Riviera Resort

AdamsMum

DIS Veteran
Joined
Sep 12, 2009
Hi All,

I just saw a picture of the construction of this resort. It's huge! Is it 100% DVC? I'm feeling anxious that DVD is going to flood the market with DVC points sold to people who don't necessarily want to stay there. I own at BWV and BCV and it's getting harder and harder to book for busy times of the year. In addition, how is this going to affect the traffic at BW and BC, and the International Gateway?

This year, I couldn't get my vacation approved until 10 months out. My manager doesn't like committing, I had to explain to her how hard it is too book this late in the game. I'm still not sure she believes me.

It's a solo trip so I wanted a studio. I was able to get the studio at BC from Dec 12-17 but for the first 3 days from Dec 9-12 had to take a 1 bed at BWV. Standard wasn't available, but I was able to snag a Boardwalk view over the "preferred" (I don't know who prefers it but I found it wholly unimpressive when I booked it a few years ago).

I love BW and BC, the area, the convenience, and the atmosphere, and bought there because I wanted to stay there. I don't always need a studio, but I do the occasional solo trip. Looks like its going to be me at 8 a.m. when the 11 month window opens from now on.

Am I just being paranoid?
 
Riviera is being positioned as a high end resort, like the Grand Floridian. While DVC may issue many points for the resort, I don't see people who buy there wanting to use those points at BC or BWV. I suspect they will be more likely to want to try the monorail resorts, or AKV, for variety.
 
BWV and BCV are already nearly impossible at 7 months, and Star Wars will increase that. Riviera won't mean a thing for those two.
 
Keep in mind that none of the Riviera owners will be competing against you for nights at BWV or BCV during your Home Resort Period. The Riviera could bring 4 to 6 million DVC points into the system, but your home resorts will be untouchable to the Riviera owners until the 7-month window opens. If you experience any difficulty getting BWV or BCV at the 10 month mark, then its your fellow BWV or BCV owners that are to blame.
 


Riviera is supposed to be all DVC. Adding a new resort seems always to have some adverse impact on 7 month reservations at any near park resorts. Moreover, if, as I suspect, the nightly point requirements for Riviera rooms are going to be more than the same-sized BWV preferred and BCV rooms, you could see BWV and BCV rooms disappear at 7 months out somewhat quicker than they do now. Also, as far as "traffic" at BWV and BCV, it is not clear what impact Riviera is going to have but the existence of the gondola system should make it easier for all those in all the resorts in that area to come to the boardwalk or BCV restaurants at night. Likewise, you will have far more people using the International Gateway for entry into and exit from EPCOT.

But BCV's and BWV's problems with getting rooms using the 11 month reservation window are not likely to change in any significant extent because of Riviera. Riviera could possibly have some minor impact simply because making it harder to reserve things at 7 months out can lead more owners of a resort to reserve at 11 months out at their home resort instead of waiting; however, that kind of effect has likely already happened close to its fullest possible extent because of the increasing difficulties at 7 months out that have occurred in the last 8 or so years. The main causes of problems that exist for BCV and BWV, particularly for studios (and resulting 2BR lock-offs), during the 11 month window are not related to the additon of a new resort.

Other than for BWV standard view and on rare occassions boardwalk view, the two resorts have not really had issues booking at 11 or even 10 months out during the DVC low to moderate demand season that runs from the Monday after marathon weekend in January to late September. In fact, BWV pool/garden view is usually open even at 7 months out, and BCV likewise about 50% of that time, and you can even get lucky a number of times and get BWV boardwalk view at 7 months out. The hardest times to reserve during that season are race weekends and that is likely due both to the popularity of such weekends with DVC members and to a high amount of rentals for such weekends (a factor of the internet and rental brokers making it easy now to do a rental).

It is during DVC's high demand season, from late Sep to marathon weekend in Jan, where the ability to book BCV or BWV studios if you wait past 11 months out continues to get more difficult. The time you could not get, Dec 9-12, is part of the first two weeks in Dec, extremely high demand times (the first week is DVC's highest demand week of the year, the second week is the third highest -- in between the two at second is Christmas week). During those weeks there is even a real risk of not getting BWV standard and boardwalk view studios and to a lesser extent BCV studios at exactly 11 months. Other extremely high demand periods during that season include the Thursday before Columbus Day to the second weekend after Columbus Day, the Wine & Dine race weekend in the first part of Nov (the highest demand weekend of the year), the last weekend of Food & Wine in mid-Nov, the Tues to Fri of Thanksgiving week, and marathon weekend in Jan.

The causes of the high demand during that season for BWV and BCV (and other near park resorts) are several, all unrelated to having a new resort. The high demand season has some of the best weather in Orlando for the year. It then has all the events Disney has created for it -- Halloween, Food & Wine, Christmas decorations and events (which now starts in first half of Nov). It has the lowest and second lowest nightly point requirements except for three days around Thanksgiving and the last week of December. In essence, it is an ideal time of the year for DVC members to go. Added to that is the aging population of many DVC resorts, including BWV and BCV, where annually more and more of the earlier purchasers escape having to obey school schedules for their vacations because their kids are now grown. More and more of those want time during the high demand season and many of them no longer need a 1BR or 2BR but instead now want studios, and with the lower point requirements can take longer vacations in those studios than they ever did in 1BRs or 2BRs when they had kids. Disney and the internet also helped to increase demand for studios at 11 to 10 months out during that period. Disney by selling low (as low as 25 point) add-ons over the years, many of which have been sold to others by owners easily doing so by using the internet, and a huge number of those resale purchasers now have only a low number of points, which are to be used, ideally in their minds, for studios during that high demand but low point cost season. The internet just generally added to demand at 11 months out by providing information to owners where many learned that they could be blocked out if they did not book 11 months out. Moreover, after the Great Recession struck, Disney added to the problem by abandoning its minimum point requirements for new purchasers and creating 100 point minimums which at times became 50 point minimums, for sales of points to new purchasers, including at BCV and BWV that it got back through foreclosures or exercises of right of first refusal for resales, thus creating even more BWV and BCV owners who would want studios during that high demand season. Finally, the growth of the rental market on the internet has likely had some impact on demand at 11 months out during that high demand season, particularly for the November and January race weekends.
 
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A minority of new IG gondola traffic will be from the new Rivera resort, since the gondola system will also serve the larger POP, AoA and CBR resorts, too. (I’m not certain if CBR will have more rooms?)
 


Hi All,

I just saw a picture of the construction of this resort. It's huge! Is it 100% DVC? I'm feeling anxious that DVD is going to flood the market with DVC points sold to people who don't necessarily want to stay there. I own at BWV and BCV and it's getting harder and harder to book for busy times of the year. In addition, how is this going to affect the traffic at BW and BC, and the International Gateway?

This year, I couldn't get my vacation approved until 10 months out. My manager doesn't like committing, I had to explain to her how hard it is too book this late in the game. I'm still not sure she believes me.

It's a solo trip so I wanted a studio. I was able to get the studio at BC from Dec 12-17 but for the first 3 days from Dec 9-12 had to take a 1 bed at BWV. Standard wasn't available, but I was able to snag a Boardwalk view over the "preferred" (I don't know who prefers it but I found it wholly unimpressive when I booked it a few years ago).

I love BW and BC, the area, the convenience, and the atmosphere, and bought there because I wanted to stay there. I don't always need a studio, but I do the occasional solo trip. Looks like its going to be me at 8 a.m. when the 11 month window opens from now on.

Am I just being paranoid?

You're looking at a 7 month booking from Riviera owners affecting your home resort which is what you still were at 10 months and that can't happen. The two weeks of December are the most difficult to book so that was also a factor.

Did you waitlist for the studio at BCV for the nights you hadn't gotten? Also, with no penalty to cancel you might consider booking right at 11 months and once you know if the vacation is approved or not you can adjust if necessary. That could be worrisome if you have to borrow but if you are using banked and/or current points then nothing lost in doing so.
 
I think Riviera could actually help a bit.....right now the only options for the Epcot/HS area for DVC are BC and BW so adding a resort with as many rooms as Riviera should help to eat up a bit of the demand. I think that a lot of renters will end up going to Riviera rather than deal with the struggle of getting into BC or BW.
 
No impact for at all for BWV/BCV owners who book within the home resort priority window. For DVC members who own at resorts they don't necessarily want to stay at, it will provide a lot more competition for rooms at BWV/BCV. If Riveria rooms will be points pricey, the allure of relatively cheap rooms at BWV/BCV will draw many Riveria owners to try and switch at the 7 month window. Since we haven't seen any points charts yet, this is still a major assumption though. If Riveria resort points are more in line with BCV/BWV, then probably not.
 
A minority of new IG gondola traffic will be from the new Rivera resort, since the gondola system will also serve the larger POP, AoA and CBR resorts, too. (I’m not certain if CBR will have more rooms?)

After all is said and done, CBR will have less rooms than before because half of Martinique and all of Barbados were torn down.

I own at BWV and am concerned about the IG. Unless they can pre-screen the Gondola resorts, it’s going to be a mess. Plus they need more tapstyles.
 
Riviera is being positioned as a high end resort, like the Grand Floridian. While DVC may issue many points for the resort, I don't see people who buy there wanting to use those points at BC or BWV. I suspect they will be more likely to want to try the monorail resorts, or AKV, for variety.
Guess we'll be the exceptions then - We own both BWV & BCV, & are only holding off buying more points because we want an EPCOT resort with more years.
 
Guess we'll be the exceptions then - We own both BWV & BCV, & are only holding off buying more points because we want an EPCOT resort with more years.

But you won't be using Riviera points at BWV or BCV or have expectation of changing to them at 7, which was @CraigInPA 's drift. Riviera won't change home resort competition anywhere.
 
After all is said and done, CBR will have less rooms than before because half of Martinique and all of Barbados were torn down.

I own at BWV and am concerned about the IG. Unless they can pre-screen the Gondola resorts, it’s going to be a mess. Plus they need more tapstyles.
.
As to prescreening it would be really hard on guests that have a single day park ticket who got on the Skyliner at CBR that they just wanted a ride to the Boardwalk area, but instead they had to use a park ticket to ride. Also the unloading area at DHS is far from the turnstiles so I doubt that park will require them to scan MBs when entering the Skyliner. But Disney could easily send them through a security screening IMO.

I was wondering about this lack of turnstiles at the International Gateway myself. They definitely need to do something about them.
 
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As to prescreening it would be really hard on guests that have a single day park ticket who got on the Skyliner at CBR that they just wanted a ride to the Boardwalk area, but instead they had to use a park ticket to ride. Also the unloading area at DHS is far from the turnstiles so I doubt that park will require them to scan MBs when entering the Skyliner. But Disney could easily send them through a security screening IMO.

I was wondering about this lack of turnstiles at the International Gateway myself. They definitely need to do something about them.

I meant to pre screen for security at the resorts, not park tickets. The problem would be keeping them separate from those using security at the gates.
 
If anything I think Riviera will relieve pressure on BWV/BCV since there will be a third option for the Epcot/HS area, with a shiny new transportation system to boot. Subject to the desirability of the theme (all we have is one vague rendering), resort amenities, and points per night of course.

International Gateway no doubt will be under pressure with the nearly 4,000 rooms at Pop/AoA shifting to that entrance.
 
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Count me in as another BWV owner who is concerned about the additional traffic at IG. I really wish Disney would give some information about their plans for this Epcot entrance to put to rest the questions and concerns that owners and guest of the Epcot area resorts have...
 
Hi All,

I just saw a picture of the construction of this resort. It's huge! Is it 100% DVC? I'm feeling anxious that DVD is going to flood the market with DVC points sold to people who don't necessarily want to stay there. I own at BWV and BCV and it's getting harder and harder to book for busy times of the year. In addition, how is this going to affect the traffic at BW and BC, and the International Gateway?

This year, I couldn't get my vacation approved until 10 months out. My manager doesn't like committing, I had to explain to her how hard it is too book this late in the game. I'm still not sure she believes me.

It's a solo trip so I wanted a studio. I was able to get the studio at BC from Dec 12-17 but for the first 3 days from Dec 9-12 had to take a 1 bed at BWV. Standard wasn't available, but I was able to snag a Boardwalk view over the "preferred" (I don't know who prefers it but I found it wholly unimpressive when I booked it a few years ago).

I love BW and BC, the area, the convenience, and the atmosphere, and bought there because I wanted to stay there. I don't always need a studio, but I do the occasional solo trip. Looks like its going to be me at 8 a.m. when the 11 month window opens from now on.

Am I just being paranoid?

You could be paranoid but it doesn’t mean you are wrong lol. JK

In same boat with the Mr.. we took to taking early October @ BWV, since nobody else seemed to want that time frame. Conversely, Funny how it’s so popular with DVC members. Only once did we have to scramble when we didn’t get the week we booked on faith. Plenty of time to bank the points and book CRO, all good!

I disagree with majority here. When SSR came online, things became exponentially more difficult at the 7 month window for studios.

Riviera is being positioned as a high end resort, like the Grand Floridian. While DVC may issue many points for the resort, I don't see people who buy there wanting to use those points at BC or BWV. I suspect they will be more likely to want to try the monorail resorts, or AKV, for variety.

IDK, I’m just not getting high end from what I’ve seen thus far. Who knows, maybe they’ll hit it out of the park with spcacious rooms and high-end design. Hate to to say it but many of the resorts disney describes as 4 star resorts don’t quite measure up in my eyes, discounting location, to each their own.

Riviera is supposed to be all DVC. Adding a new resort seems always to have some adverse impact on 7 month reservations at any near park resorts. Moreover, if, as I suspect, the nightly point requirements for Riviera rooms are going to be more than the same-sized BWV preferred and BCV rooms, you could see BWV and BCV rooms disappear at 7 months out somewhat quicker than they do now. Also, as far as "traffic" at BWV and BCV, it is not clear what impact Riviera is going to have but the existence of the gondola system should make it easier for all those in all the resorts in that area to come to the boardwalk or BCV restaurants at night. Likewise, you will have far more people using the International Gateway for entry into and exit from EPCOT.

But BCV's and BWV's problems with getting rooms using the 11 month reservation window are not likely to change in any significant extent because of Riviera. Riviera could possibly have some minor impact simply because making it harder to reserve things at 7 months out can lead more owners of a resort to reserve at 11 months out at their home resort instead of waiting; however, that kind of effect has likely already happened close to its fullest possible extent because of the increasing difficulties at 7 months out that have occurred in the last 8 or so years. The main causes of problems that exist for BCV and BWV, particularly for studios (and resulting 2BR lock-offs), during the 11 month window are not related to the additon of a new resort.

Other than for BWV standard view and on rare occassions boardwalk view, the two resorts have not really had issues booking at 11 or even 10 months out during the DVC low to moderate demand season that runs from the Monday after marathon weekend in January to late September. In fact, BWV pool/garden view is usually open even at 7 months out, and BCV likewise about 50% of that time, and you can even get lucky a number of times and get BWV boardwalk view at 7 months out. The hardest times to reserve during that season are race weekends and that is likely due both to the popularity of such weekends with DVC members and to a high amount of rentals for such weekends (a factor of the internet and rental brokers making it easy now to do a rental).

It is during DVC's high demand season, from late Sep to marathon weekend in Jan, where the ability to book BCV or BWV studios if you wait past 11 months out continues to get more difficult. The time you could not get, Dec 9-12, is part of the first two weeks in Dec, extremely high demand times (the first week is DVC's highest demand week of the year, the second week is the third highest -- in between the two at second is Christmas week). During those weeks there is even a real risk of not getting BWV standard and boardwalk view studios and to a lesser extent BCV studios at exactly 11 months. Other extremely high demand periods during that season include the Thursday before Columbus Day to the second weekend after Columbus Day, the Wine & Dine race weekend in the first part of Nov (the highest demand weekend of the year), the last weekend of Food & Wine in mid-Nov, the Tues to Fri of Thanksgiving week, and marathon weekend in Jan.

The causes of the high demand during that season for BWV and BCV (and other near park resorts) are several, all unrelated to having a new resort. The high demand season has some of the best weather in Orlando for the year. It then has all the events Disney has created for it -- Halloween, Food & Wine, Christmas decorations and events (which now starts in first half of Nov). It has the lowest and second lowest nightly point requirements except for three days around Thanksgiving and the last week of December. In essence, it is an ideal time of the year for DVC members to go. Added to that is the aging population of many DVC resorts, including BWV and BCV, where annually more and more of the earlier purchasers escape having to obey school schedules for their vacations because their kids are now grown. More and more of those want time during the high demand season and many of them no longer need a 1BR or 2BR but instead now want studios, and with the lower point requirements can take longer vacations in those studios than they ever did in 1BRs or 2BRs when they had kids. Disney and the internet also helped to increase demand for studios at 11 to 10 months out during that period. Disney by selling low (as low as 25 point) add-ons over the years, many of which have been sold to others by owners easily doing so by using the internet, and a huge number of those resale purchasers now have only a low number of points, which are to be used, ideally in their minds, for studios during that high demand but low point cost season. The internet just generally added to demand at 11 months out by providing information to owners where many learned that they could be blocked out if they did not book 11 months out. Moreover, after the Great Recession struck, Disney added to the problem by abandoning its minimum point requirements for new purchasers and creating 100 point minimums which at times became 50 point minimums, for sales of points to new purchasers, including at BCV and BWV that it got back through foreclosures or exercises of right of first refusal for resales, thus creating even more BWV and BCV owners who would want studios during that high demand season. Finally, the growth of the rental market on the internet has likely had some impact on demand at 11 months out during that high demand season, particularly for the November and January race weekends.

I have not been as lucky as you describe for non BW view studios if not booking very near the 11 month window. Have been initially shut out more times than I can remember until I discovered the power of walking a reservation. Not that they didn’t usually come thru, just some nail biting there.

IMO GV & studios seem to be in very high demand. Don’t understand why the don’t build a larger proportion of them.
 

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