Rumored Changes to G+

[starlite_]

But what's interesting is the people with young kids who say they won't go to Disney unless there is some sort of Genie+/ILL or FP+ system. Despite the fact that yes there are unpredictableness with a toddler and their stamina and behaviors that day.

When Genie+/ILL came around without the ability to pre-book rides that made a lot of people with young kids very upset. Their argument was at least they could pre-plan some rides, know that they could get on some rides and the switch to day of planning made it harder for them to tour the parks. The getting up at 7am is especially a pain point for many people with families.

That's interesting. We shall see if I change my mind when I have kids haha.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

That's interesting. We shall see if I change my mind when I have kids haha.

I remember all the complaining about the pre-planning part but I guess it was more of a "be careful what you wish for" because then they saw how Genie+/ILL was implemented. I was surprised myself at seeing all the comments related to comparing the time Disney was open with only Standby and how people felt if it stayed that way their Disney days were over but I guess that's how some feel.

 

[Disneychick13]

On the last Disney Dish podcast @lentesta ran through the numbers on how back in 2013 (there was a lawsuit) that 3% of park guests have a DAS card. Those 3% took up 30% of the Lightning lane (Fast Pass back then) capacity and this 30% double the stand-by wait times.

He then ran through a recent scenario where Touring plans counted 1500 people getting into the Haunted Mansion Lightning lane line in one hour. Touring plans have determined that less than 300 slots are allocated to Genie+ per hour slot. So, 1200+ people were either rider swap, DAS or VIP tours. They counted zero VIP tours that time slot. 80% of the lightning lane capacity was non-Genie+. An insane number. This is likely why 3rd Part VIP tours have been banned.

DAS is being abused and it is almost impossible to deal with that without getting into law suits and PR trouble.

This type of information is very important to consider when analyzing waitimes and guest experience.

This issue is the elephant in the room that no one wants to talk about. Until the abuse of the DAS system is addressed, it might not make a difference no matter how Genie+ is altered.

 

[Jrb1979]

This issue is the elephant in the room that no one wants to talk about. Until the abuse of the DAS system is addressed, it might not make a difference no matter how Genie+ is altered.

Easy solution. Copy the same program Universal and Six Flags uses.

This what is required

For a successful registration process to secure attraction queue accommodations through the IAC, the following information is needed:

A recent photograph of the cardholder, serving as identification.

Contact details of the cardholder or the parent/guardian/support person responsible.

Contact information along with a statement from a medical provider, government entity, or educational support professional pertaining to the specific accommodations being requested.

 

[clarker99]

Easy solution. Copy the same program Universal and Six Flags uses.

This what is required

For a successful registration process to secure attraction queue accommodations through the IAC, the following information is needed:

A recent photograph of the cardholder, serving as identification.

Contact details of the cardholder or the parent/guardian/support person responsible.

Contact information along with a statement from a medical provider, government entity, or educational support professional pertaining to the specific accommodations being requested.

You would think a live video chat with a cast member would be as much of a deterrent as getting a doctors note.

 

[Jrb1979]

You would think a live video chat with a cast member would be as much of a deterrent as getting a doctors note.

You would but it obviously hasn't done enough.

 

[SL6827]

I thought people couldn't abuse the DAS as easily as they did in the past. But it's not working?

 

[Disneychick13]

You would think a live video chat with a cast member would be as much of a deterrent as getting a doctors note.

I think it’s probably easier for someone to lie through a video chat than in person to be honest. And universal’s new policy (to go through a 3rd party vendor that just kind of does a minimal job but at least is quasi-verifying some type of documentation) is at least going to eliminate the bold faced abusers.

I thought people couldn't abuse the DAS as easily as they did in the past. But it's not working?

If a company has absolutely no way to separate people who truly need the system and those who abuse it (because front line workers can only do so much and have no qualifications to determine true eligibility - although I’m sure they do the best they can) and you add in a paid system that will only increase the incentive to cheat, you will have a system that will only get more abuse.

 

[SL6827]

I think it’s probably easier for someone to lie through a video chat than in person to be honest. And universal’s new policy (to go through a 3rd party vendor that just kind of does a minimal job but at least is quasi-verifying some type of documentation) is at least going to eliminate the bold faced abusers.



If a company has absolutely no way to separate people who truly need the system and those who abuse it (because front line workers can only do so much and have no qualifications to determine true eligibility - although I’m sure they do the best they can) and you add in a paid system that will only increase the incentive to cheat, you will have a system that will only get more abuse.

Good point about the addition of the paid system now. Even more incentive to try. I just can't imagine. What in the world do they come up with that would qualify them for DAS?

 

[Minnie1222]

How many guests can a DAS holder bring on a ride? I'm just curious.

We're at WDW now and have been using Genie+ for the past 3 days. 99.9% of the people in the lightning lanes look like they wouldn't be qualified for anything.

 

[Disneychick13]

How many guests can a DAS holder bring on a ride? I'm just curious.

We're at WDW now and have been using Genie+ for the past 3 days. 99.9% of the people in the lightning lanes look like they wouldn't be qualified for anything.

There’s just no way to know why people are in the LL. Some have purchased ILL or genie+, some are DAS holders, some are child swap, some are people who have been given LL access through customer service (for ride breakdowns or compensation for whatever), some are VIP tours (very very few) or golden oak and Club 33 ( even fewer). I assume that Disney of course knows the percentages of who is using the LL/ what the patterns of use are, etc. If what a PP mentioned about something touring plans put out regarding LL use is actually true then there is a very serious problem and at some point Disney will have no choice but to address it.

 

[VAtink]

This is purely anecdotal, but in the past few years we have rarely seen other DAS users scan into the LL queue. If the information from Len Testa is accurate with ~75-80% of users of the LL being DAS users, then I would suspect purely probabilistically that we would see at least a few each trip, if not more. In the three trips I’ve been on this year alone, the only time I’ve seen other DAS users scan in has been on our most recent trip (very obvious since it turns blue instead of green for the initial scan), and we saw this twice the whole week of using DAS/Genie+. In trips prior to this year I don’t recall ever seeing another DAS user scan in.

While I have a lot of respect for Len Testa and what he’s doing, I clearly have some doubts about his source on the number of G+ users allowed per hour. I suspect it’s more than just 300/hr (which is only 5 people/minute which seems super low).

Not saying DAS isn’t being abused, I’m certain it is. I’m in multiple Facebook groups where people ask/provide information on how to get it without actually needing it. Fortunately the groups I’m in delete those pretty quickly, but it’s clearly something that some people are doing.

No idea on a good solution, we use it, however sparingly, usually on top of G+ and it definitely is helpful and allows us to do more than we had in the past, but we’d be fine if they would move to a doctors note or something along those lines were required.

 

[Disneychick13]

This is purely anecdotal, but in the past few years we have rarely seen other DAS users scan into the LL queue. If the information from Len Testa is accurate with ~75-80% of users of the LL being DAS users, then I would suspect purely probabilistically that we would see at least a few each trip, if not more. In the three trips I’ve been on this year alone, the only time I’ve seen other DAS users scan in has been on our most recent trip (very obvious since it turns blue instead of green for the initial scan), and we saw this twice the whole week of using DAS/Genie+. In trips prior to this year I don’t recall ever seeing another DAS user scan in.

While I have a lot of respect for Len Testa and what he’s doing, I clearly have some doubts about his source on the number of G+ users allowed per hour. I suspect it’s more than just 300/hr (which is only 5 people/minute which seems super low).

Not saying DAS isn’t being abused, I’m certain it is. I’m in multiple Facebook groups where people ask/provide information on how to get it without actually needing it. Fortunately the groups I’m in delete those pretty quickly, but it’s clearly something that some people are doing.

No idea on a good solution, we use it, however sparingly, usually on top of G+ and it definitely is helpful and allows us to do more than we had in the past, but we’d be fine if they would move to a doctors note or something along those lines were required.

My only anecdotal evidence that Len Testa might be on to something is when I went to the Christmas party. And at the parties basically the only people using the LL are DAS holders. I mean yeah there could be a random golden oaks or child swap, but for all intents and purposes they are just DAS holders. We went in space mountain (which is one of the few rides that it’s easy to see because the LL line runs right next to the regular line up to a certain point. And there were no fewer than 60 people pass us up in the LL (in the span of maybe 15 minutes until the point the lines weren’t running together). There easily could have been 100 people pass us up. That’s a significant number of DAS holders that were using the LL. Could that ride have been a one off? Sure. But if it wasn’t a one off, if that’s typical use of the LL, then I have to think that touring plans speculation might very well be correct. Again, totally anecdotal- but it definitely changed some of my thinking of the whole process.

I’m glad that you have been able to make good use of it and I clearly hope that Disney(and all theme parks) can find a reasonable way for the people that need a DAS to be able to get one while shutting the cheaters out (because they really affect everyone’s use of the LL).

 

[gottalovepluto]

-

 

[gottalovepluto]

Easy solution. Copy the same program Universal and Six Flags uses.

This what is required

For a successful registration process to secure attraction queue accommodations through the IAC, the following information is needed:

A recent photograph of the cardholder, serving as identification.

Contact details of the cardholder or the parent/guardian/support person responsible.

Contact information along with a statement from a medical provider, government entity, or educational support professional pertaining to the specific accommodations being requested.

People got approved under the new Uni program with a single page of an IEP that didn’t even discuss issues and others got notes from doctors/etc that aren’t verified because they can’t be- no professional would talk to the 3rd party outfit. The program is completely smoke and mirrors- but it means Uni doesn’t have to pay nearly as many Team Members to deal with this park aspect anymore since they’ve outsourced it.

 

[gottalovepluto]

We went in space mountain (which is one of the few rides that it’s easy to see because the LL line runs right next to the regular line up to a certain point. And there were no fewer than 60 people pass us up in the LL (in the span of maybe 15 minutes until the point the lines weren’t running together). There easily could have been 100 people pass us up.

That many people sounds like recovery level LLs from the ride being down at some point

 

[New Mouse]

Manh DAS eligible guests also often tended to not request assistance in the past when fp was free.

The higher they raise the price the more reason there is to use das.

 

[Jrb1979]

People got approved under the new Uni program with a single page of an IEP that didn’t even discuss issues and others got notes from doctors/etc that aren’t verified because they can’t be- no professional would talk to the 3rd party outfit. The program is completely smoke and mirrors- but it means Uni doesn’t have to pay nearly as many Team Members to deal with this park aspect anymore since they’ve outsourced it.

Regardless if it's smoke and mirrors, it does seem to be working as there isn't as much abuse compared to Disney.

 

[clarker99]

Regardless if it's smoke and mirrors, it does seem to be working as there isn't as much abuse compared to Disney.

We do not know that. All we can determine is that in 2020 30% and up to 80% (one recently reported instance at Haunted Mansion) of LL capacity is made up of DAS. We have zero clue what Universals numbers are.

 

[VAtink]

My only anecdotal evidence that Len Testa might be on to something is when I went to the Christmas party. And at the parties basically the only people using the LL are DAS holders. I mean yeah there could be a random golden oaks or child swap, but for all intents and purposes they are just DAS holders. We went in space mountain (which is one of the few rides that it’s easy to see because the LL line runs right next to the regular line up to a certain point. And there were no fewer than 60 people pass us up in the LL (in the span of maybe 15 minutes until the point the lines weren’t running together). There easily could have been 100 people pass us up. That’s a significant number of DAS holders that were using the LL. Could that ride have been a one off? Sure. But if it wasn’t a one off, if that’s typical use of the LL, then I have to think that touring plans speculation might very well be correct. Again, totally anecdotal- but it definitely changed some of my thinking of the whole process.

Funny enough, one of the places we saw other DAS users on our trip last week was at the Christmas party at Space Mountain. I know for us, the rides we use DAS on at the parties are those with overlays since those standby lines are usually too long for us (other rides standby is short enough we can just wait), so maybe others do the same so more DAS users are concentrated on those rides with overlays at the parties? I will say there was a shocking number of people in the LL for Space during the party.

I did notice one of the times on Space there was a huge group ahead of us that used the LL during the party and they were definitely not DAS (party was too big and none scanned in blue), so there are definitely other groups using LL during the party without DAS, whether it be Golden Oak, Club 33, Ride Recovery, etc. I wouldn't be surprised if these other users make up a small but noticeable chunk of LL users.