How does renting points work?

[DVCSunDevil]

I have not rented points before. I know you can either go through a company like David’s or rent “direct” via listing points on this board. However, I’m not 100% educated on the “ins and outs” of each option. I have read comments on these boards talking about renter and rentee contracts through David’s. So I guess my questions are the following:
- how does David’s system work? What are the steps? Do they give you all the money upfront for points and then they just sell them as they want, or do they get their money once they find someone who wants to rent your points? I guess I’m just looking for a little more information on the intricacies of their program and how it works for David’s, the buyers, and the sellers. From reading comments on here, it seems very confusing.
- if you are renting points via the boards on this site, do you just rent points or do you make a reservation and then see if anyone is interested in that reservation? It seems like renting via the boards on the site would be easier and less sketchy than dealing with a company like David’s, although I suppose David’s offer some sort of protection for both parties against getting swindled. Although I don’t know how David’s offers that protection.

Thank you for your help!!

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

I think the David's, and probably any other broker, has a primer on renting that will be applicable to how each does it. In general though you sign an offering of points with the broker that includes home resort, the number of points, when they are valid for, if you'll borrow etc, if you'll only consider home resort bookings or if 7 month bookings are ok. Then they forward requests out and you need to respond back. Once the reservation is secured you receive whatever percentage they are going to pay you quickly and then the remainder will be paid on the date the renter checks into the villa.

The pandemic showed some cracks in the business ethics IMO. I didn't particularly recommend a broker anyway and don't now but it takes some work to rent out and from the renters stand point it takes a little more faith or investigation.

 

[DVCSunDevil]

I think the David's, and probably any other broker, has a primer on renting that will be applicable to how each does it. In general though you sign an offering of points with the broker that includes home resort, the number of points, when they are valid for, if you'll borrow etc, if you'll only consider home resort bookings or if 7 month bookings are ok. Then they forward requests out and you need to respond back. Once the reservation is secured you receive whatever percentage they are going to pay you quickly and then the remainder will be paid on the date the renter checks into the villa.

The pandemic showed some cracks in the business ethics IMO. I didn't particularly recommend a broker anyway and don't now but it takes some work to rent out and from the renters stand point it takes a little more faith or investigation.

OK, thanks for the info. I was curious because I was reading a lot of comments about how David's was pulling some shady stuff lately. I also read that David's is stuck with a lot of points and is trying to get rid of those first before points that were recently contracted with them. I wasn't sure how David's could even be stuck with points. Once they buy the points from the DVC owner (the 70% they give us up front), don't they get 70% from the renter? What happens if a renter cancels? Do they give the points back to the owner? This is the stuff I am trying to figure out.

I don't even have plans to rent points. I am just curios so I understand the process if I need to rent points down the road.

 

[Sandisw]

OK, thanks for the info. I was curious because I was reading a lot of comments about how David's was pulling some shady stuff lately. I also read that David's is stuck with a lot of points and is trying to get rid of those first before points that were recently contracted with them. I wasn't sure how David's could even be stuck with points. Once they buy the points from the DVC owner (the 70% they give us up front), don't they get 70% from the renter? What happens if a renter cancels? Do they give the points back to the owner? This is the stuff I am trying to figure out.

I don't even have plans to rent points. I am just curios so I understand the process if I need to rent points down the road.

When the resorts closed, and renters trips canceled, David’s asked owners to either return the 70% already paid, or allow him to rent the same points..
which may have been returned to the owner by DVC...again to a new renter.

For any renter who offered to keep the cash, David’s now has all those points to rent again because he has paid the owner 70% of what he owes them. This is not normally what would happen, but it did with closure.

If I ever rent again, it won’t be through him and may not even use a broker. I realized that privately, a lot more give and take and terms because as an owner, I get to decide.

 

[crisi]

So the deal is that rentals through David were billed as non-refundable. If the renter cancels, its non-refundable - for any reason. If the owner cancels, you lose your reservation but get your money back. As an owner, going through Davids, if you cancel, it isn't my problem. I am not required to switch names on the reservation if David can sublet - or at least I wasn't. Over the years this led to a few issues - say a renter who couldn't travel due to health issues. But that's what travel insurance is for. (Brokers may operate in different fashions).

The problem came in when DISNEY cancelled. That really wasn't covered clearly. There really wasn't a way for the owners to get what they contracted for (a non-refundable rental where they had very little responsibility once the reservation was made) and the renter to get compensated. Since the owners contract with David was "you get paid whether the renter takes the trip or not" - David was stuck holding the bag on a whole lot of uncertainty, with some owners willing to cancel and rebook, and some owners saying "sorry, by the terms of the contact, pay up." Adding complexity were cancelled reservations using points that were nearing their expiration, or using banked or borrowed points and Disney not having clear communications and policies out quickly on what was going to happen with points.

 

[DVCSunDevil]

When the resorts closed, and renters trips canceled, David’s asked owners to either return the 70% already paid, or allow him to rent the same points..
which may have been returned to the owner by DVC...again to a new renter.

For any renter who offered to keep the cash, David’s now has all those points to rent again because he has paid the owner 70% of what he owes them. This is not normally what would happen, but it did with closure.

If I ever rent again, it won’t be through him and may not even use a broker. I realized that privately, a lot more give and take and terms because as an owner, I get to decide.

Aha. That makes more sense. I agree with your thoughts of not wanting to go through a broker. If I ever rent it will probably be a private transaction. In any industry, brokers typically offer value because they already have access to a pool of buyers (or in this case, renters). But from what I have been able to gather through comments on this site, points are not too difficult to rent by posting them on the rental forum.

Thank you for the info!

 

[DVCSunDevil]

So the deal is that rentals through David were billed as non-refundable. If the renter cancels, its non-refundable - for any reason. If the owner cancels, you lose your reservation but get your money back. As an owner, going through Davids, if you cancel, it isn't my problem. I am not required to switch names on the reservation if David can sublet - or at least I wasn't. Over the years this led to a few issues - say a renter who couldn't travel due to health issues. But that's what travel insurance is for. (Brokers may operate in different fashions).

The problem came in when DISNEY cancelled. That really wasn't covered clearly. There really wasn't a way for the owners to get what they contracted for (a non-refundable rental where they had very little responsibility once the reservation was made) and the renter to get compensated. Since the owners contract with David was "you get paid whether the renter takes the trip or not" - David was stuck holding the bag on a whole lot of uncertainty, with some owners willing to cancel and rebook, and some owners saying "sorry, by the terms of the contact, pay up." Adding complexity were cancelled reservations using points that were nearing their expiration, or using banked or borrowed points and Disney not having clear communications and policies out quickly on what was going to happen with points.

Very interesting. The layers just keep getting peeled back. This is great. This is exactly the kind of stuff I wanted to learn. The comments I have been reading are starting to make more sense.

 

[LAX]

Please do thorough research on the brokers if you wish to use one, especially the contract you have with them. I personally now feel the brokers don't offer anything more than a match-making service, which will save you some work screening for potential renters. However, you really don't get anything more than that. I was previously under the impression (which has since been proven wrong) that I get a layer of protection using brokers. I am glad I didn't end up learning the hard way the few times I used one. I have vowed to never use one again. Obviously, you make whatever decision that works best for you. Good luck.

LAX

 

[DVCSunDevil]

Please do thorough research on the brokers if you wish to use one, especially the contract you have with them. I personally now feel the brokers don't offer anything more than a match-making service, which will save you some work screening for potential renters. However, you really don't get anything more than that. I was previously under the impression (which has since been proven wrong) that I get a layer of protection using brokers. I am glad I didn't end up learning the hard way the few times I used one. I have vowed to never use one again. Obviously, you make whatever decision that works best for you. Good luck.

LAX

Thank you, LAX. That’s good info. The level of protection that brokers provide was one of the questions I had. It sounds like they don’t really provide any. It sounds like all they really do is take care of some of the minutia. Like you, I’d prefer to just do it myself.

 

[crisi]

You do get a layer of protection with brokers - but its a small one. With DVC, the owner is in control of the reservation at all times. So lets say Bob rents points through Greg. Greg gets his 70% of the money when he makes the reservation. Six weeks later the reservation Greg cancels the reservation - a broker will refund all your money. It very rarely happens that someone gets scammed with private points, but it does happen. The bigger benefit is the matchmaking service. If what you are looking for is a a completely safe transaction, book direct through Disney, who does refund if you get caught by hurricane or pandemic. The risk is a big reason why DVC rentals are cheap.

 

[DVCSunDevil]

You do get a layer of protection with brokers - but its a small one. With DVC, the owner is in control of the reservation at all times. So lets say Bob rents points through Greg. Greg gets his 70% of the money when he makes the reservation. Six weeks later the reservation Greg cancels the reservation - a broker will refund all your money. It very rarely happens that someone gets scammed with private points, but it does happen. The bigger benefit is the matchmaking service. If what you are looking for is a a completely safe transaction, book direct through Disney, who does refund if you get caught by hurricane or pandemic. The risk is a big reason why DVC rentals are cheap.

Ok, good to know. So there is some small level of protection for the renter, it seems.

 

[crisi]

There is. And there is the matchmaking service. Although renting DVC points is not - under non-pandemic circumstances - necessarily a slam dunk no matter if you go through a broker or through a private individual. Popular resorts book quickly. If you want a popular resort at a popular time, you need to find and owner of that resort who wants to rent points that are good for that time. Pre-pandemic, there were more people who wanted to rent points at - say - Beach Club - then there were Beach Club owners that weren't using their own points. So, as a renter you face two hurdles - finding an owner with the points you want, and then the availability hurdle of what you want being available.

 

[GoingSince1990]

I would recommend the DVC Rental Store over David’s. They pay $0.50 more per point and pay 75% upfront as opposed to David’s 70%. They also handled the Covid situation in a much more professional manner, and I like how they list the available rental opportunities on their website and even allow point owners to sign up for email alerts.

 

[DVCSunDevil]

I would recommend the DVC Rental Store over David’s. They pay $0.50 more per point and pay 75% upfront as opposed to David’s 70%. They also handled the Covid situation in a much more professional manner, and I like how they list the available rental opportunities on their website and even allow point owners to sign up for email alerts.

Good to know. Thank you! Although, if I ever decide to rent points, I think I will try doing a direct owner to renter transaction. It prefer not working through "middle men" when possible.