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Old 11-11-2012, 02:06 PM   #16
Worfiedoodles
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Originally Posted by cewait View Post
Sorry, I disagree....

You are correct that the medal/lanyard does not say finisher. But frankly it is an insult to finishers from the winner through the last struggling runner who is peddling as hard as they can to cross the finish line. You know the runner, the one who suffered through the last 10 miles with a huge blister, dehydrating and just barely willing their body to take that very next step.

Sorry if this offends anyone but I would rather the Race Director reserve medals for actual finishers and for that very last place runner's RIGHT to say I FINISHED! and wear their medal proudly.
You are certainly welcome to your opinion, as I hope you acknowledge I am welcome to mine. And I have been that DLF finisher, so perhaps I offer a different perspective. I would hate to think someone would read what you posted and decide not to even enter a Disney race, because if they didn't finish and yet wanted to wear their medal to celebrate the long journey and hard effort, they felt they were not allowed to do so. If the medal if offered, it can be worn. And proudly.

WISH is supposed to be a community of support and encouragement. It makes me so sad that it has apparently evolved into a group that is reserved for the "real" runners.

Maria
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Old 11-11-2012, 02:17 PM   #17
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This is the first year since I had my kids that I'm running again. Back in 1998 (!!) when I did my only 15k, it was a major race (Gate River Run in Jacksonville, FL) and I finished at just over a 10 minute mile pace which I was super proud of but I did not get a medal. Back then, they only gave medals to the first 1,000 or 5,000 or some # of runners and I didn't make the cut despite finishing in what I considered a very respectable time. So, it's kind of funny to me that anyone would get a medal whether they finish or not.

I thought it was crappy that I didn't get a medal even though I finished a pretty major race, just because it would be a nice reminder of what I consider to be a big accomplishment (all I have is the race bib). So, I'm glad races have switched to giving medals to all finishers. But, I do think that you should have to finish to get a medal.

That being said, having the courage to start is amazing and I would NEVER disparage someone for trying and not finishing (despite my full year of training, I could be that person, due to injury, starting too fast, or just having a bad day). I just don't think they should get a medal. And I think the people who do it (start with no intention of finishing just to get a medal) intentionally are few and far between. Just my opinion, of course!
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Old 11-11-2012, 02:25 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Worfiedoodles View Post
You are certainly welcome to your opinion, as I hope you acknowledge I am welcome to mine. And I have been that DLF finisher, so perhaps I offer a different perspective. I would hate to think someone would read what you posted and decide not to even enter a Disney race, because if they didn't finish and yet wanted to wear their medal to celebrate the long journey and hard effort, they felt they were not allowed to do so. If the medal if offered, it can be worn. And proudly.

WISH is supposed to be a community of support and encouragement. It makes me so sad that it has apparently evolved into a group that is reserved for the "real" runners.

Maria
I think you will see i am very supportive of runners on this site. I am not supportive of the RD on this (or the very few who game the system).

I will continue to support and encourage runners on this and other sites. I think learning to run an endurance event is a LIFE ALTERING process that is scary for most folks the first time they send in the entry but so rewarding once they get across the line. Just because I believe that a finisher's medal should be what it is labelled does not mean that I or others are any less supportive of those who try and fail. Frankly, folks learn and gain more from one failure than any easy success.
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Old 11-11-2012, 02:40 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by cewait View Post
I think you will see i am very supportive of runners on this site. I am not supportive of the RD on this (or the very few who game the system).

I will continue to support and encourage runners on this and other sites. I think learning to run an endurance event is a LIFE ALTERING process that is scary for most folks the first time they send in the entry but so rewarding once they get across the line. Just because I believe that a finisher's medal should be what it is labelled does not mean that I or others are any less supportive of those who try and fail. Frankly, folks learn and gain more from one failure than any easy success.
I have to agree with Coach and I dispute those claims that those swept were more trained than most people out there. If that was the case, they wouldn't have been swept. I had my close encounter this year during the Marathon and the reason I was hurting is because I didn't not train properly. I was in a car accident before my 18 mile run, and stopped training alltogether. I let others convince me that I would be fine if I took it easy when I originally e-mailed runDisney to say I wouldn't be participating. I was hurting, and you know the majority of the people around me that day were not properly trained either. Some had injuries (from under or overtraining), but the majority weren't as prepared as some claim they must be. I would never laugh at anyone that did not finish, I just don't see why they need a medal. Would you not be more inspired to come back the next year to earn it?

Either way, no one has any business entering any race they aren't trained for. It doesn't matter if it is Disney or your local small races. But, just know that the majority of races will never give you a medal for trying.
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Old 11-11-2012, 02:41 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Worfiedoodles View Post
I would hate to think someone would read what you posted and decide not to even enter a Disney race, because if they didn't finish and yet wanted to wear their medal to celebrate the long journey and hard effort, they felt they were not allowed to do so. If the medal if offered, it can be worn. And proudly.

WISH is supposed to be a community of support and encouragement. It makes me so sad that it has apparently evolved into a group that is reserved for the "real" runners.

Maria
Whoa! First, if you think Coach is anything but supportive of everyone on WISH, then you have not been around lately. And you are also insulting to the rest of us who support all comers to this site, regardless of whether they walk,wog, or run.

And why would anyone who can read look at a race site that says "finishers medals" and expect to be given something if they didn't finish. I'm all for celebrating accomplishments--I grabbed an "I did it" button at the MK after my races, and I cheer like hell for all racers on course--but just don't expect to be given the reward for finishers just because you started the race.

And if a person doesn't want to enter, because s/he can't bear not to get a medal regardless of his/her performance, then maybe s/he should find an event where everyone gets a medal, so they'll feel okay.
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Old 11-11-2012, 03:21 PM   #21
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i get that people might not want DNFers to get a medal. but this is a disney race. this isn't the boston marathon that requires some intense qualifications. and this is the WISH board. if we all truly supported everyone we'd think of our fellow WISHers who are on here, who worked damn hard for the race, and DNF. not one of you knows the amount of training and effort than anyone else did but yourselves, so how can you say that you know that a DNFer did not properly train. that's not fair.

i don't think it's fair to say that someone shouldn't get a medal just because they didn't finish. it doesn't say that someone has to finish to get a medal (though if anyone has the spare time to go wading through the rundisney material minutia to disprove me then go for it). does it really affect you if someone gets a medal? so why be so adamant against them getting it?
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Old 11-11-2012, 03:27 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by jmasgat View Post
Whoa! First, if you think Coach is anything but supportive of everyone on WISH, then you have not been around lately. And you are also insulting to the rest of us who support all comers to this site, regardless of whether they walk,wog, or run.

And why would anyone who can read look at a race site that says "finishers medals" and expect to be given something if they didn't finish. I'm all for celebrating accomplishments--I grabbed an "I did it" button at the MK after my races, and I cheer like hell for all racers on course--but just don't expect to be given the reward for finishers just because you started the race.

And if a person doesn't want to enter, because s/he can't bear not to get a medal regardless of his/her performance, then maybe s/he should find an event where everyone gets a medal, so they'll feel okay.
Maura
I have been around plenty, and I feel confident in saying I am not the only person who has not found Coach Charles supportive of me.

Since you have personally insulted me by implying I am illiterate because I have interpreted Disney's policy in the same manner they clearly have, as they are providing medals to everyone who starts the race, I don't know what I can possibly say about your accusation that I am insulting the WISH community. Apparently I am insulting myself most of all, which is a bit ironic.

And again for the record -- this race DOES provide a medal to everyone so they can feel ok -- that is the point of my post. People have found this race and entered and received medals whether they finish or not. Disney clearly has implemented this policy. Disney races are the event you so caustically suggest someone find.

I appreciate the policy, you do not. I will simply agree to disagree, and leave it at that.

Maria
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Old 11-11-2012, 04:19 PM   #23
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The rundisney site clearly states that you need to maintain a 16:00 mpm pace so you don't get swept. Granted this is a Disney race and there are lots of picture opportunities which means you have be that much faster to FINISH and get a FINISHER'S medal. I'm not doubting that people didn't put it some hard training, but there's a huge difference between being able to start a race and being capable of finishing one. I'm not the fastest runner, but I bust my butt, miss my bed, miss my kids and my family all so I can get out there and get what I deserve. I don't think you are entitled to a FINISHER'S medal unless you actually finish.

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Old 11-11-2012, 04:25 PM   #24
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i get that people might not want DNFers to get a medal. but this is a disney race. this isn't the boston marathon that requires some intense qualifications. and this is the WISH board. if we all truly supported everyone we'd think of our fellow WISHers who are on here, who worked damn hard for the race, and DNF. not one of you knows the amount of training and effort than anyone else did but yourselves, so how can you say that you know that a DNFer did not properly train. that's not fair.

i don't think it's fair to say that someone shouldn't get a medal just because they didn't finish. it doesn't say that someone has to finish to get a medal (though if anyone has the spare time to go wading through the rundisney material minutia to disprove me then go for it). does it really affect you if someone gets a medal? so why be so adamant against them getting it?
I would be the first person to console a fellow WISH'er and congratulate them on starting the road to a healthier lifestyle and for having the courage to want to complete a marathon, but I would also be the person to say "try again next year". If I DNF'ed I know I wouldn't take the medal because I didn't earn it by finishing the race. I'm adamant about people who don't finish receiving them because it insults the effort I put in on race day and cheapens the experience.

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Old 11-11-2012, 04:40 PM   #25
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While I don't agree with "Finisher" medals being awarded to people who don't complete the course, I also can see my friend Dumbo_Buddy's point. For a lot of people it is the journey.

I would *hope* that the majority of people who try and don't finish and get a medal RESPECT what they did, and use that medal as inspiration and incentive to try harder and go back and really earn it. That means that I hope and believe to be the case is that it is a small minority who laugh about taking a medal and feel like they are scamming the system.

As for my history...I DNF'ed the Goofy Challenge in 2012 due to an injury and ended up in a van to the finish. I was handed a marathon finisher medal (and tried to refuse a couple of times, and then just decided that being rude to the volunteer was worse than taking the medal that I never displayed). I was not given my Goofy medal and they made it clear I would not. I've done the Goofy before and the marathon by itself....so it's not that I wasn't respecting the distances...I just happened to get hurt 3 weeks out from the race in a sortof freak accident.

On the other hand....I almost missed the cutoff at Ironman Canada (triathlon) this past summer. Not hurt. Did train. Just slow. I sort of lost track of time on the run and didn't realize that I was cutting it close until mile 18. I wanted an official finish, and I wanted my medal (they pretty much will not give a medal to a late finisher at Ironman). So you know what? I busted my butt and picked up the pace to EARN it. Negative split that marathon by 20 minutes because I HAD to, and finished with 4 minutes to spare...my slowest full Ironman ever.
So maybe that is what the back of the packers need to do...not bleed time, and pick it up if they have to. Unfortunately, the WDW race RDs don't make them.

Do I begrudge them their medals? No. It really doesn't affect me. I know when I earned it by my standards, which generally match the race standards. I don't need to waste my effort on strangers who don't follow the same line of thinking. (and maybe they are the same who tell the CMs their kids are 2 and not 3, or making duplicate ADRs...LOL....I just don't have to make it my business)
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Old 11-11-2012, 05:01 PM   #26
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While I don't agree with "Finisher" medals being awarded to people who don't complete the course, I also can see my friend Dumbo_Buddy's point. For a lot of people it is the journey.

I would *hope* that the majority of people who try and don't finish and get a medal RESPECT what they did, and use that medal as inspiration and incentive to try harder and go back and really earn it. That means that I hope and believe to be the case is that it is a small minority who laugh about taking a medal and feel like they are scamming the system.

As for my history...I DNF'ed the Goofy Challenge in 2012 due to an injury and ended up in a van to the finish. I was handed a marathon finisher medal (and tried to refuse a couple of times, and then just decided that being rude to the volunteer was worse than taking the medal that I never displayed). I was not given my Goofy medal and they made it clear I would not. I've done the Goofy before and the marathon by itself....so it's not that I wasn't respecting the distances...I just happened to get hurt 3 weeks out from the race in a sortof freak accident.

On the other hand....I almost missed the cutoff at Ironman Canada (triathlon) this past summer. Not hurt. Did train. Just slow. I sort of lost track of time on the run and didn't realize that I was cutting it close until mile 18. I wanted an official finish, and I wanted my medal (they pretty much will not give a medal to a late finisher at Ironman). So you know what? I busted my butt and picked up the pace to EARN it. Negative split that marathon by 20 minutes because I HAD to, and finished with 4 minutes to spare...my slowest full Ironman ever.
So maybe that is what the back of the packers need to do...not bleed time, and pick it up if they have to. Unfortunately, the WDW race RDs don't make them.

Do I begrudge them their medals? No. It really doesn't affect me. I know when I earned it by my standards, which generally match the race standards. I don't need to waste my effort on strangers who don't follow the same line of thinking. (and maybe they are the same who tell the CMs their kids are 2 and not 3, or making duplicate ADRs...LOL....I just don't have to make it my business)
I am so glad you picked up the pace and earned that Ironman medal! That is what should happen and what really did happen with those around me at the Marathon this year. The sweepers were nice as could be and told us how far ahead or behind pace we were. I was two minutes from the clock being turned off...and it took everything to speed up to get across that finish line. I don't think I have ever been so tired or grumpy after a race, but I earned those medals that day and somehow didn't land in the medical tent.

I don't care if people get the medals, but they shouldn't parade them around as though they earned them when they didn't personally cross the finish line. I would rather them take the RNR philosophy and have people walk the last few feet across the finish line. Because, at least they did cross the finish line.

I get being testy about the whole issue, but I have been in those shoes and there is no way that I find the comments by others against the medals to be an attack on anyone and if you think that are being singled out, then you are mistaken. The group here is incredibly supportive and Coach got me through my first Marathon after I experienced IT band pain. If it wasn't for his recommendations, that would have been a DNF. I find the comments against him to be uncalled for.

We have all struggled at times, there is no one here that is an elite runner or someone who rolls out of bed and just runs a race because they have nothing to do. We all work hard to get to the finish line no matter what corral we are in or what pace we each run at. I would look at a DNF as inspiration to come back stronger. I look at my Goofy experience this year almost in the same way. The only reason I am going to go through that crap again is so that I can finish that weekend the way I wanted to. Most people would never subject themselves to that torture.
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Old 11-11-2012, 05:39 PM   #27
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So I worked my butt off to keep ahead of the sweepers last night (and I'm not a person who could even run a mile continuously a year ago) and I wore my medal around the park today and apparently people may have been just saying "oh look at that, she tried that race"? I mean, not that I do it for the accolades but it does make me a bit angry that they call it a finishers medal but give them to everyone. I did make a lot of sacrifices and knew that when I was faced with setbacks in training that it might cost me the race.

I'm more proud of my journey and what I learned along the way than I am of having a medal. But if people don't think that there are affects on other runner by them entering and not training or planning to finish, they are not thinking about things like race logistics and congestion. If there are that many people signing up with the intention of not finishing that can affect corrals. And say they can make it 5 miles and are pretty fast but cant go further- anyone who entered animal kingdom last night will tell you how tight it was. And what about other runners that would like to actually experience and run the race but couldn't register because registration was sold out so quickly?

Again I'm not talking about dnf because you just couldn't make it for whatever reason. I'm talking about people who never planned to.
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Old 11-11-2012, 07:39 PM   #28
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I would rather them take the RNR philosophy and have people walk the last few feet across the finish line. Because, at least they did cross the finish line.
I don't have your experience, but I would not want people bussed in front of me at the finish line.
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Old 11-11-2012, 07:57 PM   #29
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I DNF'd my first marathon last month. Had to give it up at mile 20. Was driven to the finish. Could I have jumped into the race and crossed the finish line to get a medal? Probably. Would I have? Not a chance. I felt sad that I didn't EARN a medal, but I would not have been comfortable with a medal from a race I didn't finish. I even have trouble with wearing the shirt, though I did run 20 of the 26.2 miles.

Our local Turkey Trot gave out medals at packet pickup a few years ago. My FIL picked up our packets and asked the volunteer what that was about. Volunteer said it was "easier" for them to hand them out at pickup instead of at the end of the race.

Most of us here are not elite athletes and yes we work our butts off training for these races. But a finishers medal is just that-for finishing.

Just my 2 cents.
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Old 11-11-2012, 08:22 PM   #30
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I don't have your experience, but I would not want people bussed in front of me at the finish line.
I agree. I am just saying that if Disney has this philosophy of giving medals to everyone, they might as well make them cross the actual finish line. I highly doubt that most DNF runners who get medals actually come back to redeem themselves. But, maybe if they experienced crossing the finish line around those that actually ran the entire distance they would feel guilty about accepting medals or feel the excitement of the finish line and want to come back to earn the medal the next time. For now, they are shielded from anyone who completes the entire course, so most runners don't even know that medals are given to those who are swept.
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