Hats in Restaurants

[MedicGoofy]

1) It is good to discuss removing hats in eateries.
. . . of course there are some exceptions
. . . there are ladies' hats/bonnets which are acceptable to remain on the head
. . . when going through chemo and wearing a headdress (not a ballcap)
2) However, the general public has shown a severe lack of etiquette.
3) It would be nice to hand out an etiquette card when you check-in.

{FLAME PROOF SUIT IN PLACE}
4) After all, it would be nice to correct
. . . people wearing hats in eateries
. . . people frequently dressing and eating like slobs
. . . people showing a lack of respect in waiting lines, or in line cutting
. . . people pushing and shoving in trying to view parades, even those already waiting in place
. . . people striking you in the back of your heels with strollers and ECVs
. . . people not controlling their kids and letting them misbehave at parks or meals
{FLAME PROOF SUIT BACK IN THE DRAWER}

oh man....AMEN to that....

and to the poster just underneath this....I don't think it's just that you are 'brought up old school'....I think it's just that you were brought up right.

This is just manners. And people, for the most part, have forgotten how to use them.

 

[Disney_Princess83]

This!

1) It is good to discuss removing hats in eateries.
. . . of course there are some exceptions
. . . there are ladies' hats/bonnets which are acceptable to remain on the head
. . . when going through chemo and wearing a headdress (not a ballcap)
2) However, the general public has shown a severe lack of etiquette.
3) It would be nice to hand out an etiquette card when you check-in.

{FLAME PROOF SUIT IN PLACE}
4) After all, it would be nice to correct
. . . people wearing hats in eateries
. . . people frequently dressing and eating like slobs
. . . people showing a lack of respect in waiting lines, or in line cutting
. . . people pushing and shoving in trying to view parades, even those already waiting in place
. . . people striking you in the back of your heels with strollers and ECVs
. . . people not controlling their kids and letting them misbehave at parks or meals
{FLAME PROOF SUIT BACK IN THE DRAWER}

 

[Uncleromulus]

Times and "standards" change I guess. I used to work in a Funeral Home and saw some folks visiting AND at the actual funerals in shorts, t-shirts, and jeans.

Ditto as to the last 2 weddings I attended--a lot of jeans, t-shirts shorts and tennis shoes.

So I guess none of us should be too suprised (regardless as to how we feel) seeing it in restaurants.

Even the Disney Cruise line is now allowing shorts in their TS onboard restaurants---and some reports of folks even in bathing suits being allowed in.

 

[BeerMe]

The question remains. Exactly why is it good manners to remove a hat in a restaurant?

 

[SouthJersey]

Of all things that go on in restaurants, the last thing I'd judge is a hat, unless I'm at a firmly required business casual or higher dress code. (V&A's, banquet dinners, special occasions, etc.)
If the attire you're already wearing is on the level of where you'd be wearing a ball cap, then I don't see how a hat is an issue besides the group who likes to maintain British originated ettiquette. In that case, we should be doffing and donning our hats at women also.

Hats were worn originally as protection to the elements. Two reasons for removing the hat indoors came about; 1.) a hat on indoors implied you'd be leaving soon, since hats were intended to protect from the environment elements/dirt and simply didn't serve a purpose indoors. 2.) Since hats were correlated to protecting from dirt and rain, why have a dirty item at the table?

That 'etiquette' was established well before men wore hats as a fashion item. Think about it, it's hypocritical. That same 'etiquette' rule says women can wear their fashionable hats indoors and it's fine. What is the difference? Hats today are 98% worn as a fashion article of clothing. When you add up the origins and women's fashion hats being accepted, the outlook on men's hats in the 21st century is completely flawed.

98% of people against hats indoors couldn't tell you the origin, which is hypocritical to expect etiquette of others without knowing the origins, aka 'phony'.

Also, given the circumstances of Disney World, say you're sweating in the parks during 95 degree florida weather and your hair is a mess (excluding the Mr. Clean guys). I don't think it's an etiquette issue for someone to confine their hat hair or wet hair at dinner.

Also, as someone who has a thick head of hair and wears baseball hats all the time, you know how 'pleasant' they can smell inside the hat after a couple days of use, especially in a hot environment.That tends to stay confined while that hat is on.

Society has carried over the irrelevant hat etiquette from a far in the past practice of removing it indoors.But, nobody judges the guy with the 1970's chest afro bursting out the top of his nice collared shirt, or the 'properly dressed' woman with straggly, twirling whiskers.

I'd rather see someone presentable with a hat on than nearly 3/4 of the things I see in nice restaurants.

Glad to see you take others and your surroundings into consideration OP, points for that!

 

[Tigger's ally]

Heck, half the restaurants around the country have their employees wearing hats now. I have twin sons who spend alot of money on hats, snapbacks, fitted, etc. It is a fashion statement. They take them off in fine eateries and always during the National Anthem and prayer. I don't expect them to take them off when Cosmic Ray is singing to them.

 

[minnie mum]

The question remains. Exactly why is it good manners to remove a hat in a restaurant

South Jersey's post does contain a few elements of correct information. Since the use of hats both for protection from the elements and as a fashion accessory predates Colonial America, it would be fair to say that both the wearing of hats and their removal when indoors is a centuries old tradition of European origins. The doffing of hats to ladies has not been an etiquette "must" for a very long time. Simply touching one's fingers to the brim was quite sufficient.

It has only been in the last decade or two where we have seen men fail in this very simple, polite act. Why? I have no idea. I'm sure their mamas brought them up better than that. Perhaps it is part and parcel of the "me" generation who feel that they are free to do whatever they want, whenever they want just as long as they aren't breaking any law. Good manners are simply disregarded if they are perceived as an inconvenience, perhaps.

Given the preponderance of baseball caps and bucket hats in the parks (by both sexes), in various stages of cleanliness and repair, I would challenge the assertion that they are 98% worn as a fashion article. While some fashion choice may go into the selection of a Yankees cap over a Mets one, I think that function is the primary driver here. That being the case, why would you wear it when it isn't needed? You aren't getting sunburned or rained on when you are inside. If your hair is a mess when you take it off, then use the opportunity to use the mirror in the bathroom to comb your hair after you have washed your hands. You do wash your hands before eating, don't you?

As to it being hypocritical (and to call those who actually prefer good manners as phony) to object to examples of poor etiquette if you can't recite all of the origins of the tradition...... I can't quote chapter and verse as to why chewing with your mouth open is in bad taste either. But I'm sure that even today it is looked upon as bad form.

DH wears a hat in most types of weather when outside. I have never seen him fail to remove his hat when entering a restaurant. It's as automatic to him as holding open a door for someone needing a hand. Just one of the many things that distinguishes a man as a gentleman.

You aren't going to spoil my meal or ruin my dining experience if you refuse to remove your headgear when you sit down for your meal. But this doesn't mean I won't have formed an opinion about your manners.

 

[MolonLabe]

The question remains. Exactly why is it good manners to remove a hat in a restaurant?

Because some people a long time ago said so. They are all dead and gone but we better still listen to them because.... etiquette.

Those were the same people who also said things like:
-You must wear a corset
-Dresses must cover your ankles
-Colored folks should use the back boor

Yeah... etiquette.

 

[Bob NC]

I guess most might agree that Emily Post and Miss Manners would say a hat should never be worn while dining.

I look at all these old etiquette rules as somewhat situational though.

At Disney many people wear hats to protect themselves from the sun and to keep cool.

Many folks have a serious case of unattractive, (Maybe to them only), 'hat head' after removing a hat.

I know if I wear a hat all day and then remove it, I am probably embarrassed about the looks of my hair.

If I were going to an offsite nice restaurant I'd most likely take a shower and go sans hat to the restaurant. When exiting an amusement park and walking 5 minutes to a theme park resort restaurant, though, chances are I'm not changing on the way. I'll meet the dress code, of course, but I'm sure there will ALWAYS be someone offended by my dress for some reason.

At Disney, though, the restaurants are there FOR theme park patrons. The restaurants wouldn't be there if there were no theme parks.

I for one don't care if someone wears a hat in the same building where I am eating. Doesn't affect me in the least. I guess if it DID affect me it would only be because those hat wearing slobs aren't adhering to some long antiquated rules somebody I don't know came up with.

Adhere to the dress codes? Yes. Go above and beyond just to satisfy some folks I don't know? Not so much.

 

[BEASLYBOO]

1) It is good to discuss removing hats in eateries.
. . . of course there are some exceptions
. . . there are ladies' hats/bonnets which are acceptable to remain on the head
. . . when going through chemo and wearing a headdress (not a ballcap)
2) However, the general public has shown a severe lack of etiquette.
3) It would be nice to hand out an etiquette card when you check-in.

{FLAME PROOF SUIT IN PLACE}
4) After all, it would be nice to correct
. . . people wearing hats in eateries
. . . people frequently dressing and eating like slobs
. . . people showing a lack of respect in waiting lines, or in line cutting
. . . people pushing and shoving in trying to view parades, even those already waiting in place
. . . people striking you in the back of your heels with strollers and ECVs
. . . people not controlling their kids and letting them misbehave at parks or meals
{FLAME PROOF SUIT BACK IN THE DRAWER}

Brave at 8:51 in the am!

I agree, and without pointing fingers or judging anyone on these boards, what is commonly known as "etiquette" or "socially acceptable" behavior is lost on a great many generations! These were things that were once taught/covered in school. My son, 17 tells his friends, "Take your hat off, we're at the dinner table." Teach them young!

 

[River Country]

Socially aceptable and ettiquite seem to be out the window sometimes at WDW. I was raised in a house that hats were not permitted at the table, thats how i roll and i have a baseball cap on all day but we always break during the day go back to the room and freshen up for dinner, but thats the way we vaction. There is another thread on here about bringing a pizza into BOG so i mean do you think those people care about wearing a hat? I THINK NOT LOL

Anyway i would not be offended if i saw someone else wearing a hat in a restaurant but its something i will not do..

Peace and Love

 

[Princess Vespa]

I can say that I have never noticed if anyone was wearing a hat at the table. My son doesn't wear hats so I have never had to tell him to take it off. And honestly, I don't pay much mind to whatever anyone else is doing. As long as my kids manners are where they need to be, I don't worry about anyone else.

 

[abolanwoski]

My DH and sons are ball cap wearers, too. Caps come off in entryways -- for dinner, church, theater, someone else's house, basically anytime they're going to sit down indoors and stay awhile. The only times they leave them on indoors is in gas stations, grocery stores, and the livestock sale barn.

Here, here. It's restaurant, not a barn!

I don't know when people stopped teaching their kids that men/boys remove their hats when entering a building. Maybe I'm old (only 40s) but I think it's a shame...

 

[jennylyn_b]

Here, here. It's restaurant, not a barn!

I don't know when people stopped teaching their kids that men/boys remove their hats when entering a building. Maybe I'm old (only 40s) but I think it's a shame...

I'm only 33 and think its a shame too!

 

[MIGrandma]

Here, here. It's restaurant, not a barn!

I don't know when people stopped teaching their kids that men/boys remove their hats when entering a building. Maybe I'm old (only 40s) but I think it's a shame...

I'm 56 and did grow up learning that men/boys removed their hats when going indoors.

It's just not one of those things that bothers me as an adult, it never has.

Everything changes. Used to be a white wedding gown meant purity, now? Not so much. Many brides choose to not even wear white. People flying on a plane used to dress up for the trip, now? Not so much. Cruise ships used to have first class, second class, and steerage. So many things that "used to be proper" are no longer adhered to.

And I don't agree with those who say a person "doesn't have proper manners" if they choose not to remove their hat inside a restaurant. To me, proper manners are being polite, saying "please" and "thank you", letting someone in line behind you go ahead of you if they have one or two items to check out and you have a cart full. Things like that. I wouldn't consider someone not removing their hat to be without manners. Obviously, their view of removing their hat or not just differs from yours. No big deal.

 

[SouthJersey]

South Jersey's post does contain a few elements of correct information. Since the use of hats both for protection from the elements and as a fashion accessory predates Colonial America, it would be fair to say that both the wearing of hats and their removal when indoors is a centuries old tradition of European origins. The doffing of hats to ladies has not been an etiquette "must" for a very long time. Simply touching one's fingers to the brim was quite sufficient.

It has only been in the last decade or two where we have seen men fail in this very simple, polite act. Why? I have no idea. I'm sure their mamas brought them up better than that. Perhaps it is part and parcel of the "me" generation who feel that they are free to do whatever they want, whenever they want just as long as they aren't breaking any law. Good manners are simply disregarded if they are perceived as an inconvenience, perhaps.

Given the preponderance of baseball caps and bucket hats in the parks (by both sexes), in various stages of cleanliness and repair, I would challenge the assertion that they are 98% worn as a fashion article. While some fashion choice may go into the selection of a Yankees cap over a Mets one, I think that function is the primary driver here. That being the case, why would you wear it when it isn't needed? You aren't getting sunburned or rained on when you are inside. If your hair is a mess when you take it off, then use the opportunity to use the mirror in the bathroom to comb your hair after you have washed your hands. You do wash your hands before eating, don't you?

As to it being hypocritical (and to call those who actually prefer good manners as phony) to object to examples of poor etiquette if you can't recite all of the origins of the tradition...... I can't quote chapter and verse as to why chewing with your mouth open is in bad taste either. But I'm sure that even today it is looked upon as bad form.

DH wears a hat in most types of weather when outside. I have never seen him fail to remove his hat when entering a restaurant. It's as automatic to him as holding open a door for someone needing a hand. Just one of the many things that distinguishes a man as a gentleman.

You aren't going to spoil my meal or ruin my dining experience if you refuse to remove your headgear when you sit down for your meal. But this doesn't mean I won't have formed an opinion about your manners.

Chewing with your mouth open doesn't need knowledge of any existing reasons, same as would be slurping or trying to dislodge something in your teeth at the table, for someone to find it poor etiquette.

However, if you don't know why hats are deemed to be not proper etiquette in a dining establishment, what about the actual action/practice would be in poor taste? You can see "ew he's smacking his mouth all loud and his food is sloshing around" in regards to the chewing example, however what would the claim be against the hat? Simply "I have no idea, but society tells me it's wrong, so I'm going to judge the hat wearer!" = phony.

If it's acceptable for a woman to wear a hat to dinner, then it's hypocritical to say men should remove theirs simply because a 100 year old trans-atlantic society started doing so first. You referred to functionality in hats- for my generation and maybe everyone under 40, hats have become primarily about repping their home town or as a fashion accessory. Venture into your local mall and stop at Lids. Men in their teens, 20's and 30's of all classes of society buying hats based off the color of their sneakers or stitching on their jeans, to match colors.


Also, holding a door for an individual and removing a hat in a restaurant, are not related at all. I know people who dress the part for expensive dinners, would remove their hats while thumbing their nose at people in jeans, however refuse to tip for service and would never hold a door for someone. So those things aren't related. One is helping your fellow human and the other is preserving the image you think is deemed appropriate by society.

In closing three sentences, it's clear your outlook would render me lesser of a gentleman for leaving my hat on in a casual dining environment and lack manners. My parents are worth in the area of $35,000,000 and I have a nice trust fund to fall back on, yet I've deployed three times in two wars and a fourth time in a civil unrest to avoid the stigma of being a trust-fund baby and to serve OUR country. I'm accustomed to many thing from military life, such as addressing every adult woman as ma'am and every senior male as sir and the same for professionals and those in authority. However, I'm a lesser gentleman than 'DH' since I support men wearing clean hats in casual dining settings. (Your last three sentences, firmly imply that.)

 

[SouthJersey]

Socially aceptable and ettiquite seem to be out the window sometimes at WDW. I was raised in a house that hats were not permitted at the table, thats how i roll and i have a baseball cap on all day but we always break during the day go back to the room and freshen up for dinner, but thats the way we vaction. There is another thread on here about bringing a pizza into BOG so i mean do you think those people care about wearing a hat? I THINK NOT LOL

Anyway i would not be offended if i saw someone else wearing a hat in a restaurant but its something i will not do..

Peace and Love

I'm the same way with at home and if I'm going somewhere even semi-decent, I'll not only not be wearing a hat, but will have showered to fix the 'hat hair'. At home, I can toss my hat in a room or place it somewhere away from the table.

However, if we're strolling into a casual mid-level dining setting and I've been wearing a hat all day, I'm not going to subject diners to loose hair (virtually every human accumulates hair in a hat), the inside 'hat' smell, or just toss my worn hat on a surface of the establishment. The best option in that scenario, is wearing it.

 

[minnie mum]

In closing three sentences, it's clear your outlook would render me lesser of a gentleman for leaving my hat on in a casual dining environment and lack manners. My parents are worth in the area of $35,000,000 and I have a nice trust fund to fall back on, yet I've deployed three times in two wars and a fourth time in a civil unrest to avoid the stigma of being a trust-fund baby and to serve OUR country. I'm accustomed to many thing from military life, such as addressing every adult woman as ma'am and every senior male as sir and the same for professionals and those in authority. However, I'm a lesser gentleman than 'DH' since I support men wearing clean hats in casual dining settings. (Your last three sentences, firmly imply that.)

Quite frankly, someone's parents income and their status as a trust fund baby have nothing whatsoever to do with their being a gentleman. I have know quite a few wealthy men with the manners of a complete boor. OTOH, I have known unskilled labourers who work for minimum wage who were always gentlemanly in their conduct. Nor does service to one's country (while commendable) automatically define them as a gentleman or exempt them from the use of commonly acceptable manners and behavior. As for the many things in military life to which you were accustomed, was not removing your head gear one of those things? It certainly is in our military- of which my husband was a member for his entire working life.

As to whether or not I would consider you less than gentlemanly for wearing a stinky, sweaty hat in a restaurant (your description from a previous post)- yes. But don't let that stop you. I'm not sure why you are so vehemently opposed to anyone who has an opinion that differs from your own.

 

[SouthJersey]

Quite frankly, someone's parents income and their status as a trust fund baby have nothing whatsoever to do with their being a gentleman. I have know quite a few wealthy men with the manners of a complete boor. OTOH, I have known unskilled labourers who work for minimum wage who were always gentlemanly in their conduct. Nor does service to one's country (while commendable) automatically define them as a gentleman or exempt them from the use of commonly acceptable manners and behavior. As for the many things in military life to which you were accustomed, was not removing your head gear one of those things? It certainly is in our military- of which my husband was a member for his entire working life.

As to whether or not I would consider you less than gentlemanly for wearing a stinky, sweaty hat in a restaurant (your description from a previous post)- yes. But don't let that stop you. I'm not sure why you are so vehemently opposed to anyone who has an opinion that differs from your own.

1.) The wealth comment wasn't correlated to manners or being a gentleman. It was in regards to doing for others and bettering myself as an individual despite having an easy cushion to fall back on.

2.) I got defensive when it was made clear that simply wearing a hat deducts points from a stranger's character to some.

3.) Military service doesn't define someone as a gentleman. However, a selfless figure loses such quality in their character from wearing a hat.

I argue in all good fun, nothing personal, no grudges. Just my view point. I understand it and your point, I was just offended at the character judgement in regards to it. No malice <3

 

[momofboyz3]

Chewing with your mouth open doesn't need knowledge of any existing reasons, same as would be slurping or trying to dislodge something in your teeth at the table, for someone to find it poor etiquette.

However, if you don't know why hats are deemed to be not proper etiquette in a dining establishment, what about the actual action/practice would be in poor taste? You can see "ew he's smacking his mouth all loud and his food is sloshing around" in regards to the chewing example, however what would the claim be against the hat? Simply "I have no idea, but society tells me it's wrong, so I'm going to judge the hat wearer!" = phony.

If it's acceptable for a woman to wear a hat to dinner, then it's hypocritical to say men should remove theirs simply because a 100 year old trans-atlantic society started doing so first. You referred to functionality in hats- for my generation and maybe everyone under 40, hats have become primarily about repping their home town or as a fashion accessory. Venture into your local mall and stop at Lids. Men in their teens, 20's and 30's of all classes of society buying hats based off the color of their sneakers or stitching on their jeans, to match colors.

Also, holding a door for an individual and removing a hat in a restaurant, are not related at all. I know people who dress the part for expensive dinners, would remove their hats while thumbing their nose at people in jeans, however refuse to tip for service and would never hold a door for someone. So those things aren't related. One is helping your fellow human and the other is preserving the image you think is deemed appropriate by society.

In closing three sentences, it's clear your outlook would render me lesser of a gentleman for leaving my hat on in a casual dining environment and lack manners. My parents are worth in the area of $35,000,000 and I have a nice trust fund to fall back on, yet I've deployed three times in two wars and a fourth time in a civil unrest to avoid the stigma of being a trust-fund baby and to serve OUR country. I'm accustomed to many thing from military life, such as addressing every adult woman as ma'am and every senior male as sir and the same for professionals and those in authority. However, I'm a lesser gentleman than 'DH' since I support men wearing clean hats in casual dining settings. (Your last three sentences, firmly imply that.)

I enjoyed reading this reply. Whether you keep your baseball hat on our not it's obvious that you are a true gentleman, thanks for reminding me that guys like you exist.