:*

• Organization Skills
• Anger Management
• Social Skills
• Girls /Self Esteem Group
• Anti Bullying

*Contact Room may refer to students to further resources/interventions:*


• Vice Principal
• Guidance
• Social Work
• In School Review Committee
• Parents
• Academic/Monitoring Support – Student Success/Learning Center


So much to consider here.


Mel


----------



## tgropp

One thing that puzzles me is why it can be so transferable through droplets (agreed), then why do they have to shove a swab up to your brain to take a test. I have stopped taking the tests the last four weeks. Some were gentle wit eyes watering and sneezing but the last few were taken in a drive through clinic and they pinned my head against the head rest and kept pushing it in. That was enough for me. Can any nurses fill me in.


----------



## Silvermist999

bababear_50 said:


> My Board is going to be sending out emails this week asking parents and students to commit to at home online or in school learning.
> They will have a date by which the decision needs to be made. (I believe it is Aug 14-15th).
> *I would keep in mind that many places just entered into stage 3 of reopening and the results of how that goes will not be seen for a few weeks.*



This is what I am thinking also. With Toronto and Peel now in Stage 3, the last to join the rest of Ontario, the results over the next few weeks will be even more crucial to confirm whether they should even go ahead with in school instruction at all.


----------



## bababear_50

Silvermist999 said:


> This is what I am thinking also. With Toronto and Peel now in Stage 3, the last to join the rest of Ontario, the results over the next few weeks will be even more crucial to confirm whether they should even go ahead with in school instruction at all.



Yes and this is why I think Parents need to be prepared.
I have a small list of things I would be doing if I was a parent to prepare to make next year the best I could for my kids.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## bababear_50

tgropp said:


> One thing that puzzles me is why it can be so transferable through droplets (agreed), then why do they have to shove a swab up to your brain to take a test. I have stopped taking the tests the last four weeks. Some were gentle wit eyes watering and sneezing but the last few were taken in a drive through clinic and they pinned my head against the head rest and kept pushing it in. That was enough for me. Can any nurses fill me in.




According to this article it seems to be one of the best test to detect Covid 19
**The video is graphic**

https://www.nydailynews.com/coronav...0200401-no3nuzb7frgzfhmbp542q55eja-story.html
Hugs to you for what you do everyday to make others lives so valued and special.
Hugs
Mel


----------



## MoreTravels

If the swab does not get enough contact with the mucosal skin in your nasopharynx then it may not pick up the viral particle and give false negative.

Unfortunately, a false negative result is really serious because most people will let the guard down and take little precautions... because they feel “cleared and not infectious”.


----------



## tgropp

bababear_50 said:


> According to this article it seems to be one of the best test to detect Covid 19
> **The video is graphic**
> 
> https://www.nydailynews.com/coronav...0200401-no3nuzb7frgzfhmbp542q55eja-story.html
> Hugs to you for what you do everyday to make others lives so valued and special.
> Hugs
> Mel


 Likewise to you Mel.....this is why I like the DISBOARDS. Wishing all teachers students etc a safe Return to school. God knows that we need this.


----------



## AngelDisney

Maddysdaddy said:


> Before you invest in a Chromebook, you should try to investigate whether the online platform used by your school is D2L. I teach post secondary using that platform and when we went full remote in March, there were significant issues with students trying to use Chromebooks, with most having to go out to purchase a new Windows or Apple computer.


I agree. Some resources used by D2L can’t be accessed using chromebook. I had a student using chromebook having that issue with Brightspace D2L work. We were doing credit recovery for history. I am a math teacher doing student success, so I used board provided resources. For my math classes, I created my own resources and there’s no issue. Yet the D2L ones did. It’s better to research first before buying. I bought a Microsoft laptop for my department instead of a chromebook which is cheaper for that reason in June.


----------



## wdwmom3

Maddysdaddy said:


> Before you invest in a Chromebook, you should try to investigate whether the online platform used by your school is D2L. I teach post secondary using that platform and when we went full remote in March, there were significant issues with students trying to use Chromebooks, with most having to go out to purchase a new Windows or Apple computer.



Our school board actually gives out chrome books to all grade nine students.  They  have been doing this for the last few years.  So we know what they use works fine.  They primarily use google classroom.

I should also add we also have windows based computers at home, that’s what he was doing stuff on before.  But they are shared computers so we also wanted him to have his own.


----------



## mshanson3121

tgropp said:


> One thing that puzzles me is why it can be so transferable through droplets (agreed), then why do they have to shove a swab up to your brain to take a test. I have stopped taking the tests the last four weeks. Some were gentle wit eyes watering and sneezing but the last few were taken in a drive through clinic and they pinned my head against the head rest and kept pushing it in. That was enough for me. Can any nurses fill me in.



I can't answer the question, but I admit I did laugh a bit at your description   I know many places are starting to do throat swabs instead.


----------



## wdwmom3

mshanson3121 said:


> Hand scrubbing is good, but also not all that effective since the primary means of infection is droplets. So the #1 defense that kept you healthy and keeps others healthy, is masks. Which many schools will not be requiring. The second is social distancing, which in the younger years, many schools will also not be requiring within their "bubble" (keeping in mind the bubble could be anywhere from 15-60 kids depending on class size and then how many classes are in the bubble, and that all those kids in the bubble are being exposed to many people outside of school). Temperature checking isn't being proposed here, either.
> 
> The return to school is really a very different scenario than going to eat on a patio or running into Canadian Tire for half an hour, or even your job where you had hand washing, masks and temp checks.
> 
> To me, I think one of the most important things school can do this year is take learning outside as much as possible, then require face shields and/or masks while indoors. Parents could easily start working with their kids now re: wearing them, especially learning not to fidget with them. I'm thinking face shields for teachers and students would be better for K-2, for the purpose of learning to read, social skills learning etc... Not as good as masks, but better than nothing. Then have a hand wash station set up in each K-2 classroom, so kids can wash their hands with soap regularly, since those ages are the slimiest lol. By grade 3/4, most schools have moved past learning to read to reading to learn, so masks would be fine, though I think face shields will always be better for teachers since some kids are always going to rely on seeing what they are hearing. I also think they should be screening everyone (temp check), every day. While temp checks are useless for the asymptomatic cases, even if they catch just a few cases, that could go a long way towards stopping a local outbreak.



Related to the face sheilds.  I read somewhere that Canadian Sheild, a company that started producing shields for healthcare workers at the start of this, is donating hundreds of thousands of face shields for teachers.


----------



## hdrolfe

My parents got kiddo a chromebook for school for Christmas, it's practically indestructible, my dad used his former military status to get a really good deal on one from the US, military grade apparently. Thing is bullet proof. For my little temper tantrum kid who has broken more electronics than I like to think about, this is key. I know they use them in the high school as well, starting in grade 7 kids are asked to bring one. They do have school ones they can use there, and the board uses google accounts for all the kids. It is fairly interesting because my sister's kids both went to the same schools and the older one had to have an iPad, second one started with iPad and then was switched to chromebook. Now kiddo also has his own laptop, my dad got it for him. It won't be going to school though, at last not until high school maybe. The chromebook should suffice. They use google docs and such, instead of the microsoft suite. I do need to get him a mouse for it though, he prefers that now after using his laptop. 

I hope they get at least a few weeks in class room before we shut down again, simply to get him some exercise and outside time with friends. If we end up back at home, I'll have to decide what to do. The learning they offered in the spring was not good. I'm sure that varied by class and school, but for him it was impossible. At that point I may have to look into some other version of homeschooling. I am sure it will happen, I fully expect a second wave to shut us back down to stage 1 or whatever, but hopefully I'm a little more prepared for it this time.


----------



## Maddysdaddy

Makes sense that google chromebooks would work with google classroom...

For others whose children are on D2L - or who may not know what platform their school may use - just know that there are potential compatibility issues with chromebooks.  I realize that for the most part, chromebook are the more economical choice, but not if you have to end up purchasing a second computer because your kids can’t access parts of their courses.


----------



## wdwmom3

Maddysdaddy said:


> Makes sense that google chromebooks would work with google classroom...
> 
> For others whose children are on D2L - or who may not know what platform their school may use - just know that there are potential compatibility issues with chromebooks.  I realize that for the most part, chromebook are the more economical choice, but not if you have to end up purchasing a second computer because your kids can’t access parts of their courses.



I agree with this! If we didn’t also already have other computers at home we would be buying a regular laptop.  There are some inexpensive options out there.


----------



## pigletto

My 16yr old has a Chromebook and I just asked him if they use D2L or Google Classroom . He said that it depends on the teacher and that  they use both , but more often D2L . He also said that he’s never run into anything on D2L that wouldn’t work on his Chromebook. I don’t doubt that there are some issues but he’s never run into any . 
I’ll be buying him a really good laptop for a grad gift when he goes to University in two years. I think for this year he will be fine with our PC and his Chromebook . My husband builds computers for a hobby so I’m sure he’d love a reason to do another build but I don’t think we need to spend the money .


----------



## bababear_50

Now now Pigletto it would give hubby a little side project,,,lol,,hugs to you.

My son asked as a parent what would you do mom..

Well my guys are all adults but if this happened when they were younger,,,,,,,
1. stock the wine cabinet,,keep in mind I have 3 boys!!!

2. find the best neighbour kid friend family and approach the parents about
forming a small 2 family POD. (Parents Of Desperados),,lol
:share that my kids have all their immunizations and will be getting a Flu shot
: share that we have a family doctor and who that is
:share a mutually agreed upon daily play timetable (Maybe 3 --45 minute outdoor)
: Decide if indoor basement get togethers are agreeable
: Clean the garage out and use it as a clubhouse
: Be in firm agreement that all online work comes before play.
: Review rules with both parties including kids.

I'd also
: invest in a printer
: scrappy paper/pencils
: have designated school work area in the house.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## FigmentSpark

My son was using D2L on a Windows computer and he had troubles.  He was using the Chrome browser, so maybe that was it.  He actually signed in one day, did a whole math test and thought he was done.  It had never transmitted his login to the teacher.  She had no record of it.  Yet, the software administered the test.  I heard from my older son that some of his friends had issues with D2L, as well.

So, in our house, we're hoping for Google classroom.  It's not as 'organized' as D2L, but I don't want to have to wonder if the teacher actually got the work submitted.  Google classroom seemed better.  But again, that's just our anecdotal experience.  Whatever they choose, just make sure it works and the kids and teachers are trained on how to use it.


----------



## pigletto

bababear_50 said:


> Now now Pigletto it would give hubby a little side project,,,lol,,hugs to you.
> 
> My son asked as a parent what would you do mom..
> 
> Well my guys are all adults but if this happened when they were younger,,,,,,,
> 1. stock the wine cabinet,,keep in mind I have 3 boys!!!
> 
> 2. find the best neighbour kid friend family and approach the parents about
> forming a small 2 family POD. (Parents Of Desperados),,lol
> :share that my kids have all their immunizations and will be getting a Flu shot
> : share that we have a family doctor and who that is
> :share a mutually agreed upon daily play timetable (Maybe 3 --45 minute outdoor)
> : Decide if indoor basement get togethers are agreeable
> : Clean the garage out and use it as a clubhouse
> : Be in firm agreement that all online work comes before play.
> : Review rules with both parties including kids.
> 
> I'd also
> : invest in a printer
> : scrappy paper/pencils
> : have designated school work area in the house.
> 
> Hugs
> Mel


I laughed because you should have seen my husbands face light up when I said ds16 might need a new laptop . 
I love your suggestions Mel . We are still going back and forth but we think online school will be the winner for ds this semester. Our biggest concern is ds having contact / interactions with friends. He’s not a very social guy to begin with and is more than content to spend all his time at home . I just don’t know that it’s healthy to go almost a year without any friend activity . I think that I will encourage them to hang out at our house . The way I see it , they can wear masks / socially distance with one or two other kids in my home and it’s a lot less risky than sending him to the high school every day . I know there are a lot of kids who need to go in person for a variety of reasons , but if I can just solve this isolation issue for ds , we could happily be one of the families that opts out .


----------



## bababear_50

pigletto said:


> I laughed because you should have seen my husbands face light up when I said ds16 might need a new laptop .
> I love your suggestions Mel . We are still going back and forth but we think online school will be the winner for ds this semester. Our biggest concern is ds having contact / interactions with friends. He’s not a very social guy to begin with and is more than content to spend all his time at home . I just don’t know that it’s healthy to go almost a year without any friend activity . I think that I will encourage them to hang out at our house . The way I see it , they can wear masks / socially distance with one or two other kids in my home and it’s a lot less risky than sending him to the high school every day . I know there are a lot of kids who need to go in person for a variety of reasons , but if I can just solve this isolation issue for ds , we could happily be one of the families that opts out .




Hi Hon
I have a very quiet/shy son,,middle one, 32 yrs old,,and yeah I even worry about him being kind of isolated. He is best friends with his younger brother , who doesn't live at home with us (yeah they can gang up on me at times). They do see each other 1-2 times a week and it seems enough,,but as a mom you always worry. Kids /Adults do so much social connection via online stuff nowadays though.
Lots to think and consider eh?
Hugs to you
Mel


----------



## pigletto

bababear_50 said:


> Hi Hon
> I have a very quiet/shy son,,middle one, 32 yrs old,,and yeah I even worry about him being kind of isolated. He is best friends with his younger brother , who doesn't live at home with us (yeah they can gang up on me at times). They do see each other 1-2 times a week and it seems enough,,but as a mom you always worry. Kids /Adults do so much social connection via online stuff nowadays though.
> Lots to think and consider eh?
> Hugs to you
> Mel


Thanks Mel , 
It’s hard to not try to fix things for them , even when they aren’t worried about it isn’t it ? And you are so right . I spent a lot more time in person with my friends at his age but they are all connected with social media and play online together now . And my son says it’s draining to be in a pack of teens all the time since it’s so loud . He’s more of a one on one kind of kid . He’s happy and kind and doing fine so I just need to not overthink it too much .


----------



## Best_Vacation_EVER!

tgropp said:


> Just out of curiosity, how many people have gone to restaurants and especially Walmart since the epidemic?


Only take-out from restaurants... no dining-in -- most places have pretty tight social distancing for take-out.    Have done the grocery order from walmart but not gone in the store....   Just realized this might be somewhat later to answer --- it's been a busy few days....


----------



## Iralyn

FigmentSpark said:


> People, in the before-times, if the class sizes were low, they made a split class with another grade.  Be careful hoping for people to withdraw or do remote, because the board may just end up filling up fewer classes with split grades.  That would be hard to manage, but if they are required to keep "full" classes, it could happen.



If a family chooses remote 'for now', then they will need to keep a classroom spot for them.  But if families actually withdraw from school to homeschool so that they do not have to follow the school distance education program, then that could cause reorganization.  I know in the U.S. some public school advocates were strongly encouraging parents to not formally withdraw their child from school because of the impact on school funding.


----------



## quandrea

Iralyn said:


> If a family chooses remote 'for now', then they will need to keep a classroom spot for them.  But if families actually withdraw from school to homeschool so that they do not have to follow the school distance education program, then that could cause reorganization.  I know in the U.S. some public school advocates were strongly encouraging parents to not formally withdraw their child from school because of the impact on school funding.


We formally withdrew our daughter. She homeschooled all through elementary. 9 and 10 were bricks and mortar—we thought it would be good for her. But, in fact it was a waste. She’s been much happier with online, but with the school board’s plan we just couldn’t stay. First and foremost, we want a stable year. I know her funding follows her, but she is my first priority, not the school’s funding.  She’ll get that with homeschool. I think it’s going to be another roller coaster year. Probably can’t be helped, given the circumstances. No one’s fault, really.


----------



## bcwife76

tgropp said:


> Just out of curiosity, how many people have gone to restaurants and especially Walmart since the epidemic?


So far, eaten at four restaurants since end of May (once on a patio, other three times inside) and while I haven't been to Walmart since January (I avoid that place like the plague), we've been to Home Depot numerous times, IKEA once, our local shopping malls a couple of times etc.


----------



## pixie_mtl

tgropp said:


> Just out of curiosity, how many people have gone to restaurants and especially Walmart since the epidemic?



I've been to Walmart once at opening hours. And a few times ate at restaurants; lunch on a patio and breakfast inside.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

I just wanted to weigh in on the nasal swab thing. When I got tested, they scraped the heck out of my throat and only rimmed my nostrils, no nasal cavity action.  My nurse friend said that she got the full nasal cavity swab though.  Her thoughts are that most people won't get tested due to how uncomfortable it is, so they have two tests.  

On the school front, DD is starting grade 7 (Junior High here in NS) and I really hope they get at least until December in before the second wave.  DD is in French Immersion, but we don't speak French at home. I know French from my school days in grades 2-12. After this past year, my French comprehension has really come back, that's for sure! LOL

The school is emailing the supply lists out this week.  Sucks that the kids won't be able to use lockers though. That should be interesting considering they will have to lug around their winter jackets, wet boots, tons of books, etc.


----------



## FigmentSpark

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> I just wanted to weigh in on the nasal swab thing. When I got tested, they scraped the heck out of my throat and only rimmed my nostrils, no nasal cavity action.  My nurse friend said that she got the full nasal cavity swab though.  Her thoughts are that most people won't get tested due to how uncomfortable it is, so they have two tests.
> 
> On the school front, DD is starting grade 7 (Junior High here in NS) and I really hope they get at least until December in before the second wave.  DD is in French Immersion, but we don't speak French at home. I know French from my school days in grades 2-12. After this past year, my French comprehension has really come back, that's for sure! LOL
> 
> The school is emailing the supply lists out this week.  Sucks that the kids won't be able to use lockers though. That should be interesting considering they will have to lug around their winter jackets, wet boots, tons of books, etc.


Boots will probably go in the hallway and coats on the back of their chairs.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

FigmentSpark said:


> Boots will probably go in the hallway and coats on the back of their chairs.



If my mind serves to remind me, her school's hallways (if it's still like it was when I went there) doesn't have spaces for coats and boots in the hallways anymore. Those were removed when the lockers came in (my grade 9 year LOL).  They also change classrooms for each course, but stay as a single class.  Unlike high school where you would be with varying students in different classrooms.


----------



## hdrolfe

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> If my mind serves to remind me, her school's hallways (if it's still like it was when I went there) doesn't have spaces for coats and boots in the hallways anymore. Those were removed when the lockers came in (my grade 9 year LOL).  They also change classrooms for each course, but stay as a single class.  Unlike high school where you would be with varying students in different classrooms.



Has your school or board released any details yet? I'd wait until they do, but I suspect the teachers will move, not the students.

My son's board said their "stuff" would stay with them but they will review when the weather gets colder. I guess that will also depend on if we have a second/third/whatever wave happening and have to stay home (I'd rather stay home during the winter since I'm kind of bear like and want to hibernate, if I can't be travelling some place warmer). And also on how many kids end up getting sent to school.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

hdrolfe said:


> Has your school or board released any details yet? I'd wait until they do, but I suspect the teachers will move, not the students.
> 
> My son's board said their "stuff" would stay with them but they will review when the weather gets colder. I guess that will also depend on if we have a second/third/whatever wave happening and have to stay home (I'd rather stay home during the winter since I'm kind of bear like and want to hibernate, if I can't be travelling some place warmer). And also on how many kids end up getting sent to school.



So far the plan for September is everyone is back in class 100%. If there is an outbreak then the sister/family of schools would be targeted for closure, not the entire school system, which makes sense. High school students need to wear masks in the hallways, etc but not in class. This made me think of the Junior Highs that also change classes.  But I would agree with you @hdrolfe that the teachers could move to the class instead.  Each teacher would have to wipe down the desk, whiteboard and accessories, etc.

I had DD out shopping for some fall clothes and man, I forgot how expensive everything is now!


----------



## Cdn Gal

As far as I know, I will still have 25 kids in my class, and there is absolutely no way that with the class size, students will be able to stay 1m or 3ft apart.  There just isn't the room in the class, even if we are all spread out.  I would have liked to see smaller class sizes so kids are not on top of each other.  My class could potentially go up to 30, like the kindergarten classes, and there is nothing to stop it.


----------



## hdrolfe

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> So far the plan for September is everyone is back in class 100%. If there is an outbreak then the sister/family of schools would be targeted for closure, not the entire school system, which makes sense. High school students need to wear masks in the hallways, etc but not in class. This made me think of the Junior Highs that also change classes.  But I would agree with you @hdrolfe that the teachers could move to the class instead.  Each teacher would have to wipe down the desk, whiteboard and accessories, etc.
> 
> I had DD out shopping for some fall clothes and man, I forgot how expensive everything is now!



The province (Ontario) gave it's recommendations but the school boards still provide their details on how they will implement the plan. At least mine is. I have really only been watching closely for details on my son't grade though. I am hoping the school will provide even more details than the school board does. I am sure they will but I was hoping to get that before school is due to start.

It feels like September is going to be here really soon.

And thanks for the reminder that he'll need new pants for winter and boots, and shoes... ugh!


----------



## Madame

Cdn Gal said:


> As far as I know, I will still have 25 kids in my class, and there is absolutely no way that with the class size, students will be able to stay 1m or 3ft apart.  There just isn't the room in the class, even if we are all spread out.  I would have liked to see smaller class sizes so kids are not on top of each other.  My class could potentially go up to 30, like the kindergarten classes, and there is nothing to stop it.


Teachers have choices too, even if it plays into the government’s privatization.  At this point, having a say & not just being forced  into an unsafe situation is important for our own mental & physical health.  My boys had 33 kids in their gr 5 class last year.  Completely the norm here.  Here are 2 that I am looking at & both pay well......

https://www.niteo.ca/teaching-a-pod


----------



## mshanson3121

Madame said:


> Teachers have choices too, even if it plays into the government’s privatization.  At this point, having a say & not just being forced  into an unsafe situation is important for our own mental & physical health.  My boys had 33 kids in their gr 5 class last year.  Completely the norm here.  Here are 2 that I am looking at & both pay well......
> 
> https://www.niteo.ca/teaching-a-pod
> View attachment 515649



I wonder how Covid may play out re: more private schools coming about, the return of smaller, one room schools (whether run as a private school for pay, or a free community school run by parents) etc...


----------



## Cdn Gal

I don't want to lose seniority of 21 years and teach privately for a year.  Losing my job and taking another is not really an option for my family.  There are options for teachers to teach remotely, but I don't want to take the place of somebody like a colleague of mine who just finished cancer treatments.  People like that should get first crack at doing an online teaching job before me.  Unless parents get upset and call their politicians then classes in the elementary level will be high.  There will be 30 kids in kindergarten, in grades 4+ there will be 24-30+ students in a class.  The last 10 years I have had class between 28-32 students a year.  That's just the norm.  I just hope that something will change in the upcoming weeks and they will reduce the sizes to 15 per class.


----------



## Madame

Cdn Gal said:


> I don't want to lose seniority of 21 years and teach privately for a year.  Losing my job and taking another is not really an option for my family.  There are options for teachers to teach remotely, but I don't want to take the place of somebody like a colleague of mine who just finished cancer treatments.  People like that should get first crack at doing an online teaching job before me.  Unless parents get upset and call their politicians then classes in the elementary level will be high.  There will be 30 kids in kindergarten, in grades 4+ there will be 24-30+ students in a class.  The last 10 years I have had class between 28-32 students a year.  That's just the norm.  I just hope that something will change in the upcoming weeks and they will reduce the sizes to 15 per class.


I have similar seniority.  You can request a non paid leave & work with a private group.  Parents hoping others keeping their kids home will result in lower class numbers are going to get a shock when the classes are folded in order to save money.  No one will advocate for you but you.  I view it like a mat leave, but instead of collecting EI, I’ll be teaching online.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

My nephew and DD are very close, like, brother-sister vs cousins close.  My sister and I are going to ask the principal if they can be placed in the same class so that IF there is an outbreak they can still bubble together outside of school. 
DD goes to their house for lunch and after school, so it only makes sense. Hopefully the principal thinks so too.


----------



## Madame

@FigmentSpark was it your son at the UoW this year?  Just wanted to update.  We are still phase 2 (political pressure from dying businesses pushed us out of phase 1, not declining numbers).  Elementary schools will operate as normal (even though we aren’t in phase 3 I guess).

There has been another outbreak at a greenhouse operation (these are not really farms but massive greenhouse “factories” that sit within walking/biking distance from the centre of our towns for the workers).

We had an outbreak in one LTC facility in my town earlier in the pandemic & just yesterday DH got the call that his uncle (his main father figure) has “pneumonia” in the LTC facility literally 4 minutes by foot from our house.  He’s not expected to survive the week - he has diabetes and severe dementia.  We had noticed a weird excess of cars in the last 2 weeks there.  I feel like I’m living in Florida  - I guess they think we’re naïve enough to believe pneumonia in Aug is a totally normal thing.  None of this seems to be common knowledge (i.e. it doesn’t seem to be in the news that I’ve seen).  Just a heads up.


----------



## mort1331

So both my girls are in french immer, No chance at home schooling there. Neither my wife or I speak a lick of it. And I would say that is the same for 80% of the school. Plus close to 80% are bused in from all over. That is the bigger concern for me the busing. They have asked us to commit to the busing or not. Now we will probably say yes, but for 3 out of 5 days we will drive them since our work schedules allow us. The school has said if we say no to busing then we can not opt in again till Jan. Well I hate taking a space away from kids on half the days, we have no choice.


----------



## bababear_50

mort1331 said:


> So both my girls are in french immer, No chance at home schooling there. Neither my wife or I speak a lick of it. And I would say that is the same for 80% of the school. Plus close to 80% are bused in from all over. That is the bigger concern for me the busing. They have asked us to commit to the busing or not. Now we will probably say yes, but for 3 out of 5 days we will drive them since our work schedules allow us. The school has said if we say no to busing then we can not opt in again till Jan. Well I hate taking a space away from kids on half the days, we have no choice.



Hi Hon
Yes driving them in when you can is a much better idea than busing at this point.
Just make sure they sit together on that bus.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## FigmentSpark

Madame said:


> @FigmentSpark was it your son at the UoW this year?  Just wanted to update.  We are still phase 2 (political pressure from dying businesses pushed us out of phase 1, not declining numbers).  Elementary schools will operate as normal (even though we aren’t in phase 3 I guess).
> 
> There has been another outbreak at a greenhouse operation (these are not really farms but massive greenhouse “factories” that sit within walking/biking distance from the centre of our towns for the workers).
> 
> We had an outbreak in one LTC facility in my town earlier in the pandemic & just yesterday DH got the call that his uncle (his main father figure) has “pneumonia” in the LTC facility literally 4 minutes by foot from our house.  He’s not expected to survive the week - he has diabetes and severe dementia.  We had noticed a weird excess of cars in the last 2 weeks there.  I feel like I’m living in Florida  - I guess they think we’re naïve enough to believe pneumonia in Aug is a totally normal thing.  None of this seems to be common knowledge (i.e. it doesn’t seem to be in the news that I’ve seen).  Just a heads up.


It has me worried, for sure.  Thanks for the heads up. DS is hoping to be on campus in the fall.  We decided to get him a room so he’d have one for the winter session, but I was hoping he’d just take the room and stay at home in the fall session.  

i hope your DH’s uncle will be okay.


----------



## bababear_50

Madame said:


> @FigmentSpark was it your son at the UoW this year?  Just wanted to update.  We are still phase 2 (political pressure from dying businesses pushed us out of phase 1, not declining numbers).  Elementary schools will operate as normal (even though we aren’t in phase 3 I guess).
> 
> There has been another outbreak at a greenhouse operation (these are not really farms but massive greenhouse “factories” that sit within walking/biking distance from the centre of our towns for the workers).
> 
> We had an outbreak in one LTC facility in my town earlier in the pandemic & just yesterday DH got the call that his uncle (his main father figure) has “pneumonia” in the LTC facility literally 4 minutes by foot from our house.  He’s not expected to survive the week - he has diabetes and severe dementia.  We had noticed a weird excess of cars in the last 2 weeks there.  I feel like I’m living in Florida  - I guess they think we’re naïve enough to believe pneumonia in Aug is a totally normal thing.  None of this seems to be common knowledge (i.e. it doesn’t seem to be in the news that I’ve seen).  Just a heads up.



So so so sorry Hon,,
My thoughts and prayers are with you,DH and family.

In my opinion no school should be opening if not in Phase #3.
I'm not even sure about Phase #1 or Phase #2.
Is reality that this is ..........................................
*Back To School* ?
OR
*Back To Work* ?

Hugs
Mel


----------



## Madame

bababear_50 said:


> So so so sorry Hon,,
> My thoughts and prayers are with you,DH and family.
> 
> In my opinion no school should be opening if not in Phase #3.
> I'm not even sure about Phase #1 or Phase #2.
> Is reality that this is ..........................................
> *Back To School* ?
> OR
> *Back To Work* ?
> 
> Hugs
> Mel


Thank-you.  I feel so bad right now.  DH’s uncle and his aunt were teachers.  His aunt has made the decision not to go see him (no one has been allowed in in months) - they would have to mask him up and get him outside somehow and she’s a super sweet lady and doesn’t want the staff there to be at any more risk than necessary.  

He’s probably going to die without family there, but he wouldn’t recognize any of us anyway.  Jesus I wish we could just go back to normal.


----------



## vegs1

Madame said:


> Thank-you.  I feel so bad right now.  DH’s uncle and his aunt were teachers.  His aunt has made the decision not to go see him (no one has been allowed in in months) - they would have to mask him up and get him outside somehow and she’s a super sweet lady and doesn’t want the staff there to be at any more risk than necessary.
> 
> He’s probably going to die without family there, but he wouldn’t recognize any of us anyway.  Jesus I wish we could just go back to normal.



So sorry about your uncle. It’s so hard on families in long term care.  

Why are visits not allowed?    In June, outdoor visits in Ontario long term care homes started back up  and in July, you could visit indoors as long as you had tested negative for the virus within the prior two weeks. This was put out by the Ford government.  Just curious if it’s the home saying that.


----------



## vegs1

For those with children heading back to school, will that change your “bubble”?  The bubble of people you can hug?  I know so many grandparents are wondering if they should limit visits with their grandchildren once school goes back.  The kids were in their bubble but will now be seeing so many more people, it changes the parameters.  I was trying to find the FAQ I had read where the health ministers said it was ok to continue that but it doesn’t make sense.


----------



## Madame

vegs1 said:


> So sorry about your uncle. It’s so hard on families in long term care.
> 
> Why are visits not allowed?    In June, outdoor visits in Ontario long term care homes started back up  and in July, you could visit indoors as long as you had tested negative for the virus within the prior two weeks. This was put out by the Ford government.  Just curious if it’s the home saying that.


We have been in phase one until about 2 weeks ago.  The rest of the province might have this under control, but we are not very urban and have had consistently higher numbers than the GTA.  The outbreak in the other LTCH earlier is a sister home, owned by the same company.  The only thing we can figure is they were sharing staff.


----------



## Disneylover99

vegs1 said:


> For those with children heading back to school, will that change your “bubble”?  The bubble of people you can hug?  I know so many grandparents are wondering if they should limit visits with their grandchildren once school goes back.  The kids were in their bubble but will now be seeing so many more people, it changes the parameters.  I was trying to find the FAQ I had read where the health ministers said it was ok to continue that but it doesn’t make sense.


Once I go back to teaching and my kids go back to school next month, we will definitely avoid visiting my dad and mother in law, at least for the first 3 months or so. Then we’ll see what COVID numbers are like, and decide if it would be safe to visit at that point. That makes the most sense to me.


----------



## vegs1

Madame said:


> We have been in phase one until about 2 weeks ago.  The rest of the province might have this under control, but we are not very urban and have had consistently higher numbers than the GTA.  The outbreak in the other LTCH earlier is a sister home, owned by the same company.  The only thing we can figure is they were sharing staff.



Such  a shame since they were told, although not until later on in the pandemic, that they couldn’t share staff.  This pandemic has definitely brought light to the issues in LTC.


----------



## bababear_50

Bubble rejection is what it's called.


My son and daughter in law are in my *Bubble*
and work from home,,their companies are saying at least until next Jan/Feb 2021.

If I go back to the school environment I am out of their *Bubble*.....
I can't imagine Christmas without them???????????????????????????


----------



## vegs1

Disneylover99 said:


> Once I go back to teaching and my kids go back to school next month, we will definitely avoid visiting my dad and mother in law, at least for the first 3 months or so. Then we’ll see what COVID numbers are like, and decide if it would be safe to visit at that point. That makes the most sense to me.



That seems like the wisest thing at this point. That gives time to assess how things are going. It’s so hard to take a step back from hugging our favourite little people.  

I do not envy any of you parents having to make decisions about your children’s schooling during this. It is so difficult for all of you and I can’t even imagine the stress involved.


----------



## wdwmom3

vegs1 said:


> For those with children heading back to school, will that change your “bubble”?  The bubble of people you can hug?  I know so many grandparents are wondering if they should limit visits with their grandchildren once school goes back.  The kids were in their bubble but will now be seeing so many more people, it changes the parameters.  I was trying to find the FAQ I had read where the health ministers said it was ok to continue that but it doesn’t make sense.



The only other people in our bubble are my parents.  Who are in there 80s and at high risk.  Even though we are in the same “bubble” I’m still careful.  No hugging and try to not sit right beside each other, we also maybe only visit with them every couple weeks (was like that before). Part of me was thinking I should avoid seeing them after ds goes back to school but instead I may just cut down a little more on visits and keep just a little more distance.  My parents are basically like my kids who won’t listen and keep going out and doing things even though they are at high risk.  So I kind of gave up on being really careful with them.


----------



## vegs1

bababear_50 said:


> Bubble rejection is what it's called.
> View attachment 515770
> 
> My son and daughter in law are in my *Bubble*
> and work from home,,their companies are saying at least until next Jan/Feb 2021.
> 
> If I go back to the school environment I am out of their *Bubble*.....
> I can't imagine Christmas without them???????????????????????????



I totally understand that.  It’s like we took a step forward to have a bubble and then went a giant leap back.  Ugh!


----------



## Madame

vegs1 said:


> Such  a shame since they were told, although not until later on in the pandemic, that they couldn’t share staff.  This pandemic has definitely brought light to the issues in LTC.


It definitely has.  DH’s uncle’s LTCH is not currently listed as having an outbreak, but the sister LTCH is listed as “ongoing outbreak” on the public health site.  It could just be community spread too.  All of these workers live/shop/etc alongside us so who knows.  I shouldn’t assume, because I am not sure.  It’s a guess I suppose that since there is an ongoing outbreak in one that the did not allow visits in the other.  Maybe the company made that decision.  If so it was wise as the other greenhouse community 5 mins down the road still has one of their LTCHs listed as “outbreak ongoing” too.


----------



## vegs1

wdwmom3 said:


> The only other people in our bubble are my parents.  Who are in there 80s and at high risk.  Even though we are in the same “bubble” I’m still careful.  No hugging and try to not sit right beside each other, we also maybe only visit with them every couple weeks (was like that before). Part of me was thinking I should avoid seeing them after ds goes back to school but instead I may just cut down a little more on visits and keep just a little more distance.  My parents are basically like my kids who won’t listen and keep going out and doing things even though they are at high risk.  So I kind of gave up on being really careful with them.



A friend of ours is in her 80’s and does her own groceries, walks in the park, etc. Won’t let her kids or anyone else help. When we tell her the risks, she keeps saying she is getting old and wants to live what life she has but will be careful. She won’t change her mind.  

It is hard with family to not see each other so if you can at least distance, you’re lucky.


----------



## wdwmom3

vegs1 said:


> A friend of ours is in her 80’s and does her own groceries, walks in the park, etc. Won’t let her kids or anyone else help. When we tell her the risks, she keeps saying she is getting old and wants to live what life she has but will be careful. She won’t change her mind.
> 
> It is hard with family to not see each other so if you can at least distance, you’re lucky.



Yeah when all this started we were getting their groceries and would leave them at the door for them, picking up prescriptions etc. But I suspected they may still be going places. Which they were. So they just said we will get our groceries, and started going in the store not doing pickup (which we do), they went for haircuts as soon as they could, go shopping everywhere multiple times a week cause they “want to get out”.

So I gave up and figured they are probably more a risk to us lol.


----------



## mshanson3121

mort1331 said:


> So both my girls are in french immer, No chance at home schooling there. Neither my wife or I speak a lick of it. And I would say that is the same for 80% of the school. Plus close to 80% are bused in from all over. That is the bigger concern for me the busing. They have asked us to commit to the busing or not. Now we will probably say yes, but for 3 out of 5 days we will drive them since our work schedules allow us. The school has said if we say no to busing then we can not opt in again till Jan. Well I hate taking a space away from kids on half the days, we have no choice.



If you were considering homeschooling otherwise, don't count it out because of French. There are excellent French curriulum options out there, taught online/via computer, that do not require you to have any French knowledge


----------



## mshanson3121

vegs1 said:


> So sorry about your uncle. It’s so hard on families in long term care.
> 
> Why are visits not allowed?    In June, outdoor visits in Ontario long term care homes started back up  and in July, you could visit indoors as long as you had tested negative for the virus within the prior two weeks. This was put out by the Ford government.  Just curious if it’s the home saying that.



It's up to each individual home, what they are comfortable with. The care home that my sister lives in is still not accepting visitors. One person only (not one at a time, but only one person approved), masked, gowned and gloves, and you can only visit through a screened window.


----------



## pigletto

If my son goes back, then we will take ourselves out of the grandparent bubble. They are all over 65 and it’s not worth the risk in the least. Being able to still visit grandmas and grandpas is another bonus to not returning. But that will also depend on what the community looks like and what my nieces and nephews are doing. My parents won’t be doing in person visits with the kids that are going back to school ( and my mother is PHD health professional if that tells you anything ), but I’m not sure about my inlaws. So we will see.

The  kids who return to school are also going to be in the community at stores and restaurants etc , so we will see more community spread as the virus hasn’t disappeared all of a sudden. So I really have to rethink my bubble strategy whether my child is  in school or not. I don’t feel like I can wait to start seeing community numbers start climbing to determine it’s no longer safe to have indoor visits.

I am so sick of all of this.


----------



## mshanson3121

vegs1 said:


> For those with children heading back to school, will that change your “bubble”?  The bubble of people you can hug?  I know so many grandparents are wondering if they should limit visits with their grandchildren once school goes back.  The kids were in their bubble but will now be seeing so many more people, it changes the parameters.  I was trying to find the FAQ I had read where the health ministers said it was ok to continue that but it doesn’t make sense.



We homeschool, so perhaps moot. But, that said, they are involved in activities, that would increase their exposure. *If* (huge if right now) we pursue those, then we will limit our contact with grandparents, especially their great-grandmother and their grandfather, both of whom are in poor health. However, we ourselves are a higher risk family, so, we fully planned to limit our contact with everybody come cold/flu season (starts around November here normally), anyways. That all said, after what we personally went through this spring, there is no way in you-know-where, we will ever fully stop visits again, regardless of what the government decrees. Life is too short, and your loved ones can be taken from you in a second.  I will not allow Covid to steal any more time from me. So for us, that will mean no overnight visits, no family dinners. However, we will still visit with grandparents, but socially distanced, with masks, outdoors as much as possible, that might even just mean visiting through an open door or window, and no visiting at all, if anyone has had any symptoms.


----------



## mort1331

bababear_50 said:


> Hi Hon
> Yes driving them in when you can is a much better idea than busing at this point.
> Just make sure they sit together on that bus.
> 
> Hugs
> Mel



They have told us that it is seperate and assigned seating, only same households with be sitting together. Not sure how this will happen as the bus was full before this.




mshanson3121 said:


> If you were considering homeschooling otherwise, don't count it out because of French. There are excellent French curriulum options out there, taught online/via computer, that do not require you to have any French knowledge


No we both work anyways, I have been working straight thru as cant let things pile up at work here..
The french program where we are is 100% french for our youngest, and oldest in grade 8 is math and english in english, everything else french.


----------



## mshanson3121

mort1331 said:


> The french program where we are is 100% french for our youngest, and oldest in grade 8 is math and english in english, everything else french.



Sounds similar to here. Though they can't ever make up their mind on what they're doing in the elementary years for immersion. So it changes every couple/few years, LOL.


----------



## bababear_50

Day to celebrate..
I have been in contact with one of my students since March,,,he got sort of stuck in India.....medically fragile....bright, brillant,  charming, cute as a button and  just a great kind kid!! (grade 3).
Today he emailed that they are finally coming home to Canada Aug 11th....so so relieved and happy!
Sorry just had to share!
I emailed the mom to let her know we are more than willing to pick up pharmacy /groceries needs and to have a safe trip home.
sorry just had to share something HAPPY!
Just very excited here!
Hugs
Mel


----------



## Madame

bababear_50 said:


> Day to celebrate..
> I have been in contact with one of my students since March,,,he got sort of stuck in India.....medically fragile....bright, brillant,  charming, cute as a button and  just a great kind kid!! (grade 3).
> Today he emailed that they are finally coming home to Canada Aug 11th....so so relieved and happy!
> Sorry just had to share!
> I emailed the mom to let her know we are more than willing to pick up pharmacy /groceries needs and to have a safe trip home.
> sorry just had to share something HAPPY!
> Just very excited here!
> Hugs
> Mel


Great news!  Lots of Canadians got stuck in Asia!  I had no idea some were still trying to get home!!


----------



## vegs1

pigletto said:


> I am so sick of all of this.



Me, too!  I keep thinking, it’s just a while longer. However, because there is no true end date, it’s hard to see it.  I just want to hug my grandkids. But I don’t want to get sick. Same with all my friends. I may have to buy a one piece suit with full face mask so I can continue.


----------



## hdrolfe

vegs1 said:


> For those with children heading back to school, will that change your “bubble”?  The bubble of people you can hug?  I know so many grandparents are wondering if they should limit visits with their grandchildren once school goes back.  The kids were in their bubble but will now be seeing so many more people, it changes the parameters.  I was trying to find the FAQ I had read where the health ministers said it was ok to continue that but it doesn’t make sense.



We really only added my parents to our bubble, everyone else we see at a distance if at all. I hope we will still be able to see them, it is such a great break for both of us. The first few months of this when it was just my kiddo and I, well it was not easy! Don't get me wrong, I love my kid and spending time with him, but this was stressful on so many levels, I was still working from home, he was trying to figure out what he was allowed to do or not. As soon as we were allowed, he spent one night with my parents. It was just enough to keep us going. I think it will be different if he is able to be in school, we'll both be busy during that time of course (I still have to work) but we won't be all up in each other's faces all the time. I am not sure what the rules will be by Thanksgiving, but even if we can't all get together as a big family, we will do as we did at Easter and facetime. Christmas will be hard. Kiddo's birthday falls in there as well. Heck, even Remembrance Day, I normally go up to the school for the assembly, but I am sure that won't be held this year.

In the meantime, I hope he will spend another few sleepovers there before school starts, just in case we can't afterwards. After our hospital trip two weeks ago I was waiting until the two weeks were up. While I'm pretty sure we weren't exposed to anything there, it is the hospital so who knows what everyone was in for.


----------



## Debbie

Madame said:


> We had an outbreak in one LTC facility in my town earlier in the pandemic & just yesterday DH got the call that his uncle (his main father figure) has “pneumonia” in the LTC facility literally 4 minutes by foot from our house.  He’s not expected to survive the week - he has diabetes and severe dementia.  We had noticed a weird excess of cars in the last 2 weeks there.  I feel like I’m living in Florida  - I guess they think we’re naïve enough to believe pneumonia in Aug is a totally normal thing.  None of this seems to be common knowledge (i.e. it doesn’t seem to be in the news that I’ve seen).  Just a heads up.


I'm so sorry that you and your family are going through all this. (((hugs)))



vegs1 said:


> For those with children heading back to school, will that change your “bubble”?  The bubble of people you can hug?  I know so many grandparents are wondering if they should limit visits with their grandchildren once school goes back.  The kids were in their bubble but will now be seeing so many more people, it changes the parameters.  I was trying to find the FAQ I had read where the health ministers said it was ok to continue that but it doesn’t make sense.


I mentioned that to my daughter-in-law. She teaches kindergarten so is at a bigger risk than high school-high numbers, wee ones can not nor will not social distance, and her mom and dad are at risk. And then it occurred to me, that we, being 66 and 70, are vulnerable as well. I am sooooo sad that we won't get to hug that little boy. 


bababear_50 said:


> Bubble rejection is what it's called.
> View attachment 515770
> 
> My son and daughter in law are in my *Bubble*
> and work from home,,their companies are saying at least until next Jan/Feb 2021.
> If I go back to the school environment I am out of their *Bubble*.....
> I can't imagine Christmas without them???????????????????????????


I know, Mel, it sucks! And our big family Christmas, too.  This was the year that we'd get to have the 4 year old for Christmas. 4 at Christmas is the best.  


mort1331 said:


> They have told us that it is separate and assigned seating, only same households with be sitting together. Not sure how this will happen as the bus was full before this.


Parents have to register for busing. When it is full, it is full. I hope that message has gotten through to the parents. 
Like everyone else, I am tired of this, but I won't give in or give up. I'll do what it takes to be safe, and keep others safe. My sister says school will last 7 baseball games. I am praying that all goes well.


----------



## Madame




----------



## wdwmom3

Madame said:


> View attachment 515796




Are other school board really that bad? My kids have never been in a class in elementary school with more then 25 kids.  I found this info from our board from the 2017-2018 year. And I only hear of the odd larger class size once they hit grades 7-8. But never more then 30.


----------



## wdwmom3

Delete duplicate


----------



## wdwmom3

Just heard on the news that Alberta will be requiring masks.  I thing grade 4 and up but I’m not sure.  

Oh and there is a petition in Ontario regarding class sizes.  Don’t think cause of other stuff I’ve posted that I don’t want smaller class sizes, I do.  It would make me feel a lot better.  Just it seems like my sons school doesn’t have the issues with large classes like others are talking about.  So his class would be more likely to be in the low 20s anyway.  But 15-20 max would be better for everyone.


----------



## pigletto

Yes, our school board regularly sees those numbers. My son was never in a class in elementary with less than 25 kids . Our JK/SK classes are blended and over 30 children,


----------



## Silvermist999

wdwmom3 said:


> Are other school board really that bad? My kids have never been in a class in elementary school with more then 25 kids.  I found this info from our board from the 2017-2018 year. And I only hear of the odd larger class size once they hit grades 7-8. But never more then 30.
> 
> View attachment 515805


I know my kids have been lucky to have relatively small class sizes all throughout elementary school.  I don’t think they have ever been in a class larger than 23-24 even in kindergarten.  My youngest just graduated from grade 8, with 22 kids in his class.  There were 5 grade 8 classes at his school.

PS. Our school board shows the same stats for 2017-18, we might belong to the same school board.


----------



## Debbie

wdwmom3 said:


> Are other school board really that bad? My kids have never been in a class in elementary school with more then 25 kids.  I found this info from our board from the 2017-2018 year. And I only hear of the odd larger class size once they hit grades 7-8. But never more then 30.
> 
> View attachment 515805


Yes, sadly, it is true. You're very fortunate that your school doesn't have the numbers in the photo above. FDK of 30, 31 kids are not uncommon. The numbers are sent to the Ministry September 30th and then the caps don't matter anymore. Grades 4-8 have taken the brunt of lowered class sizes in primary and high school, like they don't matter, and, as Lecce (aka the Leech), likes to tout FDK has TWO educators. Yeah that's just two more bodies. 3-5 year olds do not social distance.


----------



## wdwmom3

pigletto said:


> Yes, our school board regularly sees those numbers. My son was never in a class in elementary with less than 25 kids . Our JK/SK classes are blended and over 30 children,



Maybe it’s because our area has multiple elementary schools but not a huge population of families (it’s a mix).  One year my son had 18 in his class.  Last year it was 21

Actually thinking about it.  My daughter was in an weird situation where there weren’t many kids in her year.  Her grade 6 class only had 16 kids.  Because it was the final year at that school they didn’t want to mix grades.


----------



## hdrolfe

wdwmom3 said:


> Just heard on the news that Alberta will be requiring masks.  I thing grade 4 and up but I’m not sure.
> 
> Oh and there is a petition in Ontario regarding class sizes.  Don’t think cause of other stuff I’ve posted that I don’t want smaller class sizes, I do.  It would make me feel a lot better.  Just it seems like my sons school doesn’t have the issues with large classes like others are talking about.  So his class would be more likely to be in the low 20s anyway.  But 15-20 max would be better for everyone.



My son't classes have been the same. Except when full day kinder started, his class was about 30 kids then, a mix of JK & SK, with a teacher and an ECE. Since then though his classes have all bee less than 20 except last year it was 23. I expect it will be similar or smaller this year as well. I am not sure what it will be like when he goes to grade 7 in the high school next year, as they combine so many elementary schools. It is odd though, his grade is much smaller than the grade above and below him, it's like there were just many fewer kids born that year. But the classes above and below simply have more classes. His grade has been 2 classes, more kids have joined the school as the area has some new builds and such going in. I would be happy with smaller classes as well. It's funny too, there are a few empty classrooms in his school. They added on two new kinder classrooms to the school (not portables) when the full days rolled out and one of them was used as part of the daycare for the first two years before they needed it. Down in the portapack (which is attached to the school but not air conditioned) they have at least 3 empty rooms, two were used by the daycare for before/after care. He was actually quite lucky, they used to have the grade 5/6 kids down there but last year they moved them into the a/c part of the school and put the littles down there because "they are better able to handle the heat". Any way. They could easily add 5 or 6 classes and have the space for them if they have the money for the teachers. The catchment area is smaller I guess, there are so many catholic elementary schools in this area.


----------



## bankr63

bababear_50 said:


> Hi Hon
> You will need time to exit ,,even if it's to your car and take a break away,,walk around the block.
> Remember your health and well being is important so that you can be strong to support the kids.
> It is not going to be easy,,talk to your co workers and lean on them for support.
> 
> Hugs to you
> Mel


This probably won't be possible in the primary grades.  The teacher is supposed to be cohorted with the class throughout the day, and students MUST be supervised at all times.  You can't have others coming into the classroom randomly to spell off the teacher; that becomes a cross-infection route.  I assume bathroom breaks for teachers will even pose a challenge.


----------



## bankr63

vegs1 said:


> For those with children heading back to school, will that change your “bubble”?  The bubble of people you can hug?  I know so many grandparents are wondering if they should limit visits with their grandchildren once school goes back.  The kids were in their bubble but will now be seeing so many more people, it changes the parameters.  I was trying to find the FAQ I had read where the health ministers said it was ok to continue that but it doesn’t make sense.


Well with my wife heading back to school we have already discussed plans with our family.  I am a caretaker/support for my mom (92) who lives a couple of hours away.  I have warned her that I will continue to do exterior maintenance on the house every couple of weeks or so, but will no longer enter her home.  I have told my two children who live with my former spouse that I will be cutting off face-to-face contact (back to zoom once a week).  DW is in Toronto now for a final visit with her parents.  
So effectively on September 4 we plan to cut our bubble to just the 2 of us, except that DW's bubble will be approximately 250 people assuming that 25 students are all following the rules and only have a bubble of 10 each (probability is probably low that that is true).  
Both of my kids are in post secondary, with 100% online learning.  They are going to get pretty tired of the same four walls (again), but all for the greater good!  I can't imagine them both taking rapid transit to their campuses every day.


----------



## bankr63

bababear_50 said:


> Bubble rejection is what it's called.
> View attachment 515770
> 
> My son and daughter in law are in my *Bubble*
> and work from home,,their companies are saying at least until next Jan/Feb 2021.
> 
> If I go back to the school environment I am out of their *Bubble*.....
> I can't imagine Christmas without them???????????????????????????


Oh come on!
My general feeling is that schooling will be in full outbreak by late October.  With shutdown, and a couple of weeks of isolation, assuming we all avoid contracting it ourselves, Christmas should be entirely doable.

Which I guess is another one of those random questions.  How long does everyone feel this return to school thing will last before they have to shut it down?  After what I just said, I actually think that 8 weeks is pretty optimistic.

ETA: 3 quick posts in a row there.  Just trying to be everyone's ray of sunshine on a rainy day here in Ottawa  🌧


----------



## hdrolfe

bankr63 said:


> Oh come on!
> My general feeling is that schooling will be in full outbreak by late October.  With shutdown, and a couple of weeks of isolation, assuming we all avoid contracting it ourselves, Christmas should be entirely doable.
> 
> Which I guess is another one of those random questions.  How long does everyone feel this return to school thing will last before they have to shut it down?  After what I just said, I actually think that 8 weeks is pretty optimistic.
> 
> ETA: 3 quick posts in a row there.  Just trying to be everyone's ray of sunshine on a rainy day here in Ottawa  🌧



It would be great if they didn't have to shut it down again but I'm guessing by Thanksgiving-ish. If not before then I'm sure shortly after. People are having a hard time staying the course, getting worn out I guess. Thanksgiving is the next big holiday, those little groups of up to 10 will be hard to maintain.


----------



## pigletto

My money is on early November for the school related outbreaks to be really prevalent. I don’t see another large scale school shutdown though. I think it will be just a “putting out fires“ approach with closing schools with high positive numbers. I think it would take USA type numbers to start shutting down en masse again .


----------



## bababear_50

bankr63 said:


> This probably won't be possible in the primary grades.  The teacher is supposed to be cohorted with the class throughout the day, and students MUST be supervised at all times.  You can't have others coming into the classroom randomly to spell off the teacher; that becomes a cross-infection route.  I assume bathroom breaks for teachers will even pose a challenge.



My understanding is the rules of common labour still exist.
for myself as an E.A.
15 minute break
1/2- hr lunch
https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/C.R.C.,_c._986/index.html&
Teacher lunches are usually longer at my school, 1 hr.
then there are teacher planning times that will have to happen.

Staff will be floating around through classrooms covering for people.
I am not sure at this point if lunchroom supervisors will be back next year,,goodness knows we never had enough consistent supervision at lunchtime.
This is in a elementary school.

And my school is going to a 2- 40 min nutrition break system next year,,,so all this may change as we have never done the Nutrition Break system. (Fun something new during Covid 19).......................
https://www.unlockfood.ca/en/Articles/School-Health/Articles/Food-for-a-Balanced-School-Day.aspx
Mel


----------



## hdrolfe

bababear_50 said:


> My understanding is the rules of common labour still exist.
> for myself as an E.A.
> 15 minute break
> 1/2- hr lunch
> https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/C.R.C.,_c._986/index.html&
> Teacher lunches are usually longer at my school, 1 hr.
> then there are teacher planning times that will have to happen.
> 
> Staff will be floating around through classrooms covering for people.
> I am not sure at this point if lunchroom supervisors will be back next year,,goodness knows we never had enough consistent supervision at lunchtime.
> This is in a elementary school.
> 
> And my school is going to a 2- 40 min nutrition break system next year,,,so all this may change as we have never done the Nutrition Break system. (Fun something new during Covid 19).......................
> https://www.unlockfood.ca/en/Articles/School-Health/Articles/Food-for-a-Balanced-School-Day.aspx
> Mel



I know my son's school has had little lunch time supervision, the few time's I've gone to pick him at that time there is no teacher or adult around his class, apparently one teacher is in the hall near a block of classes. I know they only get a few minutes to eat in any case, like 15 or something? Then it's outside. I imagine it will be harder to manage if they have to stagger the lunch breaks though, I believe they are restricting volunteers and such so not sure how that works. I am sure they will have some sort of plan in place. To maintain social distancing but still provide supervision. 

I wonder if the balanced day would be easier to manage with supervision, though I've never understood if it is then just two recess breaks? He gets two short ones and one long one at lunch time now. And of course that is the most important "class".  I believe the public board here in Ottawa does balanced day while the Catholic has, so far any way, done two short and a longer lunch time break.


----------



## bankr63

bababear_50 said:


> Staff will be floating around through classrooms covering for people.
> 
> And my school is going to a 2- 40 min nutrition break system next year,,,so all this may change as we have never done the Nutrition Break system. (Fun something new during Covid 19).......................
> 
> Mel


And I don't see how this can happen.  The idea is not to cross contaminate, so having any kind of "floater" strikes me as counter to the entire gist of the thing.

The Ontario Principal's Association recently published a very detailed response to the government,  Although the tone started supportive, they raised a bunch of good points; the real eye opener for me was their questioning about what we do about substitutes?  We all know more will be required; DW usually works through everything unless she literally can't get up out of bed in the morning.  But now she also has to call in for a sniffle.  But Subs can't be floating from school to school.  The principals are asking that substitute teachers be assigned to a single school for safety.  That makes a lot of sense for reducing the spread, but will it happen? 

And DW's school went to double nutrition break a couple of years ago.  Takes a bit of adjustment, but it works pretty well.  I haven't heard any of her crowd opining on whether it has improved student attention/performance or not.  It works really well for her personally as she is one of those people who thrives on a few really small meals over 3 large ones.


----------



## bababear_50

We are doing away with the traditional 1 hr lunch and 2 15 minute breaks at our school.

It will be
11:05-11:25     20 minutes to eat
  11:25-11:45    20  minutes for outside activities


The afternoon will be the same with 2, 20 minute breaks.
(20 to eat and 20 outside).

Not that this something that happens at all schools,, but at my school many kids don't eat breakfast ,,,so them having to wait till 11:05 is going to be quite the change.
I hope parents/kids pack lots of food as we will not be allowed to supplement food this year,(no budget).
You would not believe how many grade 6/7/8 turn up everyday without lunches.
Our school LRS (Lunchroom supervisors are paid by the board).
Hugs
Mel


----------



## bababear_50

bankr63 said:


> And I don't see how this can happen.  The idea is not to cross contaminate, so having any kind of "floater" strikes me as counter to the entire gist of the thing.
> 
> The Ontario Principal's Association recently published a very detailed response to the government,  Although the tone started supportive, they raised a bunch of good points; the real eye opener for me was their questioning about what we do about substitutes?  We all know more will be required; DW usually works through everything unless she literally can't get up out of bed in the morning.  But now she also has to call in for a sniffle.  But Subs can't be floating from school to school.  The principals are asking that substitute teachers be assigned to a single school for safety.  That makes a lot of sense for reducing the spread, but will it happen?
> 
> And DW's school went to double nutrition break a couple of years ago.  Takes a bit of adjustment, but it works pretty well.  I haven't heard any of her crowd opining on whether it has improved student attention/performance or not.  It works really well for her personally as she is one of those people who thrives on a few really small meals over 3 large ones.



So are you saying school staff will not be getting any lunch time or breaks?

Mel


----------



## bankr63

bababear_50 said:


> So are you saying school staff will not be getting any lunch time or breaks?
> 
> Mel


No, just saying I don't know how they are going to do so "safely".  My current worry is that there are so many unanswered questions for Ontario at the moment.  Someone else posted that NB seems to actually be planning and has things under control.  Wondering if they are hiring new well experienced teachers on short notice? I am currently terrified that DW is walking into an absolute sh-show. 

In seriousness (something I only rarely display), I DO actually want school to restart.  DW is a dedicated teacher and loves her job and her kids.  Kids DO need to get back to school.  BUT this needs to be done safely! Other counties have proven it can be done with a well thought out plan and lots of resourcing. I admit I already have a chip on my shoulder about our current administration as they have decimated my sector of health care, and I know they DO NOT have a plan when they say they do.  I am a project manger in health IT with a string of successes under my belt.  I can't get any work in my sector because innovation is now anathema to the current ministry; there has not been an innovative idea out of this government in months. 

This thing absolutely requires sober thought and consultation with experts to get right.  They are completely flying it by the seat of their pants.  When it all falls down, the school boards will get the blame for bad plans.  If, by miracle, it actually works, all credit will go to the great ministry action and planning.  I personally am terrified of the real and deadly consequences that this might have on my family and the families of DW's school kids.  Playing fast and loose with people's lives is a deadly game.

ETA: expect this will be reported and deleted in short order.  But really needed to get this off my chest.  Thanks to any who read it while it is here.


----------



## hdrolfe

@bababear_50 my son is one who rarely eats breakfast. The first break was when he'd have his first snack, around 10:30. Even when he was going to before school daycare he wouldn't eat there. 

My thought, and it is certainly only that, is that teachers will of course get their breaks and lunches, it's the law after all! I would guess that the masks and social distancing would come into play here. It's supervision, not teaching, is there a need to get so close to the kids during this time? I don't think social distancing counts towards the 10 people circle or a worry for transmission if the teacher or whoever is covering the breaks is wearing a mask/PPE, stays 6 feet from the students and washes hands before/after.

I do also worry about substitutes, but perhaps with all the hand washing and mask wearing, people/kids/teachers won't get sick as often?


----------



## Aladora

Donald - my hero said:


> *I know from the parking lot discussions and the local newspaper that our school board wants an answer by August 14th from families. Either in class or online,  it's an all or nothing type choice so they can get classes set and lessons planned.  *



I got an email from DS's new school that said that we will hear something by the last week of August! I think they have to submit their plan to the BC government by Aug 26th. Ugh



tgropp said:


> Just out of curiosity, how many people have gone to restaurants and especially Walmart since the epidemic?



DH and I have gone out to one restaurant since all this began and that was just a couple of weeks ago. We ate inside but the restaurant had blocked off every other table and there was way more than 2m between them.



bankr63 said:


> Which I guess is another one of those random questions.  How long does everyone feel this return to school thing will last before they have to shut it down?  After what I just said, I actually think that 8 weeks is pretty optimistic.



Ive been saying to people that I would put good money on there being an outbreak that causes schools to go back to remote learning no later than the second week of October.


----------



## bababear_50

Yeah .......................................................................... about that distancing stuff............and breaks...................

I guess in this situation it kind of sucks to be the E.A in the school that
has paramedical training eh? Seemed like a good idea at the time,,,
They (kids) are all in different classes,,,mainstream.....
G tube feeding/spoon training feeding /suctioning.
Diaper / Depend changes
toilet training
Physio exercises
Ileostomy care
wound bandaging
catheter care etc................................................
Oh Boy


Well it could be ........................

Hugs
Mel
Tomorrow will be sunny


----------



## Madame

bababear_50 said:


> Yeah .......................................................................... about that distancing stuff............and breaks...................
> 
> I guess in this situation it kind of sucks to be the E.A in the school that
> has paramedical training eh? Seemed like a good idea at the time,,,
> They (kids) are all in different classes,,,mainstream.....
> G tube feeding/spoon training feeding /suctioning.
> Diaper / Depend changes
> toilet training
> Physio exercises
> Ileostomy care
> wound bandaging
> catheter care etc................................................
> Oh Boy
> 
> 
> Well it could be ........................
> 
> Hugs
> Mel
> Tomorrow will be sunny


Yes it does.  EAs/CYWs/ECEs are essential to the functionality of any school.  They are also going to be the most vulnerable.  Hands down.  I am praying for you that this mad experiment is short-lived, or that they  come to their senses and hard cap ALL classes at 15 before the year starts (yeah, not going to happen ).


----------



## wdwmom3

For those of you in provinces that aren’t mandating masks for older kids, looks like the feds will be coming out with guidelines that recommend masks for kids ages 10 and up.  So your back to school plans may change to include them.

https://apple.news/AIox_E2gBQUmJPf-K7MnyIQ


----------



## Iralyn

bankr63 said:


> No, just saying I don't know how they are going to do so "safely".  My current worry is that there are so many unanswered questions for Ontario at the moment.  Someone else posted that NB seems to actually be planning and has things under control.  Wondering if they are hiring new well experienced teachers on short notice? I am currently terrified that DW is walking into an absolute sh-show.



Yes, so many unanswered questions.  But our teacher unions will be fighting to ensure that the school boards are following all aspects of our collective agreements including maximums on supervision time and a 40 minute uninterrupted lunch.  How will they achieve that without introducing too many extra points of contact?  No idea.


----------



## Madame

Iralyn said:


> Yes, so many unanswered questions.  But our teacher unions will be fighting to ensure that the school boards are following all aspects of our collective agreements including maximums on supervision time and a 40 minute uninterrupted lunch.  How will they achieve that without introducing too many extra points of contact?  No idea.


Don’t know the specifics, but they just pushed through a bill allowing them to override collective agreements, because of the “emergency” situation.  Imagine that...


----------



## MamaLema

tgropp said:


> Just out of curiosity, how many people have gone to restaurants and especially Walmart since the epidemic?


Restaurants- 0
Walmart - few times to get prescriptions only. I don’t want to change pharmacies since they have all my history there


----------



## Cdn Gal

wdwmom3 said:


> Are other school board really that bad? My kids have never been in a class in elementary school with more then 25 kids.  I found this info from our board from the 2017-2018 year. And I only hear of the odd larger class size once they hit grades 7-8. But never more the


My class average over the past 10 years teaching in the junior division has been 29 students.


----------



## wdwmom3

Cdn Gal said:


> My class average over the past 10 years teaching in the junior division has been 29 students.



Wow haven’t seen anything like that in junior grades here. Just read this and it looks to me like school boards will be looking at trying to reduce class sizes as best they can. I also think with all the pressure the ford government is getting we may hear of some changes. I know for my sons school it wouldn’t be hard to get their classes to around 20 kids.

https://apple.news/ANEouSCKVTvGiOU_F-VlOzA


----------



## damo

Are there enough teachers and nurses available for these possible new hires (if cap sizes are lowered)?  If every school needs about 3 new teachers and 1 nurse, would there be enough qualified and available  personnel to meet this demand?  This might be an impossible situation.


----------



## Madame

damo said:


> Are there enough teachers and nurses available for these possible new hires (if cap sizes are lowered)?  If every school needs about 3 new teachers and 1 nurse, would there be enough qualified and available  personnel to meet this demand?  This might be an impossible situation.


The nurses are not going to be new hires.  If you look closely they are current nurses to be pulled from other duties.  I think the funding came to the equivalent of 1 nurse shared by 10 schools & custodial funding for 1 shared by 4 - not that it matters as new evidence suggests it’s airborne & nothing in the budget can renovate and fix ventilation in 70-100 year old schools in 4 wks.


----------



## ottawamom

So the nurses and custodians are effectively window dressing for optics. A nurse in a school 1/2 day per week isn't going to be able to do much to monitor the ongoing situation. An extra 2 hours of a custodian each day isn't going to be able to do all the additional cleaning necessary to combat possible spread.

I feel for those of you with a tough decision to make in the coming weeks.


----------



## quandrea

ottawamom said:


> So the nurses and custodians are effectively window dressing for optics. A nurse in a school 1/2 day per week isn't going to be able to do much to monitor the ongoing situation. An extra 2 hours of a custodian each day isn't going to be able to do all the additional cleaning necessary to combat possible spread.
> 
> I feel for those of you with a tough decision to make in the coming weeks.


Exactly. This was what I found so difficult teaching special Ed years ago. Sixty kids on my case load, most who were years behind their peers. I was window dressing. A paper pusher. I didn’t have the time nor the resources to help sixty kids. Very frustrating.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

We don’t have a back to work thread so posting this here.

My office just sent around a sign up sheet for August and September. You pick a colour group (green or blue) and you work in the office alternating weeks with the same 10 people. Then you work from home the next week.

I told my supervisors that I can’t be in the office until school goes back in. Hopefully that won’t be an issue.

Editing to add:  DH is driving me nuts, so I officially put myself back at work the week of August 31 since he has a week's vacation LOL


----------



## Madame

Madame said:


> The nurses are not going to be new hires.  If you look closely they are current nurses to be pulled from other duties.  I think the funding came to the equivalent of 1 nurse shared by 10 schools & custodial funding for 1 shared by 4 - not that it matters as new evidence suggests it’s airborne & nothing in the budget can renovate and fix ventilation in 70-100 year old schools in 4 wks.


----------



## damo

Madame said:


> The nurses are not going to be new hires.  If you look closely they are current nurses to be pulled from other duties.  I think the funding came to the equivalent of 1 nurse shared by 10 schools & custodial funding for 1 shared by 4 - not that it matters as new evidence suggests it’s airborne & nothing in the budget can renovate and fix ventilation in 70-100 year old schools in 4 wks.



I had seen this  https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/covid-19-coronavirus-ontario-july-30-back-to-school-1.5668495

"According to Dr. Barbara Yaffe, Ontario's associate chief medical officer of health, the government will hire as many as 500 additional public health nurses that will each be assigned to a "family of schools.""

That is a lot of new nurses to come up with.  There are already a ton of requests for new nurses ... https://ca.indeed.com/School-Nurse-jobs-in-Ontario


----------



## uandmfan

Even if our school is able to make smaller classes we don't have room for it.  We don't have empty classrooms and just getting kindergarten down to 20 kids a class would probably require 4 to 5 rooms. Then there are the junior classes as well (grades 4 to 6).  Grades 1 to 3 should all be under 20 kids, but not 15. I don't see how most schools have the physical space to decrease class sizes so drastically.


----------



## bankr63

quandrea said:


> Exactly. This was what I found so difficult teaching special Ed years ago. Sixty kids on my case load, most who were years behind their peers. I was window dressing. A paper pusher. I didn’t have the time nor the resources to help sixty kids. Very frustrating.


DW is a Spec Ed Specialist and used to teach in a segregated setting a few years ago until SES's were removed.  Since she teaches core, she has those same students along with her regular students.  Hard to prepare appropriate material for kids who are operating at a grade 2-3 level at the same time that she challenges those kids that are operating at the grade 7 standard or above.  I don't know how she manages it - well actually I do, very long hours at home doing unpaid planning - but it is a huge chore.


----------



## wdwmom3

I 


Madame said:


> View attachment 515968


I thought the nurses were more to help with education around protocols and helping make sure they are followed.  Like wearing a mask properly etc.  Someone for teachers or students to raise any concerns with or ask questions. Not monitoring the health of everyone.  

If you have a nurse assigned to 10 schools they could go to each to school every week.  They could do one in the morning and one in the afternoon.


----------



## chirona

It is a tough decision.  I guess you want to value human life and love for your neighbor are two guiding principles that people can use in making their decisions.  There are a lot of factors to consider.  Parents that work, kids ability to adapt to an more isolated environment.  Each person must weigh the factors carefully.


----------



## Madame

damo said:


> I had seen this  https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/covid-19-coronavirus-ontario-july-30-back-to-school-1.5668495
> 
> "According to Dr. Barbara Yaffe, Ontario's associate chief medical officer of health, the government will hire as many as 500 additional public health nurses that will each be assigned to a "family of schools.""
> 
> That is a lot of new nurses to come up with.  There are already a ton of requests for new nurses ... https://ca.indeed.com/School-Nurse-jobs-in-Ontario


I’ll see if I can dig up the article/interview  I saw about the reassignment of nurses.


----------



## Madame

Madame said:


> I’ll see if I can dig up the article/interview  I saw about the reassignment of nurses.


It was stated during a pressser

This is what they are expected to do

And teachers were *very* upset at Yaffe or whatever her name is, indicated teachers would somehow be trained to do some type of Covid testing if permission was granted by parents.


----------



## mshanson3121

Read in a CBC article shared on another thread here:

*Recommends masks for children over 10*
_ 
Tam said one of the busiest areas of planning for officials is the reopening of schools in September, for which, she said, the Public Health Agency of Canada will be publishing detailed guidelines later this week.

The guidelines will include a recommendation that children over the age of 10 be required to wear masks, said Tam, in French. Extra consideration should be given for children under the age of 10, she said._


It blows my mind, that they have left this so late. I assumed this was already released since school boards have already been making their plans.  So, basically, all the plans shared with parents thus far (and that we've all been discussing), will probably be moot.  Prime example? Masks.  Our province had no intention of making masks mandatory. However, based on this ^^ they will now have to go back and change that. Which, I 100% support, but, we all know that's going to go over like a lead balloon with many parents.  It'll also be interesting to see what they recommend/require regarding physical distancing within the classroom. Many places are not planning to require any distancing under a certain age. Others are only requiring 1m. If they come out with a 2m requirement... oie. I have a feeling, it's going to be very interesting next week....


----------



## hdrolfe

Didn't Alberta already change their mind on masks? I thought they originally said no but now are matching Ontario with grade 4 through 12 needing them. 

I'm not sure the Federal government has any jurisdiction over education, or provincial health regulations, isn't that why they haven't employed the Emergencies Act yet? Leaving it for provinces to handle? They can recommend things, but they can't require them. Every province has responded differently, yes there are the "social distancing" measures, wash your hands, stay a certain distance from others. But those are provincially set, the Feds just recommended stuff and control the borders. Masks too, she said they should be used well before provinces said anything, and those seem to come down to the cities in most places actually. Outside of schools the province (in Ontario at least) hasn't legislated masks indoors, though I guess Quebec has. 

Someone else mentioned space, and having the ability to hire enough teachers. Even if they move to smaller classes and more space between desks, do very many schools have the space to do so? Can they find enough teachers to hire? What about subs? This coming year is going to be hectic, I think there will be a lot of decisions made on the fly as things go along. It is really frustrating. I like plans, knowing what will be happening. Yes, there is a certain amount of uncertainty in all of this, who knows when it will flare up again, but having an idea of what will happen in those situations would sure be nice! It is really hard to prepare my son for this without having any idea yet of what will actually be happening. 

And I am still not sure when I will be required to go back to the office, but I can tell you I will fight on that until there is a vaccine. There is nothing I do there that I cannot do at home, that I haven't been doing at home. And then I can perhaps worry less about schools shutting down or moving all online again.


----------



## wdwmom3

mshanson3121 said:


> Read in a CBC article shared on another thread here:
> 
> *Recommends masks for children over 10*
> _
> Tam said one of the busiest areas of planning for officials is the reopening of schools in September, for which, she said, the Public Health Agency of Canada will be publishing detailed guidelines later this week.
> 
> The guidelines will include a recommendation that children over the age of 10 be required to wear masks, said Tam, in French. Extra consideration should be given for children under the age of 10, she said._
> 
> 
> It blows my mind, that they have left this so late. I assumed this was already released since school boards have already been making their plans.  So, basically, all the plans shared with parents thus far (and that we've all been discussing), will probably be moot.  Prime example? Masks.  Our province had no intention of making masks mandatory. However, based on this ^^ they will now have to go back and change that. Which, I 100% support, but, we all know that's going to go over like a lead balloon with many parents.  It'll also be interesting to see what they recommend/require regarding physical distancing within the classroom. Many places are not planning to require any distancing under a certain age. Others are only requiring 1m. If they come out with a 2m requirement... oie. I have a feeling, it's going to be very interesting next week....



I agree it’s late.  But my guess, education falls under provincial jurisdiction.  The feds likely stayed out of it letting the provinces make their plans.  But once the plans were announced they felt they had to say something.   The Provinces should have done this on their own.  I’m glad ontario and Alberta did.


----------



## mshanson3121

hdrolfe said:


> Didn't Alberta already change their mind on masks? I thought they originally said no but now are matching Ontario with grade 4 through 12 needing them.
> 
> I'm not sure the Federal government has any jurisdiction over education, or provincial health regulations, isn't that why they haven't employed the Emergencies Act yet? Leaving it for provinces to handle? They can recommend things, but they can't require them.



No idea, we're in NB.

From what I understand, the legal enforcement comes through the provincial department of health, but _their_ recommendations/requirements come from the federal department. So, if the federal department says "this is the recommendation for the bare minimum", then the provincial departments job is to enforce that. So, yes, if they say masks for ages 10+, then, it will be masks for ages 10+, enforced through each province and/or municipality. That said, the provincial departments can choose to go above and beyond federal recommendations, but my understanding is they're not supposed to go lower.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

Well, NS is always behind the times.  Our BTS plan is soooo vague and not well thought out. 

High schoolers and teachers are the only ones needing to wear masks and it's only in the hallways, etc. Not in the classroom.

Elementary and Jr High/Middle School are exempt from masks, which blows my mind.

I honestly think they ALL should be wearing masks, even in the classroom.


----------



## isabellea

Masks are now mandatory in all public buildings for 12yo and older in QC (for the whole province, even in regions that had very low numbers of cases or no cases at all). Since this mandate/law has passed, I noticed that even young kids wear one. My kids are both younger than 12yo but they know I expect them to wear one the rare times we go somewhere indoor with them. I’m expecting to wear masks for a very long time so I am slowly building my collection. I just bought one with flamingos wearing Santa hats for the Holidays.  I wear 2-3 different masks everyday at work so I like fun ones.


----------



## wdwmom3

isabellea said:


> Masks are now mandatory in all public buildings for 12yo and older in QC (for the whole province, even in regions that had very low numbers of cases or no cases at all). Since this mandate/law has passed, I noticed that even young kids wear one. My kids are both younger than 12yo but they know I expect them to wear one the rare times we go somewhere indoor with them. I’m expecting to wear masks for a very long time so I am slowly building my collection. I just bought one with flamingos wearing Santa hats for the Holidays.  I wear 2-3 different masks everyday at work so I like fun ones.



My daughter is hoping she will get to wear festive masks at work lol.


----------



## bankr63

isabellea said:


> Masks are now mandatory in all public buildings for 12yo and older in QC (for the whole province, even in regions that had very low numbers of cases or no cases at all). Since this mandate/law has passed, I noticed that even young kids wear one. My kids are both younger than 12yo but they know I expect them to wear one the rare times we go somewhere indoor with them. I’m expecting to wear masks for a very long time so I am slowly building my collection. I just bought one with flamingos wearing Santa hats for the Holidays.  I wear 2-3 different masks everyday at work so I like fun ones.


^^ This is DW (mostly) too!
We are building quite a collection of masks in all kinds of fancy patterns.  She is still searching for the perfect mask since she will be wearing one all day once school starts.  Most are uncomfortable and ill fitting, they tend to ride up or down if you are talking a lot (teacher), causing you to actually touch your face more.  Although it may all be moot now as I read that teachers will be required to wear medical grade masks that will be supplied for them.

I do think that masks may become the new fashion statement.  We love to camp and I have a few with camping or camper themes.  And I love my Canadian Flag mask.  Nothing more obvious than wearing you life passions on your face.  I guess that means I need to find some masks with my alter ego Goofy on them...


----------



## Donald - my hero

*I don't want to be accused of making light of this situation but i also really wanted to share this article  a little bit of humour can lighten our hearts for a brief moment (i hope)
Planning to Teach using Disney GIFs*


----------



## mshanson3121

So the government (NB) announced today that they will be updating twice a week starting Aug 13th and concluding SEPT 3 (!!!) re: their plans for back to school. Topics will include use of masks, extra curriculars, how learning will be approached, bussing etc... 

 So the meetings conclude September 3, and school is supposed to start Sept 8. That is completely unacceptable.  I feel so sorry for all the parents who are just waiting for information, so they can decide if their child is going back to school, staying home, so they can make arrangements at work etc...  This truly feels as though they are honestly hoping as many people as possible will just get fed up with waiting, and pull their kids from school.


----------



## isabellea

bankr63 said:


> ^^ This is DW (mostly) too!
> We are building quite a collection of masks in all kinds of fancy patterns.  She is still searching for the perfect mask since she will be wearing one all day once school starts.  Most are uncomfortable and ill fitting, they tend to ride up or down if you are talking a lot (teacher), causing you to actually touch your face more.  Although it may all be moot now as I read that teachers will be required to wear medical grade masks that will be supplied for them.
> 
> I do think that masks may become the new fashion statement.  We love to camp and I have a few with camping or camper themes.  And I love my Canadian Flag mask.  Nothing more obvious than wearing you life passions on your face.  I guess that means I need to find some masks with my alter ego Goofy on them...



I had to try 5 different mask styles before I found one that fitted me perfectly. I LOVE the masks from Le Grenier de Lexi on FB. So far, everybody I referred to her are very happy with how the masks fit. My daughter even do tumbling with them and they stay in place (I bought her a 5-10 yr and adjusted the elastics for a perfect fit). Her page is in French but she's anglophone so wouldn't have any issue answering in English. 

For my kids:

For me: 


I posted a photo on the mask thread on how they compare to a medical-grade procedure mask when opened.


----------



## pigletto

mshanson3121 said:


> So the government (NB) announced today that they will be updating twice a week starting Aug 13th and concluding SEPT 3 (!!!) re: their plans for back to school. Topics will include use of masks, extra curriculars, how learning will be approached, bussing etc...
> 
> So the meetings conclude September 3, and school is supposed to start Sept 8. That is completely unacceptable.  I feel so sorry for all the parents who are just waiting for information, so they can decide if their child is going back to school, staying home, so they can make arrangements at work etc...  This truly feels as though they are honestly hoping as many people as possible will just get fed up with waiting, and pull their kids from school.


I wondered what the timeline is in other places and boards. In Niagara, Ontario we really haven’t heard anything other than the provincial announcements last week. It’s cutting it close to get any sort of accurate numbers. Most of us can’t make decisions without facts and the silence is frustrating. I think I want to just see the plan, decide once and for all, and put it to rest.


----------



## CanadianKrista

I'm seriously stressing about the timelines.  Our daycare sent an email yesterday saying we have to let them know by Aug 20 if we still want our spot or we forfeit it.  I have no idea if we want our spot until we understand what is happening with buses - we are only at the school we are at because it buses from our daycare.  My DD is old enough now that daycare probably isn't really required, but we are still there because it's how she gets to school and back.   I'm not sure we are going to have any idea what the bussing plan is by Aug 20, let alone whether I'm comfortable with that plan or would be driving her to school regardless.  And DS is now off to another school, which does bus to our home, but again, no idea if I want him on the bus.  The school start times are an hour apart, so driving them both to school and picking them up is problematic, but putting them on packed buses is not okay.  The bus from the daycare has been known to have 3 kids per seat in the past!


----------



## hdrolfe

@CanadianKrista that sucks, what a hard decision! On top of the "regular" covid choices  can you have both kids at the same school? 

I pulled my son from daycare right around March break, not for Covid reasons. He hated going so since he is 10, I gave him the choice to get himself to/from every day. I leave for work before he leaves for school. Now, I'm WFH so it doesn't matter, except he'll want me to drive him. We are too close for busing. I guess we are luck in that sense though, if he went to a different school he'd have to bus and I am not sure how I feel about that.


----------



## CanadianKrista

I can't have them at the same school - DS is going to Grade 7, which is a different school (and don't get me started on the fact that I have no idea if his grade 7 will look more like the grade 6 plan or high school plan, since 7 and 8 in this school are in the same school as 9-12 - I seriously have no clue which plan we'd be following for him).  We knew when we went to the elementary school we did we'd be committed to daycare until they finished grade 6.  DD is going to grade 5 this year, so we should be there 2 more years, but if there are no buses, we'd be paying over $400/month for well, nothing.  But if we give up our spot, we have to drive her to/from school for the next two years, which doesn't really work for our jobs.   Bah.


----------



## hdrolfe

CanadianKrista said:


> I can't have them at the same school - DS is going to Grade 7, which is a different school (and don't get me started on the fact that I have no idea if his grade 7 will look more like the grade 6 plan or high school plan, since 7 and 8 in this school are in the same school as 9-12 - I seriously have no clue which plan we'd be following for him).  We knew when we went to the elementary school we did we'd be committed to daycare until they finished grade 6.  DD is going to grade 5 this year, so we should be there 2 more years, but if there are no buses, we'd be paying over $400/month for well, nothing.  But if we give up our spot, we have to drive her to/from school for the next two years, which doesn't really work for our jobs.   Bah.



That sucks. Hopefully your Board will make their grade 7 plans known soon? I understand here, where grade 7 & 8 are also in the high school, that they will be following the plans for the elemntary kids in terms of classes. (Ottawa Catholic School Board). New daycare? Change schools to one closer to home instead of daycare? Not much time left for any decisions to be made that's for sure!


----------



## CanadianKrista

We are in the Ottawa Catholic board as well, but all I've seen is the provincial plan (which does say up to grade 8, but the public schools have the kids in the elementary school to grade 8, which makes it simplier), nothing from the board - so until I see something from the board or the school I don't trust it.   We are rural, so really we don't have a close school, just "closer".  Which is still a significant drive or bus ride away.  We'll figure it out, I'm just stressed!  I just checked the board website and they said the plan is coming Monday, so here's hoping we have some answers then!


----------



## hdrolfe

CanadianKrista said:


> We are in the Ottawa Catholic board as well, but all I've seen is the provincial plan (which does say up to grade 8, but the public schools have the kids in the elementary school to grade 8, which makes it simplier), nothing from the board - so until I see something from the board or the school I don't trust it.   We are rural, so really we don't have a close school, just "closer".  Which is still a significant drive or bus ride away.  We'll figure it out, I'm just stressed!  I just checked the board website and they said the plan is coming Monday, so here's hoping we have some answers then!



https://www.ocsb.ca/coming-monday-back-to-school-plan-and-online-learning-survey/ 

was just coming to post this  but you should read their original plans as well, and there have been many comments on facebook about grade 7 & 8. I look forward to reading the plan and filling out their survey. Still, timing of all this is kind of tight, I mean I get why, but it is frustrating.


----------



## mshanson3121

So this came out today:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/willia...spread-covid-19-more-efficiently-than-adults/


----------



## Madame

mshanson3121 said:


> So this came out today:
> 
> https://www.forbes.com/sites/willia...spread-covid-19-more-efficiently-than-adults/


It’s even Disney related


----------



## pigletto

Madame said:


> It’s even Disney related
> View attachment 516449


I remember reading a few weeks back the opinion of a Harvard epidemiologist who basically said that it’s impossible to say how children will fare spreading or contracting Covid because it hasn’t been studied . Kids were the most sheltered of us all in the lockdown . No jobs , no errands , no school .. they weren’t leaving the house. So we aren’t going to know how this is going to go until we conduct this giant experiment.
If that four night YMCA summer camp is any indication of how quickly they can spread Covid, we’re in for a rough rough Fall and Winter .


----------



## Pumpkin1172

So I have been silently reading along...not really sure where I stand on the whole issue.

In Alberta...they first came out saying...classes will resume as normal, with social distancing, increased cleaning, blah blah blah - but no masks.  

Our youngest ds is going into Gr 12.  He was wanting to go back into the classroom.  He did not like the online learning experiences that he had.  He found it unorganized, especially any zoom meeting classes that they tried to do.  He found learning without being the the classroom, extremely difficult.  He was hoping that they would be going back into the classroom.  He is wanting to complete his classes, and go onto what he wants for college/university. 

I was hoping for a partial return with a scenario of group A and B...with zoom classroom on the day that you are NOT in the classroom...so that when you are in the school the next day, any work you did not understand you would be able to have more help on a one on one basis.  Sadly...this is not what they have come up with.  I am disappointed, in the lack of planning.  They have had 6 months to come up with plans, and their best plan is to just resume like they were with social distancing, and enhanced cleaning around the school.  We have come up with a better plans for our busniesses that we work in to keep everyone safe who enters the buildings than the government did for returning students.  How sad is that!!!!  

I had told ds that I wanted him to wear a mask even though they were not mandated.  He was ok with that.  We already wear them when we go out, so for him, he wasn't really bothered by that.  But now masks are required now...and the government is supplying each student with 2 reusable ones.  We are working on finding ones that work the best for him.  So far, he really likes the disposable ones...and if those are the ones we likes the best, I'll keep buying them.  

I guess we will see how this will all work.  I just hope that the school divisions have a " Plan B " that will help students to actually learn if they shut down the schools again.  And not just fly by the seat of their pants.  They have the time now, to plan and come up with different scenarios of what could or might work.  I AM expecting more of them right now.  Just like I AM expected to do my job differently to keep other staff members and customers safe.


----------



## Madame

Well, this looks like fun.  Guess teachers nor students ever have to pee or eat.  Oh and that pesky prep period for teachers is gone - the 2 copiers for dozens of staff & the hundreds of kids whipping of their masks in the hallway to grab a snack between pds should be very safe & sanitary


----------



## FigmentSpark

Madame said:


> Well, this looks like fun.  Guess teachers nor students ever have to pee or eat.  Oh and that pesky prep period for teachers is gone - the 2 copiers for dozens of staff & the hundreds of kids whipping of their masks in the hallway to grab a snack between pds should be very safe & sanitary
> View attachment 516486


Is that elementary or high school?


----------



## Madame

FigmentSpark said:


> Is that elementary or high school?


High school- non-designated (15 per class, every other day f2f then asynchronous).


----------



## pigletto

Madame said:


> High school- non-designated (15 per class, every other day f2f then asynchronous).


DSBN just released our plan. It’s says basically that students can eat at their desks during class but there won’t be a lunch time. The compressed schedule is 4 hours for us so they aren’t scheduling a lunch.
We only have three 75 minute periods, where it looks like your schedule has 75 minutes more instruction than us.


----------



## Madame

pigletto said:


> DSBN just released our plan. It’s says basically that students can eat at their desks during class but there won’t be a lunch time. The compressed schedule is 4 hours for us so they aren’t scheduling a lunch.
> We only have three 75 minute periods, where it looks like your schedule has 75 minutes more instruction than us.


That’s the problem.  No one is protected if they take the masks off and eat in the classrooms.  No other segment of the population is not being asked to unmask in hot zero ventilation rooms and eat together.  Might as well not have a mask at all.


----------



## pigletto

Madame said:


> That’s the problem.  No one is protected if they take the masks off and eat in the classrooms.  No other segment of the population is not being asked to unmask in hot zero ventilation rooms and eat together.  Might as well not have a mask at all.


I don’t disagree. I think they are hoping people just won’t eat and they won’t have to deal with it.


----------



## Madame

pigletto said:


> I don’t disagree. I think they are hoping people just won’t eat and they won’t have to deal with it.


I wouldn’t, but teenagers have to eat.  Most of them don’t eat breakfast as it is


----------



## wdwmom3

Madame said:


> That’s the problem.  No one is protected if they take the masks off and eat in the classrooms.  No other segment of the population is not being asked to unmask in hot zero ventilation rooms and eat together.  Might as well not have a mask at all.



That’s crazy with no breaks.  I don’t have kids in high school right now (dd just graduated) but I looked at our boards plan.  It’s confusing but it looks like they will only go to one course a day, next day they do their other course.  They are only in school until 1pm (when the teachers lunch, prep time and student distance learning is planned?).  But they also have a 45 min break mid/late morning.

Actually I think I’m wrong.  I think the kids in class leave at 12:15? And from 12:15 - 1pm the teachers are with the kids who aren’t in class that day doing distance learning?


----------



## FigmentSpark

My son is supposed to be taking a foods course.  Part of that is tasting what you cook.


----------



## Northern Disney Girl

Have been reading along. Posting what our board sent out today (Lakehead Public Schools in Thunder Bay).
My DD is going into grade 12 so this for secondary.
The year has been split into 4 “quadmesters”. Each “quadmester” will have 2 classes. One in the morning, one in the afternoon. Only one room change per day. 
I dont yet have info on lunchtime or bathroom breaks. (School board is holding a town hall meeting for parents This week) 
My DD is also in the International Baccalaureate program so her classes are already a smaller size.
Mandatory masks, etc.
We live close to her school so she walks. 
All things considered, I feel fairly ok with this. 
she is excited to be going back to school


----------



## bababear_50

Just sharing 
Yeah I cried.
Damn this Virus...............
https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/cana...chool/ar-BB17IOPe?li=AAggNb9&ocid=hplocalnews
Hugs
Mel

**And I hope the family's community steps up to the plate and offers whatever help they can to this family while the Dad is away.


----------



## Frozen2014

bababear_50 said:


> Just sharing
> Yeah I cried.
> Damn this Virus...............
> https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/cana...chool/ar-BB17IOPe?li=AAggNb9&ocid=hplocalnews
> Hugs
> Mel
> 
> **And I hope the family's community steps up to the plate and offers whatever help they can to this family while the Dad is away.


SO sad what this virus is doing to families.


----------



## chrispeto

Madame said:


> Well, this looks like fun.  Guess teachers nor students ever have to pee or eat.  Oh and that pesky prep period for teachers is gone - the 2 copiers for dozens of staff & the hundreds of kids whipping of their masks in the hallway to grab a snack between pds should be very safe & sanitary
> View attachment 516486


Looks like GECDSB. Every point you made was addressed in admin meetings.


----------



## Madame

Madame said:


> It definitely has.  DH’s uncle’s LTCH is not currently listed as having an outbreak, but the sister LTCH is listed as “ongoing outbreak” on the public health site.  It could just be community spread too.  All of these workers live/shop/etc alongside us so who knows.  I shouldn’t assume, because I am not sure.  It’s a guess I suppose that since there is an ongoing outbreak in one that the did not allow visits in the other.  Maybe the company made that decision.  If so it was wise as the other greenhouse community 5 mins down the road still has one of their LTCHs listed as “outbreak ongoing” too.


DH’s uncle passed yesterday.  I didn’t think it would hit me this hard, but it has.  I’m going off social media for a good bit.  Take care everyone.


----------



## Madame

chrispeto said:


> Looks like GECDSB. Every point you made was addressed in admin meetings.


Great.  Maybe it should be shared with staff so we can stop panicking.  Oh & parents too.  I’m one of those as well.


----------



## bababear_50

Madame

With deepest sympathy and healing thoughts
Hugs
Mel


----------



## AngelDisney

Madame said:


> DH’s uncle passed yesterday.  I didn’t think it would hit me this hard, but it has.  I’m going off social media for a good bit.  Take care everyone.



Sorry for your loss, Madame!
Take care and stay well!!


----------



## FigmentSpark

Madame said:


> DH’s uncle passed yesterday.  I didn’t think it would hit me this hard, but it has.  I’m going off social media for a good bit.  Take care everyone.


So sorry to hear of your loss.  May he rest in peace.


----------



## TammyLynn33

Madame said:


> DH’s uncle passed yesterday.  I didn’t think it would hit me this hard, but it has.  I’m going off social media for a good bit.  Take care everyone.



sorry for your loss .


----------



## Debbie

Madame said:


> DH’s uncle passed yesterday.  I didn’t think it would hit me this hard, but it has.  I’m going off social media for a good bit.  Take care everyone.


I'm so sorry for your family's loss, Madame. Please take cared
 of yourselves.


----------



## uandmfan

OnceUponATime15 said:


> I took a quick look at all the GTA board websites .. all are showing September 8/20
> I thought maybe I had misrepresented so I watched the video of the press conference again.
> Here are the words from the mouth of the Premier at today’s press conference.  At 33 minutes in,  he gets to announcing the date.



Just to circle back to this as the Premier caused some confusion about when kids go back to school.....we had an email on Friday from the Ottawa English Public Board and it confirmed classes start September 3. So when Ford said kids go back to school on September 8 he wasn't changing the date for boards that had already announced an earlier start.


----------



## chrispeto

Madame said:


> Great.  Maybe it should be shared with staff so we can stop panicking.  Oh & parents too.  I’m one of those as well.


My husband is admi staff at a high school in GECDSB that’s where my information comes from 
Im going to try to put your mind at ease first of all last Thursday the Administration staff his school met with the custodians and they walked through the school where all the safety protocols have been put in place.  His school is ready to receive students, I’m assuming the other schools are ready or soon will be ready for school. 
Also the school board meets on August 11 and the back to school plan is on the agenda and I’m sure once it’s been approved it will be released to the public.
For parents at GECDSD there is a back to school picture click on it, takes you to a timeline on one side and FAQ on the other side. I’m sure other school boards have similar information on their websites


----------



## mkmommy

I know this thread is mostly about K to grade 12 but questions for parents with University kids.

 I have 2 going to different Universities one in residence the other sheared House, how are we supposed to deal with Thanksgiving/Christmas breaks the residence will be closed and they will have to come home, but that makes the social bubble More than 10 when you factor in their roommates.


----------



## wdwmom3

mkmommy said:


> I know this thread is mostly about K to grade 12 but questions for parents with University kids.
> 
> I have 2 going to different Universities one in residence the other sheared House, how are we supposed to deal with Thanksgiving/Christmas breaks the residence will be closed and they will have to come home, but that makes the social bubble More than 10 when you factor in their roommates.



I will have 2 kids in university as well. One will be living at home though. My oldest will be away (currently not living at home because of co-op). I’m not sure if they will actually come home during their reading week in October. For Christmas I may ask him to limit his interaction with other family members for the first few days he’s home, and limit interactions with friends for a couple days before he leaves to come home. He only has one roommate. It’s not the perfect solution but figured it’s better then nothing.

Back in March we had to fly him home when the university closed residence. We just kept our distance for the first few days and I disinfected everything a lot more.  You are taking some risk because that’s the age groups spreading the virus right now.  But all you can do is try and reduce it. And be willing to change things based on what’s happening then.


----------



## Madame

chrispeto said:


> My husband is admi staff at a high school in GECDSB that’s where my information comes from
> Im going to try to put your mind at ease first of all last Thursday the Administration staff his school met with the custodians and they walked through the school where all the safety protocols have been put in place.  His school is ready to receive students, I’m assuming the other schools are ready or soon will be ready for school.
> Also the school board meets on August 11 and the back to school plan is on the agenda and I’m sure once it’s been approved it will be released to the public.
> For parents at GECDSD there is a back to school picture click on it, takes you to a timeline on one side and FAQ on the other side. I’m sure other school boards have similar information on their websites


I know who your husband is.  I have seen what has been released.  I prefer not to name my employer/my spouse’s employer on social media, but I guess we all have different views on what is acceptable.


----------



## FigmentSpark

chrispeto said:


> My husband is admi staff at a high school in GECDSB that’s where my information comes from
> Im going to try to put your mind at ease first of all last Thursday the Administration staff his school met with the custodians and they walked through the school where all the safety protocols have been put in place.  His school is ready to receive students, I’m assuming the other schools are ready or soon will be ready for school.
> Also the school board meets on August 11 and the back to school plan is on the agenda and I’m sure once it’s been approved it will be released to the public.
> For parents at GECDSD there is a back to school picture click on it, takes you to a timeline on one side and FAQ on the other side. I’m sure other school boards have similar information on their websites


Our board hasn't communicated with us since July 30 when they posted what Lecce and Ford had to say.  They haven't even said when they will give us more information.  Oh, and all that is under the note saying the board is closed right now.  

While I'm sure there are things going on behind the scenes, it would be nice to see even a note saying they will have more on a certain day.  We know nothing.  And the only other thing I found was from the minutes of the board meeting on July 23 - before the gov't announcement, which laid out (in the very broadest of terms) a possible weekly schedule for cohorts, but no information on what those cohorts would look like or what semesters would look like or what type of remote systems will be put in place to supplement (or supplant) in class learning.

That is frustrating.


----------



## wdwmom3

FigmentSpark said:


> Our board hasn't communicated with us since July 30 when they posted what Lecce and Ford had to say.  They haven't even said when they will give us more information.  Oh, and all that is under the note saying the board is closed right now.
> 
> While I'm sure there are things going on behind the scenes, it would be nice to see even a note saying they will have more on a certain day.  We know nothing.  And the only other thing I found was from the minutes of the board meeting on July 23 - before the gov't announcement, which laid out (in the very broadest of terms) a possible weekly schedule for cohorts, but no information on what those cohorts would look like or what semesters would look like or what type of remote systems will be put in place to supplement (or supplant) in class learning.
> 
> That is frustrating.



That is frustrating.  I think many boards have released more detailed information.  We have to give them our decision about in class or online by the end of this week.  I can’t imagine making a decision with no information.


----------



## chrispeto

[


Madame said:


> I know who your husband is.  I have seen what has been released.  I prefer not to name my employer/my spouse’s employer on social media, but I guess we all have different views on what is acceptable.


Well it was my husband whom said
Looks like GECDSB. Every point you made was addressed in admin meetings.


----------



## TammyLynn33

I would like to know my social needs child placement. he could be a 2/3 split or a 3/4 which I assume the older class would be masked. I also would like to know whether his IEP is in place or irrelevant, before I make any choices but ion unsure if I will have this info prior to being forced into a decision.. a teacher fr our board was like teach your kid to do zippers and kunchpails bc I sent be able to..my son cant do fine motor I cant send him to school if he has no assistance


----------



## chrispeto

wdwmom3 said:


> That is frustrating.  I think many boards have released more detailed information.  We have to give them our decision about in class or online by the end of this week.  I can’t imagine making a decision with no information.


We have to make decision next week too.
I honestly don’t know what platform our board is using for online learning 
all I know is the platform they used when schools closed sucked


----------



## wdwmom3

chrispeto said:


> We have to make decision next week too.
> I honestly don’t know what platform our board is using for online learning
> all I know is the platform they used when schools closed sucked


We haven’t been given a huge amount of information about online.  But I do know our board is planning a mix of synchronize and non-synchronized and the teachers will touch base with each student at least once a week on a one on one basis.  No other information about what “platform” but I think our board mainly uses google classroom.  Google classroom was used a lot by our board before covid.


----------



## chrispeto

wdwmom3 said:


> We haven’t been given a huge amount of information about online.  But I do know our board is planning a mix of synchronize and non-synchronized and the teachers will touch base with each student at least once a week on a one on one basis.  No other information about what “platform” but I think our board mainly uses google classroom.  Google classroom was used a lot by our board before covid.


Our board used Edsby which wasn’t meant for online teaching.  Also a lot of our teachers where not trained to teach online.


----------



## FigmentSpark

wdwmom3 said:


> That is frustrating.  I think many boards have released more detailed information.  We have to give them our decision about in class or online by the end of this week.  I can’t imagine making a decision with no information.


Honestly, no one has even asked us to tell them if we're coming back or going remote.  We had a 3 question general survey to do last month, but I didn't get the impression it was in any way binding.


----------



## hdrolfe

Apparently the French Catholic Board here (Ottawa) was expecting about 4-500 kids to do online, and got closer to 1700 sign up so they are contacting each family to make sure. I wonder if that is indicative of all school boards, more are signing up for online than expected. 

I also can't wait to get more information next week. I know it comes from the board so won't address specific to my kid needs but hopefully will cover the basics of what I want to see/know. 

It was interesting this weekend, I dropped kiddo off with my parents yesterday for a sleepover and my dad made a comment about how Ontario's plan is the best across the country... I yelled a bit about how yeah sure it is but they should have followed advice to reduce class sizes. He told me not all doctors agreed with that and I kind of went off on him about it. I read the Sick Kids report, it clearly said reduced class sizes, small cohorts. I never yell at my dad, his politics and mine do not match at all but I try to simply not get into it.  I told them we wouldn't be visiting once school starts up since they are both in their 70's with health issues and how would we feel if we brought covid to them. My mom said "well we have to die sometime"... yeah... that would make us feel better if it was because of us. Her solution then was that we could wear masks and Jackson won't sleep over. Perhaps. We'll see how it goes when things start up. 

Without seeing the plan I still intend to send him but I reserve the right to pull him out if I feel it's not safe. He wants to go, he wants to see his friends and he knows he won't do the online stuff they set up. I'll decide tomorrow I guess, once I see what the plan involves and what sort of commitment it requires. I am thankful the board seems to be pretty good at communicating what's going on. It sounds like not all of them are.


----------



## wdwmom3

hdrolfe said:


> Apparently the French Catholic Board here (Ottawa) was expecting about 4-500 kids to do online, and got closer to 1700 sign up so they are contacting each family to make sure. I wonder if that is indicative of all school boards, more are signing up for online than expected.
> 
> I also can't wait to get more information next week. I know it comes from the board so won't address specific to my kid needs but hopefully will cover the basics of what I want to see/know.
> 
> It was interesting this weekend, I dropped kiddo off with my parents yesterday for a sleepover and my dad made a comment about how Ontario's plan is the best across the country... I yelled a bit about how yeah sure it is but they should have followed advice to reduce class sizes. He told me not all doctors agreed with that and I kind of went off on him about it. I read the Sick Kids report, it clearly said reduced class sizes, small cohorts. I never yell at my dad, his politics and mine do not match at all but I try to simply not get into it.  I told them we wouldn't be visiting once school starts up since they are both in their 70's with health issues and how would we feel if we brought covid to them. My mom said "well we have to die sometime"... yeah... that would make us feel better if it was because of us. Her solution then was that we could wear masks and Jackson won't sleep over. Perhaps. We'll see how it goes when things start up.
> 
> Without seeing the plan I still intend to send him but I reserve the right to pull him out if I feel it's not safe. He wants to go, he wants to see his friends and he knows he won't do the online stuff they set up. I'll decide tomorrow I guess, once I see what the plan involves and what sort of commitment it requires. I am thankful the board seems to be pretty good at communicating what's going on. It sounds like not all of them are.



I hope they reduce class sizes.  The pressure they are getting I think they might.  We are like you, we are sending our son but watching our local situation closely.  We have been told we can switch if we want to, but it would just require some time for the “transition”.  Well if I notice things are getting bad I will give them a week to switch him, that’s it.


----------



## FigmentSpark

hdrolfe said:


> Apparently the French Catholic Board here (Ottawa) was expecting about 4-500 kids to do online, and got closer to 1700 sign up so they are contacting each family to make sure. I wonder if that is indicative of all school boards, more are signing up for online than expected.
> 
> I also can't wait to get more information next week. I know it comes from the board so won't address specific to my kid needs but hopefully will cover the basics of what I want to see/know.
> 
> It was interesting this weekend, I dropped kiddo off with my parents yesterday for a sleepover and my dad made a comment about how Ontario's plan is the best across the country... I yelled a bit about how yeah sure it is but they should have followed advice to reduce class sizes. He told me not all doctors agreed with that and I kind of went off on him about it. I read the Sick Kids report, it clearly said reduced class sizes, small cohorts. I never yell at my dad, his politics and mine do not match at all but I try to simply not get into it.  I told them we wouldn't be visiting once school starts up since they are both in their 70's with health issues and how would we feel if we brought covid to them. My mom said "well we have to die sometime"... yeah... that would make us feel better if it was because of us. Her solution then was that we could wear masks and Jackson won't sleep over. Perhaps. We'll see how it goes when things start up.
> 
> Without seeing the plan I still intend to send him but I reserve the right to pull him out if I feel it's not safe. He wants to go, he wants to see his friends and he knows he won't do the online stuff they set up. I'll decide tomorrow I guess, once I see what the plan involves and what sort of commitment it requires. I am thankful the board seems to be pretty good at communicating what's going on. It sounds like not all of them are.


Not sure how blunt you want to be with your parents, but you could try asking them where they want to be buried and what their end of life plans are.  Sometimes that makes people think a little harder.


----------



## bababear_50

Definitely a stressful time for Parents & school staff.
I am trying to remember that we all want the same thing,,everyone to be safe as possible.

A special lady ,,kind of adopted mom figure for me since my mom died leaves to go back to Italy tomorrow,,we had a good long talk today. She said you know I have always loved you ,,I wanted a hug so bad but I signed hand over heart and said you'll always be in my heart.
My hope is that I will see her again next year.

For so long we have been told to *bubble*, *distance*, *wear masks* and stay home.
Now we are told that our families will be safe if we increase our bubbles over 100%.
What happens to the kids if parents get sick,,who will care for them.
I am especially concerned for single parents should they fall ill.
I am still struggling with the sense of this.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## star72232

I’m happy with the WRDSB secondary plan. We’re a designated school board, so it’s the hybrid model. The plan appears to be one week at school, one week at home, with the weeks running Thursday to Wednesday. That means that kids are in school 2 days one week, 3 days the next week. They are also doing quadmesters, with 2 classes per block. Each day will only have one class, for 3 hours (1.5 hr, break, 1.5 hr). It seems the best I’ve actually seen.

Unfortunately, elementary is full time, like the rest of the province. I have 2 kids in that (and 2 in HS). My youngest is Gr 3 - although masks aren’t mandatory for him, I will be requiring him to wear one. None of my kids have had over 22 kids in a class at that age, so I’m hopeful for his class size. My middle boy is going into Gr 5. He’ll be in a specialty class (full time enrichment), and we already know it will have 19 kids.
My biggest fear are the buses. I’m thinking we’ll try to drive the younger boys if possible.


----------



## vegs1

I find it interesting that kids are heading back to school as we are being told the second wave is coming. Makes me feel like we should be waiting or really looking at a better way instead of the guinea pig way they are treating the kids.


----------



## MoreTravels

My wife and I are the worried type. We often wear face shield and N95 to shop in a supermarket. We only go to a park when there is no one else there. That said, I am sending my youngest child to a daycare now in preparation of the in-person classroom attendance. He is in Grade 1. I have noticed a tremendous loss of social skills after him staying home with only family members for 6 months. He has forgotten how to take turn to speak, ask politely, and work independently. It has been well described in medical and psychological literature. I am seeing that in my own child. This has caused me more concern than COVID.


https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-05-developmental-regression-children-covid-.html

As much as we are scared and would like to keep him home until vaccine availability, we are more worried that he will miss a critical component of social development if he does not meet real humans other than his immediate family members. Zoom or online meetings do not work for young elementary kids. It is not an easy decision. However, it is like driving. There is a risk of car accident and death every-time we drive. But we still drive despite the risks. I guess it's about risks and benefits... In my child's case, I believe the benefits of attending a school in person far outweigh the risks. That is my opinion as a concerned parent.


----------



## TammyLynn33

MoreTravels said:


> My wife and I are the worried type. We often wear face shield and N95 to shop in a supermarket. We only go to a park when there is no one else there. That said, I am sending my youngest child to a daycare now in preparation of the in-person classroom attendance. He is in Grade 1. I have noticed a tremendous loss of social skills after him staying home with only family members for 6 months. He has forgotten how to take turn to speak, ask politely, and work independently. It has been well described in medical and psychological literature. I am seeing that in my own child. This has caused me more concern than COVID.
> 
> 
> https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-05-developmental-regression-children-covid-.html
> 
> As much as we are scared and would like to keep him home until vaccine availability, we are more worried that he will miss a critical component of social development if he does not meet real humans other than his immediate family members. Zoom or online meetings do not work for young elementary kids. It is not an easy decision. However, it is like driving. There is a risk of car accident and death every-time we drive. But we still drive despite the risks. I guess it's about risks and benefits... In my child's case, I believe the benefits of attending a school in person far outweigh the risks. That is my opinion as a concerned parent.



You can socialize your child outside the confines of a classroom . My 6 yr old is doing tball it’s outside lots of social distancing , sanitizing, but he’s seeing other kids , unattached to my hip, taking direction from another adult , his coach  having fun and a sense of normal again. 
He is terrified of going back to school grade 1, Right now my plan is to keep him home but keep him in sports for socialization. Yes it’s not necessary but I feel safer with one hour exposure once or twice a week than 6 hours a day in a non-distanced class..
Just a thought for you


----------



## TammyLynn33

bababear_50 said:


> Definitely a stressful time for Parents & school staff.
> I am trying to remember that we all want the same thing,,everyone to be safe as possible.
> 
> A special lady ,,kind of adopted mom figure for me since my mom died leaves to go back to Italy tomorrow,,we had a good long talk today. She said you know I have always loved you ,,I wanted a hug so bad but I signed hand over heart and said you'll always be in my heart.
> My hope is that I will see her again next year.
> 
> For so long we have been told to *bubble*, *distance*, *wear masks* and stay home.
> Now we are told that our families will be safe if we increase our bubbles over 100%.
> What happens to the kids if parents get sick,,who will care for them.
> I am especially concerned for single parents should they fall ill.
> I am still struggling with the sense of this.
> 
> Hugs
> Mel


 
oh Mel so hard . Thinking of your friend that she has a safe journey . xo
From the early days in March we have had a plan as being a single parent I’ve felt obligated.  I am blessed my oldest just turned 18  and isn’t moving from home for school because of all this ( extra year of college here now ) so now there are 2  “adults “ in the home.
Big kids 18,14 and I if we get sick will self isolate in their rooms. I have Isolation kits like  extra garbage bags and cans and whatnot in hallway closet, as well as all Tylenol, Kleenex ,etc Ready to move into affected persons room. My pantry is full of easy make meals, cereals, sandwich wraps, peanut butters etc  so god forbid even the 2 littles 8,6 would be able to self sustain for a couple weeks if the big kids and I  all go down . If it’s one little then the little will move to my room with me so I can monitor .. and the rest of the kids are on their own.  
praying hard this is overkill but better to be prepared But being a single parent there’s a lot to think of for sure


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

This is from the HRCE website for NS:

*Plan for September*
*Here is a high-level overview of the plan for September and response plans.*

*In-class Instruction - All Students Return to Class:*


In-class instruction will resume in September.
Regional Centres for Education and the Conseil scolaire acadien provincial will have plans for their schools.
There will be enhanced cleaning measures in schools and greater emphasis on handwashing/sanitizing and physical distancing.
Mask use will be required for some grade levels and staff, for some situations.
School bus riders and drivers will are required to wear masks while on the bus.
Signs in schools will support physical distancing and health and safety practices.
Other services students accessed in school (cafeteria, meal programs) will be delivered to students.
No use of lockers.
You don't get more vague then that!

*Covid-19 Response Plans*
*Response Plan: Blended Learning Model - Some Students in Class, Some at Home:*

Pre-primary to grade 8 students will receive in-class instruction in smaller class sizes.
Grades 9 to 12 will be supported to learn from home.
Students in all grades who need SchoolsPlus services will continue to receive them at school.
Regional Centres for Education and the Conseil scolaire acadien provincial will have plans for those children, students, and staff, who need to be at school.
School bus riders and drivers are required to wear masks while on the bus.
Signs in schools will support physical distancing and health and safety practices.
Other services students accessed in school (cafeteria, meal programs) will be delivered to students.
Response plan can be applied province-wide, to a specific region, or to a specific school, at the direction of public health.


----------



## Frozen2014

I'm in Ontario and have one kid in secondary school and one in elementary (entering grade 6).  I'm glad that they are going back in some form and our kids...by their grade...are required to wear masks. 

My older one has a mix, but it's not 50/50.  He'll basically be in school every other morning...then the rest at home either with online realtime instruction and also assigned work similar to how it's been.  Class sizes are small and they do not have their lunch there.  I am comfortable with his plan, even though he won't even be in school that much overall.

My younger one as others have said is full time but large class sizes.  It's the latter that concerns me.  We typically have her in a before and after care.  If all was normal, the plan this year was to just keep her in the morning care. But since DH and I are home it's not needed. But moreover, I didn't want to expose her to a second cohort.

Both my kids have been at camp this summer.  Counselors (my older one) must wear a mask, but campers do not.  They are in their cohorts of 10 only and they stick to only those groups.  At activities, the person running it social distances, and the camp cleans things very well.

I'm quite nervous but I think it's good to get them back.  Our numbers here are low but just pray they stay that way.  Any covid occurrence will be an issue and can snowball quickly.


----------



## vegs1

MoreTravels said:


> My wife and I are the worried type. We often wear face shield and N95 to shop in a supermarket. We only go to a park when there is no one else there. That said, I am sending my youngest child to a daycare now in preparation of the in-person classroom attendance. He is in Grade 1. I have noticed a tremendous loss of social skills after him staying home with only family members for 6 months. He has forgotten how to take turn to speak, ask politely, and work independently. It has been well described in medical and psychological literature. I am seeing that in my own child. This has caused me more concern than COVID.
> 
> 
> https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-05-developmental-regression-children-covid-.html
> 
> As much as we are scared and would like to keep him home until vaccine availability, we are more worried that he will miss a critical component of social development if he does not meet real humans other than his immediate family members. Zoom or online meetings do not work for young elementary kids. It is not an easy decision. However, it is like driving. There is a risk of car accident and death every-time we drive. But we still drive despite the risks. I guess it's about risks and benefits... In my child's case, I believe the benefits of attending a school in person far outweigh the risks. That is my opinion as a concerned parent.



I am a bit of a worrier, too. Not over the top but I like to see what is happening and how things will move forward clearly. My kids are being asked to decide if they want at home or in school learning for their children when the school board hasn’t even released their plan yet. Seems a bit unfair and yes, life is unfair. 

We have been extremely conscious, as have our kids, to not discuss all of the Covid19 and back to school issues in front of the children.  They know there is a virus which causes illness in people so for now we have to maintain distance. That’s it. They wash their hands properly, wear masks when out.  We don’t want them to be terrified of life so we made sure that conversations they needed as I mentioned were discussed but every day talk about it all is not done in front of them.  I actuallyhope that when they all go back to daycare and school that parents and teachers think before speaking and do not discuss all of the Covid19 back to school issues or illness issues in front of the kids. I feel that sometimes there is just too much openly discussed in front of small children.

We have all worked extremely hard to keep up with social skills for them such as saying please and thank you, not interrupting because they should be doing that no matter what.  Yes, they have had their fair share of meltdowns....to be expected.  As the article says, regression is also normal in children and with all of the stress they see parents under, as well as their lives changing with no school, not as many visits, it’s understandable.  

I think we are all worried. I don’t personally know anyone who is happy to be sending their kids back with no concern whatsoever.  I think we are all just not good with the unknown.


----------



## vegs1

Frozen2014 said:


> Both my kids have been at camp this summer.  Counselors (my older one) must wear a mask, but campers do not.  They are in their cohorts of 10 only and they stick to only those groups.  At activities, the person running it social distances, and the camp cleans things very well.



We have our “huggable” bubble of 10.  Once the kids go back to school and they are in contact with so many more kids, that exposes all of us further. Just curious how you handled that when the kids were at camp.  Did your personal bubble change to accommodate?


----------



## Pumpkin1172

It is hard to know what is too much...or what is too little.  The virus is here...it is NOT going away.  All we can do is find ways to safely move forward with our lives.  The medical community doesn't even have a true picture of " real numbers" of infections, due to limited testing, people being told to stay home, even though they were exhibiting symptoms.  the numbers of people who have already had the virus, is way higher than what is being presented by all health authorities...including the WHO.  Is this a virus that is going to linger around like the cold or flu - where some people will get extremely sick and have serious complications from it.  Once we get it, do we get it again.  If it acts more like the common cold or seasonal flu...how is a vaccine going to help that?  What about the numbers of people who have recovered from it?  And before anyone decides to be a keyboard warrior...I am NOT talking about someone who in immunocompromised.  I am talking about the general public.  Those who are at risk...are taking the same precautions that they would against other viruses/diseases like the seasonal flu and other nasty bugs that go around.  

There are WAYYYYYYYY too many unanswered questions about the virus.  The medical community of learning more and more about the virus daily.  We take many risks daily by leaving our homes to even get to work.  Does this mean I'm going to just run around all willey nilley.  NOPE...but we also take a look at how we can limit our exposure while still trying to life our lives.  

I do know, that our youngest ds is VERY ready to go back to school.  He misses his friends, the daily interaction of his peers, having his mind challenged.  He is in gr 12.  My fear is that he will be short changed in his education with the virus.  This is it for him.  He needs his teachers to be able to complete his education, so that he can go to university next year.  I think he will be part of what the Gr 12 of last school year experienced.  He won't get the challenges of being educated, shortchanged on the experiences of being in Gr 12 etc etc etc.  And that makes my heart sad for him.  Will he just roll with it...yes he will.  He always does.  His metal health is needing him to go back to school.  His mental health outweighs the risks of him getting sick with the virus.


----------



## Frozen2014

vegs1 said:


> We have our “huggable” bubble of 10.  Once the kids go back to school and they are in contact with so many more kids, that exposes all of us further. Just curious how you handled that when the kids were at camp.  Did your personal bubble change to accommodate?


Yes very true.  The school "bubble" will be way more than 10.
We decided to let our kids go to camp, but outside of that we are very cautious.  They have not had playdates, and the only family we see are my inlaws and I've seen my aunt and dad's partner.  And those are still keeping a distance and masks if not.  Our circumstances are a bit different though as my dad was actually very sick the past few months (nothing to do with covid but same timing) so we've really been extra cautious anyways (sadly he passed away right before camp started).  I found it frustrating too as extended family was pressuring us to see them and do things but we had to be extra careful due to his health. 
You make a good point though that there is no bubble of 10 once school starts.


----------



## bababear_50

Well I just figured out why my school needs so many repairs,,,it's ......................................wait for it

127 years Old!!! 

Hugs
Mel


----------



## quandrea

The thing with the half days a few times a week is it seems an inordinate amount of risk to assume for such little payoff. We have already withdrawn our kids from the system entirely, but if still choosing public education, I’d be picking home online learning simply because the hybrid model offers so little in school time. High risk. Low reward.


----------



## wdwmom3

quandrea said:


> The thing with the half days a few times a week is it seems an inordinate amount of risk to assume for such little payoff. We have already withdrawn our kids from the system entirely, but if still choosing public education, I’d be picking home online learning simply because the hybrid model offers so little in school time. High risk. Low reward.


Actually many of the highschool models I’ve seen do offer a lot to students.  Many students don’t do well with 100% online learning.  With the mixed approach they have a good mix of teacher led and independent work.  Any concerns or problems the students have can be addressed in person in class.  While they can use the time outside of class for reading, assignments etc.  When you are talking about highschool it’s not the amount of time that’s important.  It’s how it’s used.  And smaller classes will likely mean teachers can cover more in a shorter amount of time.


----------



## vegs1

Frozen2014 said:


> Yes very true.  The school "bubble" will be way more than 10.
> We decided to let our kids go to camp, but outside of that we are very cautious.  They have not had playdates, and the only family we see are my inlaws and I've seen my aunt and dad's partner.  And those are still keeping a distance and masks if not.  Our circumstances are a bit different though as my dad was actually very sick the past few months (nothing to do with covid but same timing) so we've really been extra cautious anyways (sadly he passed away right before camp started).  I found it frustrating too as extended family was pressuring us to see them and do things but we had to be extra careful due to his health.
> You make a good point though that there is no bubble of 10 once school starts.



I am so sorry for your loss. Losing a parent is so difficult. 

It is so hard and I know our bubble will have to change. Too much risk with the kids all going back.


----------



## bababear_50

Planning For Teaching During Covid
https://www.weareteachers.com/plann...63BimHnk5hjz4EiSrRc1TjYjo2ZyLwKZ02isYBCRT-QMw


----------



## hdrolfe

Well Ottawa Catholic Board shared their plans, at 4:20 pm, which was a bit annoying since when they said they would share it Monday I thought they meant Monday morning. The plans are generally vague, apparently schools will provide more details AFTER parents have decided to send or keep their kids home. The details I wanted, like how the cohorts will work, is it the class or the grade? What will the schedule be like? They did share they will be using Hapara (again) for the online learning but it will be the same curriculum as the in class kids, who will also be doing assignments on there. Online kids will have access to teachers to ask for help since their teacher will be teaching the in class people. The online kids will be part of a class, and they are asking to stick with your decision until first report cards come out in late October. So a two month commitment I guess. This is for the elementary kids. I didn't read the high school. Grade 7 & 8 will follow the elementary plans. 

He wants to go, so I said he can go for the two months, but we'll re-evaluate if necessary. He doesn't want to do online because he doesn't think he will be able to do it, he knows he will be too distracted. I am hopeful some parents will keep their kids home, since his classes are usually 23 or so kids, and they are counted in the class numbers if they stay home, hopefully it will work out. I wish the school plans came first but it's a catch 22, they can't plan without the numbers and parents want more information to decide first.


----------



## momof2gr8kids

Northern Disney Girl said:


> Have been reading along. Posting what our board sent out today (Lakehead Public Schools in Thunder Bay).
> My DD is going into grade 12 so this for secondary.
> The year has been split into 4 “quadmesters”. Each “quadmester” will have 2 classes. One in the morning, one in the afternoon. Only one room change per day.
> I dont yet have info on lunchtime or bathroom breaks. (School board is holding a town hall meeting for parents This week)
> My DD is also in the International Baccalaureate program so her classes are already a smaller size.
> Mandatory masks, etc.
> We live close to her school so she walks.
> All things considered, I feel fairly ok with this.
> she is excited to be going back to school


The catholic board is doing the same thing for high school students.  DS is going into in grade 11, also walks to school, so we're ok with it as well.  He also mainly hangs with 4 close friends- he's not the social butterfly that will have to be doing everything with everyone at the school.  He wasn't disciplined enough with online learning, and both of us were working, so we weren't here to keep on him to get his work done first, and get off the PS4!


----------



## hdrolfe

I was reading some of the high school plans for here, the Catholic board is doing 2 - 3 mornings a week in class, for 2 1/2 hours, then kids go home for lunch and stay there doing an online class (teacher led). Parents are not happy. Basically 5 to 7 1/2 hours in class a week.


----------



## Best_Vacation_EVER!

hdrolfe said:


> I was reading some of the high school plans for here, the Catholic board is doing 2 - 3 mornings a week in class, for 2 1/2 hours, then kids go home for lunch and stay there doing an online class (teacher led). Parents are not happy. Basically 5 to 7 1/2 hours in class a week.



Our DS goes to an Ottawa Catholic High School and that is the plan (at least until January) --- I'm not super thrilled about only having the half day thing for the in-class portion, as we thought it would be 2 full days per week  (and 3 full days on alternate weeks) but it is what it is and they did say it may evolve depending on how things go.  We have already decided to drive him to/from school instead of taking the bus.    It's got to be a tough job for the school boards though to balance safety (students, teachers, and staff), contracts, transportation, budget issues, having to expand capacity/offerings online, etc.... so I'm definitely willing to give them credit for coming up with a plan, communicating it, and being ready to react to changing conditions.   Will be interested in seeing how the "quad-mesters" work out.


----------



## Frozen2014

Same schedule for my son in high school (non catholic school).  I figure some in person is better than none.  It does make me nervous sending them back so it's a start while things are still unsure.  I get it as I assume they are avoiding the kids hanging around for lunch.  It's easier with little kids to keep them in their classrooms at lunch time.


----------



## quandrea

Best_Vacation_EVER! said:


> Our DS goes to an Ottawa Catholic High School and that is the plan (at least until January) --- I'm not super thrilled about only having the half day thing for the in-class portion, as we thought it would be 2 full days per week  (and 3 full days on alternate weeks) but it is what it is and they did say it may evolve depending on how things go.  We have already decided to drive him to/from school instead of taking the bus.    It's got to be a tough job for the school boards though to balance safety (students, teachers, and staff), contracts, transportation, budget issues, having to expand capacity/offerings online, etc.... so I'm definitely willing to give them credit for coming up with a plan, communicating it, and being ready to react to changing conditions.   Will be interested in seeing how the "quad-mesters" work out.


I think the quadmesters could be very good for learning, so long as a child doesn’t get sick and miss school. In our homeschool, I often “blitz” a unit. We go hard on a topic to get it finished all at once. This helps with continuity and the overall concepts connect in a more cohesive manner. I could see this in the condensed manner of course delivery this year. However, if a child falls ill, and can’t work for a bit due to illness, he or she will fall significantly behind. In math and science especially, catching up will be near impossible.


----------



## hdrolfe

quandrea said:


> I think the quadmesters could be very good for learning, so long as a child doesn’t get sick and miss school. In our homeschool, I often “blitz” a unit. We go hard on a topic to get it finished all at once. This helps with continuity and the overall concepts connect in a more cohesive manner. I could see this in the condensed manner of course delivery this year. However, if a child falls ill, and can’t work for a bit due to illness, he or she will fall significantly behind. In math and science especially, catching up will be near impossible.



Or if they have to quarantine for 2 weeks because of any kind of illness. It seems like they are all requiring a student to not be in class if they have any symptoms, either for 2 weeks or they can get tested and then it's only 72 hours after the last symptom. Which could still be a long time considering how long some coughs and such last. I wonder if they'd  be allowed to switch to online only at that point? Often they aren't "can't do anything" sick but just a general cold or such. 

This is going to be quite the interesting school year... I have moments I am tempted to pull him out completely and "unschool" him but he wants to go see his friends.


----------



## pigletto

My son is going into Grade 11. Our board will be doing cohorts of approx. 15 students. He will go two days one week and three the next. They will do three 75 minute blocks a day in the same classroom and come home and do an additional 75 minutes. My understanding is that it’s one class per day, in mini blocks of two weeks.  There will be no cafeteria or designated lunch. Busing will be one student every other seat.

We have a considerate and socially responsible kid. We trust him  and we feel like he should get at least a third of the say in his decision to return or not. So we all sat down and talked it out. His father and I were more on the side of not returning and doing the online option. He was far more on the side of returning. He takes his future very seriously and is very anxious about the online option. 

He struggled a great deal in the Spring with the online model. I told him it would probably be better now that there’s been time to perfect the delivery . He very understandably said he didn’t want to leave his grade 11 year up to “probably”. The program he is hoping to get into for university had an entrance average of 92 last year. And he can do it. But not with the way learning went in the spring. We completely understand that it was foisted upon teachers at the last second and they had to scramble to make it work at all. We are VERY pro educator. However, he did have two teachers who I would say did less than the bare minimum, one of whom only answered 1 of 5 emails sent for help. This same teacher basically just dumped his lesson plan online and said “Go for it”. DS taught himself grade 11 history. Was it a hardship ? No. It’s a pretty first world problem. But he’s not trusting the online model and I don’t blame him.

So there we are. And it turns out I don’t feel any better about having made a decision than when we hadn’t made one. We are moving forward into the unknown.


----------



## Iralyn

hdrolfe said:


> The plans are generally vague, apparently schools will provide more details AFTER parents have decided to send or keep their kids home.



Similar for my daughter's board.  They say that they may alter school schedules, including start and end times, but give no details.  Because of our circumstances, going back to school is likely the only practical choice but if they change school start and end times or other things that could create enough headaches that I would want to reconsider.


----------



## hdrolfe

Iralyn said:


> Similar for my daughter's board.  They say that they may alter school schedules, including start and end times, but give no details.  Because of our circumstances, going back to school is likely the only practical choice but if they change school start and end times or other things that could create enough headaches that I would want to reconsider.



This for sure. They also speak about the before/after school programs that are in the schools... how will that run with staggered start/end times? It's all so frustrating... always waiting for more details. I am lucky, my boss will be accomodating of start/end times, also because I am able to work from home, but not all parents are so lucky. 

I have the added bonus that kiddo does not usually get along with his teachers, he's had a few that were ok but certainly most have been hard for him. So if he gets one who he doesn't do ok with it will just add to the frustrations here.


----------



## hdrolfe

pigletto said:


> My son is going into Grade 11. Our board will be doing cohorts of approx. 15 students. He will go two days one week and three the next. They will do three 75 minute blocks a day in the same classroom and come home and do an additional 75 minutes. My understanding is that it’s one class per day, in mini blocks of two weeks.  There will be no cafeteria or designated lunch. Busing will be one student every other seat.
> 
> We have a considerate and socially responsible kid. We trust him  and we feel like he should get at least a third of the say in his decision to return or not. So we all sat down and talked it out. His father and I were more on the side of not returning and doing the online option. He was far more on the side of returning. He takes his future very seriously and is very anxious about the online option.
> 
> He struggled a great deal in the Spring with the online model. I told him it would probably be better now that there’s been time to perfect the delivery . He very understandably said he didn’t want to leave his grade 11 year up to “probably”. The program he is hoping to get into for university had an entrance average of 92 last year. And he can do it. But not with the way learning went in the spring. We completely understand that it was foisted upon teachers at the last second and they had to scramble to make it work at all. We are VERY pro educator. However, he did have two teachers who I would say did less than the bare minimum, one of whom only answered 1 of 5 emails sent for help. This same teacher basically just dumped his lesson plan online and said “Go for it”. DS taught himself grade 11 history. Was it a hardship ? No. It’s a pretty first world problem. But he’s not trusting the online model and I don’t blame him.
> 
> So there we are. And it turns out I don’t feel any better about having made a decision than when we hadn’t made one. We are moving forward into the unknown.



Our board indicated that the online portions will have teachers available to answer questions, it may not be the actual teacher but they will have those who are unable to work in school to do this part. It changes a bit between elementary and secondary but I understood that there would be additional help available. Hopefully, for everyone, the online will go better this time around. But yes, it does still require a certain amount of "self teaching" I think. 

Oh, the fully online model for our board is the same as whatever they currently use for a fully online model, one course at a time. It sounded like they've been doing that for awhile so it's not new and must have been working before, just will probably have a lot more kids now. It's the hybrid model where there will be additional help for the online bits.


----------



## mshanson3121

And it starts. My friend sent me this. Granted it's in Alabama, but still a glimpse of what will likely happen here. Not even so much a positive case, that's just a given, but the quarantining of large numbers of people. So how do families and schools manage this?

https://www.waaytv.com/content/news...bers-in-coronavirus-quarantine-572070701.html


----------



## quandrea

hdrolfe said:


> Or if they have to quarantine for 2 weeks because of any kind of illness. It seems like they are all requiring a student to not be in class if they have any symptoms, either for 2 weeks or they can get tested and then it's only 72 hours after the last symptom. Which could still be a long time considering how long some coughs and such last. I wonder if they'd  be allowed to switch to online only at that point? Often they aren't "can't do anything" sick but just a general cold or such.
> 
> This is going to be quite the interesting school year... I have moments I am tempted to pull him out completely and "unschool" him but he wants to go see his friends.


I’m a huge homeschool/unschool advocate. I always tell people, if you are the least bit curious, give it a try. When I started with my twins, I gave myself until Christmas to see if it was a good fit. We’ve been homeschooling nine years now. It’s allowed travel, independence in learning, self direction, autonomy. All three of my kids are very social—it is just separated from school. They all say, we are at school to work, socialising happens later.

One of the huge benefits that we didn’t plan for, is each child will have the opportunity for a gap year if they desire. They will all graduate a year early because they got so far ahead in elementary school. Homeschool also allowed dd the flexibility to pursue high performance swimming.

Anyway, if you have the itch, it might be worth exploring.


----------



## mort1331

So thats will be one of many questions..if there is one case..how many are sent to isolate? I know there is no magic bubble..but we have to start with something and see. And I knoe some will say that experiment is with my kids life or my parents life. The reality is unless you have ypur bunker in the back yard and dont plan to come out for a couple of years, nothing is full proof. Also the flip is the complaints of isolation and how negative that is. Its even hard to weigh the pros and cons to it all as we dont have full models that are not guesses to how each plays out.
Do your best research, find your semi-comfortable position and go fo it.


----------



## mort1331

quandrea said:


> I’m a huge homeschool/unschool advocate. I always tell people, if you are the least bit curious, give it a try. When I started with my twins, I gave myself until Christmas to see if it was a good fit. We’ve been homeschooling nine years now. It’s allowed travel, independence in learning, self direction, autonomy. All three of my kids are very social—it is just separated from school. They all say, we are at school to work, socialising happens later.
> 
> One of the huge benefits that we didn’t plan for, is each child will have the opportunity for a gap year if they desire. They will all graduate a year early because they got so far ahead in elementary school. Homeschool also allowed dd the flexibility to pursue high performance swimming.
> 
> Anyway, if you have the itch, it might be worth exploring.


Great for you and the thousands that do. As long as the parent can stay home and feel comfortable to do it.


----------



## hdrolfe

quandrea said:


> I’m a huge homeschool/unschool advocate. I always tell people, if you are the least bit curious, give it a try. When I started with my twins, I gave myself until Christmas to see if it was a good fit. We’ve been homeschooling nine years now. It’s allowed travel, independence in learning, self direction, autonomy. All three of my kids are very social—it is just separated from school. They all say, we are at school to work, socialising happens later.
> 
> One of the huge benefits that we didn’t plan for, is each child will have the opportunity for a gap year if they desire. They will all graduate a year early because they got so far ahead in elementary school. Homeschool also allowed dd the flexibility to pursue high performance swimming.
> 
> Anyway, if you have the itch, it might be worth exploring.



I am reading a lot about it and wish it had been possible sooner for him given his school problems. Given my newfound ability to work from home, and how well he's been doing recently with less game playing and more interest in other things, it's very tempting. We will try in school but I am prepared to pull him out. Hopefully I'll be able to figure out ways to keep him socialized outside of school. Current restrictions make any socialization that much harder. Thanks (and any tips, feel free to send me a message, I don't know anyone who does this here and would love to hear how it really works).


----------



## wdwmom3

mort1331 said:


> Great for you and the thousands that do. As long as the parent can stay home and feel comfortable to do it.



And great for the kids who are a fit with that. A lot of kids aren’t. I know my son isn’t. Sure I can teach him, but he needs to be in school, away from mom and dad. He needs the social aspect, to learn how to deal with things on his own (when we aren’t there), how to cope with all different types of personalities etc. Since being home he’s moody, more withdrawn, snapping at people including some of his friends.

We need to stop downplaying the affect not being in school has on a lot of kids.


----------



## hdrolfe

wdwmom3 said:


> And great for the kids who are a fit with that. A lot of kids aren’t. I know my son isn’t. Sure I can teach him, but he needs to be in school, away from mom and dad. He needs the social aspect, to learn how to deal with things on his own (when we aren’t there), how to cope with all different types of personalities etc. Since being home he’s moody, more withdrawn, snapping at people including some of his friends.
> 
> We need to stop downplaying the affect not being in school has on a lot of kids.



It's interesting isn't it, how everyone (kids included) are so different? It took my kid a couple months but he is now actually doing better, though I also credit that with him getting off the games in addition to not being in school. He only plays a couple things now that he actually really likes, as opposed to what his friends liked. Any way, he was like you describe when in school. He gets so anxious to "please" everyone that he just gets overwhelmed. He loves being with his friends, but not so much the teachers. He also has no interest in sitting and doing an online course or a workbook, but ask him anything about planes and he'll go on and on about the biggest, fastest, what it takes to land one, how they fly... all stuff he learned himself because it interested him. Heaven forbid you ask him to write something down though... I totally agree that kids need to play and spend time with one another to learn the social skills, to know how to get along with each other and "follow the rules". Kids are so different from one to another, and they do need to learn to all get along. I sometimes think there are a few adults I work with that could use a bit more skill in that area too


----------



## mshanson3121

quandrea said:


> I’m a huge homeschool/unschool advocate. I always tell people, if you are the least bit curious, give it a try. When I started with my twins, I gave myself until Christmas to see if it was a good fit. We’ve been homeschooling nine years now. It’s allowed travel, independence in learning, self direction, autonomy. All three of my kids are very social—it is just separated from school. They all say, we are at school to work, socialising happens later.
> 
> One of the huge benefits that we didn’t plan for, is each child will have the opportunity for a gap year if they desire. They will all graduate a year early because they got so far ahead in elementary school. Homeschool also allowed dd the flexibility to pursue high performance swimming.
> 
> Anyway, if you have the itch, it might be worth exploring.



Yes, 1000x over, yes. We started homeschooling due to special needs with the intention to put them in school when issues were a little better managed. Well, that was 9 years ago, and we have 0 intention of putting them in school now (even before Covid, lol).  




mort1331 said:


> So thats will be one of many questions..if there is one case..how many are sent to isolate?



In this article, it was every single person who was within 6' of the person for 10 minutes or longer. So, at one school alone, _one_ student and _one_ teacher tested positive - and now there are over 70 people in a 2 week quarantine.



hdrolfe said:


> I am reading a lot about it and wish it had been possible sooner for him given his school problems. Given my newfound ability to work from home, and how well he's been doing recently with less game playing and more interest in other things, it's very tempting. We will try in school but I am prepared to pull him out. Hopefully I'll be able to figure out ways to keep him socialized outside of school. Current restrictions make any socialization that much harder. Thanks (and any tips, feel free to send me a message, I don't know anyone who does this here and would love to hear how it really works).



We have allowed outdoor visits with friends, which hasn't been an issue for them at all. They also have tablets, so they talk to their friends daily on that. They have also had visits where they all wore masks. There are lots of ways to make socialization work/happen! They just take some creative thinking and... the willingness to adapt one's way of thinking. 

If you want to mesasge me with any questions you may have re: homeschooling, please feel free! The tips I have could fill a book, so it's probably easier for you to ask specifics, lol. Also, even if you're just considering homeschooling, or want to learn more about it - join some groups on Facebook!


----------



## wdwmom3

hdrolfe said:


> It's interesting isn't it, how everyone (kids included) are so different? It took my kid a couple months but he is now actually doing better, though I also credit that with him getting off the games in addition to not being in school. He only plays a couple things now that he actually really likes, as opposed to what his friends liked. Any way, he was like you describe when in school. He gets so anxious to "please" everyone that he just gets overwhelmed. He loves being with his friends, but not so much the teachers. He also has no interest in sitting and doing an online course or a workbook, but ask him anything about planes and he'll go on and on about the biggest, fastest, what it takes to land one, how they fly... all stuff he learned himself because it interested him. Heaven forbid you ask him to write something down though... I totally agree that kids need to play and spend time with one another to learn the social skills, to know how to get along with each other and "follow the rules". Kids are so different from one to another, and they do need to learn to all get along. I sometimes think there are a few adults I work with that could use a bit more skill in that area too



I’ve talked to a few friends who say the same thing. Their kids have changed. Others they haven’t and are doing great. But a lot of people just want to argue about how safe school is, but don’t want to address what keeping schools closed is doing to many kids.

There are kids like my son who just need to be back in that environment for their development. There are others who don’t have the supports at home, with parents who just can’t do it all (especially single parents). There are kids who are sadly living in very bad, toxic environments and need the escape school gives them.

There are lots of reasons why some kids need school.  And it makes me sad so few want to even acknowledge it.


----------



## quandrea

mshanson3121 said:


> Yes, 1000x over, yes. We started homeschooling due to special needs with the intention to put them in school when issues were a little better managed. Well, that was 9 years ago, and we have 0 intention of putting them in school now (even before Covid, lol).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In this article, it was every single person who was within 6' of the person for 10 minutes or longer. So, at one school alone, _one_ student and _one_ teacher tested positive - and now there are over 70 people in a 2 week quarantine.
> 
> 
> 
> We have allowed outdoor visits with friends, which hasn't been an issue for them at all. They also have tablets, so they talk to their friends daily on that. They have also had visits where they all wore masks. There are lots of ways to make socialization work/happen! They just take some creative thinking and... the willingness to adapt one's way of thinking.
> 
> If you want to mesasge me with any questions you may have re: homeschooling, please feel free! The tips I have could fill a book, so it's probably easier for you to ask specifics, lol. Also, even if you're just considering homeschooling, or want to learn more about it - join some groups on Facebook!


Everything @mshanson3121 said!  My kids have been socialising all through this pandemic. We have plans this afternoon, in fact!  With homeschooling, you not only have to take responsibility for your child’s learning, but also must take responsibility to ensure they are out in the world meeting people, having fun, connecting. It’s never been a problem. I was a public and private school teacher years ago. I like that my kids don’t equate school with socialising. They equate school with work. That was always my expectation as a classroom teacher. Work now. Play later. Unfortunately most of my students didn’t agree. It was a real impediment to learning.


----------



## mshanson3121

hdrolfe said:


> I totally agree that kids need to play and spend time with one another to learn the social skills, to know how to get along with each other and "follow the rules". Kids are so different from one to another, and they do need to learn to all get along. I sometimes think there are a few adults I work with that could use a bit more skill in that area too



The best place to learn these skills is honestly from home. But over the last years, parents have been increasingly leaving it up to the schools and teachers to teach these things. My kids never went to school, were never in activities until they were older. They had 0 issue learning social skills. Why? Because _we_ taught them, and because they had each other. There is nothing better than siblings from which to learn the importance of sharing, taking turns, listening, understanding, cooperating, compromise, problem solving, terrorist negotiation etc....  I will say, in the cases of an only child, exterior socialization does then become more beneficial, for sure. But seriously... think of the all the pioneers and the immigrants, who lived largely isolated from each other when they were settling in new areas. Their only source of socialization? Their family. Or the distant neighbour they saw once in awhile. Or the rare trip to town. And yet, they still learned social skills. How? Their parents. The idea that school is somehow necessary for teaching social skills is such a false construct. And it's definitely been a detriment, as it has in part led to leaving it up to the school to teach the habits and morals that parents once took upon themselves. Okay, rant over.


----------



## Donald - my hero

*I haven't seen this shared (mind you I'm only following as a very interested community member who's wanting to know what's happening in our country for everyone, kids & adults alike) but this article made me very unsettled for the Quebecois members of the boards and slightly worried for the rest of us.*
*Seems the Quebec Education Minister has modified their back-to-school plans with regards to mask wearing (not required everywhere despite the entire province being mandated to wear one inside?!) and this bothers me because, well, it eliminates the possibility of families wanting to keep their kids home because they don't feel it's safe (something i think should be a family decision until we get a clearer view of how  safe schools actually will be) sure you can keep them home but you'll need a medical exemption!

Direct quote from the article
The minister also responded to concerned parents who fear that their child or a relative is particularly vulnerable to the virus: “Your children have the right to be taught at home,” he said, but they will have to seek a doctor’s note to obtain an exemption from in-person classes. *

*https://montrealgazette.com/news/ma...THL5V3L-GG2U09QNjkAEUn5NTg3Ht1a7qjX74NRauQHCo*


----------



## wdwmom3

Donald - my hero said:


> *I haven't seen this shared (mind you I'm only following as a very interested community member who's wanting to know what's happening in our country for everyone, kids & adults alike) but this article made me very unsettled for the Quebecois members of the boards and slightly worried for the rest of us.*
> *Seems the Quebec Education Minister has modified their back-to-school plans with regards to mask wearing (not required everywhere despite the entire province being mandated to wear one inside?!) and this bothers me because, well, it eliminates the possibility of families wanting to keep their kids home because they don't feel it's safe (something i think should be a family decision until we get a clearer view of how  safe schools actually will be) sure you can keep them home but you'll need a medical exemption!
> 
> Direct quote from the article
> The minister also responded to concerned parents who fear that their child or a relative is particularly vulnerable to the virus: “Your children have the right to be taught at home,” he said, but they will have to seek a doctor’s note to obtain an exemption from in-person classes. *
> 
> *https://montrealgazette.com/news/ma...THL5V3L-GG2U09QNjkAEUn5NTg3Ht1a7qjX74NRauQHCo*



yeah that’s wrong. Above all else families have the option to choose what’s best for them. Like I’ve said every child and every situation is different. Some kids may need to go back, for others the thought of going back could give them a lot of anxiety.

Families need to be able to make their own choice.


----------



## FigmentSpark

There's been one good thing for my DS.  He was grounded in Feb for vaping.  We were struggling to get a handle on it.  With the quarantine (and the grounding together), he wasn't around the kids who were also vaping and he wasn't able to get it.  Now, 6 months later, it's not even on his radar.  And hopefully, it'll stay that way.  He graduated, so that school and those kids are done for him.  He's on to other, better things, now.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

@FigmentSpark nothing like a fresh start for kids and teens!


----------



## hdrolfe

And now I'm trying to get in touch with kiddo's friends parents, and so far most of them are keeping their kids home. So the benefit will be much less if he can't even play with the friends at school (if it's only girls going, since we don't keep in touch with their parents, I will never hear the end of it).


----------



## bcwife76

The start of the school year is being pushed back from September 8 in BC. No new date has been announced yet.


----------



## SleeplessInTO

We are going to be called to answer a survey about what we plan to do for school in September. (Toronto District School Board)
https://www.tdsb.on.ca/Pre-Registration-Survey


----------



## Aladora

bcwife76 said:


> The start of the school year is being pushed back from September 8 in BC. No new date has been announced yet.



I was just coming here to post this! 

Given the fact that we were posting numbers around 10-20 new cases per day in June and are now back up in the 40-50 per day range, I am not at all surprised by the announcement today. My son is going to a private school this year so I have no idea yet what their plan is, last news we got from the school is that they are basically following the public schools so I anticipate that the next email I get from them will be that the start date is going to be pushed back.

We have an appointment at the school store on Thursday to get all of his uniforms so I guess we will carry on with the expectation that at some point this year he will need them!


----------



## Disneylover99

SleeplessInTO said:


> We are going to be called to answer a survey about what we plan to do for school in September. (Toronto District School Board)
> https://www.tdsb.on.ca/Pre-Registration-Survey


I was just reading up on this. The phone number begins with 1-833. I didn’t recognize the number and totally blew them off today. Lol.


----------



## DisTXMom

I believe most of the Tennessee schools have not required masks. Curious to see what experience is for schools mandating masks to see if results are the same or different. Some of what’s driving the mandated quarantines isn’t confirmed cases- it’s that staff/students have been in close contact with people that are confirmed cases. I guess we will watch it unfold and hopefully learn some things along the way.


----------



## wdwmom3

Apparently the Ontario government will be announcing “updated” back to school plans later this afternoon.  Around 3:45 I think.  

Fingers crossed it’s either a modified approach for elementary, or full time with reduced class sizes.


----------



## hdrolfe

wdwmom3 said:


> Apparently the Ontario government will be announcing “updated” back to school plans later this afternoon.  Around 3:45 I think.
> 
> Fingers crossed it’s either a modified approach for elementary, or full time with reduced class sizes.



I'm doubtful, Ford has been clear he won't be changing that and it will only be "updates" to the already presented plan... which sucks. Ottawa is expecting about 10% to do online only, but from kiddo's friends it is about 50/50, including one kid whose mom is a teacher (at a different school but same board).


----------



## bababear_50

Just a guess but I think he will be announcing a delay to the timeline for back to school.
Just a guess.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## Silvermist999

After our board’s announcement on Monday of their so-called plan, there has been zero communication via Twitter let alone emails.  A group of us parents have also sent one group email to the admin as well as the school trustee, with not even a reply that they received the email.  None of us are happy with being ignored. Other school boards are holding webinars to address any concerns or questions, but this board is doing nothing.
I hope they will delay the start of the school year so they can figure things out and plan properly beforehand, not after an outbreak, they can’t expect parents to make an informed decision with so little information.


----------



## wdwmom3

Silvermist999 said:


> After our board’s announcement on Monday of their so-called plan, there has been zero communication via Twitter let alone emails.  A group of us parents have also sent one group email to the admin as well as the school trustee, with not even a reply that they received the email.  None of us are happy with being ignored. Other school boards are holding webinars to address any concerns or questions, but this board is doing nothing.
> I hope they will delay the start of the school year so they can figure things out and plan properly beforehand, not after an outbreak, they can’t expect parents to make an informed decision with so little information.



I have learnt from listening to you guys how different some school boards are.  I have to say I’m actually pretty happy with how our school board has been communicating with us.  Still some information we don’t have, but you can tell they are trying hard.  I think our school board is more prepared then others to be back in class.


----------



## hdrolfe

wdwmom3 said:


> I have learnt from listening to you guys have different some school boards are.  I have to say I’m actually pretty happy with how our school board has been communicating with us.  Still some information we don’t have, but you can tell they are trying hard.  I think our school board is more prepared then others to be back in class.



My school board has been trying as well, they have a huge FAQ up now that actually has been really helpful. And I actually got an email from the new principal at the school to everyone introducing herself and saying more info will follow soon.


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

Yesterday when a reporter asked Ford a question about poor ventilation in schools he mentioned Lecce would be coming out in the next couple of days with an announcement. This is just a guess but I think it has something to do with HVAC.


----------



## wdwmom3

DiaryofaDisneyKid said:


> Yesterday when a reporter asked Ford a question about poor ventilation in schools he mentioned Lecce would be coming out in the next couple of days with an announcement. This is just a guess but I think it has something to do with HVAC.



Just heard the officer of public health answer a reporters question saying they are looking at the ventilation in schools.  But didn’t give any details.


----------



## bcwife76

The delay in the timeline here in BC ends up o my being two days. So instead of returning Sept 8, our kids will go back Sept 10. What's the point of that? The poor teachers in our province are just being pushed from pillar to post now, not to mention all the parents. Oh and a few hours after announcing this new start date, the province announced a huge surge in cases, our third highest daily case counts since the pandemic began


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

My little Niagara town has only had 24 cases in total since the schools were shut down and most weeks we have had no cases. We will be sending our 3 kids, DS Grade 8, DD Grade 5 and DS Grade 3 back to school. They are all excellent students and did great online but missed the social aspect of school. They know school is for learning but they like learning with other children their own age. When you are in a class with 20 other kids you get 20 different views on things and learn that there are many ways to solve a problem. They may not agree with everyone in their classes but they learn to work together. Every expert agrees that if your community has low or no community transmission the chances are lower for it to spread in schools. If we start to see a jump up in community transmission to a point we feel uncomfortable, we will pull them out. All classrooms at our school have sinks and windows that open with most classes having a lower numbers of students per class. If all of the grade 3's go back there will be 2 classes of 20. If all the Grade 5's go back there will be 2 classes of 21. My oldest is the only one where the class size makes me nervous as there would be 2 Grade 8 classes of 27. Last year when he was in Grade 7 they had a 6/7 split so they spread them out and the largest class size was 24. The largest class sizes at our school was the kindergarten classes. They had 3 classes with 30 students each and I do feel this is to many. It's a tough for parents, teachers and students right now as there really is no perfect solution. I recently read something a local teacher posted online and I am going to share it here as I think it really deserves to be shared.  

LET'S BEGIN PRACTICING THIS NOW:
 When a friend says she is sending her kids back to school: 
OUR RESPONSE: "Man! I am so proud of you! I know that wasn't an easy choice to make." 
 When a friend says she is doing virtual learning with her kids:
OUR RESPONSE: "Man! I am so proud of you! I know that wasn't an easy choice to make."
 When a friend says she is home schooling her kids:
OUR RESPONSE: "Man! I am so proud of you! I know that wasn't an easy choice to make."


----------



## Aladora

bcwife76 said:


> Oh and a few hours after announcing this new start date, the province announced a huge surge in cases, our third highest daily case counts since the pandemic began




Yesterday Canada had 423 new cases and of those, 85 were in BC. Ugh ugh ugh, we HAVE to get our...poop...together again or we are going to be forced to go back to Stage 2 or even 1.


----------



## wdwmom3

DiaryofaDisneyKid said:


> My little Niagara town has only had 24 cases in total since the schools were shut down and most weeks we have had no cases. We will be sending our 3 kids, DS Grade 8, DD Grade 5 and DS Grade 3 back to school. They are all excellent students and did great online but missed the social aspect of school. They know school is for learning but they like learning with other children their own age. When you are in a class with 20 other kids you get 20 different views on things and learn that there are many ways to solve a problem. They may not agree with everyone in their classes but they learn to work together. Every expert agrees that if your community has low or no community transmission the chances are lower for it to spread in schools. If we start to see a jump up in community transmission to a point we feel uncomfortable, we will pull them out. All classrooms at our school have sinks and windows that open with most classes having a lower numbers of students per class. If all of the grade 3's go back there will be 2 classes of 20. If all the Grade 5's go back there will be 2 classes of 21. My oldest is the only one where the class size makes me nervous as there would be 2 Grade 8 classes of 27. Last year when he was in Grade 7 they had a 6/7 split so they spread them out and the largest class size was 24. The largest class sizes at our school was the kindergarten classes. They had 3 classes with 30 students each and I do feel this is to many. It's a tough for parents, teachers and students right now as there really is no perfect solution. I recently read something a local teacher posted online and I am going to share it here as I think it really deserves to be shared.
> 
> LET'S BEGIN PRACTICING THIS NOW:
> When a friend says she is sending her kids back to school:
> OUR RESPONSE: "Man! I am so proud of you! I know that wasn't an easy choice to make."
> When a friend says she is doing virtual learning with her kids:
> OUR RESPONSE: "Man! I am so proud of you! I know that wasn't an easy choice to make."
> When a friend says she is home schooling her kids:
> OUR RESPONSE: "Man! I am so proud of you! I know that wasn't an easy choice to make."



I agree with you! We really need to respect and not question other parents choices.  Everyone has different reasons for their choices and we need to support that.


----------



## Donald - my hero

wdwmom3 said:


> I agree with you! We really need to respect and not question other parents choices.  Everyone has different reasons for their choices and we need to support that.


*Agreed and can i add one other thing to that? We need to find a way to treat all of the adults who will need to be in the buildings as well with the same grace. It's not any easier for them to be walking this tightrope and when you add in that they can't as easily just decide to stay home it has to be very difficult.*


----------



## mshanson3121

Day 1 of our back to school meetings for New Brunswick. So far details released: 

- No masks required at all for grades K-5 (though they are encouraged)
- Masks required for grades 6-12, but not in the classroom. Only when outside of the classroom (hallways etc...).
- Caveat to ^^^, masks will be required in classroom for grades 9-12, if a 1m distance cannot be maintained. 
- Students in grades 6-12 will be required to sanitize their own desk and chair every time they leave the classroom for another class or at the end of the day.... because yeah, this won't cause issues  Here's a genius idea... keep the students in the same room all day, and just have the teacher's change classes. But anywho.... LOL.
- They have not finalized directives for phys. ed. yet, but there will be absolutely no singing or any wind instruments allowed. So essentially - no choir, no musicals and no band.


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

Donald - my hero said:


> *Agreed and can i add one other thing to that? We need to find a way to treat all of the adults who will need to be in the buildings as well with the same grace. It's not any easier for them to be walking this tightrope and when you add in that they can't as easily just decide to stay home it has to be very difficult.*


I definitely agree it is tough for the staff at the schools too! The teachers I have talked to in my area are excited to go back and they said they will find a way to make it work and be as safe as possible. I also know that there are staff and parents who may have health concerns and are just genuinely scared to go back or send their children back and I feel really bad for them! I will be making my DS 7 who is going into Grade 3 wear a mask even if he doesn't have to as this might help protect the staff and students. I have been practicing with all 3 at home with mask wearing and how to wear it correctly. All 3 of my kids are great at following rules and directions and know school will be different this year. If any teachers have any ideas of things that would make you feel better if your students did them feel free to share, I am willing to listen!


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

mshanson3121 said:


> Day 1 of our back to school meetings for New Brunswick. So far details released:
> 
> - No masks required at all for grades K-5 (though they are encouraged)
> - Masks required for grades 6-12, but not in the classroom. Only when outside of the classroom (hallways etc...).
> - Caveat to ^^^, masks will be required in classroom for grades 9-12, if a 1m distance cannot be maintained.
> - Students in grades 6-12 will be required to sanitize their own desk and chair every time they leave the classroom for another class or at the end of the day.... because yeah, this won't cause issues  Here's a genius idea... keep the students in the same room all day, and just have the teacher's change classes. But anywho.... LOL.
> - They have not finalized directives for phys. ed. yet, but there will be absolutely no singing or any wind instruments allowed. So essentially - no choir, no musicals and no band.


I agree with keeping the kids in the same classroom all day that makes more sense. I also really think classes should all be outside my kids would love that!


----------



## mshanson3121

Whoops, there's more, sorry: 

For busing: 

- Only one child per seat for grades K-5, no masks required. 
- Two per seat for grades 6-12, masks required.

In the event of a positive case: 

- the student/teacher/staff member and all potential contacts (which could be the class, the class bubble or potentially entire school depending) to isolate for 14 days. 

In the event of distance education being necessary during an outbreak: 

- For grades K-2, their distance learning will be paper based with a daily check in with the teacher. For grades 3-5 it will be part paper, part on line with "routine" teacher engagement (could they be any more obscure?), for grades 6-12 it will be all online with regular teaching.

Class Size & Bubbles:

- Can only interact with students in the same grade. So students in grade 3 will have to keep 2m apart from any student in any other grade, at all times. 
- K-2 will be limited to "as close to 15 students as possible"
- 3-5 will be limited to "as close to 22 students as possible"
- No change in class sizes for grades 6-12

High School: 

- High schools that can maintain distancing at all times will not have a rotating schedule. Those that can't, will have rotating schedules, which means one day students will be in school, the next they'll be home. 

General: 

- No water fountains. Bottle filling stations are being installed. 
- Shareable materials must be sterilized immediately after use. Things that can't be sterilized can only be used by one child. 
- Parents not allowed in school at all, with the exception of picking up their child. Masks required for adults entering the building.


----------



## mshanson3121

DiaryofaDisneyKid said:


> I agree with keeping the kids in the same classroom all day that makes more sense. I also really think classes should all be outside my kids would love that!



As soon as I read that to my husband (re: kids sanitizing their own equipment), he said.... "So, how long until the first student is injured because another student sprayed him in the face with disinfectant? Because I guarantee someone is going to get sprayed."


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

mshanson3121 said:


> As soon as I read that to my husband (re: kids sanitizing their own equipment), he said.... "So, how long until the first student is injured because another student sprayed him in the face with disinfectant? Because I guarantee someone is going to get sprayed."


HAHA! My DD would be great at doing this herself, my boys not so much.


----------



## wdwmom3

So in Ontario they will be allowing access to more funding so school boards can do things like lease space, hire more staff etc in order to have more spacing.  Also to use to improve ventilation and cleaning.

So not mandating smaller classes.  But allowing use of more funds so school boards can make classes smaller if they feel they need to.


----------



## wdwmom3

Apparently they have already been working at getting air filtration systems, including stand alone systems.


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

wdwmom3 said:


> Apparently they have already been working at getting air filtration systems, including stand alone systems.


I think the stand alone option is great for portables. My children's school has 2 portables. One is a grade 8 portable and the other is the french portable, although I think they will probably use that as a classroom this year and have the french teacher rotate between classes.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

I also thought the teachers should be the one changing classes versus all of the students! Teachers might not like having to lug all of their different teaching materials around though and not having their own dedicated desk.

It's a lot easier to disinfect one desk and a whiteboard/markers then 20-30 desks.


----------



## bababear_50

Hmmmm
Things parents can do to help their child prepare for school.
Here are a few.............................

1) spring laces 


https://www.amazon.ca/No-Tie-Elasti...ocphy=9000821&hvtargid=pla-451164554860&psc=1
2) pack utensils if the food requires it,,schools don't supply spoons,forks,straws.

3) wash lunch and backpacks regularly,,not seasonally or yearly

4) add ski tags to coats to help little finger do up zippers

5) have child assist in lunch decisions(1/2 to 3/4 of food sent gets thrown out...really!

6) buy water bottles and test that they don't leak before sending them in a backpack.

7) buy a proper size backpack (this year is going to be important to have that extra room).

8) pop a note or two into their lunch bag occasionally,,,makes their day.

9) pack an extra snack in the backpack side pouch,,,you never know when hunger will strike

10) YES NUTELLA has nuts in it and it can cause life threatening anaphylaxis shock/death.

11) throw a napkin /paper towels in the lunch container,,yes kids will wipe their mouths after eating.

12) Puddle jumping is a favorite Fall activity,,,pack an extra pair of socks in the bottom of the bag.

13) Glass jars & bottles are a accident waiting to happen.

14) Feed them breakfast

15) support regular bedtime routines

16) Read everyday with your child.

17 turn off the phone/computer and talk with them about their day,,(what kids see is what kids do).
     take time to talk about school.

18) Hold adult conversations for adults.

19) Support homework policies

20) Teach organizational skills starting with their personal belongings / bedroom.



Hugs
Mel


----------



## bababear_50

https://www.heretohelp.bc.ca/factsheet/back-to-school-guide-for-parents-of-young-kids
Show your children empathy ,caring and compassion,,by doing so you are teaching them how to be empathic ,caring and compassionate.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## hdrolfe

The French Catholic board here says "no backpacks" and I am glad my kiddo doesn't go to that school, how are kids supposed to get everything back and forth? Including lunch and a water bottle! Crazy


----------



## bababear_50

hdrolfe said:


> The French Catholic board here says "no backpacks" and I am glad my kiddo doesn't go to that school, how are kids supposed to get everything back and forth? Including lunch and a water bottle! Crazy



Is this for the high school group or elementary group ?
I know some high schools are not full days and they are not eating lunch at school.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## hdrolfe

bababear_50 said:


> Is this for the high school group or elementary group ?
> I know some high schools are not full days and they are not eating lunch at school.
> 
> Hugs
> Mel



Both, all grades from K thru 12. Crazy, right? Kinders will be allowed to bring a plastic bag with a change of clothes.


----------



## mshanson3121

My husband just found out today that there will be no cafeteria available at the college he teaches at. Nothing has been said yet about cafeterias at public schools in NB, but I wouldn't be surprised if they're shut down.


----------



## hdrolfe

mshanson3121 said:


> My husband just found out today that there will be no cafeteria available at the college he teaches at. Nothing has been said yet about cafeterias at public schools in NB, but I wouldn't be surprised if they're shut down.



None in Ontario, but high school kids will mostly be going home at lunch time and I don't think any elementary schools have them. But also no pizza lunches, milk program, etc.


----------



## hdrolfe

I didn't realize they have updates to the Ontario plan for the online learning, they are putting numbers to the synchronous learning component (where a teacher will lead the online class)... for kiddo's grade it would be 225 of the 300 minutes of instruction!


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

bababear_50 said:


> Hmmmm
> Things parents can do to help their child prepare for school.
> Here are a few.............................
> 
> 1) spring laces
> View attachment 518200
> 
> https://www.amazon.ca/No-Tie-Elasti...ocphy=9000821&hvtargid=pla-451164554860&psc=1
> 2) pack utensils if the food requires it,,schools don't supply spoons,forks,straws.
> 
> 3) wash lunch and backpacks regularly,,not seasonally or yearly
> 
> 4) add ski tags to coats to help little finger do up zippers
> 
> 5) have child assist in lunch decisions(1/2 to 3/4 of food sent gets thrown out...really!
> 
> 6) buy water bottles and test that they don't leak before sending them in a backpack.
> 
> 7) buy a proper size backpack (this year is going to be important to have that extra room).
> 
> 8) pop a note or two into their lunch bag occasionally,,,makes their day.
> 
> 9) pack an extra snack in the backpack side pouch,,,you never know when hunger will strike
> 
> 10) YES NUTELLA has nuts in it and it can cause life threatening anaphylaxis shock/death.
> 
> 11) throw a napkin /paper towels in the lunch container,,yes kids will wipe their mouths after eating.
> 
> 12) Puddle jumping is a favorite Fall activity,,,pack an extra pair of socks in the bottom of the bag.
> 
> 13) Glass jars & bottles are a accident waiting to happen.
> 
> 14) Feed them breakfast
> 
> 15) support regular bedtime routines
> 
> 16) Read everyday with your child.
> 
> 17 turn off the phone/computer and talk with them about their day,,(what kids see is what kids do).
> take time to talk about school.
> 
> 18) Hold adult conversations for adults.
> 
> 19) Support homework policies
> 
> 20) Teach organizational skills starting with their personal belongings / bedroom.
> 
> 
> 
> Hugs
> Mel


#12 I will have to remember for DS 7 because he is that kid.  I usually remember to pack him extra socks but with all of the new things to pack this year (masks, mask extenders, extra hand sanitizer) I forgot about socks. I am also packing travel size hand cream for my younger 2 because hand sanitizer seems to really dry out their hands. #17 is my favourite thing to do!! I love meeting the kids at the bus stop after school and seeing their excitement as they run down the sidewalk eager to tell me all about their day! Even my oldest (the teenager) has a little grin on his face and starts telling me about funny things that happened at school.


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

hdrolfe said:


> None in Ontario, but high school kids will mostly be going home at lunch time and I don't think any elementary schools have them. But also no pizza lunches, milk program, etc.


My kids don't have a cafeteria and have always eaten in their classrooms. They were disappointed about no pizza Fridays at school, so I said I would make them pizza and they can bring it on Fridays. Not the same but they were happy with the compromise.


----------



## bababear_50

Lots of changes
Unfortunately one of the main ways school councils fund themselves is Sub Day,Pizza Day,Fruit Stand, Bakery shack,etc.....
It is going to be rough coming up with some alternative ideas.

It is also going to impact some of our Spec Ed classes where we used to do a lot of cooking/baking.

I wonder if tutors in the school will happen this year.

I do know our breakfast program is in danger of being cancelled.

I usually organize a winter/Christmas food drive,,I can still organize it I think.
It's going to be a rough year for many families this year.


Hugs
Mel


----------



## Debbie

hdrolfe said:


> I didn't realize they have updates to the Ontario plan for the online learning, they are putting numbers to the synchronous learning component (where a teacher will lead the online class)... for kiddo's grade it would be 225 of the 300 minutes of instruction!


I can't imagine doing synchronous learning with the little ones. That's a lot of time in front of a screen.  I also can't imagine trying to keep them in their seats at school. It is definitely not in their natural wheelhouse.


----------



## hdrolfe

I'll be doing pizza and subway days for kiddo, those are a few lunches he will eat any way! Lunches are hard for him. I know the council raises a lot of money this way, I guess they won't need as much for field trips since those won't be happening this year. I know they use the money for other things as well. It's unfortunate. They had to give refunds last year for the unused portions as well. 

Hopefully this works for a table:

Division         Grade Level of Students    Daily Minimum Synchronous Learning Time Requirement*
Elementary    Kindergarten                      180 minutes
                      Grades 1 to 3                     225 minutes
                      Grades 4 to 8                     225 minutes
Secondary     Grades 9 to 12                   The higher of 60 minutes for each 75-minute class period** or 225 minutes per day for a full course schedule

No idea how they will do this for the kids, especially the little ones. It's hard enough in classrooms.


----------



## bababear_50

Well my board takes 1st. prize .....65 pages of info and protocols.........
Whew,,,lots to absorb.
Lots to learn.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## FigmentSpark

I can't believe our board was going to put in place 23 day 1 class Octomesters!  They changed to quadmesters last night, thank goodness.  How they thought teens could digest and really learn anything in 23 days that they would retain as a foundation for the next grade's class is beyond me.


----------



## wdwmom3

FigmentSpark said:


> I can't believe our board was going to put in place 23 day 1 class Octomesters!  They changed to quadmesters last night, thank goodness.  How they thought teens could digest and really learn anything in 23 days that they would retain as a foundation for the next grade's class is beyond me.



That’s what happens when you do a course in summer school.  So it can be done.  But it’s not a great idea.  And doing that 8 times in a row would be terrible.


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

bababear_50 said:


> Lots of changes
> Unfortunately one of the main ways school councils fund themselves is Sub Day,Pizza Day,Fruit Stand, Bakery shack,etc.....
> It is going to be rough coming up with some alternative ideas.
> 
> It is also going to impact some of our Spec Ed classes where we used to do a lot of cooking/baking.
> 
> I wonder if tutors in the school will happen this year.
> 
> I do know our breakfast program is in danger of being cancelled.
> 
> I usually organize a winter/Christmas food drive,,I can still organize it I think.
> It's going to be a rough year for many families this year.
> 
> 
> Hugs
> Mel


My oldest sons bestfriends mom is one of our schools breakfast club volunteers. I doubt they will be able to do the traditional hot breakfasts every morning in the gym but I am wondering if maybe they can hand out some sort of bagged packaged breakfast items to the kids that need them? I will have to get in touch with the school when it opens and find out if donations or gift cards for this will be accepted. I volunteered to help the kids in my youngest sons class last year with home reading. Every week I got to go to his class and listen to kids read levelled books to me. I will really miss doing that this year as I think they will be (understandably) limiting volunteers to the school.


----------



## wdwmom3

DiaryofaDisneyKid said:


> My oldest sons bestfriends mom is one of our schools breakfast club volunteers. I doubt they will be able to do the traditional hot breakfasts every morning in the gym but I am wondering if maybe they can hand out some sort of bagged packaged breakfast items to the kids that need them? I will have to get in touch with the school when it opens and find out if donations or gift cards for this will be accepted. I volunteered to help the kids in my youngest sons class last year with home reading. Every week I got to go to his class and listen to kids read levelled books to me. I will really miss doing that this year as I think they will be (understandably) limiting volunteers to the school.



My sons school had “nutrition bowls” in every classroom that was filled with different healthy foods.  The kids were told they could go and grab something from it if they were running late and didn’t have breakfast, or if they were extra hungry and didn’t have enough for lunch.  It helped take the stigma away from kids asking for food if they didn’t have enough.  Something like that could be an idea.  Maybe with those little boxes of cereal, fruit cups or things like that.


----------



## Silvermist999

FigmentSpark said:


> I can't believe our board was going to put in place 23 day 1 class Octomesters!  They changed to quadmesters last night, thank goodness.  How they thought teens could digest and really learn anything in 23 days that they would retain as a foundation for the next grade's class is beyond me.



I can only hope that our board would change to quadmesters.
They decided to stick with the regular semester, meaning no opportunity to change from in person to online or vice versa until the end of January, when the semester ends.  And more risk of exposure with four courses each semester.


----------



## MoreTravels

For those who are self employed or work for large national corporations, have you thought of moving away to rural towns where there are almost no cases and class sizes are much smaller? It’s a possibility to rent an apartment for one year and bring the entire family there for a safer environment? I guess some people in GTA must have thought about that. Then in one year the vaccine would be out (hopefully) so they move back to GTA?!


----------



## FigmentSpark

wdwmom3 said:


> That’s what happens when you do a course in summer school.  So it can be done.  But it’s not a great idea.  And doing that 8 times in a row would be terrible.


It can be done, but, as one board member said, there’s a reason most kids don’t take summer school. It’s much harder to retain.  And, if the kid misses even one day due to sickness, catching up may well be impossible.

 The board said they recommended it to keep the teens As safe as possible, all while saying they can’t afford to make smaller elementary school class sizes or increase the number of busses used so kids could socially distance.


----------



## TammyLynn33

Yeah im not feeling optimistic about this .. DD14 starting high school full size classes , capacity buses but in quads.so exposed to 40- 60 kids And whoever they associate with and then the bus . 
Ds6 that seems Like a lot of screen time . 
DS8 ASD was hoping he’d get in 3/4 split he didn’t 2:3 classes only Recommending masks but same teacher he was not a good fit with at all last year. He made such academic strides last year at home
Apparently the 3/4 teacher is less of a fit I was told. Take the known evil . I can’t be texted every day with he’s doing this or doing that or .. I wanted to beat my head off the wall last year. Do I want that stress level as a HCP in a pandemic ? But how do I monitor two littles online for 4 hours a day . I get the importance of love learning but if families have 1 laptop, or what if wanted to supplement with learning pods ? I almost would prefer taped classes at least part of that, then I could sit with one at a time ..
I don’t know about work, I currently work 8-2, I will be stepping out if my comfort bubble
And looking for an evening and weekend job I guess .. 
This sucks Guys


----------



## quandrea

bababear_50 said:


> Well my board takes 1st. prize .....65 pages of info and protocols.........
> Whew,,,lots to absorb.
> Lots to learn.
> 
> Hugs
> Mel


We must be the same board!  Released yesterday. The online modality is offering a limited amount of courses. Glad I pulled dd from the system. She needs mostly level 12 courses.  Not sure they’d have a full complement of courses to fill her timetable.


----------



## quandrea

TammyLynn33 said:


> Yeah im not feeling optimistic about this .. DD14 starting high school full size classes , capacity buses but in quads.so exposed to 40- 60 kids And whoever they associate with and then the bus .
> Ds6 that seems Like a lot of screen time .
> DS8 ASD was hoping he’d get in 3/4 split he didn’t 2:3 classes only Recommending masks but same teacher he was not a good fit with at all last year. He made such academic strides last year at home
> Apparently the 3/4 teacher is less of a fit I was told. Take the known evil . I can’t be texted every day with he’s doing this or doing that or .. I wanted to beat my head off the wall last year. Do I want that stress level as a HCP in a pandemic ? But how do I monitor two littles online for 4 hours a day . I get the importance of love learning but if families have 1 laptop, or what if wanted to supplement with learning pods ? I almost would prefer taped classes at least part of that, then I could sit with one at a time ..
> I don’t know about work, I currently work 8-2, I will be stepping out if my comfort bubble
> And looking for an evening and weekend job I guess ..
> This sucks Guys


You make a good point about taped classes. The synchronous learning was a deal breaker for dd. We are homeschooling for her last year. She loves online learning—has used it extensively since grade seven. The beauty of online studies is the freedom to do it where and when you want. The synchronous learning kills one of the main benefits of online studies.


----------



## TammyLynn33

quandrea said:


> You make a good point about taped classes. The synchronous learning was a deal breaker for dd. We are homeschooling for her last year. She loves online learning—has used it extensively since grade seven. The beauty of online studies is the freedom to do it where and when you want. The synchronous learning kills one of the main benefits of online studies.



I would tho zero experience but with DS8 having needs I don’t want to lose any although they can’t say what they are supports they may put in place. 
gius I just don’t know I’m ready to teach two at home but being told the known evil is better than the unknown as teachers go how can I  put him in class knowing he will be miserable and so will I and he will learn nothing all year..


----------



## quandrea

TammyLynn33 said:


> I would tho zero experience but with DS8 having needs I don’t want to lose any although they can’t say what they are supports they may put in place.
> gius I just don’t know I’m ready to teach two at home but being told the known evil is better than the unknown as teachers go how can I  put him in class knowing he will be miserable and so will I and he will learn nothing all year..


You speak about making strides with at home learning. I’d focus on that and go forward from there. Good luck. Let me know if I can help at all!


----------



## hdrolfe

DiaryofaDisneyKid said:


> My oldest sons bestfriends mom is one of our schools breakfast club volunteers. I doubt they will be able to do the traditional hot breakfasts every morning in the gym but I am wondering if maybe they can hand out some sort of bagged packaged breakfast items to the kids that need them? I will have to get in touch with the school when it opens and find out if donations or gift cards for this will be accepted. I volunteered to help the kids in my youngest sons class last year with home reading. Every week I got to go to his class and listen to kids read levelled books to me. I will really miss doing that this year as I think they will be (understandably) limiting volunteers to the school.



No volunteers in our schools. They said breakfast programs will still run but no idea how that will work or what it will look like. 



wdwmom3 said:


> My sons school had “nutrition bowls” in every classroom that was filled with different healthy foods.  The kids were told they could go and grab something from it if they were running late and didn’t have breakfast, or if they were extra hungry and didn’t have enough for lunch.  It helped take the stigma away from kids asking for food if they didn’t have enough.  Something like that could be an idea.  Maybe with those little boxes of cereal, fruit cups or things like that.



My son's classes have had this as well, but we've been told it won't be happening this year. 



TammyLynn33 said:


> Yeah im not feeling optimistic about this .. DD14 starting high school full size classes , capacity buses but in quads.so exposed to 40- 60 kids And whoever they associate with and then the bus .
> Ds6 that seems Like a lot of screen time .
> DS8 ASD was hoping he’d get in 3/4 split he didn’t 2:3 classes only Recommending masks but same teacher he was not a good fit with at all last year. He made such academic strides last year at home
> Apparently the 3/4 teacher is less of a fit I was told. Take the known evil . I can’t be texted every day with he’s doing this or doing that or .. I wanted to beat my head off the wall last year. Do I want that stress level as a HCP in a pandemic ? But how do I monitor two littles online for 4 hours a day . I get the importance of love learning but if families have 1 laptop, or what if wanted to supplement with learning pods ? I almost would prefer taped classes at least part of that, then I could sit with one at a time ..
> I don’t know about work, I currently work 8-2, I will be stepping out if my comfort bubble
> And looking for an evening and weekend job I guess ..
> This sucks Guys



I am expecting to get many phone calls about my son, he has ADHD and sitting for that long is going to be hard. I pray he gets a teacher he likes, I have the names of the ones who will be teaching his grade, 1 is new to the school and the other one, I am not sure if he knows who she is. Plus there will be a French teacher as well, not sure who that is yet. The only benefit is that his nemesis is going to be in the other class, they will have to split the French Immersion from the French Core kids, normally they mix them and the immersion kids go to one class and the other kids to another for one block. But they can't mix them like that now. My son's in immersion and the other boy is not... so phew! But I'm not clear on if they will be allowed to mix at Recess (I hope not). 



quandrea said:


> You make a good point about taped classes. The synchronous learning was a deal breaker for dd. We are homeschooling for her last year. She loves online learning—has used it extensively since grade seven. The beauty of online studies is the freedom to do it where and when you want. The synchronous learning kills one of the main benefits of online studies.



I talked about this with my son as well, he was kind of wanting to do the online if he was allowed to do the work and if it didn't take him 5 hours then when he's done, he could be done. But once he heard the synchronous part he was "nope". So... my choice at the moment is to send him and see how it goes, but at the first sign of trouble I will be pulling him out.


----------



## pigletto

DiaryofaDisneyKid said:


> My oldest sons bestfriends mom is one of our schools breakfast club volunteers. I doubt they will be able to do the traditional hot breakfasts every morning in the gym but I am wondering if maybe they can hand out some sort of bagged packaged breakfast items to the kids that need them? I will have to get in touch with the school when it opens and find out if donations or gift cards for this will be accepted. I volunteered to help the kids in my youngest sons class last year with home reading. Every week I got to go to his class and listen to kids read levelled books to me. I will really miss doing that this year as I think they will be (understandably) limiting volunteers to the school.


Our board notice did indicate the pre packaged items would be given out for those who need or want breakfast club.


----------



## uandmfan

Breakfast club will continue at our school and there will be food for lunch. 

No parents are allowed on property without special permission. This means we lose all parent volunteers. that's a huge blow to the school. I'm Chair of our school Council. it will be a really tough year in a lot of ways. I think that we can still do a lot to help teachers and kids but it sure won't be normal. And it will be next to impossible to raise funds!!


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

Well, well.  NS government changed their tune.  Grades 4-12 = mandatory masks.

Students will be required to wear a masks inside schools except if they are seated at their desks while two metres apart ad facing in the same direction. They must also be worn in the hallways and other common areas if two metres cannot be maintained. 

Kinda still not good and most kids will likely take them off at their desks.  But if we cannot have inside groups of 50 or more inside without masks, why do they get to remove them in the classroom.  I mean, IT'S THE SAME THING!

There is no way the classrooms will be able to space out the desks, so masks it is!


----------



## bababear_50

uandmfan said:


> Breakfast club will continue at our school and there will be food for lunch.
> 
> No parents are allowed on property without special permission. This means we lose all parent volunteers. that's a huge blow to the school. I'm Chair of our school Council. it will be a really tough year in a lot of ways. I think that we can still do a lot to help teachers and kids but it sure won't be normal. And it will be next to impossible to raise funds!!



Online school fundraiser orders
-Family Friday (or any day) Pizza Night --time to talk to those pizza companies
-Potted Poinsettias for christmas--time to talk to those Nursery companies
-Christmas wreaths/planters--time to talk to the Nursery companies.
-Cookie Mixes--
This year is the year for Parents to get creative..
Hugs
Mel

Have a look here
https://doublethedonation.com/tips/fundraising-ideas-for-schools/


----------



## Pumpkin1172

I just went online to see what was happening in our district ( northern Alberta ) as all I could hear was crickets...nothing     NO emails, no mail, no phone calls....nothing

Of course when I go online...there is some information.  They are gathering information to see if there is interest in having  online schooling...but have stated that it would be multi grade classrooms.  

Looks like we have staggered re-entry.  They are not guaranteeing buses for all the students needing buses due to limiting capacity.  They will have staggered start times for classes, lunches, and end of day.  They will keep the kids in small pods to limit their exposure to all the students.   Hand sanitizer when they come into the school, upon entering classrooms etc.  No microwaves ( which will bum out Ds, as he was that kid who would take his favorite left overs to school all the time ) There is no information about the cafeteria yet, but many of the kids go off campass to the fast food places that smartly opened up in the area.

They are also asking for the kids to come with their own laptop or cromebook.  As well as masks are mandatory for gr 4- 12.  Which was not a problem for Ds already as we had talked about it, and we had both agreed that for the safety of everyone around him, He would wear one whether it was mandatory or not.  He does not like the fabric ones, so I have stocked up on the disposable ones for him to wear.  If he has to wear a mask, the least I can do is make sure that his sensory issues are addressed.  I will keep trying to find a reusable one that he likes.  Our province is giving each student 2 reusable masks to keep and use.  

I guess we will see how this all plays out, and how it looks once everything is starting.   This is a fluid situation, for all of us.  We have been very lucky so far in our community, we have not had many cases, although now we seem to have more active cases again  We have only had 40 cases...and only 9 are active now the last I heard.    I hope that with school starting we don't see a big spike.  Time will tell.  

There will be another release on Aug 24 with more information about school re-entry.  Like I said...it is a fluid situation.   There is nothing saying that after a month of classes that they will say no more classes in the classroom.  I just hope that they are working on a plan B for when this happens.  AND NOT what was presented to us in the spring.  They have had time to prepare and come with a better system.   I was expected to come up and execute different work methods to keep myself, co-workers, and visitors/client safe while they were in our building.  I expect the same from them, and our school board


----------



## uandmfan

bababear_50 said:


> Online school fundraiser orders
> -Family Friday (or any day) Pizza Night --time to talk to those pizza companies
> -Potted Poinsettias for christmas--time to talk to those Nursery companies
> -Christmas wreaths/planters--time to talk to the Nursery companies.
> -Cookie Mixes--
> This year is the year for Parents to get creative..
> Hugs
> Mel
> 
> Have a look here
> https://doublethedonation.com/tips/fundraising-ideas-for-schools/



Thanks!! I have talked to our usual pizza provider and he will donate a certain amount (probably $1 or $2) per pizza if someone orders and says they are from our school. he's a small business and was really hurt by the pandemic. I think he's an amazing supporter of the school and hopefully this will also bring in some business for him. 

Christmas is touchy at our school but the ideas are great!!  Thank you!!

What a year this will be


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

pigletto said:


> Our board notice did indicate the pre packaged items would be given out for those who need or want breakfast club.


Great I hope so! My 3 kiddos have been keeping me busy and I haven't had time to read everything yet!


----------



## damo

uandmfan said:


> Thanks!! I have talked to our usual pizza provider and he will donate a certain amount (probably $1 or $2) per pizza if someone orders and says they are from our school. he's a small business and was really hurt by the pandemic. I think he's an amazing supporter of the school and hopefully this will also bring in some business for him.
> 
> Christmas is touchy at our school but the ideas are great!!  Thank you!!
> 
> What a year this will be



One of our best fundraisers when I was school chair was a cookbook.  Each kid brings in a favourite recipe and you compile them into a cookbook including the donator's name.  It is done completely away from the school and made a lot of money.  We still use ours years and years later.  We still got requests for extra cookbooks for at least 10 years after we made them.


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

wdwmom3 said:


> My sons school had “nutrition bowls” in every classroom that was filled with different healthy foods.  The kids were told they could go and grab something from it if they were running late and didn’t have breakfast, or if they were extra hungry and didn’t have enough for lunch.  It helped take the stigma away from kids asking for food if they didn’t have enough.  Something like that could be an idea.  Maybe with those little boxes of cereal, fruit cups or things like that.


One of my sons teachers did this in the past and I thought it was such a great idea! My DD had to walk by the gym in the morning after first bell to get to her classroom and she said lots of kids seem to be coming out. I hope they will do something because I know if I'm hungry I can't think clearly!


----------



## Silvermist999

uandmfan said:


> Thanks!! I have talked to our usual pizza provider and he will donate a certain amount (probably $1 or $2) per pizza if someone orders and says they are from our school. he's a small business and was really hurt by the pandemic. I think he's an amazing supporter of the school and hopefully this will also bring in some business for him.
> 
> Christmas is touchy at our school but the ideas are great!!  Thank you!!
> 
> What a year this will be



It would be a great time to reach out to local(small) business owners to see if they want to partner up for fundraising, even with raffle prizes.
Our school did fundraising for the grade 8 Grad trip with our local COBS Bread, perfect timing for Xmas gifts with their bread basket vouchers, and also gift certificates for a local nut free cupcake bakery.  For raffle prizes, reach out to local realtors and other small business for prize donations or contributions.  I don’t think it will be an issue involving parent volunteers, who can contact these businesses for their help. They don’t need to be physically inside the school to participate.


----------



## star72232

MoreTravels said:


> For those who are self employed or work for large national corporations, have you thought of moving away to rural towns where there are almost no cases and class sizes are much smaller? It’s a possibility to rent an apartment for one year and bring the entire family there for a safer environment? I guess some people in GTA must have thought about that. Then in one year the vaccine would be out (hopefully) so they move back to GTA?!



I’m self employed, but don’t work from home. In fact, I started a 5 year lease the beginning of March. Moving away isn’t an option. My job is not only unable to be done remotely, it also requires close contact (I’m a chiropractor). I’ve made my office as safe as possible (I have quite the cleaning routine!), and thankfully there aren’t a large number of cases in my area (Waterloo region).


----------



## Donald - my hero

*Just be careful asking for donations from small businesses please, there's a lot of treading water happening for everyone. While businesses were closed they still had to pay rent, utilities, taxes, any bills that came due for product they had already received and if they still had staff working those salaries had to be paid as well. Meanwhile they had no income and those who qualified for the wage subsidy didn't see the first payment until mid-may which meant 2 rent cycles, multiple pay-periods passed. Personal gripe here that's more important right now, please don't ask for something from a store you've never been to before.

I'm not sure how it works exactly but I know that Dominos is very involved with local fundraising, they are connected to Sick Kids once a year.*


----------



## MoreTravels

Our kid school has published different plans, among those include these...

*Outdoor Classrooms
Covered outdoor learning spaces have been created on our fields so that the teachers can take their classes outside to learn as frequently as possible, per recommendations from both the Ministry of Education and the report from SickKids Hospital have strongly encouraged all schools to take students outside to learn as frequently as possible. Teachers will be able to book these learning spaces throughout the year.  

Arrival
Parents are not permitted to come into the building for pick up and drop off their kids. Kindergarten to Grade 6 teachers will walk their students to the exit door to meet their parents outside. *


I thank the schools for trying to do something... This is a unknown territory so there is no "right answer". We need to support our teachers and school kids so they can feel confident moving forward.


----------



## mshanson3121

Just in case there was any question that New Brunswick is run by incompetent idiots... 

They have decided to go ahead with an election this fall, AND, they announced today that because of the election, they will no longer be providing the scheduled twice-weekly updates on the return to school plans.

They said, "Department staff will provide updates regarding various topics [sometime] over the next few weeks, dates to be determined."


Um... Yeah, okay. After all, who really needs to know what the return to school plans and requirements are?

And they wonder why people refuse to move here, and keep fleeing the province for other parts of Canada.


----------



## mort1331

mshanson3121 said:


> Just in case there was any question that New Brunswick is run by incompetent idiots...
> 
> They have decided to go ahead with an election this fall, AND, they announced today that because of the election, they will no longer be providing the scheduled twice-weekly updates on the return to school plans.
> 
> They said, "Department staff will provide updates regarding various topics [sometime] over the next few weeks, dates to be determined."
> 
> 
> Um... Yeah, okay. After all, who really needs to know what the return to school plans and requirements are?
> 
> And they wonder why people refuse to move here, and keep fleeing the province for other parts of Canada.


Move out??  Hook me up im looking to move to there..or NS


----------



## MamaLema

So today I got an email from my son’s high school to confirm his registration for Sept. 
The link doesn’t work, I tried to reply but it’s undeliverable and no one answered the school phone.
Not sure how to make sure my son goes to 12th Grade.


----------



## FigmentSpark

MamaLema said:


> So today I got an email from my son’s high school to confirm his registration for Sept.
> The link doesn’t work, I tried to reply but it’s undeliverable and no one answered the school phone.
> Not sure how to make sure my son goes to 12th Grade.


Have you checked on the school website?  Actually, isn't there a link in the email?  Crazy stuff.  Has your board had their meetings put on youtube?  If so, you might want to see what plans they are making.

Our board has asked what we are doing, with minimal information.  We are told there are 2 cohorts of 15 (HS, not Elementary) and they'd be in school "at least 50%" of the time and trading days in and out of school.   The trouble is, if you actually listen to the many hours of the board meeting, you find out (and that's the only way to find out, mind you) that they will only be in class in the mornings of their in-school days, but the board is counting synchronous learning in the afternoon (ie: zoom meeting of the class) as "in school" time.  

Also, the in-person teacher for Cohort A on M-W will also be the same teacher for in-person Cohort B on T-F.  So if a kid in cohort A gets sick and gives it to the teacher, the teacher will then pass it to cohort B.  I understand if we're talking about a class where there is only one teacher (foods, shops, art, music), but math, English, history, French?  Why wouldn't you separate those cohorts completely?  My understanding is that same teacher will also teach the fully remote Cohort C, as well, so 30 students plus the synchronous cohort C remote students.  That's a big class.

Also, quadmesters and no finals.  It would have been nice to see a summary of the changes posted, instead of just asking parents to choose which type of learning they want.  Oh, and the switching from remote to in-class or vice versa can be done "in a timely manner", which really means after Thanksgiving, at Xmas break, or at quadmester end.  So, not timely at all, but they haven't put that detail out on the website anywhere.  And no one's discussed the second half of the year, yet.

They also mentioned that they're getting a lot of teacher requests for early parental leave (for pregnancy) and other leaves, so they might have a teacher shortage.


----------



## MamaLema

FigmentSpark said:


> Have you checked on the school website?  Actually, isn't there a link in the email?
> 
> They also mentioned that they're getting a lot of teacher requests for early parental leave (for pregnancy) and other leaves, so they might have a teacher shortage.


Yup, the link they sent doesn’t work.

Another problem is many lunchroom supervisors are quitting. It’s all a big mess, really.


----------



## TammyLynn33

I’m at a total loss right now and decision is  due by Sunday. Throw a special needs kid into the mix and gets so much more complex. 
Had his transition meeting yesterday and got the ball dropped virtually on me , had a really rough year last year and when asked to switch teachers was told she was his best option the other teacher was Not a good fit at all.. and guess whose class he’s in as of yesterday ?  like it’s not a stressful enough time you tell me how awful the one teacher is and a few days later tell me ohh well.. I guess it’s one way to lower numbers for kids that aren’t easy.


----------



## Disneylover99

TammyLynn33 said:


> I’m at a total loss right now and decision is  due by Sunday. Throw a special needs kid into the mix and gets so much more complex.
> Had his transition meeting yesterday and got the ball dropped virtually on me , had a really rough year last year and when asked to switch teachers was told she was his best option the other teacher was Not a good fit at all.. and guess whose class he’s in as of yesterday ?  like it’s not a stressful enough time you tell me how awful the one teacher is and a few days later tell me ohh well.. I guess it’s one way to lower numbers for kids that aren’t easy.



I’m so sorry. These are such frustrating times for parents, students and teachers. And there is so much confusion and uncertainty for everyone. 

Getting the right teacher is critical for many children.
Getting the wrong teacher is detrimental for many children.


----------



## Silvermist999

I can’t decide whether to send my kids or keep them home. The school board will have a special meeting sometime next week for questions to be answered.  But it is AFTER our survey deadline which is this Sunday. Makes absolutely no sense to me.


----------



## bababear_50

Silvermist999 said:


> I can’t decide whether to send my kids or keep them home. The school board will have a special meeting sometime next week for questions to be answered.  But it is AFTER our survey deadline which is this Sunday. Makes absolutely no sense to me.



I have been thinking about this
Well you are the parent and have the right to say what you feel is best for your child.
Do the survey but reserve the right to change your mind should circumstances change.
I mean this is what the government is saying right? Circumstances are ever evolving and changing and we have to accept that so they need to accept that from parents also.
Ok off my soap box for now 
Hugs
Mel


----------



## bababear_50

Latest information from my area. Peel Region. 
26% of all students will be Online Distance Learning so far.

Plus only 80% so far have chosen,,thus leaving another 20% undecided.

School starts date may be delayed but no indication when.

Another update is expected early next week.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## SleeplessInTO

Toronto District School Board delayed start of school by at least one week. Reducing class sizes for some classes in “high risk” areas (as determined by certain metrics).

We have withdrawn from TDSB for the year but I can’t seem to stop watching the news and reading about it ...


----------



## pigletto

Silvermist999 said:


> I can’t decide whether to send my kids or keep them home. The school board will have a special meeting sometime next week for questions to be answered.  But it is AFTER our survey deadline which is this Sunday. Makes absolutely no sense to me.


Just don’t answer the survey in time. The deadline is so that they can plan properly for your return . They can have the decency to give you the pertinent information you need to make this critical choice in time, or they can wait.


----------



## reliev

Silvermist999 said:


> I can’t decide whether to send my kids or keep them home. The school board will have a special meeting sometime next week for questions to be answered.  But it is AFTER our survey deadline which is this Sunday. Makes absolutely no sense to me.


I think they are using the survey to present it to the board. My kid's school doesn't have online but they have where you can enroll (they are not in a public school in child development due to their age) I asked how many kids were enrolled they said all 10 then I said how many are going to class it was 2 now its 1 kid. I wonder if the one kid is going to be thinking why are they the only one in this class with all these webcams everywhere. we are waiting a month to see how it goes then re-asses.

Edit I forgot to add my child is able to learn online but technically there is no online enrollment, I think this is because some parents must have asked for a discount on tuition and some arent paying at at all.


----------



## hdrolfe

It seems to be fairly consistent that 25% (give or take) are doing online, it's more than the school boards here were expecting any way. We were asked to submit a new form by yesterday if we changed our minds after seeing their plans. However, in the FAQs they have been posting it was asked if parents could decide not to send kids and switch to online and the answer was "yes", but for sending them back to class it was "speak to the principal". So we'll see what happens I guess! The principal sent an email saying more details would follow, like who the teacher is, where the kids should meet the teacher on the first day and stuff like that. It's all very nerve wracking to be sure. I am sending him, because he wants to go, but I am fairly sure it won't last long. He hates school to begin with, and the changes are not going to make that better. I'm prepared to do anything at this point, in class, online or fully homeschooled. And I can't think about it any more or I drive myself crazy!


----------



## wdwmom3

I get the difficulty parents are having making decisions with limited information.   But how can school boards give you information without having an idea who is coming and who is not.  

What information are parents waiting to hear? If it’s what their class size will be etc, they can’t give you that until they know who is going. I’ve read a lot of parents plan on keeping the kids home but answered they were attending to “save a spot”. Well how are school boards supposed to plan properly with that?


----------



## FigmentSpark

I just got an email from my son's Taekwondo instructor.  His wife is a retired teacher, so they are opening the dojang and will take 14 elementary aged kids.  Children will do fully remote at their school, but will be able to get help from a teacher.  Also, they will provide the after school care.  It's a perfect set up for parents that aren't comfortable with the 25+ kids in a classroom, have to go to work and would need after school care anyway.

I wonder if we will see a lot of these pockets of alternative remote learning?


----------



## quandrea

SleeplessInTO said:


> Toronto District School Board delayed start of school by at least one week. Reducing class sizes for some classes in “high risk” areas (as determined by certain metrics).
> 
> We have withdrawn from TDSB for the year but I can’t seem to stop watching the news and reading about it ...


I’m the same. It’s like a car wreck and I can’t look away. I must say, I do find myself irrationally irritated by the late start. I feel as a taxpayer that my money is getting squandered.


----------



## Silvermist999

pigletto said:


> Just don’t answer the survey in time. The deadline is so that they can plan properly for your return . They can have the decency to give you the pertinent information you need to make this critical choice in time, or they can wait.


I wish we could take the risk and not reply on time, but this is likely the only chance for us to submit our decision.  Logically they would have held the info session first so questions about the plan could be answered, but guess they never thought of that as being useful.  Deadline is 4pm tomorrow...


----------



## Silvermist999

bababear_50 said:


> I have been thinking about this
> Well you are the parent and have the right to say what you feel is best for your child.
> Do the survey but reserve the right to change your mind should circumstances change.
> I mean this is what the government is saying right? Circumstances are ever evolving and changing and we have to accept that so they need to accept that from parents also.
> Ok off my soap box for now
> Hugs
> Mel



Yes we can change our minds at the end of the 1st quadmester in mid Nov. 
I know many kids are going back now but plan to switch to online in Nov, during flu season or if there’s a second wave.  We were thinking to do online only but then they came out with their new virtual model which raises so many questions. My head hurts from trying to decide, lol.


----------



## Prince John Robin Hood

FigmentSpark said:


> I just got an email from my son's Taekwondo instructor.  His wife is a retired teacher, so they are opening the dojang and will take 14 elementary aged kids.  Children will do fully remote at their school, but will be able to get help from a teacher.  Also, they will provide the after school care.  It's a perfect set up for parents that aren't comfortable with the 25+ kids in a classroom, have to go to work and would need after school care anyway.
> 
> I wonder if we will see a lot of these pockets of alternative remote learning?



It seems like a lot of people are looking at school 'pods'.  We're sending our oldest to school and youngest to home daycare but something like this would be great IMO, especially if you are sending multiple kids.


----------



## TammyLynn33

So it’s official my 6 and 8 year old are home for the year. 8 year old doing remote to keep all his special needs services in place and 6 year old and I going rogue. 
its 430 am I can’t sleep I work at 8 and have to tell the family i work for.. been with them for 4 years. 
I hate 2020


----------



## Madame

TammyLynn33 said:


> So it’s official my 6 and 8 year old are home for the year. 8 year old doing remote to keep all his special needs services in place and 6 year old and I going rogue.
> its 430 am I can’t sleep I work at 8 and have to tell the family i work for.. been with them for 4 years.
> I hate 2020


I was serious with my offer for Immersion help.  If you need anything just DM me.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

@TammyLynn33 Sorry to hear of all your woes.  Who would have thought we would still be dealing with the ramifications of COVID-19 still in Sept.  Know that you are not alone!


----------



## vegs1

This is an interesting read from CTV news.  They speak often with Dr. Sharkawy, an infectious disease specialist and he is always very down to earth, factual, no scare tactics. Just the science. This was posted on CTV ......

https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coron...-school-activities-by-covid-19-risk-1.5073993


----------



## Debbie

vegs1 said:


> This is an interesting read from CTV news.  They speak often with Dr. Sharkawy, an infectious disease specialist and he is always very down to earth, factual, no scare tactics. Just the science. This was posted on CTV ......
> 
> https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coron...-school-activities-by-covid-19-risk-1.5073993


Love Dr. Sharkawy. I shared this as well as soon as I saw it. It is going to be a different year, and teachers will be pulling out the stops to be sure learning is happening for every child, in as safe a manner as possible. I know that my daughter (ON) is reading and planning to be outside teaching for as long as possible. Best of luck, whatever everyone chooses.


----------



## Iralyn

hdrolfe said:


> However, in the FAQs they have been posting it was asked if parents could decide not to send kids and switch to online and the answer was "yes", but for sending them back to class it was "speak to the principal".


My principal said today (for our board) that families can only change to online at designated times, just like with switching to in person.  Basically if a family chooses to keep their child home because they are not happy with how things are going at school, they will be on their own with homeschooling until November.  I understand why with all the necessary coordination and planning but it still seems kind of crazy.  Honestly, I'm not sure that I would send my child to my school.  It is overcrowded to begin with and anything that the principal has requested to help with distancing, etc., has been denied if it involves any kind of money.  I am hoping my daughter's school is able to do better (smaller population, bigger building) since I don't have a reasonable option to keep her home.


----------



## wdwmom3

Iralyn said:


> My principal said today (for our board) that families can only change to online at designated times, just like with switching to in person.  Basically if a family chooses to keep their child home because they are not happy with how things are going at school, they will be on their own with homeschooling until November.  I understand why with all the necessary coordination and planning but it still seems kind of crazy.  Honestly, I'm not sure that I would send my child to my school.  It is overcrowded to begin with and anything that the principal has requested to help with distancing, etc., has been denied if it involves any kind of money.  I am hoping my daughter's school is able to do better (smaller population, bigger building) since I don't have a reasonable option to keep her home.



They have said that to for our board. That we can only switch at certain times. Now I get that if you are switching to in person, that would involve a lot. But I’m sorry it doesn’t involve as much to switch from in person to online. I’m sending my son to school but I’m watching community transmitting rates in our area very closely and if it goes up significantly he will be pulled. I really don’t care what “their dates” are, I will give them a week to figure out the switch. After that I will become the squeaky wheel like they have never seen before. I will not put up with any BS.

I have started to see really crazy things being posted. I’ve seen parents actually posting stuff like “if there is an outbreak our kids will be locked in the school and taken to a hospital against their will”. Hello paranoia or what? I’m also getting tired of groups making this political.

We all have to accept that there will be some risk and decide if we accept that risk or not.  Get over that it’s not going to be perfect and could very well suck.  Everything in 2020 sucks.  Parents need to make decisions for their kids.   And teachers need to make decisions about going back to work just like many other workers.


----------



## hdrolfe

Iralyn said:


> My principal said today (for our board) that families can only change to online at designated times, just like with switching to in person.  Basically if a family chooses to keep their child home because they are not happy with how things are going at school, they will be on their own with homeschooling until November.  I understand why with all the necessary coordination and planning but it still seems kind of crazy.  Honestly, I'm not sure that I would send my child to my school.  It is overcrowded to begin with and anything that the principal has requested to help with distancing, etc., has been denied if it involves any kind of money.  I am hoping my daughter's school is able to do better (smaller population, bigger building) since I don't have a reasonable option to keep her home.



The school board posted but if the school says otherwise, to be honest, I will pull him and homeschool. His school is fairly small, there are usually a couple empty class rooms, and the classes are smallish (he had two 23 kid grade 5 classes last year, so hopefully they will be similar for grade 6 (with a handful staying home for now? but we'll see). I am hoping for more information this week from the principal. A number of his friends will be staying home, and others are in non-immersion so won't be in his class/cohort. 

I do find it funny that my work sent an email saying basically "don't expect to take time off to keep your kids out of school", which is fine, my son is 10 so he can do school while I work if it comes to it. Then my boss told me today he is keeping his two littles homes, SK & Grade 4, so he'll be rather distracted while he's supposed to be working. But, best choice for his family, I can respect that, and his wife will be working part time. 

I am exhausted thinking about all this and school hasn't even started yet! My son often has a hard time in class as it is, this is going to be hard on him. He's very smart and easily bored, lacks motivation and if he isn't interested in what the teacher is teaching, he's not going to really try. He is afraid of being wrong, so he won't even try. We are working on that more than anything over summer. If he wasn't so determined to go back, I'd just keep him home. But he really wants to go so we'll see. It's been 6 months... Plus all the strike days they had over winter, grade 5 was a write off for him. 

My kiddo is at my parent's for a couple days, since we won't be able to see them once school starts. I am enjoying the quiet. He is back tomorrow and we are off next week. Hopefully we will find some fun stuff to do. I had booked the week to get him sorted with back to school, which got pushed a week, so now we have a little vacation.

And to rub salt in my wounds, facebook is reminding me that this time last year we were arriving at All Star Movies and heading to Hollywood Studios to ride Rockin Roller Coaster for the first time... I really hope we get to go back soon. Man this pandemic just sucks.


----------



## hdrolfe

wdwmom3 said:


> They have said that to for our board. That we can only switch at certain times. Now I get that if you are switching to in person, that would involve a lot. But I’m sorry it doesn’t involve as much to switch from in person to online. I’m sending my son to school but I’m watching community transmitting rates in our area very closely and if it goes up significantly he will be pulled. I really don’t care what “their dates” are, I will give them a week to figure out the switch. After that I will become the squeaky wheel like they have never seen before. I will not put up with any BS.
> 
> I have started to see really crazy things being posted. I’ve seen parents actually posting stuff like “if there is an outbreak our kids will be locked in the school and taken to a hospital against their will”. Hello paranoia or what? I’m also getting tired of groups making this political.
> 
> We all have to accept that there will be some risk and decide if we accept that risk or not.  Get over that it’s not going to be perfect and could very well suck.  Everything in 2020 sucks.  Parents need to make decisions for their kids.   And teachers need to make decisions about going back to work just like many other workers.



I have been reading a lot of facebook stuff and have had to (temporarily) block some people. Things being posted that don't match what has been said by the schools or board... I don't know. Everyone needs to decide for themselves... and yes... Everything in 2020 sucks!


----------



## wdwmom3

hdrolfe said:


> I have been reading a lot of facebook stuff and have had to (temporarily) block some people. Things being posted that don't match what has been said by the schools or board... I don't know. Everyone needs to decide for themselves... and yes... Everything in 2020 sucks!



I’ve had to do the same.  Some people posting stuff from the US and then freaking out that schools are even opening at all here.  And then some of the comments like kids being taken to hospitals  without consent , kids being made to wear a mask by physical force if needed, it is just crazy.


----------



## hdrolfe

One other thing that was just shared here in Ottawa, school buses won't start until Sept 14th (school starts by the 9th for almost all kids I believe). So... that'll be fun for parents! Apparently they can't plan the buses until the schools know who will be going and that's all still in flux. What a year this will be...


----------



## bababear_50

My heartfelt wish right now is 
"Compassion" 
Whether that be for your child's teacher, school Admin staff, bus driver,custodian ,,,neighbour
they are people too and they are doing the best they can right now.

Sometimes it is good to reflect upon oneself as to how you are helping during times of crisis instead of looking to cast blame and shame on others.

I've spent the better part of my life teaching and sharing compansion with kids and hope some of it has rubbed off on their families.

For just a day offer someone your compassion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compassion

Hugs
Mel


----------



## MamaLema

quandrea said:


> I’m the same. It’s like a car wreck and I can’t look away. I must say, I do find myself irrationally irritated by the late start. I feel as a taxpayer that my money is getting squandered.


I’ve had some frustrations too but I feel like we should cut the school board a little slack. They are dealing with a large amount of teachers deciding they want to take a leave of absence or retire and need to interview and hire a lot of teachers to fill those spots.
Lunch room supervisors are quitting. 
They got a large sum of money from the federal government and need to decide how best to use it. 
Guidelines from Public Health change so rapidly it’s hard to keep up. I work in childcare so it’s a little different but my supervisor says “Public Health says we can’t/can do this now” every few days.
So childcare/school is making guidelines and setting up things and then Public Health says something different and things change again.
School opening a week later is still pretty good considering.


----------



## quandrea

MamaLema said:


> I’ve had some frustrations too but I feel like we should cut the school board a little slack. They are dealing with a large amount of teachers deciding they want to take a leave of absence or retire and need to interview and hire a lot of teachers to fill those spots.
> Lunch room supervisors are quitting.
> They got a large sum of money from the federal government and need to decide how best to use it.
> Guidelines from Public Health change so rapidly it’s hard to keep up. I work in childcare so it’s a little different but my supervisor says “Public Health says we can’t/can do this now” every few days.
> So childcare/school is making guidelines and setting up things and then Public Health says something different and things change again.
> School opening a week later is still pretty good considering.


I still think they’ve had since March to plan. I in no way put this on teachers. The powers that be needed to convene on March 16 when shut down occurred to start strategising a reopening plan. If they didn’t need to use it because all ended up being well come September, great. What we’ve ended up experiencing is mass panic among staff, parents, support workers. We knew September 8 was coming.


----------



## Silvermist999

MamaLema said:


> I’ve had some frustrations too but I feel like we should cut the school board a little slack. *They are dealing with a large amount of teachers deciding they want to take a leave of absence or retire* and need to interview and hire a lot of teachers to fill those spots.
> Lunch room supervisors are quitting.
> They got a large sum of money from the federal government and need to decide how best to use it.
> Guidelines from Public Health change so rapidly it’s hard to keep up. I work in childcare so it’s a little different but my supervisor says “Public Health says we can’t/can do this now” every few days.
> So childcare/school is making guidelines and setting up things and then Public Health says something different and things change again.
> School opening a week later is still pretty good considering.



Why is this happening is my question?  I’ve also heard from my friends who know of many teachers now looking to teach virtual instead of being in classrooms.

Did all those essential healthcare workers (not just paramedics, nurses and doctors but everyone else working in a hospital) long term care home workers, grocery store employees, grocery store suppliers and distributors, have the option to retire, stay home or “go virtual” in mid March when everything shut down and everyone else stayed home?  Don’t forget the shortage and lack of PPE they were dealing with as well.


----------



## Silvermist999

wdwmom3 said:


> I’ve had to do the same.  Some people posting stuff from the US and then freaking out that schools are even opening at all here.  And then some of the comments like kids being taken to hospitals  without consent , kids being made to wear a mask by physical force if needed, it is just crazy.



This is the most frustrating and annoying part.  Instead of reporting on how schools in other parts of the world such as Asia and Europe who have reopened schools successfully (some did not even close for long) and learning from them, the media is choosing to only report on what is not working in the U.S..


----------



## vegs1

No one, on March 16, had a crystal ball to see what this pandemic would have done by this point.  School boards were trying to figure out if there would be an end to the school year for the current year in progress. They had to deal with that before they could start on this year. 
They were also not able to decide anything for this year until they were told by our public health people if there would even be a school year starting in September. 

I think, as parents, we are hoping for this magical situation to unfold which will have our children 10 feet apart, in classes of 10 students, with no other person intruding on the day and buses holding less than 10 people. We want to know with 100% accuracy that our children and our families will be safe. Unfortunately, no one is going to give us that. 

No matter how long the school board had to put forth a plan, as parents, it is our time to decide our plan. No one, no Facebook group or Disboard group can decide that for you and nor should they.  

Try and stay as positive as possible in front of your kids, no matter if they are starting kindergarten or university. The situation may stink but it is how we deal with it that our children will learn from.  It is a scary time for everyone but we are going to get through this. 

And as bababear_50 said, let’s show some compassion to everyone.


----------



## bababear_50

Interesting read
https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/week...-time-to-call-a-strike/ar-BB18kolT?li=AAggNb9


----------



## wdwmom3

bababear_50 said:


> Interesting read
> https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/week...-time-to-call-a-strike/ar-BB18kolT?li=AAggNb9



Yeah except despite what we keep seeing in the media, I’ve talked to more and more of the people I know who have kids, and most are actually ok with the kids going back. The few that aren’t are keeping are their kids home and have said they would have even if classes were made smaller. People just want their kids back in school. We realize that community transmitting is low right now.

Also this whole “parents go on strike”.  Why? In Ontario people can choose to keep their kids home and be supported with remote learning.  Nobody is being forced to send their kids back.  And teachers can always request leave if they really don’t want to do back.   They have the same options as everyone else


----------



## MamaLema

bababear_50 said:


> Interesting read
> https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/week...-time-to-call-a-strike/ar-BB18kolT?li=AAggNb9


Strike for what? People either send their kids or keep them home. They have a choice


----------



## MamaLema

Silvermist999 said:


> Why is this happening is my question?  I’ve also heard from my friends who know of many teachers now looking to teach virtual instead of being in classrooms.
> 
> Did all those essential healthcare workers (not just paramedics, nurses and doctors but everyone else working in a hospital) long term care home workers, grocery store employees, grocery store suppliers and distributors, have the option to retire, stay home or “go virtual” in mid March when everything shut down and everyone else stayed home?  Don’t forget the shortage and lack of PPE they were dealing with as well.


Agree with you fully. Us childcare workers have been in close contact feeding and changing kids since June when Ontario was still in Phase 1. All those people you mentioned above worked when the numbers were at their highest and there was no mandatory mask policy then.
I too, don’t understand why teachers are deciding to take leave so close to school opening. If they feel unsafe, I think they should of not waited until last minute and request unpaid leave.


----------



## bababear_50

MamaLema said:


> Strike for what? People either send their kids or keep them home. They have a choice


Just sharing an article.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## bababear_50

MamaLema said:


> Agree with you fully. Us childcare workers have been in close contact feeding and changing kids since June when Ontario was still in Phase 1. All those people you mentioned above worked when the numbers were at their highest and there was no mandatory mask policy then.
> I too, don’t understand why teachers are deciding to take leave so close to school opening. If they feel unsafe, I think they should of not waited until last minute and request unpaid leave.



Just a FYI
Staff in certain areas (Boards) were not given the opportunity you suggest until the second week of Aug. It is now the last week of Aug and staff are still checking their emails and waiting for notifications.
Many Boards have said they are unsure if all staff groups can/will be accomodated.
Many teachers/ECE EA are not sure where they will even be working in a week,,online/in classroom or with what grade level.
Leaves of absence even without pay are not automatically accepted by the school Board.

Mel


----------



## wdwmom3

MamaLema said:


> Agree with you fully. Us childcare workers have been in close contact feeding and changing kids since June when Ontario was still in Phase 1. All those people you mentioned above worked when the numbers were at their highest and there was no mandatory mask policy then.
> I too, don’t understand why teachers are deciding to take leave so close to school opening. If they feel unsafe, I think they should of not waited until last minute and request unpaid leave.



I understand why teachers are nervous. But I also have friends who work in daycare and have been working already. I also know nurses, and some family who work in long term care home. I also have family members who work in food processing. All of these people have continued to work when their job was not without risk of contracting covid. They didn’t even have the protection teachers are being given, when spread was much higher. They were scared but knew they could decide to go to work or quit. They worked. If they hadn’t essential workers would have had no daycare, people would not have been cared for and food shelves would have been more bare. My daughter has friends who worked long shifts at grocery stores with no protection and having adults (they are teens) yell at them because there was no bread. I know many of these people are starting to get really annoyed at hearing every day how dangerous it is for teachers. I can’t blame them.

People say have compassion.  But where is the compassion for all the people who worked hard under crappy conditions for months that we don’t thank? We all need to help each other out and understand things will never be without risk.  And lest say thank you to all those who already accepted that risk for us.   Because right now all this attention on schools, when we paid such little attention to factories, transportation and  long term care workers kind of feels like a slap in the face to those peolle.  And those are not my words but what those people are saying to me.  They are hurt and angry.


----------



## Debbie

hdrolfe said:


> One other thing that was just shared here in Ottawa, school buses won't start until Sept 14th (school starts by the 9th for almost all kids I believe). So... that'll be fun for parents! Apparently they can't plan the buses until the schools know who will be going and that's all still in flux. What a year this will be...


Our Board announced just tonight....school is not starting until September 14, with half the kids going the 14th and 15th, the second half the 16th and 17th, and then everyone on the 18th.


----------



## hdrolfe

Debbie said:


> Our Board announced just tonight....school is not starting until September 14, with half the kids going the 14th and 15th, the second half the 16th and 17th, and then everyone on the 18th.



Oh goodness, I hope that isn't here, I've already had to ask for more time off. I normally take him on the first day of school, this is the last year I guess for that since he'll be off to high school.


----------



## FigmentSpark

I don't think we have an early start, but I just got my son's class schedule for  the year.  Quadmesters in first Sem., regular semester (so far) in the second sem.


----------



## Iralyn

MamaLema said:


> I too, don’t understand why teachers are deciding to take leave so close to school opening. If they feel unsafe, I think they should of not waited until last minute and request unpaid leave.



I think many teachers expected the return to school circumstances to be different.  In June we were told that it would be a hybrid model for September with smaller class sizes.  Of course, that is not what is happening.  And there have been lots of gaps and delays in communications about what is going on.  I see pictures being shared of classrooms online with all the desks in rows, 1 metre apart.  But that is not what is happening in my classroom -- we only have shared tables, no desks and that is not changing (no money for alternate furniture).  Kids will be wearing masks for much of the day but I will also be supervising them for part of the day when they will be eating without masks on.  Some school boards are apparently providing plexiglass dividers and such but not mine.

Despite all that, I'm kind of anxious to get back.  But if there are active cases in the community, I don't think school will be at all safe.  So I understand why some teachers are not wanting to return.


----------



## uandmfan

The Ottawa English Public Board announced that school is delayed until the 8th (we were supposed to start on the 3rd) with a staggered entry. We have no details on the staggered entry, only that it goes to the 14th. More details to come the last week in August. Which I hope means this week.


----------



## chrispeto

bababear_50 said:


> Just a FYI
> Staff in certain areas (Boards) were not given the opportunity you suggest until the second week of Aug. It is now the last week of Aug and staff are still checking their emails and waiting for notifications.
> Many Boards have said they are unsure if all staff groups can/will be accomodated.
> Many teachers/ECE EA are not sure where they will even be working in a week,,online/in classroom or with what grade level.
> Leaves of absence even without pay are not automatically accepted by the school Board.
> 
> Mel


that is because the priority to stay home and teach online learning was given to teachers with pre existing health conditions


----------



## Pumpkin1172

I do wish that they would delay the schools opening here ( Alberta ) by a week, to let teachers get better prepared.  Officials on both sides have met, and it was decided that school is starting when they first stated the start date ( next Monday or Tuesday )  I know my ds start on Sept 2.  

I also heard on the news today, that Trudeau is now printing another 2 billion dollars to give to the provinces to help school boards for extra funding ( which our Alberta teachers were asking for more money to help cover costs )  I hope that this will help.  

But at the same time, as was mentioned earlier in the thread, I was ( at the time thankful and still am ) that I was able to work through the shutdown.  But we also had to get creative and change they way we did business, and still keep the doors open for people to be able to get our products.  We DID NOT have access to PPE or many of the recommendations that are now in place for many businesses.  I do understand teachers concerns are kids are like little petri dishes!!!!  But many adults ( especially older adult males and yes...I see and work with MANY all day ) are just as gross.  

I think some families feel that their needs are not being addressed.  What works for one family, will not necessarily work for another family.   It is a fluid situation for every family.  There are no right or wrong answers, but finding a solution that works for their family.  What works for my family, may not work for someone else.  I hope all families can find solutions that work for their situation.  It is NOT going to be easy.


----------



## Pumpkin1172

FigmentSpark said:


> I just got an email from my son's Taekwondo instructor. His wife is a retired teacher, so they are opening the dojang and will take 14 elementary aged kids. Children will do fully remote at their school, but will be able to get help from a teacher. Also, they will provide the after school care. It's a perfect set up for parents that aren't comfortable with the 25+ kids in a classroom, have to go to work and would need after school care anyway.
> 
> I wonder if we will see a lot of these pockets of alternative remote learning?



I have seen other businesses and even home daycares ( we call them dayhomes here ) are offering to help parents who have to work, but do not want their children back into the actual schools, to be there as a guide to help with the online learning.  It would be using the online teaching ( if there was enough interest for that to happen ) and guide the kids through the day and their studies, in a safer and controlled environment.    People will get creative and find ways to make it safer for those who need " safer "  schools!  

All businesses and offices are needing to be creative in how to create safer work environments for their employees and customers.  Schools are NO different.  

Like I said earlier in the thread, I expect the schools to creative and create a safe environment for our kids.  I was expected to change and adapt to new policies and practices to keep myself, my co-workers, and customers as well.   We have changed the way we operate our business.  My second job as well, there are changes, and even more changes with mandatory masks and sanitizer for everyone starting Sept 1.  We have all changed the way we operate.  Daycares, dayhomes, ( I still have friends who run dayhomes ) have all had to change practices and policies to make it safe for all in their care.  Teachers and school boards will find a way to make it work too.  They will be just a creative as they had to be in the past.  They are teachers, and honestly, they are sooooooooooooo great at being creative, I have no doubts that they will find ways to do this too.


----------



## hdrolfe

The teachers do seem to be scrambling, I understand high schools (in Ontario) now have to offer one class at a time? That's nuts. So instead of taking two classes at a time the kids will have one and focus on it for 5 weeks then move to the next. Also looks like the Public board here (Ottawa) is scrambling to find teachers for the online stuff for the elementary kids, where they want to make those online classes bigger so the in person can be smaller, which makes sense in a safety way, but they say they need 750 teachers for online and only 300 applied to do it. And how does a teacher get up to 35 kids in an online class to pay attention, or even know if they are? 

While I do understand this whole things has been very fluid and changes from day to day, it feels like the schools and boards are really struggling. But I guess that is the way of all bureacracy, when you have so many levels of people to get through, the ones doing the work are often the last to get the details they need. 

I hope we get some more information this week, though I'm guessing it won't be until next week, coming frmo the school principal. I hate that I feel like I am crossing my fingers and hoping for the best, if it was me, sure, but for my kid? That does really add an extra layer of "am I making the right choice" worry.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

I start back to work in-office on Monday on a rotational basis - one week in, the next work from home, etc.

I will be working from home the first week of school, which I like just in case $hit hits the fan and DD needs to be pulled.  I highly doubt that will happen since NS has a good grasp on the virus right now.  BUT, we did catch and fine a University student $1000 for not self-isolating up in Antigonish. They are likely attending St FX University. 

The Northern area of the province has had three separate clusters of  2-3 cases in the last couple of weeks.


----------



## FigmentSpark

hdrolfe said:


> The teachers do seem to be scrambling, I understand high schools (in Ontario) now have to offer one class at a time? That's nuts. So instead of taking two classes at a time the kids will have one and focus on it for 5 weeks then move to the next. Also looks like the Public board here (Ottawa) is scrambling to find teachers for the online stuff for the elementary kids, where they want to make those online classes bigger so the in person can be smaller, which makes sense in a safety way, but they say they need 750 teachers for online and only 300 applied to do it. And how does a teacher get up to 35 kids in an online class to pay attention, or even know if they are?
> 
> While I do understand this whole things has been very fluid and changes from day to day, it feels like the schools and boards are really struggling. But I guess that is the way of all bureacracy, when you have so many levels of people to get through, the ones doing the work are often the last to get the details they need.
> 
> I hope we get some more information this week, though I'm guessing it won't be until next week, coming frmo the school principal. I hate that I feel like I am crossing my fingers and hoping for the best, if it was me, sure, but for my kid? That does really add an extra layer of "am I making the right choice" worry.


Our board was going to go with the ‘one class at a time’ plan for high school, but, at the last minute changed to quadmesters.  I can’t imagine all students being able to focus on just one class and absorbing everything in only 5 weeks.  Sure, they do it in summer school, but most kids don’t take summer school.  Missing one day, say, if one is sick can be hard to catch up.

Anyway, our two class system will see them still only in one class a day, but alternating classes each day (more or less), which gives them time to absorb the material.


----------



## Aladora

BC's back to school plan was released yesterday but we are still waiting to hear from DS's private school with their plan. I got an email from the Head of the school and he basically said that they are waiting to hear back from the government about the plans they submitted before informing the parents and they anticipate hearing back by tomorrow. 

If they follow the SD61 (our catchment school district) then the plan for secondary school is as follows:

Students will have two face-to-face classes each 10 week term for a total of 8 courses per year. 
Course A will be face-to-face 5 mornings each week in a Learning Group of approximately 30. 
Course B will be in a blended model with instruction being in-person 2 afternoons per week, supplemented by independent home study on the remaining afternoons. 
Course B in-person instruction will be in small groups to allow physical distancing. 
After five weeks, courses flip – Course B becomes face-to-face every day and Course A is blended. 

As my husband put it, we're gonna need a decoder ring to sort that...crud...out!  

But, like everything relating to schooling and the current crisis, we will have to wait and see!


----------



## FigmentSpark

Aladora said:


> BC's back to school plan was released yesterday but we are still waiting to hear from DS's private school with their plan. I got an email from the Head of the school and he basically said that they are waiting to hear back from the government about the plans they submitted before informing the parents and they anticipate hearing back by tomorrow.
> 
> If they follow the SD61 (our catchment school district) then the plan for secondary school is as follows:
> 
> Students will have two face-to-face classes each 10 week term for a total of 8 courses per year.
> Course A will be face-to-face 5 mornings each week in a Learning Group of approximately 30.
> Course B will be in a blended model with instruction being in-person 2 afternoons per week, supplemented by independent home study on the remaining afternoons.
> Course B in-person instruction will be in small groups to allow physical distancing.
> After five weeks, courses flip – Course B becomes face-to-face every day and Course A is blended.
> 
> As my husband put it, we're gonna need a decoder ring to sort that...crud...out!
> 
> But, like everything relating to schooling and the current crisis, we will have to wait and see!


You think you need a decoder ring? Check this out:


We need a detailed calendar.  Some days the classes alternate, others are back to back with a 2 day break for the other class.  Two cohorts of students and two classes on different days each.  I get it, because in 4 weeks, they've all had the same time in each class, but it's complicated.


----------



## wdwmom3

Thought others would like this.  Yes it’s from one particular school board but I thought others may find it helpful.  It’s a short video about what kids can expect at school.  May help some kids who are concerned 

https://www.wrdsb.ca/blog/2020/08/27/day-in-the-life-elementary-students/


----------



## Aladora

FigmentSpark said:


> You think you need a decoder ring? Check this out:
> View attachment 522073
> 
> We need a detailed calendar.  Some days the classes alternate, others are back to back with a 2 day break for the other class.  Two cohorts of students and two classes on different days each.  I get it, because in 4 weeks, they've all had the same time in each class, but it's complicated.



We just went on a school tour and got our son's schedule, at least the one they have so far...who knows what is going to change when the plan is released tomorrow! The school divides the schedule into week 1 and week 2. Even without Covid adding to the confusion, the schedule is crazy! (Blacked out any last names) Also, the school doesn't use typical course names for some of the classes, IB Design is actually Computers and IT, IB Individuals and Societies is Social Studies, etc.


----------



## FigmentSpark

Aladora said:


> We just went on a school tour and got our son's schedule, at least the one they have so far...who knows what is going to change when the plan is released tomorrow! The school divides the schedule into week 1 and week 2. Even without Covid adding to the confusion, the schedule is crazy! (Blacked out any last names) Also, the school doesn't use typical course names for some of the classes, IB Design is actually Computers and IT, IB Individuals and Societies is Social Studies, etc.
> 
> View attachment 522155View attachment 522156


So that's totally all in class, then?  That's a lot of in-person contacts.


----------



## Aladora

FigmentSpark said:


> So that's totally all in class, then?  That's a lot of in-person contacts.



As of today it is totally in class but that could change tomorrow when the school is sending out their approved reopening plan. 

And yes, it is a lot of in person contact but the school he is going to is really small, less than I think 300 for grades 9-12. The province has set out a cap of 120 in any high school cohort and even if they added all the grade 9s and the grade 10s, they would not reach that amount. The average class size at the school is less than 22. 

It is an independent school so they don’t have to follow the public school district plans but I am really curious to see what they send out tomorrow!


----------



## hdrolfe

My son's school has sent out it's weekly memo (they normally do this Fridays during the school year). Apparently the online French won't start for at least 3 weeks. And they have a map of the play yard with marks to show where each grade will play when they arrive and for recess and such. I'll have to make sure kiddo knows where to go. They split the grade 5 & 6's from each other, putting the grade 3's between them. But this does seem to imply that the whole of grade 6 will be a "cohort" to play together. I'm not sure how I feel about that, though he will be happy to a certain extent since some of his friends are not in immersion and likely not in his class, unless they've put them all in one class. More info to follow next week I guess. Hopefully a bit more detailed since that'll be the last update before the school year starts.


----------



## susanv

My kids schools have sent out the plans for what they are doing.  I am very happy with them.  For the two in High School they will be going 5 days a week for in person schooling.  They will have two courses a day for 42 or 43 days (quadmester system) in cohorts of 15.  Luckily they are in the process of finishing off an addition so that helps.  Staggered lunches and breaks with an extra custodian exclusively for cleaning the washrooms between kids.  Three main sets of washrooms are being rotated through during breaks.  No lunch room/cafeteria, however they can order one of two offerings that will be prepaid the week ahead and then delivered to the classroom.  No use of the microwave.  Sports and teams will be decided later in the fall when they see what they can safely do and follow all safety protocols.  Maximum 30 to a school bus with siblings sitting together.  Classes run from 8:45 am until 1:45 pm, with the students required to do 40 minutes work online at home per subject per day.  My two in elementary school are in cohorts of 18 per class, two cohorts per grade.  Five days a week, full days.  Also staggered lunches and breaks, with a lot of outdoor educating going on.  We have our own outdoor classroom in the woodlot behind the school.  All phys ed taking place outdoors.  Again no microwave, this time with lunch orders available only two days a week.  Extra teachers hired and an extra daytime custodian strictly for cleaning surfaces, etc.  Parents and visitors are not allowed in the schools at this time.  We are at two different private christian schools.  

My work not quite the same.  I drive a school bus for both the public and separate school boards.  I will have to do my best to make sure I am not the weak link.


----------



## bababear_50

New update for the staff at my school,,a little late for those who already made or purchased their own.............................
:***To ensure that health and safety standards are met, school-based staff are required to wear the medical mask that is being provided by the Ministry/Board. The mask that is being provided is an ASTM Level 1 grade mask that provides a higher level of protection than any cloth or non-medical mask. School-based staff may not wear their own cloth masks or alternative face coverings.
*Staff will not be able to work in a school building without wearing a board-provided face mask*.  




Hugs
Mel


----------



## bankr63

Shocked at the recent change for high school students at OCDSB (Ottawa).  Students will be quadmestered (nothing new there) but will be taking only one subject per week alternating weeks between the two subjects.  Instructional periods will be 225 minutes long - yes that is 3 hours and 45 minutes long!
I'm not sure how teachers are going to maintain the focus of a room full of teenagers for 3 and 3/4 hours at a stretch.  I know how I get when a meeting runs much more than an hour at work.  And this will be every instructional day for them. 
https://www.ottawamatters.com/local...students-to-learn-one-course-per-week-2673967
DW is back in school tomorrow.  Looking forward to finally getting the revelation of the plans (at least we hope she does)!  Normally she would have spent last week in preparing her room, but it seemed futile as she doesn't even really know what her teaching assignment will be at this point.  With the start of classes delayed a week now though, she has this coming week to prepare as best she can. 

Funny @bababear_50's post about masks.  They are starting with a staff meeting, and have all been told to "bring your own masks".  Note that the staff meeting is a bit funny too; all teachers are expected to join a zoom call from isolation in their classrooms. Hardly seems worth the trip in to school just to lock yourself into your room; could have just joined from home.


----------



## FigmentSpark

Our (HS) school day just came out:



So half the week they will be going to school in the morning, then rushing home to sign in for the online afternoon sessions.  

I hear you about the focus, but maybe this will be good for some classes, like sciences or shops or foods where they can get into labs/projects that would take longer than a normal class to complete.  It will be dreadful for history, math and English, though, unless those are your favorite subjects.  Not sure how French (FSL) would be, either.  That's a lot to take in for a day with no break.  But maybe they can do some conversation, so who knows.

One things' fro sure, this will be a great "experiment" for educators, to see how well students learn in different settings and lengths of school days.  I hope someone's doing some analysis.


----------



## Jrb1979

First I will say is I'm glad my daughter isn't school age yet so I don't have to deal with this. My biggest issue at least in Ontario with the whole school thing is the lack of agreement between what parents and teachers want and what the provincial government put out. It feels like parents pushed for back to school so they could go back to work. When the government put out what the plan was to get kids back to school it feels like it's not good enough.


----------



## bankr63

FigmentSpark said:


> Our (HS) school day just came out:
> 
> View attachment 522753
> 
> So half the week they will be going to school in the morning, then rushing home to sign in for the online afternoon sessions.
> 
> I hear you about the focus, but maybe this will be good for some classes, like sciences or shops or foods where they can get into labs/projects that would take longer than a normal class to complete.  It will be dreadful for history, math and English, though, unless those are your favorite subjects.  Not sure how French (FSL) would be, either.  That's a lot to take in for a day with no break.  But maybe they can do some conversation, so who knows.
> 
> One things' fro sure, this will be a great "experiment" for educators, to see how well students learn in different settings and lengths of school days.  I hope someone's doing some analysis.


Don't recall if you are GTA or Ottawa.  If Ottawa note that the change I mentioned was just announced on Friday and probably would not be reflected in anything sent home yet.  Apparently the OCDSB 2nd attempt at a plan was mostly accepted by the ministry except that it did not contain sufficient in school time for HS students, so thus the longer instructional time was announced on Friday.


----------



## quandrea

bababear_50 said:


> New update for the staff at my school,,a little late for those who already made or purchased their own.............................
> :***To ensure that health and safety standards are met, school-based staff are required to wear the medical mask that is being provided by the Ministry/Board. The mask that is being provided is an ASTM Level 1 grade mask that provides a higher level of protection than any cloth or non-medical mask. School-based staff may not wear their own cloth masks or alternative face coverings.
> *Staff will not be able to work in a school building without wearing a board-provided face mask*.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hugs
> Mel


Level 1 masks are the least protective of any mask you can buy. They needed to buy level 3. They literally have it backwards and they are requiring their  staff to wear them?!!!  Unbelievable!


----------



## FigmentSpark

bankr63 said:


> Don't recall if you are GTA or Ottawa.  If Ottawa note that the change I mentioned was just announced on Friday and probably would not be reflected in anything sent home yet.  Apparently the OCDSB 2nd attempt at a plan was mostly accepted by the ministry except that it did not contain sufficient in school time for HS students, so thus the longer instructional time was announced on Friday.


GTA.  Sorry, I should have said so in the post.


----------



## Best_Vacation_EVER!

bankr63 said:


> Shocked at the recent change for high school students at OCDSB (Ottawa).  Students will be quadmestered (nothing new there) but will be taking only one subject per week alternating weeks between the two subjects.  Instructional periods will be 225 minutes long - yes that is 3 hours and 45 minutes long!
> I'm not sure how teachers are going to maintain the focus of a room full of teenagers for 3 and 3/4 hours at a stretch.  I know how I get when a meeting runs much more than an hour at work.  And this will be every instructional day for them.
> https://www.ottawamatters.com/local...students-to-learn-one-course-per-week-2673967



So far the Ottawa Catholic Board is still proceeding with the alternate cohorts (ABABA/BABAB) with full days and doing one course in the morning and the second in the afternoon.   I'm actually pretty happy with what they're proposing -- I hope they don't change it.


----------



## quandrea

bababear_50 said:


> New update for the staff at my school,,a little late for those who already made or purchased their own.............................
> :***To ensure that health and safety standards are met, school-based staff are required to wear the medical mask that is being provided by the Ministry/Board. The mask that is being provided is an ASTM Level 1 grade mask that provides a higher level of protection than any cloth or non-medical mask. School-based staff may not wear their own cloth masks or alternative face coverings.
> *Staff will not be able to work in a school building without wearing a board-provided face mask*.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hugs
> Mel


Had to quote this again as I’m awestruck by it. Many doctors have advised teachers to purchase a minimum of five n95 masks to rotate through the school week. To have the choice of wearing a better mass taken away is shocking to me. I’m a teacher by profession. If I were still in the classroom, I’d at a minimum be filing a grievance, but more likely, I’d be leaving my job.


----------



## Madame

quandrea said:


> Had to quote this again as I’m awestruck by it. Many doctors have advised teachers to purchase a minimum of five n95 masks to rotate through the school week. To have the choice of wearing a better mass taken away is shocking to me. I’m a teacher by profession. If I were still in the classroom, I’d at a minimum be filing a grievance, but more likely, I’d be leaving my job.


They simply don’t care.  They are betting on kids not getting really sick & do NOT care about the adults in the buildings.


----------



## quandrea

Madame said:


> They simply don’t care.  They are betting on kids not getting really sick & do NOT care about the adults in the buildings.
> View attachment 522881


You’re right. Watching this whole thing unfold these past weeks has been quite the experience. Such a comedy of errors (but nothing funny about it).  This level 1 mask issue is the most egregious disregard for teachers’ and staff’s well being I’ve witnessed. The government and boards deserve to have all staff and teachers walk out en masse.


----------



## wdwmom3

quandrea said:


> You’re right. Watching this whole thing unfold these past weeks has been quite the experience. Such a comedy of errors (but nothing funny about it).  This level 1 mask issue is the most egregious disregard for teachers’ and staff’s well being I’ve witnessed. The government and boards deserve to have all staff and teachers walk out en masse.


Again where were all the teachers voicing concern over their teenage students working full time in April with NO protection?  What would you have done if all the grocery store workers just didn’t go to work


----------



## bababear_50

wdwmom3 said:


> Again where were all the teachers voicing concern over their teenage students working full time in April with NO protection?  What would you have done if all the grocery store workers just didn’t go to work




No one here has suggested that store clerks and others don't deserve proper protection.
This is a thread on back to school during a Pandemic though.
We are saying that staff in a room with a group of kids for 6 or more hours should be afforded Proper Protection.
And just a FYI teachers and school staff are 110 % there for their kids and act as their advocates and mentors often!!! Many of us have teeenagers (I have a granddaughter that took 2 part time jobs this summer).I was right there advocating and buying supplies where I could.
I also supply ,one of my sons with extra PPE.

Mel


----------



## wdwmom3

quandrea said:


> Level 1 masks are the least protective of any mask you can buy. They needed to buy level 3. They literally have it backwards and they are requiring their  staff to wear them?!!!  Unbelievable!



Level 3 is recommended for cases where there is high risk of aerosols.  You know like when a medical professional is treating someone.  A teacher does not need a level 3.  Yes there is some risk, but can we stop acting like the classroom is somehow comparable to an ICU treating covid patients it’s really not.


----------



## wdwmom3

bababear_50 said:


> No one here has suggested that store clerks and others don't deserve proper protection.
> This is a thread on back to school during a Pandemic though.
> We are saying that staff in a room with a group of kids for 6 or more hours should be afforded Proper Protection.
> A just a FYI teachers and school staff are 110 % there for their kids and act as their advocates and mentors often!!! Many of us have teeenagers (I have a granddaughter that took 2 part time jobs this summer).I was right there advocating and buying supplies where I could.
> 
> 
> Mel



Well I have heard from many of my daughters friends who were forced (or lose their job) to work full time in April with zero protection.   And now they see their “teachers” complaining about the type of male they are being give.   It makes the teenagers feel like crap, where was the teachers union calling for protection of everyone? That’s right they weren’t.  Where were teachers posting all over social media, standing up for their students they claim they care about? That’s right there weren’t.  

My daughter had to receive training on what would happen if someone got mad and spit in her face. And you guys are complaining that you aren’t getting masks that medical professional use to treat covid patients? Seriously?

You know what happened to everyone else who chooses to not go to work cause they think it’s “not safe”.  They lose their job and get zero pay and no CERB and no ei.  I never liked Ford but I’m starting to share his frustration with teachers unions.


----------



## quandrea

.


----------



## quandrea

wdwmom3 said:


> Well I have heard from many of my daughters friends who were forced (or lose their job) to work full time in April with zero protection.   And now they see their “teachers” complaining about the type of male they are being give.   It makes the teenagers feel like crap, where was the teachers union calling for protection of everyone? That’s right they weren’t.  Where were teachers posting all over social media, standing up for their students they claim they care about? That’s right there weren’t.
> 
> My daughter had to receive training on what would happen if someone got mad and spit in her face. And you guys are complaining that you aren’t getting masks that medical professional use to treat covid patients? Seriously?
> 
> You know what happened to everyone else who chooses to not go to work cause they think it’s “not safe”.  They lose their job and get zero pay and no CERB and no ei.  I never liked Ford but I’m starting to share his frustration with teachers unions.


I would have had my teenager quit.


----------



## wdwmom3

quandrea said:


> .


Nope.   Most were given nothing until mask mandates came out.  Now most are given the disposable paper ones we can buy at the drug store.


----------



## wdwmom3

quandrea said:


> I would have had my teenager quit.



Well I guess then teachers can quit too?

Not everyone has the luxury of quitting work and getting no paycheque


----------



## bababear_50

We as school staff are allowed to advocate for ourselves just as parents and family are allowed to advocate for their children.
We as school staff are advocating for the wellbeing of our students also and I think this needs to be recognized.

Mel


----------



## Aladora

Aladora said:


> We just went on a school tour and got our son's schedule, at least the one they have so far...who knows what is going to change when the plan is released tomorrow! The school divides the schedule into week 1 and week 2. Even without Covid adding to the confusion, the schedule is crazy! (Blacked out any last names) Also, the school doesn't use typical course names for some of the classes, IB Design is actually Computers and IT, IB Individuals and Societies is Social Studies, etc.
> 
> View attachment 522155View attachment 522156



The email from the school came at 5:30pm on Friday. Full time in school learning as set out in the timetable I posted above. 

Also released on Friday were the numbers for the previous 24 hours. 124 new cases, the single highest number that we have posted ever. 

Yeah, this is gonna go well.


----------



## Madame

quandrea said:


> I would have had my teenager quit.


My DD did detassling this year.  Safety precautions were amazing.  Not going back to school though...  DoFo’s doc with the stellar LTC record has already said (on YouTube if anyone cares to look) that teachers will NOT get C-19 in schools.  It will be their own carelessness in their community 

All ed staff want is what everyone working in a retail setting has - limited capacity, masking and proper ventilation (boards are already being blamed for not picking up the pace to rehab ventilation with the pittance they were allotted like 1 wk ago).  This situation is not on ed staff, not on boards.  This is the provincial gov.


----------



## AngelDisney

wdwmom3 said:


> Again where were all the teachers voicing concern over their teenage students working full time in April with NO protection?  What would you have done if all the grocery store workers just didn’t go to work


The issue here is teachers are forced to use what’s provided for their protection. Grocery workers have had a choice of what they can use for their safety, work or not work as well.  I have an elderly mom to care for. If I get sick, who’s going to take care of her! It is easier to say whatever when you are not in the shoes. I am more worried about passing COVID-19 to health compromised family members or friends without knowing it. Think about how many teachers and students there are and how widely students and teachers can spread COVID. It’s more that personal concerns here!


----------



## wdwmom3

AngelDisney said:


> The issue here is teachers are forced to use what’s provided for their protection. Grocery workers have had a choice of what they can use for their safety, work or not work as well.  I have an elderly mom to care for. If I get sick, who’s going to take care of her! It is easier to say whatever when you are not in the shoes. I am more worried about passing COVID-19 to health compromised family members or friends without knowing it. Think about how many teachers and students there are and how widely students and teachers can spread COVID. It’s more that personal concerns here!



Well you mention grocery store workers had a choice to work or not work.   You also have that choice.  Yes those decisions suck.  I have a friend who quit her job as a dental hygienist because she felt like she had to.  Teachers have those same choices.  I don’t get why teachers should be treated differently then everyone else.  

And not everyone has can “wear what they want”.  My daughter has to wear specific masks provided to her.  I know others that are the same. It’s like some people on here think that everyone else working has been given amazing protection and the teachers are just being left out .  Or is that they feel teachers should get better then everyone else?


----------



## AngelDisney

wdwmom3 said:


> Well I have heard from many of my daughters friends who were forced (or lose their job) to work full time in April with zero protection.   And now they see their “teachers” complaining about the type of male they are being give.   It makes the teenagers feel like crap, where was the teachers union calling for protection of everyone? That’s right they weren’t.  Where were teachers posting all over social media, standing up for their students they claim they care about? That’s right there weren’t.
> 
> My daughter had to receive training on what would happen if someone got mad and spit in her face. And you guys are complaining that you aren’t getting masks that medical professional use to treat covid patients? Seriously?
> 
> You know what happened to everyone else who chooses to not go to work cause they think it’s “not safe”.  They lose their job and get zero pay and no CERB and no ei.  I never liked Ford but I’m starting to share his frustration with teachers unions.


To your knowledge, I have seen students spit at their teachers. And teachers are never trained to protect themselves from that. They may also have to treat students with seizures before professional help arrives. Only when you are in the profession, you know the inside out. Stereotyping based on personal experiences is dividing up the world unnecessarily.


----------



## wdwmom3

AngelDisney said:


> To your knowledge, I have seen students spit at their teachers. And teachers are never trained to protect themselves from that. They may also have to treat students with seizures before professional help arrives. Only when you are in the profession, you know the inside out. Stereotyping based on personal experiences is dividing up the world unnecessarily.



You are right and obviously some teachers have no idea what people who work in other professions have to deal with.  We keep getting told over and over again how much harder your job is then anyone else’s.  But I don’t think you have a clue what people without a powerful union have to deal with.

And sorry but for a lot of us this is getting old. It’s the same story we kept hearing before the pandemic.


----------



## quandrea

wdwmom3 said:


> Well I guess then teachers can quit too?
> 
> Not everyone has the luxury of quitting work and getting no paycheque


That’s what I would be doing, yes. The stumbling block on the mask issue for me is that the choice to purchase one’s own n95 has been removed. That’s unreasonable in my opinion. If I’m heading into a higher risk environment, I choose an n95. A visit to the hospital?  N95. To the hairdresser? N95. A quick run to to curb side pick up? A level 1 mask. My choice.

The viral load in those rooms can build if there is a Covid case present. Think what you will, but many medical professionals recommend n95 masks in a classroom setting. I’m not saying the board needs to supply them. I’m saying staff should have a choice to buy their own if they decide to do so.

My family has completely withdrawn from the school system.We know the consequences of this. We haven’t taken one penny from the government in all this.   I have no dog in this fight. I’m just appalled that choice In managing one’s risk has been taken away from school staff. And yes, I’d grieve that removal of choice or quit if necessary. And I’d rearrange my whole life if it came to that.


----------



## bababear_50

School staff are just like anyone else. We have children,friends and family.
We have held many jobs in the Gov/Private sector.
My job is no more easier / harder than anyone else's.
This is however Canada and we are afforded the freedom of rights to advocate for ourselves.
You can be your own child's advocate for education,,join a school council,,call your MP or area superintendent,etc.

Mel


----------



## AngelDisney

wdwmom3 said:


> Well you mention grocery store workers had a choice to work or not work.   You also have that choice.  Yes those decisions suck.  I have a friend who quit her job as a dental hygienist because she felt like she had to.  Teachers have those same choices.  I don’t get why teachers should be treated differently then everyone else.
> 
> And not everyone has can “wear what they want”.  My daughter has to wear specific masks provided to her.  I know others that are the same. It’s like some people on here think that everyone else working has been given amazing protection and the teachers are just being left out .  Or is that they feel teachers should get better then everyone else?


Everyone has the right to voice their concerns. Teachers have a bigger presence so the voice is louder. So you can hear it. Imagine your daughter had a union to represent her, would you feel the same now. We don’t think we deserve better, but if you work in a room with no window and poor ventilation that never works properly for 6 hours, you get worried.



wdwmom3 said:


> You are right and obviously some teachers have no idea what people who work in other professions have to deal with.  We keep getting told over and over again how much harder your job is then anyone else’s.  But I don’t think you have a clue what people without a powerful union have to deal with.
> 
> And sorry but for a lot of us this is getting old. It’s the same story we kept hearing before the pandemic.


Teachers have a bigger united body, so their voices are bigger. Every profession should have the right to voice their workers’ concerns. We are lucky to be able to do that. I don’t think we are better but now I may think we are luckier. I do have colleagues who choose to quit. It’s a loss to the students. They are great teachers.


----------



## pigletto

wdwmom3 said:


> You are right and obviously some teachers have no idea what people who work in other professions have to deal with.  We keep getting told over and over again how much harder your job is then anyone else’s.  But I don’t think you have a clue what people without a powerful union have to deal with.
> 
> And sorry but for a lot of us this is getting old. It’s the same story we kept hearing before the pandemic.


Who keeps saying their job is so much harder ? Or is that your negative perception of their concerns and fears ? Im self employed, I don’t have a powerful union. I don’t even have paid sick days. I still support educators and their right to fair and safe working conditions. I will never understand the argument that because working conditions are  unsafe or unfair for one group it should suck for everyone. Why not throw some energy behind advocating for those who don’t have the working conditions you are concerned about rather than taking issue with those who do ?


----------



## Donald - my hero

*Hey, I'll take the heat this might generate but perhaps this specific thread is discussing the ramifications to teachers and staff in schools because it's a thread ABOUT school? There was never one comment throughout this entire thread that dismissed any other type of employee and how their personal lives, health (both physical & mental) and family lives were not impacted by the conditions created by COVID-19. I have seen comparison based on what we have either read, heard or personally experienced between school staff (and yes, I'm lumping everyone together because every single one of the adults inside a school will be in contact with many other people throughout the day) and any other job situations. Comparisons based on the perceived differences in level of contact each type of employee experiences, the main one being, that other than those in health care and meat packing plants, those who've been working from the beginning (or as we passed through each phase and more places opened up) haven't been in close contact with the same group of people for extended periods of time in enclosed spaces that tend to have poor air quality.*


----------



## isabellea

I will only post ONCE about masks on this thread. I'm only giving info because I've seen wrong recommendations about N95 posted, not debating on whether or not a teacher should wear a N95 or not.

If you decide to wear a N95 mask, remember it has to be your fit. For that you need to be *fit-tested* and buy the right N95 model. If your N95 is not a good fit (no way to know unless you get fit-tested), your mask probably won't protect you more than a level 1 or even a non-medical mask (or offers no protection at all). N95 are *DISPOSABLE*!  That means one use only. I know some hospitals are testing ways to disinfect N95 masks to re-use them when stocks are low but right now, to my knowledge, these methods are not approved by Health Canada and I don't see how someone can do it safely from home. If you want a re-usable N95 level 'mask', you need to get a reusable respirator.

https://www.3mcanada.ca/3M/en_CA/wo.../respiratory-protection/reusable-respirators/


----------



## Madame

isabellea said:


> I will only post ONCE about masks on this thread. I'm only giving info, not debating.
> 
> If you decide to wear a N95 mask, remember it has to be your fit. For that you need to be *fit-tested* and buy the right N95 model. If your N95 is not a good fit (no way to know unless you get fit-tested), your mask probably won't protect you more than a level 1 or even a non-medical mask (or offers no protection at all). N95 are *DISPOSABLE*!  That means one use only. I know some hospitals are testing ways to disinfect N95 masks to re-use them when stocks are low but right now, to my knowledge, these methods are not approved by Health Canada and I don't see how someone can do it safely from home. If you want a re-usable N95 level 'mask', you need to get a reusable respirator.
> 
> https://www.3mcanada.ca/3M/en_CA/wo.../respiratory-protection/reusable-respirators/


Meh.  Masks don’t matter anyway.  Kids are eating maskless in rooms & some boards have indicated that kids can’t be taken outside for lunch.


----------



## bcwife76

We're in BC and our school board (Surrey School district) has really stepped up to the plate to go above and beyond what the MOE has planned. Just today they announced some more learning options, including now adding in a blended learning/hybrid model for those who do not want to return full time as of yet (they will be 'phased in' to return to full time face to face by January). While we are still planning on sending our kids to school full time face to face I am really happy to be in a school district that values parents opinions and is giving families even more options. Those who chose this route WILL be tied to their choice school and will NOT lose their place, which again is even more than what the gov't has mandated.


----------



## quandrea

isabellea said:


> I will only post ONCE about masks on this thread. I'm only giving info because I've seen wrong recommendations about N95 posted, not debating on whether or not a teacher should wear a N95 or not.
> 
> If you decide to wear a N95 mask, remember it has to be your fit. For that you need to be *fit-tested* and buy the right N95 model. If your N95 is not a good fit (no way to know unless you get fit-tested), your mask probably won't protect you more than a level 1 or even a non-medical mask (or offers no protection at all). N95 are *DISPOSABLE*!  That means one use only. I know some hospitals are testing ways to disinfect N95 masks to re-use them when stocks are low but right now, to my knowledge, these methods are not approved by Health Canada and I don't see how someone can do it safely from home. If you want a re-usable N95 level 'mask', you need to get a reusable respirator.
> 
> https://www.3mcanada.ca/3M/en_CA/wo.../respiratory-protection/reusable-respirators/


Good information. I was in health care and have been fit tested. I agree, it’s important. As for reusing them, even hospitals are reusing them as they are scarce. Not ideal, but there you have it.


----------



## Silvermist999

Teachers and school staff do have a valid concern that they will be at risk without proper PPE or smaller class sizes. However, it seems as if the focus of many conversations is always on the safety of the teachers and school staff.

Think about all of the children who are in these crowded classrooms.  Will these children be protected enough by their personal cloth/disposable masks in a crowded classroom.  They could also get infected by their teacher, and their classmates. 

Think also about their parents who are likely anxious and worried, since they have no other choice but to send their kids to school, in order to go to work.  These parents are those that do not have the option to work from home or stay home with their kids, they are likely those who kept working in healthcare, manufacturing or at local grocery stores, when everyone else including teachers, stayed safe at home back in March.

Let’s also remember that there are thousands of children in these crowded classrooms, who are facing the same health risks as the teachers.


----------



## Lumpy1106

Well here we go...
First grader in private Catholic school - started this AM, online only, went off without a hitch.  The school pretty much had it together last spring though, so it went as well as we expected and there was ZERO drama about it all summer.  10/10.

Public High School starts tomorrow - buckle up and don't look into the eye, this is going to be rough.  Spring was a fiasco, it could only improve, but drama?  Oh dear lord.  More drama than Newsies!  First they sent out a bunch of questionnaires, all of which were moot because the state shut down the schools anyway.  Then they fought about contracts. As part of the fight, the superintendent said they had to teach from their classrooms.  You would have though the superintendent was filling each classroom with angry bees, because that really started an uproar.  The superintended relented - they could teach from home.  Then the FINALLY chose to use Canvas.  More drama - how long will they get (paid) training?  They got a full week of paid training, but honestly - look up "Canvas" on YouTube.  There are, no exaggeration, 100's, maybe 1000's of videos for every imaginable question you could possible have.  That didn't stop the drama - several of the more outspoken teachers took to social media crying about how hard it was.  Well, no, because I could set it up for them and I've only watched a couple of videos - 15 mins tops.  It's not that hard - learn by doing, just jump in.

But wait...
We've been getting e-mails all morning - Canvas has not gone live, and does not work.  Classes start tomorrow.  They are scheduled to teach for 1/2 days for the first 3 days, then take Friday off.  Personally, my line of work, I'd be writing lesson plans using Powerpoint, or making PDFs and soldiering on like it didn't matter, but guessing it will get pushed until after the holiday.  

Is that vaccine ready yet?


----------



## bankr63

I know this is Florida and not Ontario, and their situation is much more dire than ours, but still, this is a horrible result for the first two weeks of classes:

https://thehill.com/homenews/state-...Nq0YWL1HIqJ-TSdmLekx23xlETloM_vdnRTViHHTgeqTw


----------



## hdrolfe

Ottawa public board is post posing the start of school, again. Catholic board hasn't said anything though. I have already had to add extra vacation days and shuffle my time off to accommodate this, and my employer is pretty understanding. I am not sure what the extra week is for.  But this is what annoys me about the planning and I dont know if it is the boards or the unions who cause the teachers to not be able to get to their classes to start preparing. Even knowing that they had a hard time planning without knowing parents choices. They have had the information for a week or two already and should have been in the school this week to set it up. 

Seems to me this year will be another write off for education, like last year with all the strikes and then covid shutdown. I wonder when the kids will make up the information they will be missing.


----------



## Debbie

hdrolfe said:


> ..... I dont know if it is the boards or the unions who cause the teachers to not be able to get to their classes to start preparing. Even knowing that they had a hard time planning without knowing parents choices. They have had the information for a week or two already and should have been in the school this week to set it up.
> 
> Seems to me this year will be another write off for education, like last year with all the strikes and then covid shutdown. I wonder when the kids will make up the information they will be missing.


I know that in TVDSB it was the Boards that would not let the teachers into their classrooms until after August 15. The teachers who went in went in blind as to numbers. And some, because of the Boards adding more time for parents to decide (not enough information earlier) are now not teaching the same grade (classes ARE being consolidated) or are surplus and haven't YET been assigned their position for the new year. I posted a link on FB about the vision of FDK and my daughter about flipped....she has never seen the proposals that the Board is putting out there for parents. It affects how she will set up her classroom, and teach. (Luckily much is what she had planned anyway, but still...)

So, in a nutshell....the information is not there for the teachers. They have nothing, and are planning blind, but knowing that it could all change tomorrow or next Tuesday. (Not to mention on October 1)

Finally, the teachers will, as they always do, take each child from where they are and plan to move them forward. Teaching facts isn't the goal, teaching learning strategies is. And, to be honest, who's to say that they are behind? If the curriculum needs to be adjusted over the next little while, that's fine. The learning strategies won't.


----------



## Debbie

One more thing that I thought of this morning. For anyone who has registered for face-to-face education but planning to keep them at home to see how it goes, do not forget to call them in absent every day. I did one year when my daughter was on a choral trip and when she got back to school they had removed her from the roll and she needed to be re-registered.


----------



## star72232

WRDSB has changed their start again.  

I just have to laugh at this point.  I get the teachers' frustration - I know some who don't even know what grade they will be teaching yet.  I get parents' frustration - dates and times and everything are still changing.  We are lucky - my DH is a SAHD, so we have a lot more flexibility than most people.  However, with 4 kids in 3 different schools, with start dates changing, with cohorts still not assigned for HS, with my HS kids classes changing on a daily basis -  - I think I'm ready for a drink.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

Are any of your schools allowing the use of lockers?  DD12's junior high said no to them.  That should be interesting when a bunch of kids can't be bothered to lug every since textbook and expect to share with someone LOL
DD is lucky since my sister's/nephew's house is across the street from their school. Many have to walk a good distance.


----------



## vegs1

I am not a teacher. I try very hard to always have respect for others, especially in hard times such as through this pandemic. So many people from grocery store clerks to nurses to the disabled man down my street who delivers newspapers have stepped up to do what is needed. I think Teachers are having a hard time right now....same as the people above. 

The only ask I have is that these conversations not be had out loud in front of  children, no matter their age. My neighbour, whom I adore, is a teacher.  As much as I love her, we have had to ask her to not discuss how “unsafe” it is when kids are around. Starting school is scary enough but when an actual teacher is telling them on a daily basis they’re going to get sick and that it isn’t safe, and that she is putting herself and the kids in danger, it just seems like too much. 

My friend is a mental health counsellor.  She said everyone needs to take a big, deep breath, try very hard to not over-worry (and we all know it is difficult to not do that) and to have compassion and empathy for everyone whether it is teachers, the government, the school board but especially the children. All of this negative talk is hurting everyone. Our local school had this on their Facebook page.  Sometimes, lemons do make lemonade!!!!  

Wishing everyone well with the decision that is right for their family.


----------



## vegs1

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> Are any of your schools allowing the use of lockers?  DD12's junior high said no to them.  That should be interesting when a bunch of kids can't be bothered to lug every since textbook and expect to share with someone LOL
> DD is lucky since my sister's/nephew's house is across the street from their school. Many have to walk a good distance.



My daughter had to carry all of her heavy chemistry, algebra, English texts with her in grade 12. The school was being renovated and lockers were pulled away from the wall. She managed with it and she is a very tiny person.  They won’t be allowed to share this year I imagine and without their texts, they will fall behind. Aren’t most kids on a revamped schedule so they don’t have every class every day?  Maybe they won’t need every single textbook with them.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

There hasn't been any announcement about modified course loads.  Just that everyone is back 100% for now.

I was thinking they might make the teachers be the ones to change classrooms and keep the students in the same one versus moving to a different one for each course. Won't know until next week.


----------



## BLAZEY

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> Are any of your schools allowing the use of lockers?  DD12's junior high said no to them.  That should be interesting when a bunch of kids can't be bothered to lug every since textbook and expect to share with someone LOL
> DD is lucky since my sister's/nephew's house is across the street from their school. Many have to walk a good distance.


From my understanding, yes as they want as few personal belongings in the classroom as possible. so you coat backpack and lunch need to go somewhere.


----------



## star72232

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> Are any of your schools allowing the use of lockers?  DD12's junior high said no to them.  That should be interesting when a bunch of kids can't be bothered to lug every since textbook and expect to share with someone LOL
> DD is lucky since my sister's/nephew's house is across the street from their school. Many have to walk a good distance.



Our kids won't be able to use lockers in HS in WRDSB.  

They also only have 1 class a day, so it's less of an issue - they only have the books they need for that class with them.  I'm not sure what the middle school is doing (my older 2 are out of it, my younger 2 aren't in it yet).  

There are no indoor/outdoor shoes for the elementary kids in September in our board.  One less thing to buy!


----------



## mshanson3121

So a few more updates in NB: band isn't allowed, but music class is. K-8 are allowed to "sing quietly" inside the class, but high school students can only sing outside   Apparently the NB government missed the science that says children 5 & under spread Covid worse than old kids/adults, and otherwise, and over that age they spread it just as much as adults. And apparently administration is clueless to the fact that young kids have a harder time regulating volume when singing than older kids. Yet again showing our provincial government to be clueless, LOL.

Busing schedules are starting to come out today. Going to be hard for people in rural areas. A friend of mine, her grade 2 student is going to be getting on the bus at 7:30 am, and won't be getting home until 4:00. That's a mighty long day for a 7 year old. Another friend of mine lives within a km of school so technically are walking distance, but have always been able to use the bus. They just received notice today that they aren't going to be allowed to use the bus this year. This leaves her completely incapable of getting her kids to school since she runs a daycare, her husband is a long haul trucker, and her daughter will not walk due to severe anxiety. Just crazy to me that we are one week out from the return to school and they are JUST giving parents - the vast majority of whom work, this information now.


----------



## Disneylover99

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> Are any of your schools allowing the use of lockers?  DD12's junior high said no to them.  That should be interesting when a bunch of kids can't be bothered to lug every since textbook and expect to share with someone LOL
> DD is lucky since my sister's/nephew's house is across the street from their school. Many have to walk a good distance.


No lockers in TDSB. I think students are only in one class for the morning, every other day, then they head home for lunch. So, no need.


----------



## pigletto

DSBN ( Niagara) is not allowing lockers. They are in one classroom for the four hours they are there and need to bring their things to class. That could be a challenge when we are back to winter coats and boots etc. But we also may not be in school by then so we will cross that bridge when we get there. 

My high schooler will get to school 15 minutes early and his bus comes 15 minutes after school lets out . For those times they have to report to “Study Hall” . I‘m not sure what that is tbh. I imagine they would be smart enough to not stick them all in one large group to wait . We shall see.


----------



## FigmentSpark

It's also possible that some of the texts will be available as online copies.  If so, that will help with the load of books.


----------



## pigletto

FigmentSpark said:


> It's also possible that some of the texts will be available as online copies.  If so, that will help with the load of books.


My ds16 doesn’t bring home a lot of textbooks. Just one here and there . Much of his work was online already. And last year his locker was near his one class on the third floor and the rest of his classes were on first so he carried around his bag most of the time anyway. I think they will be fine without the lockers.


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

No lockers this year but they still need to bring inside shoes.  I think they will probably have to line shoes up outside their classroom door like they do in the winter with their boots. Each class will start the day outside in their community (cohort) and will enter at staggered times with some teachers choosing to remain outside for awhile doing outdoor learning. We are supposed to find out this week who the teachers are for our kids as well as the approximate outside area for their class.


----------



## star72232

pigletto said:


> My ds16 doesn’t bring home a lot of textbooks. Just one here and there . Much of his work was online already. And last year his locker was near his one class on the third floor and the rest of his classes were on first so he carried around his bag most of the time anyway. I think they will be fine without the lockers.



Especially in boards where they are doing early dismissals. My ODS will be home by 1pm. He’ll just take a snack and eat lunch at home. That reduces what he’s carrying even more.
DDs school hasn’t posted times, schedules, etc, so I’m not sure what time she’ll be home. I’m hoping it’s similar, and she can bypass the lunch issue as well.


----------



## AngelDisney

Disneylover99 said:


> No lockers in TDSB. I think students are only in one class for the morning, every other day, then they head home for lunch. So, no need.


The updated schedule as of now is one class in-school in the morning and one class virtually in the afternoon with two classes per quadmester on a class1/class2 alternating in-school schedule with alternating cohorts. I think the students would be more confusing with the alternating cohort/class schedule. I will have to remind them when they will see me again daily to make sure they don’t come in for the wrong class. It happened when our school was on a simple day1/day2 schedule years ago. Then we changed to semestered school.

This is for TDSB high schools.


----------



## damo

mshanson3121 said:


> So a few more updates in NB: band isn't allowed, but music class is. K-8 are allowed to "sing quietly" inside the class, but high school students can only sing outside   Apparently the NB government missed the science that says children 5 & under spread Covid worse than old kids/adults, and otherwise, and over that age they spread it just as much as adults. And apparently administration is clueless to the fact that young kids have a harder time regulating volume when singing than older kids. Yet again showing our provincial government to be clueless, LOL.
> 
> Busing schedules are starting to come out today. Going to be hard for people in rural areas. A friend of mine, her grade 2 student is going to be getting on the bus at 7:30 am, and won't be getting home until 4:00. That's a mighty long day for a 7 year old. Another friend of mine lives within a km of school so technically are walking distance, but have always been able to use the bus. They just received notice today that they aren't going to be allowed to use the bus this year. This leaves her completely incapable of getting her kids to school since she runs a daycare, her husband is a long haul trucker, and her daughter will not walk due to severe anxiety. Just crazy to me that we are one week out from the return to school and they are JUST giving parents - the vast majority of whom work, this information now.




I am still hearing that kids 5 and under do not transmit the disease as much.  Do you have a link to something?  I've got a 3 year old grand-daughter going back to nursery school and I'd be really interested in reading that information.  I've read in a small study of symptomatic youngsters that they may carry more covid load but there is no evidence that they are super spreaders.

https://healthblog.uofmhealth.org/c...ween-kids-and-spread-of-covid-remains-unclear
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...uper-spreaders-Covid-19-scientists-claim.html


----------



## Disneylover99

AngelDisney said:


> The updated schedule as of now is one class in-school in the morning and one class virtually in the afternoon with two classes per quadmester on a class1/class2 alternating in-school schedule with alternating cohorts. I think the students would be more confusing with the alternating cohort/class schedule. I will have to remind them when they will see me again daily to make sure they don’t come in for the wrong class. It happened when our school was on a simple day1/day2 schedule years ago. Then we changed to semestered school.
> 
> This is for TDSB high schools.



My kids are in high school and I teach elementary and we continue to be confused. Lol.

I will feel better once they get a schedule and I get a confirmed teaching assignment.


----------



## pigletto

damo said:


> I am still hearing that kids 5 and under do not transmit the disease as much.  Do you have a link to something?  I've got a 3 year old grand-daughter going back to nursery school and I'd be really interested in reading that information.  I've read in a small study of symptomatic youngsters that they may carry more covid load but there is no evidence that they are super spreaders.
> 
> https://healthblog.uofmhealth.org/c...ween-kids-and-spread-of-covid-remains-unclear
> https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...uper-spreaders-Covid-19-scientists-claim.html


https://thehill.com/homenews/state-...Nq0YWL1HIqJ-TSdmLekx23xlETloM_vdnRTViHHTgeqTw
This article ( from a politically neutral and fact checked media source ) was shared on the last page. It shares the breakdown of  child numbers in Florida. At the time of the article there were 17,311 child cases recorded to date. 7616 of which were in the 1-4 age group.
My personal opinion is that not enough children were studied to make any solid claims on their ability to spread the virus. They were at home and socially isolated for the first 5 months of the pandemic.


----------



## MoreTravels

mshanson3121 said:


> Another friend of mine lives within a km of school so technically are walking distance, but have always been able to use the bus. They just received notice today that they aren't going to be allowed to use the bus this year. This leaves her completely incapable of getting her kids to school since she runs a daycare, her husband is a long haul trucker, and her daughter will not walk due to severe anxiety. Just crazy to me that we are one week out from the return to school and they are JUST giving parents - the vast majority of whom work, this information now.



I believe there are private school bus companies, similar to Uber on contract, that can pick up your kids for a door-to-door drop off. The drivers are insured and bonded. This will allow consistency and reduced contacts. The downside is obviously the cost.


----------



## MoreTravels

damo said:


> I am still hearing that kids 5 and under do not transmit the disease as much.  Do you have a link to something?  I've got a 3 year old grand-daughter going back to nursery school and I'd be really interested in reading that information.  I've read in a small study of symptomatic youngsters that they may carry more covid load but there is no evidence that they are super spreaders.



Well, medical evidence is based on different levels of research such as randomized control trials (RCT), cohort studies, and observational studies. Since it would not be ethical to do RCT on transmission rate of a contagious disease, the only way to do some scientific analysis is from observation studies. This is done by observing cases that have occurred and draw epidemiological conclusion from them. This is how medical doctors study transmissible diseases such as HIV.

The only problem is, COVID-19 is a new disease. When it first started as a pandemic in March 2020, the whole world practically shuts down. Only the adults and essential workers are still outside. All the children have stayed home full-time until very recently. This means there has not been any experience on how kids would transmit when they are exposed in a crowd. The schools, libraries, sports, all have been canceled. Most of our children are simply quarantined from the outside world during this pandemic.

So when people say "there has been no case of kids with COVID this and that", I think it is not fair. It is almost the same as saying "there has been no COVID reported on the moon". 

We have to remember, as many lawyers with logic training would know.... ABSENCE OF EVIDENCE IS NOT THE SAME AS EVIDENCE OF ABSENCE. Right now, with children's cohort transmission rate, we have an "absence of evidence" Think about it, is that what you are really inquiring about? I think most people want "evidence of absence".


----------



## damo

MoreTravels said:


> Well, medical evidence is based on different levels of research such as randomized control trials (RCT), cohort studies, and observational studies. Since it would not be ethical to do RCT on transmission rate of a contagious disease, the only way to do some scientific analysis is from observation studies. This is done by observing cases that have occurred and draw epidemiological conclusion from them. This is how medical doctors study transmissible diseases such as HIV.
> 
> The only problem is, COVID-19 is a new disease. When it first started as a pandemic in March 2020, the whole world practically shuts down. Only the adults and essential workers are still outside. All the children have stayed home full-time until very recently. This means there has not been any experience on how kids would transmit when they are exposed in a crowd. The schools, libraries, sports, all have been canceled. Most of our children are simply quarantined from the outside world during this pandemic.
> 
> So when people say "there has been no case of kids with COVID this and that", I think it is not fair. It is almost the same as saying "there has been no COVID reported on the moon".
> 
> We have to remember, as many lawyers with logic training would know.... ABSENCE OF EVIDENCE IS NOT THE SAME AS EVIDENCE OF ABSENCE. Right now, with children's cohort transmission rate, we have an "absence of evidence" Think about it, is that what you are really inquiring about? I think most people want "evidence of absence".



What I'm inquiring about is  "the science that says children 5 & under spread Covid worse than old kids/adults, and otherwise, and over that age they spread it just as much as adults." as posted by a previous poster.  That is all.


----------



## Pumpkin1172

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> Are any of your schools allowing the use of lockers?


In our highschool...no lockers.  The kids are to bring all their books, chromebooks/laptops, in class with them.  They will store their backpacks and jackets on the back of chairs.  No microwaves, no cafeteria.  i am not sure if kids change classrooms, or if the kids do.  

I know it has been a struggle for teachers, school boards and all the extra staff employed by the school districts....but like all other people returning to work, they are working through all the logistics of it.  Our local school district has done great!  And like everyone else who is back to work, things are fluid and changes will be made where needed.  

I dropped our youngest DS for his first day of Senior year!!!!  He was excited and very anxious about it.  Each grade has different entrances and staggered start times.  They are in cohorts of 10-15 kids.  Since we are in northern Alberta...no outdoor learning.  Our weather does not permit that to happen.  No one comes into the school, unless you call ahead and book a time to see someone.  Our kids still have classes same as before...semester 1 and 2,  5 blocks a day I believe.  

The buses are running.   You had to fill out ( like in previous years ) the application to get a bus pass.  There may not be room for all kids due to social distancing.  Passes were given on a first come, first serve basis.  The kids tap the pass each time they get on and off the bus.  I had sent the form in at the beginning of August, and DS has one for the whole year.  Hopefully he passes his road test, then he will drive to school and free up that space for someone else.  

As a whole, I have been impressed with our local school board.  In the beginning of this whole s#&t show started, and we didn't know much about the whole virus, and here my dh and I are trotting off to work, we were scared and unsure about what to do.  Our work places changed adapted, and we are continually changing.  It is a fluid situation.  The whole teaching community has stepped up, and they are doing what they can.  I am glad their voice is loud...but they also need to remember that many of the other people working, are at risk everyday with different people coming into our work places.  We can't make our patrons wear masks if they don't want to, wash their hands or use hand sanitizer.  I can't stop someone from yelling at me across my desk when I tell them I need a payment on their account before they can pick up more material or that they need to put a mask on if they want to shop in the store that I work at for my second job.  They have WAY MORE control about their work environment than I do.  But as a whole...they have done extremely well!!!!!


----------



## MoreTravels

I think there is not enough science to draw any strong conclusion. It was once thought the masks would not be useful but that changed. It was once thought there is immunity but that changed, with a confirmed case of someone getting re-infected.

Medical science and guideline change frequently. I would keep an open mind and take more cautious steps.


----------



## bankr63

So third day at work for DW, and she still doesn't even know what her teaching assignment is yet.  Last night they removed all of the desks from her classroom (puzzling).  Administration is not able to tell her (or any of the other staff) anything yet, apparently awaiting approval of their plan.  She is probably now the most senior teacher at her school with all of the early retirements that were taken, so her job is secure, but she has been in tears coming home for the past two nights with fear of the unknown and dreading what is happening.  She thinks a lot about worst case scenarios, so I keep trying to suggest positive ones (I know I sound somewhat negative on here, but trying to keep up appearances at home - this is MY outlet), but keeping a calm face is getting increasingly hard to do.


----------



## pigletto

bankr63 said:


> So third day at work for DW, and she still doesn't even know what her teaching assignment is yet.  Last night they removed all of the desks from her classroom (puzzling).  Administration is not able to tell her (or any of the other staff) anything yet, apparently awaiting approval of their plan.  She is probably now the most senior teacher at her school with all of the early retirements that were taken, so her job is secure, but she has been in tears coming home for the past two nights with fear of the unknown and dreading what is happening.  She thinks a lot about worst case scenarios, so I keep trying to suggest positive ones (I know I sound somewhat negative on here, but trying to keep up appearances at home - this is MY outlet), but keeping a calm face is getting increasingly hard to do.


I can’t even begin to understand the stress and the worry she’s under. I think as a responsible professional she‘s likely trying to plan for all scenarios, but can’t possibly do that without any information .  That would make me anxious too . I‘m sure it‘s draining for all of you and I’m sorry it’s so rough right now.


----------



## scrappinginontario

My friend who has taught high school for the past 10+ years applied to teach virtually.  This was granted but she was informed last Friday that she will be teaching elementary.  It's now less than a week before school begins and she has not yet been told what grade(s) she will be teaching.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

NS has a back to school update in  few minutes online:

https://novascotia.ca/stayinformed/webcast/


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

Our school board (DSBN) voted on Monday night to use 1% of it's reserves to lower class sizes in Elementary schools. Kindergarten classes will have no more than 22 students, maximum of 17 kids in grades 1-3 and a cap of 22 in grades 4-8. They are using the reserves to hire around 60 elementary teachers and 10 for secondary schools. Most new teachers hired will be assigned to virtual classrooms. 80% of Elementary students are coming back in person as well as 83% of Secondary students. I think most teachers have chosen to return to in class and that is why the new hires will be teaching virtual classes. The NCDSB (Niagara Catholic) will see 87% returning for in class in Elementary and 83% in Secondary but so far they have not decided to hire more teachers.


----------



## bankr63

I have to say that I was infuriated by Premier Ford's comments reported in media today that the schools are "all ready to go".  Really?!? How does that work if the teachers don't know what they are teaching yet.  Also, no PPE present in DW's school yet (they are all still providing their own).  I think we are a fair way away from "ready to go" yet!


----------



## pigletto

DiaryofaDisneyKid said:


> Our school board (DSBN) voted on Monday night to use 1% of it's reserves to lower class sizes in Elementary schools. Kindergarten classes will have no more than 22 students, maximum of 17 kids in grades 1-3 and a cap of 22 in grades 4-8. They are using the reserves to hire around 60 elementary teachers and 10 for secondary schools. Most new teachers hired will be assigned to virtual classrooms. 80% of Elementary students are coming back in person as well as 83% of Secondary students. I think most teachers have chosen to return to in class and that is why the new hires will be teaching virtual classes. The NCDSB (Niagara Catholic) will see 87% returning for in class in Elementary and 83% in Secondary but so far they have not decided to hire more teachers.


I think this is commendable and I’m glad to see it. I also don’t think these are appropriate social distancing numbers but just reasonable class sizes. We haven’t seen that in so long in the DSBN we’ve forgotten what it looks like.


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

pigletto said:


> I think this is commendable and I’m glad to see it. I also don’t think these are appropriate social distancing numbers but just reasonable class sizes. We haven’t seen that in so long in the DSBN we’ve forgotten what it looks like.


I don't think I can remember smaller class sizes, LOL. I was in public school in the late 80's and we had classes of 30.  I think for some classes and schools it will still be harder to social distance with these numbers. Our school is older (same school I went to) and has really big classrooms so I don't think there will be a problem with distancing. Unless one of my older 2 get stuck in a portable.


----------



## Debbie

bankr63 said:


> I have to say that I was infuriated by Premier Ford's comments reported in media today that the schools are "all ready to go".  Really?!? How does that work if the teachers don't know what they are teaching yet.  Also, no PPE present in DW's school yet (they are all still providing their own).  I think we are a fair way away from "ready to go" yet!


Yes, and people on Twitter are reporting that some school boards are telling their staff that they are not to let the public know how bad it really is.


----------



## Pumpkin1172

bankr63 said:


> So third day at work for DW, and she still doesn't even know what her teaching assignment is yet. Last night they removed all of the desks from her classroom (puzzling). Administration is not able to tell her (or any of the other staff) anything yet, apparently awaiting approval of their plan. She is probably now the most senior teacher at her school with all of the early retirements that were taken, so her job is secure, but she has been in tears coming home for the past two nights with fear of the unknown and dreading what is happening. She thinks a lot about worst case scenarios, so I keep trying to suggest positive ones (I know I sound somewhat negative on here, but trying to keep up appearances at home - this is MY outlet), but keeping a calm face is getting increasingly hard to do.


I am so sorry that your DW is dealing with all of this!!!!  It has to be mentally and emotionally draining.  This is NOT an easy time for anyone...and right now, it is NOT easy for teachers.  I will cross my fingers that soon, things start to work out and she finds a schedule and flow for her days.   Teaching is not for the light hearted.  It is like being a nurse.  Those are two professions that deserve the most appreciation for what they do.  Just know that people are thinking of all the teachers when they are sending their children back into the doors of the schools, knowing how amazing most teachers are...and appreciative of what they do.  Especially after having to home school their children for the remainder of the previous school year.


----------



## mshanson3121

MoreTravels said:


> I believe there are private school bus companies, similar to Uber on contract, that can pick up your kids for a door-to-door drop off. The drivers are insured and bonded. This will allow consistency and reduced contacts. The downside is obviously the cost.



Not here. We are in a tiny rural area. We don't even have taxis let alone Uber etc... lol.


----------



## mshanson3121

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> Are any of your schools allowing the use of lockers?



No lockers allowed here. No idea how that's going to work? Winter jackets, winter boots? Lunches? Not to mention a slew of heavy textbooks, books etc...??? Where is that all going?


----------



## Disneylover99

bankr63 said:


> So third day at work for DW, and she still doesn't even know what her teaching assignment is yet.  Last night they removed all of the desks from her classroom (puzzling).  Administration is not able to tell her (or any of the other staff) anything yet, apparently awaiting approval of their plan.  She is probably now the most senior teacher at her school with all of the early retirements that were taken, so her job is secure, but she has been in tears coming home for the past two nights with fear of the unknown and dreading what is happening.  She thinks a lot about worst case scenarios, so I keep trying to suggest positive ones (I know I sound somewhat negative on here, but trying to keep up appearances at home - this is MY outlet), but keeping a calm face is getting increasingly hard to do.


I just found out today that only roughly 25% of the students in my school are going back to class. Teachers are overwhelmed and scrambling. Some will be placed at another school or do online teaching. A few are considering a leave of absence. Nobody knows who gets to stay or go. I don't expect we'll get a teaching assignment til late next week.


----------



## wdwmom3

Disneylover99 said:


> I just found out today that only roughly 25% of the students in my school are going back to class. Teachers are overwhelmed and scrambling. Some will be placed at another school or do online teaching. A few are considering a leave of absence. Nobody knows who gets to stay or go. I don't expect we'll get a teaching assignment til late next week.



only 25%? Well that will make small classes easier.


----------



## quandrea

wdwmom3 said:


> only 25%? Well that will make small classes easier.


I wonder where this is. The averages we’ve heard are 80% back, 20% online. Hadn’t really thought of the places outside the average. Must be areas with a lot of work from home or stay at home parents. Interesting.....


----------



## Disneylover99

wdwmom3 said:


> only 25%? Well that will make small classes easier.


Not necessarily. Split classes will help to maximize class sizes and eliminate teachers.


----------



## Disneylover99

quandrea said:


> I wonder where this is. The averages we’ve heard are 80% back, 20% online. Hadn’t really thought of the places outside the average. Must be Andrea with a lot of work from home or stay at home parents. Interesting.....


It was frustrating to listen to CP24 this evening. They don't seem to talk about schools where the majority of students are not going back. There are other neighbouring schools with a very low percentage of students returning as well.


----------



## quandrea

Disneylover99 said:


> Not necessarily. Split classes will help to maximize class sizes and eliminate teachers.


This is true.


----------



## OnceUponATime15

Disneylover99 said:


> It was frustrating to listen to CP24 this evening. They don't seem to talk about schools where the majority of students are not going back. There are other neighbouring schools with a very low percentage of students returning as well.



Out here as well. (DDSB)  One of my childcare families, Mom & Dad are teachers.. Dad is a Secondary school Guidance Counselor,  Mom was telling me yesterday that every day they get closer to the start date of school, more & more families are having a change of heart about in person classes and numbers are dropping dramatically.  She was a JK teacher the past few years at a lower enrollment school, she has no idea what her assignment will end up being. She feels she has enough seniority to stay put.. but as the numbers drop so does her morale and her anxiety level rises. 

When Doug Ford did his school tour this week and pronounced all was great... maybe he should have visited schools that were not staged for his “photo op”.


----------



## tgropp

If an outbreak happens and students are to stay at home, what would stop the teachers from reporting to school each day during their regular working hours and work from there? They could do their planning lessons and video calls from the school where all their resources are. There would be plenty of space to social distance from the other school personnel in the school during working hours. If there are 30 students in a classroom, Every student could get approximately 45 Minutes of video time a week


----------



## mshanson3121

quandrea said:


> I wonder where this is. The averages we’ve heard are 80% back, 20% online. Hadn’t really thought of the places outside the average. Must be areas with a lot of work from home or stay at home parents. Interesting.....



Here in NB there are no online options. Your options are enroll in school (which will be blended delivery for high school) or homeschool. That's it.


----------



## scrappinginontario

Disneylover99 said:


> Not necessarily. Split classes will help to maximize class sizes and eliminate teachers.


  Yes.  Last year my daughter’s grade had 2 full classes and a split.  This year I’ve been told there is1 full class and 2 splits (5/6, full 6, 6/7).  I’m not convinced class sizes will be much (if at all) smaller.


----------



## Disneylover99

scrappinginontario said:


> Yes.  Last year my daughter’s grade had 2 full classes and a split.  This year I’ve been told there is1 full class and 2 splits (5/6, full 6, 6/7). * I’m not convinced class sizes will be much (if at all) smaller.*



Class sizes will be capped at a lower number if your child attends a school in a community that is deemed at risk for covid, otherwise it's really going to be business as usual and luck of the draw in terms of getting a smaller class size. As an example, the 2/3 split at my school only has 14 students in it. Quite low since the cap is 20. The other classes are much higher. And once parents get wind of a low class size, they may decide to re-register their child at the next opt in. Which may significantly boost the enrolment in the class with low enrolment......I'm not sure where your daughter goes, so this may not apply to you. I'm just talking about the TDSB.


----------



## FigmentSpark

New one that's come up... our HS has uniforms.  The students who are in online classes (whether full or halftime) are to "dress appropriately for school", meaning, in uniform at home in front of their computer.


----------



## quandrea

FigmentSpark said:


> New one that's come up... our HS has uniforms.  The students who are in online classes (whether full or halftime) are to "dress appropriately for school", meaning, in uniform at home in front of their computer.


That’s ridiculous!  And this is coming from someone who wore a uniform for 15 years in school. Again, they are taking everything good about online learning and throwing it out the window. Do these boards not have consultants?


----------



## mshanson3121

FigmentSpark said:


> New one that's come up... our HS has uniforms.  The students who are in online classes (whether full or halftime) are to "dress appropriately for school", meaning, in uniform at home in front of their computer.



Do they mean an actual physical uniform (do they have to wear one at school?) or just conform to dress codes? To be honest, I can kind of understand this one - if they're doing virtual classrooms where they can see each other, it makes sense that they would maintain the same dress code as in class.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

NS doesn't have online options either.  In class or Homeschooling.


----------



## scrappinginontario

Disneylover99 said:


> Class sizes will be capped at a lower number if your child attends a school in a community that is deemed at risk for covid, otherwise it's really going to be business as usual and luck of the draw in terms of getting a smaller class size. As an example, the 2/3 split at my school only has 14 students in it. Quite low since the cap is 20. The other classes are much higher. And once parents get wind of a low class size, they may decide to re-register their child at the next opt in. Which may significantly boost the enrolment in the class with low enrolment......I'm not sure where your daughter goes, so this may not apply to you. I'm just talking about the TDSB.


In Durham the Trustees voted to ensure 1M distancing in classes.  This is not possible in most classrooms in my dd's school if class sizes are similar to what they were.

_"A. The Board of Trustees passed a motion on August 12 to exceed the Ministry of Education’s guidance on physical distancing of students by: a) Ensuring all classes allow for the distancing of students, at a minimum of one metre as recommended in the guidance documents relied upon by the government for other aspects of its reopening plan; b) Authorizing the Director of Education to implement any and all measures that the Director may deem necessary and appropriate to best ensure a minimum of one-metre 7 spacing for students, including but not limited to measures such as reorganizing classes, providing portable classrooms, using common areas as classroom space, redeploying staff, hiring additional school staff, and such other measures as the Director may deem appropriate. "_


----------



## scrappinginontario

We received a lot of information from the school this morning.  
- no lockers or hooks, all items must stay with child
- indoor shoes not required.  Children will stay in shoes they arrive at school wearing.  will be reviewed when boot weather arrives.
- each class is to gather in a specific location.  All school doors will be used for entrance and exit, not just a select few.  These assigned locations are also used for recess.  Children from different classes should not mingle at lunch or recess
- children may remove masks (if they choose to) during outdoor learning and recess
- Kiss n Ride will be available at our school but is discouraged.  No teachers will be at Kiss n Ride and parents cannot exit their vehicles
- no dropping off of lunches, etc.  Parents not allowed in school building.  Call ahead if child needs to be picked up and arrangements will be made
- parents asked to drop off children as close to bell time as possible, not early
- Jr/Int students discouraged from leaving school property at lunch to frequent ff locations
- Covid health check should be done by parents at home each morning.  It doesn't sound like anything about this is being done at the school

Not the 'warm, fuzzy' excitement it used to be returning to school but  I greatly appreciate the care our school and board are taking to ensure our children are as safe as possible during these uncertain times.


----------



## bankr63

tgropp said:


> If an outbreak happens and students are to stay at home, what would stop the teachers from reporting to school each day during their regular working hours and work from there? They could do their planning lessons and video calls from the school where all their resources are. There would be plenty of space to social distance from the other school personnel in the school during working hours. If there are 30 students in a classroom, Every student could get approximately 45 Minutes of video time a week


Public Health.
In March, schools were closed and teachers were not allowed to enter the buildings.  Since DW did not bring her Chromebook home for the break (we left for vacation directly from school on Friday) there was a bit of scrambling to get her setup here.  It was several weeks before teachers were allowed back to the classrooms, one at a time, for maybe an hour each to collect their resources.  If PH decides that schools are fully closed then teachers will again be restricted from entering, but it might be different.  
There really aren't much in the way of resources in the classroom that will help with online learning.  Kind of hard to hand out math manipulatives over the internet.  The actual materials are all electronic now so accessible, but the problem was they were not in a format that lent itself to online.  A word document with math problems that a teacher would normally print out needed transformation to a fillable form that could be shared with everyone in the class.  There was a ton of prep work.  Her internet connection from home is MUCH better (faster and reliable) than the connections provided through the board's network.
For this year, DW will bring her work resources home EVERY night, just in case there is declared outbreak at her school before next morning.  If she can work from school, she will, but it would actually be safer for her to stay at home.  Why drive across the city and interact with several people so you can sit in an empty classroom when you can stay safe at home and lower the transmission risk?  The employment contract does stipulate that teachers should be on board property when working though, so the board will probably insist on teachers being at school unless PH says otherwise.


----------



## FigmentSpark

mshanson3121 said:


> Do they mean an actual physical uniform (do they have to wear one at school?) or just conform to dress codes? To be honest, I can kind of understand this one - if they're doing virtual classrooms where they can see each other, it makes sense that they would maintain the same dress code as in class.


My understanding is the uniform is required.  Certainly, making sure you're dressed and ready for school is one thing, but to make sure you have your uniform on (at least the top) seems a bit hard to police.


----------



## tgropp

bankr63 said:


> Public Health.
> In March, schools were closed and teachers were not allowed to enter the buildings.  Since DW did not bring her Chromebook home for the break (we left for vacation directly from school on Friday) there was a bit of scrambling to get her setup here.  It was several weeks before teachers were allowed back to the classrooms, one at a time, for maybe an hour each to collect their resources.  If PH decides that schools are fully closed then teachers will again be restricted from entering, but it might be different.
> There really aren't much in the way of resources in the classroom that will help with online learning.  Kind of hard to hand out math manipulatives over the internet.  The actual materials are all electronic now so accessible, but the problem was they were not in a format that lent itself to online.  A word document with math problems that a teacher would normally print out needed transformation to a fillable form that could be shared with everyone in the class.  There was a ton of prep work.  Her internet connection from home is MUCH better (faster and reliable) than the connections provided through the board's network.
> For this year, DW will bring her work resources home EVERY night, just in case there is declared outbreak at her school before next morning.  If she can work from school, she will, but it would actually be safer for her to stay at home.  Why drive across the city and interact with several people so you can sit in an empty classroom when you can stay safe at home and lower the transmission risk?  The employment contract does stipulate that teachers should be on board property when working though, so the board will probably insist on teachers being at school unless PH says otherwise.


We have many custodians with extra hired to do the cleaning to make it safe. Hospitals, retirement homes, grocery stores and other essential places of employment answered the bell....no questions asked. The teachers have their resources at their school. There is no reason on why they cannot go To their school when everyone else in higher risk areas Manage to do that. I would hope that 90% of the teachers will be glad to do this.


----------



## Madame

tgropp said:


> We have many custodians with extra hired to do the cleaning to make it safe. Hospitals, retirement homes, grocery stores and other essential places of employment answered the bell....no questions asked. The teachers have their resources at their school. There is no reason on why they cannot go To their school when everyone else in higher risk areas Manage to do that. I would hope that 90% of the teachers will be glad to do this.


But what in the world is the POINT???  If a teacher is online, who cares where they work from?  My husband is in my basement until Jan working.  He can go in every other week for a set time if he wants.  If a job can be done at home, why wouldn’t it be?   Maybe I am missing something.


----------



## Debbie

tgropp said:


> . . . We have many custodians with extra hired to do the cleaning to make it safe. . .


I think that I will wait to see exactly how many extra custodians are actually available for cleaning-especially in places that aren't in the GTA. My daughter's custodian has told the staff to send all requests to the night custodian. That's not going to work for cleaning tables/desks after lunch.


----------



## tgropp

Madame said:


> But what in the world is the POINT???  If a teacher is online, who cares where they work from?  My husband is in my basement until Jan working.  He can go in every other week for a set time if he wants.  If a job can be done at home, why wouldn’t it be?   Maybe I am missing something.


Teachers resources are in the school, not in their homes. That is my point. If no one is in the schools I am sure that there will be cutbacks and layoffs. I am sure that the union would not want that. Just why would a teacher not want to go where they work when it is safe. There must be some reason. As A Taxpayer it is a very reasonable question. It is not asking for much.


----------



## Madame

tgropp said:


> Teachers resources are in the school, not in their homes. That is my point. If no one is in the schools I am sure that there will be cutbacks and layoffs. I am sure that the union would not want that. Just why would a teacher not want to go where they work when it is safe. There must be some reason. As A Taxpayer it is a very reasonable question. It is not asking for much.


For online teaching?!?  No.  No they’re not at the school.


----------



## Disneylover99

tgropp said:


> Teachers resources are in the school, not in their homes. That is my point. If no one is in the schools I am sure that there will be cutbacks and layoffs. I am sure that the union would not want that. Just why would a teacher not want to go where they work when it is safe. There must be some reason. As A Taxpayer it is a very reasonable question. It is not asking for much.


Nobody knows who will be teaching remotely or in class at this point at my school, but I can tell you that everyone on staff would be happy if they could teach online at school where all their resources are. But as far as I know, we’re being told that it’s not allowed.


----------



## tgropp

Disneylover99 said:


> Nobody knows who will be teaching remotely or in class at this point at my school, but I can tell you that everyone on staff would be happy if they could teach online at school where all their resources are. But as far as I know, we’re being told that it’s not allowed.


Thank You for clarifying that.


----------



## Madame

Disneylover99 said:


> Nobody knows who will be teaching remotely or in class at this point at my school, but I can tell you that everyone on staff would be happy if they could teach online at school where all their resources are. But as far as I know, we’re being told that it’s not allowed.


Staff here cannot teach from home.  They  teach online onsite, maybe not their home school, but onsite.  This was dictated by the MoE..........


----------



## Disneylover99

Madame said:


> Staff here cannot teach from home.  They  teach online onsite, maybe not their home school, but onsite.  This was dictated by the MoE..........


The rumour is we will be doing remote teaching onsite somewhere, but nobody seems to know where that is. Lol. 

Some teachers will teach from home because they have health exemptions.


----------



## Madame

Disneylover99 said:


> The rumour is we will be doing remote teaching onsite somewhere, but nobody seems to know where that is. Lol.
> 
> Some teachers will teach from home because they have health exemptions.


Yes, but online teachers are onsite.  I just don’t understand the resources argument.  There are online whiteboards, flipcharts, etc.  Online resources are, well, online.   Most teachers use their personal (non tax deductible) tech to deliver online curriculum.  The argument makes zero sense.


----------



## Disneylover99

Madame said:


> Yes, but online teachers are onsite.  I just don’t understand the resources argument.  There are online whiteboards, flipcharts, etc.  Online resources are, well, online.   Most teachers use their personal (non tax deductible) tech to deliver online curriculum.  The argument makes zero sense.


For many of us, it’s not an argument. It’s just a preference.


----------



## Madame

Disneylover99 said:


> For many of us, it’s not an argument. It’s just a preference.


I don’t follow, but forcing online teachers to go onsite while encouraging employers to have their employees wfh whenever possible is asinine and speaks to a need to dominate & control teachers.  My doctor will call me for an appt next Tues & the secretary told me it will be a private number....  cause he’s working from home.....


----------



## Disneylover99

Madame said:


> I don’t follow, but forcing online teachers to go onsite while encouraging employers to have their employees wfh whenever possible is asinine and speaks to a need to dominate & control teachers.  My doctor will call me for an appt next Tues & the secretary told me it will be a private number....  cause he’s working from home.....


Nobody wants to be told what to do. That’s not what I’m saying at all. The teachers don’t want to be forced to go to some random onsite place. They just want to be able to access the materials at their own school and work from their own  classroom if they wish.


----------



## tgropp

Madame said:


> I don’t follow, but forcing online teachers to go onsite while encouraging employers to have their employees wfh whenever possible is asinine and speaks to a need to dominate & control teachers.  My doctor will call me for an appt next Tues & the secretary told me it will be a private number....  cause he’s working from home.....


In all honesty, this type of thinking is why some people are upset with teachers. Teachers have fared out very well in their negotiations with the previous governments  but some always think that they are picked on.


----------



## Madame

tgropp said:


> In all honesty, this type of thinking is why some people are upset with teachers. Teachers have fared out very well in their negotiations with the previous governments  but some always think that they are picked on.


You angry at my doc for working from home?  You want an accounting from him as a taxpayer?  No?  What about the cops that have little education and make more than a teacher who has spent 6 yrs of his/her life & $$$$ to get educated?  No?   We should privatize education.  At least you can sue a private employer for unsafe working conditions.


----------



## Madame

Disneylover99 said:


> Nobody wants to be told what to do. That’s not what I’m saying at all. The teachers don’t want to be forced to go to some random onsite place. They just want to be able to access the materials at their own school and work from their own  classroom if they wish.


I get that, but he wants his tax dollars worth & the only way he thinks he can get it is to pointlessly put people in harms way.


----------



## tgropp

Madame said:


> I get that, but he wants his tax dollars worth & the only way he thinks he can get it is to pointlessly put people in harms way.


You will not “pointlessly” be put in harms way. There are many people in the workforce that are in more danger than you will be and yes they are taxpayers also.  And be careful what you wish for if education is privatized. My biggest concern for a teacher is the lack of respect that children show their teachers . I sympathize with them and that causes all kinds of ill feelings about their job. If that was cleaned up, maybe teachers would be able to be what teachers used to be..... it was like a calling. Whatever happens I wish you the best of luck and a safe and healthy environment


----------



## Disneylover99

Madame said:


> I get that, but he wants his tax dollars worth & the only way he thinks he can get it is to pointlessly put people in harms way.


Honestly? I’d just be happy with a bit of flexibility at this point. 

And if it’s not too much to ask, I’m hoping to find out my teaching assignment before the school year begins. Lol. I’m trying to be positive, but at this point my expectations are low. I’m really worried about the future of education for students through this.


----------



## Madame

tgropp said:


> You will not “pointlessly” be put in harms way. There are many people in the workforce that are in more danger than you will be and yes they are taxpayers also.  And be careful what you wish for if education is privatized. My biggest concern for a teacher is the lack of respect that children show their teachers . I sympathize with them and that causes all kinds of ill feelings about their job. If that was cleaned up, maybe teachers would be able to be what teachers used to be..... it was like a calling. Whatever happens I wish you the best of luck and a safe and healthy environment


But it IS.  You know who would not agree with you?  Nurses.  Nurses would tell you that adding 5/10/20 more people unnecessarily to a building with little ventilation during a pandemic is NOT smart.  They’d tell you this because THEY will be the ones caring for the teachers/parents/grandparents who get infected because there will be too many people in school buildings this fall.  They get to intubate and treat bed sores and risk their lives.  So yes, I think it is ridiculously selfish and petty to politicize whether an educator working online is onsite or at home.  Have a good night.


----------



## Madame

Disneylover99 said:


> Honestly? I’d just be happy with a bit of flexibility at this point.
> 
> And if it’s not too much to ask, I’m hoping to find out my teaching assignment before the school year begins. Lol. I’m trying to be positive, but at this point my expectations are low. I’m really worried about the future of education for students through this.


I hear you.  I have colleagues in schools with no soap & no sanitizer - it’s on back order.  Nothing is normal now, maybe never again.  Your main objective is safety, safety for you and for your students.  If you end up online message me, I have some awesome supportive FB groups I can add you to if you are into that kind of thing


----------



## Silvermist999

Saw this posted on social media by a GTA school board. Definitely a picture for the history books.


----------



## AngelDisney

For my school, teachers are provided with two masks a day and a face shield. Hand sanitizers at 3 entrances. We are not provided individually with hand sanitizer, soap in washroom or disinfectant wipes as publicized. No changes in air ventilation or quality. My room is a few degree hotter than outside temperature as usual. Yet I am happy to be back. It’s great to be around with colleagues again without texting or emailing. Staffing is a mess now with teacher reallocation due to students opting out to virtual school. We are still working on timetables and I seriously do not think we are ready for students to start school on September 15.

About virtual school, many teachers “volunteered” to virtual school placement without training. I have elearning training but the elearning platform gets updated regularly. I am not familiar with many new features being offered now. Having teachers onsite teaching virtually makes it easier to provide tech support in person. When I was having trouble using Brightspace D2L in June, I had to wait for a day or two to get responses from IT. That was not helpful at all. Virtual school has it’s own platform. It’s not just using Google Classroom or Google Meet. This may be the reason why teachers at virtual school without medical accommodations have to go onsite to teach. And we have no clue where these sites would be  yet.


----------



## Madame

AngelDisney said:


> For my school, teachers are provided with two masks a day and a face shield. Hand sanitizers at 3 entrances. We are not provided individually with hand sanitizer, soap in washroom or disinfectant wipes as publicized. No changes in air ventilation or quality. My room is a few degree hotter than outside temperature as usual. Yet I am happy to be back. It’s great to be around with colleagues again without texting or emailing. Staffing is a mess now with teacher reallocation due to students opting out to virtual school. We are still working on timetables and I seriously do not think we are ready for students to start school on September 15.
> 
> About virtual school, many teachers “volunteered” to virtual school placement without training. I have elearning training but the elearning platform gets updated regularly. I am not familiar with many new features being offered now. Having teachers onsite teaching virtually makes it easier to provide tech support in person. When I was having trouble using Brightspace D2L in June, I had to wait for a day or two to get responses from IT. That was not helpful at all. Virtual school has it’s own platform. It’s not just using Google Classroom or Google Meet. This may be the reason why teachers at virtual school without medical accommodations have to go onsite to teach. And we have no clue where these sites would be  yet.


I guess each board is different as our tech support is shared between many schools so the support you get will be virtual support anyway.  You have dedicated tech help in each school?  Teachers will be isolated in their own area to teach - either a classroom or office so again, help will be virtual.


----------



## scrappinginontario

I wonder if all boards are doing virtual teaching from a central location?  This is new news to me.  We were told in a Trustees meeting that was open to all to watch that our virtual teachers would most likely be teaching from their homes so as parents, not to anticipate seeing them in a classroom setting should we choose virtual learning for our children.

I know one friend who applied to teach virtually and was approved also chose to keep her children home to learn virtually.  Her husband is a custodian in a school so works out of the home each day.  It will be quite a surprise to them if she suddenly has to go to a specific location to do her virtual teaching as it wouldn't leave anyone at home with their children.  Her one child has some struggles and would find wearing a mask all day a big challenge which is what led the children and mom to move to virtual in the first place.


----------



## bababear_50

I have been told with my Board (GTA) that remote locations if needed might be accommodated should there be space,,,,which we all know in most schools that Tech space is not available.
My school only has electrical outlets on one side of the classroom.
 Staff  looking for a remote work location could be offered it at their home or non home school.

Medical accommodations to work from home are being offered for some.

95% of our Tech support is virtual,,unless new systems or upgrades are being made.

Staff working from home will need to provide care for their own kids as they are expected to be online teaching. Our board is pushing a lot of synchronous learning this year.

This explains the two types of learning people are throwing around.
https://thebestschools.org/magazine/synchronous-vs-asynchronous-education/
While staff have been working 24/7 we still have a done of work to do.


Hugs
Mel


----------



## wdwmom3

scrappinginontario said:


> I wonder if all boards are doing virtual teaching from a central location?  This is new news to me.  We were told in a Trustees meeting that was open to all to watch that our virtual teachers would most likely be teaching from their homes so as parents, not to anticipate seeing them in a classroom setting should we choose virtual learning for our children.
> 
> I know one friend who applied to teach virtually and was approved also chose to keep her children home to learn virtually.  Her husband is a custodian in a school so works out of the home each day.  It will be quite a surprise to them if she suddenly has to go to a specific location to do her virtual teaching as it wouldn't leave anyone at home with their children.  Her one child has some struggles and would find wearing a mask all day a big challenge which is what led the children and mom to move to virtual in the first place.



So your friend is expecting to supervisor her kids and help them with their online learning while teaching remotely? That’s not right.  She can’t just drop what she’s teaching to go deal with her own kids.  That’s not fair to her students.


----------



## bababear_50

Someone mentioned before and after school care,,,
Yes some schools are hoping to be able to accommodate it however keep in mind ,,,
the areas used are usually school/ childcare shared and overlap time will be needed to clean and disinfect those areas. Classes or childcare may need to be held or redirected outside for a short period of time .

All staff at my school are in 
:Covid 19 training

:WHMIS training

:New Math curriculum training

:Anaphylaxis training / Epipen training

:CPI (Crisis Prevention Intervention) training

:Anti black racism training

Along with hauling and moving their stuff around the school as most of the classes are folding into split classes
1/2 2/3 3/4 4/5 etc.

Some staff know what they are doing next week ,,however some don't.
We are being asked to remain flexible as school numbers are going up and down,,
school PPE supplies are *on their way* we have been told. 
Parents and caregivers are also now being asked to be flexible in a ever changing 
Pandemic.
But yeah it is a Pandemic and I guess we need to focus on that instead of other petty things,,,at least for me I am going to try.

Hugs
Mel


----------



## Disneylover99

AngelDisney said:


> About virtual school, many teachers “volunteered” to virtual school placement without training. I have elearning training but the elearning platform gets updated regularly. I am not familiar with many new features being offered now. Having teachers onsite teaching virtually makes it easier to provide tech support in person. When I was having trouble using Brightspace D2L in June, I had to wait for a day or two to get responses from IT. That was not helpful at all. Virtual school has it’s own platform. It’s not just using Google Classroom or Google Meet. This may be the reason why teachers at virtual school without medical accommodations have to go onsite to teach. And we have no clue where these sites would be  yet.



This Is my stress for the day. The survey that’s due at midnight. I have to decide between going virtual or teaching a class at school. I really wish we knew where the site locations are. And I’ve been researching BrightSpace like crazy, but it’s a lot to figure out, especially without having a teacher assignment. Many teachers won’t get their assignments until a day or two before the students start.


----------



## bankr63

Madame said:


> For online teaching?!?  No.  No they’re not at the school.


Actually in Ottawa (OCDSB), and I believe across Ontario, they ARE at school or other board facilities.  Teachers are required by their contract to be on board property.  Online teaching will be from schools unless the schools are physically closed by Public Health.  They were at home after March last year because the schools were closed by government order, like so many other places of business and public facilities, but that was not a board decision.
My point above was that teachers don't necessarily NEED to be at school.  There are no resources necessary for online learning in my wife's classroom.  All of her teaching manipulatives and books and other resources have had to be removed from her classroom anyway.  Online education requires a different kind of resource, and they are all electronic.  These teaching resources can be accessed virtually from anywhere.  She has a large library of electronic resources build up over the years (at her own expense, of course, although the federal government does allow teachers a tax deduction for the expense, so she doesn't pay income tax on all the money she spends on classroom resources - sorry, that's a bit OT), that she relied on even more heavily from March 2020 as they were better suited to the online delivery style.  Those resources are on our server here at home, and on a portable drive that travels to and from school every day with her.


----------



## mshanson3121

tgropp said:


> We have many custodians with extra hired to do the cleaning to make it safe. Hospitals, retirement homes, grocery stores and other essential places of employment answered the bell....no questions asked. The teachers have their resources at their school. There is no reason on why they cannot go To their school when everyone else in higher risk areas Manage to do that. I would hope that 90% of the teachers will be glad to do this.



1. Unless the custodians can suck the virus from the breathe of those who are also in the building, then it will never be without some amount of risk.
2. Just because custodians are hired, doesn't mean they actually do their job. Example: there is a dust bunny under my husband's desk that has not been cleaned for 2 years now, despite adequate custodial staffing. At this point DH is leaving it there just to see how long they will go before cleaning the floors. They also haven't cleaned the bookshelves in several years. DH does it himself.



tgropp said:


> Teachers resources are in the school, not in their homes. That is my point. *If no one is in the schools I am sure that there will be cutbacks and layoffs. *I am sure that the union would not want that. Just why would a teacher not want to go where they work when it is safe*.* There must be some reason. As A Taxpayer it is a very reasonable question. It is not asking for much.



You clearly have no clue on how any of this works. Nope, they don't layoff teachers who are working from home, just because the school is empty during a pandemic. Why? Because they're still doing their job. Also, because legally, they can't. 



Madame said:


> Yes, but online teachers are onsite.  I just don’t understand the resources argument.  There are online whiteboards, flipcharts, etc.  Online resources are, well, online.   Most teachers use their personal (non tax deductible) tech to deliver online curriculum.  The argument makes zero sense.



You're arguing with someone who has no clue about teaching or the education profession. 




tgropp said:


> In all honesty, this type of thinking is why some people are upset with teachers. *Teachers have fared out very well in their negotiations with the previous governments  but some always think that they are picked on.*



Spoken by someone who quite frankly doesn't have two sweet clues what they're talking about or what teachers go through or what their job entails.


----------



## mshanson3121

DH returned to work (provincial community college) Monday. Their delivery mode is going to be fully online as of October.  Once they go fully online they are allowed to work from wherever they want, home or school, management doesn't care as long as the job gets done.  They actually prefer people work from home as much as possible as it reduces risk for the entire college staff and whatever students will be there (some classes are doing a rotation of one day a week in class). DH plans to split his time between home and college. There will be times he needs his Smart Board so he'll go into the school for those classes. Otherwise, he will work from home, because why wouldn't it when he has everything he needs here for those classes?


----------



## ottawamom

This thread is getting a "little" heated. Please people, there are ways to express ones opinion without attacking others. Use your language skills and Everyone dial it back a bit!


----------



## Madame

bankr63 said:


> Actually in Ottawa (OCDSB), and I believe across Ontario, they ARE at school or other board facilities.  Teachers are required by their contract to be on board property.  Online teaching will be from schools unless the schools are physically closed by Public Health.  They were at home after March last year because the schools were closed by government order, like so many other places of business and public facilities, but that was not a board decision.
> My point above was that teachers don't necessarily NEED to be at school.  There are no resources necessary for online learning in my wife's classroom.  All of her teaching manipulatives and books and other resources have had to be removed from her classroom anyway.  Online education requires a different kind of resource, and they are all electronic.  These teaching resources can be accessed virtually from anywhere.  She has a large library of electronic resources build up over the years (at her own expense, of course, although the federal government does allow teachers a tax deduction for the expense, so she doesn't pay income tax on all the money she spends on classroom resources - sorry, that's a bit OT), that she relied on even more heavily from March 2020 as they were better suited to the online delivery style.  Those resources are on our server here at home, and on a portable drive that travels to and from school every day with her.


Yes I was referencing the resources being at school, not the teachers.


----------



## bankr63

So DW finally got her teaching assignment yesterday, and will be back in her usual classroom with her usual homeroom class assignment once the desks that were recently removed have been restored.  It was a big win and a great relief to find out.  Now, keep in mind that students were originally supposed to be starting yesterday.  Now the focus is on coming up with teaching plans for all of the subjects that she has not previously taught as her school had specialists for several subjects.
Science will be a challenge as her school has only one class set of science textbooks that were previously shared by all classes.  So no textbooks this year.
Also, the Fire Marshall apparently has told the school that they are not allowed to use any of the fire exit doors as entrances to the school as the hand sanitizing stations are a hazard in the entryways, so the school will only be allowed to use the 2 main entrances to bring students into the school.  They had planned to assign different cohort groupings to different doors.  Seems pretty counter-intuitive, but I guess if an evacuation were required then you would want those doors completely clear.  Not sure it is the greater need here though.


----------



## bankr63

tgropp said:


> In all honesty, this type of thinking is why some people are upset with teachers. Teachers have fared out very well in their negotiations with the previous governments  but some always think that they are picked on.


I would respectfully disagree with this.  DW is a teacher, which required an undergrad degree and then her teacher degree post-grad.  She has never been on the sunshine list.  In Ottawa, OC Transpo bus drivers often make the sunshine list. I cannot think of any other career where a post-graduate degree gets such a lousy salary. I have a college diploma and have been on the sunshine list for years, and I do NOT feel that I am overpaid for my work, as all of my fellow employees at my middle-management level are also on the list.  I might add that I used to make a fair bit more in the private sector, but suffer the lousy wages of public sector because the work is very fulfilling.  I work in health and enjoy trying to make a difference in people's lives, something that is the calling that most teachers also answer to.
Teachers bargain hard every round, but it is usually for concessions that benefit students as much or more than themselves.  Teachers fight for better education, not for increased wages.  That is why teaching salaries have not come anywhere near to keeping up with inflation.  Governments also try each round to strip away concessions bargained into previous agreements, blind to the fact that it was a negotiated settlement and that teachers' unions already made concessions for those that were won and are now being stripped away.  It is really more a story that the government tries constantly to whittle away while the teachers are just trying to maintain.  Eventually I would expect teaching to be a profession like it is in parts of the United States where many teachers have to take extra jobs just to make ends meet.

ETA: read a bit more here for an excellent teacher's perspective: http://itsdilovely.com/2020/09/01/heres-why-ontario-teachers-unions-are-still-fighting-doug-ford/


----------



## Iralyn

There is so much variation from board to board and even school to school thet it is a bit crazy.  For my board I *think* remote learning teachers can opt for in school or work from home (that was the initial plan). For instance one of my colleagues has spotty internet so she opted for in school and another has a health issue so she has been given the okay to teach remotely ftom home.


----------



## Madame

ottawamom said:


> This thread is getting a "little" heated. Please people, there are ways to express ones opinion without attacking others. Use your language skills and Everyone dial it back a bit!


Sorry about that.  It’s a very stressful time for everyone & I see things like below daily & I just want to rage at the craziness.  Little things like who works where just seem so ridiculous.  Like really?  This is what we’re on about??  I will try to have a wait period before I post (I am part Gaelic and a natural redhead so no promises  but I will try my best)


----------



## hdrolfe

We got a bit more information from my son's school, there will be quite a few classes, I don't have the number of students but I know they are separating the immersion from non for grade 4/5/6. It looks like a few split classes based on the way the yard is being divided for the kids to play. He was given his teachers names, same French teacher from last year (but it looks like only 1 instead of 2 as last year) plus one English teacher (who will also be math) and who is new to the school. That is kind of good for him too as he has had a rough time in the past, hopefully a bit of a clean slate (he did get along with his French teacher last year that he will have for grade 6). Now to wait... a few more days and he'll be heading off! They asked parents not to come like normal on the first day. We have been having a fun final week before I feel like we will need to be more isolated again, to keep contacts low.


----------



## ottawamom

@Madame , I just don't want someone to get so upset that this thread gets shut down. That wouldn't do anyone any good.


----------



## Debbie

hdrolfe said:


> We got a bit more information from my son's school, there will be quite a few classes, I don't have the number of students but I know they are separating the immersion from non for grade 4/5/6. It looks like a few split classes based on the way the yard is being divided for the kids to play. He was given his teachers names, same French teacher from last year (but it looks like only 1 instead of 2 as last year) plus one English teacher (who will also be math) and who is new to the school. That is kind of good for him too as he has had a rough time in the past, hopefully a bit of a clean slate (he did get along with his French teacher last year that he will have for grade 6). Now to wait... a few more days and he'll be heading off! They asked parents not to come like normal on the first day. We have been having a fun final week before I feel like we will need to be more isolated again, to keep contacts low.


I think that with this positive attitude rubbing off on your kidlet, and the new teacher, things will be better than last. Fingers crossed for both of you.


----------



## Minniemoo15

I just finished my first week back as a Kindergarten teacher in NB. It was just preparing and PD this week and the kids start coming Tuesday (staggered entry). I feel fantastic about our province’s response and our own school plan. It’s a wonderful balance between keeping things as normal for our kids as possible while still being incredibly safe. Of course nothing is without risk, but hours and hours and hours have gone into these plans and it shows. We had a school supply drive-through drop off earlier this week and the sheer joy of the kids who were cheering, waving, smiling in the backseats made me quite emotional. I feel so lucky to be a NB teacher (and parent) right now and that we are able to give our kids a somewhat sense of normalcy.

Now to enjoy this beautiful long weekend before the real excitement (and exhaustion!) hits next week!


----------



## scrappinginontario

wdwmom3 said:


> So your friend is expecting to supervisor her kids and help them with their online learning while teaching remotely? That’s not right.  She can’t just drop what she’s teaching to go deal with her own kids.  That’s not fair to her students.


This is not at all what I said so please don’t put words into my mouth.

My daughter is 11yo and I have successfully worked from home for almost 6 months while she completed school work for 4 of those months and then did a little school plus other things the past 2 months.

My friend who is a teacher is in the same situation.  Her children are also 11 and will be in Grade 6.  At this age our children are fully capable of going online, participating in class and completing their schoolwork almost 100% independently.  What they cannot do is be asked to be home alone 40+ hours a week while parents leave the home for work.  Teaching virtually allows my friend the opportunity to successfully complete her job as a teacher while at the same time being an adult in the home so that her children are not alone.

Many parents have successfully navigated this over the past 6 months and many will continue to.  I applaud all parents who are learning to successfully function well as an employee while at the same time caring for the needs of their family during these unprecedented times!!


----------



## quandrea

scrappinginontario said:


> This is not at all what I said so please don’t put words into my mouth.
> 
> My daughter is 11yo and I have successfully worked from home for almost 6 months while she completed school work for 4 of those months and then did a little school plus other things the past 2 months.
> 
> My friend who is a teacher is in the same situation.  Her children are also 11 and will be in Grade 6.  At this age our children are fully capable of going online, participating in class and completing their schoolwork almost 100% independently.  What they cannot do is be asked to be home alone 40+ hours a week while parents leave the home for work.  Teaching virtually allows my friend the opportunity to successfully complete her job as a teacher while at the same time being an adult in the home so that her children are not alone.
> 
> Many parents have successfully navigated this over the past 6 months and many will continue to.  I applaud all parents who are learning to successfully function well as an employee while at the same time caring for the needs of their family during these unprecedented times!!


Agree with you wholeheartedly. I too have eleven year olds. While they can’t be home alone yet, they are fully capable of learning on their own through the day (we homeschool) and they can take care of their own needs. They simply need an adult home in case of an emergency.

What has struck me through this whole mess is how much we underestimate our children. All I hear is, “He/She can’t work independently, learn online, set his/her own goals/agenda.”  The fact is, no one has tried yet. Remote learning could be an excellent learning opportunity for so many kids. A chance to be self directed, learn a new way of doing things, mature.  Through all this, I’ve heard nothing but what can’t be done, rather than turning the situation on its head and approaching things with a can do attitude.

The government’s approach has been that synchronous learning is the be all and end all in online learning. I actually think the synchronous learning piece is what threatens to make this remote experience fail. The beauty of online learning is its ability to afford the learner freedom. Freedom to work any time and any where. Freedom to set the pace. Freedom to ask the questions he or she has. Freedom to not have to wait while others catch up. Synchronous learning kills all that.

I wish everyone the best of luck as they return to school. I’ve been following this all closely even though my kids are not in the system. I’m an educator and I find it all fascinating, if disappointing. We shall see what the coming weeks hold.


----------



## hdrolfe

@quandrea this is why my son wouldn't do the online version, he wants to be able to go at his own pace. He is 10 and has adhd so has a hard time sitting and focusing on things unless it is something that he really enjoys. He asked to go back to school so he will be but I am prepared to pull him out. 

Yes, I work from home and have since March, he didnt do any of the learning in March. If school doesn't go well I will remove him and not do the online version. He has learned a lot over the past 6 months, but not the stuff he is "supposed to". I would rather he learn the things that interest him, they often come with math and science and vocabulary associated. I have found ways to help him with his interests, including library books and the Aviation Museum. While still working. If he was younger, this would have been a lot harder to do. 

This year is going to be interesting as it plays out.


----------



## tgropp

mshanson3121 said:


> 1. Unless the custodians can suck the virus from the breathe of those who are also in the building, then it will never be without some amount of risk.
> 2. Just because custodians are hired, doesn't mean they actually do their job. Example: there is a dust bunny under my husband's desk that has not been cleaned for 2 years now, despite adequate custodial staffing. At this point DH is leaving it there just to see how long they will go before cleaning the floors. They also haven't cleaned the bookshelves in several years. DH does it himself.
> 
> 
> 
> You clearly have no clue on how any of this works. Nope, they don't layoff teachers who are working from home, just because the school is empty during a pandemic. Why? Because they're still doing their job. Also, because legally, they can't.
> 
> 
> You're arguing with someone who has no clue about teaching or the education profession.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoken by someone who quite frankly doesn't have two sweet clues what they're talking about or what teachers go through or what their job entails.


I have edited this after Ottawamoms plea. I always  thought For someone to Personally insult another persons character speaks volumes of that person.


----------



## samsteele

Hoping to side step some of the contention but on Friday was driving by my local high school at 11am after going to post office when school let out for the day. First day of school so some chats and get together expected but what I saw was nuts. While stopped at the lights, watched groups of 15 plus students in waves easily at least 100 students total come out of the front doors. They threw their paper masks on the ground then wrapped arms around one another and passed shared smokes back and forth. They walked touching and hugging and kissing in groups of 15 plus across front lawns of school and through the intersection. Appalling. Almost as if the principal had told them to social distance when they left and 90% did the exact opposite in defiance. I try to remember being 13 to 16 yrs old. I just can't connect with this kind of stupid. When I walked home from high school, I either walked by myself or with my best friend. Think Stranger Things in tiny small village Ontario. We had a 20 min walk to our homes and knew we had 2 hrs of homework plus yard work and household chores to do before sleep. We never left in mass exodus of 25 plus huggy buddies touching and smoking together. And if my government and parents had told me that we had to keep our distance or would risk our grandparents and parents lives, I would have been shocked into compliance and prob would have had to change my undies with fright. I just don't understand this kind of stupid defiance. Really hoping my small city in Eastern Ontario is the exception. We've had really good low numbers for the virus since the spring. Now expecting a second wave by October if what I watched is happening across the city. Look, every generation shocks the ones that came before. But this is just awful. How selfish and stupid can some kids be?


----------



## mshanson3121

tgropp said:


> I have edited this after Ottawamoms plea. I always  thought For someone to Personally insult another persons character speaks volumes of that person.



Gotta love the hypocrisy of this post 

Though for the record, I didn't say a word about your character. Was just commenting on your lack of knowledge regarding the topic you were speaking of, which was leading you to insult people.


----------



## mshanson3121

So, of the 46 schools already reporting Covid cases in Quebec after the first week, have they said how many students have had to isolate as a result? I didn't see anything in the CBC article, but saw they said "In cases where there are concerns of contact between students or staff, everyone in a given class might be told to go into self-isolation and monitor for symptoms in order to prevent further spread of the virus."


----------



## Madame

mshanson3121 said:


> So, of the 46 schools already reporting Covid cases in Quebec after the first week, have they said how many students have had to isolate as a result? I didn't see anything in the CBC article, but saw they said "In cases where there are concerns of contact between students or staff, everyone in a given class might be told to go into self-isolation and monitor for symptoms in order to prevent further spread of the virus."


They are refusing to give numbers....   Since they wouldn’t give the list of schools even, an acct on Twitter started a running total based on reports from parents, of infected schools and there are many more.  I will try to link here.


----------



## wdwmom3

A bit of info I would like to point out to everyone.  Before school starts and people start freaking out about “outbreaks”.  Outbreaks is not even an accurate term.  It’s considered an outbreak as soon as a single person tests positive.  So you could have one person (adult or child) who has caught covid somewhere else, but an outbreak will be reported at the school/daycare etc even if there isn’t a other single person who got infected from them.  So you will hear about “outbreaks” even when all the protocols are working.  

A friend of mine recently sent me an article freaking out about kids going back to school because there was an “outbreak” at a day camp.  They freaked saying “see kids can’t go back it’s too dangerous, look there was an outbreak at a camp”.  There was a single case of one child that tested positive .  The child caught it from someone else. Not at the camp.  And apparently the outbreak is still listed as having only a single case.  That’s not an outbreak.


----------



## mshanson3121

wdwmom3 said:


> A bit of info I would like to point out to everyone.  Before school starts and people start freaking out about “outbreaks”.  Outbreaks is not even an accurate term.  It’s considered an outbreak as soon as a single person tests positive.  So you could have one person (adult or child) who has caught covid somewhere else, but an outbreak will be reported at the school/daycare etc even if there isn’t a other single person who got infected from them.  So you will hear about “outbreaks” even when all the protocols are working.
> 
> A friend of mine recently sent me an article freaking out about kids going back to school because there was an “outbreak” at a day camp.  They freaked saying “see kids can’t go back it’s too dangerous, look there was an outbreak at a camp”.  There was a single case of one child that tested positive .  The child caught it from someone else. Not at the camp.  And apparently the outbreak is still listed as having only a single case.  That’s not an outbreak.



And....not a single person used the word outbreak. Not here or in the news.


----------



## Madame

Madame said:


> They are refusing to give numbers....   Since they wouldn’t give the list of schools even, an acct on Twitter started a running total based on reports from parents, of infected schools and there are many more.  I will try to link here.


This is the article.  Still looking for the Twitter acct as I didn’t follow it. 

https://montrealgazette.com/news/lo...track-number-of-covid-cases-in-quebec-schools


----------



## wdwmom3

mshanson3121 said:


> And....not a single person used the word outbreak. Not here, or in the news.



They are using outbreak in the news.  Public health reports them as an outbreak.  They have actually defined an outbreak as “one or more cases”.


----------



## mshanson3121

Madame said:


> This is the article.  Still looking for the Twitter acct as I didn’t follow it.
> 
> https://montrealgazette.com/news/lo...track-number-of-covid-cases-in-quebec-schools



Of all the stuff going on with school this year, I think the mandatory isolations are going to be the biggest issue, for students and parents.


----------



## mshanson3121

wdwmom3 said:


> They are using outbreak in the news.  Public health reports them as an outbreak.  They have actually defined an outbreak as “one or more cases”.



The CBC article I read didn't refer to them that way. Regardless, outbreak or not, that wasn't the point of my post.


----------



## Madame

mshanson3121 said:


> Of all the stuff going on with school this year, I think the mandatory isolations are going to be the biggest issue, for students and parents.


So 82 so far by their count.


----------



## wdwmom3

mshanson3121 said:


> The CBC article I read didn't refer to them that way. Regardless, outbreak or not, that wasn't the point of my post.



I wasn’t commenting on your post. I was just giving people information that even a single case can be called an outbreak.

My post had nothing to do with you.

You seem like you want to argue with people even when there is nothing to argue over


----------



## DisTXMom

Our schools have been open 2 weeks.  Of the 33 campuses in the district, 6 have had COVID cases (one has 3 and 5 have 1).  The ratio of quarantined people (per single case of COVID) appears to be in the 2-5 range on average.  The school with 3 cases is a high school, but the cases appear to be pretty evenly spread across elementary, middle school and high school.  Our DD’s school has around 800 on campus(and 300 remote learners) and we don’t have any cases yet. We are in Texas- our region doesn’t have low numbers, although our immediate area does. Face coverings are required and are strictly enforced.  Kids with “symptoms” are quickly sent off campus and can only return with a negative COVID test AND an alternate diagnosis (or subject to other quarantine measures if COVID positive).  All-in-all it’s been a good start to the year- fingers crossed Labor Day doesn’t throw a wrench in it.


----------



## mshanson3121

wdwmom3 said:


> I wasn’t commenting on your post. I was just giving people information that even a single case can be called an outbreak.
> 
> My post had nothing to do with you.
> 
> You seem like you want to argue with people even when there is nothing to argue over



Yeah that's the pot calling the kettle black if I ever heard it lol.

You quoted my post, so yes, that implies it has to do with what I'm saying. Hence my initial reply. My second reply was not an argument. It was a mere statement/explanation that the article I read hadn't used that word, and that fear mongering over outbreaks wasn't the point of my post which you quoted.

At any rate. Lesson learned for unblocking.


----------



## mshanson3121

DisTXMom said:


> Our schools have been open 2 weeks.  Of the 33 campuses in the district, 6 have had COVID cases (one has 3 and 5 have 1).  The ratio of quarantined people (per single case of COVID) appears to be in the 2-5 range on average.  The school with 3 cases is a high school, but the cases appear to be pretty evenly spread across elementary, middle school and high school.  Our DD’s school has around 800 on campus(and 300 remote learners) and we don’t have any cases yet. We are in Texas- our region doesn’t have low numbers, although our immediate area does. Face coverings are required and are strictly enforced.  Kids with “symptoms” are quickly sent off campus and can only return with a negative COVID test AND an alternate diagnosis (or subject to other quarantine measures if COVID positive).  All-in-all it’s been a good start to the year- fingers crossed Labor Day doesn’t throw a wrench in it.



Sounds like they're doing a good job of enforcing the rules. They announced here that students not complying with the mask rules will be suspended/removed from school until they comply. There's been some uproar over that.


----------



## wdwmom3

mshanson3121 said:


> Yeah that's the pot calling the kettle black if I ever heard it lol.
> 
> You quoted my post, so yes, that implies it has to do with what I'm saying. Hence my initial reply. My second reply was not an argument. It was a mere statement that the article I read hadn't used that word, and an explanation that fear mongering over outbreaks wasn't the point of my post which you quoted.
> 
> At any rate. Lesson learned for unblocking.



I didn’t quote anyone in my post about outbreaks.


----------



## mshanson3121

wdwmom3 said:


> I didn’t quote anyone in my post about outbreaks.



Well for that, I'm sorry. For whatever reason, to my tired mind, at quick glance it looked like you had quoted me, which made your comment seem pointed at mine.


----------



## wdwmom3

mshanson3121 said:


> Well for that, I'm sorry. For whatever reason, to my tired mind, at quick glance it looked like you had quoted me, which made your comment seem pointed at mine.



Apology accepted. The talk of cases in schools had just reminded me of what my friend had sent me. I wasn’t commenting on what you guys were discussing regarding Quebec schools.


----------



## mshanson3121

wdwmom3 said:


> Apology accepted. The talk of cases in schools had just reminded me of what my friend had sent me. I wasn’t commenting on what you guys were discussing regarding Quebec schools.



I do agree that calling a single case an outbreak is misleading. I've seen that term used for other things, too - measles, whooping cough etc...


----------



## Madame

DisTXMom said:


> Our schools have been open 2 weeks.  Of the 33 campuses in the district, 6 have had COVID cases (one has 3 and 5 have 1).  The ratio of quarantined people (per single case of COVID) appears to be in the 2-5 range on average.  The school with 3 cases is a high school, but the cases appear to be pretty evenly spread across elementary, middle school and high school.  Our DD’s school has around 800 on campus(and 300 remote learners) and we don’t have any cases yet. We are in Texas- our region doesn’t have low numbers, although our immediate area does. Face coverings are required and are strictly enforced.  Kids with “symptoms” are quickly sent off campus and can only return with a negative COVID test AND an alternate diagnosis (or subject to other quarantine measures if COVID positive).  All-in-all it’s been a good start to the year- fingers crossed Labor Day doesn’t throw a wrench in it.


This sounds an excellent system.  In Ontario a student can continue to attend school even if a parent in the same household has tested positive.....  A student does NOT need a COVID test to return to school after showing symptoms....  I think what you described is very sensible and fingers crossed for you that the school start up is smooth.


----------



## damo

Madame said:


> This sounds an excellent system.  In Ontario a student can continue to attend school even if a parent in the same household has tested positive.....  A student does NOT need a COVID test to return to school after showing symptoms....  I think what you described is very sensible and fingers crossed for you that the school start up is smooth.




This is what is on the Ontario.ca website.

https://www.ontario.ca/page/operational-guidance-covid-19-management-schools#section-3
*Scenario: Parent tests positive for COVID-19*
*This scenario applies to anyone who shares a household with a student or staff member in a school community.*

If a parent receives a positive test for COVID-19, he or she is not obligated to inform the school of their test result. However, it is strongly recommended.

Children in a household where a parent or other member has tested positive should stay home and isolate for 14 days.

The PHU would provide direction to close contacts, including household members of a person diagnosed with COVID-19.

The PHU would provide direction to the school principal on the actions to be taken with the school, depending on the circumstances of the positive COVID-19 case.

*Recommended action by teacher*
The teacher should:


support continuation of learning for any students who need to isolate if necessary
*Recommended action by principal*
The principal should:


if student is in the school, when notified by the parent, coordinate immediate student pick-up and designate an area to isolate the student until pickup
ask that the student follow the direction of their health care provider and PHU
ensure student portfolio information (that is, class list, seating charts, transportation details, etc.) is up-to-date. Note: Be prepared to provide this information to PHU upon request
support PHU next steps
connect with Superintendent and make them aware of the situation
ensure/coordinate environmental cleaning and/or disinfection of the space and items used by the individual(s)
if the student tests positive, refer to Management of Positive COVID-19 diagnosis in the school.
monitor the school population for new/additional illness
report in the daily tracking tool as necessary

*Recommended action by school board*
The superintendent should:


inform the board COVID-19 lead and support principal as needed
The board COVID-19 lead should:


continue to monitor the situation and liaise with the Ministry of Education as necessary
*Recommended action by parent and student*
The parent and student should:


continue to adhere to current infection prevention, control practices and advice provided by local public health
Note: Testing recommendations are made by an individual’s health care provider and PHU.


----------



## Madame

damo said:


> This is what is on the Ontario.ca website.
> 
> https://www.ontario.ca/page/operational-guidance-covid-19-management-schools#section-3
> *Scenario: Parent tests positive for COVID-19*
> *This scenario applies to anyone who shares a household with a student or staff member in a school community.*
> 
> If a parent receives a positive test for COVID-19, he or she is not obligated to inform the school of their test result. However, it is strongly recommended.
> 
> Children in a household where a parent or other member has tested positive should stay home and isolate for 14 days.
> 
> The PHU would provide direction to close contacts, including household members of a person diagnosed with COVID-19.
> 
> The PHU would provide direction to the school principal on the actions to be taken with the school, depending on the circumstances of the positive COVID-19 case.
> 
> *Recommended action by teacher*
> The teacher should:
> 
> 
> support continuation of learning for any students who need to isolate if necessary
> *Recommended action by principal*
> The principal should:
> 
> 
> if student is in the school, when notified by the parent, coordinate immediate student pick-up and designate an area to isolate the student until pickup
> ask that the student follow the direction of their health care provider and PHU
> ensure student portfolio information (that is, class list, seating charts, transportation details, etc.) is up-to-date. Note: Be prepared to provide this information to PHU upon request
> support PHU next steps
> connect with Superintendent and make them aware of the situation
> ensure/coordinate environmental cleaning and/or disinfection of the space and items used by the individual(s)
> if the student tests positive, refer to Management of Positive COVID-19 diagnosis in the school.
> monitor the school population for new/additional illness
> report in the daily tracking tool as necessary
> 
> *Recommended action by school board*
> The superintendent should:
> 
> 
> inform the board COVID-19 lead and support principal as needed
> The board COVID-19 lead should:
> 
> 
> continue to monitor the situation and liaise with the Ministry of Education as necessary
> *Recommended action by parent and student*
> The parent and student should:
> 
> 
> continue to adhere to current infection prevention, control practices and advice provided by local public health
> Note: Testing recommendations are made by an individual’s health care provider and PHU.


Strongly recommended does not equal required 

ETA - I think by now it is evident that I am extremely well informed on this specific issue (school return in ON during C-19).

The hrs I spend on different platforms sourcing info from a variety of sources is extensive.  I am diagnosed OCD and am compulsive in research- I simply cannot help myself & must know as much as possible to quiet my mind.   I believe I said weeks ago on the border thread that school wouldn’t be the same - rows, no group work etc etc.  only to be poo-pooed.  I am ALWAYS open to new information, and to being corrected, but encourage others to do as much research as possible as adding incorrect information is confusing & counterproductive.


----------



## Starwind

wdwmom3 said:


> A bit of info I would like to point out to everyone.  Before school starts and people start freaking out about “outbreaks”.  Outbreaks is not even an accurate term.  It’s considered an outbreak as soon as a single person tests positive.  So you could have one person (adult or child) who has caught covid somewhere else, but an outbreak will be reported at the school/daycare etc even if there isn’t a other single person who got infected from them.  So you will hear about “outbreaks” even when all the protocols are working.
> 
> A friend of mine recently sent me an article freaking out about kids going back to school because there was an “outbreak” at a day camp.  They freaked saying “see kids can’t go back it’s too dangerous, look there was an outbreak at a camp”.  There was a single case of one child that tested positive .  The child caught it from someone else. Not at the camp.  And apparently the outbreak is still listed as having only a single case.  That’s not an outbreak.



It can depend on jurisdiction.

Here in Ottawa, this is the definition Ottawa Public Health will use for declaring an outbreak at a school:

_What is considered an outbreak in a school?
An outbreak would be declared in a school once it has been determined that there are two positive cases with an epidemiological link (e.g. these children could have become infected with COVID-19 at school either from each other or a common source). Each case will need to be assessed and it would need to be determined that transmission occurred in the school before confirming it as an outbreak since it is possible that children could have been infected outside the school setting. _
(https://www.ottawapublichealth.ca/e...x#What-is-considered-an-outbreak-in-a-school-)

It can also be context-specific. In the earlier days of the pandemic, for example, they had used a larger # of cases to define an outbreak in long term care homes and when it became clear that was a problem that was contributing to making the outbreaks worse in LTC, "outbreak" in LTC homes was redefined to mean a single case. I believe at some point that became a province-wide definition for LTC homes in Ontario.

SW


----------



## damo

Madame said:


> Strongly recommended does not equal required
> 
> ETA - I think by now it is evident that I am extremely well informed on this specific issue (school return in ON during C-19).
> 
> The hrs I spend on different platforms sourcing info from a variety of sources is extensive.  I am diagnosed OCD and am compulsive in research- I simply cannot help myself & must know as much as possible to quiet my mind.   I believe I said weeks ago on the border thread that school wouldn’t be the same - rows, no group work etc etc.  only to be poo-pooed.  I am ALWAYS open to new information, and to being corrected.  This scoring points off of others is not helpful.



I honestly feel it is up to the community to keep covid out of the schools.  There is only so much that can be done in the schools and by the schools to keep them safe.  It's been evident all summer that kids are still getting together in large groups despite the government's rules about bubbles and congregations.  If everyone doesn't do their part outside of the school, it makes no difference what the rules are inside of the school.

Not sure what you mean by "This scoring points off of others is not helpful."


----------



## DisTXMom

Starwind said:


> It can depend on jurisdiction.
> 
> Here in Ottawa, this is the definition Ottawa Public Health will use for declaring an outbreak at a school:
> 
> _What is considered an outbreak in a school?
> An outbreak would be declared in a school once it has been determined that there are two positive cases with an epidemiological link (e.g. these children could have become infected with COVID-19 at school either from each other or a common source). Each case will need to be assessed and it would need to be determined that transmission occurred in the school before confirming it as an outbreak since it is possible that children could have been infected outside the school setting. _
> (https://www.ottawapublichealth.ca/e...x#What-is-considered-an-outbreak-in-a-school-)
> 
> It can also be context-specific. In the earlier days of the pandemic, for example, they had used a larger # of cases to define an outbreak in long term care homes and when it became clear that was a problem that was contributing to making the outbreaks worse in LTC, "outbreak" in LTC homes was redefined to mean a single case. I believe at some point that became a province-wide definition for LTC homes in Ontario.
> 
> SW


Wow.  Students here have to do a daily health screener to be on campus- 3 questions: 1) have you tested positive 2) do you have any of the following symptoms...3) have you been in close contact with anyone that has tested positive.  A YES on any of the 3 will have the student quarantined (meaning not on campus).  Remote learning technology is utilized by on-campus and by remote learners so students know what to do if they get moved to remote.  For families that don’t want to wear a mask or can’t, I believe the general response is “remote learning is a better option for your family”(special ed has different rules I believe).  Our district cases are tracked by a dashboard that’s updated daily, which is both helpful and distracting/nerve wracking


----------



## mshanson3121

damo said:


> I honestly feel it is up to the community to keep covid out of the schools.  There is only so much that can be done in the schools and by the schools to keep them safe.  It's been evident all summer that kids are still getting together in large groups despite the government's rules about bubbles and congregations.  If everyone doesn't do their part outside of the school, it makes no difference what the rules are inside of the school.



This is a really good point. I know in our area, and even nationally, more and more stores are making masks mandatory, even if the province doesn't require it. NB has not yet made masks mandatory in public like NS has, but I know the government is under a lot of pressure to do so, and honestly, I support it - for this reason. If people want schools to succeed this year, and not get shut down again, not deal with massive disruptions due to isolations etc... then those people need to do their part. Wear a mask, social distance, take general immune boosting/preventative measures, reduce how often you're going into at-risk places (stores etc...).


----------



## wdwmom3

mshanson3121 said:


> This is a really good point. I know in our area, and even nationally, more and more stores are making masks mandatory, even if the province doesn't require it. NB has not yet made masks mandatory in public like NS has, but I know the government is under a lot of pressure to do so, and honestly, I support it - for this reason. If people want schools to succeed this year, and not get shut down again, not deal with massive disruptions due to isolations etc... then those people need to do their part. Wear a mask, social distance, take general immune boosting/preventative measures, reduce how often you're going into at-risk places (stores etc...).


Agreed.  The best ways to keep schools safe is avoiding spread by any other sources.   If staff and students never get the virus to begin with it won’t ever be brought into schools.  

Our decisions about our son going was made because of the low cases in our immediate area.  If cases start going up a lot he’s coming home.  I feel if cases are very low in an area schools will be safe.  Everyone needs to do their part to make that happen.


----------



## quandrea

wdwmom3 said:


> Agreed.  The best ways to keep schools safe is avoiding spread by any other sources.   If staff and students never get the virus to begin with it won’t ever be brought into schools.
> 
> Our decisions about our son going was made because of the low cases in our immediate area.  If cases start going up a lot he’s coming home.  I feel if cases are very low in an area schools will be safe.  Everyone needs to do their part to make that happen.


Very true. But every day the case numbers rise in Ontario. We are not on the right trajectory. People are returning to normal in their behaviour, opening up their social contacts at the very time we should be limiting social contacts and being vigilant. I get very frustrated because it’s basic math. Take a look at the graph. Just because we’ve been at this six months and we are sick of it doesn’t make it over. Unless behaviour in the community improves, I fear our numbers will keep rising. When was the last time Ontario saw less than 100 cases in a day?


----------



## Madame

damo said:


> I honestly feel it is up to the community to keep covid out of the schools.  There is only so much that can be done in the schools and by the schools to keep them safe.  It's been evident all summer that kids are still getting together in large groups despite the government's rules about bubbles and congregations.  If everyone doesn't do their part outside of the school, it makes no difference what the rules are inside of the school.
> 
> Not sure what you mean by "This scoring points off of others is not helpful."


Yes, I edited my comment as the ETA was more a generalization and I did not make that clear that it was not a direct response to you.  Sorry about that.  It was clear in my head, but did not translate well.  

My point was, what I posted was exactly what you posted from the Ministry; I just removed the spin.  Your post felt like a rebuttal to my statement on the realities of trace and rules regarding return to school after symptoms etc.  I apologize if that was not the way it was intended.  Ministry statements should not be taken at face value.  It’s like the “iron ring” supposedly around LTCH.  Sounded great but mandatory masking and no staff sharing was NOT happening & the result was the armed forces being sent in to clean up the mess.  

When a bus driver from Ottawa posts on Twitter that he has received no PPE and will have 3 to a seat in his bus, I believe him.   The bus driver on Twitter telling us that he will be forced to pick up the kid hacking at the bus stop if the parent doesn’t come to collect him/her - I believe him.  When a J/SK teacher reports 30 kinders in her room, I believe her.  When a trustee has to make a motion to allow teachers to open windows that are screwed shut because the windows are in such poor repair that when open they risk the pane dislodging and falling on a student, I believe her too. 

Community responsibility sounds nice, but any ed staff knows that every day kids are given Tylenol & sent to school.  Kids diagnosed with strep don’t wait the required number of days before returning and it burns through the class like wildfire.  This is NOT an attack on parents - I have dosed my own kids & sent them off bc we all have to work  We need a provincial plan for how parents can go to work and still have the ability to take time off if their child is sick; we need small class sizes in elementary to reduce the number of contacts.  

We need the public to believe ed staff right now or at least dig a little deeper.  Lecce was a deputy director of communications under the last federal government.  Spin is his game.  Sorry this wandered a bit.  I apologize for not being more clear.


----------



## Debbie

quandrea said:


> ...When was the last time Ontario saw less than 100 cases in a day?


If I'm not mistaken, I think I heard August 12 this week.


----------



## DisTXMom

damo said:


> I honestly feel it is up to the community to keep covid out of the schools.  There is only so much that can be done in the schools and by the schools to keep them safe.  It's been evident all summer that kids are still getting together in large groups despite the government's rules about bubbles and congregations.  If everyone doesn't do their part outside of the school, it makes no difference what the rules are inside of the school.
> 
> Not sure what you mean by "This scoring points off of others is not helpful."


100%!  The cases of COVID at our schools were not caught at school- they were caught at home- largely in social event settings.


----------



## wdwmom3

Madame said:


> Yes, I edited my comment as the ETA was more a generalization and I did not make that clear that it was not a direct response to you.  Sorry about that.  It was clear in my head, but did not translate well.
> 
> My point was, what I posted was exactly what you posted from the Ministry; I just removed the spin.  Your post felt like a rebuttal to my statement on the realities of trace and rules regarding return to school after symptoms etc.  I apologize if that was not the way it was intended.  Ministry statements should not be taken at face value.  It’s like the “iron ring” supposedly around LTCH.  Sounded great but mandatory masking and no staff sharing was NOT happening & the result was the armed forces being sent in to clean up the mess.
> 
> When a bus driver from Ottawa posts on Twitter that he has received no PPE and will have 3 to a seat in his bus, I believe him.   The bus driver on Twitter telling us that he will be forced to pick up the kid hacking at the bus stop if the parent doesn’t come to collect him/her - I believe him.  When a J/SK teacher reports 30 kinders in her room, I believe her.  When a trustee has to make a motion to allow teachers to open windows that are screwed shut because the windows are in such poor repair that when open they risk the pane dislodging and falling on a student, I believe her too.
> 
> Community responsibility sounds nice, but any ed staff knows that every day kids are given Tylenol & sent to school.  Kids diagnosed with strep don’t wait the required number of days before returning and it burns through the class like wildfire.  This is NOT an attack on parents - I have dosed my own kids & sent them off bc we all have to work  We need a provincial plan for how parents can go to work and still have the ability to take time off if their child is sick; we need small class sizes in elementary to reduce the number of contacts.
> 
> We need the public to believe ed staff right now or at least dig a little deeper.  Lecce was a deputy director of communications under the last federal government.  Spin is his game.  Sorry this wandered a bit.  I apologize for not being more clear.



Just because we don’t agree with everything people say doesn’t mean we don’t believe people. But there are also other opinions.

I also know many teachers who can’t wait to get back in the classroom and who feel with masks etc their classes will be pretty safe.  They think that getting back to class is worth the risk. They are more annoyed with the school boards actions and having to hear about it constantly on the news.  I had one mom at my sons soccer practice (who teaches middle school) say she’s getting annoyed at the “fear” being thrown around every day.  She just wants to get back to teaching her class and wished everyone would stop going on about things.  

I think we need to accept that having 15 kids in every elementary school class will never happen.  It’s not just the money.   There isn’t enough physical space or enough teachers to make that happen even if money was no object.  So we just need to get over that dream and do the best we can.  We all have choices we can make.


----------



## tgropp

mshanson3121 said:


> Gotta love the hypocrisy of this post
> 
> Though for the record, I didn't say a word about your character. Was just commenting on your lack of knowledge regarding the topic you were speaking of, which was leading you to insult people.


Go back and read your post. For someone to accuse someone of  not having a clue about this or doesn’t have two sweet clues on what he’s talking about etc. is not a compliment. It’s condescending. There are other posters on here that may respectfully disagree with each other but They offer their views and are well respected whether we agree or not. That is the purpose of these boards. Most times everyone learns something new about the discussion. You on the other hand are very forceful, sometimes mean but understanding given what everyone is facing with this pandemic.


----------



## pigletto

So I took my ds16 for some back to school shopping yesterday. I hadn’t bought him anything during the stay at home period and nothing fit.  It had to be done in person. He has grown so much and needed to try things on.

At one of the stores the lady on cash said they had been very busy but  most parents said they were buying half of what they usually would since their high schoolers were only going to be there half the time . My husband said it might be that people are also being more cautious with money right now too.
   The mall was kind of sad. It’s not a big mall but it’s always been full and 5 clothing stores have closed since March.

Ds16 starts with online portion of back to school tomorrow. He’s going in person every other Wednesday , Thursday,  and Friday.  We still don‘t know if we need a webcam or how the synchronous learning works but I’m sure we will figure it out.

At the risk of sounding too preachy I just want to say I hope we can all be kinder to each other during this time. I think every one of us is really anxious or has legitimate concerns for health and welfare .. no matter what we have chosen to do in the Fall. And just from a personal standpoint .. I feel the school and teachers have done what they can do.. the rest is on me. It’s not their job to shelter me or my family from our own decisions. We have chosen to go back , and we will accept responsibility for how that turns out.
Wishing everyone peace and luck with their return to the school year.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

DD starts grade 7 tomorrow! I am excited for her. I love that her main concern is trying to keep her hair’s face-framing layers curled “away” from her face lol No issues with the mask, distancing, no lockers...just preteen girlie stuff


----------



## ottawamom

Hair curled away from one's face takes me right back to the 70's and my years in high school.


----------



## MoreTravels

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> DD starts grade 7 tomorrow! I am excited for her. I love that her main concern is trying to keep her hair’s face-framing layers curled “away” from her face lol No issues with the mask, distancing, no lockers...just preteen girlie stuff



My kid is in the same age group, going to grade 7. The school has made it clear they are moving from lower school area to middle school area. They are expected to behave more maturely. I am actually feeling very emotional. I have cleaned up her study room this week in preparation for her school. I have collected all kinds of cartoon drawings, Disney princess merchandises, plush toys, and artistic crafts. Now she is in middle school... I feel good but sad that she grows up so fast. It's a different milestone in middle school. I am worried about all the non-kiddie things such as drugs and cigarettes in senior schools. I guess I am just the worried type of parent.


----------



## ottawamom

Keep and eye on them and be there to hear about their day. You'll know what's going on. Be present in their lives and they will come to you with any issues they have.


----------



## bcwife76

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> DD starts grade 7 tomorrow! I am excited for her. I love that her main concern is trying to keep her hair’s face-framing layers curled “away” from her face lol No issues with the mask, distancing, no lockers...just preteen girlie stuff


Oh my gosh this is my DD as well!! My oldest also starts grade 7 on Thursday and last night she gave herself a bang trim because why not right? Thankfully they came out well and she made sure to keep the outer layers long so as to frame her face too! Thank goodness for some normalcy in all of this


----------



## badiggio

On the 6 o clock news here in ottawa,heard that 5 separate french schools came up with positive tests today.Only caught part of it,so i don't have all the details.Imo,i can't see it working


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

Go to CBC.ca and click on your locale. They will have the news there.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

badiggio said:


> On the 6 o clock news here in ottawa,heard that 5 separate french schools came up with positive tests today.Only caught part of it,so i don't have all the details.Imo,i can't see it working



https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/sept-7-2020-covid-19-update-1.5714939


----------



## MoreTravels

It's almost 9:30pm.... is there any parent that is still nervous like me, doing last-minute packing for the kids for tomorrow? I don't think I can sleep well tonight. Gosh... This is affecting the parents more than the kids.


----------



## wdwmom3

MoreTravels said:


> It's almost 9:30pm.... is there any parent that is still nervous like me, doing last-minute packing for the kids for tomorrow? I don't think I can sleep well tonight. Gosh... This is affecting the parents more than the kids.



You are very right.  I think it is way tougher on the parents.


----------



## SleeplessInTO

MoreTravels said:


> It's almost 9:30pm.... is there any parent that is still nervous like me, doing last-minute packing for the kids for tomorrow? I don't think I can sleep well tonight. Gosh... This is affecting the parents more than the kids.


This is me! I just finished packing. Now reading disboards because I’m too keyed up to sleep. First day of school tomorrow


----------



## scrappinginontario

MoreTravels said:


> It's almost 9:30pm.... is there any parent that is still nervous like me, doing last-minute packing for the kids for tomorrow? I don't think I can sleep well tonight. Gosh... This is affecting the parents more than the kids.





wdwmom3 said:


> You are very right.  I think it is way tougher on the parents.


I’m sure this will be me Wed night as my dd starts Thurs.  I’m glad this is harder on the parents as we correctly take on the worry so our children can be kids!

We live in Oshawa and sadly too many children grew up far too quickly this weekend when Friday’s tragedy took the lives of one of their friends or a beloved teacher.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

Good luck to everyone (parents lol) today!!


----------



## tgropp

MoreTravels said:


> It's almost 9:30pm.... is there any parent that is still nervous like me, doing last-minute packing for the kids for tomorrow? I don't think I can sleep well tonight. Gosh... This is affecting the parents more than the kids.


yes, loving parents are thinking what you are.....and not sleeping. Hoping that things go well and curious to see the children’s reaction when they see their friends again. The teachers love and care for their students should be of a comfort to you. Some  Parents lack of respect with hygiene and a variety of Other reasons may scuttle this but hopefully not. This is affecting children more than we think. All the Best !!!


----------



## CanadianKrista

Yeah, I was dreaming about back to school last night, and not sleeping much either.  Dropped DS off to his first day at Grade 7 at a new school this morning.  He was pretty cool about it, here's hoping his day goes well.  DD is back to Grade 5 tomorrow.


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

MoreTravels said:


> It's almost 9:30pm.... is there any parent that is still nervous like me, doing last-minute packing for the kids for tomorrow? I don't think I can sleep well tonight. Gosh... This is affecting the parents more than the kids.


This will be me for the next three nights! DS7 starts tomorrow, DD10 the next day and DS13 on Friday. Our school sent out an email telling us to send suntan lotion and a hat as they will be spending a significant part of the day outside. I think being outside more will be good for all of the students! Good luck to all the parents and teachers and I hope everyone has a great first week!!!


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> DD starts grade 7 tomorrow! I am excited for her. I love that her main concern is trying to keep her hair’s face-framing layers curled “away” from her face lol No issues with the mask, distancing, no lockers...just preteen girlie stuff


My DD10's main concern is what mask will match what she is wearing, LOL!


----------



## ottawamom

Strangely, that is my thought as I pick out my mask before I head out the door to do errands.


----------



## pigletto

DS16 was not added to any of his classes, the login page is frozen and he’s clicking around in frustration reading 10 sets of instructions and guides trying to figure out what he is doing wrong. Not a great start to the online learning portion. Hopefully we get it figured out today.


----------



## quandrea

pigletto said:


> DS16 was not added to any of his classes, the login page is frozen and he’s clicking around in frustration reading 10 sets of instructions and guides trying to figure out what he is doing wrong. Not a great start to the online learning portion. Hopefully we get it figured out today.


A shame they didn’t just use the Prism online consortium or ILC courses that have been in use for years. I will never understand the government led school system. So much waste of tax dollars.

We opted out of both offerings. Dd logged on with the ILC this morning and is on her way. ILC has been offering courses since 1926. Why would the government not have looked to them for guidance with online/independent learning?


----------



## pigletto

There are some major kinks to be worked out but he’s accessed his course content for accounting so he’s following the lesson plan and put in a help request for the stuff he’s been denied access to.

DS set an alarm for this morning, did his hair, put on his new back to school clothes , made breakfast , took his allergy meds and sat down to the computer for period one start. It was so cute . He’s really excited to be starting school again. He enjoys it and he craves structure and purpose. Remind me of this day when I’m knocking on his door and hollering he’s got 15 minutes or his going to miss his bus. This will wear off soon .


----------



## hdrolfe

MoreTravels said:


> It's almost 9:30pm.... is there any parent that is still nervous like me, doing last-minute packing for the kids for tomorrow? I don't think I can sleep well tonight. Gosh... This is affecting the parents more than the kids.



This will be me tonight. And most of today. The rain weather suits my mood i guess. I will worry whether I made the right choice, whether he has everything he needs, if his friends are in school or not. And probably for the whole school year. I have tomorrow off, normally I would walk him up to school on the first day but they said parents can't be there so it will be strange.


----------



## pigletto

hdrolfe said:


> This will be me tonight. And most of today. The rain weather suits my mood i guess. I will worry whether I made the right choice, whether he has everything he needs, if his friends are in school or not. And probably for the whole school year. I have tomorrow off, normally I would walk him up to school on the first day but they said parents can't be there so it will be strange.


Hugs to you today , and all the parents who are worrying and nervous. 
I realized I was going to worry if I made the right decision no matter what I chose.


----------



## FigmentSpark

My son doesn't start until tomorrow, and his first day will be on line.  Tonight will be my sleepless night, followed by tomorrow's sleepless night, as he goes in to class on Thurs. 

Older DS will be starting university on Thurs (online).  We went out to pick up his dorm room keys and take a bunch of his stuff (and make the bed), but he won't be actually moving in until later in the semester or even for the next.  It was nice to get his place, though.  He thinks he will be happy there and, more importantly, I approve.  It looks like a nice place and he will be safe and hopefully able to be successful and even make friends.


----------



## 22Tink

I hope everyone’s first days go well! DD goes into grade 7 this year, first day is on Friday. It’s also her first day at the high school. Our town only has one high school, grades 7/8 in their own wing and 9-12 in the rest of the school. Due to COVID she didn’t get the usual Grade 7 tour of the high school back in June so she’s a bit nervous about not knowing her way around. Fingers crossed it goes well!


----------



## Aladora

DS starts at his new school tomorrow, it's only a 90 minute assembly for just the grade 10 students but full day in school learning starts at 8:10am Thursday.

Between the wacky week1/week2 schedule and the 3 different uniforms he has to wear (PE, daily and #1 dress) on various days, I may lose my mind before we get all of this figured out!  

As far as I can tell, they wear their daily on M, T, Th, Fri and their #1's on Wed. But, because of Covid the school, has closed the change rooms so now they wear their PH uniform any day that they have PE and do not get changed at all. Of course, on week 1, DS has PE on M, W, F and week 2 on M, T, Th. 

(consulting my spreadsheet, venn diagram, pie chart, and possibly ouija board)

I think we have it figured out but we are going to have to get a calendar started JUST for what the heck he has to wear each day...and here I thought one of the side benefits of private school was going to be that he no longer had to worry about what to put on each day!


----------



## star72232

I still feel so lost about what my kids are doing!

My ODS starts Gr. 9 tomorrow.  Only the one day (orientation), then he's home until a week from Thursday.  However, we don't know if he's supposed to be doing online learning beginning on Friday?  I think so, but no guidance about that yet.  I'm assuming he'll get that tomorrow. At least he knows what classes he has (Math and Business this quadmester).

My MDS starts Gr. 5 on Thursday.  We assumed he'd start next week like the rest of his school.  He's in SpEd (full time enrichment) so they are starting full time this week.  Kind of funny that the enrichment kids "need" to start earlier (I know it's just that they treat all congregated classes the same, but it is a bit funny).  However, although most kids in his class will be bussed this week, he won't be.  Our enrichment class is in our home school, so he doesn't get special bussing.  Regular busses don't start until next week, so we need to take him Thursday and Friday (he's the only kid in the class from our home school, so I think they just didn't even think about his bus).  Thankfully that isn't an issue for us.

My YDS starts Gr. 3 next Tuesday.  We still don't know his teacher yet, but it doesn't really matter, so I guess he's good to go.  

My DD starts Gr. 10 at some point.  They haven't told her what Cohort she's in yet, or what classes she has.  Since we are supposed to be carpooling, not knowing Cohorts is annoying.  Oh well.  At some point I imagine she'll learn what classes she's taking and what cohort she's in.


----------



## hdrolfe

I dropped kiddo off for grade 6 this morning, it was a bit rainy so I drove him. I have no idea if he will have any friends in his class or even how many kids are in his class. It seems his friends are mostly doing online or in the non-immersion group. I think I am more nervous than when he started JK. And the house is SO QUIET! At least tomorrow I am back at work so will be busy myself.


----------



## DisTXMom

MoreTravels said:


> It's almost 9:30pm.... is there any parent that is still nervous like me, doing last-minute packing for the kids for tomorrow? I don't think I can sleep well tonight. Gosh... This is affecting the parents more than the kids.


I think there is an element of knowing you’ve done all that you can do and you can then either


MoreTravels said:


> It's almost 9:30pm.... is there any parent that is still nervous like me, doing last-minute packing for the kids for tomorrow? I don't think I can sleep well tonight. Gosh... This is affecting the parents more than the kids.



For my own peace of mind, I drafted safety protocols that govern the kids’ activities at school, as well as at home. Things like wiping down phones and showering upon arriving at home, taking personal items to bedrooms so they aren’t scattered around the house, hygiene protocols at school, etc.  This was my way of knowing we’ve done what we can (within reason) as a family to still feel reasonably secure while returning to campus.


----------



## Frozen2014

My younger one starts tomorrow, full time at school (grade 6).
My older one starts online tomorrow but Monday he'll start every other morning at school, rest online.

For those in the classroom for the day, how many masks are you sending?  Are you sending a "clean" bag and a "dirty" bag?  Such a strange thing....pencils - check, binder - check, erasers - check, masks - check.....


----------



## hdrolfe

Frozen2014 said:


> My younger one starts tomorrow, full time at school (grade 6).
> My older one starts online tomorrow but Monday he'll start every other morning at school, rest online.
> 
> For those in the classroom for the day, how many masks are you sending?  Are you sending a "clean" bag and a "dirty" bag?  Such a strange thing....pencils - check, binder - check, erasers - check, masks - check.....



I sent 4 masks of different styles because I wasn't sure which one he'd prefer. We'll see once he's home what he prefers I guess. I sent them all in a plastic bag with a smaller one inside it for the dirty ones.. we'll see if he does that. And they will all go into the wash. We are lucky to have a fair number of them, and it's only 3 days this week. I have a couple disposable ones if he wants to take those instead, but everything that goes to school comes home. They aren't doing any recycling or anything in school this year, even food garbage, if it does there it comes home. So they don't congregate around the garbage cans.


----------



## Aladora

Frozen2014 said:


> My younger one starts tomorrow, full time at school (grade 6).
> My older one starts online tomorrow but Monday he'll start every other morning at school, rest online.
> 
> For those in the classroom for the day, how many masks are you sending?  Are you sending a "clean" bag and a "dirty" bag?  Such a strange thing....pencils - check, binder - check, erasers - check, masks - check.....



I told DS that his mask is like his cell phone, don't leave home without it!


----------



## wdwmom3

I’m getting really annoyed at our school and school board.  Not only did they decide to delay the start until next week (was supposed to be back yesterday).  But the school won’t give out much information.  They tell us last week that classes are set and list should be up online by yesterday.  Well it wasn’t.  And now we get an email giving us no information except our kids teacher will call us “sometime” before the end of the day on Friday and to answer if we see an “unknown” number.  Still zero about what classes they are in.  And it actually really pisses me off that they think we can drop whatever we are doing to answer a phone call that could come at any time .  

I’m getting really tired of the lack of information and time wasted on BS emails to us that tell us nothing.  And this constant assumption that parents have no lives. In the same amount of time they spent sending the email with no info they could have given us the class information.


----------



## Orion Nebula

What a PITA, our year started without a hitch and is going well enough. I couldn't imagine just sitting there knowing nothing.


----------



## wdwmom3

Orion Nebula said:


> What a PITA, our year started without a hitch and is going well enough. I couldn't imagine just sitting there knowing nothing.



Yep it’s starting to really get me mad. Especially when the school tells you last week they were all set. I’m tired of them telling us they are going to do something and then it either doesn’t happen or they do something different.


----------



## scrappinginontario

We made lanyards for my DD to wear so that she has a place to attach her mask at recess as they're allowed to take masks off at recess while outdoors but need to wear it until she gets outside.  Also sending both cloth and disposable masks plus a bag to put dirty masks in if needed.

Add us to the group who will require a shower and changing clothes as soon as she gets home.  Going to be a lot of laundry being done around here!!


----------



## dawnelda

wdwmom3 said:


> I’m getting really annoyed at our school and school board.  Not only did they decide to delay the start until next week (was supposed to be back yesterday).  But the school won’t give out much information.  They tell us last week that classes are set and list should be up online by yesterday.  Well it wasn’t.  And now we get an email giving us no information except our kids teacher will call us “sometime” before the end of the day on Friday and to answer if we see an “unknown” number.  Still zero about what classes they are in.  And it actually really pisses me off that they think we can drop whatever we are doing to answer a phone call that could come at any time .
> 
> I’m getting really tired of the lack of information and time wasted on BS emails to us that tell us nothing.  And this constant assumption that parents have no lives. In the same amount of time they spent sending the email with no info they could have given us the class information.



You must be with the same garbage school board as I am (WRDSB). I agree with what you say about their emails containing no actual information. All I know so far is that DD's backpack should contain only lunch and 2 water bottles. Not much reason to inspire confidence in parents.


----------



## pigletto

Ds16 goes in person tomorrow and Friday. He’s been online yesterday and today. In one of the communications I read we were asked to send a paper bag for dirty masks to be placed in , and more than one mask per day. He’s there for four hours so I will send two. We are using cloth wherever possible because I am seriously concerned about how much waste is being created by this pandemic and needing to go to one use items. So we can do our small part by cloth masks I guess. He has four, so I can do laundry every other day.
I don’t know about the rest of you but I’ve hit information overload. There’s sooo much to keep up with. Guides from the board with multiple pages of new practices and protocol  , guides for the actual school with multiple pages of new practices and protocol , emails, different online portals for this and that, forms to be sent in, new things we have to do that nobody can find or don’t work ( I have no idea where the self declaration form is) , new bus procedures , new bus start times, new bus stop. New bell times ..
.
To those of you with multiple kids in multiple grades .. you have my sympathy and admiration !


----------



## Silvermist999

DisTXMom said:


> I think there is an element of knowing you’ve done all that you can do and you can then either
> 
> 
> For my own peace of mind, I drafted safety protocols that govern the kids’ activities at school, as well as at home. Things like wiping down phones and showering upon arriving at home, taking personal items to bedrooms so they aren’t scattered around the house, hygiene protocols at school, etc.  This was my way of knowing we’ve done what we can (within reason) as a family to still feel reasonably secure while returning to campus.


That is a good idea to have some safety protocols.  I’m wondering since we are wiping phones, should binders brought home from school, etc need to be wiped too.  What about loose pages or handouts they are given.  I don’t want to go down that rabbit hole...


----------



## scrappinginontario

Silvermist999 said:


> That is a good idea to have some safety protocols.  I’m wondering since we are wiping phones, should binders brought home from school, etc need to be wiped too.  What about loose pages or handouts they are given.  I don’t want to go down that rabbit hole...


Each of us will choose what is best for our family but personally I don't plan on wiping down her binder each night as she will be the only one touching it.  But, that's just me.


----------



## wdwmom3

Silvermist999 said:


> That is a good idea to have some safety protocols.  I’m wondering since we are wiping phones, should binders brought home from school, etc need to be wiped too.  What about loose pages or handouts they are given.  I don’t want to go down that rabbit hole...



Medical experts are now saying that the risk of transmission through surfaces is actually very low. Because your child should be the only one touching their binders it shouldn’t be an issue.

Also I know everyone I has to do what makes them comfy, but I heard an interesting interview yesterday.   It had to do around kids being anxious about going back to school.  And it was mentioned that yes it’s a good idea to have them remove their shoes and wash their hands as soon as they get home.  But they brought up about how we should be careful about doing things like having a child have a shower as soon as they get home. For  a lot of kids it could lead to more anxiety because it would be like telling them everyday that they are in an unsafe place full of germs that need to be washed away as soon as they get home.  It could cause more anxiety about spending time in the class room.  I had not thought of this before.  But it makes sense.  Even if we are nervous about how safe it is for our kids, we need to be careful with what we share with our kids.  If we tell them school will be safe they will be more relaxed.  If we talk about how unsafe it is, it could stress them out.


----------



## hdrolfe

Well I'm not sure. He's home, he said he "kind of" had fun, is happy they will have gym outside 3 times a week, and he gets to play with his friends at recess. Problems, his friends all appear to be in the other class, he has a couple in his class but not the ones he is closest to, or the ones he has been playing with throughout the summer. And one of those children told him he could drink his water through his mask... so he used 3 today and one came home very wet. Kids? He is very tired, I think mentally more than anything, and is in his room with his favourite cat cuddling and decompressing. I am trying to be hopeful but I am not sure how this is going to end up, he said he wishes he had chosen the online classes. He hasn't done any french in 6 months so he is not enjoying that at all. Man this 2020 year is not my fav...


----------



## ottawamom

How did the day go? Already answered.


----------



## Iralyn

hdrolfe said:


> Well I'm not sure. He's home, he said he "kind of" had fun, is happy they will have gym outside 3 times a week, and he gets to play with his friends at recess. Problems, his friends all appear to be in the other class, he has a couple in his class but not the ones he is closest to, or the ones he has been playing with throughout the summer. And one of those children told him he could drink his water through his mask... so he used 3 today and one came home very wet. Kids? He is very tired, I think mentally more than anything, and is in his room with his favourite cat cuddling and decompressing. I am trying to be hopeful but I am not sure how this is going to end up, he said he wishes he had chosen the online classes. He hasn't done any french in 6 months so he is not enjoying that at all. Man this 2020 year is not my fav...



Sorry it wasn't a great day.  My DD hasn't started yet but I've had half my class for the last few days.  They seem to be quite happy so far.  For recess they can only play with their own class which I worry is going to be problematic eventually but so far they are just so happy to be hanging with other kids and seem to be including everyone.  Have a repeat of first day again today with group 2.  So strange.  So normal but not.  I have to say that I find it much harder to follow the safety protocols in reality than in theory.  E.g., kids were using their chromebooks yesterday.  Some are very independent (depending upon class they were in, may have used a lot last year) but others were struggling (lower literacy levels and lack of experience) and the easiest thing is to just type in the website for them BUT I really shouldn't be touching their devices....


----------



## Frozen2014

hdrolfe said:


> is water through his mask... so he used 3 today and one came home very wet. Kids? He is very tired, I think mentally more than anything, and is in his room with his favourite cat cuddlin


This is what is frustrating/upsetting.  When creating these cohorts, they should have accounted for friends.  I know it's all complicated but they could have reached out (or previous teachers know) and ensured close friends are together.  This is especially important as they have these cohorts and they are the only ones they can/should be handing out with. I'm sorry for your son.  I hope things improve.

So far so good for my DD.  She started today.  Felt strange dropping her off with everyone wearing masks.  I am impressed with the school and her teacher.  She called every parent beforehand and was patient with questions on the phone, etc. We can't control if someone gets covid, but the school is doing what they can to limit things. Scary times.
My DD is with one very good friend. I had assumed her other very good friend won't be in her class as they split the first days up alphabetically, but found out this morning that is not how they arranged the classes (i.e. only half the kids are there today, and other half tomorrow)....so this other friend could be in her class.  Really hope so as this is the child she was going to walk to school and from school with.


----------



## siren0119

Frozen2014 said:


> This is what is frustrating/upsetting.  *When creating these cohorts, they should have accounted for friends*.  I know it's all complicated but they could have reached out (or previous teachers know) and ensured close friends are together.  This is especially important as they have these cohorts and they are the only ones they can/should be handing out with. I'm sorry for your son.  I hope things improve.



I know that sounds good on paper...but it's basically impossible to please everyone. There was literally no way for a school to manage trying to place kids in cohorts, ensure families stayed on the same cohort schedule, AND manage their friend circles. Nevermind the fact that friend connections can change on a dime (especially at the lower levels) - what happens if you set up a cohort of friends and then suddenly one or more aren't getting along anymore?  Heck, sometimes kids can't even agree on how close friendships are, my son had a friend last year who latched onto him hard - the other kid viewed my son as his best friend, but my son would consider our neighbor's son his bestie. Can you imagine parents trying to negotiate that, or schools trying to accommodate that? No thanks.


----------



## Frozen2014

siren0119 said:


> I know that sounds good on paper...but it's basically impossible to please everyone. There was literally no way for a school to manage trying to place kids in cohorts, ensure families stayed on the same cohort schedule, AND manage their friend circles. Nevermind the fact that friend connections can change on a dime (especially at the lower levels) - what happens if you set up a cohort of friends and then suddenly one or more aren't getting along anymore?  Heck, sometimes kids can't even agree on how close friendships are, my son had a friend last year who latched onto him hard - the other kid viewed my son as his best friend, but my son would consider our neighbor's son his bestie. Can you imagine parents trying to negotiate that, or schools trying to accommodate that? No thanks.


Yeah ok...good point.


----------



## pigletto

siren0119 said:


> I know that sounds good on paper...but it's basically impossible to please everyone. There was literally no way for a school to manage trying to place kids in cohorts, ensure families stayed on the same cohort schedule, AND manage their friend circles. Nevermind the fact that friend connections can change on a dime (especially at the lower levels) - what happens if you set up a cohort of friends and then suddenly one or more aren't getting along anymore?  Heck, sometimes kids can't even agree on how close friendships are, my son had a friend last year who latched onto him hard - the other kid viewed my son as his best friend, but my son would consider our neighbor's son his bestie. Can you imagine parents trying to negotiate that, or schools trying to accommodate that? No thanks.



I agree, it totally sucks to be stuck in a class without your friends but I don‘t think it’s the schools job in any way to manage children’s social lives. That’s a parent job. I would hope that if there was a bullying situation they would change cohorts or groups but they are there to educate our kids and navigate this nightmare of a pandemic, I think that’s more than enough .


----------



## hdrolfe

Dropped him off for day 2 this morning, we'll see if it goes better! He has asked to do online learning instead of in class, or to switch to the non-immersion class since his friends are all there (at least the ones he plays with now). I don't think they will let him switch like that though, and I worry the teacher for French in that class (they do still get one block of French) is one he has had in the past and not done well with. It's so hard...I had sent a message to the principal before school started about his nemesis, and his friends, but because they split them along the immersion/non line, it wouldn't have mattered. He has 20 kids in his class, which is only a few less than last year, and surprised me since I know of at least 4 or 5 who are doing the at home version instead. I told him to give it to the weekend and we can have a conversation about it when he's not so tired. 

I am very glad the boy he always gets into it with is in the other class, but they have recess together as the two classes mix then. So the cohort is 40 I guess? both classes together. 

He went out with a friend yesterday evening, they got stuck in a rain storm and ended up at the other boy's house. He had a lot of fun and really enjoyed the time with his friend. Who is in the other class. I am just glad he has one friend he enjoys spending time with.


----------



## Iralyn

Frozen2014 said:


> Yeah ok...good point.



On this end of things, class lists have changed so many times (not a normal thing at my school) so while friendship groupings were likely a consideration in June or whenever the initial lists were made, things have changed with families choosing remote (or homeschool) and classes collapsed and/or needing to even out numbers.  Sometimes the person rejigging the classes wasn't even familiar with the kids and aware of friendships.


----------



## pigletto

wdwmom3 said:


> Medical experts are now saying that the risk of transmission through surfaces is actually very low. Because your child should be the only one touching their binders it shouldn’t be an issue.
> 
> Also I know everyone I has to do what makes them comfy, but I heard an interesting interview yesterday.   It had to do around kids being anxious about going back to school.  And it was mentioned that yes it’s a good idea to have them remove their shoes and wash their hands as soon as they get home.  But they brought up about how we should be careful about doing things like having a child have a shower as soon as they get home. For  a lot of kids it could lead to more anxiety because it would be like telling them everyday that they are in an unsafe place full of germs that need to be washed away as soon as they get home.  It could cause more anxiety about spending time in the class room.  I had not thought of this before.  But it makes sense.  Even if we are nervous about how safe it is for our kids, we need to be careful with what we share with our kids.  If we tell them school will be safe they will be more relaxed.  If we talk about how unsafe it is, it could stress them out.


I think it’s probably all in the way we present it . We don’t have to be alarmist and weird about it but the reality is that we are sending them back to school in a pandemic. It’s still serious stuff. Scare them ? No way. But saying “it’s a good idea if we shower right after school ”  or something equally boring. They are going to hear about it at school . Control the message at home , because there will be parents scaring their kids and they will need to hear our thoughts from our mouths to make sense of it.  I’m pretty sure “ewwwww you have Covid !!” will be the new school yard insult this year . So I would choose to use plain language and age appropriate info. But asking them to shower will probably be just one of a million messages they get about this stuff in a day unfortunately.


----------



## Aladora

DS had his first day yesterday, although it was really just a 90 minute assembly with only other grade 10's. Today is the first full day and he is all kitted out in his #1 dress uniform! This morning's tie tying session made me glad we decided to wake up a bit early today!


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

For washing of the masks in regular laundry, I use a lingerie mesh bag and put them in there so they don't get all tangled with everything else.  I wash them in the delicate cycle with clothes that go in there too.

For quick washes during the week, I use a tupperware-type container and fill it with laundry soap water and let them soak for an hour, rinse and then air dry.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

Anyone have kids in the school band?

DD's teacher sent an email that the woodwind instruments (i.e., Saxophone, Clarinet) need to have a bag cover for the whole instrument.  You can make them from a pillow case, but I just said eff it and bought one LOL:


----------



## wdwmom3

pigletto said:


> I think it’s probably all in the way we present it . We don’t have to be alarmist and weird about it but the reality is that we are sending them back to school in a pandemic. It’s still serious stuff. Scare them ? No way. But saying “it’s a good idea if we shower right after school ”  or something equally boring. They are going to hear about it at school . Control the message at home , because there will be parents scaring their kids and they will need to hear our thoughts from our mouths to make sense of it.  I’m pretty sure “ewwwww you have Covid !!” will be the new school yard insult this year . So I would choose to use plain language and age appropriate info. But asking them to shower will probably be just one of a million messages they get about this stuff in a day unfortunately.



Agree!! And every kid is different. I don’t think my son would take being told to go have a shower in any way (except it would interrupt Xbox time lol).  But I could see how some kids could, especially depending on how it’s presented to the kids.  I haven’t decided what we will do, but if we want him to have a shower I would probably frame it around being sweaty from wearing a mask all day, and would make everyone “feel” better.  He already sees his sister go have a shower as soon she gets home from work.  So its kind of “normal”.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

DD has been coming home and showering after school just due to being so hot in class, plus the mask!


----------



## Aladora

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> Anyone have kids in the school band?
> 
> DD's teacher sent an email that the woodwind instruments (i.e., Saxophone, Clarinet) need to have a bag cover for the whole instrument.  You can make them from a pillow case, but I just said eff it and bought one LOL:
> View attachment 525068



DS is taking band this year as his arts elective and we just got a long email about this! Copy/paste of the relevant bits from the email:



> Facilities
> 
> In order to reduce the number of students using any of our spaces, we are taking full advantage of the space provided by the Music Centre. Mr. T will be teaching his classes in the main downstairs Band Room, while Mr. G’s classes will take place in the upstairs Rehearsal Room. Entrance and exit pathways have been clearly marked to ensure a safe flow of traffic. Individual instrument storage spaces will be provided in each room - students are asked to store their instruments in the Music Centre at all times, rather than in their lockers or homeforms. Instruments can be picked up at the end of the day for practicing as needed.
> 
> Physical Distancing
> 
> While students will be playing with others in their own learning group, the size of the Band Room also allows for each student to remain at least 2m from others while playing their instruments. All students will face the same direction.
> 
> Plexiglass Partitions
> 
> Our amazing Maintenance Team has built a number of rolling plexiglass barriers, which are installed between teachers and students.
> 
> Face Masks
> 
> We are asking each Band student who plays a brass or woodwind instrument to provide a second face mask, in addition to the one they have been asked to wear in hallways and common areas at school.* **
> 
> This “band mask” will have a small vertical slit cut at mouth level for inserting the mouthpiece, and is for use during Band class only. Please ensure that this mask is laundered regularly.
> 
> *Bass and percussion students may wear their regular school face masks, as mouthpiece slits are not required.
> 
> **Specialized face masks will be provided by GNS for flute players
> 
> Bell Covers
> 
> We have purchased a set of bell covers to mitigate emissions from brass and woodwind instruments (except flutes). Each student will receive a bell cover to be installed on their instrument, which can stay in place while not in use. Please ensure that this bell cover is laundered regularly.
> 
> Absorbent Pads
> 
> At the beginning of each class, students who play an instrument with a water key (“spit valve”) will be provided with a disposable absorbent pad on which to collect any droplets or excess moisture. These pads are to be discarded after each use.



DS is switching from Viola to Bass so none of this really applies to us, but yeah it is a lot to take in!


----------



## Frozen2014

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> Anyone have kids in the school band?
> 
> DD's teacher sent an email that the woodwind instruments (i.e., Saxophone, Clarinet) need to have a bag cover for the whole instrument.  You can make them from a pillow case, but I just said eff it and bought one LOL:


Yeah. DS took an extra credit that usually is after school band for the year.  So now it's turned to theory (no playing for him).  Too bad as those classes are not what they signed up for.


----------



## bankr63

Iralyn said:


> kids were using their chromebooks yesterday.


I'm surprised you have Chromebooks to use!  The board sent all of DW's class set home with students last year; it took several years to requisition the full class set she had.  This year she is starting with her own Chromebook and the one other unit that was actually returned to the school.  Unfortunately there is more than one student in her class on an IEP with accommodation for laptop.  One more issue to deal with.


----------



## hdrolfe

bankr63 said:


> I'm surprised you have Chromebooks to use!  The board sent all of DW's class set home with students last year; it took several years to requisition the full class set she had.  This year she is starting with her own Chromebook and the one other unit that was actually returned to the school.  Unfortunately there is more than one student in her class on an IEP with accommodation for laptop.  One more issue to deal with.



I know it was always an issue for my son to be able to use one in class and he had begged me to buy him one last year, my parent's caved and got him one for Christmas. I guess he's lucky he has it then, he brings it back and forth each day as they don't have enough places to charge them up in the class room. I know they got sent home in April/May for kids to use, they tried to give us one. I would assume people sent them back! Unless they are doing online learning, but that isn't everyone!


----------



## Iralyn

bankr63 said:


> I'm surprised you have Chromebooks to use!  The board sent all of DW's class set home with students last year; it took several years to requisition the full class set she had.  This year she is starting with her own Chromebook and the one other unit that was actually returned to the school.  Unfortunately there is more than one student in her class on an IEP with accommodation for laptop.  One more issue to deal with.



We are a 1:1 school for grade 4-8 meaning that every student in those grades has a chromebook.  When they were sent home, almost all were returned as required in June.  Because we have lower numbers in the building we still have enough for all the kids.  Fortunate I know as I've heard many other stories like your wife's.  We have been directed to work ASAP on having the kids able to use the tech they will need if we end up virtual again.


----------



## siren0119

Iralyn said:


> We are a 1:1 school for grade 4-8 meaning that every student in those grades has a chromebook.  When they were sent home, almost all were returned as required in June.  Because we have lower numbers in the building we still have enough for all the kids.  Fortunate I know as I've heard many other stories like your wife's.  We have been directed to work ASAP on having the kids able to use the tech they will need if we end up virtual again.



Our school system ended up getting a grant to go 1:1 tech a while back, we were SO lucky that they had implemented chromebooks for every student (K-5 had access to them in school only, 6-12 brought them home each day) two years ago. Other schools in our area are having huge issues getting orders delivered right now.


----------



## Best_Vacation_EVER!

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> Anyone have kids in the school band?



Our DS will be doing extra credit band this year.    They are doing it through a combo of synchronous and asynchronous online (it will be theory, practice, solo and group performance online.)   I was pretty impressed with the package the teacher sent out.


----------



## star72232

dawnelda said:


> You must be with the same garbage school board as I am (WRDSB). I agree with what you say about their emails containing no actual information. All I know so far is that DD's backpack should contain only lunch and 2 water bottles. Not much reason to inspire confidence in parents.



WRDSB is driving me nuts.  I have 4 kids in 3 different WRDSB schools.  Emails are useless.  MDS went to class today (he's in a congregated special ed class for gifted students).  They forgot that his bus isn't a special bus (the class is in our home school).  Until I contacted them, they didn't realize that there wasn't a bus for him.  He's my 3rd kid in that class - they know that some of the kids aren't out of area!  Fortunately we can get him to school, but if we hadn't been able to, he'd have been out of luck.  Especially because they didn't tell us he'd be starting before the other kids in the school until Monday night. 

DD just found out her classes today (she starts tomorrow).  One of them (her ONLY optional class this year, she's IB) isn't one of the choices she gave last year.  They put her in Business.  She had Music, World History or Physics as her choices.  They told her that her only other option is a Fast Forward class (not really an option for an IB kid).  

The bathroom procedure at my ODS school (Preston HS) is nuts.  The kids have to wash their hands before they leave the classroom.  Then when they get into the bathroom.  Then after they use the bathroom.  And again when they get back to their classroom.

Does that seem excessive to anyone else?  Or am I just a germy gross person?


----------



## scrappinginontario

star72232 said:


> The bathroom procedure at my ODS school (Preston HS) is nuts.  The kids have to wash their hands before they leave the classroom.  Then when they get into the bathroom.  Then after they use the bathroom.  And again when they get back to their classroom.
> 
> Does that seem excessive to anyone else?  Or am I just a germy gross person?


This doesn't seem obsessive to me because each child is touching their desk with their hands.  The same desk where they eat snacks and lunch without a mask on.

When they go to the bathroom they first need to lock the stall and then unlock it afterwards so touching it at least twice.  Also, depending on the school the door to the bathroom may or may not be propped open so each child may need to touch that on the way in and the way out.  If a child is the type of person who puts their hands near their face, they are breathing on their hands even through their mask.  These same hands touch the doors mentioned above.

For these reasons i'm happy kids are required to sanitize their hands on the way out of the classroom and then again on the way in.  It's for their safety as well as their schoolmates.

In my DD's school bathroom breaks are allowed during certain times each hour.  In her case the teacher has placed a piece of blue celophane on their clock between the '6 and the 9'  as my daughter described it.  If the long hand is in the blue they may ask to go to the bathroom.  This will be fine for her as she doesn't need to go often but I'm guessing could be a challenge for others.  Makes sense though.  Not complaining, just sharing how things are being done at her school.


----------



## wdwmom3

star72232 said:


> WRDSB is driving me nuts.  I have 4 kids in 3 different WRDSB schools.  Emails are useless.  MDS went to class today (he's in a congregated special ed class for gifted students).  They forgot that his bus isn't a special bus (the class is in our home school).  Until I contacted them, they didn't realize that there wasn't a bus for him.  He's my 3rd kid in that class - they know that some of the kids aren't out of area!  Fortunately we can get him to school, but if we hadn't been able to, he'd have been out of luck.  Especially because they didn't tell us he'd be starting before the other kids in the school until Monday night.
> 
> DD just found out her classes today (she starts tomorrow).  One of them (her ONLY optional class this year, she's IB) isn't one of the choices she gave last year.  They put her in Business.  She had Music, World History or Physics as her choices.  They told her that her only other option is a Fast Forward class (not really an option for an IB kid).
> 
> The bathroom procedure at my ODS school (Preston HS) is nuts.  The kids have to wash their hands before they leave the classroom.  Then when they get into the bathroom.  Then after they use the bathroom.  And again when they get back to their classroom.
> 
> Does that seem excessive to anyone else?  Or am I just a germy gross person?



One of my DDs friends foind our they only enrolled her in 4 university level courses. She needs 6 to go to University next year and her guidance is not being helpful. Also another friend didn’t get put in gr12 English which she needs to graduate .


----------



## quandrea

wdwmom3 said:


> One of my DDs friends foind our they only enrolled her in 4 university level courses. She needs 6 to go to University next year and her guidance is not being helpful. Also another friend didn’t get put in gr12 English which she needs to graduate .


Ask for e learning through the Ontario e learning consortium. It’s called Prism. If the school can’t fill her timetable, they must, by law allow her to pursue studies another way. There is also the Independent Learning Centre through TVO. The school MUST accommodate her. Have the student demand service tomorrow. This is crazy. We are mid September.


----------



## wdwmom3

quandrea said:


> Ask for e learning through the Ontario e learning consortium. It’s called Prism. If the school can’t fill her timetable, they must, by law allow her to pursue studies another way. There is also the Independent Learning Centre through TVO. The school MUST accommodate her. Have the student demand service tomorrow. This is crazy. We are mid September.



Well it’s not my kid. I’m going to assume her parents are dealing with it. But I did mention if it was her I would be on the phone to the principal and if they didn’t get it figured out my next call would be the school board.

Tou are right it’s crazy it’s mid September.  And I don’t like ford, but you can’t blame the mess in high schools on them.  The Boards have known about a hybrid model for a couple months that is plenty of time to figure this stuff out.  Lots of businesses including my own work had to adapt and change things with zero notice.  The fact that schools still can’t figure things out if disgusting.


----------



## quandrea

[


wdwmom3 said:


> Well it’s not my kid. I’m going to assume her parents are dealing with it. But I did mention if it was her I would be on the phone to the principal and if they didn’t get it figured out my next call would be the school board.
> 
> Tou are right it’s crazy it’s mid September.  And I don’t like ford, but you can’t blame the mess in high schools on them.  The Boards have known about a hybrid model for a couple months that is plenty of time to figure this stuff out.  Lots of businesses including my own work had to adapt and change things with zero notice.  The fact that schools still can’t figure things out if disgusting.


Perhaps because I’m a teacher by profession that this all makes me irrationally angry. If a kid doesn’t have a well informed parent advocate, he or she might really have problems with all kinds of things—access, timetabling, etc. It shouldn’t be that way. It shouldn’t be a fight. I think back to my high school days. My parents didn’t need to get involved. I’ve had to push and advocate repeatedly for my daughter and she only spend a year and a half in school. If I was not informed, she’d have missed out on several opportunities.


----------



## star72232

quandrea said:


> Ask for e learning through the Ontario e learning consortium. It’s called Prism. If the school can’t fill her timetable, they must, by law allow her to pursue studies another way. There is also the Independent Learning Centre through TVO. The school MUST accommodate her. Have the student demand service tomorrow. This is crazy. We are mid September.



I actually found the ILC information earlier and DD picked a few classes she would rather take. She has a meeting with guidance tomorrow at 11:30.  Hopefully they’ll allow her to drop business and take an online class. Too bad that screws up her carpool.


----------



## quandrea

star72232 said:


> I actually found the ILC information earlier and DD picked a few classes she would rather take. She has a meeting with guidance tomorrow at 11:30.  Hopefully they’ll allow her to drop business and take an online class. Too bad that screws up her carpool.


You’ll really have to fight for it, I expect. Be prepared to step in. You may get the line it’s for students who are ill, a homeschooler or behaviour problems. All untrue. Don’t take no for an answer if those courses suit her better.

Prism also will have pretty much every course that is offered. The guidance counsellor has the list and can check the computer system in real time. That actually might be the better option for your daughter. Have her ask for those by name.

Let me know how it works out. 


ETA. My dd is enjoying her ILC classes so far.


----------



## alohamom

I just wanted to jump in here and tell all of you that I feel for you in this situation and that I am in awe of all of you.

Parents who are concerned enough about their children's education to discuss it here are *great parents.*

My kids are basically though the system (son in last year of University to become an AI code programmer and daughter who just finished her Masters in linguistics and is applying this fall for her PhD - yes, I am bragging a bit LOL)
I was/had to be their advocate all the way through. Although I was seen as a helicopter mom, I made sure they attempted to deal with a situation first, or we did it together and as a last resort I got involved.

I cannot even imagine the stress you are all going through, the unknowns and the red tape. Just keep swimming folks....


----------



## quandrea

alohamom said:


> I just wanted to jump in here and tell all of you that I feel for you in this situation and that I am in awe of all of you.
> 
> Parents who are concerned enough about their children's education to discuss it here are *great parents.*
> 
> My kids are basically though the system (son in last year of University to become an AI code programmer and daughter who just finished her Masters in linguistics and is applying this fall for her PhD - yes, I am bragging a bit LOL)
> I was had to be their advocate all the way through. Although I was seen as a helicopter mom, I made sure they attempted to deal with a situation first, or we did it together and as a last resort I got involved.
> 
> I cannot even imagine the stress you all going through, the unknowns and the red tape. Just keep swimming folks....


Yep, first line of attack was always dd speaking up first. I’d hoped it would be a way of helping her learn to self advocate. Unfortunately she was often met with one word emails in response to questions—no.


----------



## star72232

quandrea said:


> You’ll really have to fight for it, I expect. Be prepared to step in. You may get the line it’s for students who are ill, a homeschooler or behaviour problems. All untrue. Don’t take no for an answer if those courses suit her better.
> 
> Prism also will have pretty much every course that is offered. The guidance counsellor has the list and can check the computer system in real time. That actually might be the better option for your daughter. Have her ask for those by name.
> 
> Let me know how it works out.
> 
> 
> ETA. My dd is enjoying her ILC classes so far.



Thanks, she's looking at the Prism information right now. She picked a few ILC courses yesterday that she would be interested in.  She's also going to ask about doing a Gr. 11 or 12 class in school instead of them only allowing her to pick from Gr. 10 classes.  She's a great student who's been in enrichment since kindergarten - she can handle a course from a higher grade.

I'm curious how much they will fight her on this.  She's certainly capable of doing a 100% online course.  During the early phase of lock down she did an online Intro to Psychology course from Yale.  She's never had an issue with staying focused.  We'll see how this goes.


----------



## quandrea

star72232 said:


> Thanks, she's looking at the Prism information right now. She picked a few ILC courses yesterday that she would be interested in.  She's also going to ask about doing a Gr. 11 or 12 class in school instead of them only allowing her to pick from Gr. 10 classes.  She's a great student who's been in enrichment since kindergarten - she can handle a course from a higher grade.
> 
> I'm curious how much they will fight her on this.  She's certainly capable of doing a 100% online course.  During the early phase of lock down she did an online Intro to Psychology course from Yale.  She's never had an issue with staying focused.  We'll see how this goes.


Let me know how it works out. My daughter has been able to take courses all over the map. She was homeschooled and arrived to Hs ahead. Took grade eleven math in grade nine, grade ten was all grade eleven courses but one.  It doesn’t have to be one size fits all.


----------



## pigletto

System wide outage of D2L Brightspace for the province right now. No known time frame for when it will be back up. DS16 just texted to see if we had any plans this weekend because he “will need to do all the work at home.”
Ok.. I’m really trying to be patient and understanding, and I get that this is really hard . But why would they not still be able to teach today’s lessons for the in class cohorts ? He’s there. Surely there is a way to teach that doesn’t need D2L? What am I missing ?


----------



## bankr63

star72232 said:


> The bathroom procedure at my ODS school (Preston HS) is nuts.  The kids have to wash their hands before they leave the classroom.  Then when they get into the bathroom.  Then after they use the bathroom.  And again when they get back to their classroom.


Waiting to see how this one plays out in DW's school.  No sinks in classrooms, but perhaps a shot of hand sanitizer? (They don't have any yet, but they have yet to receive most of their PPE supplies).  There is no hot water in the washrooms at her school, so cold water at one of the two sinks (both with manual turn handle) not to mention the potential issue of regular washing with lead contaminated water. 
Only one kid from the class can go at one time and must sign in and out of classroom with exact time.  What is odd is that there are 8 classrooms on the floor sharing the same bathroom, and no way of policing how many kids are actually in there.  Can see this becoming an issue as kids rendezvous with friends from other classes in the bathroom ("meet me at 10:30...")

Edit: changed "any" of to "most" of PPE, they do have the sanitizer dispensers for the main doors.  Also on yesterday's post I said two Chromebooks, I was wrong.  There are three for the class of 23 students, including the 1 for the teacher.


----------



## FigmentSpark

pigletto said:


> System wide outage of D2L Brightspace for the province right now. No known time frame for when it will be back up. DS16 just texted to see if we had any plans this weekend because he “will need to do all the work at home.”
> Ok.. I’m really trying to be patient and understanding, and I get that this is really hard . But why would they not still be able to teach today’s lessons for the in class cohorts ? He’s there. Surely there is a way to teach that doesn’t need D2L? What am I missing ?


Did things work out?  I had heard about the D2L outage, but my DS's afternoon class was on Google, so he wasn't affected.  I would have also assumed that the teacher was teaching in-class, but maybe your son meant that all the resources were on D2L and he had to wait to get access?


----------



## pigletto

FigmentSpark said:


> Did things work out?  I had heard about the D2L outage, but my DS's afternoon class was on Google, so he wasn't affected.  I would have also assumed that the teacher was teaching in-class, but maybe your son meant that all the resources were on D2L and he had to wait to get access?


It went back up at the end of the day so he will have some homework this weekend but nothing too crazy. The lessons are all online for this course so there was nothing prepared. They aren’t allowed to give handouts right now . My husband asked if the blackboard was broken or there was a chalk shortage. My son told us there was no blackboard and called us dinosaurs.


----------



## hdrolfe

pigletto said:


> It went back up at the end of the day so he will have some homework this weekend but nothing too crazy. The lessons are all online for this course so there was nothing prepared. They aren’t allowed to give handouts right now . My husband asked if the blackboard was broken or there was a chalk shortage. My son told us there was no blackboard and called us dinosaurs.



My kiddo says no blackboards in his classes, only smartboards! I do feel like a dinosaur


----------



## MamaLema

Madame said:


> They simply don’t care.  They are betting on kids not getting really sick & do NOT care about the adults in the buildings.
> View attachment 522881


I am a PS teacher. Today I was informed a 3 year old in my classroom tested positive. We were sent home and I’ll be spending the next 14 long and boring days in a bedroom away from my family.


----------



## AngelDisney

MamaLema said:


> I am a PS teacher. Today I was informed a 3 year old in my classroom tested positive. We were sent home and I’ll be spending the next 14 long and boring days in a bedroom away from my family.


This is what I have been worrying about. Do you have to do distance teaching during this period? Thank goodness high school students must wear masks at school! We were told that there’s no eating in classroom but sipping of only water is allowed. However, under special circumstances, students can remove their masks to take snack in class, one at a time. I think I will notify students to try to eat before coming to class and leave school for lunch right after class. My room has poor ventilation and I will explain why it’s not a good idea to snack in my room. TDSB has postponed HS start date to September 17. Staffing just collapsed some courses and reallocated some teachers in the last two days. Hopefully we will have our firm timetables on Monday. I can’t even plan my courses since I don’t know what I will be teaching in Quad 1. I feel sorry for the students. With 45 classes being cancelled in my school due to students opted for virtual school, some students would have issues with taking their desired courses this year. Guidance would help them seek other options. Some of our students thought virtual school was like distance learning with their day school teachers last semester and opted in without realizing that it was separate from their day school. They are allowed to change back to in-school learning in Quad 2 two weeks before it starts based on space availability. Hope everyone goes through this school year safely despite all the challenges!


----------



## damo

MamaLema said:


> I am a PS teacher. Today I was informed a 3 year old in my classroom tested positive. We were sent home and I’ll be spending the next 14 long and boring days in a bedroom away from my family.



Was the 3 year old showing symptoms?  Wonder if there was someone else in the family that was sick and the whole family got tested or why the 3 year old was tested.


----------



## MamaLema

damo said:


> Was the 3 year old showing symptoms?  Wonder if there was someone else in the family that was sick and the whole family got tested or why the 3 year old was tested.


No symptoms during the day but developed fever in the evening so they decided to go.  So far no symptoms for the parents.


----------



## Silvermist999

AngelDisney said:


> This is what I have been worrying about. Do you have to do distance teaching during this period? Thank goodness high school students must wear masks at school! We were told that there’s no eating in classroom but sipping of only water is allowed. However, under special circumstances, students can remove their masks to take snack in class, one at a time. I think I will notify students to try to eat before coming to class and leave school for lunch right after class. My room has poor ventilation and I will explain why it’s not a good idea to snack in my room. TDSB has postponed HS start date to September 17. Staffing just collapsed some courses and reallocated some teachers in the last two days. Hopefully we will have our firm timetables on Monday. I can’t even plan my courses since I don’t know what I will be teaching in Quad 1. I feel sorry for the students. With 45 classes being cancelled in my school due to students opted for virtual school, some students would have issues with taking their desired courses this year. Guidance would help them seek other options. Some of our students thought virtual school was like distance learning with their day school teachers last semester and opted in without realizing that it was separate from their day school. They are allowed to change back to in-school learning in Quad 2 two weeks before it starts *based on space availability*. Hope everyone goes through this school year safely despite all the challenges!



We were told by our board that switching from in person learning to virtual or vice versa would be possible for everyone after quad 1. But nothing was ever mentioned about spot availability. Now I’m thinking it will not be as simple as they made it sound, especially for those trying to move from virtual to in school where cohorts are limited to 15.

There is already a long waitlist to go onto virtual at our board . They could not accommodate all the requests and these were made before their final deadline.  My son has a friend on the waitlist. They would not process students to switch from virtual either - many who later found out and disliked the idea that the virtual school is a separate entity from their home school, with its own admin, guidance, principal  etc. with students all across the school board, .


----------



## damo

MamaLema said:


> No symptoms during the day but developed fever in the evening so they decided to go.  So far no symptoms for the parents.



Were the parents tested too?  Just wondering where the child would have got it.  I have a 3 year old grand-daughter who just started preschool, so the situation interests me.  She only has 4 kids in her class but it is still a concern.


----------



## Silvermist999

For those on here with kids/grandkids in Ontario schools, or day care,  I think this is a very useful site. I know I will be checking it often to be informed.

https://www.ontario.ca/page/covid-19-cases-schools-and-child-care-centres


----------



## MamaLema

damo said:


> Were the parents tested too?  Just wondering where the child would have got it.  I have a 3 year old grand-daughter who just started preschool, so the situation interests me.  She only has 4 kids in her class but it is still a concern.


Public Health is  in the process of contact tracing with the family. The parents said they tested their child and not themselves at the time and they went to test themselves after their child tested positive. We don’t know parents results yet.
Our room is 16 children with 2 teachers.

We spend an insane amount of time cleaning throughout the day. We try our best to distance them, 2 children per table divided by a line. Every child has a ziplock bag with their name on it that has supplies for them only. Window open all day.
I just hope no other children develop symptoms. I have a son in the high risk category. I had a little mental breakdown at the though of passing anything to him. He’s been through hell medically in his life. Waiting for results has been torture.


----------



## MamaLema

Silvermist999 said:


> For those on here with kids/grandkids in Ontario schools, or day care,  I think this is a very useful site. I know I will be checking it often to be informed.
> 
> https://www.ontario.ca/page/covid-19-cases-schools-and-child-care-centres


This is great info. Thank you for sharing.


----------



## AngelDisney

Silvermist999 said:


> We were told by our board that switching from in person learning to virtual or vice versa would be possible for everyone after quad 1. But nothing was ever mentioned about spot availability. Now I’m thinking it will not be as simple as they made it sound, especially for those trying to move from virtual to in school where cohorts are limited to 15.
> 
> There is already a long waitlist to go onto virtual at our board . They could not accommodate all the requests and these were made before their final deadline.  My son has a friend on the waitlist. They would not process students to switch from virtual either - many who later found out and disliked the idea that the virtual school is a separate entity from their home school, with its own admin, guidance, principal  etc. with students all across the school board, .


I said it was based on availability because if you want to add a teacher for additional classes, you need to first have enough students to open one course. Then two courses to fit into the timetables of all added students. Then hire a teacher that has the qualifications to teach the two courses. With students demand all over the place, I don’t see all students who prefer to go back to in-school learning can be accommodated all at once. Also in this case, newly added classes would probably be taught be long-term occasional teachers as teachers have contract by semesters unless it’s a full year school. One quad is half a semester and you cannot hire a contracted teacher this way. So it would not be a regular teacher from day school teaching the new classes.


----------



## OnceUponATime15

damo said:


> Were the parents tested too?  Just wondering where the child would have got it.  I have a 3 year old grand-daughter who just started preschool, so the situation interests me.  She only has 4 kids in her class but it is still a concern.



I understand your concerns, I can add a bit to the conversation based on my own experience. I am an RECE who works in Regionally operated childcare in a GTA municipality.  

Our seven centres have operated throughout the pandemic providing emergency 24/7 care for frontline workers, as of July 2nd we have reverted back to regular childcare and early learning programs with new regulations on ratios, cohorts, screening, cleaning and best practices.

As another poster has said the amount of cleaning being done in childcare centres at the oversight of our local public health department and very strict Ministry of Ed guidelines is more then abundant.
Our screening process is very strict and unforgiving.  I’ve seen children that I suspect are cutting teeth and running a low grade fever - refused entry or sent home for further investigation by the family physician.  Staff are held to the same standards, if we feel unwell it is on us to remain home. 

Since our centres reopened on March 30th through today - we have not had a single positive covid case across all seven centres. Staff have been tested, as well as children where their own doctors chose to err on the side of caution.  
That said.. it can happen at any time - we are only too aware of what can and does happen.  We feel we are doing our part (well) where we feel uncertain is around what our families are exposed to away from our centres and what they may inadvertently expose their kids and ours to as our world returns to more normalcy or becomes overwhelmed with covid fatigue, leading to choices that may not be in the interest of the greater good. 

We continue to do our best... and rely on others to do their part.


----------



## bababear_50

*MamaLema*

Hi Hon
I just wanted to drop by and say I am so sorry this is happening to you.
So many thoughts went through my mind,does she have family that needs her?,,does she have enough supplies and food for a quarantine?,,does she have family needs/responsibilities that she usually meets and is there someone else to do those things. Is her home big enough to quarantine from the rest of the family? Does she have a family doctor that is readily available to her. Is she losing all her sick days?
I know my school staff would be like a team crowding around the person to make sure the staff member had all the things she/he needed.
I am not sure where you live but I am in Mississauga and if I can be of any help please just PM me.
Rest well and know many people care about you.
YOU WILL GET THROUGH THIS!!!!!!
GIANT HUGS
Mel


----------



## damo

OnceUponATime15 said:


> I understand your concerns, I can add a bit to the conversation based on my own experience. I am an RECE who works in Regionally operated childcare in a GTA municipality.
> 
> Our seven centres have operated throughout the pandemic providing emergency 24/7 care for frontline workers, as of July 2nd we have reverted back to regular childcare and early learning programs with new regulations on ratios, cohorts, screening, cleaning and best practices.
> 
> As another poster has said the amount of cleaning being done in childcare centres at the oversight of our local public health department and very strict Ministry of Ed guidelines is more then abundant.
> Our screening process is very strict and unforgiving.  I’ve seen children that I suspect are cutting teeth and running a low grade fever - refused entry or sent home for further investigation by the family physician.  Staff are held to the same standards, if we feel unwell it is on us to remain home.
> 
> Since our centres reopened on March 30th through today - we have not had a single positive covid case across all seven centres. Staff have been tested, as well as children where their own doctors chose to err on the side of caution.
> That said.. it can happen at any time - we are only too aware of what can and does happen.  We feel we are doing our part (well) where we feel uncertain is around what our families are exposed to away from our centres and what they may inadvertently expose their kids and ours to as our world returns to more normalcy or becomes overwhelmed with covid fatigue, leading to choices that may not be in the interest of the greater good.
> 
> We continue to do our best... and rely on others to do their part.




I know her little school is doing screening.  They asked her how she was feeling the other day as she was being dropped off and she replied, "I just sneezed once at home."  She's a funny bunny.


----------



## OnceUponATime15

damo said:


> I know her little school is doing screening.  They asked her how she was feeling the other day as she was being dropped off and she replied, "I just sneezed once at home."  She's a funny bunny.



My little grands are the same way 

At the beginning my GD had my GS convinced that if he went outside of the house - the virus could (read would) make him die... he was convinced she was correct. Took allot of patience & perseverance to get him outside and enjoying it.  

Oh those out of the mouths of babes moments! lol


----------



## MoreTravels

AngelDisney said:


> I said it was based on availability because if you want to add a teacher for additional classes, you need to first have enough students to open one course. Then two courses to fit into the timetables of all added students. Then hire a teacher that has the qualifications to teach the two courses. With students demand all over the place, I don’t see all students who prefer to go back to in-school learning can be accommodated all at once. Also in this case, newly added classes would probably be taught be long-term occasional teachers as teachers have contract by semesters unless it’s a full year school. One quad is half a semester and you cannot hire a contracted teacher this way. So it would not be a regular teacher from day school teaching the new classes.



This is how some independent schools handle the in-person and virtual students.... they group them in the same class. Let's say you have a cap of 24 students per class. Out of those students, about 1/3 of them will not feel comfortable coming in. So you will have about 16 students in classroom and 8 at home. All the classes are simultaneously livestreamed on Zoom. The two groups of students can see each other virtually and participate. The teachers talk to the camera at the rear of classroom and live audience at the same time. If any student is feeling unwell that day or even the teacher, then they just have to phone in the school and switch instantaneously to virtual learning for those 14 days. 

This allows:
1. Smaller class size, cap at full size, but practically about 1/3 less
2. Students not to miss a single day of class regardless their quarantine status
3. Less fear from parents that they have no option but to send a sick kid back to school

My kid's class currently has 10 students... another 6 stay home. They say hi to each other and eat lunch virtually together. So the number can be between 1 to 16 students throughout the school year. The teachers will be hired for the full year and there is no need for staffing change.


----------



## Silvermist999

MoreTravels said:


> This is how some independent schools handle the in-person and virtual students.... they group them in the same class. Let's say you have a cap of 24 students per class. Out of those students, about 1/3 of them will not feel comfortable coming in. So you will have about 16 students in classroom and 8 at home. All the classes are simultaneously livestreamed on Zoom. The two groups of students can see each other virtually and participate. The teachers talk to the camera at the rear of classroom and live audience at the same time. If any student is feeling unwell that day or even the teacher, then they just have to phone in the school and switch instantaneously to virtual learning for those 14 days.
> 
> This allows:
> 1. Smaller class size, cap at full size, but practically about 1/3 less
> 2. Students not to miss a single day of class regardless their quarantine status
> 3. Less fear from parents that they have no option but to send a sick kid back to school
> 
> My kid's class currently has 10 students... another 6 stay home. They say hi to each other and eat lunch virtually together. So the number can be between 1 to 16 students throughout the school year. The teachers will be hired for the full year and there is no need for staffing change.



This is exactly how everyone thought the virtual classes would be run in Ontario public secondary schools. Instead the boards were instructed to create separate virtual schools, comprised of students from various schools across the board.

As an example, our board has created three virtual elementary schools each with its own principal, vice principals , guidance, teaching staff, admin, etc. and one virtual secondary school, also with its own separate staff.  Not only does this create obvious issues with staffing but the children in the virtual schools are isolated from their friends who have chosen in person classes.


----------



## Frozen2014

MoreTravels said:


> This is how some independent schools handle the in-person and virtual students.... they group them in the same class. Let's say you have a cap of 24 students per class. Out of those students, about 1/3 of them will not feel comfortable coming in. So you will have about 16 students in classroom and 8 at home. All the classes are simultaneously livestreamed on Zoom. The two groups of students can see each other virtually and participate. The teachers talk to the camera at the rear of classroom and live audience at the same time. If any student is feeling unwell that day or even the teacher, then they just have to phone in the school and switch instantaneously to virtual learning for those 14 days.
> 
> This allows:
> 1. Smaller class size, cap at full size, but practically about 1/3 less
> 2. *Students not to miss a single day of class regardless their quarantine status*
> 3. Less fear from parents that they have no option but to send a sick kid back to school
> 
> My kid's class currently has 10 students... another 6 stay home. They say hi to each other and eat lunch virtually together. So the number can be between 1 to 16 students throughout the school year. The teachers will be hired for the full year and there is no need for staffing change.


This to me is a big thing.  My DD is in school where is class is in-class only.  I have to question what will happen if she gets a cold.  If its a nose cold, so prob not flagged as covid, the mask situation will be horrible with congestion or runny nose.  Does she stay home for the week until the cold is gone?

And if it is a cough (but just a cold), I'm sure they'll send her home.  And what if someone tests positive either in the class, or someone we know where just DD has to quarantine (i.e. not the entire class).  That would eliminate missing 2 weeks of school.


----------



## hdrolfe

Frozen2014 said:


> This to me is a big thing.  My DD is in school where is class is in-class only.  I have to question what will happen if she gets a cold.  If its a nose cold, so prob not flagged as covid, the mask situation will be horrible with congestion or runny nose.  Does she stay home for the week until the cold is gone?
> 
> And if it is a cough (but just a cold), I'm sure they'll send her home.  And what if someone tests positive either in the class, or someone we know where just DD has to quarantine (i.e. not the entire class).  That would eliminate missing 2 weeks of school.



We've been instructed that any type of illness, even mild, is stay home. I also wonder how it will work since I'd like him to keep on learning from home but how will he just switch over? Then of course he also wishes to do the online version now, and at first they said it would be possible to switch to online at any point but I don't think that's the case any more. The whole things is such a mess. I am glad he went for even a few days though, he has reconnected with a few friends who he spent time with yesterday (outside, and now playing minecraft together). 

I can't wait for this to be over... it feels endless.


----------



## FigmentSpark

MoreTravels said:


> This is how some independent schools handle the in-person and virtual students.... they group them in the same class. Let's say you have a cap of 24 students per class. Out of those students, about 1/3 of them will not feel comfortable coming in. So you will have about 16 students in classroom and 8 at home. All the classes are simultaneously livestreamed on Zoom. The two groups of students can see each other virtually and participate. The teachers talk to the camera at the rear of classroom and live audience at the same time. If any student is feeling unwell that day or even the teacher, then they just have to phone in the school and switch instantaneously to virtual learning for those 14 days.
> 
> This allows:
> 1. Smaller class size, cap at full size, but practically about 1/3 less
> 2. Students not to miss a single day of class regardless their quarantine status
> 3. Less fear from parents that they have no option but to send a sick kid back to school
> 
> My kid's class currently has 10 students... another 6 stay home. They say hi to each other and eat lunch virtually together. So the number can be between 1 to 16 students throughout the school year. The teachers will be hired for the full year and there is no need for staffing change.


This would be ideal, but I know with our board, they were already trying to lower the class sizes and the best way was to consolidate the virtual kids into wherever there was room, which might be a totally different school.  

You said about a 1/3 might go virtual, but our board found only about 15% went virtual, not necessarily from the same schools, so they did the consolidation thing to best use the teaching resources they had and not have to have cameras in every single classroom (also an investment).


----------



## scrappinginontario

Silvermist999 said:


> This is exactly how everyone thought the virtual classes would be run in Ontario public secondary schools. Instead the boards were instructed to create separate virtual schools, comprised of students from various schools across the board.
> 
> As an example, our board has created three virtual elementary schools each with its own principal, vice principals , guidance, teaching staff, admin, etc. and one virtual secondary school, also with its own separate staff.  Not only does this create obvious issues with staffing but the children in the virtual schools are isolated from their friends who have chosen in person classes.


Not everyone thought this way.  I’m in Ontario snd understood from early on that in our board the virtual students would not be part of their regular school or class.  Our board has created 6 separate virtual schools for our elementary students.

While it may be ideal that the teacher live stream their teaching so that both students at home and those in the class are ‘together’ it’s not always possible due to the physical limitations of the school.  Not all schools have the equipment or the wifi to support this.

In my daughter’s school approx 1/6 students chose virtual learning.  This allowed the school to use the additional room in the classrooms to get the recommended 1M distancing.  There will be 22 or 23 children in her 6/7 split when all attend together.  

The entire school and all portables are being used to capacity.  I truly don’t know what would happen if students learning virtually requested to return to the classroom as I’m not sure how they would accommodate all of those 100+ students plus maintain the distancing of those currently there unless some of them request to move to virtual.

This weighed into my decision as a parent when I chose the learning style we did.  I knew from early in August that I needed to be prepared to stay in whatever stream I chose for the entire year as there was no guarantee there would be room for her in the other stream should we choose to switch.


----------



## hdrolfe

So my son's school board had originally said the virtual kids would be "attached" to an in class teacher, so they'd be with their friends. They would get some kind of message at the start of the day on what to do and then could speak to a different teacher for help if necessary. Then more kids signed up for virtual than expected and the province said it had to be 225 minutes of synchronous learning. The original plan went out the window. The original idea would have made it easier to switch between online and in class for sure.


----------



## OnceUponATime15

scrappinginontario said:


> Not everyone thought this way.  I’m in Ontario snd understood from early on that in our board the virtual students would not be part of their regular school or class.  Our board has created 6 separate virtual schools for our elementary students.
> 
> While it may be ideal that the teacher live stream their teaching so that both students at home and those in the class are ‘together’ it’s not always possible due to the physical limitations of the school.  Not all schools have the equipment or the wifi to support this.
> 
> In my daughter’s school approx 1/6 students chose virtual learning.  This allowed the school to use the additional room in the classrooms to get the recommended 1M distancing.  There will be 22 or 23 children in her 6/7 split when all attend together.
> 
> The entire school and all portables are being used to capacity.  I truly don’t know what would happen if students learning virtually requested to return to the classroom as I’m not sure how they would accommodate all of those 100+ students plus maintain the distancing of those currently there unless some of them request to move to virtual.
> 
> This weighed into my decision as a parent when I chose the learning style we did.  I knew from early in August that I needed to be prepared to stay in whatever stream I chose for the entire year as there was no guarantee there would be room for her in the other stream should we choose to switch.



I believe we are in the same school district.  I watched my daughter struggle with her decision to send my sweet little grandkids back to school feeling unsure every step of the way.  She texted me early Friday with the surprising news that my GS who is going into grade two only has 15  children in his class & my littlest grand (GD) has 17 children in her grade one class. These numbers make their social distancing easier to achieve and we are grateful.  Their school has struggled with under enrollment for several years as many in the catchment area have opted for french immersion which is offered at a school three blocks away.  

We are waiting to see how those wanting to switch back to in class learning from virtual classes once the low in class numbers become known - impacts the current situation.


----------



## bookbabe626

I think the biggest misconception the public has is that having a third of the kids opt for virtual school will make in-person classes smaller.  That’s not the case.  The only reason in-person classes are any smaller in Toronto is that students are only attending every other day, so that half of each class is in Cohort A and half is in Cohort B.  The actual class cap is the same as pre-covid.

I’m a retired TDSB high school guidance counselor.  My school called me and asked me to work last week and this upcoming week because of all the changes.  We lost 16 teachers (about 1/3 of our staff) to surplus/virtual school on the Friday before Labour Day weekend, meaning 90 classes had to be collapsed, and pretty much the whole school had to be retimetabled.  This process usually takes about four to six weeks each spring.  Our poor VP is trying to get it done for Monday morning so teachers can find out what they’re teaching. 

Our priority with the students has been to get them two of the classes they actually picked in quad one, then guidance will have some breathing space to get their other six classes fixed/replaced (since a lot of one-off electives were cancelled).

And, to add to the confusion the board let kids swap back and forth between in-person and virtual all week.  And there‘s the usual influx of new registrations and incoming international (visa) students to find timetables for.

I’ve never been so glad to be retired.  I feel so sorry for teachers, students and parents having to deal with this chaos.


----------



## pigletto

bookbabe626 said:


> I think the biggest misconception the public has is that having a third of the kids opt for virtual school will make in-person classes smaller.  That’s not the case.  The only reason in-person classes are any smaller in Toronto is that students are only attending every other day, so that half of each class is in Cohort A and half is in Cohort B.  The actual class cap is the same as pre-covid.
> 
> I’m a retired TDSB high school guidance counselor.  My school called me and asked me to work last week and this upcoming week because of all the changes.  We lost 16 teachers (about 1/3 of our staff) to surplus/virtual school on the Friday before Labour Day weekend, meaning 90 classes had to be collapsed, and pretty much the whole school had to be retimetabled.  This process usually takes about four to six weeks each spring.  Our poor VP is trying to get it done for Monday morning so teachers can find out what they’re teaching.
> 
> Our priority with the students has been to get them two of the classes they actually picked in quad one, then guidance will have some breathing space to get their other six classes fixed/replaced (since a lot of one-off electives were cancelled).
> 
> And, to add to the confusion the board let kids swap back and forth between in-person and virtual all week.  And there‘s the usual influx of new registrations and incoming international (visa) students to find timetables for.
> 
> I’ve never been so glad to be retired.  I feel so sorry for teachers, students and parents having to deal with this chaos.


And this right here is why I believe every one working in a school right now deserves our patience and grace. There is so much going on behind the scenes and staff is scrambling to make it all work somehow. If you look at the comments section for our boards social media pages it’s just hundreds of people complaining and ripping into the schools and staff for every little thing under the sun. We have to give these people a break. So many of them are likely doing the best they can.


----------



## wdwmom3

March break ends today!!!


----------



## quandrea

wdwmom3 said:


> March break ends today!!!


Not everywhere. Peel just announced that online high school is delayed until September 22. Online elementary begins September 21.


----------



## Disneylover99

quandrea said:


> Not everywhere. Peel just announced that online high school is delayed until September 22. Online elementary begins September 21.


Toronto Board hasn’t started yet either.


----------



## wdwmom3

quandrea said:


> Not everywhere. Peel just announced that online high school is delayed until September 22. Online elementary begins September 21.



Yes I know.  But for us it has.  Who knows if it will last though.


----------



## MamaLema

bababear_50 said:


> *MamaLema*
> 
> Hi Hon
> I just wanted to drop by and say I am so sorry this is happening to you.
> So many thoughts went through my mind,does she have family that needs her?,,does she have enough supplies and food for a quarantine?,,does she have family needs/responsibilities that she usually meets and is there someone else to do those things. Is her home big enough to quarantine from the rest of the family? Does she have a family doctor that is readily available to her. Is she losing all her sick days?
> I know my school staff would be like a team crowding around the person to make sure the staff member had all the things she/he needed.
> I am not sure where you live but I am in Mississauga and if I can be of any help please just PM me.
> Rest well and know many people care about you.
> YOU WILL GET THROUGH THIS!!!!!!
> GIANT HUGS
> Mel
> View attachment 525539


I have been on the Dis for 16 years. I have never teared up reading any post until now. Thank you for your beautiful words and kind heart. I have banished myself to the basement and I’m very lucky to have a caring family and not worry about groceries, etc God bless you


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

We are starting week 2 of school here in NS. First week was great. I am also back in the office this week, which I am actually enjoying.   DD's sports are ramping up at the end of the month though, so the weeks will start to fly by again with routine.

It will be Christmas before we know it LOL


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

The start of the school year for my 3 seemed to go smoothly last week. My youngest DS is in Grade 3 and he has 17 kids in his class. My DD is in Grade 5 and has 23 in her class and my oldest DS is in Grade 8 and he has 24. They have to use hand sanitizer when the enter or exit both the classroom and the school. At lunch they can use the sink in the classroom to wash their hands or wait in a socially distanced line to wash them in the washroom. Recess and lunch breaks are staggered so that only 1/3 of the school is out at one time. They also have the field and pavement marked off with lines into a big section for each class. A class can only play in their own section. They even have walkways with directional arrows so kids can get to their section without walking through another classes area. So far everything seems to be thought out well and all 3 of my kids were super excited to be back! The only area I think they might have a problem with is the washrooms. They have 2 magnets on each washroom door and children are supposed to turn it over to occupied when they enter and turn it back to unoccupied when they exit as only 2 kids are aloud in a washroom at one time. I don't think little ones will remember to turn it all the time when they leave so the washroom might be full all day, LOL. I am sure the school will figure it out as they go. I am thankful for the awesome principle and teachers at my children's school and I think the smooth restart is because all of their creative ideas and hard work!


----------



## hdrolfe

Well, kiddo has a "headache" so I'm going to guess we are done now. I'll pull him out and homeschool him. His only concern is if he can still see his friends and play with them. He had 3 days last week and is already getting sick from anxiety over it. He wants to be able to go back to grade 7 (maybe). I thought things went ok last week but apparently not.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

@hdrolfe Oh I hope he is feeling better.  So much anxiety for these kids.


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

hdrolfe said:


> Well, kiddo has a "headache" so I'm going to guess we are done now. I'll pull him out and homeschool him. His only concern is if he can still see his friends and play with them. He had 3 days last week and is already getting sick from anxiety over it. He wants to be able to go back to grade 7 (maybe). I thought things went ok last week but apparently not.


Aww, I hope everything works out. This is such a stressful time for kids!


----------



## gskywalker

Our 4 are supposed to go back to school this week.  2 in middle school are back full time.  2 in High school are only in class 6.25 hours a week.  I can't make sense of why high schools are only being open for 2.5 hours a day but hopefully my one daughter will make do.  The one who won't is our oldest.  For some crazy reason they are using cohorts for her class of 8 students.  So she only has 4 students in her cohort and only going to school for 6 hours a week when they aren't capable of doing school at home unless a parent is the teacher.  Last year they basically just assigned cooking and art projects which of course has to be done with a parent the entire time.  With all the money going out to help people and having her home has meant I can't work and yet the government hasn't given me a penny to account for the difference between a special needs child being at home compared to a regular teenager( I don't qualify for the CERB).


----------



## ottawamom

@hdrolfe, I am so sorry the in-school thing didn't work. I know how much you were hoping it would. I remember saying to DH the other day, if we had kids in school right now they likely wouldn't be there at all. Somebody in this house usually has "something on the list" going on on any particular day.

Are you going to be able to manage the homeschooling with work? At least this way you may be able to tailor the curriculum to keep him engaged (wishful thinking?)

I pray this "Pandemic" is gone sooner than later but I'm afraid we are all in for a long haul.


----------



## quandrea

MamaLema said:


> I have been on the Dis for 16 years. I have never teared up reading any post until now. Thank you for your beautiful words and kind heart. I have banished myself to the basement and I’m very lucky to have a caring family and not worry about groceries, etc God bless you❤


We are very lucky to have @bababear_50 as part of this wonderful, caring little group.


----------



## quandrea

hdrolfe said:


> Well, kiddo has a "headache" so I'm going to guess we are done now. I'll pull him out and homeschool him. His only concern is if he can still see his friends and play with them. He had 3 days last week and is already getting sick from anxiety over it. He wants to be able to go back to grade 7 (maybe). I thought things went ok last week but apparently not.


My kids do Zoom meetings with their two swim friends twice a week. We started in the summer. The intent of the meeting is to do dry land exercises. However I don’t think much exercise happens, and that’s fine by me. They love it! Last week they met up with their friends on zoom for a birthday party. It’s not exactly like in person, but it keeps them connected. Especially with winter coming.


----------



## hdrolfe

Thanks everyone. I think we'll be able to manage, even with me working. At least I am working from home so we should be able to manage, learning doesn't have to be from 9 to 3, it can be any time. I am really only worried about math. It's so funny, in grade 3 he was way ahead in math and the teacher was sending home extra work for him, then in grade 4 he just lost all of it and has never caught up again, I think they changed methods or something and he just couldn't understand. At least his reading comprehension is way ahead. We'll focus on what he needs, and what he enjoys, and see where it leads. 
I just can't see him doing the online school version since it's synchronous, he likes to get stuff done and then do something fun. I guess he won't be going back to French Immersion though, I'm not bilingual and there is no way I can do that! Since he wants to be a pilot maybe he won't need it? 

I am hoping he'll agree to swimming lessons or something so he still gets enough exercise, he finds most things boring


----------



## jeepwreck

Well today was my son’s first full day of school grade 1, and he is home sick with a cold. He was sick all weekend so we kept him home today just to make sure he is completely over it before he goes back tomorrow maybe

he went last Thursday and Friday, for a while and everything seemed to go well. But we will see how this week goes full time


----------



## Disney Addicted

MamaLema said:


> I am a PS teacher. Today I was informed a 3 year old in my classroom tested positive. We were sent home and I’ll be spending the next 14 long and boring days in a bedroom away from my family.





MamaLema said:


> I just hope no other children develop symptoms. I have a son in the high risk category. I had a little mental breakdown at the though of passing anything to him. He’s been through hell medically in his life. Waiting for results has been torture.





MamaLema said:


> I have been on the Dis for 16 years. I have never teared up reading any post until now. Thank you for your beautiful words and kind heart. I have banished myself to the basement and I’m very lucky to have a caring family and not worry about groceries, etc God bless you❤



I'm sorry you have to go through this.  I hope everything goes well and you won't have caught it as well.  Out of curiosity, how long was your classroom open before this happened?  Our school board just opened today.  Hopefully you have lots to keep you occupied while you're isolating in the basement!



AngelDisney said:


> We were told that there’s no eating in classroom but sipping of only water is allowed. However, under special circumstances, students can remove their masks to take snack in class, one at a time.



It's funny how every school board has a different set-up.  My teen is with Kawartha Pine Ridge.  He doesn't go back until this Thursday.  He will be taking 1 course all day every day for an entire week in one class.   Then the second course (math) all day every day the next week.  Alternating for 9 weeks.   However the kids will be taking their breaks and lunches in the same classroom.  Depending on the room the student is in, they will have a particular school door they will enter & leave by each day.

He opted to go back to school as for Quad 2 he has an Electrical and Hand Tools course that cannot be done online.  We were hoping he could do online for computer science and math during Quad 1 but found out that he would have been "removed" from his high school and then would have to reapply and pick his Quad 2 and Semester 2 courses all over again from what's left!!  Semester 2 is suppose to be co-op at a construction site but who knows if that will happen.  The Gold Collar program has been cancelled for the school year.  Last year guidance insisted he choose English even though we said he was taking it over the summer, just like the previous summer!  So now they cannot get him into the computer science grade 12 university course online with Prism like he wanted originally... Ugh.  The only course left for grade 11 or 12 that he's mildly interested in is Music (he likes to play bass guitar) but I'm worried about music class and reed instruments being played.. (sigh)

He's made the decision that he will go for a 5th year (victory lap) in high school so he can complete all the courses he wanted to take.   I believe in a couple of weeks he should select 4 new courses for Semester 2 and tell the guidance office if co-op gets cancelled to slot him in these course as soon as they know.  Or put him on the wait list immediately.  Hopefully if he has to take 4 new courses instead of co-op, he can do them through Prism or ILC and not lose his Grade 12 courses at the high school.  Unlike this "virtual" high school they have set up.


----------



## Maddysdaddy

Per Alberta Health Services definitions, my daughter's High School started last week and lasted two full days before an "outbreak" (two or more students attended while Covid+) was declared.  Now we're just waiting to see what happens in the incubation/testing period and what the spread looks like.

I was stopped at a red light in front of her school last week as classes were letting out and the hordes of students filing out through the doors, immediately unmasking, and then hugging/kissing/crowding in tight groups tells me that Covid isn't going away for a long, long time. 

In AB, either it was business as usual in terms of high schools running like normal (e.g. no cohorts or alternate days or alternate entry/exit times, or mandatory masks in classrooms, plus 30-40 students in each class) or students could choose full-time online until January.  At my daughter's school, about 1300 of the 1400 students chose to go back, so when I talk about "hordes", I'm talking about 1300 students exiting at one time and congregating in front of the school.

I get it - they're teenagers being teenagers and it's unrealistic to expect some (most?) of them to act as if their actions have far-reaching consequences, but it's hard not to think that asymptomatic teens aren't going to be bringing Covid home to their parents/grandparents/siblings...

Really, really glad that my daughter chose to go online this semester and that we're fortunate enough that she's old enough and responsible enough to handle online learning - I know for that, we're definitely the exception and not the rule.


----------



## pigletto

Maddysdaddy said:


> Per Alberta Health Services definitions, my daughter's High School started last week and lasted two full days before an "outbreak" (two or more students attended while Covid+) was declared.  Now we're just waiting to see what happens in the incubation/testing period and what the spread looks like.
> 
> I was stopped at a red light in front of her school last week as classes were letting out and the hordes of students filing out through the doors, immediately unmasking, and then hugging/kissing/crowding in tight groups tells me that Covid isn't going away for a long, long time.
> 
> In AB, either it was business as usual in terms of high schools running like normal (e.g. no cohorts or alternate days or alternate entry/exit times, or mandatory masks in classrooms, plus 30-40 students in each class) or students could choose full-time online until January.  At my daughter's school, about 1300 of the 1400 students chose to go back, so when I talk about "hordes", I'm talking about 1300 students exiting at one time and congregating in front of the school.
> 
> I get it - they're teenagers being teenagers and it's unrealistic to expect some (most?) of them to act as if their actions have far-reaching consequences, but it's hard not to think that asymptomatic teens aren't going to be bringing Covid home to their parents/grandparents/siblings...
> 
> Really, really glad that my daughter chose to go online this semester and that we're fortunate enough that she's old enough and responsible enough to handle online learning - I know for that, we're definitely the exception and not the rule.


While I agree with you that its probably unrealistic to expect some teens to realize that their actions have consequences I think this points to a giant failure on their parents part, and moreover your provincial government . They just went back to school business as usual with zero public health measures ?! And people were a-ok with that ?
I live around the corner from a high school. The kids that vape are still standing in tight little groups passing it around. I guess if they don’t care about their own health its a stretch to think they will care about someone else’s.


----------



## Disneylover99

TDSB virtual school was supposed to start on the 17th, now delayed until the 22nd as parents opt to pull their children out of in class school due to growing COVID numbers.


----------



## AngelDisney

Disney Addicted said:


> I'm sorry you have to go through this.  I hope everything goes well and you won't have caught it as well.  Out of curiosity, how long was your classroom open before this happened?  Our school board just opened today.  Hopefully you have lots to keep you occupied while you're isolating in the basement!
> 
> 
> 
> It's funny how every school board has a different set-up.  My teen is with Kawartha Pine Ridge.  He doesn't go back until this Thursday.  He will be taking 1 course all day every day for an entire week in one class.   Then the second course (math) all day every day the next week.  Alternating for 9 weeks.   However the kids will be taking their breaks and lunches in the same classroom.  Depending on the room the student is in, they will have a particular school door they will enter & leave by each day.
> 
> He opted to go back to school as for Quad 2 he has an Electrical and Hand Tools course that cannot be done online.  We were hoping he could do online for computer science and math during Quad 1 but found out that he would have been "removed" from his high school and then would have to reapply and pick his Quad 2 and Semester 2 courses all over again from what's left!!  Semester 2 is suppose to be co-op at a construction site but who knows if that will happen.  The Gold Collar program has been cancelled for the school year.  Last year guidance insisted he choose English even though we said he was taking it over the summer, just like the previous summer!  So now they cannot get him into the computer science grade 12 university course online with Prism like he wanted originally... Ugh.  The only course left for grade 11 or 12 that he's mildly interested in is Music (he likes to play bass guitar) but I'm worried about music class and reed instruments being played.. (sigh)
> 
> He's made the decision that he will go for a 5th year (victory lap) in high school so he can complete all the courses he wanted to take.   I believe in a couple of weeks he should select 4 new courses for Semester 2 and tell the guidance office if co-op gets cancelled to slot him in these course as soon as they know.  Or put him on the wait list immediately.  Hopefully if he has to take 4 new courses instead of co-op, he can do them through Prism or ILC and not lose his Grade 12 courses at the high school.  Unlike this "virtual" high school they have set up.


With students removed for virtual school, there are less options of courses students can take in each quad. We are asked to look for virtual Coop placements. I am overseeing the Specialist High Skills Majors program and it’s challenging to fit all academic requirements especially Coop in students’ schedule this year.


----------



## FigmentSpark

My DS had been back at school since last Wed., but Ottawa just went back today, apparently and Peel is also delayed, I think.  How will these boards make up the days?  No spring break?  Extra days on the other end?  No PA days?


----------



## hdrolfe

FigmentSpark said:


> My DS had been back at school since last Wed., but Ottawa just went back today, apparently and Peel is also delayed, I think.  How will these boards make up the days?  No spring break?  Extra days on the other end?  No PA days?



Only a couple PD days (Ottawa), one in November, one in January, two in June. I assume these are "report card writing days" of some sort. That's for elementary, I think secondary may have a bit different. We are used to having the Friday before Thanksgiving but not this year, same with the Friday before Family Day.


----------



## bcwife76

First full day of school here in Surrey BC (and most school districts around BC I believe). For us it was a GONG show, last Thurs/Fri our kids went for an hour each day to go over the cleaning protocols. That all went amazingly well. Today we had staggered starts for primary, K and intermediates. My kids are grades 5&7. Lining up outside by our giant grass field, waiting to be let in the gates in their respective lines to meet their teachers. Like what the actual F??? Sorry but this was just so ridiculous. I got my 12yr old in her line then went back to meet my 9yr old in the grade 4/5 line, thank goodness we were both wearing masks because apparently if there are no marks on the ground people forget how to stay 6 feet away from each other  lord love a duck. Cohorts are max of 2 classes, at most 60 kids but *should* be under. Both girls in portables AGAIN, sinks outside of the portables with cold water, this should be fun in winter....so to say I'm having 2nd, 3rd and 4th thoughts about their face to face return (esp when I learn their desks are in groups of 3 or 4)..... 2020 REALLY needs a manual


----------



## wdwmom3

So ds says his first day of school went ok.  Wearing the masks wasn’t a big deal and some of his friends are in his class.  He said it was especially good cause they didn’t do any real work yesterday lol.  So the fact that his biggest complaint has to do with “boring schoolwork” as he puts it.  I think that’s a good sign.


----------



## Frozen2014

My DS has high school with morning in class for the first time.  He got unlucky and has a portable and said it was pretty hot. His other complaint is they didn't get a break, even to stretch their legs in the 2.5 hrs.  And with covid, he didn't want to stand up to use the bathroom.  It'll cool off here soon so the temp shouldn't be an issue for a bit, but don't know why they don't give them a break.  Even at work, they would let us break during that time if a meeting went that long.


----------



## FLVacationGirl

My 2 teens are on their 4th day of school. They go mornings one day and afternoons the next. Seems to be a good system. I have a station by our front door for clean and used masks. School provides masks if anyone forgets. The school isn't sure what the plan for band is yet. Might switch all students away from wind instruments to stringed instruments. Some schools are having band outside. Our school has gym outside, except for the days that it's colder than -27... with or without the windchill. 

This was supposed to be the first time in 7 years that my 2 would be in the same school again. They are but the school is basically divided into 4 sections now to keep the grades completely apart. Separate outside doors, washrooms, hallways, etc. I'm just happy that they are going the same mornings and afternoons as each other! Makes drop offs and pick ups easier. Feeling grateful that my husband and I are both working from home and can drive them.


----------



## pigletto

Frozen2014 said:


> My DS has high school with morning in class for the first time.  He got unlucky and has a portable and said it was pretty hot. His other complaint is they didn't get a break, even to stretch their legs in the 2.5 hrs.  And with covid, he didn't want to stand up to use the bathroom.  It'll cool off here soon so the temp shouldn't be an issue for a bit, but don't know why they don't give them a break.  Even at work, they would let us break during that time if a meeting went that long.


There is a break built into my DS16 school day but it’s weird. They are in one room from 10am to 2pm and break is at 1:10 . I guess that’s just the way it shook out with scheduling but it’s not ideal.


----------



## Pumpkin1172

I know in Alberta they have tried to make it as " normal " and back to business as usual as they could.  What the government and our chief medical officer are saying is " this virus is here, it is not going away, we have to learn to live with it "  and manage where we can.  I don't think there is any right or wrong way to do it.  If there is more than " 2 cases " in any school, hospital or LTC facility, it is handled as an outbreak.  Then more guidelines are put into place over and above what guidelines are in place now.  

We have been EXTREMELY lucky in our community.  We are at 12 active cases in our city and another 6 in the county.  Considering how transient our area is, our cases have remained fairly low.

We have our son in the separate school system and our niece is in the public school system.  It seems like both seem to have the same guidelines in place.  They are doing what they can to social distance the kids as best as they can.  It is NO different than people crowding into stores,  I see people meeting up, hugging, close chatting in stores ( taking up isles that I want to walk through ) Kids are NOT going to social distance when they are outside - especially when I see adults can not even do it in stores or when our in public.  

I want to know when this whole thing became about NEVER getting the virus?  It was about flattening the curve and limiting spread.  All the precautions that are in place are to limit the spread.  There needs to be some going forward.  People need to get back to work, kids back to school...doing our daily lives again...as safe as we can.  We need new routines with our precautions that we need to do to limit the spread.  If we do not get the economy going again...our country will be in very big trouble...and not just because of a virus.  The government will need to stop printing money at some point, people will not be able to find work, and families will be literally starving to death.  We do NOT want another depression on the 30's.  If we don't get back to work, the depression will be worse than the 1930's.  We need to find ways to move forward, changing and adapting as they find new information about the virus.  

I know as a family, we are keeping our social circle very small.  Doing what we can to keep our family, co-workers  and neighbors safe.   Like many on these boards, we are anxiously waiting to be able to travel again and will booking trips as soon as they make any annoucements, and we feel that it is safe for us to go.


----------



## Frozen2014

pigletto said:


> There is a beak built into my DS16 school day but it’s weird. They are in one room from 10am to 2pm and break is at 1:10 . I guess that’s just the way it shook out with scheduling but it’s not ideal.


Interesting.  Our whole system is organized such that kids aren't there over lunch time.  I guess they don't want lingering, masks taken off, etc.  We don't even have an afternoon session.  Mornings only (but 2.5 hrs as opposed to 4hrs that you mention).


----------



## pigletto

Frozen2014 said:


> Interesting.  Our whole system is organized such that kids aren't there over lunch time.  I guess they don't want lingering, masks taken off, etc.  We don't even have an afternoon session.  Mornings only (but 2.5 hrs as opposed to 4hrs that you mention).


They are only there for the four hour block , but they are allowed to eat snack during the 20 minute break. Right now it’s outside only.


----------



## CanadianKrista

My kids got through 4 days and 3 days of school each.  DS woke up with cough and congestion yesterday morning, so both kids kept home. Went to two testing centres yesterday, both full.  Got up early this morning, got a centre 1 hour before open.  4 hours later walked out with the test done.  Both kids are still home until a negative test result, DS home until no symptoms for 24 hours.  Of course, if it is positive it's a whole other thing.

The lines at the centres were at least 75% school age kids.  Craziness.


----------



## scrappinginontario

CanadianKrista said:


> My kids got through 4 days and 3 days of school each.  DS woke up with cough and congestion yesterday morning, so both kids kept home. Went to two testing centres yesterday, both full.  Got up early this morning, got a centre 1 hour before open.  4 hours later walked out with the test done.  Both kids are still home until a negative test result, DS home until no symptoms for 24 hours.  Of course, if it is positive it's a whole other thing.
> 
> The lines at the centres were at least 75% school age kids.  Craziness.


Too bad you can't book appointments online.  My friend (ON) did the online assessment last Wed evening and had enough symptoms to require a test.  Booked it for 1:55pm the following day and was home by 2:30.  Test results came in today.  Negative thankfully although I was surprised it took 5 days as the same centre was turning results around in 24 hours 2 weeks ago.


----------



## hdrolfe

CanadianKrista said:


> My kids got through 4 days and 3 days of school each.  DS woke up with cough and congestion yesterday morning, so both kids kept home. Went to two testing centres yesterday, both full.  Got up early this morning, got a centre 1 hour before open.  4 hours later walked out with the test done.  Both kids are still home until a negative test result, DS home until no symptoms for 24 hours.  Of course, if it is positive it's a whole other thing.
> 
> The lines at the centres were at least 75% school age kids.  Craziness.



I understand testing here is full of kids as well. Of course anyone with a cough/cold needs a negative test to get back to school. I believe only one site here has appointments available. 

I think we need a better system for this, a friend (tested negative) had to wait with her son outside to get tested. I am surprised they didn't come up with a better plan for back to school, surely they knew they'd have more people to test! I mean we all guessed it... 

I hope you get negative test results.


----------



## CanadianKrista

I'm in Ottawa, the only appointments that can be booked are the the drive through clinic, and they won't test anyone under 14.  The 4 hours we were there, 3 were standing outside.  It's just getting colder and colder.  We need a better solution.  There should have been way more testing centres opened before school went back.


----------



## pigletto

CanadianKrista said:


> I'm in Ottawa, the only appointments that can be booked are the the drive through clinic, and they won't test anyone under 14.  The 4 hours we were there, 3 were standing outside.  It's just getting colder and colder.  We need a better solution.  There should have been way more testing centres opened before school went back.


Totally agree. What the heck are these places going to look like when actual respiratory illness season starts ?

When my son was in elementary school ( long before Covid ), on any given day in December or January a third of the kids in his class would be coughing or have a runny nose . I do daycare ... there are so many viruses that cause cough or runny noses. There will always be something floating around, especially in the younger kids with less mature immune systems.

These testing centres will be completely overwhelmed when the season starts. My brother took his kids for testing in late summer because his son woke with a fever and headache. It took five days for the results. This is when things were quiet.  I can’t even imagine what a gong show it will be when it’s busy. And this is time parents will have to take off to keep the kids home. We are in for a rough winter.


----------



## damo

pigletto said:


> Totally agree. What the heck are these places going to look like when actual respiratory illness season starts ?
> 
> When my son was in elementary school ( long before Covid ), on any given day in December or January a third of the kids in his class would be coughing or have a runny nose . I do daycare ... there are so many viruses that cause cough or runny noses. There will always be something floating around, especially in the younger kids with less mature immune systems.
> 
> These testing centres will be completely overwhelmed when the season starts. My brother took his kids for testing in late summer because his son woke with a fever and headache. It took five days for the results. This is when things were quiet.  I can’t even imagine what a gong show it will be when it’s busy. And this is time parents will have to take off to keep the kids home. We are in for a rough winter.



My son had a covid test last week at Credit Valley Hospital testing centre in Mississauga.  He was told he would know his results by the end of the next day and he did.


----------



## siren0119

pigletto said:


> Totally agree. What the heck are these places going to look like when actual respiratory illness season starts ?


My mother in law (a nurse at one of the local hospitals) was actually saying she wonders if we will actually see a reduction in the normal seasonal illnesses this winter, if people continue to wear masks in public. it would be really interesting if that ended up being the case.


----------



## pigletto

I wonder if they increase testing in the areas that are experiencing an uptick in cases as Peel  region is one of the worst right now. It would make sense that they decrease testing resources while numbers are low in a community. My brother had his kids tested at the hospital he practices at. I will ask him if they have a plan to increase testing and turn around time as cases rise.


----------



## bababear_50

damo said:


> My son had a covid test last week at Credit Valley Hospital testing centre in Mississauga.  He was told he would know his results by the end of the next day and he did.



My youngest son was also tested at Credit Valley last month and got the results the next day too.
His description of the test was priceless. Lol
Test=negative.
Hugs
Mel


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

I wonder if Public Health Canada will approve some rapid tests soon. I think I read something on CBC.ca with Dr. Tam discussing this issue. Pharmacies would be able to do the tests. Not sure if that is a good idea because then when I go out for my PC optimum points there could be exposure to the virus there.


----------



## darwinsrule

Anyone else think this is far more stressful for us as parents than for our kids?  DD12 started Gr 7 today, excited to see her friends and for get back to learning.  Walked her to school this morning (first day in middle school here in T.O. for her so brand new school experience for her).  DD16 starts Gr 11 tomorrow with the strange schedule TDSB is using.  In her case it is a 45 min commute via TTC for 1 class, in tomorrow's case Gr 11 Sculpture which you can't really do virtually.  Spent the evening with her in our basement setting up a studio/office since slightly more than half her time will be down there and the home office is mine since I won't be returning to the office until public health restrictions are lifted.


----------



## damo

Saw this today on CP24 about a long wait at Credit Valley to get a test ... https://www.cp24.com/news/this-is-t...hours-for-covid-test-in-mississauga-1.5109019


Just wanted to let people know that if they are going for a test to make an appointment first.  It will save you hours and hours in line.  My son had a covid test last week at Credit Valley.  He called in the morning and was given an appointment for 10:30.  He was home before 11.


----------



## Debbie

damo said:


> Saw this today on CP24 about a long wait at Credit Valley to get a test ... https://www.cp24.com/news/this-is-t...hours-for-covid-test-in-mississauga-1.5109019
> 
> Just wanted to let people know that if they are going for a test to make an appointment first.  It will save you hours and hours in line.  My son had a covid test last week at Credit Valley.  He called in the morning and was given an appointment for 10:30.  He was home before 11.


That works in certain jurisdictions. Where I live, my PHU is book an appointment. Walk to the edge of town and it is London and there it is line up (earlier and earlier each day). I have a friend who said her child (grade 1) has been in school 1 day. Cold symptoms and can't return until a negative COVID test or until a 14 day quarantine (of child and 2 siblings) has been completed.


----------



## CanadianKrista

We got our negative covid test for DS yesterday, so DD could go back to school.  Just got called to pick her up for a headache, now she needs a test before going back.  1 day of school this week, and tomorrow will be another 4-5 hours in line for her to get tested.  This is unmanageable.


----------



## damo

CanadianKrista said:


> We got our negative covid test for DS yesterday, so DD could go back to school.  Just got called to pick her up for a headache, now she needs a test before going back.  1 day of school this week, and tomorrow will be another 4-5 hours in line for her to get tested.  This is unmanageable.



Yes, something is going to have to change if every time a child gets a covid symptom (which kids get all the time) they have to have a test to go back to school.  That type of testing capacity is going to be astronomical.


----------



## Pumpkin1172

Not only that...but parents needing to be away from work.  Now employers will need to be understanding about needing time off for sick kids and everything that comes with that.  Some employers will be fantastic....others....we know won't.  It is going to be a very tricky tango for everyone as we learn to dance our way through cold/flu season.


----------



## siren0119

damo said:


> Yes, something is going to have to change if every time a child gets a covid symptom (which kids get all the time) they have to have a test to go back to school.  That type of testing capacity is going to be astronomical.



Hopefully the answer to that is a rapid test, that can be administered easily from the school nurse's office, and then a vaccine. A better understanding of whether herd immunity is possible will help too (I'm fortunate to know a nuclear biologist who is actually working on one of these studies, so I know there's a ton of effort being put into that). No idea how close we are yet.


----------



## CanadianKrista

I think the rapid test really is going to be key, but health canada isn't happy with any of them.   Really we should have had one avaialble before sending the kids back to school, especially in provinces where there are still many cases daily.


----------



## hdrolfe

CanadianKrista said:


> I think the rapid test really is going to be key, but health canada isn't happy with any of them.   Really we should have had one avaialble before sending the kids back to school, especially in provinces where there are still many cases daily.



This for sure. Given the waits for tests, and the increases due to schools starting, with a second wave either under way or coming soon... seems foolish to me to not have planned this better.

I heard there are 3 "pop up" testing sites coming to the Ottawa area, given the lines are at max capacity before the places even open currently... this is not at all hopeful! I doubt 3 more sites will be sufficient. And appointments can't be made at most of them.


----------



## wdwmom3

A student in her child's kindergarten class got COVID-19. Now their family is in self-isolation
Five-year-old Olivia Ristovski made it through a week of kindergarten before COVID-19 interrupted her classes. After a classmate tested positive for COVID-19, the whole family began self-isolating.

https://kitchener.ctvnews.ca/a-stud...w-their-family-is-in-self-isolation-1.5109409


----------



## ottawamom

I feel for all the parents of school aged children out there. All that testing and waiting for results. There has got to be a better way. The symptoms of Covid are the same symptoms of a lot of other "common" ailments. I know if I was in school I would be in that line for a test each and every day (I have allergies, hence, headaches, runny nose, sneezes etc)

I can't imagine how this is going to work.


----------



## badiggio

4 schools in ottawa closing for 14 days quarantine


----------



## wdwmom3

badiggio said:


> 4 schools in ottawa closing for 14 days quarantine



Hopefully it’s just a quarantine and no cases from the schools arise.  A quarantine still sucks but better then others getting sick.


----------



## hdrolfe

badiggio said:


> 4 schools in ottawa closing for 14 days quarantine



It's 4 classes at 3 schools who are being asked to stay home for 14 days, not the whole schools. 

15 schools in Ottawa have confirmed cases though. Not a good start since most have only been back a week or two.


----------



## badiggio

hdrolfe said:


> It's 4 classes at 3 schools who are being asked to stay home for 14 days, not the whole schools.
> 
> 15 schools in Ottawa have confirmed cases though. Not a good start since most have only been back a week or two.


you're right;this became more clear as more details came out
it's only a matter of time,imo


----------



## hdrolfe

badiggio said:


> you're right;this became more clear as more details came out
> it's only a matter of time,imo



Oh, I totally agree with that... based on the progression so far, it will happen sooner or later. When dealing with my son's school and moving him to home school they mentioned that the teachers are setting things up so that if they have to shift to online only it will be much more seamless than it was in March. Even the few days he was there they did most of their work in the online site the board uses. Not that it will be any easier on parents who may have to take 2 weeks or more off to be home with young kids.


----------



## isabellea

My kids went back to school on August 27th. Last week, one class went in isolation for two weeks. The school said it was one case but rumor is that there are two cases (twins) in that class. So far, no other student or staff from that class or the rest of the school tested positive so no outbreak/transmission in the school which is what is very important imo. The teacher had already started using Google Classroom when it happened (Grade 3) so apparently the transition to online teaching went very smoothly. I thought the school managed very well. Now I just hope the student(s) who tested positive won't be ostracized because of that.


----------



## Bossy22

I'm a teacher in rural Alberta and the return to school has been excellent.  Do I love all the rules?  Not really but being back in school has added some normalcy to the students lifes.  It is far from normal but it feels normal!!!  Mental health of the students has greatly improved being back.  I know I am lucky to be in a rural setting and if covid hits the school it will not be fun, but the students needed to be back.  It is a good thing in my books.


----------



## pigletto

ottawamom said:


> I feel for all the parents of school aged children out there. All that testing and waiting for results. There has got to be a better way. The symptoms of Covid are the same symptoms of a lot of other "common" ailments. I know if I was in school I would be in that line for a test each and every day (I have allergies, hence, headaches, runny nose, sneezes etc)
> 
> I can't imagine how this is going to work.


A dear family friend is a Dr who is working at our local Covid testing clinic and has been since the beginning of the pandemic. She posted on Facebook yesterday that she had a beast of a day with huge lines and wait times all day, and it was all children . She felt awful because all she did was make kids cry all day. (The test is uncomfortable).It didn’t look anything like this a few weeks ago.

   I’ll say it .. this is not sustainable. You can’t have parents taking off a week waiting for results every time one of their kids gets ill or shows symptoms of something. It‘s going to happen over and over .., and many parents have multiple kids.  They will be missing work all the time or relying on grandparents who shouldn’t be around these kids . We need quicker turn around times for results or reliable rapid testing.

There was one reported case at a local high school confirmed today. And people of course are losing their minds on Facebook. Were they thinking that Covid was gone ? Of course there are going to be outbreaks and we are going to have to handle them as they come. It feels like nobody takes responsibility for their own choices anymore .


----------



## Jrb1979

First I will say I am so glad my child is only a year old so I don't have to deal with the school thing yet. I knew there would cases once school started back up again. This was bound to happen. I have a feeling it will be shutdown within a few months anyways with the fact that our numbers are rising again. I am still of the belief that school should have continued online til we get Covid more under control. I just don't understand what parents expected. They were the ones pushing for kids to go back for their well being but now are upset that kids are getting sick. You can't have it both ways.


----------



## scrappinginontario

My child is back in school.  She may get sick or someone in her class or school may get sick which is a known risk we are willing to take.  The same thing can happen each time we leave our home to go to a store, church or anywhere else.

After 2 partial weeks in class my daughter’s spark is back!!   She’s happier, singing, dancing around the house, calling her friends after school and eager to get up in the morning to go to school.  She’s working hard and coming home willing to do her homework after a quick shower followed by some down time.

Is it without risks?  No.  But today those are risks I am willing to take and I will reevaluate each morning and decide from there.  

For our family, returning to school was a leap of faith and I’m glad we jumped in with both feet!!

Will she return to learning from home at some point this year?  I fully expect so but I truly believe the teaching, fun, normalcy, joy and more that she’s experiencing now will aid her when that time comes.

Not judging anyone who chose virtual learning or homeschooling for their child(ren), just sharing our experience.


----------



## wdwmom3

Jrb1979 said:


> First I will say I am so glad my child is only a year old so I don't have to deal with the school thing yet. I knew there would cases once school started back up again. This was bound to happen. I have a feeling it will be shutdown within a few months anyways with the fact that our numbers are rising again. I am still of the belief that school should have continued online til we get Covid more under control. I just don't understand what parents expected. They were the ones pushing for kids to go back for their well being but now are upset that kids are getting sick. You can't have it both ways.



Because being at home isolated from away from school has been very damaging to some kids.  It’s not just covid, there are many others factors parents consider.

i know my son was starting to get withdrawn, snapping at people, not himself. We saw his mental health take a dive. This is a kid who always comparing about how boring school was, who kept saying he just wanted to be back in school. He’s only been back for 3 days and he’s more like himself.

Other kids just don’t do well with things online and need to back or fall really far behind.


----------



## Jrb1979

wdwmom3 said:


> Because being at home isolated from away from school has been very damaging to some kids.  It’s not just covid, there are many others factors parents consider.
> 
> i know my son was starting to get withdrawn, snapping at people, not himself. We saw his mental health take a dive. This is a kid who always comparing about how boring school was, who kept saying he just wanted to be back in school. He’s only been back for 3 days and he’s more like himself.
> 
> Other kids just don’t do well with things online and need to back or fall really far behind.


I do understand all of that. What I was getting at is that many parents pushed for school to return but there is has been upset that kids are getting sick from going back. @pigletto  was saying how it's not sustainable having parents have to keep taking time off every time a child has symptoms and has to get tested. Its why I said you can't have it both ways.


----------



## wdwmom3

Jrb1979 said:


> I do understand all of that. What I was getting at is that many parents pushed for school to return but there is has been upset that kids are getting sick from going back. @pigletto  was saying how it's not sustainable having parents have to keep taking time off every time a child has symptoms and has to get tested. Its why I said you can't have it both ways.



You can want schools open but then still get upset that kids are getting sick.  It’s a stressful time.  You are lucky your child is not school aged right now.  There is no way you can even begin to understand how complicated and hard this is for parents, deciding what to do.  Every day my husband and I stress over sending our child to school, even though we know right now it’s what’s best for him.


----------



## Frozen2014

This is all such a mixed bag.  We've sent our kids to school as we feel the education in person will be so much better, plus the interaction with other kids and people.  Having said that, my son in high school still seems to have a lot of down time as the mornings he's not in school he has nothing (time to work on the class work but this week he finished everything when in class). His other classes also seem to have some free time. The thing with him too is that his friends are not only not in his cohort, but the ones that go to school go on opposite days.  So he's still isolated from them and never sees them.  He plays/chats with them online but no going to each others house after school like before.  There have been positives to being at home for my daughter.  First, it got her online much quicker than she would have been otherwise and now she's a typical teenager (at 11 years old) and chats with friends all the time (i.e. she wouldn't' have had a phone otherwise). The other thing is a lot of kids picked on her in class so she didn't have to deal with that drama, and it helped build her confidence back up. (And she had a great summer at camp without drama)  But I'm glad she's back this year and her 2 closest friends are in her class/cohort thank goodness.

But when I see the numbers climb...where is August we were under 100 cases a day in Ontario and yesterday we had a whopping 401...and you keep hearing of cases in schools all ready.  I feel like it's just a matter of time before it comes to their schools and they are shutdown.  Very scary and all a gamble...hoping they stay safe.  I don't even know what the right answer is for going to school or doing online only.


----------



## pigletto

Jrb1979 said:


> I do understand all of that. What I was getting at is that many parents pushed for school to return but there is has been upset that kids are getting sick from going back. @pigletto  was saying how it's not sustainable having parents have to keep taking time off every time a child has symptoms and has to get tested. Its why I said you can't have it both ways.


  I think an optimal return to school plan should and could have included the ability to test larger numbers of people and obtain quicker results . That’s not “having it both ways”, it’s common sense. That is going to need to happen to make this work.

FWIW I don‘t have a small child in school who would need me to take off work. But I can see that the model being used is not sustainable for people who have small kids which is why I said that. My 16 year old went back. If he needs to stop he can switch to online learning pretty easily. Moreover we are adults who understand the consequences of our decisions and won’t pass blame if and when Covid goes through the school. I think there is a lot of people like us.


----------



## pigletto

Frozen2014 said:


> This is all such a mixed bag.  We've sent our kids to school as we feel the education in person will be so much better, plus the interaction with other kids and people.  Having said that, my son in high school still seems to have a lot of down time as the mornings he's not in school he has nothing (time to work on the class work but this week he finished everything when in class). His other classes also seem to have some free time. The thing with him too is that his friends are not only not in his cohort, but the ones that go to school go on opposite days.  So he's still isolated from them and never sees them.  He plays/chats with them online but no going to each others house after school like before.  There have been positives to being at home for my daughter.  First, it got her online much quicker than she would have been otherwise and now she's a typical teenager (at 11 years old) and chats with friends all the time (i.e. she wouldn't' have had a phone otherwise). The other thing is a lot of kids picked on her in class so she didn't have to deal with that drama, and it helped build her confidence back up. (And she had a great summer at camp without drama)  But I'm glad she's back this year and her 2 closest friends are in her class/cohort thank goodness.
> 
> But when I see the numbers climb...where is August we were under 100 cases a day in Ontario and yesterday we had a whopping 401...and you keep hearing of cases in schools all ready.  I feel like it's just a matter of time before it comes to their schools and they are shutdown.  Very scary and all a gamble...hoping they stay safe.  I don't even know what the right answer is for going to school or doing online only.


Exactly the same here with my son and downtime. He said something interesting yesterday. He was saying he’s done his work by 12:30 most days and then just sits there until it’s time to go. He has only once used all  of the time they are supposed to use for 75 minutes when he gets home. There just isn’t enough to do. So he was saying basically it’s showing him how much extra time it takes to teach those large class sizes they normally have. He said without distraction they are blowing through  the material. And he’s doing physics and business accounting right now, so its not light material.


----------



## AngelDisney

pigletto said:


> Exactly the same here with my son and downtime. He said something interesting yesterday. He was saying he’s done his work by 12:30 most days and then just sits there until it’s time to go. He has only once used all  of the time they are supposed to use for 75 minutes when he gets home. There just isn’t enough to do. So he was saying basically it’s showing him how much extra time it takes to teach those large class sizes they normally have. He said without distraction they are blowing through  the material. And he’s doing physics and business accounting right now, so its not light material.


Probably teachers are still figuring out how to pace their lessons with the quadmester system. It could be lighter work at the beginning to promote mental health and support transition back to school. If this continues, students should let their teachers know so they can adjust their pacing. I am using a flip classroom approach. Students are expected to watch videos and complete worksheets at home during asynchronous time online. Then we will take up homework, do rich open tasks and complete assessments in class. Group work and discussion plus guided practice are done in the synchronous online learning period. I use D2L Brightspace platform and I can create a virtual breakout room for students to do group work online. I am still learning about different features of Brigjtspace and how to incorporate other virtual tools to engage students and track their progress. Teachers will slowly build the capacity. It takes time and input from students and parents is important to help promote student success this year.


----------



## pigletto

AngelDisney said:


> Probably teachers are still figuring out how to pace their lessons with the quadmester system. It could be lighter work at the beginning to promote mental health and support transition back to school. If this continues, students should let their teachers know so they can adjust their pacing. I am using a flip classroom approach. Students are expected to watch videos and complete worksheets at home during asynchronous time online. Then we will take up homework, do rich open tasks and complete assessments in class. Group work and discussion plus guided practice are done in the synchronous online learning period. I use D2L Brightspace platform and I can create a virtual breakout room for students to do group work online. I am still learning about different features of Brigjtspace and how to incorporate other virtual tools to engage students and track their progress. Teachers will slowly build the capacity. It takes time and input from students and parents is important to help promote student success this year.


I wasn’t complaining in the least, just noting what he has mentioned. My position has always been that this is an extremely difficult time to be an educator and this is just one more layer. I’m sure it will figure itself out.


----------



## FigmentSpark

My gr 11 DS says he's happy to be back in class, even though it's a hybrid.  He feels he learns more in a classroom, because he can see the others and the teacher.  At home, he may be on line synchronously, but he's only seeing the board and hearing the teacher's voice, so there's some missing ambiance.

He's also really happy that he's only doing 2 classes right now.  Even though they are supposed to be twice as fast, he feels it's easier to just concentrate on two classes than on 4 in this type of setting.

He's also disappointed to be in the opposite cohort from all his friends, but they make up for it after school with online zoom (or is is Google meets?) sessions.


----------



## Meglen

I would love to share my story here for why I have taken my child out of school and is now full distance. A little backstory, this school is under construction so only 2 wings outta the old 5 are able to be used. The auditorium is now the cafe and its just a tiny place for the amount of children. 

My email to the principal
_Hello, Today while picking up my child from school I witnessed a few mask breaks in the front of white building. The children have such a small space to move about and enjoy the fresh air. Along with this many of the children were playing and being very close to each other while playing with their now off masks. The teachers did not seem to try to separate the students. Times are hard and we all know policing children during this time will be really hard. But these kids were face to face maskless chatting it up and playing.

I am not sure what could be done here, but maybe markers on the ground could help. I think the kids are treating this like recess. My son loves going to school and to see his classmates but he also brought this up to me and said PE class was also the same. That kids would not stay away from him while he was participating in both mask breaks and PE.

I am not here to blame or point fingers,everyone has been amazing so far but I just wanted to make sure you were aware of how the mask breaks were looking to onlookers while waiting for dismissal._

This is the reply I got back
_Thank you for bringing your concerns to my attention. We have been trying our best to fulfill every guideline placed upon us. The tent area is really for shelter and to have a designated area. I have communicated to educators that they can spread out and utilize all areas (minus construction area) to walk and attain space. It is a balance and shift in thinking to create a socially distant space that would be considered ideal. The irony is I observe them walk across the crosswalk at the end of the school day and social distancing is obsolete. I observe students piling into a neighbor's car and masks are off, etc. I bring these points up to emphasize that to keep them at a distance and fully vested in our new norm is almost impossible. We will continue to do all we can, and I will surely share your concerns at an upcoming meeting with JFK educators. My only solution for P/Gs who are not comfortable with hybrid is 100% remote learning but this isn't ideal either...it is a really challenging time. 

We will continue to try our best to accommodate the almost impossible challenge placed upon our public school systems during this pandemic. _

This principal made me feel less safe for my son with this reply. I understand times are hard but to tell parents they cant do much and to go full distance if you dont like it is a bit much for me.

Sorry this is very long


----------



## Silvermist999

FigmentSpark said:


> My gr 11 DS says he's happy to be back in class, even though it's a hybrid.  He feels he learns more in a classroom, because he can see the others and the teacher.  At home, he may be on line synchronously, but he's only seeing the board and hearing the teacher's voice, so there's some missing ambiance.
> 
> He's also really happy that he's only doing 2 classes right now.  Even though they are supposed to be twice as fast, he feels it's easier to just concentrate on two classes than on 4 in this type of setting.
> He's also disappointed to be in the opposite cohort from all his friends, but they make up for it after school with online zoom (or is is Google meets?) sessions.


This is exactly the same for my DD in grade 11. She is enjoying being in school even if it’s hybrid, and opposite cohort from most of her friend group, who are all taking different electives.  She had one friend in her class last week, and next week she will not have any friends in the in person class.  She says it isn’t a big deal because they don’t get to socialize like before or even talk to one another in class, they are seated too far apart and also...it’s not like they would hear one another through their masks. Plus right after the morning class, they need to head home in time to sign in for their afternoon class. So not much time to hang around and socialize at school. We are lucky we are home so we have been picking her up right after class, too many maskless teens not social distancing.  Not ideal with the case count rising lately.


----------



## pigletto

Meglen said:


> I would love to share my story here for why I have taken my child out of school and is now full distance. A little backstory, this school is under construction so only 2 wings outta the old 5 are able to be used. The auditorium is now the cafe and its just a tiny place for the amount of children.
> 
> My email to the principal
> _Hello, Today while picking up my child from school I witnessed a few mask breaks in the front of white building. The children have such a small space to move about and enjoy the fresh air. Along with this many of the children were playing and being very close to each other while playing with their now off masks. The teachers did not seem to try to separate the students. Times are hard and we all know policing children during this time will be really hard. But these kids were face to face maskless chatting it up and playing.
> 
> I am not sure what could be done here, but maybe markers on the ground could help. I think the kids are treating this like recess. My son loves going to school and to see his classmates but he also brought this up to me and said PE class was also the same. That kids would not stay away from him while he was participating in both mask breaks and PE.
> 
> I am not here to blame or point fingers,everyone has been amazing so far but I just wanted to make sure you were aware of how the mask breaks were looking to onlookers while waiting for dismissal._
> 
> This is the reply I got back
> _Thank you for bringing your concerns to my attention. We have been trying our best to fulfill every guideline placed upon us. The tent area is really for shelter and to have a designated area. I have communicated to educators that they can spread out and utilize all areas (minus construction area) to walk and attain space. It is a balance and shift in thinking to create a socially distant space that would be considered ideal. The irony is I observe them walk across the crosswalk at the end of the school day and social distancing is obsolete. I observe students piling into a neighbor's car and masks are off, etc. I bring these points up to emphasize that to keep them at a distance and fully vested in our new norm is almost impossible. We will continue to do all we can, and I will surely share your concerns at an upcoming meeting with JFK educators. My only solution for P/Gs who are not comfortable with hybrid is 100% remote learning but this isn't ideal either...it is a really challenging time.
> 
> We will continue to try our best to accommodate the almost impossible challenge placed upon our public school systems during this pandemic. _
> 
> This principal made me feel less safe for my son with this reply. I understand times are hard but to tell parents they cant do much and to go full distance if you dont like it is a bit much for me.
> 
> Sorry this is very long



We had an outdoor socially distanced family visit  today. There were two teachers there , a doctor , a nurse practitioner and we are all parents.  We were all in agreement with what the principal has said in this email. The protocols and new rules sound great but are practically impossible to maintain when you add in human behaivour  .  Schools will do their best, but there’s just too much being asked of schools and it’s not able to be done at all times , in all instances. Cohorts are designed to stop the spread of an outbreak when it happens. But there is no way it won’t happen. 
I understand your concern but I do think he gave you honest advice and I agree with what he’s saying. It’s not that they aren't trying , it’s that it can’t be done. Covid exists ..it’s here.. we can only slow the spread. It can’t be stopped completely in a school environment and people who are not willing to take that risk should consider the online learning.


----------



## scrappinginontario

Meglen said:


> I would love to share my story here for why I have taken my child out of school and is now full distance. A little backstory, this school is under construction so only 2 wings outta the old 5 are able to be used. The auditorium is now the cafe and its just a tiny place for the amount of children.
> 
> My email to the principal
> _Hello, Today while picking up my child from school I witnessed a few mask breaks in the front of white building. The children have such a small space to move about and enjoy the fresh air. Along with this many of the children were playing and being very close to each other while playing with their now off masks. The teachers did not seem to try to separate the students. Times are hard and we all know policing children during this time will be really hard. But these kids were face to face maskless chatting it up and playing.
> 
> I am not sure what could be done here, but maybe markers on the ground could help. I think the kids are treating this like recess. My son loves going to school and to see his classmates but he also brought this up to me and said PE class was also the same. That kids would not stay away from him while he was participating in both mask breaks and PE.
> 
> I am not here to blame or point fingers,everyone has been amazing so far but I just wanted to make sure you were aware of how the mask breaks were looking to onlookers while waiting for dismissal._
> 
> This is the reply I got back
> _Thank you for bringing your concerns to my attention. We have been trying our best to fulfill every guideline placed upon us. The tent area is really for shelter and to have a designated area. I have communicated to educators that they can spread out and utilize all areas (minus construction area) to walk and attain space. It is a balance and shift in thinking to create a socially distant space that would be considered ideal. The irony is I observe them walk across the crosswalk at the end of the school day and social distancing is obsolete. I observe students piling into a neighbor's car and masks are off, etc. I bring these points up to emphasize that to keep them at a distance and fully vested in our new norm is almost impossible. We will continue to do all we can, and I will surely share your concerns at an upcoming meeting with JFK educators. My only solution for P/Gs who are not comfortable with hybrid is 100% remote learning but this isn't ideal either...it is a really challenging time.
> 
> We will continue to try our best to accommodate the almost impossible challenge placed upon our public school systems during this pandemic. _
> 
> This principal made me feel less safe for my son with this reply. I understand times are hard but to tell parents they cant do much and to go full distance if you dont like it is a bit much for me.
> 
> Sorry this is very long


 I respect the honesty of the principal.  It’s an impossible thing they’ve been tasked with to try and ensure kids stay socially distanced 100% of the time.  

I’ve done my best to teach my daughter how to do this but knowing it won’t always happen was something I needed to weigh heavily into my decision for her to return to school.


----------



## Daisy*Duck*y

We are in BC and things are going well for us.

Here, we only have to keep our children home the exact day they have any of the symptoms. The child does not need a negative Covid test in order to return to school.

If you do want to test your child for Covid, there is now a spit test (instead of the nose test) for children that is just becoming available. There is also a plan to make the new test available for adults in addition to children.

Edit: The spit test might be for children age 4+, and not for younger children. (They have to alternate at 5 second intervals between gargling and swishing, perhaps?)

Adults can be tested at Children’s Hospital if they call ahead and pre-register. Presumably so that you can go with your children to be tested.


----------



## hdrolfe

badiggio said:


> 4 schools in ottawa closing for 14 days quarantine



One of those classes has now caused the school to close. It's in our neighbourhood but not the one my son was at. I am glad now I pulled him out of the school for the year. I'm sure more schools will follow.


----------



## MoreTravels

With the new cases climbing back up, do you have a threshold number to pull your kid from school back to online learning? For example in Ontario, we were down to double digits like 80’s or 70’s in August. The last two days they have gone up to 400+ new cases per day. So when would you make that switch? 500, 1000, 10,000 daily? I am asking to see if there is a perceived unsafe number from the parents.
For me, it’s probably 1000.


----------



## scrappinginontario

MoreTravels said:


> With the new cases climbing back up, do you have a threshold number to pull your kid from school back to online learning? For example in Ontario, we were down to double digits like 80’s or 70’s in August. The last two days they have gone up to 400+ new cases per day. So when would you make that switch? 500, 1000, 10,000 daily? I am asking to see if there is a perceived unsafe number from the parents.
> For me, it’s probably 1000.


 I will say I put more weight on our local numbers than in the provincial numbers.  The cases in the province have climbed substantially but although our local numbers have changed, it isn’t at the same rate.

Also personally, I don’t believe a certain number will make me switch to virtual as I need to weigh in how this would disrupt my daughter’s learning.  Where we live, virtual learning happens in entirely different ‘schools.’  I would liken switching her to virtual to moving her mid-year to a brand new school.  New teacher, new classmates, new style of learning, risking missing materials that may already have been covered, leaving her current friends, etc.

I have faith (and this is just me) that before I feel it would be worth disrupting my child in this way that the government would move everyone/certain areas to virtual learning which would allow her to keep her sane teacher, classmates, etc both for the current time and possibly if things settled, when they moved back into the school again.

Another consideration is if I pull her to virtual then at some point want her back in the classroom, there is no guarantee she’d go back into her original class which would be disruption to her again.

I guess when I look at it closely, I don’t really have a ‘number’ that would cause me to switch learning platforms.  If I felt she was unsafe I would but for me that is not triggered by a number.

We have already had a case reported yesterday  in a school just a few kms from us.  While it does make it more ‘real’ it doesn’t make me question where we are at.  Reality is quickly showing that cases are already popping up in schools.  For this reason we’re spending this weekend setting up a desk area for her to work at should her class/school be moved to virtual learning at some point.  I’m guessing that is only a matter of time either for a short term or extended period of time.


----------



## pigletto

MoreTravels said:


> With the new cases climbing back up, do you have a threshold number to pull your kid from school back to online learning? For example in Ontario, we were down to double digits like 80’s or 70’s in August. The last two days they have gone up to 400+ new cases per day. So when would you make that switch? 500, 1000, 10,000 daily? I am asking to see if there is a perceived unsafe number from the parents.
> For me, it’s probably 1000.


I’m not sure what my threshold is but it’s not a specific number. Our board has a document online. Of the 96 schools on the document, there is one case. One case in one school. So we are good for now. 

As I’ve mentioned in my other posts DS16 had a say in whether or not he returned in person. His dad and I were leaning more toward learning online but he really felt he wanted the benefit of in person instruction. So we are trying.  We will continue to reevaluate. If at some point the ship appears to be sinking we can switch pretty easily.


----------



## quandrea

MoreTravels said:


> With the new cases climbing back up, do you have a threshold number to pull your kid from school back to online learning? For example in Ontario, we were down to double digits like 80’s or 70’s in August. The last two days they have gone up to 400+ new cases per day. So when would you make that switch? 500, 1000, 10,000 daily? I am asking to see if there is a perceived unsafe number from the parents.
> For me, it’s probably 1000.


For me, we are already there. I cancelled a hair appointment for Tuesday. The numbers have me altering my behaviour again. We have community spread and our positivity rate is between 4 and 5 which means we are probably missing cases. It should be noted that we are a high risk family though and exercise great caution.


----------



## Disneylover99

MoreTravels said:


> With the new cases climbing back up, do you have a threshold number to pull your kid from school back to online learning? For example in Ontario, we were down to double digits like 80’s or 70’s in August. The last two days they have gone up to 400+ new cases per day. So when would you make that switch? 500, 1000, 10,000 daily? I am asking to see if there is a perceived unsafe number from the parents.
> For me, it’s probably 1000.


There is no set number for me. It depends on many factors. Cases within my children’s school would probably be the number one deciding factor.

@scrappinginontario makes some excellent points to consider when deciding to switch to virtual.


----------



## Minniemoo15

We are two weeks in here in NB and things have been going very very smoothly. My Kindergarten students have adapted so well to the new routines (though for them, they don’t know any different anyway!) They are learning, playing, laughing - it all feels somewhat normal in this crazy world. I feel completely safe as an educator. Nothing is without risk, but we have a very well thought out plan and I feel lucky that our risk of community transmission here is NB is so low. 

My own two DDs (7 and 5) are so happy to be back at school. I have noticed my DD7’s anxiety is now completely gone. She was really struggling the past few months and now is the happiest kid on the playground. I can’t tell you how relieved and grateful I am for that. 

Here in NB, you need 2 symptoms to be excluded from school. That makes it a bit easier. If they have just a runny nose for example - they can go to school. If they have a runny nose and cough, they need to stay home until they are better. I will also say parents are taking this seriously. I had several students out on Friday because they had common cold symptoms. That’s the system working and parents doing their part.

It will be a different year - but I am increasingly optimistic that it will be a really great year as well.


----------



## Silvermist999

MoreTravels said:


> With the new cases climbing back up, do you have a threshold number to pull your kid from school back to online learning? For example in Ontario, we were down to double digits like 80’s or 70’s in August. The last two days they have gone up to 400+ new cases per day. So when would you make that switch? 500, 1000, 10,000 daily? I am asking to see if there is a perceived unsafe number from the parents.
> For me, it’s probably 1000.



I will be looking at the trend over a period of time because there will be variation day to day.  If the case count is consistently high and continue to climb then that is concerning enough for me.   Even if it isn’t as high in my specific area, I will seriously consider switching my children to virtual school at the next opportunity provided by the school board.


----------



## hdrolfe

I wasn't looking at numbers but rather my son's anxiety over being back. 

However, over the week we were trying to make a change he would be comfortable with, the school was willing to put him on the waiting list for online learning and have his home room teacher assist with getting him to do the work in class. They are prepared for that switch.


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

scrappinginontario said:


> My child is back in school.  She may get sick or someone in her class or school may get sick which is a known risk we are willing to take.  The same thing can happen each time we leave our home to go to a store, church or anywhere else.
> 
> After 2 partial weeks in class my daughter’s spark is back!!   She’s happier, singing, dancing around the house, calling her friends after school and eager to get up in the morning to go to school.  She’s working hard and coming home willing to do her homework after a quick shower followed by some down time.
> 
> Is it without risks?  No.  But today those are risks I am willing to take and I will reevaluate each morning and decide from there.
> 
> For our family, returning to school was a leap of faith and I’m glad we jumped in with both feet!!
> 
> Will she return to learning from home at some point this year?  I fully expect so but I truly believe the teaching, fun, normalcy, joy and more that she’s experiencing now will aid her when that time comes.
> 
> Not judging anyone who chose virtual learning or homeschooling for their child(ren), just sharing our experience.


This is my daughter!! All 3 of my kids are happy and excited to be back but my daughter has gotten back that spark!! She is so bubbly, chatty and smiling all the time again! At this time going back to school is worth the risks for my family.


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

MoreTravels said:


> With the new cases climbing back up, do you have a threshold number to pull your kid from school back to online learning? For example in Ontario, we were down to double digits like 80’s or 70’s in August. The last two days they have gone up to 400+ new cases per day. So when would you make that switch? 500, 1000, 10,000 daily? I am asking to see if there is a perceived unsafe number from the parents.
> For me, it’s probably 1000.


I will be looking at cases in our area as opposed to provincial numbers. Our region at the moment has only 38 active cases and our daily count is usually under 5. We did have a day that hit 12 in the region last week but I believe 5 or 6 of those cases were people returning from an out of Canada business trip and were already self isolating at home. Today and yesterday we only saw 1 new case each day in our region. My small town has only 3 cases at the moment and 1 of them is under investigate as they believe it might be a false positive. We don't have any in our schools at this time but an elementary school in a neighbouring town has 1 case as well as a high school in another neighbouring town. I know our town is not immune from this virus and we could definitely see numbers spike in our region, but for now I think it is more beneficial for my children to be in school.


----------



## Iralyn

MoreTravels said:


> With the new cases climbing back up, do you have a threshold number to pull your kid from school back to online learning? For example in Ontario, we were down to double digits like 80’s or 70’s in August. The last two days they have gone up to 400+ new cases per day. So when would you make that switch? 500, 1000, 10,000 daily? I am asking to see if there is a perceived unsafe number from the parents.
> For me, it’s probably 1000.



My random thoughts...

If I could do so, I might have already moved my daughter to online.  But it is not exactly based on case numbers.  Unlike for many kids (e.g., those ones with their spark back), in person schooling adds stress to my daughter's life and this year is kind of worse than others.  One of her struggles is the social aspect of school and now she is limited to just her cohort for any interactions and that is making things harder.  She is off for the next few days as she has cold symptoms so we are awaiting our Covid tests and results and she is thrilled to not have to go.  I am considering switching her to virtual in November though it will be a challenge for practical reasons.

After the Pembroke high school cases, I'm no longer willing to rely on local numbers.  They had 40 cases TOTAL in Renfrew County prior to September.  Pembroke and area is now listed as having 8 (EIGHT) cases total which presumably includes the 5 associated with the school (though possible staff members commute from elsewhere).

I'm expecting that we'll all be virtual by October 1 unless numbers start going down.  The challenges of in person schooling for parents around kids with mild symptoms needing to stay home, delays in Covid testing, classrooms and schools that are being closed because of cases, etc. make the virtual option not seem so bad in comparison (may in fact be MORE disruptive for some employers as it is unpredictable) so the pressure to keep schools open is probably lessening.


----------



## hdrolfe

Interesting, the Ottawa Catholic School Board is setting up a two day pop up testing site at the school that is shut down due to an outbreak, only for staff, students, family of the school but nice to see them take that action so hopefully everyone can get tested quickly and locally. It's my neighbourhood, so hopefully it's a lot of negative results. If we lived on the other side of the street I think we'd be in their zone.


----------



## bankr63

Meglen said:


> I would love to share my story here for why I have taken my child out of school and is now full distance. A little backstory, this school is under construction so only 2 wings outta the old 5 are able to be used. The auditorium is now the cafe and its just a tiny place for the amount of children.
> 
> My email to the principal
> _Hello, Today while picking up my child from school I witnessed a few mask breaks in the front of white building. The children have such a small space to move about and enjoy the fresh air. Along with this many of the children were playing and being very close to each other while playing with their now off masks. The teachers did not seem to try to separate the students. Times are hard and we all know policing children during this time will be really hard. But these kids were face to face maskless chatting it up and playing.
> 
> I am not sure what could be done here, but maybe markers on the ground could help. I think the kids are treating this like recess. My son loves going to school and to see his classmates but he also brought this up to me and said PE class was also the same. That kids would not stay away from him while he was participating in both mask breaks and PE.
> 
> I am not here to blame or point fingers,everyone has been amazing so far but I just wanted to make sure you were aware of how the mask breaks were looking to onlookers while waiting for dismissal._
> 
> This is the reply I got back
> _Thank you for bringing your concerns to my attention. We have been trying our best to fulfill every guideline placed upon us. The tent area is really for shelter and to have a designated area. I have communicated to educators that they can spread out and utilize all areas (minus construction area) to walk and attain space. It is a balance and shift in thinking to create a socially distant space that would be considered ideal. The irony is I observe them walk across the crosswalk at the end of the school day and social distancing is obsolete. I observe students piling into a neighbor's car and masks are off, etc. I bring these points up to emphasize that to keep them at a distance and fully vested in our new norm is almost impossible. We will continue to do all we can, and I will surely share your concerns at an upcoming meeting with JFK educators. My only solution for P/Gs who are not comfortable with hybrid is 100% remote learning but this isn't ideal either...it is a really challenging time.
> 
> We will continue to try our best to accommodate the almost impossible challenge placed upon our public school systems during this pandemic. _
> 
> This principal made me feel less safe for my son with this reply. I understand times are hard but to tell parents they cant do much and to go full distance if you dont like it is a bit much for me.
> 
> Sorry this is very long


One good example of the difficulty from DW's school.  This is a middle school, so there is no busing to school; all students must get there on their own.  That means roughly 200 students take city transit (OC Transpo).  So the school must try to keep them properly distanced on school property; that is a 200m. long lineup - roughly 2 football fields.  But the second they step to the curb and onto the bus, that all goes out the window.

Her general feedback from week one is that it is indeed impossible.  Some of the protocols are not well thought out, and the students appear more like prisoners than classmates.  Each cohort has an area on the schoolyard, but the students must maintain social distance; more space if they remove their masks.  So you have a field full of kids standing 6 feet apart for 20 minutes; no gear can be shared (like balls) - perhaps a child could bring their own skipping rope?  The teachers on duty must enforce this.  In the classroom students must sit in their desks and not move about unless necessary.  Lunch must be eaten facing forward with mask off to prevent spread, no turning around and conversing with friends.

Teachers have been provided with thick heavy face shields that muffle sound so much that they can't be heard at the back of the class; thinner flexible shields might have worked better. My favorite dumb rule is that handouts must be printed 72 hours before distributing.  Nobody thought that one through - you don't touch every handout when printing - maybe the top and bottom copy when removing from the printer. Those two could be discarded, or gloves could be worn.  But then it comes time to hand out 72 hours later; how do you do that without anyone (teacher or student) touching the papers?  So the 72 hours is probably a completely ineffectual precaution.  Also, materials testing indicates that paper and cardboard are among the least transmissive materials anyway.  

Not trying to judge; just pointing out some observations.


----------



## Meglen

bankr63 said:


> One good example of the difficulty from DW's school.  This is a middle school, so there is no busing to school; all students must get there on their own.  That means roughly 200 students take city transit (OC Transpo).  So the school must try to keep them properly distanced on school property; that is a 200m. long lineup - roughly 2 football fields.  But the second they step to the curb and onto the bus, that all goes out the window.
> 
> Her general feedback from week one is that it is indeed impossible.  Some of the protocols are not well thought out, and the students appear more like prisoners than classmates.  Each cohort has an area on the schoolyard, but the students must maintain social distance; more space if they remove their masks.  So you have a field full of kids standing 6 feet apart for 20 minutes; no gear can be shared (like balls) - perhaps a child could bring their own skipping rope?  The teachers on duty must enforce this.  In the classroom students must sit in their desks and not move about unless necessary.  Lunch must be eaten facing forward with mask off to prevent spread, no turning around and conversing with friends.
> 
> Teachers have been provided with thick heavy face shields that muffle sound so much that they can't be heard at the back of the class; thinner flexible shields might have worked better. My favorite dumb rule is that handouts must be printed 72 hours before distributing.  Nobody thought that one through - you don't touch every handout when printing - maybe the top and bottom copy when removing from the printer. Those two could be discarded, or gloves could be worn.  But then it comes time to hand out 72 hours later; how do you do that without anyone (teacher or student) touching the papers?  So the 72 hours is probably a completely ineffectual precaution.  Also, materials testing indicates that paper and cardboard are among the least transmissive materials anyway.
> 
> Not trying to judge; just pointing out some observations.


I missed a few replys to my post so I will reply to yours but  inclued my words for the others. I 100% understand its crazy and hard and some of the "rules" are insane(the paper hand outs) He did tell the truth but it just didnt give me hope for any change to try better. These teachers were on there phones not watching the kids during the breaks. The PE teach is around the building while the kids do as they please. I miss the times this was not an issue but.. damn. He is now full distance due to not much changed and my son was more worried about the boys roughhosing around him in his small space than enjoying his fresh air. I appreciate all the input. I might have over reacted I just wanna make sure my sons following rules and its hard when other children do not and ruin it for him


----------



## vegs1

Meglen said:


> I missed a few replys to my post so I will reply to yours but  inclued my words for the others. I 100% understand its crazy and hard and some of the "rules" are insane(the paper hand outs) He did tell the truth but it just didnt give me hope for any change to try better. These teachers were on there phones not watching the kids during the breaks. The PE teach is around the building while the kids do as they please. I miss the times this was not an issue but.. damn. He is now full distance due to not much changed and my son was more worried about the boys roughhosing around him in his small space than enjoying his fresh air. I appreciate all the input. I might have over reacted I just wanna make sure my sons following rules and its hard when other children do not and ruin it for him



Are the children playing around your son not part of his cohort?  I am not judging just asking as I am not 100% sure on how this works. My understanding is that kids out at the same time can play together. Is this not correct?

I think it’s a hard time for everyone. We want our kids safe but I don’t think we can put everything on the teachers. There is a risk in sending the kids back but there is also a risk if you don’t. My neighbour (a teacher) also mentioned that they use their phones during breaks to keep other teachers apprised of where they are in the yard, who is coming out, going in,  etc. Perhaps this is what the teacher was doing?


----------



## Meglen

vegs1 said:


> Are the children playing around your son not part of his cohort?  I am not judging just asking as I am not 100% sure on how this works. My understanding is that kids out at the same time can play together. Is this not correct?
> 
> I think it’s a hard time for everyone. We want our kids safe but I don’t think we can put everything on the teachers. There is a risk in sending the kids back but there is also a risk if you don’t. My neighbour (a teacher) also mentioned that they use their phones during breaks to keep other teachers apprised of where they are in the yard, who is coming out, going in,  etc. Perhaps this is what the teacher was doing?


The school is enforcing social distance for every child regarless of cohert. They have markers in the school for everything so just seemed odd that once outside they can legit wrestle and scream and yell in ppls faces. Just the 2 rules dont mix. Thats the only point I wanted to get across. They are strict till outside where they are meant to just relax and breath but the kids wanted to use it like recess ( I 100% dont blame them I would want to aswell theses are 11-14 year olds this situation is lost on them). So either its safe enough to let them hang out and play around or its so dangerous that they need masks and 6 foot desk space all day.. I dunno if I am expresing my concerns the right way. Sorry if its all over the place.


----------



## vegs1

Meglen said:


> The school is enforcing social distance for every child regarless of cohert. They have markers in the school for everything so just seemed odd that once outside they can legit wrestle and scream and yell in ppls faces. Just the 2 rules dont mix. Thats the only point I wanted to get across. They are strict till outside where they are meant to just relax and breath but the kids wanted to use it like recess ( I 100% dont blame them I would want to aswell theses are 11-14 year olds this situation is lost on them). So either its safe enough to let them hang out and play around or its so dangerous that they need masks and 6 foot desk space all day.. I dunno if I am expresing my concerns the right way. Sorry if its all over the place.



It sounds like you are frustrated and I totally get that. We all just want this over with. Unfortunately, we will all have to find our ways to get through this. Be kind to yourself and take time for yourself. Dealing with kids, school, work, covid is just stressful.


----------



## Iralyn

Meglen said:


> The school is enforcing social distance for every child regarless of cohert. They have markers in the school for everything so just seemed odd that once outside they can legit wrestle and scream and yell in ppls faces. Just the 2 rules dont mix. Thats the only point I wanted to get across. They are strict till outside where they are meant to just relax and breath but the kids wanted to use it like recess ( I 100% dont blame them I would want to aswell theses are 11-14 year olds this situation is lost on them). So either its safe enough to let them hang out and play around or its so dangerous that they need masks and 6 foot desk space all day.. I dunno if I am expresing my concerns the right way. Sorry if its all over the place.



I 100% understand.  I think I may have expressed this earlier in the thread prior to school starting.  I found that the policies were almost contradictory about many things....this is important EXCEPT in this circumstance where it would cost money or too much hassle and then it doesn't matter any more.  A bit frustrating.  Feels like we are putting on safety theatre in some ways....doing things for show while admitting behind the scenes that we have a limited ability to keep kids safe if Covid enters our school community.   I'm glad my admin has finally acknowledged that this is the case.  She even questions wearing masks for the rest of the day when they take them off for lunch at their desks.  Of course, she will enforce the mask rules (I'm glad!) and would never say that to the students or parents.


----------



## bankr63

Another quick note from our trench.
I am shocked at how quiet my street has suddenly become.  We have a few families on our street with school aged kids who have been cohorted together for the summer.  Like anyone could actually keep them apart.  There is always a ball or hockey game of some sort going on in front of our house. Unfortunately one of the kids developed some symptoms and it spread in a day.  Now the street has been incredibly quiet since Saturday morning,  and I miss the commotion.  The families are all isolating as they wait for test results.  Wishing them all 'good news'.


----------



## FigmentSpark

Just got an email from our school.  There was a case reported there in a student.  They assured us our kids are in no danger (but still need to be vigilant).  They won't say who it is due to privacy, but they also didn't say which cohort or grade or even the last time the student was in class.  I would like to know if my kid was in a class with this person and if it was recently.


----------



## Meglen

FigmentSpark said:


> Just got an email from our school.  There was a case reported there in a student.  They assured us our kids are in no danger (but still need to be vigilant).  They won't say who it is due to privacy, but they also didn't say which cohort or grade or even the last time the student was in class.  I would like to know if my kid was in a class with this person and if it was recently.


This... really makes zero sense. Wouldnt they want to notify the correct people so they can keep a closer eye on it and get tested if needed? Having the whole school shut down over 1 kid seems silly if it was in a specific cohort, Privacy is fine.. but to nto even say the class room is another level. I would be on the phone or email finding out.


----------



## hdrolfe

FigmentSpark said:


> Just got an email from our school.  There was a case reported there in a student.  They assured us our kids are in no danger (but still need to be vigilant).  They won't say who it is due to privacy, but they also didn't say which cohort or grade or even the last time the student was in class.  I would like to know if my kid was in a class with this person and if it was recently.



So I got an email like that yesterday but was also assured that those who had come in contact with the person would be contacted by the Public Health office. One of my son's friends has a little sister and her class is the one impacted so I know their mom was contacted and told her daughter needs to isolate for 14 days or get tested. No names, just that the class is impacted. The board also publishes the number of kids or teachers at each of their schools who are infected and whether it results in a class, cohort or the school being isolated. Not super helpful but I would assume that for contact tracing they would let families know if their child was in the same class as someone who tested positive.

It took 2 students and 2 teachers in a school to shut the whole school down here (Ottawa Catholic Board). And they set up testing for the whole school as well.


----------



## scrappinginontario

FigmentSpark said:


> Just got an email from our school.  There was a case reported there in a student.  They assured us our kids are in no danger (but still need to be vigilant).  They won't say who it is due to privacy, but they also didn't say which cohort or grade or even the last time the student was in class.  I would like to know if my kid was in a class with this person and if it was recently.


A friend's school in Halton Catholic had a case yesterday.  Public Health contacted all people in the cohort then an email was sent to the entire school advising them there was a case in the school but if they had not been contacted by Public Health that the case was not in their cohort.


----------



## Forevermarypoppins

One full week of school and by Friday's end there was one positive Covid case. TWO classes are now home for virtual learning for 2 weeks. The classes are one with the infected student, the other is that student's sibling's class.  My grandson is now on day 2 of being home for virtual school  grade K.  I won't bore with details. I will say this: IF this goes to ALL Virtual school year, we ( my family)  are doomed.


----------



## FigmentSpark

scrappinginontario said:


> A friend's school in Halton Catholic had a case yesterday.  Public Health contacted all people in the cohort then an email was sent to the entire school advising them there was a case in the school but if they had not been contacted by Public Health that the case was not in their cohort.


That's good to know.  My email said Public Health determined there was no exposure in the school.  I don't know how they would know that unless the person was from a cohort that hadn't been to school yet or hadn't been in a week and was exposed after that?  I think understanding their methods of the determination might go a long way to alleviating people's concerns and trusting in the system.


----------



## tonga

My son is doing virtual learning, but we got an email from his school (Ottawa Catholic school board) saying that everyone who was considered a class contact of the high school student had been notified by an earlier email.


----------



## MoreTravels

Daisy*Duck*y said:


> We are in BC and things are going well for us.
> 
> Here, we only have to keep our children home the exact day they have any of the symptoms. The child does not need a negative Covid test in order to return to school.
> 
> If you do want to test your child for Covid, there is now a spit test (instead of the nose test) for children that is just becoming available. There is also a plan to make the new test available for adults in addition to children.
> 
> Edit: The spit test might be for children age 4+, and not for younger children. (They have to alternate at 5 second intervals between gargling and swishing, perhaps?)
> 
> Adults can be tested at Children’s Hospital if they call ahead and pre-register. Presumably so that you can go with your children to be tested.



The news just came out today in BC, they simply eliminated a whole bunch of symptoms in their screening list. It may just be me but I feel this is a cheating way to say we have less cases and exposures. So now the kids can go back to school with running nose and sore throat... I think it's like statistics, you change the cut off threshold so you will have less "false positive" in your screening but at a cost of missing "true positive". The thing with COVID is that we should not miss a true positive as much as possible. 

Would they do this with airport screening? I am just picturing TSA saying there are too many questions about if one brings this and that, let's just shorten the screening questions, then there will be less "positive" so more entry allowed?! 

As a parent, I am worried about this change... and hopefully the rest of Canada does not follow.


----------



## Best_Vacation_EVER!

tonga said:


> My son is doing virtual learning, but we got an email from his school (Ottawa Catholic school board) saying that everyone who was considered a class contact of the high school student had been notified by an earlier email.



WOW... ds is a OCSB student doing in class learning alternate days -- ds said a classmates family member had symptoms earlier last week ---and the family finally got tested Sunday (because they don't have endless time to wait in line --because --- well they need to be at work....)  We still don't know the result.

Maybe .... just maybe... rather than ranting against one-off random parties... the gov't should focus on providing the volumes of testing that doesn't require a working person with to spend hours in line for themselves or their kids and instead provide a quick turn around ... The fact that testing is a crap-shoot --- and even if you get in it may take many days to get the result...  maybe if we want to know who has the virus we should make testing easy, timely, effective and provide usable info quickly.


----------



## wdwmom3

Best_Vacation_EVER! said:


> WOW... ds is a OCSB student doing in class learning alternate days -- ds said a classmates family member had symptoms earlier last week ---and the family finally got tested Sunday (because they don't have endless time to wait in line --because --- well they need to be at work....)  We still don't know the result.
> 
> Maybe .... just maybe... rather than ranting against one-off random parties... the gov't should focus on providing the volumes of testing that doesn't require a working person with to spend hours in line for themselves or their kids and instead provide a quick turn around ... The fact that testing is a crap-shoot --- and even if you get in it may take many days to get the result...  maybe if we want to know who has the virus we should make testing easy, timely, effective and provide usable info quickly.


Umm I hope these people are working from home.  If people are concerned enough to go get a covid test they should not be going to work and should be isolating.


----------



## Meglen

wdwmom3 said:


> Umm I hope these people are working from home.  If people are concerned enough to go get a covid test they should not be going to work and should be isolating.


Some people dont have the ability to do this anymore. saddly


----------



## wdwmom3

Best_Vacation_EVER! said:


> WOW... ds is a OCSB student doing in class learning alternate days -- ds said a classmates family member had symptoms earlier last week ---and the family finally got tested Sunday (because they don't have endless time to wait in line --because --- well they need to be at work....)  We still don't know the result.
> 
> Maybe .... just maybe... rather than ranting against one-off random parties... the gov't should focus on providing the volumes of testing that doesn't require a working person with to spend hours in line for themselves or their kids and instead provide a quick turn around ... The fact that testing is a crap-shoot --- and even if you get in it may take many days to get the result...  maybe if we want to know who has the virus we should make testing easy, timely, effective and provide usable info quickly.



And they are working on ramping up testing. I have heard they will soon be offering testing at pharmacies.


----------



## wdwmom3

Meglen said:


> Some people dont have the ability to do this anymore. saddly



sorry but they should be.  If you are concerned that you have covid, enough to get a test, and you go to work etc then you are knowingly putting people at risk.


----------



## hdrolfe

Ottawa put in place some new fines, $5000 per day for anyone breaking the quarantine/isolation:
(a) are identified as a person diagnosed with COVID-19; 
(b) have the signs and symptoms of COVID-19, have been tested for COVID-19 and are awaiting the results of their test; 
(c) otherwise have reasonable grounds to believe they have one or more symptoms of COVID-19; or 
(d) are a close contact* of a person identified in (a), (b) or (c). 
*"close contact" means you are caring for or living in the same household with someone who has COVID-19 or have otherwise been identified as a close contact by the Medical Officer of Health or Ottawa Public Health staff acting under the direction of the Medical Officer of Helath (“Ottawa Public Health”). 

I can only imagine how many families this impacts since if there is a case in a classroom the whole class is asked to isolate, which impacts the entire family. If there are other kids in the family those grades are impacted as well... and so on. Honestly, they should be prepared to send all the kids home to online learning sooner than later because at this rate it's going to get bad fast. I mean it already has really, so many more cases just since school started. Crazy.


----------



## Meglen

wdwmom3 said:


> sorry but they should be.  If you are concerned that you have covid, enough to get a test, and you go to work etc then you are knowingly putting people at risk.


Oh I agree with you.. but some cant jsut take time off


----------



## wdwmom3

Meglen said:


> Oh I agree with you.. but some cant jsut take time off



I don’t care.  They need to.  Other people can’t afford to get sick and possible die.


----------



## Donald - my hero

wdwmom3 said:


> And they are working on ramping up testing. I have heard they will soon be offering testing at pharmacies.


*Am I the only person who's extremely concerned about this possibility??!! I don't want to be standing in line to pick up a script in the same area that they give the flu shots (where i'm expecting that *they* figure will be the best spot for testing to take place) with people who are concerned enough that they are getting a COVID test. Who will be doing the testing? If it's a pharmacist I don't want them having any contact with my medications after they complete a test. The drug store is usually already full of people who are ill or have some kind of pre-existing condition. 

OK, enough of the semi-rant that's waaay off topic*


----------



## vegs1

Donald - my hero said:


> *Am I the only person who's extremely concerned about this possibility??!! I don't want to be standing in line to pick up a script in the same area that they give the flu shots (where i'm expecting that *they* figure will be the best spot for testing to take place) with people who are concerned enough that they are getting a COVID test. Who will be doing the testing? If it's a pharmacist I don't want them having any contact with my medications after they complete a test. The drug store is usually already full of people who are ill or have some kind of pre-existing condition.
> 
> OK, enough of the semi-rant that's waaay off topic*



You are not!  I thought the whole idea was crazy. While I am picking up my prescription, I can be near 20 people who may have Covid 19 and are being tested for it. I think it should be somewhere well away from the daily public traffic.


----------



## MoreTravels

One way is to set up pick-up lockers inside pharmacy. The prescription needs to prepaid by credit card or insurance direct billing. When a patient arrives, s/he phones in and speaks to the pharmacist. The pharmacist advises on the side effects then provide locker number and unlock code for the patient to pick up. The lockers are at the front of store near the new self checkout kiosks. This way, contactless pick up.

If it’s a new prescription, your MD can fax or send it electronically to the pharmacy of your choice.

So it is possible from a technical point of view to arrange contactless medication dispensing.


----------



## Peachy0118

MoreTravels said:


> The news just came out today in BC, they simply eliminated a whole bunch of symptoms in their screening list. It may just be me but I feel this is a cheating way to say we have less cases and exposures. So now the kids can go back to school with running nose and sore throat... I think it's like statistics, you change the cut off threshold so you will have less "false positive" in your screening but at a cost of missing "true positive". The thing with COVID is that we should not miss a true positive as much as possible.
> 
> Would they do this with airport screening? I am just picturing TSA saying there are too many questions about if one brings this and that, let's just shorten the screening questions, then there will be less "positive" so more entry allowed?!
> 
> As a parent, I am worried about this change... and hopefully the rest of Canada does not follow.



I'm a teacher in  Alberta near the BC border and this concerns me IMMENSELY. We have low to no cases at the moment, reported anyway, but every day I have more kids home sick.

As an idea, if a kid in my "cohort" gets sick, I get tested and am positive, that will affect 120 students. I teach 4 classes and have supervision with two more. That is half of our small school... So if a teacher gets sick, that will almost certainly shut down our school for a while. 

I think it depends a lot on where you are. But I have been telling all my friends with school-age children: your kid WILL be at home again for some amount of time. Get your childcare plans in place now. It might be two weeks, it might be several months. I know it sucks and it is hard, but it is going to suck more and be even harder when you just get the call that he has to stay home. Plan in advance as best you can.

I just think it is a good idea for everyone. I certainly yope it doesn't happen, but...


----------



## Silvermist999

Donald - my hero said:


> *Am I the only person who's extremely concerned about this possibility??!! I don't want to be standing in line to pick up a script in the same area that they give the flu shots (where i'm expecting that *they* figure will be the best spot for testing to take place) with people who are concerned enough that they are getting a COVID test. Who will be doing the testing? If it's a pharmacist I don't want them having any contact with my medications after they complete a test. The drug store is usually already full of people who are ill or have some kind of pre-existing condition.
> 
> OK, enough of the semi-rant that's waaay off topic*



Totally crazy.100% agree with you.  And it is really happening soon. Like this Friday!  As a start.

I did a quick check and thankfully my Shoppers location isn’t on the list, yet.

https://news.ontario.ca/en/backgrounder/58491/ontario-expands-covid-19-testing-to-pharmacies-1
I think “regular“business will go down for these locations.  I wonder how many are independently owned vs. corporate.


----------



## Silvermist999

vegs1 said:


> You are not!  I thought the whole idea was crazy. While I am picking up my prescription, I can be near 20 people who may have Covid 19 and are being tested for it. I think it should be somewhere well away from the daily public traffic.



Exactly! Shoppers isn't only a pharmacy, they also sell groceries, and other household goods as well.  Not to mention many locations have a post office inside. This makes absolutely no sense.


----------



## vegs1

MoreTravels said:


> One way is to set up pick-up lockers inside pharmacy. The prescription needs to prepaid by credit card or insurance direct billing. When a patient arrives, s/he phones in and speaks to the pharmacist. The pharmacist advises on the side effects then provide locker number and unlock code for the patient to pick up. The lockers are at the front of store near the new self checkout kiosks. This way, contactless pick up.
> 
> If it’s a new prescription, your MD can fax or send it electronically to the pharmacy of your choice.
> 
> So it is possible from a technical point of view to arrange contactless medication dispensing.



I was using the prescription as an example. Pharmacies sell much more than prescriptions.


----------



## Debbie

60 pharmacies in total across Ontario. Nothing west of Mississauga (unless I missed it). And, if I'm not mistaken, they are suggesting that the people getting a test at the pharmacies should have *no* symptoms freeing up the current testing centres for those with symptoms. Yes, they could be asymptomatic, but no different than anyone else in the store. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toro...tario-september-23-fall-plan-part-2-1.5735266


----------



## pigletto

The pharmacy tests are for people with zero symptoms , by appointment only . They are required to wear a mask and socially distance . Other than the appointment that literally describes every single person in that store already . It’s just going to ease congestion for the COVID clinics who are taking people with symptoms .

I would ask the store but I highly doubt the persons administering the swab will then be preparing prescriptions. They will be  subject to the same professional standards and procedures as the clinicians  who test in the clinics.

I think by only taking the people with no symptoms they will be  alleviating a lot of the congestion out of the lines for the clinics .

My sister works in a museum . She had dinner with another part time employee who works at another job . At the other job that part time employee worked in the same building with someone who’s mother in law tested positive for COVID . My sisters boss got wind of this and sent my sister home demanding a test . There was virtually zero chance that my sister would have had COVID . But she had to have a  test . This is a perfect person for the pharmacy program . The vague loose connection people who need a test “just in case “.


----------



## scrappinginontario

There are 60 locations across the province.  Considering the number of Shopper's Drug Marts, many (I understand not all) have an option of going to a different location if they do not want to risk being in a location where they are testing.  I can walk to 3 locations from my home and there are many more within a 10 minute drive.  I know it's not the same for all but we also need to remember why they're doing this.  People are begging for more locations for people to be tested as many places people are waiting hours and hours in line.

I really do feel this is a good option for most, especially since it's being done by appointment which is what people in this thread have been asking for over and over again.


----------



## quandrea

Donald - my hero said:


> *Am I the only person who's extremely concerned about this possibility??!! I don't want to be standing in line to pick up a script in the same area that they give the flu shots (where i'm expecting that *they* figure will be the best spot for testing to take place) with people who are concerned enough that they are getting a COVID test. Who will be doing the testing? If it's a pharmacist I don't want them having any contact with my medications after they complete a test. The drug store is usually already full of people who are ill or have some kind of pre-existing condition.
> 
> OK, enough of the semi-rant that's waaay off topic*


My husband said this very thing this afternoon. We go to a tiny, independent pharmacy so I don’t think we will be impacted.


----------



## MoreTravels

pigletto said:


> The pharmacy tests are for people with zero symptoms , by appointment only . They are required to wear a mask and socially distance . Other than the appointment that literally describes every single person in that store already . It’s just going to ease congestion for the COVID clinics who are taking people with symptoms .
> 
> I would ask the store but I highly doubt the persons administering the swab will then be preparing prescriptions. They will be  subject to the same professional standards and procedures as the clinicians  who test in the clinics.
> 
> I think by only taking the people with no symptoms they will be  alleviating a lot of the congestion out of the lines for the clinics .
> 
> My sister works in a museum . She had dinner with another part time employee who works at another job . At the other job that part time employee worked in the same building with someone who’s mother in law tested positive for COVID . My sisters boss got wind of this and sent my sister home demanding a test . There was virtually zero chance that my sister would have had COVID . But she had to have a  test . This is a perfect person for the pharmacy program . The vague loose connection people who need a test “just in case “.



There is also the example of travelers. Some countries and destinations, including Hawaii, would require a negative test before allowing an asymptomatic traveler to enter. https://www.gohawaii.com/safe-travels

There are LTC employees and visitors that are asked to do weekly test regardless if they have symptoms or not.

All these examples would be a good fit for community pharmacies to perform the test.


----------



## Starwind

MoreTravels said:


> One way is to set up pick-up lockers inside pharmacy. The prescription needs to prepaid by credit card or insurance direct billing. When a patient arrives, s/he phones in and speaks to the pharmacist. The pharmacist advises on the side effects then provide locker number and unlock code for the patient to pick up. The lockers are at the front of store near the new self checkout kiosks. This way, contactless pick up.
> 
> If it’s a new prescription, your MD can fax or send it electronically to the pharmacy of your choice.
> 
> So it is possible from a technical point of view to arrange contactless medication dispensing.



The pharmacy my Rx are at has two contactless options:

- the Rx can be delivered to your house if you are within the pharmacy's delivery zone [the service is free; they have a delivery service that does the deliveries OR

- you can call the pharmacy and arrange that you will pick it up outside the store; basically when you arrive you would call them back and they would send a pharmacy team member out with it to your car; a version of curbside pickup; it would be paid for by credit card through the first phone call.

When I needed my Rx renewed recently, the "visit" with my Family MD was be telephone due to covid, and she faxed the Rx to my pharmacy.

The pharmacy can also fax your MD if Rx have come time to renew, though your MD may then contact you for an appointment to discuss. Also, some doctors do charge a nominal fee for renewals initiated by the pharmacy, though many have dropped that during the pandemic.

SW


----------



## hdrolfe

For the pharmacy testing, I think also the kids in a class with a case would benefit. In all likelihood they aren't infected but their class would have to be isolated until they have a negative test result, and that could be the whole family. I am happy we will have more options since it has been so hard to get tested here. There are people going every two weeks and when schools reopened I think the testing sites (here at least) simply got overwhelmed. We have people lining up at 4:30 in the morning when the place doesn't open until 9. By 9:30 they are full for the day... It's crazy.


----------



## MoreTravels

Some good news for the parents.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/early-da...potential-coronavirus-transmission-in-schools


----------



## bookbabe626

MoreTravels said:


> There is also the example of travelers. Some countries and destinations, including Hawaii, would require a negative test before allowing an asymptomatic traveler to enter. https://www.gohawaii.com/safe-travels
> 
> There are LTC employees and visitors that are asked to do weekly test regardless if they have symptoms or not.
> 
> All these examples would be a good fit for community pharmacies to perform the test.



This!  We have property in Cayman that we haven’t been able to get some essential maintenance done on since January (we were supposed to go in March just as the borders all closed).  They have no cases, and the border is reopening for property owners with some fairly strict requirements, one of which is that pre-travel covid test.  I am very reluctant to spend a day in line at a testing site surrounded by symptomatic people who suspect they have covid, no matter how much social distancing and masking is going on.  I will happily make a pharmacy appointment for testing, though.  That sounds much safer to me.


----------



## pigletto

MoreTravels said:


> Some good news for the parents.
> 
> https://www.foxnews.com/us/early-da...potential-coronavirus-transmission-in-schools


Sorry but no way in heck am I taking that as anything but a sign of the current US administration running their agenda. It can be hard to find an unbiased news source, Fox News doesn’t even pretend to be one.


----------



## isabellea

Today we received an e-mail from the school to fill a survey for our computer needs in the eventuality we could go virtual in the future for a 2-week period or longer. They asked if we had enough computers for each school-aged child so they can assign Chromebooks to the families that need one or more. I thought it was a good sign that the school and school board are planning ahead so they are ready if that eventuality happens. Luckily, we are okay since we have an old Macbook Pro that we got tuned-up at the Apple Store (changed battery and had them do a big clean-up) in July and I just bought a small Chromebook (11.5'' so tiny) with my PC points. Just need to check what kind of cable I need to buy to connect the Chromebook to a bigger computer monitor we have in storage. Both my daughters (Grade 3 and 6) are already using Google Classroom as a virtual platform in class.


----------



## scrappinginontario

We received a similar survey Tues. I requested a Chromebook for my daughter as we only have an iPad at home which won’t cut it for full time schooling.

Fastforward to tonight when I was watching her do her homework and the iPad kept correcting her properly spelled a French words into English (she’s in French immersion) and I was especially thankful I’d requested one!!


----------



## wdwmom3

So just wanted to update everyone about ds’s first full week back at school.  He’s not bothered by the masks at all.  Says he’s used to it now. Best thing is, I see the spark in him coming back.  Even with all the uncertainty he seems happy again, excited to be back with friends and have a routine.  

We haven’t sugar coated things for him either.  He knows there have been cases in schools around here and he knows he could be back at home soon.  But he seems to just enjoy being back for now.  I knew he needed it, but didn’t know how much until I saw such a big difference in one week.


----------



## vegs1

scrappinginontario said:


> We received a similar survey Tues. I requested a Chromebook for my daughter as we only have an iPad at home which won’t cut it for full time schooling.
> 
> Fastforward to tonight when I was watching her do her homework and the iPad kept correcting her properly spelled a French words into English (she’s in French immersion) and I was especially thankful I’d requested one!!



I’m sure the iPad won’t work as well for full time learning but you can turn off autocorrect. Just go to settings - general - keyboard - autocorrect. Toggle off.


----------



## wdwmom3

So we also just got an email from our school.  I guess a lot of parents have been inquiring about indoor shoes.  Especially if it’s raining. Well I guess our school staff asked the board for guidance,  but nobody is answering them.  So our principal basically said screw it, and has said kids can bring indoor shoes to leave at school.  

Honestly I think a lot of school issues are being caused by the school boards lack of ability to act on anything in a timely manner.  I mean who can’t make a decision about indoor shoes


----------



## scrappinginontario

vegs1 said:


> I’m sure the iPad won’t work as well for full time learning but you can turn off autocorrect. Just go to settings - general - keyboard - autocorrect. Toggle off.


Thanks for the tip re auto-correct!  I'll look into that for sure!

We purchased a Brydge wireless keyboard for the iPad in the spring when she was learning from home and that, coupled with typing.com and learning how to touch-type worked really well for most of her needs.  Since the school has been able to acquire more Chromebooks, I won't feel bad requesting one whereas in the spring i knew she could make do with the iPad.  

Our board provides Chromebooks to all students in Grades 7 - 12 which is wonderful!  This program has been in place for as long as I remember.  My daughter is in Gr 6 of a 6/7 split so already has a Chromebook assigned just to her but she cannot bring it home as she is only in Gr 6.  The one already assigned to her will be the one she brings home if/when we flip to virtual learning so that works out wonderfully!


----------



## MoreTravels

I would remind parents to pay attention to screen size, light level, and reading posture.
After my kid went through synchronous online learning, his vision has deteriorated from 20/20 to myopia needing glasses just in 6 months. I am not sure what more I can do to slow it down but I am worried about his vision especially when everything is Google Classroom this and Edsby that.


----------



## tgropp

wdwmom3 said:


> So just wanted to update everyone about ds’s first full week back at school.  He’s not bothered by the masks at all.  Says he’s used to it now. Best thing is, I see the spark in him coming back.  Even with all the uncertainty he seems happy again, excited to be back with friends and have a routine.
> 
> We haven’t sugar coated things for him either.  He knows there have been cases in schools around here and he knows he could be back at home soon.  But he seems to just enjoy being back for now.  I knew he needed it, but didn’t know how much until I saw such a big difference in one week.


I have talked to many people who say the same things.....their children are care free once again. We can only hope it lasts.


----------



## quandrea

I got a letter yesterday from the College of teachers in Ontario asking me to come back to the classroom. Haven’t taught in Ontario public schools for seventeen years. They are desperate for staff.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

pigletto said:


> Sorry but no way in heck am I taking that as anything but a sign of the current US administration running their agenda. It can be hard to find an unbiased news source, Fox News doesn’t even pretend to be one.



None of the US news stations are unbiased.  CNN is definitely the worst news outlet ever. Most are Democratic stations and they are all fake news.


----------



## pigletto

ilovetotravel1977 said:


> None of the US news stations are unbiased.  CNN is definitely the worst news outlet ever. Most are Democratic stations and they are all fake news.


No, there are unbiased sources but you have to look for them. This is a great place to check the source of the information and what you are reading.
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/
CNN is most definitely left biased, but given that you are calling  it the ”worst ever” and referring to “fake news“ it would appear you align more with Republican bias. I don’t read or watch either as I prefer actual fact based information. I most often check the Associated Press but there are plenty of others that don’t fall into the infotainment trap.


----------



## pigletto

scrappinginontario said:


> We received a similar survey Tues. I requested a Chromebook for my daughter as we only have an iPad at home which won’t cut it for full time schooling.
> 
> Fastforward to tonight when I was watching her do her homework and the iPad kept correcting her properly spelled a French words into English (she’s in French immersion) and I was especially thankful I’d requested one!!


There’s also a specific keyboard you can download or switch to for French Immersion. My sons not home but I will ask when he is . I remember him using it in elementary . He must still but I don’t check his work anymore.


----------



## ilovetotravel1977

@pigletto DH and I were just saying how we hate watching the news and would rather read articles by other stations ie. AP


----------



## Maddysdaddy

Horror story from out west...  After a further 2 1/2 week delay to start the semester for Hub (online students - primarily core subjects), classes finally started this week. 

One might have thought with six months to plan, the Calgary Board might have figured this out, but no.

Rather than saying something like Monday = math, Tuesday = science, or math = an hour 3x a week between 8 and 10, science = an hour 3x a week between 10 and noon, etc., Hub teachers have been given the flexibility to schedule classes at their convenience (this is not me bashing teachers...)

So it turns out that online class times for my high schooler’s four classes this semester change from day to day. After two teaching days last week, my daughter has had classes scheduled at the same time on both days.

It’s an easy decision if it’s math vs. French, but she’s already had to make the decision of math vs. chemistry. The message from the Board is essentially “we tried our best, but it is what it is”.

I’m fortunate enough that I can help her with social studies and can afford a weekly online tutor for her in math and chem, but I know that most aren’t in the same position.

Seriously, how could administration not have figured this out at some point since March???

We knew that online wouldn’t be as good as being in every class every day, and that it would mean less instructional time - and given that Alberta Health Services declared an outbreak at her school in the first week of classes, we made the right decision - but I guess my expectation of a minimal level of competence from the decision makers was misplaced.


----------



## ottawamom

Some posts are dangerously close to being political. Dial it back a notch people.


----------



## scrappinginontario

Maddysdaddy said:


> Horror story from out west...  After a further 2 1/2 week delay to start the semester for Hub (online students - primarily core subjects), classes finally started this week.
> 
> One might have thought with six months to plan, the Calgary Board might have figured this out, but no.
> 
> Rather than saying something like Monday = math, Tuesday = science, or math = an hour 3x a week between 8 and 10, science = an hour 3x a week between 10 and noon, etc., Hub teachers have been given the flexibility to schedule classes at their convenience (this is not me bashing teachers...)
> 
> So it turns out that online class times for my high schooler’s four classes this semester change from day to day. After two teaching days last week, my daughter has had classes scheduled at the same time on both days.
> 
> It’s an easy decision if it’s math vs. French, but she’s already had to make the decision of math vs. chemistry. The message from the Board is essentially “we tried our best, but it is what it is”.
> 
> I’m fortunate enough that I can help her with social studies and can afford a weekly online tutor for her in math and chem, but I know that most aren’t in the same position.
> 
> Seriously, how could administration not have figured this out at some point since March???
> 
> We knew that online wouldn’t be as good as being in every class every day, and that it would mean less instructional time - and given that Alberta Health Services declared an outbreak at her school in the first week of classes, we made the right decision - but I guess my expectation of a minimal level of competence from the decision makers was misplaced.


How did they think it could possibly work when they ask teachers to choose when they want to teach?  Setting up timetables for students takes a ton of tine and coordination.  Asking teachers to choose (also not slighting the teachers) means students will loose out in valuable teaching time as class tunes get double booked.  I’m sorry you’re having to navigate this!!


----------



## pigletto

ottawamom said:


> Some posts are dangerously close to being political. Dial it back a notch people.


  I wasn’t arguing politics, but pointing out the biases . I’m sure the admin will let us know if lines are crossed.


----------



## pigletto

Maddysdaddy said:


> Horror story from out west...  After a further 2 1/2 week delay to start the semester for Hub (online students - primarily core subjects), classes finally started this week.
> 
> One might have thought with six months to plan, the Calgary Board might have figured this out, but no.
> 
> Rather than saying something like Monday = math, Tuesday = science, or math = an hour 3x a week between 8 and 10, science = an hour 3x a week between 10 and noon, etc., Hub teachers have been given the flexibility to schedule classes at their convenience (this is not me bashing teachers...)
> 
> So it turns out that online class times for my high schooler’s four classes this semester change from day to day. After two teaching days last week, my daughter has had classes scheduled at the same time on both days.
> 
> It’s an easy decision if it’s math vs. French, but she’s already had to make the decision of math vs. chemistry. The message from the Board is essentially “we tried our best, but it is what it is”.
> 
> I’m fortunate enough that I can help her with social studies and can afford a weekly online tutor for her in math and chem, but I know that most aren’t in the same position.
> 
> Seriously, how could administration not have figured this out at some point since March???
> 
> We knew that online wouldn’t be as good as being in every class every day, and that it would mean less instructional time - and given that Alberta Health Services declared an outbreak at her school in the first week of classes, we made the right decision - but I guess my expectation of a minimal level of competence from the decision makers was misplaced.


This must be very frustrating for your daughter. I can’t fathom how this couldn’t have been figured out before now.


----------



## hdrolfe

The schools here are having a hard time keeping teachers, or having enough of them I guess. The public board is warning parents that schools may close. This whole thing is just nuts. So many classes and even schools here being closed.


----------



## wdwmom3

Ok I think I’m missing something with the schools.  Everyone keeps saying in person classes aren’t much smaller.  And I keep hearing there aren’t enough teachers for online. That they have had to hire a lot of new teachers and online classes are huge.

Well the number of students hasn’t jumped drastically.  So where did all the teachers go?  With the same number of students wouldn’t they just have to shift existing teachers around? Maybe hire some new teachers? Am I missing something?


----------



## hdrolfe

From the article I read about teachers here, when teachers have to isolate for 14 days, so they can't teach, they need a substitute for the full time. Meanwhile there is a limit of 50 days a substitute can work in a year, or perhaps that's the retired teachers? So at least one board here has the teacher set up the lessons for the students and then they have someone who is not a teacher but works for the board sit in the room with the students while they do the work. This is more than they'd normally need to use in a year, add in that a lot of the substitutes from previous years possibly got hired to work full time for the year because of the online, there aren't enough occasional teachers. 

I believe they are also limiting the number of schools a particular substitute can work in, at least there was talk of that in the beginning, I'm not sure how it has played out. 

Not sure if the link will work. 

https://www.ottawamatters.com/local...cdsb-working-to-avoid-school-closures-2742471


----------



## Disneylover99

wdwmom3 said:


> Ok I think I’m missing something with the schools.  Everyone keeps saying in person classes aren’t much smaller.  And I keep hearing there aren’t enough teachers for online. That they have had to hire a lot of new teachers and online classes are huge.
> 
> Well the number of students hasn’t jumped drastically.  So where did all the teachers go?  With the same number of students wouldn’t they just have to shift existing teachers around? Maybe hire some new teachers? Am I missing something?



I can only speak about the TDSB, but in school class sizes have been getting smaller as parents choose to pull their children and opt for online. I know there are supposed to be specific entry/exit points to make these changes, but I think the board has been very flexible with parents. They won’t just clapse classes at this point to pull in school teachers into remote so they need to hire. 

Also, a lot of older teachers or teachers with underlying health problems have opted to not come back. I think the supply teacher bank has been depleted. And now they need a separate supply teacher bank of teachers for Online and in school.


----------



## wdwmom3

Disneylover99 said:


> I can only speak about the TDSB, but in school class sizes have been getting smaller as parents choose to pull their children and opt for online. I know there are supposed to be specific entry/exit points to make these changes, but I think the board has been very flexible with parents. They won’t just clapse classes at this point to pull in school teachers into remote so they need to hire.
> 
> Also, a lot of older teachers or teachers with underlying health problems have opted to not come back. I think the supply teacher bank has been depleted. And now they need a separate supply teacher bank of teachers for Online and in school.



Ok so then class sizes must not be as big as some people are claiming? I mean it doesn’t make sense that you have big in person classes and huge online classes but still don’t have enough teachers.

Also why do you need separate supply lists for in person and online?


----------



## Disneylover99

wdwmom3 said:


> Ok so then class sizes must not be as big as some people are claiming? I mean it doesn’t make sense that you have big in person classes and huge online classes but still don’t have enough teachers.


Well, I think it’s just a shift of where the students are at the moment. For the most part, in school class sizes started out at capacity or close to it. But that differs from school to school depending on how many students per grade opted to return to school. I know there are lots of split classes and there was even talk of triple split classes to max out the students in class, but I don’t think it actually went to that. So some 2 split grades  may have way fewer students than the max.



wdwmom3 said:


> Also why do you need separate supply lists for in person and online?



No idea. That’s just what I was told. 

I’m assuming there are many supply teachers who would do remote but wouldn’t be comfortable going into a school and many supply teachers who are willing to go into a school, but wouldn’t feel capable of teaching remote.

Maybe some supply teachers can be on both lists. I’m not sure.


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

I always get confused when they mention having to turn classes into a split class at TDSB. Do they not normally not have split classes in the schools or are they just making more classes splits? Our school has always had split classes so nothing is really that different. They did get rid of the 3/4 probably because it would be hard to enforce mask wearing for only half the class.


----------



## Pumpkin1172

Maddysdaddy said:


> Horror story from out west... After a further 2 1/2 week delay to start the semester for Hub (online students - primarily core subjects), classes finally started this week.
> 
> One might have thought with six months to plan, the Calgary Board might have figured this out, but no.
> 
> Rather than saying something like Monday = math, Tuesday = science, or math = an hour 3x a week between 8 and 10, science = an hour 3x a week between 10 and noon, etc., Hub teachers have been given the flexibility to schedule classes at their convenience (this is not me bashing teachers...)
> 
> So it turns out that online class times for my high schooler’s four classes this semester change from day to day. After two teaching days last week, my daughter has had classes scheduled at the same time on both days.
> 
> It’s an easy decision if it’s math vs. French, but she’s already had to make the decision of math vs. chemistry. The message from the Board is essentially “we tried our best, but it is what it is”.
> 
> I’m fortunate enough that I can help her with social studies and can afford a weekly online tutor for her in math and chem, but I know that most aren’t in the same position.
> 
> Seriously, how could administration not have figured this out at some point since March???
> 
> We knew that online wouldn’t be as good as being in every class every day, and that it would mean less instructional time - and given that Alberta Health Services declared an outbreak at her school in the first week of classes, we made the right decision - but I guess my expectation of a minimal level of competence from the decision makers was misplaced.


I am so sorry that the classes are working out that way.  

We too, are in Alberta (  think northern redneck area   ) and that was one of the reasons we opted to NOT put our ds into online classes.  Both school boards here, would not guarantee that there would be enough teachers or students for online classes.  We were not guaranteed that there would not be multiple grades for one class.  They could not answer questions on how they were going to deliver the classes, how assignments would work, deadlines for assignments, if my ds was struggling with a certain part of the current cirriculum, how would they do more " one on one " teaching.  There were ZERO answers for that.  Our ds really did not want to do online.  He tried when they were doing online after the covid lockdown, but he said it was soooo unorganized and chaotic, he simply gave up.  He wanted to go back to school.  

I will say that for our family, that was the best decision.  We have told him to keep his ears open for any whispers among his peer group for covid testing.   Both myself and dh would NOT want to be the ones to take it into our workplaces - or have to stay home to isolate and loose our wages for 2 weeks.  

I will say that our area has been very low in covid numbers.  We did see a spike up to 12 active cases when school opened with " outbreaks " at 3 ( if I am remembering correctly ) schools.  But now we are sitting at no new cases for over a week and are only at 5 active cases.  We have been very lucky in our area.  People of course were upset when some classrooms were isolated.  But with our numbers now, people are realizing how we can control " outbreaks " ( and Alberta considers an outbreak at 2 people in the same space ) by social distancing and staying home, and get tested if needed.


----------



## Disneylover99

DiaryofaDisneyKid said:


> I always get confused when they mention having to turn classes into a split class at TDSB. Do they not normally not have split classes in the schools or are they just making more classes splits? Our school has always had split classes so nothing is really that different. They did get rid of the 3/4 probably because it would be hard to enforce mask wearing for only half the class.



At most schools in the tdsb, it does seem the norm nowadays. But for the most part, they try to do straight classes when possible. But logistically, it just never seems to work out.


----------



## DiaryofaDisneyKid

Disneylover99 said:


> At most schools in the tdsb, it does seem the norm nowadays. But for the most part, they try to do straight classes when possible. But logistically, it just never seems to work out.


Thanks for clarifying that for me.  Our school always seems to have 1 straight class for each grade plus a split class. Occasionally they will have 2 full classes like Grade 8 this year. My oldest is in Grade 8 and I guess in our area that must have been a baby boom year, LOL.


----------



## bankr63

wdwmom3 said:


> Ok so then class sizes must not be as big as some people are claiming? I mean it doesn’t make sense that you have big in person classes and huge online classes but still don’t have enough teachers.
> 
> Also why do you need separate supply lists for in person and online?


As @Disneylover99 indicates, there are a lot of forces at play here.

First, a great many more teachers than normal took early retirement this year rather than returning.  In DW's school there were 2 early, and 1 scheduled retirement.  Believe me, she considered it herself.  A great many teachers then sought accommodations due to underlying health issues.  Many were granted but many more were not (hopefully most of these are teaching online instead).  So we are starting with a deficit of teachers.  Now also consider that teaching is no longer the esteemed profession it once was; there are not a lot of available trained teachers waiting in the wings to step in.  A great many people with teaching credentials end up in different careers because it is so difficult to break into teaching (usually takes several years of very unstable STO/LTO and partial positions before you get a full time assignment).  If you have moved to another career with decent pay, would you return to teaching THIS year of all years?  Probably not.

Now pressure on supply teachers. Most teachers will teach through any health issue unless they literally cannot get out of bed.  But this year, if they wake up with the slightest of symptoms, they must not go to work, and must isolate until symptoms have been absent for 24 hours.  That is a lot more time off work than in previous years.  But who are the supply teachers.  A great many of them are retired teachers who are supplementing their retirement income.  They do not HAVE to work, they CHOOSE to work because it is convenient to them.  They are generally a bit older than those teachers who are just reaching retirement, so are at greater risk than the main body of teachers.  So I ask you, if you were in that situation, would YOU return to work if you didn't have to?  Lots did not return.

ETA: This is not to imply these are the only pressures, just a couple of the ones I am aware of.

To answer another question, it was just communicated last week that supply or occasional teachers are able to teach in multiple schools, could be up to 5 (or more) per week.  This was on advice of Public Health and was supported by the board and union, although I can tell you that occasional teachers are generally not very happy.  But in thinking it through, I doubt this shifting about will happen much.  Most schools will have no problem keeping their DOTs (designated occasional teachers) busy every day based on the conditions outlined above. 

So here we are 4 weeks into the school year for some, Ottawa's largest board is just starting the 2nd full week of classes.  As reported in the Citizen this weekend, nearly 20% of Ottawa schools are already reporting at least one case of COVID-19.  It will be very hard to keep a lid on this, but they are doing their absolute best to keep the students safe with the resources available to them.  And that is one of the messages delivered to teachers this year - it is safety first, education second.


----------



## Iralyn

bankr63 said:


> Now pressure on supply teachers. Most teachers will teach through any health issue unless they literally cannot get out of bed.  But this year, if they wake up with the slightest of symptoms, they must not go to work, and must isolate until symptoms have been absent for 24 hours.  That is a lot more time off work than in previous years.  But who are the supply teachers.  A great many of them are retired teachers who are supplementing their retirement income.  They do not HAVE to work, they CHOOSE to work because it is convenient to them.  They are generally a bit older than those teachers who are just reaching retirement, so are at greater risk than the main body of teachers.  So I ask you, if you were in that situation, would YOU return to work if you didn't have to?  Lots did not return.



It is dependent upon school board/health unit, but in many places it is 24 hours symptom-free PLUS a negative covid test.  And delays in getting appointments for test plus wait times for results are now often 5 to 7 days or longer (we are on day 8 of waiting and I've heard of people who've waited 10 days!).  So a lot more supply time needed than in the past.  And teachers who have to be off with their school-aged kids with symptoms.

There are also some teachers who've ended up taking child care leaves because they couldn't find day care for little ones.  And likely a higher than usual number on stress leave.

I think the class sizes are really variable.  Some boards have continued to collapse classes and reassign teachers but others have chosen not to after a certain point (obviously it changes up cohorts, etc.) so when people have moved to online (in boards that haven't enforced a firm cutoff date) or withdrawn their kids to homeschool, the classes have become smaller in some cases.  So there are still classes of 30 in places but also classes of 15.


----------



## CanadianKrista

Honestly, this whole thing is a circus.  Between the colds that are keeping kids, their siblings, their parents out of work/school/teaching, and the long line ups for testing, and the long wait for results.....my kids have had less days in school than out, and I don't see it getting any better any time soon.  They are not getting an education right now.  I'm stressed every morning about whether I should or should not be sending them to school.  I wonder if their classmates are home waiting for tests.  I wonder if their teachers are out, and a supply teacher is in who either 1. is high risk and really shouldn't be in a school or 2. has been in multiples schools, knowing a 5th of school in our board have cases.... I reload the board dashboard multiple times a day wondering if this is the time I'll see cases in their schools.  For some places where the cases are low, and the rules can be a little more flexible, in person school makes sense.  For the hot spots in Ontario and Quebec....well, I feel more and more each day like I really made the wrong choice sending my kids back.


----------



## Starwind

Another factor, at least here in Ontario...  According to a radio interview this morning with a representative of the Ontario College of Teachers...

Due to there having been an oversupply of teachers in previous years, recently [they didn't give a timeframe] the teachers colleges in the province have reduced the number of spaces, which has resulted in fewer graduates.

Among other things, new teacher graduates make up a sizable portion of occasional teachers. And they would be who they would turn to to fulfill shortages. 

But there aren't enough in part because there were fewer of them to start with.

SW


----------



## pigletto

My 4 year old nephew had his second Covid test today. In a month. He has what his mom is pretty sure is a cold but they voluntarily took him to be sure . You can’t help but feel bad for my nephew though , who has been so stoic about it, he’s four and has had this test twice now. He got McDonalds for being brave . What a year.


----------



## MoreTravels

I remember back in the university days, one professor teaches a class of 500 students.

With teacher shortage and class cancellation, wouldn't it better to organize online classes across Ontario so the students from Ottawa can attend the same class with students from Windsor? They organize one class with 500 students, and hire a few university students as TA to help with homework correction and Q/A. It would be better than keep postponing and cancelling classes week after week.


----------



## AngelDisney

The students in Virtual School are still students of their day school. The day school is overseeing scheduling and providing support when needed. So, I don’t think it’s possible to cross school boards due to funding.


----------



## bankr63

AngelDisney said:


> The students in Virtual School are still students of their day school. The day school is overseeing scheduling and providing support when needed. So, I don’t think it’s possible to cross school boards due to funding.


This is probably depending on jurisdiction.  I know for Ottawa's largest board (OCDSB), and I assume other parts of the province of Ontario, that the students are not enrolled in their home school.  There are 7 virtual schools (6 Elementary, 1 Secondary) for the OCDSB alone with separate administration and staffing for each virtual school.  This is to accommodate scheduling of staff and students; it would be near impossible to schedule anything larger - remember that students should not have overlapping classes for example, and a teacher can only handle a certain amount of marking and assessment.


----------



## bankr63

CanadianKrista said:


> I reload the board dashboard multiple times a day wondering if this is the time I'll see cases in their schools.


If this is the OCDSB dashboard, it is only updated once per day.  I'm not sure what time it is updated, but the date of last update is at the top of the chart.  If it is the provincial dashboard covid-19.ontario.ca then it is updated once a day, weekdays only, at 10:30 AM.  No need to keep checking back.  I would think the Ottawa dashboard is probably updated at the same time the numbers are reported to the province.


----------



## hdrolfe

bankr63 said:


> This is probably depending on jurisdiction.  I know for Ottawa's largest board (OCDSB), and I assume other parts of the province of Ontario, that the students are not enrolled in their home school.  There are 7 virtual schools (6 Elementary, 1 Secondary) for the OCDSB alone with separate administration and staffing for each virtual school.  This is to accommodate scheduling of staff and students; it would be near impossible to schedule anything larger - remember that students should not have overlapping classes for example, and a teacher can only handle a certain amount of marking and assessment.



Ottawa Catholic board is the same. It wasn't supposed to be but I guess the large uptake for the online version had them alter plans pretty quickly.


----------



## scrappinginontario

I was told on the weekend that my nephew's Gr 3 class and niece's Gr 7 class were told by their teachers that they could take off their masks while seated at their desks.   Seriously?!!  We had an outdoor visit with them on the weekend with the understanding that she had been wearing masks in school.  If I'd known before the visit that she (the Gr 7) wasn't wearing one inside the classroom we wouldn't have gotten together with them, let alone with my parents who are in their 80's.  Yes, we were outside taking advantage of one last visit before it too cold but I was shocked when I heard what they'd been doing.  Our board's website says all children grade 4 and up must wear a mask at all times while inside.    

I questioned my daughter (Gr 6) and thankfully this is not happening in her school.


----------



## wdwmom3

scrappinginontario said:


> I was told on the weekend that my nephew's Gr 3 class and niece's Gr 7 class were told by their teachers that they could take off their masks while seated at their desks.   Seriously?!!  We had an outdoor visit with them on the weekend with the understanding that she had been wearing masks in school.  If I'd known before the visit that she (the Gr 7) wasn't wearing one inside the classroom we wouldn't have gotten together with them, let alone with my parents who are in their 80's.  Yes, we were outside taking advantage of one last visit before it too cold but I was shocked when I heard what they'd been doing.  Our board's website says all children grade 4 and up must wear a mask at all times while inside.
> 
> I questioned my daughter (Gr 6) and thankfully this is not happening in her school.



Are they in Ontario? My understanding is that grade 4 and over mover wear the masks except when eating.  Are there classes small enough that they are actually able to space out well? If not the school is not following what the should be


----------



## scrappinginontario

wdwmom3 said:


> Are they in Ontario? My understanding is that grade 4 and over mover wear the masks except when eating.  Are there classes small enough that they are actually able to space out well? If not the school is not following what the should be


Yes they are in Ontario.  I contacted the school board today and they are contacting the principal.  I feel it should be my brother's responsibility to take it further as it's his children's classes but I felt I was doing the correct thing to bring it to the school board's attention.  Their website clearly states that masks are to be worn at all times (except when eating) in grades 4 and above.  At my daughter's school the children are not even allowed to talk while their masks are off for eating.

They are in average sized classes.  If I believe my child is wearing their mask at school I would be greatly disturbed if the teacher was telling them differently.


----------



## wdwmom3

scrappinginontario said:


> Yes they are in Ontario.  I contacted the school board today and they are contacting the principal.  I feel it should be my brother's responsibility to take it further as it's his children's classes but I felt I was doing the correct thing to bring it to the school board's attention.  Their website clearly states that masks are to be worn at all times (except when eating) in grades 4 and above.  At my daughter's school the children are not even allowed to talk while their masks are off for eating.
> 
> They are in average sized classes.  If I believe my child is wearing their mask at school I would be greatly disturbed if the teacher was telling them differently.



I think you did the right thing.  We are in Ontario and my son has to wear his mask at all times except when they are eating their lunch.  That was the entire point of the government mandating the masks for grade 4 and up.


----------



## pigletto

My daughter is 23 and messaged me last night saying that on the official Facebook page for her old high school there are photos posted by staff of the kids “enjoying their fitness class outdoors “. It’s a grade 11 girls class . In one photo they are all piled on a park bench , 12 of them , with no masks. In the other all piled together on the grass , with the teacher , no masks . And I’m not talking standing close together . Their heads are pressed together .. inches from eachothers faces , including the teacher. She was surprised and ticked off since she works with adults and kids with disabilities and knows how vulnerable they are and how people just don’t seem to care. I told her to write her concerns to the board since they are responsible for those kids and she did . I was proud of her . They didn’t bother to answer her but the pictures came down . 

She was so polite and just pointed out that the school ..”has a strong voice in the community and could be leading by example in a time when we need strong guidance to keep our community safe and thriving . “ 

I’m the first one to say that schools are doing the best the can . But a bunch of 16 year olds and their teacher ignoring social distancing and posting it on social media is just ridiculous .


----------



## scrappinginontario

pigletto said:


> My daughter is 23 and messaged me last night saying that on the official Facebook page for her old high school there are photos posted by staff of the kids “enjoying their fitness class outdoors “. It’s a grade 11 girls class . In one photo they are all piled on a park bench , 12 of them , with no masks. In the other all piled together on the grass , with the teacher , no masks . And I’m not talking standing close together . Their heads are pressed together .. inches from eachothers faces , including the teacher. She was surprised and ticked off since she works with adults and kids with disabilities and knows how vulnerable they are and how people just don’t seem to care. I told her to write her concerns to the board since they are responsible for those kids and she did . I was proud of her . They didn’t bother to answer her but the pictures came down .
> 
> She was so polite and just pointed out that the school ..”has a strong voice in the community and could be leading by example in a time when we need strong guidance to keep our community safe and thriving . “
> 
> I’m the first one to say that schools are doing the best the can . But a bunch of 16 year olds and their teacher ignoring social distancing and posting it on social media is just ridiculous .


Please thank your daughter.  While those 16 year olds may not get sick themselves, it's the older people they interact with that are often at risk.


----------



## bankr63

So today the wheels are starting to get VERY wobbly.  DW's class had 3 kids sent to isolation and then home throughout the day.  Her class had to be evacuated and sanitized each time.  There are about 25 classes in her school.  Imagine the load on the principal and VP who must escort and accompany these kids until they are picked up to go home.  Apparently one school in the district has 16 teachers out today.  The board office had to drop in a whole department of staff and the local trustee to cover as there are not enough substitutes available.
At a staff meeting the administration started talking about what would happen WHEN schools are closed, not IF schools are closed.  This was probably not an official board line, but more likely based on the kind of days the administration (and staff) are dealing with.  Two weeks to Thanksgiving - will the schools make it that far?


----------



## AngelDisney

bankr63 said:


> This is probably depending on jurisdiction.  I know for Ottawa's largest board (OCDSB), and I assume other parts of the province of Ontario, that the students are not enrolled in their home school.  There are 7 virtual schools (6 Elementary, 1 Secondary) for the OCDSB alone with separate administration and staffing for each virtual school.  This is to accommodate scheduling of staff and students; it would be near impossible to schedule anything larger - remember that students should not have overlapping classes for example, and a teacher can only handle a certain amount of marking and assessment.


This is TDSB and I just helped a few students changed their virtual school timetables today as a student success and SHSM teacher. I am supposed to support all our students in virtual school if they got referred by their VS teachers. I don’t know about other school boards. They may have different practices. And anything can change as we reflect and move forward.


----------



## scrappinginontario

bankr63 said:


> So today the wheels are starting to get VERY wobbly.  DW's class had 3 kids sent to isolation and then home throughout the day.  Her class had to be evacuated and sanitized each time.  There are about 25 classes in her school.  Imagine the load on the principal and VP who must escort and accompany these kids until they are picked up to go home.  Apparently one school in the district has 16 teachers out today.  The board office had to drop in a whole department of staff and the local trustee to cover as there are not enough substitutes available.
> At a staff meeting the administration started talking about what would happen WHEN schools are closed, not IF schools are closed.  This was probably not an official board line, but more likely based on the kind of days the administration (and staff) are dealing with.  Two weeks to Thanksgiving - will the schools make it that far?


WOW!!!  May I ask what school board your wife works for?  Sorry she had to go through this.  Sounds like her days in the classroom may be numbered and they may soon be sent to virtual.


----------



## tonga

My son is in the Ottawa Catholic School Board but doing virtual academy.  He is in Grade 7 and still technically enrolled in his home school.  We receive regular communication from the school, heard from the resource teacher to set up his IEP etc.

The French school where a lot of his friends attend sent home all the Grade 7 and 8 students for today and tomorrow to learn virtually as there are too many absent teachers.


----------



## AngelDisney

One of our students tested positive today and he was in school last Friday. We are not informed of who the student is yet, and probably we will have to close down soon! Waiting for more info and direction from Admin.


----------



## Silvermist999

Are any of the schools closing down for one case?  There are so many schools on that list reporting one case. All the schools around here with one case are still open.


----------



## AngelDisney

Silvermist999 said:


> Are any of the schools closing down for one case?  There are so many schools on that list reporting one case. All the schools around here with one case are still open.


I don’t know. It’s two cases with students in the same neighbourhood now. Two schools are in the same community. Hope it’s isolated! Many students cannot handle distance learning!! Fingers crossed!


----------



## pigletto

Our board has a school with three cases and they declared it an outbreak but didn’t close. They did however close five classrooms and isolate the students. One would hope that the plan isn’t to shut entire schools down for one case . They would be closing over and over. Isn’t this specifically what the cohorts are for ?


----------



## ottawamom

I don't have children in school but just reading all these reports I'm getting a scratchy throat and a headache.

Good luck to each and everyone of you during this unusual Fall school season.


----------



## MoreTravels

Is any of you allowing your kids to join team sports yet, like indoor soccer, hockey, or basketball? I am so undecided. Those program organizers say they cannot play tournament yet but they will allow team registration for skill practicing. I know if I don't sign up my kids for something this year, it will hard to make them join any team next year as they don't know any teamate and have lost the sport skills to be competitive... but I am worried about COVID at the same time. If they join, they will meet 10 other local kids from 10 different local schools (eg, public, private, catholic, French immersion, etc) so there is no "bubble or cohort" any more. So I just bring them home from school and they do their homework and watch TV...


----------



## wdwmom3

MoreTravels said:


> Is any of you allowing your kids to join team sports yet, like indoor soccer, hockey, or basketball? I am so undecided. Those program organizers say they cannot play tournament yet but they will allow team registration for skill practicing. I know if I don't sign up my kids for something this year, it will hard to make them join any team next year as they don't know any teamate and have lost the sport skills to be competitive... but I am worried about COVID at the same time. If they join, they will meet 10 other local kids from 10 different local schools (eg, public, private, catholic, French immersion, etc) so there is no "bubble or cohort" any more. So I just bring them home from school and they do their homework and watch TV...



my son is playing hockey and just finished up soccer. For hockey they have cut numbers and only playing 4 on 4. No change rooms. Kids arrive fully dressed. The kids have to wear masks until they put helmets on and they have them sitting spaced on the bench. Only one parents is allowed to watch and mush wear a mask too. We have to fill out a screening form before every game.

They are also trying to limit contact by telling the kids to get no closer then one hockey stick apart.

Remember a sport is a bit different then sitting near people doing things. The kids are constantly moving so they aren’t close to each other for more then a few seconds. Also they are in a large arena with few people. We also have no tournaments in other cities.

If they are doing skills development its even easier to keep the kids spaced out.


----------



## Frozen2014

MoreTravels said:


> Is any of you allowing your kids to join team sports yet, like indoor soccer, hockey, or basketball? I am so undecided. Those program organizers say they cannot play tournament yet but they will allow team registration for skill practicing. I know if I don't sign up my kids for something this year, it will hard to make them join any team next year as they don't know any teamate and have lost the sport skills to be competitive... but I am worried about COVID at the same time. If they join, they will meet 10 other local kids from 10 different local schools (eg, public, private, catholic, French immersion, etc) so there is no "bubble or cohort" any more. So I just bring them home from school and they do their homework and watch TV...


Not a team thing but my son takes karate. Over the summer it was done by zoom but he asked to do the in-class sessions as it's so much better.  They each get their square to stay in and wear masks until they get to that square.  But he goes 2x a week and so the groups aren't necessarily the same group (which isn't good as 2 additional cohorts).  My daughter does dance, but that one she is doing by zoom (but she's the one in school full time).


----------



## meghanb133

We live in Florida and have been out of school since March. We chose to have our 8th grader do virtual this year since she did so well in the spring. We truly were thinking there would be a rise in cases once school started. Our county gave us the option to keep them home for a quarter at a time and then we could send them back. We have been watching things closely and decided we would send her back in late October for the start of the second quarter. 

Tonight we got a call from the school board saying due to flu season, low staff and them wanting to keep Covid numbers low we have to go online to register our students for the opportunity to come back and then they will invite students back based on the number of openings they have at school for the student teacher ratio. It’s basically a lottery. 

I’m really upset because the possibility of this happening was never mentioned. My daughter wants to go back. I joined the lottery tonight and have my fingers crossed we get chosen.


----------



## AngelDisney

meghanb133 said:


> We live in Florida and have been out of school since March. We chose to have our 8th grader do virtual this year since she did so well in the spring. We truly were thinking there would be a rise in cases once school started. Our county gave us the option to keep them home for a quarter at a time and then we could send them back. We have been watching things closely and decided we would send her back in late October for the start of the second quarter.
> 
> Tonight we got a call from the school board saying due to flu season, low staff and them wanting to keep Covid numbers low we have to go online to register our students for the opportunity to come back and then they will invite students back based on the number of openings they have at school for the student teacher ratio. It’s basically a lottery.
> 
> I’m really upset because the possibility of this happening was never mentioned. My daughter wants to go back. I joined the lottery tonight and have my fingers crossed we get chosen.


Sending pixie dust your way!


----------



## FigmentSpark

Frozen2014 said:


> Not a team thing but my son takes karate. Over the summer it was done by zoom but he asked to do the in-class sessions as it's so much better.  They each get their square to stay in and wear masks until they get to that square.  But he goes 2x a week and so the groups aren't necessarily the same group (which isn't good as 2 additional cohorts).  My daughter does dance, but that one she is doing by zoom (but she's the one in school full time).


My son's doing Taekwondo the same way.  No sparring, but practicing patterns in their own square with a limited number of kids in the dojang at a time and wearing masks.  When possible, they go out to the back area and have the class outside.

My other son is doing soccer skills training.  He's played a couple of games, as well.

I think if a person is deciding on putting kids into a sport, check what type of precautions the club is doing.  Some are doing more than others.  If you are not comfortable with what is offered, try another club.  There are plenty of sports and plenty of places to take lessons.


----------



## wdwmom3

FigmentSpark said:


> My son's doing Taekwondo the same way.  No sparring, but practicing patterns in their own square with a limited number of kids in the dojang at a time and wearing masks.  When possible, they go out to the back area and have the class outside.
> 
> My other son is doing soccer skills training.  He's played a couple of games, as well.
> 
> I think if a person is deciding on putting kids into a sport, check what type of precautions the club is doing.  Some are doing more than others.  If you are not comfortable with what is offered, try another club.  There are plenty of sports and plenty of places to take lessons.



Agreed look at specific clubs and their policies.  Also governing bodies for things like hockey and soccer have their own strict rules they should be following.


----------



## quandrea

My daughter is a high performance swimmer on a national team. She has not returned to training. While protocols are in place, parents, swimmers and coaches are breaking the rules left, right and centre. There is no regard for safety unless they are under the watchful eye of the city. When not under direct supervision of the city (while on deck), they do not wear masks, carpool, no social distancing. Given the people and their attitudes, we are sitting this season out.


----------



## wdwmom3

quandrea said:


> My daughter is a high performance swimmer on a national team. She has not returned to training. While protocols are in place, parents, swimmers and coaches are breaking the rules left, right and centre. There is no regard for safety unless they are under the watchful eye of the city. When not under direct supervision of the city (while on deck), they do not wear masks, carpool, no social distancing. Given the people and their attitudes, we are sitting this season out.


That sucks.  So far things for us have been good.


----------



## star72232

FigmentSpark said:


> My son's doing Taekwondo the same way.  No sparring, but practicing patterns in their own square with a limited number of kids in the dojang at a time and wearing masks.  When possible, they go out to the back area and have the class outside.
> 
> My other son is doing soccer skills training.  He's played a couple of games, as well.
> 
> I think if a person is deciding on putting kids into a sport, check what type of precautions the club is doing.  Some are doing more than others.  If you are not comfortable with what is offered, try another club.  There are plenty of sports and plenty of places to take lessons.



My kids do TKD as well.  They are able to spar, but only with siblings (which means that a lot of days don't have any sparring at all, unless it's only sibling groups there - over the summer it was common for my kids to be the only ones, which meant they did spar then).  They do temp checks and attendance every class, and they are limited to numbers (no more than 10).  There is cleaning between groups.  They do outside a lot, and if they are inside they sometimes wear masks (depends on what they are doing/how many are there).  I'm happy with what they do.


----------



## quandrea

wdwmom3 said:


> That sucks.  So far things for us have been good.


It really does. We close our own pool on Tuesday and dd is despondent. She lives to swim and not being able to is the hardest thing about this pandemic. Unfortunately, her club flouts all the public health measures, so we have to be the heavy ones in this situation as parents. She probably won’t get back to training until there is a vaccine.


----------



## Aladora

ottawamom said:


> I don't have children in school but just reading all these reports I'm getting a scratchy throat and a headache.
> 
> Good luck to each and everyone of you during this unusual Fall school season.



We are once again getting quite a bit of smoke coming up from the US wildfires so I've been coughing so much this week! Luckily I don't have any other symptoms at all and our AQ is not great so I know what is causing it but it is still annoying!


----------



## hdrolfe

We missed being able to go to the pool this summer as well, it was almost a blessing that kiddo broke his arm and couldn't swim. Not that he is in lessons or competitive or anything, he just likes to go and do the fun stuff they have, which is all closed. It's basically lane swimming and he's not interested (much as I'd like to take him). Hopefully they figure something out for this stuff sooner or later. 

My office has said they are work from home until at least end of December (I suspect it will go much longer). They have set up some temporary desks on the first floor (so no elevators needed) that you can book for a half day. It's to allow those who need access to paper files, printing etc to be able to do that. I have no need for it thank goodness. But they are coordinating the timing so they know who is in the office when and where they sat etc. Honestly, I can see this being the case going forward, think how much it would save the employer to have people WFM and not have to maintain the office space. 

As for the schools, so many single cases, classes closing, lack of subs... I am really happy about my decision to pull kiddo out of school even though he seems to spend a lot of time with his new over the door basketball hoop in his room, right above my head... he is good to stop when I have a conference all at least! And we've been reading the Harry Potter books (getting all set for someday going to Universal) as well as watching the movies and comparing them.


----------



## pigletto

I watch three kids during the day .. it used to be five but Covid permanently removed one family because they are very high risk and mom had to leave her job.

Yesterday one of the kids woke from nap with a runny nose. Mom is taking him for a test and keeping him home until they have results. This morning I woke with a headache, which isn’t too unusual since I seem to get them often. I took some Tylenol and went on with my day.  As the day has gone on I have been feeling worse and worse. Head hurts , aches, just generally unwell. So I had the other two picked up ( which I HATE to do.. if I can’t do my job, other people can’t either ). I’m waiting for a call back from public health to get a referral to go for a test. We will all be shut down until results are in.
It feels like a bad cold but there’s no way to know for sure without the test. I haven’t felt this sick in a very long time and I think it’s been at least three years since I took a sick day .

I don’t want a Covid swab. I’m weepy and I want my bed. Ds16 will need to isolate now until results are in for me so no school  Luckily my house is fully stocked and we can wait this thing out.


----------



## Debbie

pigletto said:


> I watch three kids during the day .. it used to be five but Covid permanently removed one family because they are very high risk and mom had to leave her job.
> 
> Yesterday one of the kids woke from nap with a runny nose. Mom is taking him for a test and keeping him home until they have results. This morning I woke with a headache, which isn’t too unusual since I seem to get them often. I took some Tylenol and went on with my day.  As the day has gone on I have been feeling worse and worse. Head hurts , aches, just generally unwell. So I had the other two picked up ( which I HATE to do.. if I can’t do my job, other people can’t either ). I’m waiting for a call back from public health to get a referral to go for a test. We will all be shut down until results are in.
> It feels like a bad cold but there’s no way to know for sure without the test. I haven’t felt this sick in a very long time and I think it’s been at least three years since I took a sick day .
> 
> I don’t want a Covid swab. I’m weepy and I want my bed. Ds16 will need to isolate now until results are in for me so no school  Luckily my house is fully stocked and we can wait this thing out.


Pigletto, I'm sorry you are feeling unwell. Please take care and get the rest you need. Positive thoughts for a negative test.


----------



## wdwmom3

pigletto said:


> I watch three kids during the day .. it used to be five but Covid permanently removed one family because they are very high risk and mom had to leave her job.
> 
> Yesterday one of the kids woke from nap with a runny nose. Mom is taking him for a test and keeping him home until they have results. This morning I woke with a headache, which isn’t too unusual since I seem to get them often. I took some Tylenol and went on with my day.  As the day has gone on I have been feeling worse and worse. Head hurts , aches, just generally unwell. So I had the other two picked up ( which I HATE to do.. if I can’t do my job, other people can’t either ). I’m waiting for a call back from public health to get a referral to go for a test. We will all be shut down until results are in.
> It feels like a bad cold but there’s no way to know for sure without the test. I haven’t felt this sick in a very long time and I think it’s been at least three years since I took a sick day .
> 
> I don’t want a Covid swab. I’m weepy and I want my bed. Ds16 will need to isolate now until results are in for me so no school  Luckily my house is fully stocked and we can wait this thing out.



Hopefully it’s just a cold.  Crossing my fingers for you.


----------



## bababear_50

Flowers for
*pigletto*

Hope it's just a regular old cold.
Hot tea & Chicken noodle soup Hon.
Healing Hugs To You!
Mel


----------



## AngelDisney

Dear Pigletto,


----------



## Aladora

pigletto said:


> I watch three kids during the day .. it used to be five but Covid permanently removed one family because they are very high risk and mom had to leave her job.
> 
> Yesterday one of the kids woke from nap with a runny nose. Mom is taking him for a test and keeping him home until they have results. This morning I woke with a headache, which isn’t too unusual since I seem to get them often. I took some Tylenol and went on with my day.  As the day has gone on I have been feeling worse and worse. Head hurts , aches, just generally unwell. So I had the other two picked up ( which I HATE to do.. if I can’t do my job, other people can’t either ). I’m waiting for a call back from public health to get a referral to go for a test. We will all be shut down until results are in.
> It feels like a bad cold but there’s no way to know for sure without the test. I haven’t felt this sick in a very long time and I think it’s been at least three years since I took a sick day .
> 
> I don’t want a Covid swab. I’m weepy and I want my bed. Ds16 will need to isolate now until results are in for me so no school  Luckily my house is fully stocked and we can wait this thing out.



Yuck, hope you feel better soon!

We have one staff member who has been off sick since Monday and is waiting to get a Covid test scheduled. Another one is home with her 2 kids who both have colds, her husband is going for a Covid test today because his work requires it and all 4 of them have been isolating since the weekend.


----------



## Disney Addicted

pigletto said:


> I watch three kids during the day .. it used to be five but Covid permanently removed one family because they are very high risk and mom had to leave her job.
> 
> Yesterday one of the kids woke from nap with a runny nose. Mom is taking him for a test and keeping him home until they have results. This morning I woke with a headache, which isn’t too unusual since I seem to get them often. I took some Tylenol and went on with my day.  As the day has gone on I have been feeling worse and worse. Head hurts , aches, just generally unwell. So I had the other two picked up ( which I HATE to do.. if I can’t do my job, other people can’t either ). I’m waiting for a call back from public health to get a referral to go for a test. We will all be shut down until results are in.
> It feels like a bad cold but there’s no way to know for sure without the test. I haven’t felt this sick in a very long time and I think it’s been at least three years since I took a sick day .
> 
> I don’t want a Covid swab. I’m weepy and I want my bed. Ds16 will need to isolate now until results are in for me so no school  Luckily my house is fully stocked and we can wait this thing out.



  I hope you feel better soon!


----------



## kuhltiffany

Just to give the Ottawa people some perspective, the unfilled jobs on the OCSB dashboard when I looked at 7:30 this morning numbered 159! (I’m normally an ECE, but based on my education and experience got added to both the EA and Emergency Unqualified Teacher list this week so now I can see all positions.)


----------



## quandrea

kuhltiffany said:


> Just to give the Ottawa people some perspective, the unfilled jobs on the OCSB dashboard when I looked at 7:30 this morning numbered 159! (I’m normally an ECE, but based on my education and experience got added to both the EA and Emergency Unqualified Teacher list this week so now I can see all positions.)


That’s a lot considering we are into October.

Best wishes to you, @pigletto!


----------



## TammyLynn33

My fun story . Grade 3 online teacher must be hearing complaints about not learning enough, yesterday she announced an independent study package and “ don’t print it all it’s 150 pages just do what you can “
I start skimming  through it and yep it’s not Canadian curriculum it’s all US history , geography, currency etc . Literally took me two mins to scan through it , can’t believe she would be so lazy .. sigh 
I politely sent an email saying thai is American curriculum and haven’t heard a word except it’s still up .. sigh


----------



## Debbie

TammyLynn33 said:


> My fun story . Grade 3 online teacher must be hearing complaints about not learning enough, yesterday she announced an independent study package and “ don’t print it all it’s 150 pages just do what you can “
> I start skimming  through it and yep it’s not Canadian curriculum it’s all US history , geography, currency etc . Literally took me two mins to scan through it , can’t believe she would be so lazy .. sigh
> I politely sent an email saying thai is American curriculum and haven’t heard a word except it’s still up .. sigh


That's ridiculous. It took me less than 15 seconds google "Gr. 3 Ontario Social Studies on Teachers Pay Teachers" and discovered 5 pages of Ontario curriculum for Social Studies-written by Ontario teachers for Ontario teachers.


----------



## Iralyn

TammyLynn33 said:


> My fun story . Grade 3 online teacher must be hearing complaints about not learning enough, yesterday she announced an independent study package and “ don’t print it all it’s 150 pages just do what you can “
> I start skimming  through it and yep it’s not Canadian curriculum it’s all US history , geography, currency etc . Literally took me two mins to scan through it , can’t believe she would be so lazy .. sigh
> I politely sent an email saying thai is American curriculum and haven’t heard a word except it’s still up .. sigh



That's frustrating/disappointing!  I've heard a lot of positive reports about the online learning from different people -- actually more positives than I would have expected.



kuhltiffany said:


> Just to give the Ottawa people some perspective, the unfilled jobs on the OCSB dashboard when I looked at 7:30 this morning numbered 159! (I’m normally an ECE, but based on my education and experience got added to both the EA and Emergency Unqualified Teacher list this week so now I can see all positions.)



My daughter said they had the principal for French today because they couldn't get a supply.  "We didn't learn any French at all, Mom!"


----------



## tonga

My Grade 7 son has been doing online learning, in the OCSB virtual academy, and it’s been excellent.  He was one of the lucky ones who had teachers and was online from day 1, and they have already done three small projects with oral presentations and they jumped right into new material in math.


----------



## FigmentSpark

My son is doing hybrid English - grade 11 - will be done at the end of Oct and only half time in class.  They are reading Catcher in the Rye and it doesn't sound like there will be any Shakespeare at all.  I guess they are picking their battles, but I wonder how much of the curriculum is getting cut because there isn't enough time to do a unit justice.  

Remember, these grade 11s are scheduled to write the OSSLT (Ontario Literacy test) this April, along with the grade 10s, since they missed out on writing it last spring.  I hope this isn't setting them up for failure.


----------



## TammyLynn33

Iralyn said:


> That's frustrating/disappointing!  I've heard a lot of positive reports about the online learning from different people -- actually more positives than I would have expected.
> 
> 
> 
> My daughter said they had the principal for French today because they couldn't get a supply.  "We didn't learn any French at all, Mom!"
> 
> My fav was the class can’t be left unattended and they were having technical difficulties so the boards tech guy  “ babysat “ and told them knock knock jokes for 20 mins


----------



## wdwmom3

TammyLynn33 said:


> My fun story . Grade 3 online teacher must be hearing complaints about not learning enough, yesterday she announced an independent study package and “ don’t print it all it’s 150 pages just do what you can “
> I start skimming  through it and yep it’s not Canadian curriculum it’s all US history , geography, currency etc . Literally took me two mins to scan through it , can’t believe she would be so lazy .. sigh
> I politely sent an email saying thai is American curriculum and haven’t heard a word except it’s still up .. sigh



That’s ridiculous.


----------



## isabellea

Last year when we went virtual in March, my oldest teacher (then in grade 5) send a ton of material (include answers) for both French and maths. So if someone is interested in grade 5 material in French from QC (not France), let me know and I can send you a dropbox link.


----------



## TammyLynn33

So I got a response from the teacher and have gone to the board . If a real time teacher sent home sheets on USA presidents and state geography parents would go nuts . Practice or no practice


----------



## mshanson3121

TammyLynn33 said:


> My fun story . Grade 3 online teacher must be hearing complaints about not learning enough, yesterday she announced an independent study package and “ don’t print it all it’s 150 pages just do what you can “
> I start skimming  through it and yep it’s not Canadian curriculum it’s all US history , geography, currency etc . Literally took me two mins to scan through it , can’t believe she would be so lazy .. sigh
> I politely sent an email saying thai is American curriculum and haven’t heard a word except it’s still up .. sigh



I honestly don't see the problem. When I went to school, we had to learn both US history and geography. I see no problem with it at all, in fact I think an understanding of the US is extremely important since our two countries, indeed even our histories, are so inter-dependent. And it's certainly an appropriate time to dive into the US with the upcoming election. If nothing else, look how ignorant most Americans are about Canada (or any country besides their own) - your child will have a better global awareness than them.


----------



## hdrolfe

TammyLynn33 said:


> My fun story . Grade 3 online teacher must be hearing complaints about not learning enough, yesterday she announced an independent study package and “ don’t print it all it’s 150 pages just do what you can “
> I start skimming  through it and yep it’s not Canadian curriculum it’s all US history , geography, currency etc . Literally took me two mins to scan through it , can’t believe she would be so lazy .. sigh
> I politely sent an email saying thai is American curriculum and haven’t heard a word except it’s still up .. sigh





TammyLynn33 said:


> So I got a response from the teacher and have gone to the board . If a real time teacher sent home sheets on USA presidents and state geography parents would go nuts . Practice or no practice



That really is lazy. What is it they are supposed to be practicing? If it's just reading/comprehension or writing, I think something more appropriate shouldn't be that hard to find! I'd be pretty upset too. Sure., learning about the US is nice, eventually, but for grade 3 I don't think it should be a focus, better to have an understanding of our own country and it's history and origins. There is enough going on in our own political landscape that could be covered, impacts of a minority government and such. 

I found a really neat monthly subscription that covers Canadian history and geography by province, I am hoping to get it for my son shortly, you can do month to month or get everything at once. I love that it is Canadian and includes some indigenous content as well. I also found some other free Canadian content.


----------



## Pumpkin1172

FigmentSpark said:


> Remember, these grade 11s are scheduled to write the OSSLT (Ontario Literacy test) this April, along with the grade 10s, since they missed out on writing it last spring. I hope this isn't setting them up for failure.



My son is in Gr 12...and this is my biggest fear for him.  He already didn't get the grades he would have for Gr 11 if they would have had the full term.  Now with Gr 12 and wanting to go onto some schooling past this, he is NOT going to get the learning that he needs.  I have been saying this since March.  All highschool students are being short changed with their education and being able to advance onto university or college courses if they wish to do that.  

My son does not learn well with online.  If our school here ( northern Alberta ) shuts down again, I sure hope that they are able to switch and not have it be the s#$% show it was earlier.  Right now, with him being in school, being with his peers, learning from the teacher, and able to ask for help when he really needs it is the right way for him.  His marks so far are fantastic.  He has worked sooo hard over the years to over come severe reading comprehension and his ability to focus to have the school system fail him now.  He has been on the honor roll since Gr 8...and I soooooooooooooooooo want to see him have another amazing year!!!!!!  

I just pray that the school boards/teachers have their ducks in a row for if/when the schools are closed and we go virtual again, and ARE PREPARED!!!!!  We have all had to change and adapt at how we do our jobs, to make it safer for everyone around us....I expect nothing less from them as well.


----------



## quandrea

Pumpkin1172 said:


> My son is in Gr 12...and this is my biggest fear for him.  He already didn't get the grades he would have for Gr 11 if they would have had the full term.  Now with Gr 12 and wanting to go onto some schooling past this, he is NOT going to get the learning that he needs.  I have been saying this since March.  All highschool students are being short changed with their education and being able to advance onto university or college courses if they wish to do that.
> 
> My son does not learn well with online.  If our school here ( northern Alberta ) shuts down again, I sure hope that they are able to switch and not have it be the s#$% show it was earlier.  Right now, with him being in school, being with his peers, learning from the teacher, and able to ask for help when he really needs it is the right way for him.  His marks so far are fantastic.  He has worked sooo hard over the years to over come severe reading comprehension and his ability to focus to have the school system fail him now.  He has been on the honor roll since Gr 8...and I soooooooooooooooooo want to see him have another amazing year!!!!!!
> 
> I just pray that the school boards/teachers have their ducks in a row for if/when the schools are closed and we go virtual again, and ARE PREPARED!!!!!  We have all had to change and adapt at how we do our jobs, to make it safer for everyone around us....I expect nothing less from them as well.


High schools should have gone all virtual using the existing online platforms of the ILC and Prism online consortium. This would have secured a stable education for all high school students, but especially the grade 11 and 12. A major fail by every Ontario school board.

My daughter’s friend has covered just one unit in grade 11 English thus far. The course ends early Nov!


----------



## wdwmom3

mshanson3121 said:


> I honestly don't see the problem. When I went to school, we had to learn both US history and geography. I see no problem with it at all, in fact I think an understanding of the US is extremely important since our two countries, indeed even our histories, are so inter-dependent. And it's certainly an appropriate time to dive into the US with the upcoming election. If nothing else, look how ignorant most Americans are about Canada (or any country besides their own) - your child will have a better global awareness than them.



The problem is it’s lazy and it’s not part of the curriculum.  This was not done to expose the kids to things in other countries.


----------



## wdwmom3

TammyLynn33 said:


> So I got a response from the teacher and have gone to the board . If a real time teacher sent home sheets on USA presidents and state geography parents would go nuts . Practice or no practice



I actually agree with this.  It should not be hard to find things for them to do that relate to their curriculum.  This is just lazy.


----------



## pigletto

Pumpkin1172 said:


> My son is in Gr 12...and this is my biggest fear for him.  He already didn't get the grades he would have for Gr 11 if they would have had the full term.  Now with Gr 12 and wanting to go onto some schooling past this, he is NOT going to get the learning that he needs.  I have been saying this since March.  All highschool students are being short changed with their education and being able to advance onto university or college courses if they wish to do that.
> 
> My son does not learn well with online.  If our school here ( northern Alberta ) shuts down again, I sure hope that they are able to switch and not have it be the s#$% show it was earlier.  Right now, with him being in school, being with his peers, learning from the teacher, and able to ask for help when he really needs it is the right way for him.  His marks so far are fantastic.  He has worked sooo hard over the years to over come severe reading comprehension and his ability to focus to have the school system fail him now.  He has been on the honor roll since Gr 8...and I soooooooooooooooooo want to see him have another amazing year!!!!!!
> 
> I just pray that the school boards/teachers have their ducks in a row for if/when the schools are closed and we go virtual again, and ARE PREPARED!!!!!  We have all had to change and adapt at how we do our jobs, to make it safer for everyone around us....I expect nothing less from them as well.


   My son only went back because he was so afraid that the fall online learning would go like it did in the spring. He’s in Grade 11 but already very concerned about being ready to apply for the post secondary programs he wants. His top choice had an entrance average of 93% last year. He is capable and he works hard but I don‘t think he‘s getting the instruction he needs. He couldn’t even get answers to emails in the spring . It’s definitely better now, but it’s still not an ideal delivery method. My husband spent the entire evening working out physics with him last night , after he worked on it all afternoon . The teacher will answer emails on weekdays between 9:10 and 9:40 am . That means the questions he had would have been answered while he was doing the test he was studying for .

It’s just such a jumbled mess for everyone. I support our educators and I do believe the vast majority are doing their best with a really difficult situation. This whole situation is frustration after frustration for the students too.

I keep thinking that he’s going to have to take a 12b year. He could boost any grades that needed it , and work to earn more money for school . He hasn’t been able to work this year so that would help.


----------



## pigletto

An update for anyone who might be wondering. I called our Covid assessment line yesterday around noon and had to leave a message. The message said if they didn’t get back to me within 48 hours then we were to call back and leave a second message , and say that we hadn’t been contacted in the 48 hours.  I still haven’t heard but it’s only been about 30. The mom of the little boy I watch  will call and leave the second message in about an hour as their 48 hours is almost up.
So we can’t even get the assessment to determine if we need a test    in 48 hours. Then we need to get to the actual appointment which will be a few days out. Then we need to wait several days for the lab results, isolating the whole time.  This is lost wages for me, and lost wages and scrambling for back up for the families I work with.

I do daycare for essential workers. This is problematic.
I‘ve said it once and I will say it again , the back to school / work plan needed to include adequate testing capabilities. This is not sustainable.


----------



## Disney Addicted

quandrea said:


> High schools should have gone all virtual using the existing online platforms of the ILC and Prism online consortium. This would have secured a stable education for all high school students, but especially the grade 11 and 12. A major fail by every Ontario school board.



Yes, this!  I do not understand why the schools/Ministry of Education set up a completely different online platform when there were already two existing platforms.  



pigletto said:


> I keep thinking that he’s going to have to take a 12b year. He could boost any grades that needed it , and work to earn more money for school . He hasn’t been able to work this year so that would help.



My son started Grade 11 this year and went back to school.  In order to keep his Electrical & Hand Tools course (quad 2), he had to go back.  He's only taking 1 course this Quad.  He lost out on his university computer science course.  He may still lose the Electrical & Hand Tools course, depending on COVID-19.  He may also lose his entire 2nd Semester of Co-op at a construction site.  He needs those to help get him into the Gold Collar program in Grade 12.  He already has the mind set that he may re-shuffle his courses and take a victory lap.



pigletto said:


> An update for anyone who might be wondering. I called our Covid assessment line yesterday around noon and had to leave a message. The message said if they didn’t get back to me within 48 hours then we were to call back and leave a second message , and say that we hadn’t been contacted in the 48 hours.  I still haven’t heard but it’s only been about 30. The mom of the little boy I watch  will call and leave the second message in about an hour as their 48 hours is almost up.
> So we can’t even get the assessment to determine if we need a test    in 48 hours. Then we need to get to the actual appointment which will be a few days out. Then we need to wait several days for the lab results, isolating the whole time.  This is lost wages for me, and lost wages and scrambling for back up for the families I work with.
> 
> I do daycare for essential workers. This is problematic.
> I‘ve said it once and I will say it again , the back to school / work plan needed to include adequate testing capabilities. This is not sustainable.



Ugh.  I'm not surprised.  I read today there is a back-log of 94,000+ tests in Ontario.


----------



## quandrea

pigletto said:


> An update for anyone who might be wondering. I called our Covid assessment line yesterday around noon and had to leave a message. The message said if they didn’t get back to me within 48 hours then we were to call back and leave a second message , and say that we hadn’t been contacted in the 48 hours.  I still haven’t heard but it’s only been about 30. The mom of the little boy I watch  will call and leave the second message in about an hour as their 48 hours is almost up.
> So we can’t even get the assessment to determine if we need a test    in 48 hours. Then we need to get to the actual appointment which will be a few days out. Then we need to wait several days for the lab results, isolating the whole time.  This is lost wages for me, and lost wages and scrambling for back up for the families I work with.
> 
> I do daycare for essential workers. This is problematic.
> I‘ve said it once and I will say it again , the back to school / work plan needed to include adequate testing capabilities. This is not sustainable.


I think things are becoming increasingly out of control for the province. The 90 000+ backlog for testing is very concerning. We aren’t going to be able to track our case numbers if people can’t get tested. You can’t fight an enemy you cannot see.


----------



## quandrea

Disney Addicted said:


> Yes, this!  I do not understand why the schools/Ministry of Education set up a completely different online platform when there were already two existing platforms.


The government latched on to the synchronous learning nonsense, rendering the ILC and online consortium incompatible with their plan. So ridiculous to reinvent the wheel. We dropped out of the school system and dd is chugging along with the ILC. I get so upset hearing about kids who will need a fifth year because of this. It’s not right their goals are being put on hold because of government and school board ineptness.


----------



## TammyLynn33

If a child was older maybe, but learning math and currency and learning to make change with pennies and dollar bills which we don’t have will only confuse them . We don’t teach the kids to pay in Euros because itrelevant to their daily life . Learning currency at a young age they need to relate to their own piggy banks , what’s in their homes etc . 

They are still learning the basics of everything in grade 3, it needs to be relatable and relevant . I’m not going to teach him to spell favorite, neighbor color and then correct them. Why ? Especially having a child with LD.


----------



## wdwmom3

DS woke up with a very mild cough (only a couple coughs occasionally).  Now this could be from just waking up, dry air etc. So at what point do I say, time to go get tested.  And what point do I just wait it out and see if it continues?

Thankfully it’s Saturday for no school and I will keep him home from hockey today.

I should add I’m asking this because of the difficulty with testing right now.  If it was easy and quick results I would just take him.


----------



## scrappinginontario

wdwmom3 said:


> DS woke up with a very mild cough (only a couple coughs occasionally).  Now this could be from just waking up, dry air etc. So at what point do I say, time to go get tested.  And what point do I just wait it out and see if it continues?
> 
> Thankfully it’s Saturday for no school and I will keep him home from hockey today.
> 
> I should add I’m asking this because of the difficulty with testing right now.  If it was easy and quick results I would just take him.


 What province are you in?  In Ontario testing changes today to by appointment only.  

Personally, to know for sure, if my child was not normally the type to have a dry cough, if the cough persists more than a couple of hours after waking up, I’d choose to be cautious and fill out the online questionnaire.  If it recommends he be tested I’d go that route as I’d want to know for sure.


----------



## wdwmom3

scrappinginontario said:


> What province are you in?  In Ontario testing changes today to by appointment only.
> 
> Personally, to know for sure, if my child was not normally the type to have a dry cough, if the cough persists more than a couple of hours after waking up, I’d choose to be cautious and fill out the online questionnaire.  If it recommends he be tested I’d go that route as I’d want to know for sure.


We are in Ontario.  He sometimes gets a cough just because of dry air.  I’m going to give it a couple hours I think.


----------



## pigletto

wdwmom3 said:


> We are in Ontario.  He sometimes gets a cough just because of dry air.  I’m going to give it a couple hours I think.


This is what I am facing right now. The little boy I watch is feeling completely better, I’m probably about 75% better ... we could be recovered before we even get the phone call to assess if we even need the appointment . Nevermind the actual test.
There was a news conference yesterday where they changed the guidelines again. If your child only has a runny nose, headache or sore throat they do not need the test. Frankly it’s confusing as heck and people want to do the right thing and can’t even figure out what that is anymore. I’m not even sure if we need tests now .

https://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/ontario-u...-not-required-for-only-a-runny-nose-1.5128937


----------



## Frozen2014

Our son is currently in 14 day quarantine due to a kid in his class having tested positive.  I'm hopeful that nothing will come of it.  He's only at school for one class every other day and he's very good with following protocols, but will watch for symptoms. Not planning on getting him tested unless he starts not feeling well. Don't want to put him through a that kind of test (Then again, I think that's the new rule anyways).  At home, we have separated his dishes, he's sitting on his own sofa, etc.  and just watching him.


----------



## wdwmom3

Frozen2014 said:


> Our son is currently in 14 day quarantine due to a kid in his class having tested positive.  I'm hopeful that nothing will come of it.  He's only at school for one class every other day and he's very good with following protocols, but will watch for symptoms. Not planning on getting him tested unless he starts not feeling well. Don't want to put him through a that kind of test (Then again, I think that's the new rule anyways).  At home, we have separated his dishes, he's sitting on his own sofa, etc.  and just watching him.



Actually would your son qualify for a test at a pharmacy? I think they are using a saliva test? Not the one up the nose.  But I could be wrong.


----------



## Frozen2014

wdwmom3 said:


> Actually would your son qualify for a test at a pharmacy? I think they are using a saliva test? Not the one up the nose.  But I could be wrong.


Are those out now?  And would they test if no symptoms?  That we would do.


----------



## wdwmom3

Frozen2014 said:


> Are those out now?  And would they test if no symptoms?  That we would do.



The tests at the Pharmacy were for people with no symptoms. I had heard they were a different kind of swab but now I can’t find where I saw that.  But I just checked the criteria for being tested there and I don’t think he meets them.  Sorry


----------



## Frozen2014

wdwmom3 said:


> The tests at the Pharmacy were for people with no symptoms. I had heard they were a different kind of swab but now I can’t find where I saw that.  But I just checked the criteria for being tested there and I don’t think he meets them.  Sorry


Thank you.  I appreciate you mentioning and looking into it.


----------



## scrappinginontario

wdwmom3 said:


> Actually would your son qualify for a test at a pharmacy? I think they are using a saliva test? Not the one up the nose.  But I could be wrong.


 It depends on your province.  Ontario does not have any saliva tests yet.  Hopefully soon but not yet.


----------



## tgropp

mshanson3121 said:


> I honestly don't see the problem. When I went to school, we had to learn both US history and geography. I see no problem with it at all, in fact I think an understanding of the US is extremely important since our two countries, indeed even our histories, are so inter-dependent. And it's certainly an appropriate time to dive into the US with the upcoming election. If nothing else, look how ignorant most Americans are about Canada (or any country besides their own) - your child will have a better global awareness than them.


Agreed. We were taught that also....and that was over 50 years ago.


----------



## Debbie

tgropp said:


> Agreed. We were taught that also....and that was over 50 years ago.


The problem is that what the child has been given is not in our curriculum, but there are many, many resources from Canadian teachers and publishers that _are _available. Even at Costco. Math was given as an example-pennies and dollar bills that don't coincide with our own. Spelling is different and can be confusing. Our kids need to learn our geography and be familiar with places and customs of Canada over the US. If a _parent _were to choose a resource from the States, no issue. But a teacher sending out that same resource is not acceptable in my mind, since there are Canadian options available.


----------



## damo

Debbie said:


> The problem is that what the child has been given is not in our curriculum, but there are many, many resources from Canadian teachers and publishers that _are _available. Even at Costco. Math was given as an example-pennies and dollar bills that don't coincide with our own. Spelling is different and can be confusing. Our kids need to learn our geography and be familiar with places and customs of Canada over the US. If a _parent _were to choose a resource from the States, no issue. But a teacher sending out that same resource is not acceptable in my mind, since there are Canadian options available.



Not sure if it dealt with units of measurement, but that is a huge difference as well and not in the Canadian curriculum.


----------



## quandrea

Debbie said:


> The problem is that what the child has been given is not in our curriculum, but there are many, many resources from Canadian teachers and publishers that _are _available. Even at Costco. Math was given as an example-pennies and dollar bills that don't coincide with our own. Spelling is different and can be confusing. Our kids need to learn our geography and be familiar with places and customs of Canada over the US. If a _parent _were to choose a resource from the States, no issue. But a teacher sending out that same resource is not acceptable in my mind, since there are Canadian options available.


As an educator—that is an entirely unacceptable package to assign. It’s not the curriculum educators are LEGALLY OBLIGATED to deliver. There is no merit in it at all. Teachers have a vast curriculum to deliver—no time for useless busy work. I’d be taking the matter up the chain of command.


----------



## bankr63

tgropp said:


> Agreed. We were taught that also....and that was over 50 years ago.


Yes, you were taught it when it came up in the curriculum.  They may very well still teach some of this in the curriculum now; but IIRC it wasn't until high school even 40 years ago for me.  It is not appropriate if it is delivered at the wrong stage of the educational continuum.


----------



## Pumpkin1172

pigletto said:


> My son only went back because he was so afraid that the fall online learning would go like it did in the spring. He’s in Grade 11 but already very concerned about being ready to apply for the post secondary programs he wants. His top choice had an entrance average of 93% last year. He is capable and he works hard but I don‘t think he‘s getting the instruction he needs. He couldn’t even get answers to emails in the spring . It’s definitely better now, but it’s still not an ideal delivery method. My husband spent the entire evening working out physics with him last night , after he worked on it all afternoon . The teacher will answer emails on weekdays between 9:10 and 9:40 am . That means the questions he had would have been answered while he was doing the test he was studying for .
> 
> It’s just such a jumbled mess for everyone. I support our educators and I do believe the vast majority are doing their best with a really difficult situation. This whole situation is frustration after frustration for the students too.
> 
> I keep thinking that he’s going to have to take a 12b year. He could boost any grades that needed it , and work to earn more money for school . He hasn’t been able to work this year so that would help.



I have to agree.  So far, so good for him.  His core classes seem to be going good and they are getting the curriculum taught in a timely manner.  Our who province of Gr 12's all write the same standardized test for core classes.  I am trying to stay positive that they are learning what they are needing to and not getting short changed.  I hope they have their bakcup plans ready for if any of the classes are quarantined and the lessons go virtual.  I hope the a better system in place than how it was done in Spring.  

My biggest fear is that hopefully through all of this, he will still be able to do his 

I have been very impressed with the teaching staff in all our schools in our city tbh.  Many of the schools have posted videos on their school FB pages with all their Covid protocols that they have put into place.  How they are spacing the kids, when they  need to mask, when they don't.  I know it has eased some of the worry for parents about transmission at school.


----------



## Disney Addicted

I'm not impressed with this "covid-19 cases in schools and child care centres" website (https://www.ontario.ca/page/covid-19-cases-schools-and-child-care-centres) the Ontario government is running.  It's suppose to be updated week days at 10:30 AM.

But for my school board, only one school is listed as having Covid cases for the past week.  Yet, last week the school board's website showed 2.  Today I discovered the school that I cross at (I'm a crossing guard) discovered they had a case on the 3rd.  It's on the school board's website.  It was on Durham News today.  Yet that government website still only shows the same one school.


----------



## AngelDisney

My school has its second confirmed case. Due to privacy issue, identity of the infected student cannot be revealed. After a student is tested positive, Public Health takes two days to investigate then inform any affected cohort of students and teachers to stay home for the 14-day quarantine. During those two days under investigation, the affected students and teachers are still in school. I don’t understand why there is this time lag. Can’t they just keep the maybe affected students and teachers home during the investigation? Now my colleagues are wondering who this second student is and if they are affected or not. Should I self isolate myself now at home and stay away from my husband and daughter just in case? I just wish teachers can be notified earlier.


----------



## Disney Addicted

Yes, I agree AngelDisney.

I forgot to mention in this case the school published a letter on their website addressed to their students, parents and teachers about the positive covid case and what they are doing.  Durham Region Health Dept. must have done their investigation already.  Which is why I'm puzzled by the lack of updating the government site.


----------



## pigletto

While it was a bit of a circus to actually get a test, I did have it yesterday and had results in less than 24 hours. So I am Covid free.  

In some weird way I was hoping that  it was Covid and now I wouldn’t have to worry about it .. but alas it was just the regular plague. 
In all seriousness I was more sick than I have been in years, and I’m pretty sure it was/ is influenza. It hit me like a train. But I’m on the mend and really just have a headache /fatigue left so that’s much better.
Not looking forward to the isolating / testing protocol reoccurring several times this winter but it seems inevitable for most of us.


----------



## scrappinginontario

pigletto said:


> While it was a bit of a circus to actually get a test, I did have it yesterday and had results in less than 24 hours. So I am Covid free.
> 
> In some weird way I was hoping that  it was Covid and now I wouldn’t have to worry about it .. but alas it was just the regular plague.
> In all seriousness I was more sick than I have been in years, and I’m pretty sure it was/ is influenza. It hit me like a train. But I’m on the mend and really just have a headache /fatigue left so that’s much better.
> Not looking forward to the isolating / testing protocol reoccurring several times this winter but it seems inevitable for most of us.


Thankful it wasn't Covid but sorry you're still sick.  Glad to hear you're on the mend!

How wonderful that you got your test results back so quickly!  A friend had her twin 7yos tested last Wednesday.  Once came back negative on Sun but the other result is still not there (caught in the 55,000+ backup I'm sure) so her boys are home from school for the 7th day.  So thankful to have a job where we are still working from home as this could very easily be my daughter at another time.


----------



## pigletto

scrappinginontario said:


> Thankful it wasn't Covid but sorry you're still sick.  Glad to hear you're on the mend!
> 
> How wonderful that you got your test results back so quickly!  A friend had her twin 7yos tested last Wednesday.  Once came back negative on Sun but the other result is still not there (caught in the 55,000+ backup I'm sure) so her boys are home from school for the 7th day.  So thankful to have a job where we are still working from home as this could very easily be my daughter at another time.


I wonder if labs are more overwhelmed in some areas. It took me four days to get a call back , but once I did everything happened very quickly. My sister in law took my nephew for his test  in the Guelph area. They got their appointment right away but then waited six days for results.
That must be frustrating for your friend, especially since it’s so likely that the other twin is negative as well.


----------



## wdwmom3

pigletto said:


> I wonder if labs are more overwhelmed in some areas. It took me four days to get a call back , but once I did everything happened very quickly. My sister in law took my nephew for his test  in the Guelph area. They got their appointment right away but then waited six days for results.
> That must be frustrating for your friend, especially since it’s so likely that the other twin is negative as well.


I think it does depend where you are tested.  If probably has to do with where the samples are processed and where there is a backlog.  I think some hospitals are processing some tests in their own labs.  So a backlog in other places wouldn’t affect that.

Oh and update.  DSs cough went away and since he had no other symptoms we decided not to get him tested.  It was a good 24 hours after he stopped before he went back to school.  I’m kind of glad it happened on the weekend.


----------



## bankr63

Disney Addicted said:


> I'm not impressed with this "covid-19 cases in schools and child care centres" website (https://www.ontario.ca/page/covid-19-cases-schools-and-child-care-centres) the Ontario government is running.  It's suppose to be updated week days at 10:30 AM.
> 
> But for my school board, only one school is listed as having Covid cases for the past week.  Yet, last week the school board's website showed 2.  Today I discovered the school that I cross at (I'm a crossing guard) discovered they had a case on the 3rd.  It's on the school board's website.  It was on Durham News today.  Yet that government website still only shows the same one school.


I don't think I would blame the website.  It reflects what the school boards have reported to the Ministry of Education.  The boards are required to report to the ministry, but it is possible that it is an oversight.  I see 9 schools from 2 Durham boards on the list today, so they are reporting, I would guess just an oversight.  If it is the Catholic Board, you can see from the raw data in the background (downloadable from the site) that they have been reporting All Saints for several days (starting 09/24), but that Notre Dame was reported Monday for the first time.  No other records are present in the data feed.


----------



## FigmentSpark

pigletto said:


> While it was a bit of a circus to actually get a test, I did have it yesterday and had results in less than 24 hours. So I am Covid free.
> 
> In some weird way I was hoping that  it was Covid and now I wouldn’t have to worry about it .. but alas it was just the regular plague.
> In all seriousness I was more sick than I have been in years, and I’m pretty sure it was/ is influenza. It hit me like a train. But I’m on the mend and really just have a headache /fatigue left so that’s much better.
> Not looking forward to the isolating / testing protocol reoccurring several times this winter but it seems inevitable for most of us.


Good reminder for everyone.  Flu shots are now out.  Our doctor is making appointments, but I think you can just walk up at Shopper's.


----------



## Best_Vacation_EVER!

So was interesting... we rec'd DS's High School EIP this weekend (he's in grade 9) and they had all the teachers listed for whole upcoming year (based on semester) -- all good and and feel pretty okay with how they've spaced the courses out for him for the year.  He has EIP just to cover his need to occasionally move due to ADHD -- no other accomodations.   Since each year he's developed more skills for dealing with his ADHD I can see him not needing one as he matures but it was interesting to see the info......


----------



## Disney Addicted

Disney Addicted said:


> I'm not impressed with this "covid-19 cases in schools and child care centres" website (https://www.ontario.ca/page/covid-19-cases-schools-and-child-care-centres) the Ontario government is running.  It's suppose to be updated week days at 10:30 AM.
> 
> But for my school board, only one school is listed as having Covid cases for the past week.  Yet, last week the school board's website showed 2.  Today I discovered the school that I cross at (I'm a crossing guard) discovered they had a case on the 3rd.  It's on the school board's website.  It was on Durham News today.  Yet that government website still only shows the same one school.



If anyone's curious, I checked the website a few minutes ago and it was updated today to show the school on the list.


----------



## bankr63

Well my prognostications did not come true.  Thanksgiving and schools are still open, so they are doing better at managing than I expected.

That said, the rise in school cases is as alarming as the overall rise.  School cases seem to be tracking along at about 8% of the provincial daily count, so it is still not a great picture.  On the plus side, I don't think they have identified much transmission IN the schools, seems to be community spread.

DW's school has yet to report any cases, but one family sent their kid to school for a couple of days while a sibling was waiting for results.  The test came back positive, so now waiting for results for the kid who was in class.  We'll be isolating this long weekend as we wait to hear.


----------



## Madame

bankr63 said:


> Well my prognostications did not come true.  Thanksgiving and schools are still open, so they are doing better at managing than I expected.
> 
> That said, the rise in school cases is as alarming as the overall rise.  School cases seem to be tracking along at about 8% of the provincial daily count, so it is still not a great picture.  On the plus side, I don't think they have identified much transmission IN the schools, seems to be community spread.
> 
> DW's school has yet to report any cases, but one family sent their kid to school for a couple of days while a sibling was waiting for results.  The test came back positive, so now waiting for results for the kid who was in class.  We'll be isolating this long weekend as we wait to hear.


They’re lying.  Teachers on Twitter verifying that their Covid was recorded as community spread despite students in their room having Covid.


----------



## Disney Addicted

Stage 2 lite shutdown for Toronto, Peel and Ottawa for the next 28 days starting tomorrow.  No indoor dining at restaurants & bars.  Gyms, theatres and casinos to shut down.

I wonder how long it will take before the rest of Ontario enters this stage.  I imagine a lot of people on those areas will start going into the cities around them.  We kept having a lot of people from Toronto coming up here the first time.


----------



## MoreTravels

There are lots of good restaurants north of Steeles... along Highway 7. This plan won't work... it just forces all the diners into 905/289 areas.

They are making tests more difficult to obtain. They are reducing the screening symptoms. They are shortening quarantine time from 14 to 10 days.

I am not sure if the new future statistics carry the same significance as the previous ones any more. It's like math, once you change the variables of an equation in a math problem, the results will not be the same any more. However, the good news is... the mortality rate seems to be lower than before among the diagnosed. It is perhaps related to newer discoveries how to manage this infection and/or virus getting weaker after a few rounds of mutation.


----------



## Disney Addicted

MoreTravels said:


> However, the good news is... the mortality rate seems to be lower than before among the diagnosed. It is perhaps related to newer discoveries how to manage this infection and/or virus getting weaker after a few rounds of mutation.



I've been wondering about that.  Canada went as high as 8.33% in late June.  Then it started declining.  Little by little, every day and today is down to 5.38%.  Ontario's rate went up a little in the beginning of October but is most likely because of the unreported deaths from spring & summer that were suddenly added in.  Now it's down to 5.20% from 8.33% in the middle of May.

The number of deaths in the past two weeks have gone up but the mortality rate is still creeping down.  I find that funny.  But then again, the news is saying it's more younger people getting Covid-19 now so I guess the survival rate is higher among them.


----------



## Donald - my hero

MoreTravels said:


> However, the good news is... the mortality rate seems to be lower than before among the diagnosed.





Disney Addicted said:


> The number of deaths in the past two weeks have gone up but the mortality rate is still creeping down.  I find that funny.  But then again, the news is saying it's more younger people getting Covid-19 now so I guess the survival rate is higher among them.




*The mortality rate in both Ontario and Quebec at the outset was due to the number of deaths in LTC facilities and the elderly in the community. We're no longer seeing the higher number of deaths but what isn't be captured (because there's really no way to do it!) is the number of "long-haulers". People who contract COVID-19, test positive and then eventually test negative show up in the "recovered" columns. However, that doesn't address the fact that MANY of these people will suffer lifelong complications from COVID ranging from reduced lung capacity, exhaustion, "brain fog", circulation issues (ever hear of the symptoms COVID toes/fingers? I know someone in the states who needed to have 2 toes amputated similar to what is seen in diabetics) and needing to consider themselves as "immune compromised" for life. Not everyone who "survives" COVID will end up with lifelong symptoms but those who do are falling between the cracks, no longer considered ill enough to stay home, no longer needing to quarantine, no longer "positive" but unable to work, perform household tasks or even basic day-to-day personal care. It's not a disease to be relegated to either dead or recovered, we need to remember that it's a new beast, and we aren't fully aware of everything that a positive test implicates.

Sorry for the rant, and for taking this thread waaaay off topic *


----------



## wdwmom3

Madame said:


> They’re lying.  Teachers on Twitter verifying that their Covid was recorded as community spread despite students in their room having Covid.



People won’t admit if they haven’t been careful outside of school and caught it somewhere else. Very easy to say it’s from their class.   Not sure where you are but in Ontario all cases in schools are recorded and if there is a link between 2 or more cases in a school they declare an outbreak.  So if a teacher was positive and a student in their class was positive an outbreak would be declared.


----------



## scrappinginontario

Our school has been doing an AMAZING job!  Not saying we can't get it but saying they're handling it really well and the kids are happy and have quickly adapted to the new routines.  Back to school was the perfect choice for us and so glad that's what we went with.


----------



## scrappinginontario

I don't believe with this disease anyone can truly know where a person caught it.   One of the reasons the Covid App is so important for those who are willing to, to download.

Unless someone in your household tests positive before you do, it could have been caught anywhere.   Unlike the spring when everything was shut down and we stayed in our homes for weeks on end, the majority of people are still going out for groceries, to the pharmacy and other optional places.  Yesterday alone I was at a grocery store, a coffee shop to pick up a muffin, a restaurant to pick up dinner to take home, Costco and a local apple orchard.  I wore a mask everywhere and sanitized my hands every time before getting into the car or touching my mask.  Any of those places could lead to contact with the disease on top of my daughter being in school so the contact that comes from that.

Many people are living life as best they can.  Cautiously and for us without close contact with anyone living outside our home, but we still come in socially distanced contact with many, many people each day.


----------



## Debbie

Donald - my hero said:


> *The mortality rate in both Ontario and Quebec at the outset was due to the number of deaths in LTC facilities and the elderly in the community. We're no longer seeing the higher number of deaths but what isn't be captured (because there's really no way to do it!) is the number of "long-haulers". People who contract COVID-19, test positive and then eventually test negative show up in the "recovered" columns. However, that doesn't address the fact that MANY of these people will suffer lifelong complications from COVID ranging from reduced lung capacity, exhaustion, "brain fog", circulation issues (ever hear of the symptoms COVID toes/fingers? I know someone in the states who needed to have 2 toes amputated similar to what is seen in diabetics) and needing to consider themselves as "immune compromised" for life. Not everyone who "survives" COVID will end up with lifelong symptoms but those who do are falling between the cracks, no longer considered ill enough to stay home, no longer needing to quarantine, no longer "positive" but unable to work, perform household tasks or even basic day-to-day personal care. It's not a disease to be relegated to either dead or recovered, we need to remember that it's a new beast, and we aren't fully aware of everything that a positive test implicates.
> 
> Sorry for the rant, and for taking this thread waaaay off topic *


I don't consider this a rant. This is my point with all those that declare COVID has a low mortality rate, and testing=more positive cases. The lingering effects are something that need to be talked about and understood. And, as the disease is so new, we don't _have_ all the information on it yet. Part of the problem is that a majority of people today don't remember things like the results of outbreaks of diseases like polio in the 40's/50's. Those who didn't die were scarred for life. Or, measles, which ended up causing heart problems. Until we have a viable and effective vaccine, the best recourse, in my opinion, is to do our best not to get COVID. (so....limit contact, wear your mask , distance yourself, wash, wash and wash like the kidlets in the schools) there! got it back on topic


----------



## wdwmom3

Debbie said:


> I don't consider this a rant. This is my point with all those that declare COVID has a low mortality rate, and testing=more positive cases. The lingering effects are something that need to be talked about and understood. And, as the disease is so new, we don't _have_ all the information on it yet. Part of the problem is that a majority of people today don't remember things like the results of outbreaks of diseases like polio in the 40's/50's. Those who didn't die were scarred for life. Or, measles, which ended up causing heart problems. Until we have a viable and effective vaccine, the best recourse, in my opinion, is to do our best not to get COVID. (so....limit contact, wear your mask , distance yourself, wash, wash and wash like the kidlets in the schools) there! got it back on topic



I think we will see the affects of this in people for decades to come.  Possibly even those who show little symptoms now.  Who knows what damage has been done that will just gradually get worse as they age.  Just think about how long it takes the effects of sun damage to show up.


----------



## Iralyn

bankr63 said:


> Well my prognostications did not come true.  Thanksgiving and schools are still open, so they are doing better at managing than I expected.



Same.  Though I question whether they are really doing a great job at managing.  What I'm hearing as more like what Madame is saying below.  For whatever reason, things are not being recorded and shared by the government in a way that reflects reality.  The list on the government website is days delayed and they only include cases that are laboratory confirmed.  Which I can kind of understand but also makes it appear better than it is as some parents choose not to put their child through Covid testing when they think it can be safely presumed that the child is positive based on symptoms and exposure.  I have also heard anecdotally that once a classroom is closed, they are not reporting further cases for that class.  I'm a bit skeptical on that one but I heard that from a friend of a friend in Ottawa area who was directly impacted by this.



Madame said:


> They’re lying.  Teachers on Twitter verifying that their Covid was recorded as community spread despite students in their room having Covid.



Yes, this is what I've heard too.  If there is any other possible place that Covid could have been acquired, they will not assume school outbreak.


----------



## Best_Vacation_EVER!

Debbie said:


> I don't consider this a rant. This is my point with all those that declare COVID has a low mortality rate, and testing=more positive cases. The lingering effects are something that need to be talked about and understood. And, as the disease is so new, we don't _have_ all the information on it yet. Part of the problem is that a majority of people today don't remember things like the results of outbreaks of diseases like polio in the 40's/50's. Those who didn't die were scarred for life. Or, measles, which ended up causing heart problems. Until we have a viable and effective vaccine, the best recourse, in my opinion, is to do our best not to get COVID. (so....limit contact, wear your mask , distance yourself, wash, wash and wash like the kidlets in the schools) there! got it back on topic



Very true.   My mom was one of the kids who had polio and didn't die from it.  There were several kids from the street she lived on who weren't so lucky -- either dying or being placed in iron-lung machines.   My mom recovered, finished school, graduated from university and had a normal life.   But there is something called post-polio syndrome that is pretty well documented... for my mom it kicked in at some point when she was in her late forties - weakness, breathing difficulties, etc.... this is something viruses can do -- who knows how Covid-19 will behave.

Also certain viruses remain dormant in the body and can re-activate --- Covid-19 hasn't been around long enough to know whether it will be one of those.   For those of us who've had chicken pox as kids  -- when that virus re-activates many years down the road it causes Shingles.  Will Covid-19 do the same?    

Not getting Covid-19 really is the smartest option --- so we'll wear our masks, social distance, wash our hands, and sanitize things regularly.


----------



## Pumpkin1172

Our family WILL NOT be putting the covid app on our phones.  We already disable all tracking through apps on our phones and enable it when we actually want to use GPS.  That is just opening a Pandora's Box for the government in the years to come.  NOPE....not happening.  I know exactly where I have been just by how I use my debit or cc cards.   The government is already sticking their noses into our lives too much.  Like Dr Tam making suggestions for people's sex lives and other areas...NOPE....stay out of my personal life.  

At least the schools have some control over sick kids coming to school.  If the child is show symptoms, or if the schools knows that a sibling is being tested, those children are required to stay home. 

Businesses do not have the luxury.  Our small city is now on a " watch list "  as our local Walfart... was not properly enforcing proper mask wearing for customers and EMPLOYEES.  So there are now 5 employees who have tested positive for covid...and numerous others who were customers who picked up the virus while at the store.  Walfart has handled is extremely poorly.  They should have had to close once more than 2 employees tested positive and the store deep cleaned.  This INFURIATES me.  If it was any other business, it would have been forced to close until it was safe for all employees and customers to return.  THIS....this example is exactly what I was afraid of.  Corporations NOT handling it responsibly.

I was never a big walfart shopper anyways...but this will stop me from walking into there over my lunch to pick up the odd item now.

Edited to add...that we went from 12 active cases to 41 in a week...due to the Walfart outbreak.


----------



## hdrolfe

Pumpkin1172 said:


> Our family WILL NOT be putting the covid app on our phones.  We already disable all tracking on our phones and enable them when we actually want to use GPS.  That is just opening a Pandora's Box for the government in the years to come.  NOPE....not happening.  I know exactly where I have been just by how I use my debit or cc cards.
> 
> At least the schools have some control over sick kids coming to school.  If the child is show symptoms, or if the schools knows that a sibling is being tested, those children are required to stay home.
> 
> Businesses do not have the luxury.  Our small city is now on a " watch list "  as our local Walfart... was not properly enforcing proper mask wearing for customers and EMPLOYEES.  So there are now 5 employees who have tested positive for covid...and numerous others who were customers who picked up the virus while at the store.  Walfart has handled is extremely poorly.  They should have had to close once more than 2 employees tested positive and the store deep cleaned.  This INFURIATES me.  If it was any other business, it would have been forced to close until it was safe for all employees and customers to return.  THIS....this example is exactly what I was afraid of.  Corporations NOT handling it responsibly.
> 
> I was never a big walfart shopper anyways...but this will stop me from walking into there over my lunch to pick up the odd item now.



That is infuriating... I know where we are my little neighbourhood has one of the highest rates around, no idea why! There are a lot of older people here so it's odd since cases seem to be highest among younger people. Which is why I have the app. I love it, if someone is exposed and has the app they get a code to put in and it would alert me that I was exposed (if I was near them for 15 minutes). If everyone had it, we'd be able to actual contact trace so much easier. It doesn't track my location at all...  maybe you mean a different app? It uses bluetooth to "ping" nearby phones with the app. It has no idea if I'm at walmart or anywhere else. All it stores is a random code for 14 days, that isn't connected with your identity at all. 

Just to make sure you understand how it works, and others as well. There is no location information stored or tracked. I'd suggest you check the Canada website for more information if you are interested in the details. In your situation, if you had the app and the person who was infected does as well, your app would let you know that you were exposed and should get tested. To me, that seems like a great thing.


----------



## Pumpkin1172

hdrolfe said:


> Just to make sure you understand how it works, and others as well. There is no location information stored or tracked. I'd suggest you check the Canada website for more information if you are interested in the details. In your situation, if you had the app and the person who was infected does as well, your app would let you know that you were exposed and should get tested. To me, that seems like a great thing.


I understand it.  It just give the government and other more power in the future to do more " things " like that. 

If they don't track...how does that app know you were by that person?  IT is tracking where you go!!!!  It is using your footsteps...or that your phone was in that area at a certain time.  I understand that no information is " stored " ....but it is just the algorithms that the phones use.   It is a pandoras box for what " powers that be " in the future can use for areas that they should not be getting into.  What seems like " a great thing " now....can take a turn very fast.  For our family...we are VERY UNCOMFORTABLE with that ability to " know we were in this area where someone tested positive "  There may be" a good" side to it..............but that can turn VERY FAST into something darker that people will use in the future.  

Anyways...time to step off the soap box and get back to the topic of covid in schools.


----------



## scrappinginontario

hdrolfe said:


> That is infuriating... I know where we are my little neighbourhood has one of the highest rates around, no idea why! There are a lot of older people here so it's odd since cases seem to be highest among younger people. Which is why I have the app. I love it, if someone is exposed and has the app they get a code to put in and it would alert me that I was exposed (if I was near them for 15 minutes). If everyone had it, we'd be able to actual contact trace so much easier. It doesn't track my location at all...  maybe you mean a different app? It uses bluetooth to "ping" nearby phones with the app. It has no idea if I'm at walmart or anywhere else. All it stores is a random code for 14 days, that isn't connected with your identity at all.
> 
> Just to make sure you understand how it works, and others as well. There is no location information stored or tracked. I'd suggest you check the Canada website for more information if you are interested in the details. In your situation, if you had the app and the person who was infected does as well, your app would let you know that you were exposed and should get tested. To me, that seems like a great thing.


This is exactly why I installed it on my phone too.  The day after I installed it I went to a Starbucks and placed an order.  I waited outside (socially distanced) for 20 mins and then was told to go inside as a 'dot' had opened, and there I proceeded to wait an additional 25 mins for our drinks!!  It crossed my mind more than once as I was there that the app was doing its thing and sharing a code (without any personal information attached to it) with the others around me who also had the app.  All of these people (probably 10+ in total who I was near for at least a 15 min period) were complete strangers to me and I would have zero chance of knowing if I'd been exposed....except for the app.  It's more the random strangers I feel it's helping me with as well as store employees whom I may have come in contact with.

Thankfully nothing came of it as this was more than a month ago but I'd hazard to guess the number of times my phone has exchange anonymous codes with other strangers since I installed it. 

My brother is super cautious (will not use the finger scanners at WDW) but he installed the app the week it came out as it does not store any personal information. 

When I think of it, I'm THANKFUL for the app as it is helping to keep me and my family safer when around strangers which is just a part of day to day life.  Each time I wait for a take-out order or SD in line for groceries, the little app is doing it's job and I am thankful!


----------



## scrappinginontario

Pumpkin1172 said:


> I understand it.  It just give the government and other more power in the future to do more " things " like that.
> 
> If they don't track...how does that app know you were by that person?  IT is tracking where you go!!!!  It is using your footsteps...or that your phone was in that area at a certain time.  I understand that no information is " stored " ....but it is just the algorithms that the phones use.   It is a pandoras box for what " powers that be " in the future can use for areas that they should not be getting into.  What seems like " a great thing " now....can take a turn very fast.  For our family...we are VERY UNCOMFORTABLE with that ability to " know we were in this area where someone tested positive "  There may be" a good" side to it..............but that can turn VERY FAST into something darker that people will use in the future.
> 
> Anyways...time to step off the soap box and get back to the topic of covid in schools.


If you think this information isn't already being tracked, I beg to differ.  The only way to not be tracked these days is to not own electrical devices.  It's just the world we live in.  Not saying I agree with it, I just see it as reality.


----------



## Brett Wyman

Pumpkin1172 said:


> Our family WILL NOT be putting the covid app on our phones.  We already disable all tracking through apps on our phones and enable it when we actually want to use GPS.  That is just opening a Pandora's Box for the government in the years to come.  NOPE....not happening.  I know exactly where I have been just by how I use my debit or cc cards.   The government is already sticking their noses into our lives too much.  Like Dr Tam making suggestions for people's sex lives and other areas...NOPE....stay out of my personal life.
> 
> At least the schools have some control over sick kids coming to school.  If the child is show symptoms, or if the schools knows that a sibling is being tested, those children are required to stay home.
> 
> Businesses do not have the luxury.  Our small city is now on a " watch list "  as our local Walfart... was not properly enforcing proper mask wearing for customers and EMPLOYEES.  So there are now 5 employees who have tested positive for covid...and numerous others who were customers who picked up the virus while at the store.  Walfart has handled is extremely poorly.  They should have had to close once more than 2 employees tested positive and the store deep cleaned.  This INFURIATES me.  If it was any other business, it would have been forced to close until it was safe for all employees and customers to return.  THIS....this example is exactly what I was afraid of.  Corporations NOT handling it responsibly.
> 
> I was never a big walfart shopper anyways...but this will stop me from walking into there over my lunch to pick up the odd item now.
> 
> Edited to add...that we went from 12 active cases to 41 in a week...due to the Walfart outbreak.



Wait, wait wait. So you were expecting WAL-MART to do the right thing? There are literally award documentaries showing how evil that company is.


----------



## wdwmom3

Pumpkin1172 said:


> I understand it.  It just give the government and other more power in the future to do more " things " like that.
> 
> If they don't track...how does that app know you were by that person?  IT is tracking where you go!!!!  It is using your footsteps...or that your phone was in that area at a certain time.  I understand that no information is " stored " ....but it is just the algorithms that the phones use.   It is a pandoras box for what " powers that be " in the future can use for areas that they should not be getting into.  What seems like " a great thing " now....can take a turn very fast.  For our family...we are VERY UNCOMFORTABLE with that ability to " know we were in this area where someone tested positive "  There may be" a good" side to it..............but that can turn VERY FAST into something darker that people will use in the future.
> 
> Anyways...time to step off the soap box and get back to the topic of covid in schools.



You really don’t understand how the app works.  It doesn’t track you.  It uses your Bluetooth to tell if you are close to another app user.  It has no idea where you are.  

But you seem closed minded to this and not willing to actually learn how it works.  So I won’t waste my breath.


----------



## hdrolfe

Pumpkin1172 said:


> I understand it.  It just give the government and other more power in the future to do more " things " like that.
> 
> If they don't track...how does that app know you were by that person?  IT is tracking where you go!!!!  It is using your footsteps...or that your phone was in that area at a certain time.  I understand that no information is " stored " ....but it is just the algorithms that the phones use.   It is a pandoras box for what " powers that be " in the future can use for areas that they should not be getting into.  What seems like " a great thing " now....can take a turn very fast.  For our family...we are VERY UNCOMFORTABLE with that ability to " know we were in this area where someone tested positive "  There may be" a good" side to it..............but that can turn VERY FAST into something darker that people will use in the future.
> 
> Anyways...time to step off the soap box and get back to the topic of covid in schools.



I understand your fear, but the app doesn't track my location, or anyone else's. As I said, it "pings" the bluetooth on other phones that are near you for more than 15 minutes, sharing a code. If a person with whom your phone has shared a code enters the code that they tested positive, your phone alerts you. Again, I'd suggest you look up how the actual app works.


----------



## hdrolfe

School related - looks like the Ottawa Catholic School Board has cancelled all high school exams... apparently the Ministry gave schools this option. Makes sense to me, cramming so many kids into a gym to write would not be a good idea.


----------



## scrappinginontario

hdrolfe said:


> School related - looks like the Ottawa Catholic School Board has cancelled all high school exams... apparently the Ministry gave schools this option. Makes sense to me, cramming so many kids into a gym to write would not be a good idea.


Yes, many in the Toronto area announced the same today.

A friend of mine is a teacher and she said one of the challenges with all this is how to monitor tests and exams virtually.  She had a student in the spring who was averaging 30% in her class and after students began learning virtually this same student got 100% on every single test.


----------



## bankr63

hdrolfe said:


> School related - looks like the Ottawa Catholic School Board has cancelled all high school exams... apparently the Ministry gave schools this option. Makes sense to me, cramming so many kids into a gym to write would not be a good idea.


Interesting, but it is possible to do exams online with invigilators.  That's how DS wrote some of his Uni exams last spring.  You are required to sit at your computer in an open chat session with the invigilator who watches to ensure you are not cheating.  Your eyes need to remain fixed on or near the screen, and basically your lips not moving.  A bit harder with HS classes, but not impossible.  Other exams were just set as open book with a tight deadline.  You had to complete in the allotted time.  Other coursework shifted to a more substantive summative project.


----------



## scrappinginontario

bankr63 said:


> Interesting, but it is possible to do exams online with invigilators.  That's how DS wrote some of his Uni exams last spring.  You are required to sit at your computer in an open chat session with the invigilator who watches to ensure you are not cheating.  Your eyes need to remain fixed on or near the screen, and basically your lips not moving.  A bit harder with HS classes, but not impossible.  Other exams were just set as open book with a tight deadline.  You had to complete in the allotted time.  Other coursework shifted to a more substantive summative project.


I would guess the challenge with this in publicly funded schools is the cost.  There are approx 700,000 secondary students in Ontario.  That is a lot of invigilators to hire to watch exams.  I believe their funding is already heavily taxed right now without having to hire additional resources.


----------



## FigmentSpark

I think the point is that exams aren't the only way to ensure a student understands the material and assign a grade.  But it will mean more culminatings and more assignments to get the information for grades.  Tests are a great way to find out what a student knows, but not the only way.  This is a good move.


----------



## CanadianKrista

So our little pandemic school world fell apart yesterday.  First case in both kids schools.  And the case in DD's school is her best friend's little sister.  So DD is still in school, the best friend is home waiting for test results, if they are positive DD's class will be sent home, as her friend is in her class.  DS's school there are 2 cases now, with 2 classes home.  Neither is his class, but a bunch of people in his class were sent home yesterday as they had "close contact" with at least one of the cases.  DS was up half the night sick with worry, we are all exhausted and just waiting for the next bit of news....


----------



## Aladora

bankr63 said:


> Interesting, but it is possible to do exams online with invigilators.  That's how DS wrote some of his Uni exams last spring.  You are required to sit at your computer in an open chat session with the invigilator who watches to ensure you are not cheating.  Your eyes need to remain fixed on or near the screen, and basically your lips not moving.  A bit harder with HS classes, but not impossible.  Other exams were just set as open book with a tight deadline.  You had to complete in the allotted time.  Other coursework shifted to a more substantive summative project.



That is how DS's entrance exam for private school was done in June but I can only imagine how hard it would be to manage it when there are dozens of students in each class taking an exam!


----------



## azrivest

bankr63 said:


> Interesting, but it is possible to do exams online with invigilators.  That's how DS wrote some of his Uni exams last spring.  You are required to sit at your computer in an open chat session with the invigilator who watches to ensure you are not cheating.  Your eyes need to remain fixed on or near the screen, and basically your lips not moving.  A bit harder with HS classes, but not impossible.  Other exams were just set as open book with a tight deadline.  You had to complete in the allotted time.  Other coursework shifted to a more substantive summative project.



How is that even possible? I couldn't manage that and I'm in my 30s. Poor kids who have to sit through these exams just staring at a screen for 3 hours


----------



## TammyLynn33

Sometimes the hardest exams are open book.   

Haven’t heard anything here about exams . The first octomeister ended and I’m pretty sure the kids just wrote in their classes . My daughter had outdoor Ed so no exam . 

krista - yikes that’s scary and close to home . Fingers crossed . I feel for your poor son . I know my daughter just had a sore throat and she was a mess waiting for results . Again prayers to you guys ..


----------



## Donald - my hero

*****here's the Duck eating crow!!**** I didn't actually take the time to do a deep dive into the entire Alberta website and open every single FAQ, it appears that their app is very similar to the Federal one. I stand corrected.*


----------



## hdrolfe

She's in Alberta no? It's the same app, theirs started sooner but is the same technology and last I heard was going to switch over the federal one... however it doesn't seem to have been switched yet. So not sure what you found.

And to be perfectly honest, given how many people have no idea where they contracted COVID because the tracking and tracing is not doing it's job, it would be nice if someone was tracking the information.


----------



## tonga

CanadianKrista said:


> So our little pandemic school world fell apart yesterday.  First case in both kids schools.  And the case in DD's school is her best friend's little sister.  So DD is still in school, the best friend is home waiting for test results, if they are positive DD's class will be sent home, as her friend is in her class.  DS's school there are 2 cases now, with 2 classes home.  Neither is his class, but a bunch of people in his class were sent home yesterday as they had "close contact" with at least one of the cases.  DS was up half the night sick with worry, we are all exhausted and just waiting for the next bit of news....


So sorry you’re going through this.  My son is doing virtual because I know we’d all have trouble dealing with this sort of anxiety.  Best wishes that your kids are fine and the others recover quickly.


----------



## Donald - my hero

hdrolfe said:


> She's in Alberta no? It's the same app, theirs started sooner but is the same technology and last I heard was going to switch over the federal one... however it doesn't seem to have been switched yet. So not sure what you found.
> 
> And to be perfectly honest, given how many people have no idea where they contracted COVID because the tracking and tracing is not doing it's job, it would be nice if someone was tracking the information.


*I went by the information that comes directly from the Alberta website, but i stand corrected, it is extremely confusing unless you dig deeply into the website. Can you please remove my post from within yours? Thanks and apologies again for adding more confusion to the discussion*


----------



## Maddysdaddy

I teach post-secondary and there are 'virtual' invigilators, where students are recorded via their webcam during an exam.  I then receive a report at the end of the exam and it flags students who did not stay in the frame or did anything else unusual during the exam period.  The program also locks their computer so the only window they can have open during the exam is the one with the exam itself.

That being said, the program isn't perfect, and there is no way for me to tell if a student is looking down at their keyboard to type in an answer or whether they have another electronic device sitting on the desk next to them or in their lap.  

I came to this realization after exams in the spring, so what I changed for my summer classes and classes this fall is that I created a massive test bank and each student gets a random set of questions from it, so it really doesn't matter if they're texting their friend to see what they got as an answer for any particular question, since their question #14 will be different from their friend's #14.  This is something that I wouldn't have been able to do in a traditional classroom setting with a paper exam.

I have now also made all of my exams open book, since I have my suspicions that while my stronger students would abide by closed book rules, my weaker students wouldn't, so why penalize students who would be willing to follow the rules.  The tradeoff is that they now have more questions to answer in the same amount of time than if the exam was closed book - so I warn them that while there may be comfort in having materials at hand, if they have to look up more than a handful of answers, they may have trouble finishing the exam in time.

It's tough trying to find the balance so everyone feels like they are being treated fairly.


----------



## Muskrat191

Maddysdaddy said:


> I came to this realization after exams in the spring, so what I changed for my summer classes and classes this fall is that I created a massive test bank and each student gets a random set of questions from it, so it really doesn't matter if they're texting their friend to see what they got as an answer for any particular question, since their question #14 will be different from their friend's #14.  This is something that I wouldn't have been able to do in a traditional classroom setting with a paper exam.



I went to university more years ago than I care to admit. I did have a couple profs that would mix up the order of questions, so there would be a few different paper exams. We were then seated such that the person in front of us, behind us, and to each side had a different version of the exam.


----------



## bankr63

azrivest said:


> How is that even possible? I couldn't manage that and I'm in my 30s. Poor kids who have to sit through these exams just staring at a screen for 3 hours


Didn't say it was fun.  DS wasn't nuts about it either.

Its not that difficult to do.  The invigilator doesn't have to be a 1:1 ratio.  One invigilator can probably monitor 20 students or so at a time - it's just a matter of how many can fit in a screen.  That's about the number of students a proctor would already oversee in a gymnasium setting. (one proctor per desk row). I would think that an invigilator should monitor several sessions; it would be VERY boring to only watch only one student at a time.

And just read @Maddysdaddy's response.  I don't think DS's course used electronic invigilator, it sounded like it was a live person, but sounds like a cool system you have developed.  Again, my original point is that online exams don't need to be difficult and can be setup to fair and not gamed.


----------



## bababear_50

post moved
thanks 
Mel


----------



## scrappinginontario

First case in my DD's school reported yesterday.  That class + teacher(s) self-isolating for 14 days.  My daughter went to school as normal today.

I'd wondered what it would feel like the first time a confirmed case was in her school but truly, still feel good about her being there.  Feel badly for the student who has it and their family.  Praying they recover quickly and others do not get it.


----------



## Frozen2014

scrappinginontario said:


> First case in my DD's school reported yesterday.  That class + teacher(s) self-isolating for 14 days.  My daughter went to school as normal today.
> 
> I'd wondered what it would feel like the first time a confirmed case was in her school but truly, still feel good about her being there.  Feel badly for the student who has it and their family.  Praying they recover quickly and others do not get it.


My DD has already had 2 cases in her school (other classes) and her French and music teacher are isolated too as they visit many classrooms.  She said it's quiet at recess and near her room with classes at home.  My son has already been quarantined.  Fine thank goodness.

It is scary, but feel the same...still glad we sent them to school. I just never know from one day to the next if she'll be going to school the next day.
Hope it's an easy case for the child and the family is ok too.


----------

