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Old 10-15-2013, 05:34 PM   #661
livndisney
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wishes Count View Post
I'm just curious. What do you feel is being denied Or what is happening that you feel is contradictory to Disney's official information?

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Last week we were told 10 minutes were deducted from the wait time when issuing a return time.
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Old 10-15-2013, 05:45 PM   #662
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Originally Posted by ratlenhum View Post
We got ours no problem at HS on 10/9. We were actually the first DAS issued at the outside GS. Barely any questions asked. They asked what my son needed. I said I wasn't sure how to explain without trying the DAS first and perhaps coming back later if just getting return times didn't help. They took my sons picture and we were done in less than 10 minutes
Our experience was very similar in MK on 10/9. The CM didn't second guess me when I told him that our DD couldn't wait in a long line. I told him that she would "act out" but didn't go into a list of all her behaviors -- which he didn't ask me to.

However, it is obvious that DD is severely delayed developmentally -- maybe that was why he didn't challenge what I was saying. From what has been posted here I'm glad we didn't get our card at Epcot.

We did use it at Epcot on 10/10 and had no problems. We used it for Soarin and Test Track and were given return times of the StandBy time minus 10 minutes. The only time we didn't get StandBy minus ten minutes was at Space Mountain where they let us right on when the StandBy time was 20 min.
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Old 10-15-2013, 05:51 PM   #663
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The times put on dd's DAS seemed random to me. Granted, we got it on Thursday and came home on Saturday and only used it 5 times. Twice it was 10 minutes less, once it was 15 minutes less, once it was the same as the standby time and the other time it was longer than the standby time. That was at the Little Mermaid ride at MK. As we approached the line, the standby time said 40 minutes, when I got to the podium the CM asked another person what the wait time was and he said 50 minutes, she wrote a time 45 minutes later, then I walked back past the sign and it said the standby was 30 minutes, I went back to the podium but she would not change it. I should have had her cross it off and write a new time but I didn't think about it at that time. It didn't matter though because we did something else and then came back.

We used the FP+ and regular FP most of the time. The first 2 days my KTTW cards would not work in the FP machines but I tried again on the 3rd day and they worked fine after that.
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Old 10-15-2013, 05:52 PM   #664
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Originally Posted by cmwade77 View Post
I am curious how you handle expressing your needs when not at the parks?

Another alternative to verbally explaining is to write down your needs and simply explain when you hand them the note that you are not good at verbally explaining, so you wrote it down for them, that way they don't think it's a doctor's note that they won't look at.

Now, by all means if you can work around needing the assistance, go for it, but my point is that if you need the assistance, there are ways to ask for it without having to be able to express yourself verbally.

Based on my experience at DCA on Friday, I think I am going to write out things that I have to explain at each attraction in a brief manner, so that a CM can see what my needs are at a glance. It does get tiring to say that you need to avoid stairs, etc. at each and every attraction that something might apply to, but there is a way that I can handle it to make it easier on me. Disney used to do this for me under the GAC; however, they were limited by the stamps they had. For example, I can't handle turnstiles in many cases and there was no stamp for that, but I am able to explain this on my own card. As a result, this may turn out to work better for many people.
I pretty much don't have to explain my kiddos needs anywhere else but the doctor's office and school.

Be prepared for an information dump ahead lol. I am an adult that very recently was diagnosed with Asperger's. It came about because my son was recently diagnosed as well. I am really not comfortable with the idea of aving to go somewhere to someone I don't know and explain my kids needs. It feels really "off" to me. I don't really know of a better way to describe it. I would much rather just deal with everything than go through that. Now, we won't be able to completely avoid explaining what my daughter needs. Last time we had an extra adult with us and someone was able to hold her up on those moving sidewalks. This time it will just me and my hubby with all four kiddos. I can have hubby advocate for my daughters needs at those rides. When it comes to my son, a lot of his needs are similar to mind. I can't handle the crowds. I HATE people touching me. I get very overwhelmed very quickly at Disney and need some "timeouts" to clear my head. I love the place, don't get me wrong, but it is sensory overload! I guess since I understand what my son is going through, it is easy for me to make adjustments and accomdations myself for him (if that make sense??).
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Old 10-15-2013, 05:59 PM   #665
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Originally Posted by livndisney View Post

Last week we were told 10 minutes were deducted from the wait time when issuing a return time.
That is the policy. It could be that because it is so new attractions cast maybe confused or forget. I would just politely inquire if you got an incorrect return time and you shouldn't have an issue with them correcting it.

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Old 10-15-2013, 06:29 PM   #666
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Originally Posted by mom23guys2 View Post
I am concerned about getting a return time DAS for my friend when we go next month. She has stage 4 cancer and is undergoing chemo. She will be in a wheelchair but can not wait on long lines. It is too exhausting. We don't get to the park until afternoon and only stay for about 3 hours if that so FP really isn't an option. She really only goes on one or two rides in a park, TSM in HS and the Osbourne lights and maybe visiting the new Fantasyland in MK a few days later.
I thought this DAS return time thing would be a blessing. Last year she never even got to TSM because the wait was too long even with a wheelchair.

Is she going to have an issue getting a card?
If she's going through chemo, I'd probably mention poor-immune response (stay away from as many people's germs as possible) and sudden onset nausea (need to get to rest room quickly).
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Old 10-15-2013, 06:32 PM   #667
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Originally Posted by OurBigTrip View Post
I would tell them that you have to administer pain medication at exact times during the day, and that while you don't mind waiting for a ride, you can't be stuck in a line when it comes time to administer the medication. Having a DAS, where you can wait outside of the lines and where you aren't tied to an exact return time will give you the flexibility you need to administer your pain meds on the required schedule.
Thank you!!

Do you know what you know what you need, but sometimes have a hard time explaining it?

That's what I feel like. I appreciate the help!!
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Old 10-15-2013, 06:44 PM   #668
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Originally Posted by Iggipolka View Post
My wife is very worried about the whole DAS issue as she has cognitive and psychiatric issues related to military service, that greatly impact her ability to manage touring the parks w/o assistance. She's pretty much spiraled down into stating "We're going to sell our DVC points and not go to Disney anymore."

My hope is that our upcoming trip to WDW in February will change her mind, but I do think that we won't be traveling during peak times of year anymore. This is unfortunate, since our kids and extended family can only visit when school isn't in session.

I'm really disappointed in the change to the DAS and have written to Disney to express my concerns. I hope that they are paying attention to the feedback they are getting.
I sent you a PM. I hope the information is useful to you.
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Old 10-15-2013, 06:49 PM   #669
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paula Sedley-Burke View Post
Anybody have any experience of CM position towards adults with autism? It's not like you reach 18 and it disappears.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wishes Count View Post
DAS is based on what accommodations you need, not your age, so guests of all ages can be accommodated.

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Thanks Wishes Count.

Age is not the issue. Needs are.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wishes Count View Post
That is the policy. It could be that because it is so new attractions cast maybe confused or forget. I would just politely inquire if you got an incorrect return time and you shouldn't have an issue with them correcting it.

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The new policy just started a week ago, so it's understandable that there would be some discrepancies.
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Originally Posted by TreeSapp View Post
If she's going through chemo, I'd probably mention poor-immune response (stay away from as many people's germs as possible) and sudden onset nausea (need to get to rest room quickly).
Yes.
Think about the needs, not the diagnosis.
What needs does she have that can't be met just by having the wheelchair?
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Old 10-15-2013, 06:53 PM   #670
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nixie View Post
I pretty much don't have to explain my kiddos needs anywhere else but the doctor's office and school.

Be prepared for an information dump ahead lol. I am an adult that very recently was diagnosed with Asperger's. It came about because my son was recently diagnosed as well. I am really not comfortable with the idea of aving to go somewhere to someone I don't know and explain my kids needs. It feels really "off" to me. I don't really know of a better way to describe it. I would much rather just deal with everything than go through that. Now, we won't be able to completely avoid explaining what my daughter needs. Last time we had an extra adult with us and someone was able to hold her up on those moving sidewalks. This time it will just me and my hubby with all four kiddos. I can have hubby advocate for my daughters needs at those rides. When it comes to my son, a lot of his needs are similar to mind. I can't handle the crowds. I HATE people touching me. I get very overwhelmed very quickly at Disney and need some "timeouts" to clear my head. I love the place, don't get me wrong, but it is sensory overload! I guess since I understand what my son is going through, it is easy for me to make adjustments and accomdations myself for him (if that make sense??).
I certainly understand that you can make adjustments. Ultimately you have to do what is right for you. But, I think in your case a DAS would make sense, at least in my opinion, as it would reduce the crowded spaces you are in. If you are not comfortable explaining, perhaps having you husband advocate for you and your son at GR would be better or as I said, handing a note. As I said, you ultimately have to make the right decision for you and your family, just a friendly observation as to what might make the parks more enjoyable and perhaps allow you to stay a little longer and as a result do a little more each day.
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Old 10-15-2013, 07:09 PM   #671
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GAC/DAS and ADA

I am probably going to hit a nerve with a lot of folks but I feel a certain aspect of this conversation is missing namely the law or ADA Title III. As part of my job with the government I have to deal ADA and ABA. I also have a DD that is in a wheelchair, has had her Make-a-Wish trip and her doctors have stated they are surprised she has made it this long so I do have an understanding of what disability means.

During her Wish trip we were given a GAC and didn’t realize anyone other than a Wish child could get one because of the special privileges it provided. In the last six visits to DL, DCA and WDW we only asked once for a GAC after reading about it on the DIS. We found that it provided little difference in the way we enjoyed the park. Lines are lines and you are at the most popular theme park chain in the world.

My personal opinion is that Disney was using the GAC as an easy way to make guests happy who may or may not have a real disability issue. Just sprinkle a little pixie dust on it and it will take care of it's self. When the GAC finally became overwhelmed by the number of requests and abuse they decided to fall in line and use the same accommodation system their competition was already using.

The GAC and now DAS is an accommodation system that in a lot of cases is not required by law. To require “Accommodation” an individual must have a disability. An individual with a disability is a person who --Has a physical or mental impairment that substantially limits one or more major life activities, or has a record of such impairment, or is regarded as having such impairment. The key point here is that it substantially limits one or more major life activities. "Major life activities" include functions such as caring for oneself, performing manual tasks, walking, seeing, hearing, speaking, breathing, learning, and working.

Once those two criteria have been met then you must look at how the existing attraction in this case is preventing the individual “Equal Access”. If the standard access line is not wide enough to accommodate a wheelchair then an alternate method of access must be provided. Visual and hearing impairments must also be made equal as much as possible. If the proposed accommodation fundamentally changes the attraction, violates safety or exceeds equality then it is normally not provided. Not waiting in line is normally not meeting the test as a Major Life Activity.

While I know I have probably upset people let me also say I think what Disney was doing with the GAC was a very good public relations tool to help guests which challenges and disabilities enjoy the parks. I fully understand the desire of parents to want their children to enjoy their time at the parks because it may have been the only place where that could actually happen. As a disabled veteran I know what it is like to have times of difficulty getting around and a little help is really appreciated.

The DAS is a very new attempt to correct an issue that grew untenable. It will take time to get all CMs singing the same song. Some people will not get a DAS and feel they have been deprived a right or privilege. Most will be patient as the issue resolves itself. Regardless of how it all turns out Disney is a place where Dreams have come true and will continue to come true in the future.

As part of this post I have included significant parts of ADA Title III

II. Overview of Requirements

Public accommodations must --

Provide goods and services in an integrated setting, unless separate or different measures are necessary to ensure equal opportunity.

Eliminate unnecessary eligibility standards or rules that deny individuals with disabilities an equal opportunity to enjoy the goods and services of a place of public accommodation.

Make reasonable modifications in policies, practices, and procedures that deny equal access to individuals with disabilities, unless a fundamental alteration would result in the nature of the goods and services provided.

Furnish auxiliary aids when necessary to ensure effective communication, unless an undue burden or fundamental alteration would result.

Remove architectural and structural communication barriers in existing facilities where readily achievable.

Provide readily achievable alternative measures when removal of barriers is not readily achievable.

Provide equivalent transportation services and purchase accessible vehicles in certain circumstances.

Maintain accessible features of facilities and equipment.

Design and construct new facilities and, when undertaking alterations, alter existing facilities in accordance with the Americans with Disabilities Act Accessibility Guidelines issued by the Architectural and Transportation Barriers Compliance Board and incorporated in the final Department of Justice title III regulation.

A public accommodation is not required to provide personal devices such as wheelchairs; individually prescribed devices (e.g., prescription eyeglasses or hearing aids); or services of a personal nature including assistance in eating, toileting, or dressing.

A public accommodation may not discriminate against an individual or entity because of the known disability of a person with whom the individual or entity is known to associate.

Commercial facilities are only subject to the requirement that new construction and alterations conform to the ADA Accessibility Guidelines. The other requirements applicable to public accommodations listed above do not apply to commercial facilities.

Private entities offering certain examinations or courses (i.e., those related to applications, licensing, certification, or credentialing for secondary or postsecondary education, professional, or trade purposes) must offer them in an accessible place and manner or offer alternative accessible arrangements.

III. "Individuals with Disabilities"

The Americans with Disabilities Act provides comprehensive civil rights protections for "individuals with disabilities".

An individual with a disability is a person who --

Has a physical or mental impairment that substantially limits one or more major life activities, or

Has a record of such an impairment, or

Is regarded as having such an impairment.

Examples of physical or mental impairments include, but are not limited to, such contagious and noncontagious diseases and conditions as orthopedic, visual, speech, and hearing impairments; cerebral palsy, epilepsy, muscular dystrophy, multiple sclerosis, cancer, heart disease, diabetes, mental retardation, emotional illness, specific learning disabilities, HIV disease (whether symptomatic or asymptomatic), tuberculosis, drug addiction, and alcoholism. Homosexuality and bisexuality are not physical or mental impairments under the ADA.

"Major life activities" include functions such as caring for oneself, performing manual tasks, walking, seeing, hearing, speaking, breathing, learning, and working.
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Old 10-15-2013, 07:29 PM   #672
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nixie View Post
I pretty much don't have to explain my kiddos needs anywhere else but the doctor's office and school.

Be prepared for an information dump ahead lol. I am an adult that very recently was diagnosed with Asperger's. It came about because my son was recently diagnosed as well. I am really not comfortable with the idea of aving to go somewhere to someone I don't know and explain my kids needs. It feels really "off" to me. I don't really know of a better way to describe it. I would much rather just deal with everything than go through that. Now, we won't be able to completely avoid explaining what my daughter needs. Last time we had an extra adult with us and someone was able to hold her up on those moving sidewalks. This time it will just me and my hubby with all four kiddos. I can have hubby advocate for my daughters needs at those rides. When it comes to my son, a lot of his needs are similar to mind. I can't handle the crowds. I HATE people touching me. I get very overwhelmed very quickly at Disney and need some "timeouts" to clear my head. I love the place, don't get me wrong, but it is sensory overload! I guess since I understand what my son is going through, it is easy for me to make adjustments and accomdations myself for him (if that make sense??).
Also, keep in mind that there is no RULE that people with special needs are required to use DAS.
It's just another tool that is available to meet needs.

A lot of people in the past got a GAC, but seldom used it to access attractions. They used it more for 'insurance' and only used it when they felt they really needed it. Others used it more often.

So, if you feel like you just can't ask for a DAS and would rather just deal with everything, you can do that. If you find it is too difficult or change your mind, you can always go to Guest Relations and discuss your issues and see how a DAS might help you.
There is no rule that says you need to request a DAS as soon as you enter the park.

Even with a DAS, using Fastpass and information from different touring plan websites will help you. The 2 people recommend most for WDW are www.touringplans.com and www.easywdw.com
We don't follow a plan exactly - we use it to know which park is likely to be least busy and which area of the park will be least busy. That is a big help both with attractions and just generally avoiding crowds.

If you haven't looked at Disney's new Guidebook for Guests with Cognitive Disabilities, you might find it very helpful. It includes a lot of helpful information for ANY guests with disabilities, not only the ones it was written for.
You might find the list of quiet places to be very helpful.
This thread has a link to the guidebooks for DL and WDW in post 9
http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=3179398
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Old 10-15-2013, 07:41 PM   #673
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Schepp - you have a point. Technically, Disney could do a lot less than they do now, which includes more than the DAS system. For example, Disney has several shows in WDW and DL that have sign language interpreters present at set times. In DL it is 4 days a week, in WDW it is every day. ASL Interpreters are very expensive to pay, and Disney really does not need to have them there like they do. They would be meeting the law by saying the interpreters are available "upon request" like before. But the interpreters are still there, which is truly awesome for us locals who are either deaf/hard of hearing, use sign as a primary or alternate means of communication, or are learning to sign.

The law really has not caught up to what constitutes a "disability" for a lot of people, for example, on the autism spectrum. Some people are not able to perform those activities of daily living (ADLs) as you listed, and there are some who can perform the ADLs but more complex situations like Disney is difficult or impossible with some form of help.

This is an area of law which is still developing, as more is learned about disorders like autism, and currently it is a very murky area of law indeed. It is easy for both parties to claim they are in the right with regards to the law and who "must" get accommodation and what that "must" be - and only a court and more legislation can decide anything.

And none of what I just said helps in the parks.

So Disney is doing the best they can, trying to provide "equal" access while not endangering anyone. Disney was the last theme park to move to a system like the DAS, and this system will only get easier, in my opinion, as technology increases (with a few bumps along the way of course - nothing is perfect).

I have not tried the DAS in WDW, and I cannot speak to the behavior of CMs or guests. I do know that Disney has absolutely no interest in making the lives of guests with disabilities harder - if nothing else, it reduces their revenue. And I like to think they actually care - hence adding wheelchair or transfer vehicles to as many rides as possible.

I do not doubt that Disney can defend their new system in court (they certainly have enough lawyers). All we can do now is wait, try it, and give feedback. I know I have talked to every manager and lead I see when I encounter a problem.

I have been to Disney park enough, however, to know that they really do want to make magic, and really do want to have the best system they can to provide equal access for guests.
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Old 10-15-2013, 07:56 PM   #674
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Schlep, I also agree with you. WDW has done so much more than required. Thanks for your input.
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Old 10-15-2013, 08:11 PM   #675
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Worried about upcoming trip

Thanks to everyone for writing their concerns. I have used GAC because of severe neck disc and nerve conditions. I have 4 gedenerative discs that out of place and touch nerves in my neck. Walking, standing and sitting for periods of time cause the spasms and pain to be unbearable. I have had surgery to repair 2 discs but still have more to go. A wheel chair is not an optin because sitting is not a relief.
I agree with a previous post that DVC points will have to be sold if DAS is not an option anymore. Taking medicine to eliminate pain that can be avoided is a safer choice.

I have written letters to find out what options I would have. I pray that something makes the trip easier.

If anyone can give some advice please PM me...... Thanks
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