Ham radio operators: Don't take your radios to Disneyland...

[prestoncaldwell]

This morning I was turned away at the entrance to the Disneyland Resort and told I could not bring my amateur band radio into the parks. I had to trek all the way back to my car and leave it there. I was initially told it was because I could listen in on their park radios, but when my wife and I went to Guest Services to complain, we were shown a page right off their website saying the radio fell into the following, and this is a direct quote off their website: "Items that may be disruptive (e.g. laser pointers, slingshots, stink bombs, air horns)" When I asked them how it could be disruptive, I was told that it could be used to interfere with their in-park communications. I tried to explain that the radio wouldn't even transmit on their frequencies, they still said my radio was prohibited.

Now, I realize Disneyland and California Adventure are private property and it's their prerogative to prohibit whatever items they wish, but they're prohibiting ham radios for all the wrong reasons. Even if they were using analog business radios in the Land Mobile Service, there is no way my little ham radio could interfere with them. However, my research shows, according to Radio Reference, they use a Nextel PTT cell phone system with a 900mHz trunking system as a back-up. Their communications are way separated from the amateur bands.

To add to the annoyance, they are perfectly OK with FRS (Family radio Service) radios you can buy at Radio Shack. AND... There is an active amateur radio repeater located WITHIN the confines of the Disneyland park. Kinda hypocritical, in my opinion...

Thanks to my Disney addicted wife, I was on the verge of Disney burnout and we had already agreed that we weren't renewing my annual pass next year, but this is the final straw. It will be a long, long time before I go back there.

Is this a 2M?

DLR security is just trying to keep things safe in unstable times. You cannot expect them to be as expert on radio frequencies as you are, and I've seen some 2M handhelds that could be intimidating to the uninitiated.

 

[ImDMous]

I was reading this and thinking to myself "there was someone else that was complaining about this same thing a few years ago" and then I saw the date.

 

[GrumpyGoat]

Well, two and a half years have elapsed since I first started this thread and the situation is different now.

First off, I found a solution for my Disney burnout. Being a Navy retiree, I can purchase a three-day park hopper ticket that doesn't have to be used on three consecutive days. It's valid for most of the year and good for three visits. And visiting WDW and going on a number of Disney cruises has given me a better perspective on Disney.

Second, I have taken my radio to Disneyland several times in the the last couple of years and it's been allowed in. apparently, I encounter cast members that weren't aware of the "regulations" that one time. I'm also finding I don't have to have the thing with me 24/7. We're headed to WDW and a short cruise later this month and I probably won't take it with me at all.

 

[Laundress]

Thank you for the update.

 

[piper9285]

In 2014 I contacted Disneyland about this very issue. After spending some time, and writing or talking to a number of people, about this, a person, who has the technical knowledge, finally realized that my handheld was no threat to the Disneyland repeater systems. Because of that, I was able to carry my handheld into the parks for three years. I even have pictures of me standing next to security with my handheld secured to the strap on my backpack. And then one day, all of a sudden, it was forbidden. WHAT? What's up with that? Like the OP, I explained that it was no different than bringing an FRS radio into the park, but they thought they knew better, and out came one BS excuse after another. The one that made me raise an eyebrow was when they were afraid I would talk to someone outside the park. HUH? Oh you mean like when someone talks on their cellphone? I was told that it might interfere with their communications, I was told I could talk to someone outside the park, I was told I might be mistaken for security, I was told it's professional equipment, and I was given a couple of other bogus excuses that I can't remember. And while that was frustrating, the one thing that really pissed me off was when I was told I was lying, when I told them that I was assured three years ago that my handheld wouldn't be an issue.

For those of you that think it isn't necessary to bring ham radio into the park, consider this. My handheld radio, used in conjunction with other ham operators IN THE PARKS, is as useful as someone bringing FRS radios into the parks. In fact we can communicate much easier, and we don't have to deal with the kids that are playing with their toy FRS radios. Let me also add that the battery life on a handheld is far better than a cell phone which is constantly communicating with something, which is why batteries die faster than with a handheld that is on but not communicating unless someone is pushing the PTT switch so that they can talk. So while YOU think that ham radio has no place in the parks, you're speaking out of ignorance.

One last thing, I have a scanner that IS capable of receiving transmissions on their systems. And while it will only receive their radio traffic, I can hear some of what they are saying, even though their system is mostly encrypted. Let me also add that their system is crap, so if there's a breakdown in communications, it will be because they have a crappy system, and it won't be because anyone interfered with their repeaters.

 

[grnflash]

They should just make a clear policy banning all these devices. People can participate in their hobbies elsewhere and Disney security can spend their time and training efforts in more productive ways than arguing with people about their hobbies.

 

[whoever]

What do you expect from minimum wage? Critical thinking abilities?

 

[BriannaRuth]

I didn't take the time to read this whole thread, but I just wanted to comment since it's come up at my house recently. We're having terrible problems with our wireless internet all of the sudden getting very squirrely. Several techs have mentioned the possibility of a neighbor with a ham radio as being the source of intermittent interference. With Disney's new wireless in the parks, just thought I'd mention it.

I personally know nothing about them, but for what it's worth they may start banning them again if they hadn't previously if this is true.

 

[piper9285]

I didn't take the time to read this whole thread, but I just wanted to comment since it's come up at my house recently. We're having terrible problems with our wireless internet all of the sudden getting very squirrely. Several techs have mentioned the possibility of a neighbor with a ham radio as being the source of intermittent interference. With Disney's new wireless in the parks, just thought I'd mention it.

I personally know nothing about them, but for what it's worth they may start banning them again if they hadn't previously if this is true.

Well, here's the deal, IF a ham radio operators equipment was interfering in anyway with their neighbors TV, internet, or stereo equipment, they would be dealing with the issue. Because IF they were interfering, they could run afoul of the FCC, and get fined or lose their license. Ham radio operators pride ourselves on having clean equipment that doesn't cause interference, and you can bet that if their equipment was causing you issues, it would also be causing them issues as well. That is intolerable to a ham, and the problem would be fixed immediately.

So let me offer you a more likely explanation and say it's probably some individual with a CB, operating illegally, and using an illegal amplifier to operate.

But getting back on topic, an amateur radio handheld only uses about 5 watts, so it really doesn't have the power to interfere on frequencies it's not operating on, and that includes frequencies that are a harmonic of the frequency that the amateur radio operator is actually using at the moment.

 

[StormyCA]

I'm a ham, too (No Code Tech). Since our handhelds are clunkier and heavier than a cell phone I don't think I'd ever consider bringing them to DL. And with the little phone-rechargers around, my phone AND the portable charger are still smaller and lighter than my ham and last just as long. Hams also aren't as 'family friendly' as FRS since you have to be licensed to use one. It's not like you can just hand a ham radio over to your kids or spouse to keep in touch, like you can with walkie-talkies, since regulations require a license & that you ID yourself by callsign.

Sure, it would be 'fun' to monitor DL's frequency and hear the goings on and it's always nice to talk to other hams, but if DL doesn't want ham radios there, that is their right.

What do you expect from minimum wage? Critical thinking abilities?

Whoever, this comment was elitist, unkind, and uncalled for. I would have expected better from you. ALL work, no matter what one is paid, is worth respect and all workers deserve to be treated with dignity.

 

[piper9285]

I'm a ham, too (No Code Tech). Since our handhelds are clunkier and heavier than a cell phone I don't think I'd ever consider bringing them to DL. And with the little phone-rechargers around, my phone AND the portable charger are still smaller and lighter than my ham and last just as long. Hams also aren't as 'family friendly' as FRS since you have to be licensed to use one. It's not like you can just hand a ham radio over to your kids or spouse to keep in touch, like you can with walkie-talkies, since regulations require a license & that you ID yourself by callsign.

Sure, it would be 'fun' to monitor DL's frequency and hear the goings on and it's always nice to talk to other hams, but if DL doesn't want ham radios there, that is their right.





Whoever, this comment was elitist, unkind, and uncalled for. I would have expected better from you. ALL work, no matter what one is paid, is worth respect and all workers deserve to be treated with dignity.

Actually, the handheld I use is no larger than a typical FRS handheld, but the huge difference between the two is ham radio operators don't have to contend with the chaos on FRS radios, and they can actually communicate at opposite ends of the parks. FRS radios not so much.

While I agree with you that Disney can do whatever they want, that is the only argument for this, there is no technical argument against ham radio handhelds in the parks. Let me also add that yes, there are portable chargers, and Disney sells them for what...35 BUCKS? Really? I have a charger that I use for my cell phone, but that's for emergencies. My handheld can go all day without recharging, so that argument really makes no sense to me.

 

[whoever]

Whoever, this comment was elitist, unkind, and uncalled for. I would have expected better from you. ALL work, no matter what one is paid, is worth respect and all workers deserve to be treated with dignity.

How was I disrespectful? Entry-level individuals simply aren't going to apply critical thinking to make the proper decision. They will point to a blanket "policy" and just say prohibited vs. applying any vetting of the matter. I've watched it a million times and had to deal with it myself. It's really sad.

 

[piper9285]

How was I disrespectful? Entry-level individuals simply aren't going to apply critical thinking to make the proper decision. They will point to a blanket "policy" and just say prohibited vs. applying any vetting of the matter. I've watched it a million times and had to deal with it myself. It's really sad.

Security cast members aren't allowed the autonomy to think for themselves, and then there are those who are lazy and will just go with "no" instead of contacting someone who can render a more intelligent decision. Then there is the flawed combination of retired cops being managed by managers under 30 who only know Disney, and have no other real life experience, nor do they have real security experience outside Disney. It is a comedy of errors.

 

[grnflash]

How was I disrespectful? Entry-level individuals simply aren't going to apply critical thinking to make the proper decision. They will point to a blanket "policy" and just say prohibited vs. applying any vetting of the matter. I've watched it a million times and had to deal with it myself. It's really sad.

Your original comment was disrespectful. It didn't include any reasoning - and I'm positive you can see yourself how it reads as though minimum wage employees are basically stupid.

 

[BriannaRuth]

Well, here's the deal, IF a ham radio operators equipment was interfering in anyway with their neighbors TV, internet, or stereo equipment, they would be dealing with the issue. Because IF they were interfering, they could run afoul of the FCC, and get fined or lose their license. Ham radio operators pride ourselves on having clean equipment that doesn't cause interference, and you can bet that if their equipment was causing you issues, it would also be causing them issues as well. That is intolerable to a ham, and the problem would be fixed immediately.

So let me offer you a more likely explanation and say it's probably some individual with a CB, operating illegally, and using an illegal amplifier to operate.

But getting back on topic, an amateur radio handheld only uses about 5 watts, so it really doesn't have the power to interfere on frequencies it's not operating on, and that includes frequencies that are a harmonic of the frequency that the amateur radio operator is actually using at the moment.

Thanks for the info -- I'll mention that to our xfinity guy next time he comes back out. Which is often.

I have very fond memories of my great-uncle using his ham radio in Oklahoma back in the 60s. Of course way before the internet, and I could hear him having conversations with people from all over the world. Actual conversations of course, not typing. I also remember how he was able to help during a couple of natural disasters. Don't hear much about ham radios that much anymore, so I'm glad to see this thread.

 

[whoever]

Your original comment was disrespectful. It didn't include any reasoning - and I'm positive you can see yourself how it reads as though minimum wage employees are basically stupid.

Critical thinking skills are developed over time which means experience. You don't get experienced people working entry-level jobs. Sorry if that's offensive, but it's simply the facts.

 

[StormyCA]

How was I disrespectful? Entry-level individuals simply aren't going to apply critical thinking to make the proper decision. They will point to a blanket "policy" and just say prohibited vs. applying any vetting of the matter. I've watched it a million times and had to deal with it myself. It's really sad.

Not all minimum wage workers or entry level workers are unable to apply critical thinking, but most of them are constrained by company policy and/or lack of the freedom or experience to do so. We all have to start somewhere and many 'high flyers' first got their starts in low paid jobs. And many minimum wage workers have plenty of job experience but have chosen to work where they do because of circumstances beyond their control or because they choose to and generally like the work. Minimum wage does not always equal no experience or no options. And I've known plenty of highly paid people who are more stuck in 'corporate think' than lots of people just starting their careers. What's 'sad' is seeing people berate or criticize these lower paid employees for things beyond their control.

Shall I rephrase your statement for you? You said: What do you expect from minimum wage? Critical thinking abilities? How about this: "Most minimum wage workers don't have a lot of autonomy in their jobs. Many of them are just starting out and don't have the job knowledge yet to think 'outside the box'. Others would like to but they don't have the ability to take action because their job description (or their management) doesn't allow them to".

In the past I've seen you defend CMs and the great jobs they do in difficult situations trying to help guests (including you) have the best possible time at 'our Happiest Place'. I've seen your absolute enjoyment and love for all things Disney. I think that's why I felt so disappointed at your remark and your attitude towards people in low paying jobs. But maybe you're just having a bad day.

I don't want to derail. We've both had our 'say'. So I guess we'll have to 'agree to disagree'.

 

[StormyCA]

Actually, the handheld I use is no larger than a typical FRS handheld, but the huge difference between the two is ham radio operators don't have to contend with the chaos on FRS radios, and they can actually communicate at opposite ends of the parks. FRS radios not so much.

While I agree with you that Disney can do whatever they want, that is the only argument for this, there is no technical argument against ham radio handhelds in the parks. Let me also add that yes, there are portable chargers, and Disney sells them for what...35 BUCKS? Really? I have a charger that I use for my cell phone, but that's for emergencies. My handheld can go all day without recharging, so that argument really makes no sense to me.

But the thing is that Disney doesn't actually have to have any 'technical' reason. 'Rules is rules'. I'd say that if the ham community wants to change that, then they need to get together and petition Disney and provide that technical evidence that having a ham wouldn't interfere with anything or give away in-park employee communication.


I'll admit, our handheld Yaesus are 'a few' years old, so we probably don't have the latest in lightweight new technology. The batteries are pretty big and they are heavy! We mostly use them for car to car communications or when we're up camping or my DH is flying his hang glider.

To tell you the truth, I rarely run out of battery on my iPhone during a typical 16 hr day at DL. I usually walk out of the Parks at the end of the night with around 20% left on my battery. I'm not one of those who are constantly texting, chatting, posting FB, etc. My usage may go up once the new Maxpass system goes 'live', though.

My portable charger is the size of two lipsticks stacked end to end and didn't cost anywhere near $35.00. IIRC it was about $20 and I can get two charges from it. You can buy one for as little as $10.00 I'd never buy one of the ones marketed at Disney.

 

[piper9285]

But the thing is that Disney doesn't actually have to have any 'technical' reason. 'Rules is rules'. I'd say that if the ham community wants to change that, then they need to get together and petition Disney and provide that technical evidence that having a ham wouldn't interfere with anything or give away in-park employee communication.


I'll admit, our handheld Yaesus are 'a few' years old, so we probably don't have the latest in lightweight new technology. The batteries are pretty big and they are heavy! We mostly use them for car to car communications or when we're up camping or my DH is flying his hang glider.

To tell you the truth, I rarely run out of battery on my iPhone during a typical 16 hr day at DL. I usually walk out of the Parks at the end of the night with around 20% left on my battery. I'm not one of those who are constantly texting, chatting, posting FB, etc. My usage may go up once the new Maxpass system goes 'live', though.

My portable charger is the size of two lipsticks stacked end to end and didn't cost anywhere near $35.00. IIRC it was about $20 and I can get two charges from it. You can buy one for as little as $10.00 I'd never buy one of the ones marketed at Disney.

The point I was making is that technology is not an argument for not allowing ham radio handhelds in the parks. I get they can do what they want.

 

[StormyCA]

The point I was making is that technology is not an argument for not allowing ham radio handhelds in the parks. I get they can do what they want.

Then I guess I misunderstood your post and in actuality, we agree with each other. Disney doesn't really need a reason to ban something.