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Old 03-26-2013, 12:28 PM   #136
Egdisney
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Originally Posted by pigletto View Post
I am following this conversation with interest. I would put both of my children in the category of above their peers academically but they are very different children.
Our school board doesn't test or do much for "gifted" children until 5th grade. My daughter was academically very strong, but as she got older and had to develop study skills, and the organization necessary to succeed she fell behind. Things always came easily to her and when these skills became necessary she couldn't keep up. She was very intelligent but forgot her homework every day, left everything to the last minute, and couldn't organize herself out of a wet paper bag. She's my head in the clouds child and that's ok.. it's who she is

My son is very different. He brought home straight A's this past report card with the exception of two B's in Art and Music. He got A+ in every core subject. It's not that so much that makes me suspect he would test as gifted. It's a host of other things. He is rigid about mistakes and won't allow himself to make them. There's an anxiety about perfection that I have seen in him from a young age that we work hard to get him to relax about. He doesn't really understand other children and I have to work on that too. However his empathy is off the charts and always has been which I find unusual in a young boy. He is constantly trying to solve injustice and tackle issues that he lacks the maturity to fully comprehend. He's bored in school and fills notebook after notebook with doodling and drawings. He takes a chapter book of some sort every day. Both of these things are because he's done his work before everyone else and just sits or is asked to help the other kids.
With my daughter it wasn't a bad thing to be at the top of the class when she was. But with my son I see a great deal of frustration. I had wished for a gifted placement for him simply for more challenge and the feeling that he was accomplishing something meaningful but it won't happen at least for 2 more years, and even then for those kids that test in the 98th percentile they simply send them a few times a year to all day workshops so nothing changes much.
My main concern is losing a child who is compelled to do well to behaivoural issues. How long can he stay motivated to do well when he's bored and overlooked and counted on to teach the other kids?

What I ended up doing is applying for a language immersion program. He was accepted and excited. Learning in a new language solves the issue of not being challenged and hopefully will keep him engaged and excited about learning.

I don't find there is anyone I can talk to about this without sounding like saying "My special snowflake is more important than other kids!"

It isn't that at all. I just don't want to lose a kid to frustration and boredom and not fitting in. Hopefully we have found the solution with this new program.
I was the same child as your daughter. I finally discovered when I was 28 that I have ADD. I read a book about adult ADD, and realized that every single story was my story in some way. Girls are labeled as daydreamers, but since they are not problems, no one thinks there is a real issue.
I am not sure how old your daughter is, but I would suggest getting her some sort of help or advise on how to manage before high school and college. It would have helped me so much to have help with the skills that ADD makes difficult. Just look into it, as undiagnosed ADD can often cause depression as we age, as at times we feel like failures.
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Old 03-26-2013, 12:33 PM   #137
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I faced this issue with my DD and the school talked me out of it I decided to hold her back. Fast forward she just skipped 6th grade and is still bored in 7th. I wish so badly I had started her early as my heart told me to.

You know you own child better than anyone else. Make the decision with your head and your heart and ignore everyone else.

Lisa
This! My DD is in 3rd grade and bored silly. In fact, we are moving her to a school with access to gifted services next year due to the fact that she is bored most of the time. She SHOULD have started K a year earlier than she did. She would have ben 4 for all of 6 weeks of school, but the district refuses to make exceptions, even when rediness tests indicate that the child should start. Private schools in the area actively discourage this as well and actively encourage redshirting. I don't understand the one size fits all approach. While the vast majority should start within the established cutoff dates, there are those who are exceptions to that and there should be some sort of testing system in place for those exceptions on both sides of the coin.
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Old 03-26-2013, 01:04 PM   #138
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I think what alot of people are not realizing, is that being qualified as 'gifted' according to most states programs, is not calculated because you have a high Iowa test score or you are in the top % of your class or because you can do HS math in 7th grade or read at HS level in 3rd grade.

It is more of the way a gifted child thinks. They can think 'outside the box' in a way most children can not. They have ways of solving and analyzing things that most their age (or even older) can not. Yes, they do take into consideration all of the test scores from over the years before being tested for the program. Here, there is a set of guidlines before you can be tested and accepted. Test scores, grades, teacher referrals are looked at. As well as going thru a case study with the school phsycologist (to make sure you are mature enough to handle the workload and such). They give a multitude of tests (not all are basic reading/writing/math), some are basic but others are learning how the child thinks and how they are able to solve things. They are given an IQ test as well that must be met with a certain score.

Here they are set up with an IEP. I have to go to a meeting for my son every few months to sign off (state required) paperwork that he is being offered certain rights and curriculum under state guidlines. He is in a regular class of about 150students and there are only 2 out of his 10th grade class that is in the program. There are about 6 total from his highschool in the program.

My DD(20) is very intelligent. She graduated salutatorian at the top of her class. And is now on the all A honor roll at the University she attends. She is always discussing with her brother how she should have been in the program because she is so smart. Which is absolutely true, she is really smart. However, I do see a difference between them. There is just something about the way DS 'thinks' about things. They both have the same basic book smarts but like I said that is not what being gifted is all about.

I remember the last IEP meeting. The gifted teacher told me that she has never met a student that can 'think' about things the way my son does. She looked at me and said your son is very intriguing. It was kinda mysterious. lol But after I thought about it, I understood what she was talking about. It is such an indepth way of thinking that boggles an 'average' persons mind. lol

I will say, that to the kids at school he is just a normal school buddy like the next kid. He fits right in and although they know him as the smartest kid in the class, he is also the goofiest, easiest to talk to and get along with schoolmate. He has a wide range of friends and this is why the psychologist is so important when going down this path. They certainly need to be ready for it.
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Old 03-26-2013, 04:57 PM   #139
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Hello! I am coming at this from both the student and parent perspective. I was one of those children who skipped a grade, and I hated it all the way through school. I was always younger than all my peers. Everyone was driving before me, and always reached those important milestones a year prior to me. I am now a parent of an "exceptional" first grader. Our state does not typically do gifted testing until third grade, however my son was recommended by his teacher this year. The gifted program is an excellent way for your child to get that extra enrichment and not have to skip a grade. We have been extremely impressed with the gifted program and would consider going that route so that you can avoid skipping a grade.


I agree with the poster above. Without knowing your child it is very difficult to know if she is gifted, or just a bit advanced. I would discuss with the teacher and guidance counselor your concerns and discern whether she is a candidate for gifted testing. You would then have to meet with a team that is made up of a group of professionals (school counselor, county psychologist, teacher, etc.) to decide whether testing is right for her. I know here they have to score a minimum of a 128 on an IQ test, and then many other factors go into play.
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Old 03-26-2013, 05:47 PM   #140
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September Birthday, Started Early

My birthday is in early September and my parents let me start Kindergarten at 4 (I turned 5 a couple of weeks into school). I also turned 18 a couple of weeks into college. Neither was a big deal. You're just looking at a matter of weeks. If her birthday had been 5 weeks earlier she'd be with those kids anyway. If the school is willing to move her up and she wants to do it and you've prayed about it and have peace about it (as much as a parent can have about any big decision), I say do it.

I was usually one of the youngest in my class, but it never bothered me. It rarely came up. Now that I'm an adult I really like that most of my friends are getting older before me. I was the last one to turn 30!

If you had a boy, I might think differently. I think boys tend to be a little less mature. (I have a Kindergarten-aged boy, so I've been observing this at class parties, field trips, etc.)

On an personal, and unrelated note, If my parents had delayed my starting school I probably wouldn't have met my husband (He was a Senior in college when I was a Freshman). So, I'm really, really glad I started when I did!! No pressure.
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Old 03-27-2013, 09:03 AM   #141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by photos_101 View Post
I think what alot of people are not realizing, is that being qualified as 'gifted' according to most states programs, is not calculated because you have a high Iowa test score or you are in the top % of your class or because you can do HS math in 7th grade or read at HS level in 3rd grade.

It is more of the way a gifted child thinks. They can think 'outside the box' in a way most children can not. They have ways of solving and analyzing things that most their age (or even older) can not. Yes, they do take into consideration all of the test scores from over the years before being tested for the program. Here, there is a set of guidlines before you can be tested and accepted. Test scores, grades, teacher referrals are looked at. As well as going thru a case study with the school phsycologist (to make sure you are mature enough to handle the workload and such). They give a multitude of tests (not all are basic reading/writing/math), some are basic but others are learning how the child thinks and how they are able to solve things. They are given an IQ test as well that must be met with a certain score.

Here they are set up with an IEP. I have to go to a meeting for my son every few months to sign off (state required) paperwork that he is being offered certain rights and curriculum under state guidlines. He is in a regular class of about 150students and there are only 2 out of his 10th grade class that is in the program. There are about 6 total from his highschool in the program.

My DD(20) is very intelligent. She graduated salutatorian at the top of her class. And is now on the all A honor roll at the University she attends. She is always discussing with her brother how she should have been in the program because she is so smart. Which is absolutely true, she is really smart. However, I do see a difference between them. There is just something about the way DS 'thinks' about things. They both have the same basic book smarts but like I said that is not what being gifted is all about.

I remember the last IEP meeting. The gifted teacher told me that she has never met a student that can 'think' about things the way my son does. She looked at me and said your son is very intriguing. It was kinda mysterious. lol But after I thought about it, I understood what she was talking about. It is such an indepth way of thinking that boggles an 'average' persons mind. lol

I will say, that to the kids at school he is just a normal school buddy like the next kid. He fits right in and although they know him as the smartest kid in the class, he is also the goofiest, easiest to talk to and get along with schoolmate. He has a wide range of friends and this is why the psychologist is so important when going down this path. They certainly need to be ready for it.
I will never forget the test I took in third grade before I was one of 3 children in my grade admitted into the "Academically Talented" program. I found it to be so incredibly fun and interesting. It was not book-smarts (as I find myself to be only average with those things), but it was like a bunch of puzzles. At the time I had no idea what it was for... I just found it to be so enjoyable. And the program itself was a lot of fun, too-- we got do "stories with holes in them" and design board games and have our own news program. While much of school bored me, that program excited me!
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Old 03-27-2013, 09:34 AM   #142
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I was the same child as your daughter. I finally discovered when I was 28 that I have ADD. I read a book about adult ADD, and realized that every single story was my story in some way. Girls are labeled as daydreamers, but since they are not problems, no one thinks there is a real issue.
I am not sure how old your daughter is, but I would suggest getting her some sort of help or advise on how to manage before high school and college. It would have helped me so much to have help with the skills that ADD makes difficult. Just look into it, as undiagnosed ADD can often cause depression as we age, as at times we feel like failures.
Thank you for your response. You are correct on all points. I took her in 8th grade for assessment and she was diagnosed as having ADD. We very cautiously tried medication. What happened was a bit of a process. Her confidence grew, and she was more ordered for sure. Sadly though she began losing weight she didn't have to lose and when the meds wore off around 4 or 5pm she was moody and full of rage. We had never had a single behaivoural issue before. It was the withdrawal. She said she hated how it felt when they wore off and she had a tremor and was so angry every evening. It just got to the point where the benefits of the meds were far fewer than the drawbacks.

She's still maintaining a 75 average in high school so it's not too bad. She's brilliant though and gets the "you have so much potential" speech from her teachers often.
What took so long to identify what was going on with her is that she is EXACTLY like me. I didn't see it as weird because I was the same way as a child. I did learn other ways to manage as I got older and now that I am aware of it all I keep a close eye on her and don't apply too much pressure. She will be ok.. more than ok. She's got a bright future, it just might not be the traditional route.
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Old 03-27-2013, 10:31 AM   #143
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This article in the NY Times might be of some interest. The authors are two neuroscientists who wrote a book called "Welcome to Your Child's Brain: How the Mind Grows from Conception to College." The article is titled "Delay Kindergarten at Your Child's Peril."

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/25/op...tart.html?_r=0
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Old 03-27-2013, 11:29 AM   #144
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I skipped 7th and my DD has a December birthday and I put her in early (back when they were still admitting children with birthdays as late as December.)

Skipping 7th was harder, friends who considered themselves smarter than me (and may have been I skipped on a fluke!) resented it and I never really connected to kids in my grade. And it was certainly frustrating in college when everyone turned 21 and I didn't turn 21 until after I graduated. Although you could always take a year to do something constructive (or not so constructive - like working on a Disney cruise ship!) before heading to college!

Anyway, even with all that, I still put my daughter in school a year early. They put her in the younger 1st graders class on account and then moved her within a month to the higher level classroom as she was already reading and essentially assisting the teacher with other students.

Now she's in high school and loves it. All her friends drive and work and she can't wait to be able to do the same. But she has no regrets... school has never really been a challenge. She's a very responsible, mature person and I have found no need to give her a set of rules that were any different from the restrictions her friends have. I definitely think it's key to do this move when they're younger, it's more socially awkward later in life.

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Old 03-27-2013, 12:25 PM   #145
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She's bored it sounds like and you already held her back. It's not skipping, its putting her into the right class and if you do it early she's still going to make friends and be in the same class for 2nd-5th grade.

It sounds like she'll be a year "too young" for a month or less and then she'll age up. I started at 4 and my birthday is in November. The worst thing that happened was I had to take my parents along for a bunch of college stuff because I legally couldn't sign off for myself until November. Other than that, no issues.

I think she'll be way worse off if you keep her where she is.
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Old 03-28-2013, 09:31 PM   #146
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I have three children. My oldest didn't attend school until 1st grade. We didn't skip kindergarten but we weren't required to send her so we didn't. She started 1st grade when she was 7 (late birthday). Both she and my son were tested for the gifted program in 2nd grade. She was able to attend a class for accelerated learners and did fabulous. By the time my son reached that grade they no longer offered the class. He was miserable in school. He was bored and frequently asked to help other kids. Even though he had a GIEP the school didn't always follow it. We ended taking him out of school in the middle of 3rd grade and doing cyber school. He's a different child now because he can study more subjects at a pace that is suitable for him. He's become more outgoing and confident and loves school now.

We started cyber school with my oldest for 6th grade. She misses the social aspect but gets to spend more time during science and loves that aspect. My youngest lucked out because they opened an IB charter school and she was eligible to attend. We've never felt the need to get her tested because she is happy and likes school. She gets to be immersed in a curriculum that is much broader than what the public schools in our area offer.

I do want to mention as well, that each child is very different. My oldest is very bright but also very lazy and unorganized. We have to monitor her school work closely and always stay on top of her. My son has is borderline on the spectrum and had developed a "routine" that he likes to,follow every day. If it gets interrupted he can get flustered but he has learned that he can adapt to change more easily at home.
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Old 03-29-2013, 11:29 AM   #147
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I will never forget the test I took in third grade before I was one of 3 children in my grade admitted into the "Academically Talented" program. I found it to be so incredibly fun and interesting. It was not book-smarts (as I find myself to be only average with those things), but it was like a bunch of puzzles. At the time I had no idea what it was for... I just found it to be so enjoyable. And the program itself was a lot of fun, too-- we got do "stories with holes in them" and design board games and have our own news program. While much of school bored me, that program excited me!
this was me as well. I was tested in 3rd grade, and "gifted day" was the highlight of my weel in elementary school. We studied Shakespeare, famous artists, computer programming, systems of governmnet, and lots of other things on a deeper level. It was an awesome program, and I can see the need for itin my kid. She is pretty much me in 3rd grade.
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