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Old 07-31-2012, 10:37 PM   #1
zulemara
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Cars Land at Disney’s Hollywood Studios?

Sources have been indicating for a while that something is coming to DHS, but chatter recently picked up and a source indicates plans are being pushed up!. Apparently Cars Land is on the table to come to DHS. The question is where would they put it? Most agree it the backlot tour and the stunt show in the back of the park would be eliminated to make room for Carsland. The stunt show is also extremely expensive form a labor and supplies perspective, so Disney may be looking for a way to eliminate it. If TDO doesn’t cheap out and does things correctly, this could be a great addition to DHS and help draw some of the crowds away from attractions like Toy Story Mania. Tom Staggs is also known to be visiting WDW this week. The last time he was seen walking around, we got the Avatar Land announcement. Stay tuned as this one develops!
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Old 07-31-2012, 10:56 PM   #2
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Ahhh this is so exciting!!
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Old 07-31-2012, 11:39 PM   #3
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Cars Land looks incredible at DL. given how many years construction will the Cars franchise have enough life if a Cars Land opened in 2015/2016?
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Old 07-31-2012, 11:41 PM   #4
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Answer: Not Happening
Reason: Costs too much/ no significant attendance bump likely

Consolation prize: more shops/ bibbidi bobbiti boutiques
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Old 07-31-2012, 11:45 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by lockedoutlogic View Post
"no significant attendance bump likely"
I don't think this can be accurately said until we see what kind of attendance changes there have been at DCA as a result. Perhaps they'll be huge; perhaps not....but it can't be firmly stated it would have no positive attendance effects.
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Old 07-31-2012, 11:58 PM   #6
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I don't think this can be accurately said until we see what kind of attendance changes there have been at DCA as a result. Perhaps they'll be huge; perhaps not....but it can't be firmly stated it would have no positive attendance effects.
The average attendance stay did not increase to disney's estimates/ expectations when they built animal kingdom...from roughly a 5.5 to 6 (days)average up to about a 6.5-7...that extra day is not a lot to offset what was probably 2 billion total on the park and times 2 on the other things in the area built in the run up to AK and aftermath.

that may sound great, but it doesn't justify the overhead to them. And any expansion to a single park is likely to result in most park cannibalizaiton - as in those that may have previous spent more time in the other 3 parks will peel some of their time away to concentrate on the park - presumably studios - that would have the new land...

that is a fact and is closely watched both at Team Disney and by financial analysts.

You will see this when the full magic kingdom expansion opens....attendance will "spike" at MK...but numbers will fall or remain stagnant at the others...resulting in a fairly insignificant overall increase to the property (assuming outside factors like ECONOMY remain equal). EPCOT - in particular - stands to be pilfered...but AK will feel it too.

So it's not really going out on a limb...its the story behind the story that governs far more decisions than most care to admit/realize.

But the proof is in the swamp: they have added no new significant guest areas in terms of serving more capacity since animal kingdom has opened its doors...and if you're fair - have actually reduced those spaces by partially dismantling pleasure island and closing discovery island and river country.
The only "additions" have been hotel rooms and even better guaranteed repeat hotel rooms in SIX new DVC locations since AK...

That's 14 years...its fair to say that its a pattern...i'm giving the reason...based on gut an just a little experience.
Take it as a reasonable theory or complete quackiness - your call
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Old 08-02-2012, 09:53 AM   #7
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If you want new spending atDHS it is simple: the fans have to collectively stop spending any money DHS. This is how we got an expansion at DCA. For the better part of a decade the locals avoided DCA. Disney gave it away free to fill the park. During the same years Disneyland did very well. That is how Carsland was built.

Everyone needs to tell Disney they can keep their free dining. We are not interested. DVC members can stay at Disney and visit Universal and the SeaWorld expansion.

Or don't visit Orlando. Go to Dland. The new ships. Joe Rohde's latest ego booster the Aulani! See real quality at Tokyo Disney. Visit the real non-themed world!

This is the only way toget the suits to spend real money at WDW.

Larry
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Old 08-02-2012, 10:29 AM   #8
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[Everyone needs to tell Disney they can keep their free dining. We are not interested.]

Is free dining frowned upon? It saves guests thousands.
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Old 08-02-2012, 12:01 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IllinoisJones View Post
[Everyone needs to tell Disney they can keep their free dining. We are not interested.]

Is free dining frowned upon? It saves guests thousands.
Not really. Look at how room rates have skyrocketed onsite, and ticket prices have increased over the past several yeas. "Free dining" requires you pay rack rates for your room and tickets. Often you can save even more money using room only discounts and/or buying tickets thru an authorized reseller like Undercover Tourist.

Food Quality has also dropped over the years, and the Dining plan has made changes that result in it not covering as much (such as Appetizers, Tips, etc).


It's a great marketing plot "Look! You get to eat for Free!!", but the reality is that you can often save more money by using other discounts available.... and actually eating the way you would normally eat. (Instead of feeling like you need to stuff your face each meal to "get your value")
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Old 08-02-2012, 01:21 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by IllinoisJones View Post

Is free dining frowned upon? It saves guests thousands.
That's hard to quantify...but the discussion on the pros and cons of "free" dining has gone on for years...

here's the highlights in the way of "positives":

The dining plan and subsequently free dining allows WDW to account for what those programs will cost/ gain the operation on an individual basis prior to travel. This is good for management as it allows for both a projection of guaranteed revenue and cost control...which are two things that they stress and will continue to stress going forward.

The reality is that a guest will save "Up to 20%" on their costs using either the DDP or the free dining booked in conjunction with a WDW vacation package. As noted - free dining increases the costs associated with the other components of the package - notably the room rate as described. In the end, whether you book a dining plan, receive "Free" dining, or purchase a tables in wonderland card - you will get somewhere between 10-20% in savings. Of course, the prices have been inflated to the point where you are still spending more than you probably would have for the same things 5 or 10 years ago before the discounts and dining plans.

One definite advantage to WDW (and disadvantage if you ask long time travelers or local residents) is that they have used it to flesh out times of the calender year that were absolutely ghost towns - notably september and january. That is probably an overall good thing, if you're honest.

the "negatives" as often observed/ perceived can be boiled down to:

The ruination of the restaurant experience. This is a dining plan thing, not just a free dining plan thing - but the reality is that they have cut back on the quality, increased the prices (for several reasons), and jammed the restaruant system since the dining plans were implemented. They also jacked up the prices to make those on the ddp feel as if they are getting great value...while whacking those that don't fall into line and buy one or go on a free dining package. That demographic tends to encompass the somewhat vocal components of DVC, longtime disney fans/travelers, and florida/local residents...
They (aka ME) tend to get cranky.
Can you still have great food/ experiences at wdw with the plans? yes
Is the overall quality of dining at WDW diminished since DDP/free dining? The answer is a quite simply yes...it has declined on the average.

"Free" Dining has hurt the guest experience by reducing profits for WDW and created a culture of discount dependency. This is difficult to gauge...but according to disney they are not experiencing growth with the discount packages available...even if it means more people. That may be an exaggeration for their own purposes...but the case/ conclusion can be made that they are correct. Full price travelers spend more - it would seem - on the whole. That seems reasonable. And if WDW sees the full prices paid, Disney corporate's reaction will be to consider capital re-investment as a better proposition.

The one thing that has seemed to show - if you look at boards such as this - is there IS a culture of discount dependency.
There is an inherent problem when people:
A. Travel annually or several times a year to WDW but only do it if they have the discount.
B. Get indignant when the discounts are not offered, such as my favorite post/ comment "What the heck are they waiting for on free dining for ____ time period?!?!"

I can only go by what i've seen/ gut reaction...but Disney does need to stop this...as "walmart" mentality at WDW will ultimately cause damage to the product and the experiences for everyone. WDW has always been selective/ expensive proposition and not affordable to many...
But make no mistake - we want it that way

Basically it is this: don't expect a coupon, discount, or persian bazaar barter on your vacation...because vacations are luxuries not rights and should be kept in that mindframe.

If free dining is component to that type of thought process...then it should be frowned upon. Many people blame free dining specifically for alot of the ills at WDW nowadays - probably overzealously more times than is appopriate. But there is a stigmata associated with the concept - whether it is deserved or not is up to the individual to decide.

Again, these are my takes...don't kill the messenger that delivers the food.
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Last edited by lockedoutlogic; 08-02-2012 at 03:05 PM.
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Old 08-03-2012, 08:54 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IllinoisJones View Post
[Everyone needs to tell Disney they can keep their free dining. We are not interested.]

Is free dining frowned upon? It saves guests thousands.
There's no such thing (in this case, literally) as a free lunch.

You're still paying for that free dining. You're losing room discounts, you're seeing higher than previously "average" room rate increases year over year, and you're seeing higher ticket price increases year over year. You're seeing "premium" pricing (both for the DDP and for OOP guests) for busier times of year. You're seeing steeper DDP price increases/value reductions year over year.

Guests aren't saving thousands, really. They're just redistributing who's collecting the money, and giving the ILLUSION you're saving thousands. Depending on party size, where you stay, and how you vacation...you may actually be paying more or saving almost nothing....even if you're going during a "free dining" period.

And if you're not (or if you're a DVC member..though most of us can't complain given what our "nightly rates" break down to), you're almost definitely paying a LOT more than you were even 5 years ago. Way more than typical rate of inflation.
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Old 08-02-2012, 12:22 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larry_poppins View Post
If you want new spending atDHS it is simple: the fans have to collectively stop spending any money DHS. This is how we got an expansion at DCA. For the better part of a decade the locals avoided DCA. Disney gave it away free to fill the park. During the same years Disneyland did very well. That is how Carsland was built.

Everyone needs to tell Disney they can keep their free dining. We are not interested. DVC members can stay at Disney and visit Universal and the SeaWorld expansion.

Or don't visit Orlando. Go to Dland. The new ships. Joe Rohde's latest ego booster the Aulani! See real quality at Tokyo Disney. Visit the real non-themed world!

This is the only way toget the suits to spend real money at WDW.

Larry
So basically there is no hope
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Old 08-02-2012, 01:46 PM   #13
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So basically there is no hope
I did not mean to imply there is no hope. But if we all continue to reward WDW with our business, by jumping on free dining, buying pins, buying vynilmation, etc... Why should they build anything? Ultimately everyone will decide what vacation is best for them.

If you want quality and new in Orlando than a day at FLE, SeaWOrld Antarctica, and all the new stuff coming to Universal Orlando is the way to go. The other Disney parks are stale.

More quality can be found at Tokyo Disney, my personal favorite. I would rather save money which I used to spend on domestic Disney and spend it there.

DCA also has a lot of quality right now and DLand looks pretty good!

But if we, collectively, keep spending money on the same old same old and buy pins and stuff. Nothing will be built.

If you visit DCA you will feel optimistic -- not that there is no hope!

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Old 08-02-2012, 03:08 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larry_poppins View Post
I did not mean to imply there is no hope. But if we all continue to reward WDW with our business, by jumping on free dining, buying pins, buying vynilmation, etc... Why should they build anything? Ultimately everyone will decide what vacation is best for them.

If you want quality and new in Orlando than a day at FLE, SeaWOrld Antarctica, and all the new stuff coming to Universal Orlando is the way to go. The other Disney parks are stale.

More quality can be found at Tokyo Disney, my personal favorite. I would rather save money which I used to spend on domestic Disney and spend it there.

DCA also has a lot of quality right now and DLand looks pretty good!

But if we, collectively, keep spending money on the same old same old and buy pins and stuff. Nothing will be built.

If you visit DCA you will feel optimistic -- not that there is no hope!

Larry
I only said it becauae that's what I take out of your solution; that even if us die hard Disney fans stop going new "sheep" (newbies) will just flock their and take our spot.

I also don't believe DHS has reached the mediocrity of opening day DCA. Is it disorganized? Has trouble with a cohesive theme? In dire need of new rides? Yes to all but Disney is yet to let it sink to the standard of the original DCA. So far.
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Old 08-02-2012, 03:23 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by umichigan10 View Post
I only said it becauae that's what I take out of your solution; that even if us die hard Disney fans stop going new "sheep" (newbies) will just flock their and take our spot.

I also don't believe DHS has reached the mediocrity of opening day DCA. Is it disorganized? Has trouble with a cohesive theme? In dire need of new rides? Yes to all but Disney is yet to let it sink to the standard of the original DCA. So far.
agree with paragraph one, agree with paragraph two...

disney is getting too much credit with the rework of california adventure...my opinion.

This is exactly what they want and i feared.

They should get NO CREDIT because the original california adventure was built as a disaster in a string of disasterous parks/ missteps...all of which have been sold at retail price since opening.

"We spent a billion dollars for you"...great - so really you spent two billion on a park that isn't worth that and charge me 100 bucks to see it...and wasted 10 years of yours and everyone else's lives.

kudos
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