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Old 01-12-2010, 10:19 AM   #241
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Why they did not renovate this huge vacant lot?...They abandoned it for how many years?
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Old 01-12-2010, 10:50 AM   #242
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How sad.
RC was open when we 1st visited WDW but we went to the other water parks. Our friends who we were on holiday with, went. & we still have the refillable cup they brought back.
Was the refillable cup full or empty when they brought it back to you?
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Old 01-12-2010, 11:08 AM   #243
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river country

Why don't they do something constructive with this great piece of land.

Couldn't they expand it for camping. Open the swinning pool, which was fantastic.
Nature walks. Drain the water from the lake part. Let the beach as is. This is a crying shame the way they just ignored it.
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Old 01-12-2010, 11:16 AM   #244
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Probably just a case of having so many other projects they are working on. I would think there are at least a few ideas on the shelf about what to do with the property. My first thought would also be to expand Fort Wilderness, adding more campsites.
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Old 01-12-2010, 09:09 PM   #245
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I think that a lot depends on who is in charge at what point, along with all of the enviromental issues that go with it.
For example, the old train system at FW when it was installed, was never installed properly to begin with.Disney didnt want to spend the money to do it right the first time.Also, when the trains were designed, they werent designed with enough water or fuel to be effective, for the day like the trains at the MK.The final straw was that Disney hired operators for the train, they were hired as operations personell, as opposed to train operators like the park trains. The end result, was a train system doomed from the start, with frequent derailings, and from what I understand regularly running out of fuel water or both.At that point, Disneys biggest fan of railroads was dead,(Walt himself, and Roy was out of the pic) and there was no interest to do it right.So they took the trains out of service, let them rot for multiple years under the Florida sun, before private collectors got their hands on them to save them. All 4 engines are now private hands out on the west coast, along with maybe 4 of the 16 cars.


Same thing is happening with River Country.
For what ever the reason, RC was closed, and at first their may have been interest in fixing what ever the underlying issue was to begin with, but now that management has been changed prob several times, and with changing enviromental laws, add to that a sagging economy from both 911 and a recession, no one wants to spend money to do anything with it, and its more value in the short term as a tax write off, so its being left to rot.Kinda the same thing with the unbuilt section of Pop Century.
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Old 01-13-2010, 05:56 AM   #246
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So sad- I have such great memories of RC.
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Old 01-13-2010, 08:10 AM   #247
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...For what ever the reason, RC was closed, and at first their may have been interest in fixing what ever the underlying issue was to begin with, but now that management has been changed prob several times, and with changing enviromental laws, add to that a sagging economy from both 911 and a recession, no one wants to spend money to do anything with it, and its more value in the short term as a tax write off, so its being left to rot.Kinda the same thing with the unbuilt section of Pop Century.
What did change in the management was to just someone concerned with the stock price short term from Walt and his gang who were visionaries and knew guests wanted. RC and PC sitting there rotting away like some unsightly slum is not what resort guest expect of Disney. It turns people off as evidenced by this very well viewed thread. Disney needs to evolve. If RC needed to be closed then close it and do it the right way. Return it to vacant land it came from. Better yet turn it from a water park and into a nature walk. How cool to walk through the grottos and around the paths and ultimately back to Clementine Beach.
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Old 01-13-2010, 10:54 AM   #248
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Tri-Circle.....sorry if I missed this, but was wondering how you were able to access the property and get all of these photos of what was River Country?
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Old 01-13-2010, 11:00 AM   #249
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Tri-Circle.....sorry if I missed this, but was wondering how you were able to access the property and get all of these photos of what was River Country?

Shhhhhh..... I think Tri-Circle's answer would be, in his best Sgt Schultz's voice, " I know nothink! I know nothink!"

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Old 01-13-2010, 11:07 AM   #250
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Shhhhhh..... I think Tri-Circle's answer would be, in his best Sgt Schultz's voice, " I know nothink! I know nothink!"

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Old 01-13-2010, 12:47 PM   #251
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What did change in the management was to just someone concerned with the stock price short term from Walt and his gang who were visionaries and knew guests wanted. RC and PC sitting there rotting away like some unsightly slum is not what resort guest expect of Disney. It turns people off as evidenced by this very well viewed thread. Disney needs to evolve. If RC needed to be closed then close it and do it the right way. Return it to vacant land it came from. Better yet turn it from a water park and into a nature walk. How cool to walk through the grottos and around the paths and ultimately back to Clementine Beach.


I agree that the emphasis, especially in the last few years seems to be how much money can be made without spending more.I am and have been a Disney fan since I was born and I am very saddened at the state of Disney at this point. I worked for Disney for several years, and have seen first hand the change in mentality at Disney. When I went thru traditions, it was a 2 day class. Now its 1. The 2 day class was full of Walts dream parks, why things were the way they were,and the emphasis was on both safety and total guest experience giving them more than what they expect.

Today,its a 1 day class, basically saying welcome to the company, and heres your new area.Next.

To me, theres been a steady decline in the emphasis on guest experience, and more towards how many people can we get to the parks.Alot of equipment is showing its age and a lot of it has to do with the fact that Disney is now hiring off site companies to do a lot of the work.15 years ago,Almost everything was done on Disney property,from fixing crashed ride vehicles, to new builds of ride vehicles, heavy maintance of all of the rides, bldgs, shows, and equipment.90% of the people that worked in those areas, put their blood sweat and tears into their jobs,and more importantly pride,to make things as seemless, and as close to Walts ideas as possible.
Today, a large part of the maintance is done off property, by outside vendors.You can see the result walking thru the parks. Look at the hitching posts on Main Street at the MK. Years ago, if they were damaged, they would have been pulled from the park, either sandbalsted to bare material, or had the scratch filled and then repainted. Either way they would have looked like new.Last time I was up there, you can see where someone painted over the large chips, and the paint isnt seemless as it should be.

The other main issue is the and I am sad to say it, the quality of the workforce being hired.The last time I took Disney Transportation to go park hopping with my son,the one bus we were on the diriver never said a word the entire trip.He didnt even acknowledge the fact that people were getting on the bus.Never even said where the bus was going or where we stopped.I knew from experience, but someone else who has never been to Disney before, what does this tell them?Granted everyone has a bad day,and it could of been his, but its like that in the parks also.Theres very few cast members now that will come over if you stop and take out a map and look confused on how to get somewhere.Its never been this bad.

Just before I left, there was several rumors floating basically saying the same thing that Disney (and the other parks and hotels as well)has pretty much scrapped the bottom of the barrel as far as a workforce,in central Florida.Supposedly it was one of the reasons that either Port Orleans or Dixie Landings (It was still Dixie at the time) had closed for several months, and the work force was split up between a new resort that had just opened, and the other half of Port/Dixie.It was supposedly another reason that the 1st phase of Pop was finished and sat unused for several months.

As far as what to do with what remains of RC, with the amount of times that TL and BB close especially during the summer,due to capacity, RC should be brought up to standard, and reopened. It wouldnt have been that hard after the first summer or 2 to comepltely enclose the lake and make it a pool with a filtration system.

Dont get me wrong. Im all for Disney making money so that money can be spent on the parks, so that guests will return happy, and leave with the best experience.But, when Disney announces that 1000 jobs are being eliminated, and that if certain managers dont take a buy out, theyll prob be on the job reduction list, due to budget concerns,then turns around and says that the CEO is being awarded 100 million dollar bonus, along with stocks and his normal salary, that speaks volumes of the philosophy and the thought process in Burbank.
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Old 01-13-2010, 01:02 PM   #252
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Walt would fly thru that company like a white tornado cleaning house ! No doubt Walt wanted to make money, why else would a man be in business, he was however a remarkable man with great insight on how and why things should be done. And I'm pretty sure his vision didn't account for running his business into the ground.
So sad.



Hey! Come to think of it, thats kinda like the vision of this countrys fore fathers and todays congress !
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Old 01-14-2010, 04:47 AM   #253
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Truck1 I worked for the company in the 80's we did 3 day at Disney U we had to know eveything about Disney and the company.
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Old 01-14-2010, 07:28 AM   #254
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Walt would fly thru that company like a white tornado cleaning house ! No doubt Walt wanted to make money, why else would a man be in business, he was however a remarkable man with great insight on how and why things should be done. And I'm pretty sure his vision didn't account for running his business into the ground.
So sad.



Hey! Come to think of it, thats kinda like the vision of this countrys fore fathers and todays congress !

I totally agree. I am a Disney fanatic and have read all I could about the history of Walt's company. He must be flipping around in his grave to see how outwardly commercial his dream has become. Sure we all know it is a business and needs to make a profit, but when the profit motive becomes so obvious that it outways the magic then guests begin rethinking visiting. What the management does not see among the financial figures is how much guest experience and repeat visits factor into their success. They look at things short term and those decisions cut down on the future growth and profits.

Funny you mention government here. The government whether Federal, State or local has no common sense vision either. For example here in NY they are all in a panic because there is less toll money coming in because fewer drivers use the toll roads. So they clammor that toll hikes are needed. DUH!! They are so stupid to see that it is the toll increases that make drivers go out of their way to avoid toll roads. Obviously the higher the tolls get the fewer and fewer drivers use the roads and the spiral continues. Then the roads deteriorate leading further to an erosion in traffic. A good lesson for Disney.
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Old 01-14-2010, 07:53 AM   #255
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I reck'n it really does take a Rocket Scientist to figure out, "well, we finally over priced ourselves,,so lets LOWER prices (taxes,etc.) and that'll start them spending again"
But how in the heck can the smartest among these MORONS ,be it Disney or goverment, look at each other and say "wow, no one is spending, lets raise the prices" and honestly believe that will get people to spend !!!
THESE PEOPLE ARE FREAK'N NUTTS !!!
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