Paying 2022 maint. fees when there’s 0 points available in 2022

[VandVsmama]

I’m new to this whole DVC resale thing. I’ve been looking at a lot of listings on the DVC Resale Market website. And I have a question.

Why is it that sellers expect a buyer to pay for 2022 maintenance fees when, for example, on, December use year, there’s zero points coming up for December 2021? I’ve been looking at 120-175 point contracts and the maintenance fees hover around $1300 on average between a couple of the resorts I’ve been looking at for a 150 avg point contract.

So the seller seriously thinks that a buyer is going to pay $1300 in maintenance next year when the buyer can’t use any points until Dec ofnext year? Meh, forget it. I’ll wait for a better contract to come along.

what do you guys think?

 

[chalee94]

It's all negotiable. You can ask for whatever you want. If the numbers don't work for you, it's very reasonable to walk.

(It's also true that dues are paid according to calendar year and not use year - so while Dec 2022 points may seem a long way away, the calendar still says 2022, I guess.)

 

[Lorana]

I’m new to this whole DVC resale thing. I’ve been looking at a lot of listings on the DVC Resale Market website. And I have a question.

Why is it that sellers expect a buyer to pay for 2022 maintenance fees when, for example, on, December use year, there’s zero points coming up for December 2021? I’ve been looking at 120-175 point contracts and the maintenance fees hover around $1300 on average between a couple of the resorts I’ve been looking at for a 150 avg point contract.

So the seller seriously thinks that a buyer is going to pay $1300 in maintenance next year when the buyer can’t use any points until Dec ofnext year? Meh, forget it. I’ll wait for a better contract to come along.

what do you guys think?

Dues are based on calendar year, not UY. So I agree with your thinking. If there are no points till Dec 2022, I’d ask the seller to pay 2022 dues.

 

[Sandisw]

As mentioned, dues are based on calendar year for operations of the resort as an owner.

Because we are in 2021, some feel they can still get a buyer to pay the 2022 since by the time it closes, they will be the official owner when those dues happen.

However, I agree that it’s not a good deal if it’s stripped of points. Even though those are negotiable, I’d pass as well.

But, the broker and the seller know that people negotiate and they may be expecting an offer to include some level of that for those fees.

 

[robinb]

You will eventally get the points from the 2022 UY. So, the seller expects you to pay the dues on them. But, I agree with the others. This is a stripped contact and I would walk unless it was a great price.

 

[Lorana]

I also look at it this way - if I purchased direct, I’d pay 2022 but also get 2021 points. And if I didn’t purchase till December 2022 - reflecting that this contract has no 2021 points - I’d only pay 1 month of dues. I use this when negotiating offers.

Most brokers and sellers don’t see it that way, but given that dues are calendar year NOT UY, I very much consider how much of the year I have with points. I will either ask the seller to pay, or I will subtract the dues from the offer price. My UY is Sep and I feel similarly when contracts are stripped of 2021; I don’t want to pay a full year of dues but only have 4 months of points.

 

[sethschroeder]

Don't look at the MFs just add up the total of points, MFs, fees and anything else. Then divide by the points and you will have a true cost that you can compare across contracts.

Example buy 2 contracts at $130/point or 1 contract at $133/point might mean the singular contract is actually cheaper per point since you don't have all the extra fees on each contract.

 

[MICKIMINI]

I believe some resellers are lazy and use a template for the "average" listing offer. Those resellers would like all buyers to "conform" and offer "their" way. I don't pay any attention to that at all.

I make my offer based on my reality...which is often asking the seller pays closing and current years dues. If the seller has used up all or partial 2022 it is traditional for the buyer to pay a prorated amount. Again, offer and pay what YOU want! Good luck and don't get discouraged...all they can say is no.

 

[StacyLovesDisney]

I wish I had thought of this before I made my offer. That’s why this forum is so good. Better to be educated when making such a big purchase.

 

[sndral]

In my mind this has always been a difference between resale & direct. My understanding is that DVC direct prorates the dues you owe, so if you bought in Sept. ‘21 w/ a Dec. use year DVC would give you all of your 2020 points (& likely waive the banking deadline & bank the points for you) & prorate your 2021 dues only charging you 4/12s, but come Jan. you’d be charged full MFs for your 2022 points even though you wouldn‘t get them (w/out borrowing) until Dec. 2022.
Most resale brokers claim the norm is that the seller pays the full years dues irrespective of use year, when they buy, whether those points are bankable, etc.. In the contract OP mentions I suppose you could at least use 1/2 those points before Dec. via borrowing.
I’ve never cared what they called it, I just add the dues + price per point + administrative fee if the brokerage charges that to compare true price per point when making offers.

 

[rubybutt]

I think it has been touched on by a couple of people, but money is fungible. It doesn't matter what you call the amount you are using to buy the contract, it just matters what the total cost to you will be. That is where negotiation is really helpful. Know what you are willing to spend total for the contract, start 5-10% less then do negotiation to get where you want to end up. Plus sometimes they just take your initial offer!

ETA: if it doesn't work out (which it shouldn't for a few contracts) I didn't want that contract anyway!

 

[Littlelulu01]

I also look at it this way - if I purchased direct, I’d pay 2022 but also get 2021 points. And if I didn’t purchase till December 2022 - reflecting that this contract has no 2021 points - I’d only pay 1 month of dues. I use this when negotiating offers.

Most brokers and sellers don’t see it that way, but given that dues are calendar year NOT UY, I very much consider how much of the year I have with points. I will either ask the seller to pay, or I will subtract the dues from the offer price. My UY is Sep and I feel similarly when contracts are stripped of 2021; I don’t want to pay a full year of dues but only have 4 months of points.

if purchasing direct today for a December uy the contract is actually still in the 2020 uy so it will come with 2020 set of points with no maintenance fees attached (DVC will courtesy bank 2020 points into 2021 UY), a full set of 2021 uy points available next month with the mf’s prorated and then the 2022 uy points not available till December 2022.

When factoring in the additional 2 years of points, lower closing costs, no restrictions, and immediate access to points it was a no brainer for me to go direct.