How many people buy resale?

[DougEMG]

Originally Posted by disneynutz

If the resale restrictions are causing more educated owners to buy direct, I don't see how this hurts Disney?

Bill

Theoretically restrictions should cause a resale contract to have less value than a direct contract. Something that has less value should have a lower price. So anything that Disney does to restrict a resale owner has the effect of making it an even better deal to buy resale; provided you are happy staying at your home resort since they can't take that away.

So any informed buyer should be seriously looking at resale.

What would be interesting is to see how many add-ons were direct 5 years ago as compared to how many add-ons are direct now. I would bet it is less.

[disneynutz]

Originally Posted by DougEMG

Theoretically restrictions should cause a resale contract to have less value than a direct contract. Something that has less value should have a lower price. So anything that Disney does to restrict a resale owner has the effect of making it an even better deal to buy resale; provided you are happy staying at your home resort since they can't take that away.

So any informed buyer should be seriously looking at resale.

What would be interesting is to see how many add-ons were direct 5 years ago as compared to how many add-ons are direct now. I would bet it is less.

Once the prices are forced low enough, wouldn't Disney exercise their ROFR and pick up some cheap contracts that they would morph into new contracts at a higher price?

Bill

[JaimeA]

Originally Posted by disneynutz

If the resale restrictions are causing more educated owners to buy direct, I don't see how this hurts Disney?

Bill

My theory is an informed person wouldn't purchase direct knowing their contract has even less value if they need to sell and would then look to buy resale. Again I am talking about informed consumers.

Sent from my iPad using DISBoards

[ELMC]

I think that there are restrictions that could force buyers from resale to direct, but the latest round of restrictions did not accomplish that goal for many buyers. Instead what it accomplished is lowering the prices of resale contracts, making them more attractive to a subset of the buying population. Over time, DVD is sure to figure out what restrictions would push a critical mass of buyers from resale towards direct, so I would anticipate another round of restrictions at least.

For me personally, the only thing they could do that would force me into a direct purchase is to offer a longer booking window for direct vs. resale at the home resort. But I'm not entirely sure that they can legally impose this. So for me, at least, it's a moot point. Resale all the way.

[DougEMG]

I personally don't see any restriction that is going to make a person who wants to save the money buying resale instead buy direct.

My assumptions are:
(1) that all owners of a resort have to be treated the same for booking at their home resort and
(2) that non-home resort owners will not have any booking advantage over home resort owner.

Anything else is possible.

The value of owning DVC is staying at a DVC resort, which is something they can't take away, worst case you are restricted to staying at your home resort.

So lets take the case of someone looking to buy SSR at $55/point resale but being unable to stay at any other resort ever (not sure this could ever happen without effecting all SSR owners), are they instead going to pay $100+ to buy SSR direct or $170+ to buy BLT/GF? Maybe some small percentage of buyers would, but the majority are going to say "I'm happy staying anywhere" and save their money. After all that difference in price alone is going to pay for 10+ years of MF.

I would think that the key thing for Disney would be that they want/need to sell out a new resort fast enough that the resale prices for the new resort haven't dropped enough that it effects the direct sales of the new resort. That certainly seems to be what happened with BLT and I'm betting the same thing will happen with the GF.

So no more mega resorts like SSR. Smaller is better, limited supply equals high prices. Look at how well VGC resale prices have kept up (low supply and high demand), so if Disney added on to that resort it would still sell well with direct sales.

[disneynutz]

According to Disney 50% of their direct sales are first time buyers and it's safe to say that most are impulse buyers who really don't know what they are buying or anything about resale. Many are on a dream vacation at Disney and DVD marketing kicks in and they end up buying before they go home.

Disney has a certain tipping point and If Disney feels that resales are hurting direct sales I am sure that they will take additional steps to push buyers to direct.

Bill

[DougEMG]

Originally Posted by disneynutz

According to Disney 50% of their direct sales are first time buyers and it's safe to say that most are impulse buyers who really don't know what they are buying or anything about resale. Many are on a dream vacation at Disney and DVD marketing kicks in and they end up buying before they go home.

Disney has a certain tipping point and If Disney feels that resales are hurting direct sales I am sure that they will take additional steps to push buyers to direct.

Bill

I don't think they can do anything to resale restrictions to push that group of buyers to buy direct. Their better strategy would be to close the deal with more first time (uninformed buyers) buyers buying direct by offering them perks (free park passes for a X number of years, etc). As soon as they tell prospective buyers that resale contract can't do X Y and Z, the prospective buyer is suddenly made aware that there is a resale market, one they probably never even knew about. That's probably enough to make some people walk away to do more research.

[disneynutz]

Originally Posted by DougEMG

I don't think they can do anything to resale restrictions to push that group of buyers to buy direct. Their better strategy would be to close the deal with more first time (uninformed buyers) buyers buying direct by offering them perks (free park passes for a X number of years, etc). As soon as they tell prospective buyers that resale contract can't do X Y and Z, the prospective buyer is suddenly made aware that there is a resale market, one they probably never even knew about. That's probably enough to make some people walk away to do more research.

You may be right but Disney only offers sales perks when they need to and they know how to market very effectively. Disney's brand is so strong that many buy direct just because Disney told them to. How many times here on the DIS do we see posts where buyers buy from Disney even after 20 people suggest that they should buy resale.

I was told by a Guide that they don't bring up the sales restriction benefit unless the buyer mentions resale first.

Bill

[mikron]

We own 5 memberships through Disney and 2 on resale. Only reason we bought 5 from Disney was the price. With all discounts for SSR under construction points were as cheap as resales at other resorts.

[Disjunky]

What is the best resale place. Safety wise and trustworthy.

[jocin3]

We purchased our first contract through The Timeshare Store (see banner at top of this page) last year-smooth transaction and we were very pleased.

We are now in the process of purchasing our second contract through them as well and are awaiting ROFR. I would highly recommend them, not just from my experience but also from others I have read on this board.

[Msmithmd]

Originally Posted by Disjunky

What is the best resale place. Safety wise and trustworthy.

Any of the four major brokers are reputable, or else they would not be the four major brokers. The Internet has reduced the opportunity for businesses with national reach such as these to be scams. You do see the occasional post about a scam from some company that no one has ever heard of, but not from any of the main companies.

As to price, some have commented on these boards that TTS discourages lower offers more aggressively than the others. But I have no personal experience there, just echoing what others have reported. But certainly most of their customers seem very happy with their service level as you work through closing.

And remember the brokers are just that- they will suggest prices to the sellers, but you will see crazy stuff both on the high side and the low side of pricing. Be sure to understand that the listing price on brokers websites is asking price, just like when buying a house it is flexible in most cases. Depends on what the individual sellers bottom line is. Some have loans that they must pay off, this is probably the reason you see individual contract prices on some broker websites that are ridiculously over market price, as reflected by other same resort/same size contract listings.


I'd suggest you first figure out what resort you want for home. Then figure out how many points you need based on expected average usage. Then add a small cushion, 5-10% for possible reallocations. Only THEN should you look at the websites from ALL major resale brokers and find what fits your needs. Don't let the brokerage name sway you toward or away from the contract that is right for you.

[Dean]

Originally Posted by montrealdisneylovers

I still believe that Disney is shooting itself in the foot with resale restrictions.

It seems that more people bought direct before the resale restrictions came into play and lowered the value of resales. I believe that more people would prefer to buy from Disney if the price discrepancy were not so great. I know I would prefer to deal directly with Disney for a reasonable price difference. It would also be nice to know that my "investment" would not be worth half the minute I signed on the dotted line. It is nice to know that there is a reasonable after market for your contract. Right now, it is only reasonable if you buy resale!!!

The current differences aren't enough to force most to buy DVC but there certainly are differences that would push many people to retail. DVC has also been too soft on sales tours as well as lax about getting those in to tour that rent, trade in or stay on cash.

Originally Posted by dvcterry

This.

We have ownerships with other timeshares and when there were restrictions placed many owners defaulted. mf went through the roof and letter was sent justifying that is was due to the number of increasing members defaulting. mf continue to go up and are now more than double what i paid originally. domino effect. moral of the story, restrictions hurt everyone. period.

Used appropriately restrictions can help sales. While the current DVC setup doesn't really restrict a resale buyer nor does buying retail add any real benefits, this isn't the case for other companies. Certainly for Bluegreen and Wyndham, there are definite reasons and benefits buying retail. They're still not worth the dollar difference (which is much greater than DVC % wise). For Marriott being resale doesn't remove any real options compared to where it was before based on usage though it does significantly restrict future options that were added on to the points options.

There's really not much about this issue that should affect maint fees though, that's a separate area and a separate legal company in most situations. I don't think one can make the case that resale restrictions affected fees directly. Maybe indirectly with resorts still in active sales but that's about it from what I can think of right now.

Originally Posted by DougEMG

I don't think they can do anything to resale restrictions to push that group of buyers to buy direct. Their better strategy would be to close the deal with more first time (uninformed buyers) buyers buying direct by offering them perks (free park passes for a X number of years, etc). As soon as they tell prospective buyers that resale contract can't do X Y and Z, the prospective buyer is suddenly made aware that there is a resale market, one they probably never even knew about. That's probably enough to make some people walk away to do more research.

There is a point where 100% of people who are interested in buying DVC would want to go resale if they could afford it. I doubt they even mention the resale restrictions unless it come up.

My assumptions are:
(1) that all owners of a resort have to be treated the same for booking at their home resort and
(2) that non-home resort owners will not have any booking advantage over home resort owner.

I'd go a little further and assume that all reservation windows for home and non home resorts will be the same and that exchange options will exist. From a value standpoint, most all they can do to to distinguish between the 2 is add nickel and dime costs to resale buyers and remove those plus add other peripheral options to retail buyers likely with a VIP type program. Plus play with peripheral options like transfers and points usage for a host of other things like paying dues, tickets and current cash type exchange options.

[radmcg]

Another thumbs up for The TTS. Kind of funny. While I was reading this thread a person came in the office and told me he had bought DVC. When I ask where he said BLT. I mentioned resale and he didn't even know he could do that. He was at the tour and bought on the spot. Didn't have the heart to mention the differences. He was very happy and sure he will enjoy his vacations for years to come.

[BestDadEver]

Most people buy direct . Most people that post here say to but resale . But even most of them have some direct points .

There was a poll done here , and I was shocked to see most were direct points people had . I have no intrest to look for the threads but there was three threads one for how many resle points you bought , one for direct , and one for both . It was a landslide for direct points.

I myself see value in the direct points so that is what I bought and will add with . Most active posters are for resale, probably cause any time some says anything positive about direct points they get flamed , and dont come back . I myself try not to come on this forum for that reason sometimes.