DAS changes coming WDW May 20/ DL June 18, 2024

[jennab]

This is one of my worries... I am not sure if my son will qualify anymore after reading even people with developmental disablities have been denied... we will buy Genie + if we cannot get DAS but the problem is if my son has meltdown it can be 2 hours long and now we missed our window... we really need the extended window time. Also he can hyperfocus on things and will sometime just want to ride one ride... which is not allowed on Genie +.

Luckliy our first trip is not till Thanksgiving break so hopefully the kinks will have been worked out by the time we go. Our last trip... in Disneyland was just soo wonderful using DAS. We had so few big meltdowns using DAS. It was wonderful... it really made our vacation. DAS was one of the reasons why we bought into DVC. It is a vacation spot that had less meltdowns becuase of DAS.

Also a random worry I am having... now that Dinsey is pushing this leave the line and come back to your group we will soo many more people "cutting" the line.... so many of my sons meltdowns at school have been over other kids cutting the line... my son is big into everything must be in order and in it's place and if anything is outplace it can trigger him... so with all these people going back in forth in line even if my son has DAS will be interesting for us. I will need to do a lot of prepping of what ever the system is to show this is just the system disney is now useing and they are not really cutting the line. Yeah good times.

It sounds like they send the person meeting up with family through the LL, so hopefully that will help as they won’t need to “line cut”. I totally hear you though, last time my son would get so mad at people coming by to meet up with their family. I explained to him that maybe they had to go to the bathroom and come back but he still would get upset that they weren’t “following the rules”.

 

[Thegoatfeeder]

I apologise if this has been asked loads but I kind of last track of all this.

Has there been any sort of solid information yet or has anyone experienced what the DAS alternative is for parties of 2 where both parties would have to leave the line? The first with the potential DAS requirement and the 2nd to assist.

I know this only went live on the 20th but it’s really stressing me out to be honest. Always had DAS before due to inability to walk far/stand for extended periods and chronic bladder and bowel issues that trigger severe anxiety if rushing to a bathroom isn’t an option.

 

[CyberScy]

We're quite sad and worried now after reading everything this past 24 hours, we're a couple on honeymoon from the UK and going in March next year. Without listing disabilities, I am unable to queue. If I am forced to, aside from the struggle of doing so, I have needs that would require both of us to leave the queue while we take care of business, rendering this "return to queue" useless. Really hoping things are relaxed a bit, at the moment it seems that we'll be turned down DAS.

 

[Grim Grinning Ghostie]

The only reason Fastpass+ worked for a small minority of users was because it didn’t work for the majority of users.

Yes. I absolutely hated Fastpass+. I'll happily pay for Genie+ over having to compete with people booking out all the rides 60 days in advance.

 

[Thegoatfeeder]

We're quite sad and worried now after reading everything this past 24 hours, we're a couple on honeymoon from the UK and going in March next year. Without listing disabilities, I am unable queue. If I am forced to, I have needs that would require both of us to leave the queue while we take care of business, rendering this "return to queue" useless. Really hoping things are relaxed a bit, at the moment it seems that we'll be turned down DAS.

In the same boat, we’re a party of 2 so the return to line thing doesn’t assist at all.

 

[StarLime]

This might be off topic, but did Universal change their disability process recently? I’ve seen some posts in here about it. I went in May of last year and it was as simple as a telephone call and explaining my disability. I didn’t have to provide anything. That was my only time at Universal.

 

[Evita_W]

I'm curious about the legality of forcing you to agree to T&Cs post sale of their non refundable tickets / APs to be able to request an accommodation? Presumably, after the sale has happened, the customer is in an unfair position to choose whether or not to agree to these T&Cs.

Unless they are willing to offer a full refund and pay for a refund of applicable airfare and hotel stays and any other normally nonrefundable costs at 30 days out, it likely won't hold up in court if challenged.

 

[lanejudy]

This might be off topic, but did Universal change their disability process recently?

Yes, I think it was last July. You must now submit "proof" online in advance of your trip.

here is a thread: https://www.disboards.com/threads/u...t-to-a-third-party-for-accessibility.3924604/

 

[Kari2684]

Thank you for sharing your experience. Please keep us updated when you get clarification.

Did they give you any reason as to why your friend wouldn't also be included with your DAS? Thanks again and hope you have a good trip.

No, and unfortunately I didn’t ask.

 

[Chuckdlc]

Yes, and with our son, there's such a backlog that his referral for early intervention at age 2, BY A DOCTOR, can't get him an autism eval until he's 4. So an IEP at his preschool is all we have, but the reason he even qualified for that preschool is preliminary assessment by a doctor, OT, and ST. You typically can't get an IEP without some kind of trained professional being involved at some point.

I can relate. First we did the denial thing where we didn't think a doctor was necessary and then we began the arduous process of finding a child psychologist who treated young children. AND THEN, if the psychologist thinks medication is (or might be) necessary you have to go through the next step of finding a psychiatrist who treats children. Mixed in with that of course is finding a child therapist. That was though, by comparison, the easiest part.

 

[DarthChurro]

This might be off topic, but did Universal change their disability process recently? I’ve seen some posts in here about it. I went in May of last year and it was as simple as a telephone call and explaining my disability. I didn’t have to provide anything. That was my only time at Universal.

Universal you need to sign up for the site that vets them, provide doctors paperwork then once your authorized you select the parks they work for (six flags/universal etc etc) which is the big difference from disney since you're not providing medical proof to disney, its to the third party and then universal approves you because "they" approved you.

 

[gottalovepluto]

Just giving my experience today. I’ve read a lot on this board, FB, and Reddit.
I am an out of state AP who goes about once a month. My current DAS expires May 23rd and I return May 23rd. I did the video chat today as I will be returning May 23rd and wanted to make sure all was set prior to leaving. I typically travel solo. Occasionally, I friends meet up with me.

I was approved for 120 days- again, I have an AP. I am not on the autism spectrum. I explained why I could not wait in the typical queue. I was told this approval was for me only. If anyone joins me, we would need to utilize the rider swap or return to queue option. I don’t know if this is another “level” of accommodations with a sort of partial approval. I really don’t know what this will look like when a friend joins me. I suppose that’s going to be a “we’ll see how this works” moment.

I go later this week and am not planning on having any friends join me. However, while I’m there, I am going to try to get clarification.

Did the friends have active tickets for your dates or if APs did they have park reservations for your dates?

 

[Princesca]

I can relate. First we did the denial thing where we didn't think a doctor was necessary and then we began the arduous process of finding a child psychologist who treated young children. AND THEN, if the psychologist thinks medication is (or might be) necessary you have to go through the next step of finding a psychiatrist who treats children. Mixed in with that of course is finding a child therapist. That was though, by comparison, the easiest part.

Yep, and everything is also lagging because kids who were born into quarantine times are showing much higher prevalence of speech and occupational delays, and just coupled with a general heightened awareness and sensitivity to these things anyway (when I was a kid I didn't have any friends in treatment for any kind of delays - and now it's like every kid in our playgroup is being treated for something; so good to see people getting assistance they need) there are not nearly enough therapists to keep up with demand. Our son's therapy practice has a months-long waiting list, and my friend who is a speech therapist has to turn away clients daily because she doesn't have the bandwidth.

All this is to say that even if you COULD prove your disability to Disney, it wouldn't necessarily be a smooth process, especially when you have people questioning whether an IEP is valid proof. There are kids who need help and aren't able to get it.

 

[Disneychick75]

Not that it will likely help in the immediate future but write Disney and share how you feel. If you have a trip planned go to City Hall and leave a letter especially if your vacation was impacted and how it was impacted by the new rules. Disney will have to tweak the new rules and they know it. Our trip is next week and I was "grandfathered" in with the old rules. I will, however, leave a note at City Hall and I intend to share on the vacation survey (if I get one), how I feel about the rules. Going to Disney forums and sharing is good for relieving frustrations but letting Disney know is better for possible changes.
guest.services@disneyparks.com
disability.services@disneyparks.com

 

[Obi-J Kenobi]

I'm really curious about TWDC's decision to require persons to waive their rights to participate in a class action lawsuit and how that will play out with the public.

First, TWDC is conditioning their reasonable accommodation on a waiver of a legal rights. I'm not sure how that is allowed under the ADA, but perhaps you can do so.

Second, not all DD are competent to waive his/her/their right (i.e. not competent to contract) and the children receiving the accommodation are not able to waive his/her/their right (i.e. infancy as a barrier to contract). Perhaps the parent can waive but the parent doesn't have the right to the accommodation under ADA.

Third, the class action waiver is not tied to an arbitration clause. So, some DD child has to sue TWDC in federal court. Seems to hit the mark with how TWDC treats guests.

Well if I said it once I've said it a thousand times, there is nothing more magical then waiving and releasing legal rights to sue and nothing more romantic than unilateral indemnification. At least WDW has adopted one-half.

 

[BlueGreen5]

I'm not sure why the 10 minute delay after entering a line using a DAS Return Time to get another is an "F" for implementation. Some attractions have 2 scan points, but it has not been consistent that both are turned on. That part is not a change, so it was never predictable (at least at WDW ) whether or not guests could make a new DAS Return Time right after scanning in. Some people asked whether there were 2 scan points when they entered the line.

Sorry, I meant just generally Disney gets an "F" for predictability in the way the new rules would be implemented. Sooo many questions and so much anxiety about unknowns still on the switchover day (look no further than a 250+ page thread on the topic...). IMO, it could have been rolled out so much smoother.

In my experience with a neurodivergent individual - and I get it, no two people are completely alike - one of the the hardest and most overwhelming things for that person to do is try to figure out something new/different on the fly, without the ability to do advance mental prep. Even something as small as when does the 10-minute countdown start -- now, in addition to all of the other challenges he or she is bravely facing head-on to enjoy WDW like the rest of us, he or she needs to figure out how to account for a 10-minute rule, and needs to figure out "well, does 10 minutes start at this point, or does it start at that point." Small things that I may take for granted just add a new layer of complexity, which adds a new layer of stress and anxiety and reduces their ability to enjoy the moment. I like the idea of the 10-minute rule, but tell these individuals EXACTLY how it works.

Agree that things tend to smooth out over time when people settle in and some things may just be "right now" problems. But, for many of the topics on this board, better, more specific advance communication could have removed some in-the-moment complexities for these individuals. That's all I was saying when I gave them the "F".

I relate all roll-outs back to the original iPhone roll-out. That thing absolutely changed the world and turned every previous cell phone upside down. It was a virtual certainty that the world was going to reject it because it was too much change, too quickly. Yet, because of the way Apple communicated its features (in short videos, narrated by a calming voice....lol, I remember all too well and I'm sure they're still out there in cyberspace somewhere for those too young to remember), most early adopters felt like they knew how to use it before they even touched one. It was familiar to them when there was no reason for it to be. It was a perfect case study in communication and change management. Right now, I don't feel that Disney attained that standard with the new DAS rules -- even for seasoned DAS users, there are feelings of uncertainty, unfamiliarity, and worry. I attribute that exclusively to communication.

 

[Genie+]

Unless they are willing to offer a full refund and pay for a refund of applicable airfare and hotel stays and any other normally nonrefundable costs at 30 days out, it likely won't hold up in court if challenged.

What else comes close to a standard like that? It’s why travel insurance exists.

A family could book a big trip to see The Stones, the concert cancels, and just the ticket price refunded.

I don’t think Disney could be legally held to do anything beyond refund of tickets and any related pre-paid reservations like Disney room or dining.

 

[lanejudy]

First, TWDC is conditioning their reasonable accommodation on a waiver of a legal rights. I'm not sure how that is allowed under the ADA, but perhaps you can do so.

As was mentioned upthread, the individual (or parent for a minor) is not waiving any right to sue. Only the right to join a "class action" lawsuit. The individual is welcome to file a suit on their own merits.

 

[lanejudy]

now, in addition to all of the other challenges he or she is bravely facing head-on to enjoy WDW like the rest of us, he or she needs to figure out how to account for a 10-minute rule, and needs to figure out "well, does 10 minutes start at this point, or does it start at that point." Small things that I may take for granted just add a new layer of complexity, which adds a new layer of stress and anxiety and reduces their ability to enjoy the moment

I understand what you are saying...but there is a LOT of gray areas in life that don't have hard-and-fast rules. Believe me, I also have one of those who likes the black-and-white of solid rules. We often set our own "rules" for things if it will help eliminate gray areas.

In the situation of the 10-minute rule, I will simply inform DD that the 10 minutes begins once we exit the attraction. Problem solved. No need to worry about 1 tap-in or is there a 2nd tap. Too much gray in that.

 

[Liquidice]

Sorry, I meant just generally Disney gets an "F" for predictability in the way the new rules would be implemented. Sooo many questions and so much anxiety about unknowns still on the switchover day (look no further than a 250+ page thread on the topic...). IMO, it could have been rolled out so much smoother.

In my experience with a neurodivergent individual - and I get it, no two people are completely alike - one of the the hardest and most overwhelming things for that person to do is try to figure out something new/different on the fly, without the ability to do advance mental prep. Even something as small as when does the 10-minute countdown start -- now, in addition to all of the other challenges he or she is bravely facing head-on to enjoy WDW like the rest of us, he or she needs to figure out how to account for a 10-minute rule, and needs to figure out "well, does 10 minutes start at this point, or does it start at that point." Small things that I may take for granted just add a new layer of complexity, which adds a new layer of stress and anxiety and reduces their ability to enjoy the moment. I like the idea of the 10-minute rule, but tell these individuals EXACTLY how it works.

Agree that things tend to smooth out over time when people settle in and some things may just be "right now" problems. But, for many of the topics on this board, better, more specific advance communication could have removed some in-the-moment complexities for these individuals. That's all I was saying when I gave them the "F".

I relate all roll-outs back to the original iPhone roll-out. That thing absolutely changed the world and turned every previous cell phone upside down. It was a virtual certainty that the world was going to reject it because it was too much change, too quickly. Yet, because of the way Apple communicated its features (in short videos, narrated by a calming voice....lol, I remember all too well and I'm sure they're still out there in cyberspace somewhere for those too young to remember), most early adopters felt like they knew how to use it before they even touched one. It was familiar to them when there was no reason for it to be. It was a perfect case study in communication and change management. Right now, I don't feel that Disney attained that standard with the new DAS rules -- even for seasoned DAS users, there are feelings of uncertainty, unfamiliarity, and worry. I attribute that exclusively to communication.

When you consider how this entire rollout occurred, it is obvious that the people making these decisions really do not understand their disabled customers well enough or don't care enough to try. The amount of communication has been poor, their rollout of queue re-entry literally has no process defined, it is simply to ask a CM at each ride entrance. It is like they wanted to increase everyone's anxiety over this change.

But why does it seem so haphazard? Because Disney doesn't really make any money off of this change. So their investment and interest in the change is much weaker than if they were going to stand to make money.

The iPhone launch was carefully crafted and Apple likely spent millions of dollars on how the launch should go. At the time they likely thought they could make millions off of the iPhone and it has turned into billions for them and likely saved the company.

Disney likely has spent as little money as possible on the actual changes, and even less on the marketing budget to communicate the change.

Compare it to when Disney launched Disney+ there were live demos of the service, journalists got early access to the service so they could write articles on how it works. Genie+ was also communicated better, which obviously stands to make Disney money. IIRC people were given Genie+ on the first day it was available (or maybe a few days before) for free to try it out and probably generate positive feedback about it before it officially launched. Imagine if there were a Disney Parks blog like this along with YouTube videos to talk about the changes being made to DAS: https://disneyparks.disney.go.com/blog/2021/08/introducing-disney-genie/

When Disney wants to, they know how to communicate changes appropriately. It simply comes down to Disney isn't really motivated (by profits) to properly communicate the changes.