Does Disney treat those who buy resale differently?

[heynowirv]

Originally Posted by TJLGB

I just bought a used dvc and every time I call member services they mention oh you bought a resale.
The way I see it they are lucky I bought something and are paying my dues so they have a job. What if know one bought used member service?!

I own 2 resale and 1 direct contracts ,and no one ever said " Oh you bought resale " to me. I have always been treated with respect and a hearty "Welcome Home".

[TJLGB]

Originally Posted by heynowirv

I own 2 resale and 1 direct contracts ,and no one ever said " Oh you bought resale " to me. I have always been treated with respect and a hearty "Welcome Home".

I'm glad your experiences have been positive I can not say the same thus far

[Dean]

Originally Posted by TJLGB

The point I'm trying to make is it that as a customer who pays yearly dues is it shouldn't matter if I bought my dvc new or resale customer service should be equal. I didn't mention stopping dues

I believe I understood your point initially. The fact is it does matter to the sales component because once a contract is sold, they move on and every resales is a potentially lost retail sale and those that wouldn't buy without resale don't bring anything extra to the equation. Each component at Disney is separate legally, technically and accounting wise. It matters to DVD but shouldn't to members or DVCMC but the question is where does one stop and the other begin. Some will say it's not fair or appropriate but it's reality. I think it's best to just ignore or joke about the issue if anyone brings it up and enjoy the savings. The reality is that customers are not treated equally across all of corporate america, certainly not with timeshares, hotels or airlines and not with Disney in general.

Not directed at you or anyone specific but I'm of the opinion that those that can't reconcile themselves to the fact that not all are treated equally likely shouldn't participate. That's esp true since I believe the separation will widen.

[bighoo93]

Originally Posted by Brian Noble

It is important to understand how Disney, as a company, works. Each unit, and each division within each unit, has to answer to its own profit/loss goals and performance. In many respects, the company is operated as if it were several different companies. Granted, they have complimentary goals, but still, DVD gets credit only for DVC sales, not in-park spending by DVC Members, etc.

If it isn't too much trouble, could you share with me some of the links or sources you have that I could read about how Disney, as a company, works that speaks specifically to the DVD profit issue? I've looked at some of the obvious and easily accessible ones like their annual reports and public website. I would love to see some authoritative discussion of how Disney as a company works, specifically their strategic decisions regarding DVD. I don't doubt that DVD has its own sales and profit goals, but it would seem to me to be...odd...if DVD and all units, divisions, and businesses within the Walt Disney Company weren't directed toward maximizing the long-term profitability of the Walt Disney Company. In some cases, this might very well mean not maximizing the profit of an individual business unit (what was the profit of the marketing department? Or the legal department? HR?). I would be interested to learn more about it, in particular with respect to DVD. They ought to be acting with synergy, not independently, and there are obvious choices that could be made that might sacrifice potential DVD short-term profit to serve the overall goals of the Walt Disney Company. There seems to be an assumption (not necessarily by you, but by many others) that every business unit obviously just seeks to maximize its own profit and nothing else and that's that and nobody could ever question such an obvious truth. I don't think that is necessarily a good assumption.

[Dean]

Originally Posted by bighoo93

If it isn't too much trouble, could you share with me some of the links or sources you have that I could read about how Disney, as a company, works that speaks specifically to the DVD profit issue? I've looked at some of the obvious and easily accessible ones like their annual reports and public website. I would love to see some authoritative discussion of how Disney as a company works, specifically their strategic decisions regarding DVD. I don't doubt that DVD has its own sales and profit goals, but it would seem to me to be...odd...if DVD and all units, divisions, and businesses within the Walt Disney Company weren't directed toward maximizing the long-term profitability of the Walt Disney Company. In some cases, this might very well mean not maximizing the profit of an individual business unit (what was the profit of the marketing department? Or the legal department? HR?). I would be interested to learn more about it, in particular with respect to DVD. They ought to be acting with synergy, not independently, and there are obvious choices that could be made that might sacrifice potential DVD short-term profit to serve the overall goals of the Walt Disney Company. There seems to be an assumption (not necessarily by you, but by many others) that every business unit obviously just seeks to maximize its own profit and nothing else and that's that and nobody could ever question such an obvious truth. I don't think that is necessarily a good assumption.

The book Married to the Mouse might give you some insight.

[chalee94]

Originally Posted by bighoo93

In some cases, this might very well mean not maximizing the profit of an individual business unit (what was the profit of the marketing department? Or the legal department? HR?).

you don't seem to understand that there are cost centers and profit centers. that might be a good place to start.

DVD and the parks segments would both be considered profit centers. HR is a cost center but that's really not at issue...

[bighoo93]

Originally Posted by chalee94

you don't seem to understand that there are cost centers and profit centers. that might be a good place to start.

DVD and the parks segments would both be considered profit centers. HR is a cost center but that's really not at issue...

LOL. Spare me the condescension.

That's exactly my point, actually. And further, I understand that just because something is a profit center doesn't mean it necessarily acts only in its own profit-maximizing interest independently from the overall company.

[bighoo93]

Originally Posted by Dean

The book Married to the Mouse might give you some insight.

Good tip, I'll try to find it.

[TJLGB]

Originally Posted by Dean

I believe I understood your point initially. The fact is it does matter to the sales component because once a contract is sold, they move on and every resales is a potentially lost retail sale and those that wouldn't buy without resale don't bring anything extra to the equation. Each component at Disney is separate legally, technically and accounting wise. It matters to DVD but shouldn't to members or DVCMC but the question is where does one stop and the other begin. Some will say it's not fair or appropriate but it's reality. I think it's best to just ignore or joke about the issue if anyone brings it up and enjoy the savings. The reality is that customers are not treated equally across all of corporate america, certainly not with timeshares, hotels or airlines and not with Disney in general.

Not directed at you or anyone specific but I'm of the opinion that those that can't reconcile themselves to the fact that not all are treated equally likely shouldn't participate. That's esp true since I believe the separation will widen.

I didn't bring up the sales component. I just think every dvc owner should be treated equally. If dvc wants people to buy new they should make it more attractive. Dvc looks for the impulse buyer. The people that go home and do their homework win. But I will take your advice on laughing it off

[GoofyDad1970]

But one man's "riff-raff" is another man's smart busines-decision-maker. Welcome home!

[bighoo93]

Originally Posted by TJLGB

I didn't bring up the sales component. I just think every dvc owner should be treated equally. If dvc wants people to buy new they should make it more attractive. Dvc looks for the impulse buyer. The people that go home and do their homework win. But I will take your advice on laughing it off

I agree with you that DVC owners should be treated the same. I also agree with those who said that your experience is likely an outlier. It is a shame that some would treat you differently, but as long as that is atypical, it is something you can just roll your eyes at and laugh off.

[JimMIA]

Originally Posted by TJLGB

I didn't bring up the sales component. I just think every dvc owner should be treated equally. If dvc wants people to buy new they should make it more attractive. Dvc looks for the impulse buyer. The people that go home and do their homework win. But I will take your advice on laughing it off

There is a problem with this egalitarian approach. How does DVD differentiate direct sales and make them more attractive except by giving direct buyers something they don't give all owners?

Dean's example above of airlines is very apt. When I fly American Airlines (which is almost always), I am treated WAY better than someone who flies only occasionally. I get preferred seating they can't even hope to book, early boarding so I never have to worry about having a place for my carryon stuff, free baggage check instead of paying, and LOTS of other stuff. And if the weather is nasty, I get home as soon as possible and they don't because the airline bumps them off their scheduled, confirmed flight so they can put me in their seat. AA has even re-routed me so they could do that.

Is that "equal treatment?" Of course not. On the other hand, if I spend more money each year with them, is it really "fair" to give people who don't the same treatment I get? I don't think so. Preferential treatment of your better customers is sound business practice.

I would not be at all surprised to see DVC eventually go to some kind of a VIP program based on direct purchase of a certain (high) level of points. There are numerous models for that type of program in the timeshare world -- DVC is one of the few who doesn't use it...yet.

I really doubt DVC would ever go to home-resort only booking for resale customers; that would destroy their model and really wouldn't be good for direct purchasers either. But there are many, many other things they could do.

[Brian Noble]

The book Married to the Mouse might give you some insight.

That is a pretty good place to start, though it is more about WDW as a whole rather than how the units within WDW work (or don't work) together. It also looks behind the curtain about how WDW was created, how it is run as its very own government, and how it gets along with the various county governments in which RCID is housed.

Another would be Lee Cockerell's book "Creating Magic". Lee was the EVP of Operations at WDW for a decade or so. In the course of laying out his customer service principles, he bases them on some real examples from WDW, and those give a hint to how this internal structure within Disney works.

I understand that just because something is a profit center doesn't mean it necessarily acts only in its own profit-maximizing interest independently from the overall company.

Well, they aren't entirely independent entities, but they do "keep score" individually, and they have to "pay" each other for some things. As an example of cooperation, consider the DVC dining discounts. These are all at less-popular restaurants, and some restricted to less-popular times at those restaurants. Clearly, the DVC dining discounts are meant to drive traffic to under-utilized locations, and it's something that it mutually beneficial for Food & Beverage and DVD/DVCMC. As an example of accounting, it's been pretty well substantiated that DVD has to "pay" Park Operations for the instant fastpasses they sometimes give out as tour incentives.

It occurs to me that I don't know whether any DVC entity has to pay Park Operations for EMH. That would be an interesting question to know the answer to.

As for the treatment of resale buyers: as far as I can tell, once you get beyond (some) sales staff, no one cares and probably few even know. I'm often dealing with Member Services and/or resort staff as an RCI (or, back in the day, an II) inbound, someone who might arguably be even lower on the totem pole than a resale buyer, and have never experienced anything other than courtesy.

[Dean]

Originally Posted by TJLGB

I didn't bring up the sales component. I just think every dvc owner should be treated equally. If dvc wants people to buy new they should make it more attractive. Dvc looks for the impulse buyer. The people that go home and do their homework win. But I will take your advice on laughing it off

That's not reality and truthfully, not a reasonable expectation. Timeshares are about the emotional impulse buy even for many that research and know about resale. We all accepted certain risks when we bought resale whether we thought about it or not and that includes being treated differently in certain aspects of the membership. IMO there are some areas where it's appropriate and some where it's not. I also think you overestimate the degree of self control and sophistication the usual buy has, otherwise how could they sell at the current prices.

[ELMC]

Originally Posted by JimMIA

There is a problem with this egalitarian approach. How does DVD differentiate direct sales and make them more attractive except by giving direct buyers something they don't give all owners?



I would not be at all surprised to see DVC eventually go to some kind of a VIP program based on direct purchase of a certain (high) level of points. There are numerous models for that type of program in the timeshare world -- DVC is one of the few who doesn't use it...yet.

As a resale buyer, I would welcome this type of program. All I expect from my resale points is the right to book my home resort at 11 months. If DVD came out with a VIP program for direct purchasers, it would certainly liven up the conversation as to whether or not a direct purchase was worth the extra money. It would have to be pretty valuable though...