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Old 03-25-2013, 12:59 AM   #46
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I went on the wait list for VGC 1/7/13 with an AUG UY and I'm not expecting anything to happen for a long time.
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Old 03-25-2013, 07:06 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by dwight16 View Post
First of all you are clueless that is 46% profit margin on that example case in the parks division of Disney operate around a 18 to 20% gross margin and the company as a whole closer to 13% so making 46% is a no brainer. Second you are comparing 2 different resorts with 2 different price points. There is a reason for a wait list and it's not a perfect profit margin.


I am not cluelss and do not appreciate the snarky comment! I was answering a question from this thread - why is Disney not ROFR'd all contracts if there is a wait list and still a profit to be made. IMO there is a profit margin that disney is looking for and it is not buying contracts at 65.00 PP and selling them for 110.00 because they simply have not been doing that.

I am aware of the profit margins what I was saying is that Disney has NOT been ROFR quite a few contracts that would give them a decent to great profit but they have not taken them! There has been a wait lists for VGC for quite a while now and contracts are passing at 90.00 recently - they can sell them for 165.00 for anyone who wait listed after 3/20 or fill the current wait list with still a good profit, but they have not. I was mentioning BLT because as of recently it was in active sales along with AKV Disney would prefer to concentrate on the higher dollar active sales then the older resorts that just do not give them the higher profits.

So tell me what is the reason for the wait list in your opinion why not ROFR all contracts and make all direct buyers happy and give Disney a profit if its not about money what is it all about??
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Old 03-25-2013, 09:10 AM   #48
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sorry for the attack but i just got 30 more points at VWL i was on the wait list for about a month and i have a sept use year. this is my guess i got my 2012 points and 2013 points. so Disney can not create points so my guess is they only can buy contracts with all of the current use years points intact. so if a VGC is getting though maybe it did not have a full amount of current years points.
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Old 03-25-2013, 10:16 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dwight16
sorry for the attack but i just got 30 more points at VWL i was on the wait list for about a month and i have a sept use year. this is my guess i got my 2012 points and 2013 points. so Disney can not create points so my guess is they only can buy contracts with all of the current use years points intact. so if a VGC is getting though maybe it did not have a full amount of current years points.
No true. I believe a VGC just passed at $95 with all 2011 points banked, 2012 and 2013 points moving forward. This was posted in the past week.
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Old 03-25-2013, 10:28 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by dbs1228 View Post
Disney is not going to buy back a property at 75.00PP and sell for 110.00PP way too low of a profit margin considering they can charge 165.00PP for BLT and make a whole lot more money! I am sure they have profit margins they stick by and it looks like most ROFR'd properties were pretty loaded and under 60.00PP for the most part. By Disney raising direct pricing they now will be able to buy some of those 60 -70 contracts back and make their margins!
I agree. Despite what we may think, DVD has limited funds, costs of doing business and profit targets that we are not aware of. While it may seem like a no brainer to make a "free" $35 per point by ROFRing every contract that comes along, we need to consider sales commissions and marketing costs that need to be attributed to that particular sale, both of which take away from that $35pp profit. Furthermore, if they sell that person a classic resort for $35 pp profit, they are not selling them a currently marketed resort at a much higher price, which I think is the point that was made above. Most likely this customer is only going to buy one contract (for the time being), so DVD needs to maximize the profit out of every sale.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dwight16 View Post
First of all you are clueless that is 46% profit margin on that example case in the parks division of Disney operate around a 18 to 20% gross margin and the company as a whole closer to 13% so making 46% is a no brainer. Second you are comparing 2 different resorts with 2 different price points. There is a reason for a wait list and it's not a perfect profit margin.
With all due respect, you are incorrect. You are calculating profit on cost, which is not a true measure of profit margin for businesses. The true measure of profit uses the profit on return method which is calculated by dividing the profit by the total revenue. In this case that is only a 31% margin. Given that I have seen estimates posted on here that DVD's development and marketing costs associated with a property are between 25-50%, it does not make sense to spend money to make 31% when they can sell that same customer a higher priced direct resort.

Think about it, there should really be no reason for wait lists at all. If you look at the numbers posted by WDRL on his ROFR thread, plenty of contracts for all resorts and use years are passing every month. If DVD wanted to fill that wait list, they easily could. But they would do so at a reduced profit, which probably explains why they don't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dwight16 View Post
sorry for the attack but i just got 30 more points at VWL i was on the wait list for about a month and i have a sept use year. this is my guess i got my 2012 points and 2013 points. so Disney can not create points so my guess is they only can buy contracts with all of the current use years points intact. so if a VGC is getting though maybe it did not have a full amount of current years points.
If you look at the details of the VGC contracts that have passed, many of them did have had full current year's points. I don't think that's the reason.
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Old 03-25-2013, 10:41 AM   #51
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ELMC - you make some excellent points which I agree with ..... So where do you think is Disneys desired profit level is when it comes to buying back property's. They just bought back a BWV at 60 dollars a point loaded so that's roughly 50% off direct so that's appears around where it is which makes sense to me from a business point of view.... I mean why sell a buy back at lest than 50 when there is higher margin to attain from selling a new property.
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Old 03-25-2013, 10:50 AM   #52
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Originally Posted by kenspidey View Post
ELMC - you make some excellent points which I agree with ..... So where do you think is Disneys desired profit level is when it comes to buying back property's. They just bought back a BWV at 60 dollars a point loaded so that's roughly 50% off direct so that's appears around where it is which makes sense to me from a business point of view.... I mean why sell a buy back at lest than 50 when there is higher margin to attain from selling a new property.
Good question, and I really don't have an answer. My guess would be as close to the profit margin they realize on new construction. But it's safe to speculate that 31% gross profit before commissions and marketing costs is not going to cut it.

As for the BWV, I think they have acquired several at that price point, as I recently had one taken that I don't think I advertised. But I think it's more complicated than we know. For example, the BWV contract I had taken was $60 pp plus fees and closing. But it had 3 years worth of points. So if DVD can turn over the 2011 and 2012 points to CRO and get credit for a cash booking for those points, then it reduces their cost of the purchase. Then they only need to wait until AUG when it becomes the 2013 UY to sell the contract at $130 pp with current year's points. So there's a lot more that goes into the calculation than we know about.

One thing I'm not certain of is how the wait list works and if it is truly a "first come, first served" situation. I know that if I were DVD, I would rather sell those points to someone not on the waitlist for $130pp than someone on the wait list for $115. I think I'll start a thread on that.
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Old 03-25-2013, 12:44 PM   #53
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I agree. Despite what we may think, DVD has limited funds, costs of doing business and profit targets that we are not aware of. While it may seem like a no brainer to make a "free" $35 per point by ROFRing every contract that comes along, we need to consider sales commissions and marketing costs that need to be attributed to that particular sale, both of which take away from that $35pp profit. Furthermore, if they sell that person a classic resort for $35 pp profit, they are not selling them a currently marketed resort at a much higher price, which I think is the point that was made above. Most likely this customer is only going to buy one contract (for the time being), so DVD needs to maximize the profit out of every sale.
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I had posted on another thread, wondering why ROFR isn't exercised to get those needed points for direct buyers. I think your comment explains it well.
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Old 03-26-2013, 12:14 AM   #54
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I was put on a vwl waitlist 1 1/2 week ago (small contract), and today I saw my card charged.
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Old 03-26-2013, 12:27 AM   #55
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my points are in my account already.... i didn't even hear from my guide.
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Old 03-26-2013, 07:19 AM   #56
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my points are in my account already.... i didn't even hear from my guide.
What UY & congratulations!
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Old 03-26-2013, 09:51 AM   #57
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yes me too already banked my new 30 points sept use year for me!
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Old 03-29-2013, 04:22 PM   #58
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I was waitlisted for my 25 points OKW August YU and just got called they are available. Told the guide I wanted them and they were in my account a 1/2 hour later. Banked 2012 points. Was on the waitlist about 5 weeks.
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Old 03-30-2013, 05:42 AM   #59
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We went on the waitlist today for 100 BCV points with an October UY. My guide told me that we were the only ones waitlisted for Oct, and that the BCV waitlists, shockingly, were very low (he quoted me 3 for March, 1 for August, and 1 for Feb...but did not say how many points each of these waitlists were requesting). After hearing chatter on here and looking at current lack of available resales for BCV, I was very, very surprised by this information.

Now let's see how long it takes to get these little points so I can bank them in preparation for next year's big vacation
well your guide lied, as I have been waitlisted for BCV with an October use year since February. Funny, our guide also told us we were first on the wait list
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Old 03-30-2013, 08:53 AM   #60
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Yes I have been on the wait list for bwv sept use year for 2 months now. Also the banking deadline is this month for sept use year so it's getting close to lose the current use years points.
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