OT -- What is a Stay At Home Christian?

[ilandrazdsw]

There's also the "Sunday morning Christian" phenomenon. People who attend church on Sunday and then forget about it the rest of the week. I think the important thing is a daily walk with God.

There is the issue of constant church where I live. Sunday (2 times) & Sunday School (adult/child), Tuesday night prayer service & Jr. Church, Thursday night youth service, Wed night choir practice, and then the 3 chruches alternate HS youth group Mon, Wed and Fri. Literally you could be at a church nearly every night! AND there are a whole lot of people that look down on you if you are not there without a "good" excuse. The churches even go as far as to monetarily reward the children for SS attendance, so if you go on vacation and do not attend church while on said vacation that is an absence and 3 absences means less money.

 

[Worfiedoodles]

There is the issue of constant church where I live. Sunday (2 times) & Sunday School (adult/child), Tuesday night prayer service & Jr. Church, Thursday night youth service, Wed night choir practice, and then the 3 chruches alternate HS youth group Mon, Wed and Fri. Literally you could be at a church nearly every night! AND there are a whole lot of people that look down on you if you are not there without a "good" excuse. The churches even go as far as to monetarily reward the children for SS attendance, so if you go on vacation and do not attend church while on said vacation that is an absence and 3 absences means less money.

You have got to be kidding me?! They pay the children to come to Sunday School?! Wow. I have never heard of that, and I wonder the value that is teaching...Kids don't even get paid to go to school, and that is certainly necessary (I mean any kind of school, public, private, home, whatever) for adulthood!

That is alot of church opportunities...

 

[rotlex]

Very interesting reading in this thread. For me, I cannot understand, or comprehend, not attending mass with others. Being a Christian\Catholic means community as well as other things to me. Also, there is that whole "Thou shalt remember the sabbath day and keep it holy" commandment.

Seriously though, I guess I can see why some would prefer to worship at home, but I have a problem when someone says they need to find a church that "fits them". The church that fits, is the one Christ created. You are going there to worship him, show respect, and spend some time reflecting and praying. I don't feel that Christ intended you to do that alone week after week.

I try to live each day as close to Christ as possible. Yes, it's hard, but I also think that giving him some very "special" time, once a week on a Sunday, is the least I can do for all he has done for me.

 

[momx2]

Being a Christian doesn't have some form of a lifetime membership nor is it some fraternity/sorority (Once in, always in). I'm human. I understand it can be hard.

Actually, many believe that it does. It depends on which demonination you subscribe to. My parents are both baptists, as I am I. My mother's demonination believes "once saved always saved", my dad's believes "fall from grace." Since I was raised with differing thoughts on this, I ride the fence.

 

[crisi]

Well, good for the exceptions to the rule.

Crisi, for someone who's stated that she's (or he's) not Christian, in all honesty, why are you so worried about the opinions of others that follow that religion? No one's being indignant to anyone; rather, they are sharing their opinions and quite frankly, being quite civil to each other.

Interesting observation, Disykat.

Because I think self identification of religion is really important to someone. Because there are 38,000 denominations of Christians and many of them worship in very different ways from each other. Try a Quaker Friend's meeting sometime (they are very nice). Because there are Christians who can't go to church and taking the title from them over something as petty as not going to church is cruel. Because of all the things to "judge not" it seems like the one that is most hypocritical is to judge how someone else practices their faith. We cannot know the mind of God, and it seems like this - of all things - is highly presumptive.

Now, if someone says "you aren't a very good CATHOLIC if you don't take communion regularly" - that is a rule of that faith - priests visit devout shut ins to hear their confessions and give communion. Granted, you are still Catholic unless the Pope excommunicates you (once a Catholic, always a Catholic), but regularly receiving communion is a faith obligation. But Christianity covers a lot of ground - and attendance at church is not a faith obligation in all denominations.

And finally, because in my denomination (I'm UU) there are Christians, who are often told they are not Christian. Its a hurtful thing for them, and moreover, if you are supposed to be an evangelical religion, not insulting the people who are marginal might be a good idea - or they come to us. Which, is great, I suppose, we welcome pretty much anyone, but we aren't an evangelical faith.

 

[crisi]

Very interesting reading in this thread. For me, I cannot understand, or comprehend, not attending mass with others. Being a Christian\Catholic means community as well as other things to me. Also, there is that whole "Thou shalt remember the sabbath day and keep it holy" commandment.

But that is not interpreted by all faiths as a requirement to attend church. It may be a requirement of your denomination, but it may be meaningless to someone from a different denomination.

Besides, if you were keeping in the original intent of that commandment, you'd go to temple on Saturday, not church on Sunday.

 

[rotlex]

But that is not interpreted by all faiths as a requirement to attend church. It may be a requirement of your denomination, but it may be meaningless to someone from a different denomination.

Besides, if you were keeping in the original intent of that commandment, you'd go to temple on Saturday, not church on Sunday.

Sorry,was referring to the Christian faith here. (I should never assume, , I know)!

Regarding the Sabbath. Also, again, I'm assuming my background which is strong Catholic. Yes, I know, OT vs NT. Sabbath vs Lords Day. So no, I don't celebrate the "Sabbath" per say, but rather the Lord's day, which is Sunday.

The bottom line, to me, is really not which day, again, depending on denomination as you say, but rather, that you DO set aside the time once per week, and on holy days of obligation, to be with the Lord.

 

[borntoshop96]

this is a new term to me...
as per my guess it is a Christian who doesn't associate with a Christian community.

 

[ChrisandDon'sMommy]

Because I think self identification of religion is really important to someone. Because there are 38,000 denominations of Christians and many of them worship in very different ways from each other. Try a Quaker Friend's meeting sometime (they are very nice). Because there are Christians who can't go to church and taking the title from them over something as petty as not going to church is cruel. Because of all the things to "judge not" it seems like the one that is most hypocritical is to judge how someone else practices their faith. We cannot know the mind of God, and it seems like this - of all things - is highly presumptive.

Now, if someone says "you aren't a very good CATHOLIC if you don't take communion regularly" - that is a rule of that faith - priests visit devout shut ins to hear their confessions and give communion. Granted, you are still Catholic unless the Pope excommunicates you (once a Catholic, always a Catholic), but regularly receiving communion is a faith obligation. But Christianity covers a lot of ground - and attendance at church is not a faith obligation in all denominations.

And finally, because in my denomination (I'm UU) there are Christians, who are often told they are not Christian. Its a hurtful thing for them, and moreover, if you are supposed to be an evangelical religion, not insulting the people who are marginal might be a good idea - or they come to us. Which, is great, I suppose, we welcome pretty much anyone, but we aren't an evangelical faith.

That's fair.

I must admit that the UU church is something "different" to me. I have always believed it was a place for non-committing people of faith. To me, it just seemed implausible to pray with Pagans and Wiccans. So, I'm opened to discussion! Fill me in.

 

[crisi]

That's fair.

I must admit that the UU church is something "different" to me. I have always believed it was a place for non-committing people of faith. To me, it just seemed implausible to pray with Pagans and Wiccans. So, I'm opened to discussion! Fill me in.

UUs pull from a variety of religious traditions. Some congregations have a very Christian bent - some are more naturalistic - some more Humanist - it depends on the membership and the congregation. Some congregations are lay led - some congregations - like mine, have not only a full time minister, but a staff, hundreds of member families.

We get a lot of mixed faith families - people who thing giving their kids a religious foundation is crucial - but his vague Paganism and her Catholicism can't really compromise outside something like Unitarianism. We get a lot of young former Christians who are rejecting the faith they grew up with, but who want a spiritual experience - and continue to engage in a spiritual search. Unitiarians tend to be politically liberal, so we get people looking for a liberal spiritual experience that engages in relevant Social Action. We are - and have been for decades - GLBT friendly - we were one of the first denominations to perform gay marriages - so we have a lot of GLBT people - and their families - who get angry at the practices of their faith (and some Christian denominations are GLBT friendly - the UCC for instance - we aren't the only option)

There is no creed, there are principals:

http://www.uua.org/visitors/6798.shtml

My congregations sermons are posted:

http://www.whitebearunitarian.org/html/sermons.html For the sake of this discussion - 100 Ways to Pray might be interesting

For our congregation, a service may include Christian hymns or Beatles songs. It likely includes readings from a wide variety of sources - modern poets, ancient writers. About half the time the minister speaks, the other half of the time a guest speaker speaks. There is no communion (as a sacrament for most services - for some services we may use sharing of food as a meditation).

Unitarian Universalists come from two traditions. The first is the Unitarian belief that all Gods are one God. The second is the belief in universal salvation. Both those traditions have their roots in the 17th century - and modern Unitarianism has grown out of that. (The original Unitarian heresy had to do with the Trinity - its a recent turn that takes it towards a Baha'i sort of path - and beyond).

It isn't a faith for everyone. No one is going to tell you what to believe, for Unitarians, its very important that you find those answers for yourself. Therefore, if you like answers and a lot of rules about "you must go to church on Sunday" it isn't a place where you are likely to be comfortable. And that is fine - Unitarians are about discovering your path - not our path (we don't have A path anyway).

 

[ChrisandDon'sMommy]

UUs pull from a variety of religious traditions. Some congregations have a very Christian bent - some are more naturalistic - some more Humanist - it depends on the membership and the congregation. Some congregations are lay led - some congregations - like mine, have not only a full time minister, but a staff, hundreds of member families.

We get a lot of mixed faith families - people who thing giving their kids a religious foundation is crucial - but his vague Paganism and her Catholicism can't really compromise outside something like Unitarianism. We get a lot of young former Christians who are rejecting the faith they grew up with, but who want a spiritual experience - and continue to engage in a spiritual search. Unitiarians tend to be politically liberal, so we get people looking for a liberal spiritual experience that engages in relevant Social Action. We are - and have been for decades - GLBT friendly - we were one of the first denominations to perform gay marriages - so we have a lot of GLBT people - and their families - who get angry at the practices of their faith (and some Christian denominations are GLBT friendly - the UCC for instance - we aren't the only option)

There is no creed, there are principals:

http://www.uua.org/visitors/6798.shtml

My congregations sermons are posted:

http://www.whitebearunitarian.org/html/sermons.html For the sake of this discussion - 100 Ways to Pray might be interesting

For our congregation, a service may include Christian hymns or Beatles songs. It likely includes readings from a wide variety of sources - modern poets, ancient writers. About half the time the minister speaks, the other half of the time a guest speaker speaks. There is no communion (as a sacrament for most services - for some services we may use sharing of food as a meditation).

Unitarian Universalists come from two traditions. The first is the Unitarian belief that all Gods are one God. The second is the belief in universal salvation. Both those traditions have their roots in the 17th century - and modern Unitarianism has grown out of that. (The original Unitarian heresy had to do with the Trinity - its a recent turn that takes it towards a Baha'i sort of path - and beyond).

It isn't a faith for everyone. No one is going to tell you what to believe, for Unitarians, its very important that you find those answers for yourself. Therefore, if you like answers and a lot of rules about "you must go to church on Sunday" it isn't a place where you are likely to be comfortable. And that is fine - Unitarians are about discovering your path - not our path (we don't have A path anyway).

Very interesting. You've provided me with information that I've never encountered. May I ask a question? How is atheism approached in the church as I've read that some attend?

 

[DiznEeyore]

I totally agree. We are between churches at the moment. It is overwhelming to me to think about going into a new church, and these posts cemented that. Not going to church every Sunday does not make me less of a Christian. "Wherever two or more are gathered" works for our family.

I completely agree. I grew up in a particular denomination, then when I married dh and we moved away, we tried several different churches. We tried to get involved, and in two churches we liked very much, I became involved with women's Bible studies. In both studies, after I'd attended for a while, I was snubbed by the women in the group. I wasn't a member of their "cliques" and was excluded from the inner circle. It was very hurtful.

We moved again and ended up returning to my original church, where we were active members for 15 years. Then, the church lost 3 pastors in a row for various reasons (disagreements with older members on the Board over doctrine and procedure among other things), and membership dwindled. It's now mostly senior citizens. Also, my mother is a member and got it into her head that we should be accountable to her for everything we did or didn't do there. So we left.

Because of our previous bad experiences, we're hesitant about moving on to a new church. And the attitudes here make me afraid if we go, we'll end up in someone's "personal pew" and anger them!

Maybe we should stick with Dr. Stanley on TV Sunday mornings and sending our tithes to various Christian organizations!!

 

[crisi]

Very interesting. You've provided me with information that I've never encountered. May I ask a question? How is atheism approached in the church as I've read that some attend?

There are atheist UUs. Nothing in the principals demands theism. It does propose a respect for religious tradition. But not all UUs are atheists. There are more people who identify as atheist than as Christian though in the UUA as a whole.

One of the fascinating things about being a UU is the realization that there are very religious and/or spiritual people who are not theists. Religion does not need to be about the worship of God, and God is only one path to spiritualism - though if that is what it is for you, that is fine.

 

[momx2]

I completely agree. I grew up in a particular denomination, then when I married dh and we moved away, we tried several different churches. We tried to get involved, and in two churches we liked very much, I became involved with women's Bible studies. In both studies, after I'd attended for a while, I was snubbed by the women in the group. I wasn't a member of their "cliques" and was excluded from the inner circle. It was very hurtful.

We moved again and ended up returning to my original church, where we were active members for 15 years. Then, the church lost 3 pastors in a row for various reasons (disagreements with older members on the Board over doctrine and procedure among other things), and membership dwindled. It's now mostly senior citizens. Also, my mother is a member and got it into her head that we should be accountable to her for everything we did or didn't do there. So we left.

Because of our previous bad experiences, we're hesitant about moving on to a new church. And the attitudes here make me afraid if we go, we'll end up in someone's "personal pew" and anger them!

Maybe we should stick with Dr. Stanley on TV Sunday mornings and sending our tithes to various Christian organizations!!

That's the way I feel as well. People will say "oh, we don't mean anything by it" but if you think it does come across. I have been looked at very sternly several times when moving pew locations in our church. We finally did get a regular spot and if anyone was in it my DD would say, "someone's in our seats" and huff about it. I would tell her that those aren't our seats and we can sit somewhere else for the day. In my experience churches are so cliquish. As much as you try to fit in, the regulars won't accept you. My kids like the church we have been going to recently, but me and DH, not so much. The Sunday before the election the precher basically told us (in not the same words, but meaning) that if you don't vote republican, you aren't a good Christian. I don't want my kids believing that. Still searching........

 

[Worfiedoodles]

The Sunday before the election the precher basically told us (in not the same words, but meaning) that if you don't vote republican, you aren't a good Christian. I don't want my kids believing that. Still searching........

That would have caused me to start a search....for either a new minister or a new church!

Wow, no wonder you would like to find a new place to worship. Every church is not cliquish, I promise! We left our our church after about 5 years. We were being asked to do everything, and it just wasn't functional for us. It made dh bitter, and we didn't like the absolute lack of diversity in the congregation -- or the sermons every single week about empowering women. I'm all for getting empowered, but I don't need to be reminded on a weekly basis, I was hoping to move forward in my walk with God, not stay in the same place perpetually. Anyway, we shopped until we found a church that fit our needs. The congregation is American -- African, Chinese, Brazilian, English, French Canadian, Haitian, etc. in the origins of ancestors, but a true melting pot. We also have first generation citizens from England, Brazil, Nigeria, and Haiti.

Our minister is an older woman, but very tech savvy and interested in getting things done. We recently hosted the United Methodist Army, this high school group was from CT and came to do minor home repairs for seniors and others with need.

I would never have known this was available if we hadn't looked long and hard, so don't give up!

 

[ilandrazdsw]

You have got to be kidding me?! They pay the children to come to Sunday School?! Wow. I have never heard of that, and I wonder the value that is teaching...Kids don't even get paid to go to school, and that is certainly necessary (I mean any kind of school, public, private, home, whatever) for adulthood!

That is alot of church opportunities...

I don't think "paying" the kids to go to SS was the intention, reather a means of rewarding them for learning verses, participating, and such. It was totally new to me!!! Things are a little "different" here. On Prise Giving Sunday, the last Sunday in July before the boats/men go away for season, the SS service is just recognizing all the kids for their achievements. The do not only get $ (anywhere from a couple dollars to over 20), but a religious book, award paper, etc. The sad thing...well, not sad, just not what I am accustom to...is that some parents only show up for that SS (all year) and they take pictures! Please no flames, I do realize that that one Sunday (as it could be any other day, meal social, program, etc) may be the one that opens their heart/mind...it is more the taking pictures thing.

Rotlex: I think when people say they want to find a church that "fits" them, they are not referring to it as a sweater. It is more of the feeling they have when they are at that specific church/congregation. I attended a church where DH adn I would deard going to church and actually come out of the service mad! It was not the fellowship of the other members, but the attitude of the pastor and council. We left when after speaking to the pastor he said, "if you don't like it leave." YES! He really did tell me that. We did not find another church right away. Would it have been better to continue to go just for the fellowship, but still leaving upset over the manner and teachings of the pastor? To this day I cringe when he is speaking at an an event on the island. I will give it to him though...he (as well as the other churches on this island) has made me examine my own beliefs...AND they are stronger than ever God is in total control (I believe) and although I didn't not understand why things were happening (when and how) at the time I now see the answer for that specific challenging time.

 

[rcymrcym]

I think I am going to link this thread and send it to all the other ministers I know. It would be better than any church meeting! Keep discussing, please!

 

[WantToGoNow]

I wasn't raised in church, my husband was raised in a Sunday Morning only family. I ended up getting into a bit of trouble as a teenager and I had my oldest child just after graduating high school. The only church I knew was for 3 weeks and a Bible School I went to when I was a kid - but they gave me a Bible (KJV) that laid in the headboard of my bed for all of those years, only being opened occassionally. It was that Bible that took me to chuch. After my daughter was born, I was looking for something, but didn't know what. There was one verse that I had learned as a child that I always remembered - "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins...". I knew I didn't want the same life for my daughter that I was living. I went to several chuches and ended up settling down in the same church that gave me that Bible as a child. I have been a member there for the last 24 years. I met my husband there and my 2 younger children - 7 and 5 have been there since birth. We feel totally at home. If you don't go to church because you haven't found one that you feel comfortable in, please keep looking. I know you can worship at home, but there is something special about companionship with a group of like believers. My older daughter and now my son have accepted Christ - one child to go and I know that we will all be together for eternity.

 

[taximomfor4]

I went to Catholic school for a few years (and church every Sunday), then mom married my stepdad. We were changed to a United Methodist church, and were confirmed there. Mom divorced him, and went back to the Catholic church but I didn't go back with her. Later, she settled on being Wiccan.

I believe, but not in organized religion. To me, worship is best done in natural settings. In church, I feel contained and uncomfortable. I appreciate the beautiful aspects of many religions' services, but it's not spiritual for me. I study the bible on my own, have studied MANY different religions just to have knowledge of how they differ. Daoism, Buddhism, Judaism, Christianity -they ALL are beautiful in their similarities and differences.

Basically, my dh wants to go to church most Sundays. He takes the kids that WANT to attend. (Only my oldest stays home, although that just began this year. She is 15, and a wonderful kid with good values).

So I guess I am a Stay At Home Christian. NOT because I am looking for a church that fits, but by choice. Singing by myself, or playing my violin, or sitting on the cliff over Lake Erie...those are when I feel touched.

BTW, UU sounds intriguing. I know there is a UU church nearby, I was there for a wedding once.

 

[starrzone]

Anyway, we shopped until we found a church that fit our needs. The congregation is American -- African, Chinese, Brazilian, English, French Canadian, Haitian, etc. in the origins of ancestors, but a true melting pot. We also have first generation citizens from England, Brazil, Nigeria, and Haiti.

Our minister is an older woman, but very tech savvy and interested in getting things done. We recently hosted the United Methodist Army, this high school group was from CT and came to do minor home repairs for seniors and others with need.

Wow, it sounds like you have found a really great place to worship! My church, which I was baptized and confirmed in, is...rather homogenous to say the least. I know there are many factors to consider when choosing a church, but I'm not sure I'd choose to worship at mine if/when I have kids.

When I was around 16 or so, there was a search committee put together to find a new minister for our church. They wanted 2 youth members, so my friend and I volunteered. The rest of the committee was made up of a wide variety of adults; as I recall, mostly men, but the backgrounds were retired, accountants, doctors, teachers...a real mix. Anyhow, we looked at many profiles and resumes of potential candidates, and it was decided that since many members of our church were "older" (read: elderly and had been going there for a long time), "we" (i.e. the church in general) were not "ready" for a female minister. Looking back, that might have been true, but I'm not really cool with the idea that a candidate could be rejected just because she is female and that a group of people doesn't think the church is "ready" yet. I suppose, though, that some things still operate in a "traditional" manner...

I like the idea of the Unitarian church that someone posted earlier. It sounds right up my alley! I don't think there's anything like that around wher I live, but I'll have to check it out. That's one reason why I want to move away from the area I live in; there is a strong feeling of "we've always done it this way and are resistant to change" present...