Disney Information Station Logo

Go Back   The DIS Discussion Forums - DISboards.com > Global Neighbours > UK Trip Reports Board
Find Hotel Specials & DIScounts
 
facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS UpdatesDIS email updates
Register Chat FAQ Tickers Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read





Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 06-16-2013, 11:29 AM   #1
dolphingirl47
I will post my goodies once I am back
I have always been too worried to use the pillowcase
 
dolphingirl47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 27,681

But You Have Promised Me A Subtropical Paradise

Day 1

This was a bit of an unusual start to the holiday for us. For most of our holidays, we have stayed at an airport hotel the night before our flight. This had also been the plan for this trip, but for some reason the airport hotels all had silly expensive prices, even with the travel industry rates. As our flight also left later than usual at 11:35, we decided that we would spend the last night before the trip at home and take a taxi to the airport the next day. The drawback to this was that however often I told myself that I was officially on holiday once I got home from work, it did not feel that way. Even a fantastic meal at the local Brazilian Steakhouse washed down with a couple of Caipirinhas did not create a holiday feeling. The advantage however was that I could pack at my leisure when I got home and did not have to try to squeeze it in during those very busy last few days at work.

This should have been my week of 5 early shifts so when the alarm went off at 6:00, it almost felt like a lie in. We got up and got ready, packed the last odds and ends and then we headed out. We were picked up at 7:00 and the drive to the airport was very smooth. When we got there, Monarch was still wrapping up the check in for their flights at the desks that Delta is using, too. So once again we got to watch how they got ready for opening check in. Eventually everything was good to go and we were waved forward. We were first in line for the online check in line. Those of you who have followed my trip reports for a while will remember that the fact that I was traveling on a German passport leaving from the UK and going to the USA always caused some excitement. This inevitably resulted in the Spanish inquisition. I got so fed up with this that early last year I decided to apply for British citizenship, which was approved in October last year and became official in December. Although I have traveled on my British passport once before for a weekend trip to Dubai, this was my first trip to the USA since becoming British. I have to admit that I felt rather smug. One of the members of security introduced himself and asked what our final destination would be and when we would return to the UK. We answered the question and he took our passports to be swiped. He then came back and asked if he could see our itinerary. Fortunately I had decided to print this. Once he had checked the details for our return trip, he handed us our passports back. We then got the usual questions about who packed the cases, had they been unattended at any time and did we have any electrical items. This was fairly routine stuff. What threw me is when he asked how long we had owned them for. This is when I started to get a little nervous. I had bought a new camera for this trip and had this for less than a month. I told him this and he asked where I had bought it from. When I told him Amazon, he was satisfied, thanked us for our patience and wished us a good flight.

We then proceeded to check in. Although there were a few people in the normal check in line, we were the only people in the online check in line. This showed as our check in agent was in no hurry and was quite chatty. As we had got to the airport so early, we had no problem with this. Graham's suitcase was almost exactly at the weight limit and my was 1.8kg over. The irony is that this is exactly the same that my magnets weighed. She reassured me that this was perfectly OK. I had printed our boarding passes out yesterday, but the first thing she did was printing new ones for us. Eventually we were all set and headed through security.

Security was probably the quietest I had ever seen this. The only reason there was any wait at all was that they have changed over completely to self-service gates. In front of the gate there was a scanner for the boarding passes and it advised to touch the bar code against the scanner. The trouble with this was that there was more than one bar code on the boarding pass and inevitably we tried to use the wrong one. Eventually we figured out which one to use and which orientation the scanner was looking for and we were on our way. We were directed straight to a security checkpoint where there was no line. Neither of us set off the metal detector this time round and even though we had joked at home that our hand luggage would get singled out as Graham had his telescope and I had my new camera with a fairly big lens, this did not happen.

Once we had collected all of our stuff, we headed to the departure lounge. I was hoping to get a new neck pillow as I had lost mine on our Dubai trip and Graham had forgotten his. They had a good deal if you bought two neck pillows so we both got a new one. We then went in search of breakfast. We ended up in Frankie and Benny's. Graham had the New England Breakfast, which consisted of fried eggs, bacon, sausages, baked beans, mushroom and hash brown. He washed this down with an orange juice. I was not that hungry and had pancakes with bacon and maple syrup. I had wanted their fruit punch, but this contained almond syrup, which they were out of. So I decided on another mixed fruit juice drink. This contained passion fruit syrup, which they were also out of. I was at a bit of a loss as to what to have. I did not fancy a plain orange juice. Our server offered that she could mix something for me. I agreed and advised that I am allergic to banana, but anything else is good. I have no idea what was in this drink, but it was delicious. When we finished breakfast, there was a huge line waiting to be seated. However, they were in no rush whatsoever to get us the bill and let us pay. Eventually we had settled up and we went to find our gate.

Graham made himself comfortable. I left my hand luggage with him and headed to the duty free shop. They have a MAC Cosmetics concession there. The previous week I had seen a limited edition lip gloss in town that I really liked. So I decided to get this as it is cheaper at the airport. I also ended up with a matching lipstick . When I got back, I sat down near the gate and started my trip report and then read for a bit. Soon it was time to board our flight.


DSC_0001 by dolphingirl47


DSC_0002 by dolphingirl47


DSC_0003 by dolphingirl47

It was nice to have a newer aircraft with on demand entertainment. Once we were at cruising altitude, I started to watch Les Miserables. Unfortunately about 20 minutes in, they made an announcement they had issues with the entertainment system and needed to reboot this. I used the time to work on my trip report and read a bit. Unfortunately I noticed that the USB power was not strong enough to charge my iPad, but at least it slowed down the charge going down. When the entertainment system was up and running again, I made a second attempt at watching Les Miserables. At some point during the film, lunch was served. This consisted of a garden salad with olive oil and balsamic vinegar dressing, a roll, cheese and crackers and a vanilla and chocolate biscuit. For our main course we both had Chicken Mole Poblano with mash and ratatouille. This was very tasty as was the Chardonnay out of a cardboard box we had with it.

Once Les Miserables was finished, I had a quick bathroom break and then I settled down for my second film. I had really wanted to see Jack Reacher when it was in the cinema, but somehow missed it. I love the books and wanted to see how this is translated into a film. One thing that always struck me was the curious casting of the main character. In the books, Reacher is 6'5" tall with a 50-inch chest, and weighing between 220 and 250 pounds. They cast Tom Cruise for this role. Still, it was a good film and I thoroughly enjoyed it.

When the film was over, I flicked through the selections, but there was nothing that really grabbed my attention. I had figured out earlier that when you access the map that shows the progress of the flight, it has a little box at the bottom where it shows whichever film you have selected. So I put Les Miserables on again and then accessed the map so I had some music in the background. I then spent the rest of the flight reading my book.

About 90 minutes before we landed in Atlanta, they served a snack. We got a sun dried tomato and cheese panini, which to my utter delight was yeast free and a vanilla ice cream with chocolate sauce. By the time they cleared everything away, we had already started our descent into Atlanta.

Once we arrived in Atlanta, we had a quick bathroom stop and then headed to passport control. They redid this since last year. Now they have separate passport controls for people whose final destination is Atlanta and those with connecting flights. The line for visitors did not look too long, but they cleared the line for US citizens and residents a lot quicker and moved us across. We were then directed to the line for a desk almost straightaway, but where then moved to the line for another desk and then back again. It looked like we arrived in the middle of break time. This did not do my poor nerves any good. This was my first time entering the USA on my British passport. The wife of one of my colleagues was asked some questions the first time she went to the USA after becoming British regarding why she entered USA with the passport of a different country last time and now was entering with a British passport. So I expected the Spanish inquisition. The strange thing is he did not even acknowledge it. He asked how long we would be staying, where we would be going, what jobs we were doing back home, if we had brought any items that would remain in the USA and how much money we had on us. At one stage he also asked us when we were last in the USA prior to this visit and I was sure that this would then trigger more questions, but he then just stamped our passports and customs form and welcomed us back.

Customs was a huge surprise. This is normally crazy busy. When we came down the escalator to baggage claim, the customs area was completely empty. Our luggage was sitting on the stationary belt so we just had to collect it and then we could go straight through customs. They just took our customs declaration off us and waved us through. Security was also painless. Once we cleared security, I checked the screens with departure information. This was just as well as our departure gate had moved from Domestic Terminal South to Concourse A. We took the Skytrain over to Concourse A. Our plan had been to have dinner at Atlanta, but Graham was not hungry at all and I was not up for a proper dinner either. Graham found somewhere to sit near the gate and I went for a wander. When I came back, I read and worked on my trip report for a while. A little while later, I started to feel a bit hungry. I managed to find some mini corn dogs, some orange soda and a peanut butter Snickers so I was happy. Once I Had finished my Corndogs, I headed back to the gate. I was reading for a bit and soon it was time to board.

Inevitably we ended up in zone 3. I really don't understand how Delta's zones work as irrespective where our seats are, we are in zone 3. Zone 3 boards last. Also inevitably on Delta domestic flights, they never have enough room for carry ons. So sure enough, as they were starting to board zone 3, they made an announcement that the staff on the aircraft had informed them that there was no further room for carry ons and every carry on would be gate checked. I was not happy as I had my brand new camera, my jewellery and some breakable gifts in my carry on. As we approached the gate they were very busy tagging everybody's carry on and I was ready to use my charm on the gate agent, but she just waved us through with our carry ons. I looked at Graham slightly confused and then took off as quickly as I could before they changed their minds. Looking at the carry ons that were piled up just outside the aircraft door, I started to understand how we had managed to get away with this. Both of ours would have comfortably fit together in each and every one of the so called carry ons that were waiting to go into the hold. We ended up having to put our trolley cases and personal items underneath the seat in front of us, but they all fit and actually worked quite nicely as footrests.

Neither Graham and I remember the take off. Actually, I can't even remember taxiing away from the terminal so I must have been out cold as soon as I sat down. The next thing I remember is an announcement that we had started our descent into Los Angeles. I stayed awake then and looked at all the pretty lights. I love big cities at night when I am flying. We landed shortly afterwards. I realised that something was not quite right as soon as I got off the aircraft. On our last two trips to Los Angeles we have flown with Delta and the terminal did not look familiar at all. It soon became apparent why. We had not landed at Terminal 5, which is the usual Delta terminal, but in Terminal 8, which is normally reserved for United. We then had to walk to terminal 6, which is also normally used by United and is quite a hike. Because of the distances involved and the fact that Delta a merely guests at this terminal, it took forever for our luggage to arrive. I was glad that our friends that we were staying with for most of our time in Southern California were still out of town and we were therefore headed to Disney's Grand Californian Hotel and Spa for the first night. I would have been mortified if we had gone straight to them and had arrived so late. When I went to find the Supershuttle pick up area, I realised why we had arrived at a different terminal. Terminal 5 is a big building site at the moment. I did find Supershuttle eventually, checked in and was given a van number. We had to wait about 10 to 15 minutes for the van to arrive. We got the last two seats so we did not end up riding around the airport and we were the first people off so that worked out nicely.

As we arrived so late at the hotel, we could walk up straight to the check in desk. There was some confusion at first as we were already showing as checked in. Apparently we had been automatically checked in earlier in the evening. With this out of the way, we were presented with our Key to the Magic cards and given our room number. We had a room on the ground floor this time round. I had a quick peek through the patio door and was not inspired. When I checked again in the morning, I saw what precisely I was looking at, which was a fence and some bushes. If we had stayed there longer, I would have been disappointed. However, as we just needed a bed to sleep for one night, this did nicely. We quickly freshened up and got ready for bed. Door to door, our trip had taken 26 hours so it was no surprise that we were fast asleep as soon as out heads hit the pillows.
dolphingirl47 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2013, 11:46 AM   #2
Pinkocto
In love with all things Disney. Happily joined DVC 01/11.
 
Pinkocto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: MD
Posts: 7,386

I'm here marking my spot, can't wait to read all about it!

***Went back to read, great intro. Bizarre about the security guy asking how long you owned the luggage. I've never heard that one before. Glad you were able to keep your carry ons on the second leg, I hate to let my camera out of my sight.

That's one long day of traveling!

Can I ask if you've used Disneyland Express? I'm trying to figure out the best/cheapest way to get to the GCH from LAX in September. It sparked my interest when I read you used Supershuttle.
__________________
-Pam

First Trip - YC '89, CSR '98, Pop '07, Music '08, AKL CL 1/11, SSR 12/11, 5N Dream Cruise & AKV 3/12, AKV CL 9/12 , OKW 12/12, 4N Wonder Cruise 1/13, 7N Fantasy Cruise & AKV CL 3/13, AKV 6/13, DL 9/13, VGF 12/13, OKW/AKV 1/14, 5N Wonder Cruise/VBR 3/14, Western Fantasy/BCV 5/14

Last edited by Pinkocto; 06-16-2013 at 12:02 PM.
Pinkocto is offline   Reply With Quote
|
The DIS
Register to remove

Join Date: 1997
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 1,000,000
Old 06-16-2013, 12:13 PM   #3
jedijill
Chiefs fan living in Bronco country
 
jedijill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 5,304

I'm here! Off to a great start. Glad to hear you had a good flight on Delta...my last few international flights on Delta have been sub-par.

Very strange security questions.

Can't wait to hear more!

Jill in CO
__________________
jedijill is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2013, 02:26 PM   #4
carissa1970
DIS Veteran
 
carissa1970's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 847

I'm number 3! Lol. I've noticed people like to be in the first few. I can't wait to read more!!

carissa1970 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2013, 03:51 PM   #5
tiggrbaby
We must work harder to stay under the radar for this oneWe always bring our own inflatable noodle
 
tiggrbaby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 3,792

Happily joining in! Glad it was a smooth start.
__________________


DISboards 2104 Book Challenge: 34/40
DISboards 2013 Book Challenge: 36/35
tiggrbaby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2013, 04:08 PM   #6
dolphingirl47
I will post my goodies once I am back
I have always been too worried to use the pillowcase
 
dolphingirl47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 27,681

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkocto View Post
I'm here marking my spot, can't wait to read all about it!

***Went back to read, great intro. Bizarre about the security guy asking how long you owned the luggage. I've never heard that one before. Glad you were able to keep your carry ons on the second leg, I hate to let my camera out of my sight.

That's one long day of traveling!

Can I ask if you've used Disneyland Express? I'm trying to figure out the best/cheapest way to get to the GCH from LAX in September. It sparked my interest when I read you used Supershuttle.
It was not the luggage, but specifically the electronic devices he was concerned about. This made more sense when I returned to work. I thought he was worried about drug smuggling, but when I returned to work I had a bunch of emails that airport security somewhere had found cellphones that had been converted to guns.

It was definitely a long day.

We have always used Supershuttle and I would recommend them. The reason why we decided against Disneyland Express is that I had heard that you stop at the Disneyland Hotel on the way to pay. Supershuttle I can pay for in advance online.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jedijill View Post
I'm here! Off to a great start. Glad to hear you had a good flight on Delta...my last few international flights on Delta have been sub-par.

Very strange security questions.

Can't wait to hear more!

Jill in CO
We love Delta. I work for an airline myself so I have pretty high expectations towards service on an airline and Delta have always exceeded them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by carissa1970 View Post
I'm number 3! Lol. I've noticed people like to be in the first few. I can't wait to read more!!

Welcome. I tend to post updates twice a week. Usually on a Thursday and a Sunday.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tiggrbaby View Post
Happily joining in! Glad it was a smooth start.
Welcome.

Corinna
dolphingirl47 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2013, 04:14 PM   #7
disgeek009
Earning My Ears
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 36

I'm so happy you went on another vacation, since I love your trip reports! Can't wait to hear more!
disgeek009 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2013, 04:16 PM   #8
dolphingirl47
I will post my goodies once I am back
I have always been too worried to use the pillowcase
 
dolphingirl47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 27,681

Quote:
Originally Posted by disgeek009 View Post
I'm so happy you went on another vacation, since I love your trip reports! Can't wait to hear more!
Welcome. The closing installments will be set right in your fair city. I loved Seattle.

Corinna
dolphingirl47 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2013, 04:47 PM   #9
Pinkocto
In love with all things Disney. Happily joined DVC 01/11.
 
Pinkocto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: MD
Posts: 7,386

Quote:
Originally Posted by dolphingirl47 View Post
It was not the luggage, but specifically the electronic devices he was concerned about. This made more sense when I returned to work. I thought he was worried about drug smuggling, but when I returned to work I had a bunch of emails that airport security somewhere had found cellphones that had been converted to guns.

It was definitely a long day.

We have always used Supershuttle and I would recommend them. The reason why we decided against Disneyland Express is that I had heard that you stop at the Disneyland Hotel on the way to pay. Supershuttle I can pay for in advance online.
That's really scary about the guns! Wow!

Thanks so much for the info, I like the idea about paying in advance much better.
__________________
-Pam

First Trip - YC '89, CSR '98, Pop '07, Music '08, AKL CL 1/11, SSR 12/11, 5N Dream Cruise & AKV 3/12, AKV CL 9/12 , OKW 12/12, 4N Wonder Cruise 1/13, 7N Fantasy Cruise & AKV CL 3/13, AKV 6/13, DL 9/13, VGF 12/13, OKW/AKV 1/14, 5N Wonder Cruise/VBR 3/14, Western Fantasy/BCV 5/14
Pinkocto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2013, 05:49 PM   #10
franandaj

Sharing adventures and good times
My heart is forever given to Fran
 
franandaj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Long Beach, CA, VWL, BCV, SSR & VGC
Posts: 22,775

Running out the door to a show right now, but I'm marking my place so that I can come back and read!

ETA: OK, all caught up! That was odd that he asked how long you had your luggage. I can just imagine my answer... "Well we got the one suitcase on our last trip to WDW. The black one, well it came from Costco, but I have no idea what year we bought it....that green one it was part of a set, honey, do you have any idea when we bought that? The garment bag, I had that before I met you...." I have a feeling the guard would have been sorry he asked on that one! I would still have all the carry on bags to explain!

So what time did you actually get to the VGC? I'm guessing you were in one of the units facing DCA? Or were in you in one of the even numbered units that faced Grizzly Challenge Trail (if you were higher up)?
__________________
Alison ~~~~ Sleepy and Grumpy Visit Tatooine | Our Disney Dream Home|Keep Your Eyes on the Road | I do get to go to WDW this year! | Expo 2013 | ...It's How You Play the Game | We need a little Magic... | TR - Pinch me... | Destination D-75 TR | It'll be a WONDER ... | Cheating on Mickey w/ Harry, PTR | D23 Expo 2011 TR | D23 D40 WDW in Detail | DCA F&W Review | Jan 2010 DR Visits 2015: VGC, VWL, DCL 2014: VGC, CSR, VGF, DCL 2013: VWL, BCV, DCL, AKL, BLT, VGC, 2012: VGC, DCL, 2011: VGC, BLT, OKW 2010: THV, AKV, VGC, 2009: BWV 2008: SSR, 2007: AKL & GF, 2001: AKL, BC & DCL 1997: DXL & WL 1993: GF, DL Too many to count since 1973!



Last edited by franandaj; 06-17-2013 at 02:19 AM.
franandaj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2013, 08:28 PM   #12
rentayenta

There's never enough vacation time
I'm always thinking about it
I can't imagine being in it alone
 
rentayenta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Utah
Posts: 24,146

I'm here too. Going to catch up.
__________________
me DH DD17 DD15 DS13 Lily Guinness

You light 'em, they fight 'em. A DVC/Disneyland Resort PTR
http://disboards.com/showthread.php?...1#post51407145
You bet your aft we had a good time: a Disney Wonder trip report
http://disboards.com/showthread.php?t=3260751




rentayenta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2013, 01:38 PM   #13
jjk

Pete and I wait and watch some lovely baby lizards
I have always booked myself
"Play Up Pompey"
 
jjk's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Reading UK
Posts: 21,506

looking forward to reading more
__________________
Rachel "Play up Pompey, Pompey Play up"
[IMG]


[/IMG]

2000 Disneyland paris 2003 Ramada inn 2004 Quality inn plaza2005 Cumbrian lakes2006 Emerald Island July and December2007 Emerald Island May and July2008 Emerald Island and Contemporary Resort2009 Saratoga Springs 2010 Animal Kingdom lodge2011HRH Animal KingdomLodge 2012Holiday inn Miami ocean front /Animal Kingdom lodge
jjk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2013, 02:03 PM   #14
dolphingirl47
I will post my goodies once I am back
I have always been too worried to use the pillowcase
 
dolphingirl47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 27,681

Quote:
Originally Posted by franandaj View Post
Running out the door to a show right now, but I'm marking my place so that I can come back and read!

ETA: OK, all caught up! That was odd that he asked how long you had your luggage. I can just imagine my answer... "Well we got the one suitcase on our last trip to WDW. The black one, well it came from Costco, but I have no idea what year we bought it....that green one it was part of a set, honey, do you have any idea when we bought that? The garment bag, I had that before I met you...." I have a feeling the guard would have been sorry he asked on that one! I would still have all the carry on bags to explain!

So what time did you actually get to the VGC? I'm guessing you were in one of the units facing DCA? Or were in you in one of the even numbered units that faced Grizzly Challenge Trail (if you were higher up)?
I did not make it very clear. It was not the luggage he was concerned about, but just the electric items contained in it. That aspect was actually not too bad this time round. We both had brought two cameras (one water-proof and one normal per person) plus I had my iPhone and my iPad. Still, the luggage kind of had a home-coming. One suitcase we bought many years ago on International Drive in Orlando. I bought my suitcase at Costa Mesa. My purse came from Disneyland and my backpack from the Disney Magic.

We arrived at GC just before midnight and were in our room by midnight. We were in 1518. This is one of the rooms facing Grizzly River Run. We had the same location on the 4th floor in 2011 before our cruise and I actually quite liked the view there.



Quote:
Originally Posted by jenseib View Post
Joining in ....now I have to go read.
Welcome

Quote:
Originally Posted by rentayenta View Post
I'm here too. Going to catch up.
Welcome

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjk View Post
looking forward to reading more
Welcome

Corinna
dolphingirl47 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2013, 03:53 PM   #15
irongirlof12
Am I the only one who loves Quorn Sausages?
I would love to be at Ghiradelli's ice cream parlour with a massive choc sundae
 
irongirlof12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: UK.
Posts: 5,589

Yay the new passport has a USA stamp
__________________
Andrea xxx
1994:Grosvenor 1996:POFQ 2002: Comfort Inn LBV 2007: CSR 2009:OKW 2011:POFQ&Dream HNY DLP 2012
irongirlof12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS Updates
GET OUR DIS UPDATES DELIVERED BY EMAIL



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:51 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Copyright © 1997-2014, Werner Technologies, LLC. All Rights Reserved.

You Rated this Thread: